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I'm an "night owl" and I live in the U.S, If I start freelancing will it affect my business?

by imagoodguy
25 replies
I'm an "night owl" ( I stay up real late and go to sleep around 6am or 8am ) and I live in the U.S, If I start freelance writing, will it affect my business?
#affect #business #freelancing #live #night owl #start
  • Profile picture of the author Matt Lee
    First of all - how do you only sleep 2 hours, and still manage to string 2 sentences together? Will it affect your business? It shouldn't. That's the beauty of freelance- you can write whenever you feel like it. I work whenever i want, but I normally am online a few hours per day to pick up the phone, return messages, close new deals etc. But the "bulk" of my work is done at night, when I meet with my team.
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    • Profile picture of the author imagoodguy
      Originally Posted by Matt Lee View Post

      First of all - how do you only sleep 2 hours, and still manage to string 2 sentences together? Will it affect your business? It shouldn't. That's the beauty of freelance- you can write whenever you feel like it. I work whenever i want, but I normally am online a few hours per day to pick up the phone, return messages, close new deals etc. But the "bulk" of my work is done at night, when I meet with my team.
      LOL No I'm saying that I go to sleep around 6am-8am ( up awoke until 6am- 8am ). Thanks for your input, I appreciate it.
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  • Profile picture of the author nuworld
    Just remember to be awake whenever the client needs his work delivered haha. With 2 hours of sleep I would consider getting some more sleep.
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    • Profile picture of the author imagoodguy
      Originally Posted by nuworld View Post

      Just remember to be awake whenever the client needs his work delivered haha. With 2 hours of sleep I would consider getting some more sleep.
      Lol I didn't mean it in that way, I was saying that I go to sleep around that time frame. I get about 7-8 hours of sleep...
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  • Profile picture of the author Chris-
    For many freelancing jobs it won't make too much difference, particularly if the job is a relatively long-term one. I use oDesk, and the freelancers are from all over the world, and for most jobs, it doesn't matter because I just leave messages for them, and they leave messages for me and send work as it is done or whatever, so for most jobs it would make no difference.

    What it would make a difference for are short-term (hours or a day or two) complex jobs where a lot of communication back and forth is needed. For example, getting some changes done properly for a WordPress theme once, on oDesk, took 47 messages back and forth between me and the freelancer, and it would have been impossible if there was a 12 hour delay between each of them, because I needed the job done ASAP. Having said that, the amount of communication was due to the freelancer being less than fully clear or responsible . . . if he'd actually done exactly and completely what I'd said in the first place, the job could have been done with no further communication.

    So if you are going to have a relatively long communication cycle, aim for jobs that are relatively long-term, and make sure everything is totally clear from the start, so there's no room for ambiguity and mis-understandings etc. which are typically what needs communication to sort out.

    Hope that helps make some sense of how things are likely to work

    Chris
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    • Profile picture of the author imagoodguy
      Originally Posted by Chris- View Post

      For many freelancing jobs it won't make too much difference, particularly if the job is a relatively long-term one. I use oDesk, and the freelancers are from all over the world, and for most jobs, it doesn't matter because I just leave messages for them, and they leave messages for me and send work as it is done or whatever, so for most jobs it would make no difference.

      What it would make a difference for are short-term (hours or a day or two) complex jobs where a lot of communication back and forth is needed. For example, getting some changes done properly for a WordPress theme once, on oDesk, took 47 messages back and forth between me and the freelancer, and it would have been impossible if there was a 12 hour delay between each of them, because I needed the job done ASAP. Having said that, the amount of communication was due to the freelancer being less than fully clear or responsible . . . if he'd actually done exactly and completely what I'd said in the first place, the job could have been done with no further communication.

      So if you are going to have a relatively long communication cycle, aim for jobs that are relatively long-term, and make sure everything is totally clear from the start, so there's no room for ambiguity and mis-understandings etc. which are typically what needs communication to sort out.

      Hope that helps make some sense of how things are likely to work

      Chris
      Thanks for this great post and the advice, I appreciate it. Is it true that freelance sites like Odesk, freelancer etc... Are too saturated for writers and people usually get paid low ?

      Would you personally recommend me to start on a freelance site like Odesk If I'm just starting out with freelance writing or which route should I go "in your opinion" ?
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      • Profile picture of the author Chris-
        Originally Posted by imagoodguy View Post

        Thanks for this great post and the advice, I appreciate it. Is it true that freelance sites like Odesk, freelancer etc... Are too saturated for writers and people usually get paid low ?

        Would you personally recommend me to start on a freelance site like Odesk If I'm just starting out with freelance writing or which route should I go "in your opinion" ?
        It is indeed challenging, because there are a LOT of freelancers out there, and many of them in 3rd world countries who can charge low rates.

        One "trick" I found for jobs like graphics or sound design, is to find a job request that you can do, and actually DO the job, and just put "demo" over it, so that they can see the job is done, but cannot use it until they pay you. Do that and charge less than the going rate when you start, saying honestly that you are charging low rates to get good feedback. Do a great job, over-deliver, and you'll get good feedback and that makes it easier to get other work there. For writing, you could maybe do half the article so they can see how good your work is, and tell them that the rest of the article is ready so you can deliver rapidly when they hire you.

        The main thing is to do a few jobs well (even if you don't get paid much) to get good feedback, because most people looking to get work done will give the work to those who have good feedback already.

        Writing, I guess the average pay is about $10 an hour for good English these days. One option might be to outsource the research and basic writing to someone who charges less, then you just make the English really good and charge the full rate.

        Once you've done one job well for a client, they will usually come back to you for other work, so you need to do whatever is necessary to make a start and get some feedback. I've had admin workers do a few hours work for one cent, just to get the feedback.

        Hope that helps

        Chris
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        • Profile picture of the author marciayudkin
          I live in Hawaii part of the year, and for several of those months, there is a 6-hour time difference with the US East Coast. Although my clients are actually all over the world, and most of my business is not done on the phone, this time shift does actually affect my business when there are things that need to be discussed on the phone or when there needs to be a paid phone consultation - it's simply hard to schedule.

          This is partly comparable to the situation in your question.

          Nevertheless, I would say that it's not an insurmountable obstacle as long as you are conscientious about returning phone calls and emails as soon as you can.

          Good luck,
          Marcia Yudkin
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        • Profile picture of the author imagoodguy
          Originally Posted by Chris- View Post

          It is indeed challenging, because there are a LOT of freelancers out there, and many of them in 3rd world countries who can charge low rates.

          One "trick" I found for jobs like graphics or sound design, is to find a job request that you can do, and actually DO the job, and just put "demo" over it, so that they can see the job is done, but cannot use it until they pay you. Do that and charge less than the going rate when you start, saying honestly that you are charging low rates to get good feedback. Do a great job, over-deliver, and you'll get good feedback and that makes it easier to get other work there. For writing, you could maybe do half the article so they can see how good your work is, and tell them that the rest of the article is ready so you can deliver rapidly when they hire you.

          The main thing is to do a few jobs well (even if you don't get paid much) to get good feedback, because most people looking to get work done will give the work to those who have good feedback already.

          Writing, I guess the average pay is about $10 an hour for good English these days. One option might be to outsource the research and basic writing to someone who charges less, then you just make the English really good and charge the full rate.

          Once you've done one job well for a client, they will usually come back to you for other work, so you need to do whatever is necessary to make a start and get some feedback. I've had admin workers do a few hours work for one cent, just to get the feedback.

          Hope that helps

          Chris
          Thanks for the advice...I was wondering, do you think it would be better to start my own site and advertise my skills that way instead of using freelance site or maybe do both at the same time ?

          Another question also, Wouldn't it be risky to write a article ahead of time because of the possibility of the client selecting another freelancer by the time I'm finish with the article ?
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          • Profile picture of the author Chris-
            Originally Posted by imagoodguy View Post

            Thanks for the advice...I was wondering, do you think it would be better to start my own site and advertise my skills that way instead of using freelance site or maybe do both at the same time ?

            Another question also, Wouldn't it be risky to write a article ahead of time because of the possibility of the client selecting another freelancer by the time I'm finish with the article ?
            Yes you can create your own website to advertise your services. That can certainly work, but can be challenging . . . putting up the website is the easy part, actually getting clients is the challenge . . . don't assume that because you put up a website, people will find you, because it doesn't work that way.

            So you would need to actively work to get clients. Methods include any of the good "traffic methods" discussed on these forums, including article syndication, blog commenting, forum posts with signature, etc. An additional approach would be to give away some free trials of your service, to encourage people to try it, then hopefully some of them will remain as clients, but even getting people to accept a totally free offer can take considerable work (as I have found in practice).

            In many ways it is easier to get work on the freelance sites, because there you are shown lots of people who want the job done and all you have to do is to keep making offers of low prices and good quality, and you'll make a start. There's an interesting thread somewhere else on this forum on how planning to get clients by offering low prices, is not a good strategy in the long-term, because the people who want to save money are unlikely to succeed, so you will keep having to find new clients as the current ones fail. Compared to working for those who will pay much more for a top quality article, who are likely to continue to succeed in what they are doing.

            Another point is that much more money can be made from using your articles as the basis of a scalable IM method, than you could ever make by just selling the articles even to the top paying clients. Once one really understands what a residual income is, and starts to calculate how much more money that will make than getting paid for your time, then there's no way one would continue to sell their time, except as a short-term emergency measure. For example, I can spend 40 minutes writing something that will make me about a dollar a month. That doesn't sound like much, but add that up over 10 years or more, and it's a lot more than even the higher-paying clients will pay for an article. So you might consider that approach, which requires a bit more learning, but is more worthwhile in the long-term, if you are interested in a growing business rather than a freelance job.

            As for your second question, yes of course, if you do the work first then approach the client, you run the risk of getting nothing, but if you just apply for jobs in the usual way you might have a long wait before you get anything at all because most people will only consider someone with plenty of good feedback scores, unless given a food reason.

            If you are worried about losing a little, then you might want to change that attitude if you want to succeed, because most pathways to considerable success come with more risk than staying mediocre, which is why most people will never give up their day job for the change to be wealthy.

            Chris
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            • Profile picture of the author imagoodguy
              Originally Posted by Chris- View Post

              Yes you can create your own website to advertise your services. That can certainly work, but can be challenging . . . putting up the website is the easy part, actually getting clients is the challenge . . . don't assume that because you put up a website, people will find you, because it doesn't work that way.

              So you would need to actively work to get clients. Methods include any of the good "traffic methods" discussed on these forums, including article syndication, blog commenting, forum posts with signature, etc. An additional approach would be to give away some free trials of your service, to encourage people to try it, then hopefully some of them will remain as clients, but even getting people to accept a totally free offer can take considerable work (as I have found in practice).

              In many ways it is easier to get work on the freelance sites, because there you are shown lots of people who want the job done and all you have to do is to keep making offers of low prices and good quality, and you'll make a start. There's an interesting thread somewhere else on this forum on how planning to get clients by offering low prices, is not a good strategy in the long-term, because the people who want to save money are unlikely to succeed, so you will keep having to find new clients as the current ones fail. Compared to working for those who will pay much more for a top quality article, who are likely to continue to succeed in what they are doing.

              Another point is that much more money can be made from using your articles as the basis of a scalable IM method, than you could ever make by just selling the articles even to the top paying clients. Once one really understands what a residual income is, and starts to calculate how much more money that will make than getting paid for your time, then there's no way one would continue to sell their time, except as a short-term emergency measure. For example, I can spend 40 minutes writing something that will make me about a dollar a month. That doesn't sound like much, but add that up over 10 years or more, and it's a lot more than even the higher-paying clients will pay for an article. So you might consider that approach, which requires a bit more learning, but is more worthwhile in the long-term, if you are interested in a growing business rather than a freelance job.

              As for your second question, yes of course, if you do the work first then approach the client, you run the risk of getting nothing, but if you just apply for jobs in the usual way you might have a long wait before you get anything at all because most people will only consider someone with plenty of good feedback scores, unless given a food reason.

              If you are worried about losing a little, then you might want to change that attitude if you want to succeed, because most pathways to considerable success come with more risk than staying mediocre, which is why most people will never give up their day job for the change to be wealthy.

              Chris
              Thanks for the amazing advice Chris, I'll definitely keep all of this in mind. I was wondering do you know any specific courses about freelance writing that's based on starting a website and how to get clients with certain traffic methods?

              In the next couple of days I'm planning on getting started with Iwriter and a couple of freelancing websites. After a couple of weeks of writing on these sites and building some good reputation, I will build a site which will highlight my portfolio, prices, contact info etc... I'm also going to make a "warrior for hire" thread around that same time, sounds good?
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  • Profile picture of the author veronicajacob
    Its Just about managing the time you may sleep whenever you want :-)
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  • Profile picture of the author JohnnyPlan
    In a global work force, you will rarely ever be in the same time zone as your clients, when it comes to freelancing. And, actually you might find that your current work schedule is very conducive to getting work done as you are awake at a time of night when many others are not. So you will experience less lag when working online. Also, many international clients might appreciate that you are actually available to consult with them at their own hours (which presumably you will be as you are a night owl).
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  • Profile picture of the author laurencewins
    Remember that there are people from all around the world here. I am in Australia, for example, and many of my clients are asleep when I am working and vice versa. So, as long as you understand proper deadlines in terms of what your clients need, working at night should not be an issue. If you have to Skype with them, just figure out the best time to do so.
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    • Profile picture of the author imagoodguy
      Originally Posted by laurencewins View Post

      Remember that there are people from all around the world here. I am in Australia, for example, and many of my clients are asleep when I am working and vice versa. So, as long as you understand proper deadlines in terms of what your clients need, working at night should not be an issue. If you have to Skype with them, just figure out the best time to do so.
      Thanks to everyone for your replies. I was wondering which way did you start in freelance writing ? Freelance sites? Creating your own site and advertising your writing business? etc...
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      • Profile picture of the author JohnnyPlan
        Originally Posted by imagoodguy View Post

        Thanks to everyone for your replies. I was wondering which way did you start in freelance writing ? Freelance sites? Creating your own site and advertising your writing business? etc...
        You should start by creating your own freelance blog or website that shows proof of your writing quality. This site can be fancy or plain, but it should have a few basics including links to and screenshots of your most previous work. You will also want to include contact details. You can link to this site in your signature line when you are promoting on forums.
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        • Profile picture of the author imagoodguy
          Originally Posted by JohnnyPlan View Post

          You should start by creating your own freelance blog or website that shows proof of your writing quality. This site can be fancy or plain, but it should have a few basics including links to and screenshots of your most previous work. You will also want to include contact details. You can link to this site in your signature line when you are promoting on forums.
          Thanks I'm definitely gonna make a site, I was gonna get a logo made for it also...
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  • Profile picture of the author Skolr
    Peace,

    Logically it shouldn't effect you. You are a freelancer, meaning: you do the work in your own time. As long as you complete your work by the deadlines that you agree with a client then it doesn't matter when you do the work.

    I am also a night owl - in fact back when I wrote my first ebook; it took me 6 hours to complete and I started it at midnight one night. That ebook earned me over £850 GBP in less than 24 hours so go figure.

    I hope I answered your question,
    Peace,
    Skolr
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  • Profile picture of the author Samuel Adams
    When you work from home as a freelancer, it doesn't really matter when you wake or sleep, only that you are completing the job as requested. If you do a good job, that's all your clients will care about. And most importantly, you will want to deliver the results that you promised and give your client superior work product.
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    • Profile picture of the author Jeffery Moss
      Originally Posted by Samuel Adams View Post

      When you work from home as a freelancer, it doesn't really matter when you wake or sleep, only that you are completing the job as requested. If you do a good job, that's all your clients will care about. And most importantly, you will want to deliver the results that you promised and give your client superior work product.
      The key point here is to do the work on time, not late and always keep your clients in the loop on what you have done. Just be sure you can communicate with your clients at least once a day.* You don't have to be awake when they are, just communicating often enough to assure their minds that you are actually making progress on the job. How you communicate with the client will vary by site as some don't allow for communication outside the freelance site.
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  • Profile picture of the author OnTheRun
    Ah, good, so you do sleep
    Freelance writing never hurt anyone, or any business for that matter

    Long story short, as long as yo keep your work and your freelance activities separate, you should be fine. I'm doing it, I freelance, I have a "normal" job, it's all good.

    Are you planning on keeping your job or do you wish to be a full time freelance writer?
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  • Profile picture of the author gmarklin
    You can freelance any place you want. What business are you in that you would need to ask that question?
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  • Profile picture of the author skyro
    I don't think it would affect your work but might affect your health only sleeping 2 hours a day.
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    • Profile picture of the author Jill Carpenter
      A few years back I awoke early (around 4am) and was anxious to get something out.

      Spent a few hours banging out some PLR articles, put them together as a pack, then posted them as a WSO. Pretty sure I just passed out after that. Think I had to wait for the approval time to launch.

      Anyway, there are a LOT of things you can do and sell at all hours of the day. East to west coast is all different in time - and there is always the UK which is wide awake when it sounds like you are

      Just go for it!

      Heck, my SO is just getting up for work around 2-3am and sometimes I get up then too.

      Have some clear goals with what you want to do with your freelance writing - and check out making some PLR compilations that you can sell on the side.
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  • Profile picture of the author danielmcclure
    I've freelanced in both the US and UK market over the years working days and nights depending on my current lifestyle. None of it matters as long as you do the job well and deliver on time. Right now I'm living in New Zealand and I still have clients in the prior two continents. The only down side is if you want live talk time but you can work around it and juggle if you're prepared for it.
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