Why marketing is stupid...

9 years ago

You see i would say thats part of the foundations of marketing; you need to know your customer, your product and to a lesser degree your market before you start to market.

BUT if you know everything about a customers needs wants and desire you have the solution to their pain spend time in really getting to know them to create the ultimate problem solving life changing product but tell no one about then what was the point?

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I've got 99 problems but a niche ain't one

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Tony M

9 years ago

Originally Posted by quadagon

You see i would say thats part of the foundations of marketing; you need to know your customer, your product and to a lesser degree your market before you start to market.

BUT if you know everything about a customers needs wants and desire you have the solution to their pain spend time in really getting to know them to create the ultimate problem solving life changing product but tell no one about then what was the point?

You're exactly right.

The problem is: Most of today's make money online "courses"
are nothing more than Pick a market, Find a product that's selling, and BAM!

...instant sales.

And that's the problem.

No one takes the time to explain that the market needs to be well researched
before trying to drive sales.

-Tony

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Hesaidblissfully

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Tony M

You're exactly right.

The problem is: Most of today's make money online "courses"
are nothing more than Pick a market, Find a product that's selling, and BAM!

...instant sales.

And that's the problem.

No one takes the time to explain that the market needs to be well researched
before trying to drive sales.

-Tony

I suspect that this might be due to the fact that the people you describe selling these courses do understand their market, and they know that the people they're selling to want instant results, not to be told that they have to take the time to research their market well, which sounds time consuming and "hard". And so they sell instant results, because that's what their (the sellers) market wants.

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Steve B 9 years ago

Tony,

Okay, so you think "marketing is stupid."

Everyone should be focusing on "their target market."

And all the things you mentioned in your post are not part of marketing according to you.

Personally, I think you're up in the night.

How in the world can you split off market research and everything that goes with understanding your market and the needs of your prospects and not call that a part of a niche marketing effort? Of course it belongs under the marketing umbrella . . . just the same as branding, nurturing your prospects, learning about the competition, and following up after the sale.

In fact, if anything, I would argue that marketing really covers everything you do in your business on a daily basis. How you operate, how you execute, and the entire experience that a customer or prospect has with your business is going to leave an impression of some kind on your customers and their experience with you can add to or detract from your marketing message.

I don't disagree at all that focusing on the target market is important . . . but to say that isn't a part of the overall marketing you do really is a stretch that serves no purpose.

Steve
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Joan Altz

9 years ago

You're right, of course, but knowing your target audience - and I mean really knowing them - takes some time. That's why most WSOs and Marketing Products are targeted at newbies.

A newbie has to start somewhere and most of them can't start with knowing their target audience until they start driving traffic, making sales, learning through customer support requests, and testing to see what converts to sales, optins, and click-throughs.

So although I agree with you, knowing your target audience really well is more of a long term goal, with the exception being those who already have some expertise and experience coming into the game.

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Lucian Lada

9 years ago

Tony, you're on to something, even though I don't quite like the way you put it.

I think what you're trying to say is that marketers see visitors/leads as numbers, not as real human beings. And you're right. That's why the offers and sales funnels are so bad. They treat them like they're pieces of junk.

Congrats on realizing this. Most people around here never do.

However, as I said, I don't quite like the way you put it because true marketing isn't what you think it is, just like true politics doesn't mean people lying to your face.

There's nothing wrong with marketing, just as there's nothing wrong with politics if they're done in the right way, i.e. to benefit people.

What we need here is a better class of marketers, just like we need a better class of politicians.

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Tony M

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Lucian Lada

Tony, you're on to something, even though I don't quite like the way you put it.

I think what you're trying to say is that marketers see visitors/leads as numbers, not as real human beings. And you're right. That's why the offers and sales funnels are so bad. They treat them like they're pieces of junk.
.

You're absolutely right.

Spot on.

It's that "numbers game" mentality that's killing profits.

We're so used to seeing conversions VS how man people
are TRUSTING YOU enough that they've parted with their
credit card to SOLVE THEIR PROBLEM.

Think about it...

Trusting someone with your credit card online without previously
knowing them is a huge landscape...

It doesn't matter how many testimonials or screenshots they have.

-Tony

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fast2net

9 years ago

Spending money to learn how to market is one thing..spending money to gain insight about the market (learning your audience) is another.

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O0o0O

9 years ago

Yes, I see what you're saying. Finding out about your demographic is called Market Research. And displaying empathy and understanding is called building Brand Awareness.

With that being said, there is added value in having true empathy inside yourself because you will tend be inherently more engaged in your business.

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discrat

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Tony M

...you'll be able to connect with them on a level no multi-million
dollar corporation WISHED they could...

and best of all...

I wouldn't mind being able to connect like a multi-million dollar corporation...
after all they are a multi- million dollar corporation

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Tony M

9 years ago

Originally Posted by discrat

I wouldn't mind being able to connect like a multi-million dollar corporation..
after all they are a multi- million dollar corporation

Almost all of those corporations don't connect...

They spend millions and millions of dollars just to put their logo
in front of people without ever worrying about having a profitable campaign.

It takes a ton of work to be able to waste money like that.

Don't get me wrong, there are companies that have their target market research down and they use that for product development and they market the hell outta their products...

Just think about p90X. They do an excellent job of connecting and really selling the results of their products.

But what about the rest of their competition?

Zilch...

Why?

Because the majority of their competition is marketing the company's image, instead of the result their products can give their audience.

-Tony

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discrat 9 years ago

Originally Posted by Tony M

Because the majority of their competition is marketing the company's image, instead of the result their products can give their audience.

-Tony

Its called strategic Branding and can be attained by the second part of your sentence ( over a period of time)

- Robert Andrew
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quadagon

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Tony M

They spend millions and millions of dollars just to put their logo
in front of people without ever worrying about having a profitable campaign.

It takes a ton of work to be able to waste money like that.

-Tony

To be honest a lot of these companies are at a different level of marketing where branding is of higher value due to the volume of sales they make.

When our brain sees familiar brands the pleasure centre of the brain lights up. So when they see the brand out and about in the shop they have the same reaction. Its a technique called anchoring and association. Interestingly you can get a small part of this after only three days of exposure to a brand

As these brandverts have a different purpose to traditional advertising spend you will notice that they don't have traditional aspects ie there is no call to action.

People who are looking to build themselves as a brand can use similar techniques for almost free through PPC campaigns. Simply reverse your thinking and build adverts, banners etc that don't encourage the click. You'll increase the awareness of yourself and can grow organic search.

Naturally this is harder to quantify but i can promise that having tested this it does see an increase in conversion.

Eric

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Bannaz

9 years ago

Originally Posted by quadagon

Simply reverse your thinking and build adverts, banners etc that don't encourage the click. You'll increase the awareness of yourself and can grow organic search.

Eric

This is true - but trying to persuade an advertiser to have an ad built that doesn't encourage a click is very hard. Most advertisers focus strongly on the CTA and want to be able to measure everything.

I agree though - if you add a few banners in your campaign that retarget users and that do not specifically go for the click but more on brand awareness, you will see an increase in your overall campaign performance.

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deebee23

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Tony M

Sounds a bit contradicting, right?

I mean, here I am on one of the most popular forums
on the internet that's based solely around MARKETING...

...and I'm calling it stupid.

No, I'm not senile (although my friends would disagree).

Here's where I'm gettin' at.

Everyone (at least that I notice) is worried about one
thing when it comes to promoting their product/affiliate
offer...

And that's marketing.

They spend the majority of their days maxing out their credit
cards on buying traffic and cheap WSO's that promise
how to drive hundreds of thousands of visitors to your
website to build your list and buy everything you can
possibly throw their way...

...and you can find all this out in a 6 page report for only
$7

Sorry, but my bullshit meter is redlining.

Let me tell you why marketing shouldn't be your main
focus.

Rather than focusing on getting traffic from Twiddler, or
Fakebook -- You should be focusing on your target
market.

Your potential customers.

Their hopes.

Their dreams.

Their desires.

Their language.

Their PROBLEMS.

... You should know your target audience better than
you know yourself.

Why?

Because, silly...

When you know this much about your audience,
the way they speak and what problems that have...

You'll build empathy...

...you'll be able to connect with them on a level no multi-million
dollar corporation WISHED they could...

and best of all...

Your MARKETING will speak to them and gravitate
them to your product/services without an ounce
of resistance.

So tell me, do you guys/gals agree?

Uh All that stuff you mentioned is marketing dude.Lol

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Tony M 9 years ago

Originally Posted by deebee23

Uh All that stuff you mentioned is marketing dude.Lol

No.

It's market research.
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Frank Donovan

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Tony M

... You should know your target audience better than
you know yourself.

As Peter Drucker said:

"The aim of marketing is to know and understand the customer so well the product or service fits him and sells itself."

Many people confuse marketing with sales, and that confusion leads them to focus on the numbers rather than the customer. The whole point of marketing is to make selling superfluous.

.

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seoboyz01

9 years ago

Find one thing you're good at and can do passionately. Figure out where your customers are. Go there. Market to those people. Make sales. That's the basis of everything I do. You might call it marketing or something else. I'm already on my own path and taking action. And, that's a far sight better than someone who is still reading about 'how to' make money and not taking action and trying to decide what to do.

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