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how high i need to be?

by MohTawfeek
15 replies
hi

im a newbie to IM, i've spent the last 2 weeks (almost 24/7) reading about Affiliate marketing, SEO and most basics to start a niche project. my niche will be about health problem which i know too many informations about it (cause i had it). the Question is how high my site need to be on SERP before i start to see $$, specially that niche is naturally small (not cancer or boobs issues) and i can't turn it into authority site with 50 pages of content. the targeted key word have ~500 avg.monthly searches on google adwords,
i hope my question was clear enough and i will be grateful for any advice. thx
#high #niche #page rank
  • Profile picture of the author Steve B
    Originally Posted by MohTawfeek View Post

    the Question is how high my site need to be on SERP before i start to see $$

    You can see earnings even before your site is listed in the SERPs. If you use paid advertising it depends upon the kind, amount, and frequency of your promotions.

    You are wrongly assuming that high SERPs equate to money. But at this point prior to beginning your business, I would say forget about the SERPs and concentrate on your web site, your product, your sales letter, identifying your targeted audience and all the other basics that you should have in place in order to maximize your marketing.

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    • Profile picture of the author MohTawfeek
      Originally Posted by Steve B View Post

      You can see earnings even before your site is listed in the SERPs. If you use paid advertising it depends upon the kind, amount, and frequency of your promotions.

      You are wrongly assuming that high SERPs equate to money. But at this point prior to beginning your business, I would say forget about the SERPs and concentrate on your web site, your product, your sales letter, identifying your targeted audience and all the other basics that you should have in place in order to maximize your marketing.

      Steve
      unfortuantelly im on low budget :/ , 100$ for 1yr hosting, domain and aweber, and im not going to throw more money on a business which i don't know much about it. i take it as a test and application for what i'm learning more than a real business, so the only traffic i will get will be from key word and some seo till i get some $ and re-investe them. about the content i can write decent content but it can'tt be large enough to out rank the big authority sites which have 1 or 2 pages talking about the same problem(niche). right?
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      • Profile picture of the author Chris Silvey
        SEO/Serps is just one kind of way to market your product or services, it is also the hardest in my opinion.

        Have a look at the many social networks, build a decent profile, be social/transparent,interact, and you can make sales for free. Just don't become a spam bot. People will tune you out. PS. use hashtag to target your audience.
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      • Profile picture of the author talfighel
        Originally Posted by MohTawfeek View Post

        unfortuantelly im on low budget :/ , 100$ for 1yr hosting, domain and aweber, and im not going to throw more money on a business which i don't know much about it. i take it as a test and application for what i'm learning more than a real business, so the only traffic i will get will be from key word and some seo till i get some $ and re-investe them. about the content i can write decent content but it can'tt be large enough to out rank the big authority sites which have 1 or 2 pages talking about the same problem(niche). right?
        If you have a job, you should have no problem to invest some more money in more tools (ads) to get more traffic.

        You just can not rely on SEO to get traffic.

        The first thing you need to do is to see whether your site is profitable or not and paid ads helps you to see those stats in a matter of a few days.
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        • Profile picture of the author MohTawfeek
          Originally Posted by talfighel View Post

          If you have a job, you should have no problem to invest some more money in more tools (ads) to get more traffic.

          You just can not rely on SEO to get traffic.

          The first thing you need to do is to see whether your site is profitable or not and paid ads helps you to see those stats in a matter of a few days.
          thankyou for answering me, i dont have a job in fact i'm a student and i have another online business (very weak one) which is barely covering my personal expenses, and as i mentioned i have no problem with time as long as im learning.
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  • Profile picture of the author saqarra
    From KKO75 See thread "How I made my first million...Worth reading and Best piece of advice;

    So here's the best piece of advice you'll ever hear- Google has never changed. Not one bit. They only got better at meeting their original objective of making the site with the best content appear in the #1 slot, and you can't do that by trying to optimize for Google. Instead, optimize your sites for the people you're trying to connect with...and then Google will see your value. If you do that, then no Penguin or Panda update in the world can touch you.

    KKO75
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    • Profile picture of the author kk075
      Originally Posted by saqarra View Post

      From KKO75 See thread "How I made my first million...Worth reading and Best piece of advice;

      So here's the best piece of advice you'll ever hear- Google has never changed. Not one bit. They only got better at meeting their original objective of making the site with the best content appear in the #1 slot, and you can't do that by trying to optimize for Google. Instead, optimize your sites for the people you're trying to connect with...and then Google will see your value. If you do that, then no Penguin or Panda update in the world can touch you.

      KKO75
      My thanks button is still disabled from thanking people in that thread...so thanks for that.

      To the original poster, you can absolutely rank extremely well with just 50 pages since you said that your niche is very small. For example, if you look at the giants like Web MD, they rank great because of all their content combined. But then again, they likely have only one page about your exact topic and you're going to have 50....and I'd bet a dollar you win if your content is well-written. I'd take that same bet with your site having 20 pages to a mega-site's single page.

      One other quick point I'll make- you don't know that the niche converts poorly. How could you? The only thing you can know is why others have failed within the niche, and I highly recommend for you to research your competition and see what they did....because that's telling you what not to do. You bought the product yourself though so that's proof that it's worth representing, and all you have to do is educate people on what you've personally learned/experienced.

      Also, I wouldn't go nuts with pad ads until you know where to find your ideal customer. Sure, use the free ad credits on Bing (currently $50 or $100), Yahoo (currently $50), Facebook (currently $50) and on other networks, but I would personally put completely different ads on each of them. Use the freebies to test-drive several monetization ideas and just see what works the best. Then fine-tune your other messages to be similar and test some more.

      Mainly though, just focus on your core content and give people great information. That sounds so simple but few people ever do it. I can show you identical listings on Amazon where one has great copy and the other has a generic description...and the well-written one sells thousands more per week. The exact same thing is true for affiliates as well.

      Anyway, I hope that helps. Most here would say to buy ads and see what happens, but those ads aren't going to help you if your content isn't worth reading beforehand. So don't think of it as SEO...think of it as prepping your site to educate your core customers and the people they later refer.
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      • Profile picture of the author MohTawfeek
        Originally Posted by kk075 View Post

        My thanks button is still disabled from thanking people in that thread...so thanks for that.

        To the original poster, you can absolutely rank extremely well with just 50 pages since you said that your niche is very small. For example, if you look at the giants like Web MD, they rank great because of all their content combined. But then again, they likely have only one page about your exact topic and you're going to have 50....and I'd bet a dollar you win if your content is well-written. I'd take that same bet with your site having 20 pages to a mega-site's single page.

        One other quick point I'll make- you don't know that the niche converts poorly. How could you? The only thing you can know is why others have failed within the niche, and I highly recommend for you to research your competition and see what they did....because that's telling you what not to do. You bought the product yourself though so that's proof that it's worth representing, and all you have to do is educate people on what you've personally learned/experienced.

        Also, I wouldn't go nuts with pad ads until you know where to find your ideal customer. Sure, use the free ad credits on Bing (currently $50 or $100), Yahoo (currently $50), Facebook (currently $50) and on other networks, but I would personally put completely ads on each of them. Use the freebies to test-drive several monetization ideas and just see what works the best. Then fine-tune your other messages to be similar and test some more.

        Mainly though, just focus on your core content and give people great information. That sounds so simple but few people ever do it. I can show you identical listings on Amazon where one has great copy and the other has a generic description...and the well-written one sells thousands more per week. The exact same thing is true for affiliates as well.

        Anyway, I hope that helps. Most here would say to buy ads and see what happens, but those ads aren't going to help you if your content isn't worth reading beforehand. So don't think of it as SEO...think of it as prepping your site to educate your core customers and the people they later refer.
        thankyou till i find my thanks button, here's what i will do i will talk about everything i passed through while i was searching for a solution for the meant problem, what worked, what's fake, what to start with and everything i know, i will put all the (true) information which i collected from too many sources in that blog in new order, i will not make any reviews about any products just some suggestions with few affiliate links for the products that matches with my suggestions ( 3 links 1 for each product), and finally im not waiting any money from that project, at the end of the year if i got my 100$ back i will call it a bounce
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        • Profile picture of the author kk075
          Originally Posted by MohTawfeek View Post

          thankyou till i find my thanks button, here's what i will do i will talk about everything i passed through while i was searching for a solution for the meant problem, what worked, what's fake, what to start with and everything i know, i will put all the (true) information which i collected from too many sources in that blog in new order, i will not make any reviews about any products just some suggestions with few affiliate links for the products that matches with my suggestions ( 3 links 1 for each product), and finally im not waiting any money from that project, at the end of the year if i got my 100$ back i will call it a bounce
          I have no idea what your commission would be...but even if you got $10 a sale, you'd need 10 conversions in a year to break even. I'm pretty sure you'd be well above that though if you take your time and do things the right way. Also, make a separate page for everything that's fake, a separate page for everything that's real, and a single page for each of your major sources. Feel free to quote back to them but put the text in your own words/experiences.

          To start, I'd aim for about 25 pages and then slowly add an additional page or two a week. I think by the time you hit 30-35 pages, you'll have your money back and be in the green.
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          • Profile picture of the author MohTawfeek
            Originally Posted by kk075 View Post

            Also, make a separate page for everything that's fake, a separate page for everything that's real, and a single page for each of your major sources.
            that was a great addition to my plan ty
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  • Profile picture of the author mkersen
    Take it step by step. Sometimes if your trying to do too much at one time your going to get overwhelmed and want to quit. You know your niche, so I would just focus on building the website and a squeeze page to gather emails for a list so you can set your auto responder to send out newsletter to these people.

    Just get your foundation set up first then go from there.
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  • Profile picture of the author MohTawfeek
    thank you warriors for your informative answers, sure im gonna stick to all free traffic methods till i make any sales to confirm that it can make money from that niche and start the 2nd stage with the paid traffic ways, also i need to learn the free ones too even if i have the money to buy targeted traffic.
    any comment about key word with 500 search/month? does it worth it even with promoting products with low value (30~70$)
    - what if i added content about similar key words in demand off increasing pages with quality contents, would that make the site less dominant for the original keyword?
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    • Profile picture of the author art72
      Originally Posted by MohTawfeek View Post

      t
      any comment about key word with 500 search/month? does it worth it even with promoting products with low value (30~70$)
      While I am no SEO expert, targeting 'low-hanging fruit' as they say, or low-competition keywords can mean one of two things;

      1.) the niche converts poorly, thus there's no present competition
      2.) not a popular niche, but needs a problem solved which in essence could do well - if constructed properly using seo techniques.

      However, I would personally assume that a keyword getting less than 1000 searches a month, is a good indicator that it does not have a very large audience or demand. Thus, I would spend $50 running a few cheap FB ads to see what kind of response your offer or optin page gets?

      Even if you pay .05 per click, that's 1000 visitors to your site. This small investment could save you a ton of time and money, determining if there is a demand?

      Alternatively, you could spend months doing article marketing, video marketing, guest blogging, etc (*all for free) only to learn the demand is not there, and might be an indicator "WHY?" nobody else has targeted this 'problem'.

      So, the point being, even if you prefer investing your time, over that of money... you may be wasting your money paying for an autoresponder, hosting, and a domain that holds little value, if that niche doesn't convert well.

      Your conversion rates will depend on several things... your ability to build a highly converting offer. Your ability to create powerful ad copy. Your ability to write powerful 'follow-up' emails, etc...

      So, in all honesty - there is no right or wrong way to 'test' your niche. You simply need to decide how painstaking the process will be by testing your campaigns with time? or money?

      Personally, I think testing with paid ads is the fastest and cheapest method... and relying solely on search engine traffic is a bad choice, unless you are highly skilled at SEO.
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      • Profile picture of the author MohTawfeek
        Originally Posted by art72 View Post

        While I am no SEO expert, targeting 'low-hanging fruit' as they say, or low-competition keywords can mean one of two things;

        1.) the niche converts poorly, thus there's no present competition
        2.) not a popular niche, but needs a problem solved which in essence could do well - if constructed properly using seo techniques.

        However, I would personally assume that a keyword getting less than 1000 searches a month, is a good indicator that it does not have a very large audience or demand. Thus, I would spend $50 running a few cheap FB ads to see what kind of response your offer or optin page gets?

        Even if you pay .05 per click, that's 1000 visitors to your site. This small investment could save you a ton of time and money, determining if there is a demand?

        Alternatively, you could spend months doing article marketing, video marketing, guest blogging, etc (*all for free) only to learn the demand is not there, and might be an indicator "WHY?" nobody else has targeted this 'problem'.

        So, the point being, even if you prefer investing your time, over that of money... you may be wasting your money paying for an autoresponder, hosting, and a domain that holds little value, if that niche doesn't convert well.

        Your conversion rates will depend on several things... your ability to build a highly converting offer. Your ability to create powerful ad copy. Your ability to write powerful 'follow-up' emails, etc...

        So, in all honesty - there is no right or wrong way to 'test' your niche. You simply need to decide how painstaking the process will be by testing your campaigns with time? or money?

        Personally, I think testing with paid ads is the fastest and cheapest method... and relying solely on search engine traffic is a bad choice, unless you are highly skilled at SEO.
        at first thankyou and im not highly skilled at SEO, the problems is 2 weeks ago when i started reading about affiliate marketing at the first day i said " i must start a niche about fitness and bodybuilding ", 2nd day i said " no, niche about weightloss will be better ", 3rd day i said " niche about low carb diet will be more specific", yesterday i decided to make it about ketogenic diet and today when i wake up i said " ketogenic diet recipes & ketostix reviews will be a win" and 2hours ago while im trying to dig deeper in the ketogenic related keywords, i found a keyword search for a solution for a problem which i suffered from for many years and i alrdy fixed it with suggested bid ~$2 with very low competition,
        just copied it to amazon search and found some nice products ( which the visitor will 100% need it to get over his problem) to promote, my experience is growing very fast and i want to start asap and im sure if i spend 100$ today on paid service, the next week i'll regret it cause i will find better ways which i can get better results for the same 100$. thats my point of view and sure i will take the facebook ads seriously just need to feel more comfortable about what im doing . thankyou for sharing your thoughts with me
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        • Profile picture of the author art72
          Originally Posted by MohTawfeek View Post

          at first thankyou and im not highly skilled at SEO, the problems is 2 weeks ago when i started reading about affiliate marketing at the first day i said " i must start a niche about fitness and bodybuilding ", 2nd day i said " no, niche about weightloss will be better ", 3rd day i said " niche about low carb diet will be more specific", yesterday i decided to make it about ketogenic diet and today when i wake up i said " ketogenic diet recipes & ketostix reviews will be a win" and 2hours ago while im trying to dig deeper in the ketogenic related keywords, i found a keyword search for a solution for a problem which i suffered from for many years and i alrdy fixed it with suggested bid ~$2 with very low competition,
          just copied it to amazon search and found some nice products ( which the visitor will 100% need it to get over his problem) to promote, my experience is growing very fast and i want to start asap and im sure if i spend 100$ today on paid service, the next week i'll regret it cause i will find better ways which i can get better results for the same 100$. thats my point of view and sure i will take the facebook ads seriously just need to feel more comfortable about what im doing . thankyou for sharing your thoughts with me
          Having a difficult time settling on a niche or specific audiences problem can be overwhelming, especially once you start to learn all the marketing techniques shared here in the forum.

          While I'll admit, I still go through phases of being overwhelmed by having too much to choose from, you really need to settle on one topic, one niche, one audience, and stay focused on delivering a solution to that audience.

          To simplify how I see internet marketing is simply; find a common problem. Find or create the best high quality solution you can find. (*Obviously, both of these steps require displined effort and research... don't just assume, hey they're fat, and sell them some junk pills!)

          Next, you need to reverse engineer the solution. Another words, once you have a top quality offer or product you feel confident could help your target audience... put yourself where they are now.

          Then, guide them accordingly to the solution.

          Those who've mastered these techniques (Unlike myself who is still working on that, lol) - can lay out the path from front-back, and gather the appropriate information needed from their audiences habits (clickthroughs, buying habits, email opens, or even responding to a survey and directly informing you of their needs, etc...)

          I think one of the biggest issues newbies face in trying to establish an online business is they become so consumed with wanting to make money, they forget the priority never changes... expose quality products/services & deliver solutions to the right audience seeking those solutions. It takes time, resarch, and effort... but if you focus on helping other first, the money will follow... in my opinion.

          Lastly, I can tell you the only reason I am not making 6-figures online, is simply because I spend to much time questioning my knowledge, and ability to help others. Do yourself a favor, don't be a perfectionist, get stuff out there, test it, tweak it, and collect the results to determine if you should scale-up or move on.

          All the Best,

          Art
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