state of the Dating advice niche

26 replies
Hey

I'm in france and looking for insights on the US dating advice niche.

Are some people still making a lot of money in this niche. It really feels like everything has been done and said, really no new ideas floating around...
Also from my experience, it's hard to use adwords and Facebook to generate trafic.

I'd love to have the opinion of some fellow warriors in the know.
#advice #dating #niche #state
  • Profile picture of the author melchidex88
    Actually, FB ads and Adwords are still the easiest ways to generate traffic. Doing volume is never the problem, especially with the reach these platforms have. The problem lies in getting low conversions and not investing in accumulating data. Whenever I start a campaign I invest about $500 - $1000 in data to find out where my control lies. Once I'm at that point I start to further optimize and cut away the fat so I can pump money in what's converting. There's plenty of money still to be made in the dating niche, that market is bigger than you might think. Some tools I recommend to collect good data from your traffic are Kissmetrics, Analytics, Adword's Conversions Tracking, FB's CONV pixel, Visual Website Optimizer and Voluum.
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    • Profile picture of the author boris s
      Originally Posted by melchidex88 View Post

      Actually, FB ads and Adwords are still the easiest ways to generate traffic. Doing volume is never the problem, especially with the reach these platforms have. The problem lies in getting low conversions and not investing in accumulating data. Whenever I start a campaign I invest about $500 - $1000 in data to find out where my control lies. Once I'm at that point I start to further optimize and cut away the fat so I can pump money in what's converting. There's plenty of money still to be made in the dating niche, that market is bigger than you might think. Some tools I recommend to collect good data from your traffic are Kissmetrics, Analytics, Adword's Conversions Tracking, FB's CONV pixel, Visual Website Optimizer and Voluum.

      @melchidex88 : well, from my experience FB does not really accept dating advice ads (my accounts have been shut down twice).
      Have you had better luck ?
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      • Profile picture of the author melchidex88
        Originally Posted by boris s View Post

        @melchidex88 : well, from my experience FB does not really accept dating advice ads (my accounts have been shut down twice).
        Have you had better luck ?
        That's because you promoted dating offers by making claims one can't measure or proof. If you promote dating offers on Facebook you need to NOT make any claims but inform the audience on what is possible.

        Here's an example of an ad title that will get you rejected:

        Get The Hottest Girls With These 2 Pickup Lines

        Here's an example of an ad title that will get your ads approved:

        Let Us Help You In Trying To Find The Right Girl For You

        Obviously the first one sounds more sexy but once I drill deep and create a ton of ad variations I eventually stumble on a sexy combination of ad title and description that Facebook approves of and actually converts MUCH better,
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        • Profile picture of the author discrat
          Very saturated Market but if done right a load of money to be made

          No question !!


          - Robert Andrew
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        • Profile picture of the author boris s
          Originally Posted by melchidex88 View Post

          That's because you promoted dating offers by making claims one can't measure or proof. If you promote dating offers on Facebook you need to NOT make any claims but inform the audience on what is possible.

          Here's an example of an ad title that will get you rejected:

          Get The Hottest Girls With These 2 Pickup Lines

          Here's an example of an ad title that will get your ads approved:

          Let Us Help You In Trying To Find The Right Girl For You

          Obviously the first one sounds more sexy but once I drill deep and create a ton of ad variations I eventually stumble on a sexy combination of ad title and description that Facebook approves of and actually converts MUCH better,
          Thanks, that's great advice, good to know someone is able to advertise dating advice products on FB ! So I'll try something smoother.
          What about the LP, I know autoplay is a nono, but can i sned direct to vsl or do i have to capture leads ?
          ps : i'm on the french market , it's very similar to the US market.
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          • Profile picture of the author melchidex88
            Originally Posted by boris s View Post

            Thanks, that's great advice, good to know someone is able to advertise dating advice products on FB ! So I'll try something smoother.
            What about the LP, I know autoplay is a nono, but can i sned direct to vsl or do i have to capture leads ?
            ps : i'm on the french market , it's very similar to the US market.
            Do not send your traffic directly to the offer, pre-sell them on your page that does not force an opt-in. Facebook is starting to become what Adwords became 5 years ago. This means no false claims and no forced opt-ins. Add to the experience of a user, find out what they want to learn/discover and give it to them while gently sending them in a sales funnel. Don't use auto play videos or flashy ads or anything of that sort. Best to send traffic to a blog full of quality posts and to then redirect them to an opt-in page. Put an OTO in your lead funnel to recoup your ads investment and promote the offers through a newsletter of some sort.
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            • Profile picture of the author boris s
              Originally Posted by melchidex88 View Post

              Do not send your traffic directly to the offer, pre-sell them on your page that does not force an opt-in. Facebook is starting to become what Adwords became 5 years ago. This means no false claims and no forced opt-ins. Add to the experience of a user, find out what they want to learn/discover and give it to them while gently sending them in a sales funnel. Don't use auto play videos or flashy ads or anything of that sort. Best to send traffic to a blog full of quality posts and to then redirect them to an opt-in page. Put an OTO in your lead funnel to recoup your ads investment and promote the offers through a newsletter of some sort.
              wow, so you really got to go smooth, not agressive... Good to know you are still making money that way.
              I'll definitely try to set that up. thanks again.
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  • Profile picture of the author Brent Stangel
    There's plenty of money still to be made in the dating niche,
    People are being born all the time. They all grow up and want to fall in love. It's getting tougher all the time...

    Need I go on?
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    • Profile picture of the author boris s
      Originally Posted by Brent Stangel View Post

      People are being born all the time. They all grow up and want to fall in love. It's getting tougher all the time...

      Need I go on?
      you got a point there
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  • Profile picture of the author dhiraj192
    Originally Posted by boris s View Post

    Hey

    It really feels like everything has been done and said, really no new ideas floating around...
    Isn't that true of most markets? Mostly it's looking for new ways of packaging and presenting 'old' material. Naturally there are exceptions.
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  • Profile picture of the author jazbo
    I'm in it and it's working for me.

    But you need to build a brand that people want to keep coming back to as they go through their dating journey.
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    • Profile picture of the author boris s
      Originally Posted by jazbo View Post

      I'm in it and it's working for me.

      But you need to build a brand that people want to keep coming back to as they go through their dating journey.

      what do you have in my mind when you talk about "dating journey" ? Do you think people actually come back for different needs during their life, I had a feeling it was more a phase thing, people are willing to buy products for 6 weeks to 6 months and then move on, as that area of their life gets better OR they lose faith in dating infoproducts...
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    • Originally Posted by jazbo View Post

      I'm in it and it's working for me.

      But you need to build a brand that people want to keep coming back to as they go through their dating journey.
      I'm in it too and it seems pretty dead and saturated to me. I even have some truly fabulous domain names/brands for it. So what exactly is working for you? Affiliate links and banners? A white label program? Direct linking through PPC? Or are you hosting and controlling everything by using a dating script or custom software and having all the customer data?
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  • There's another thing going on, too. Aside from the big whales like match.com gobbling up the market, people are now using mobile apps instead of the Web, making it even harder for the little guy to do well in this arena.
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  • Profile picture of the author Rod Cortez
    Originally Posted by boris s View Post

    Hey

    I'm in france and looking for insights on the US dating advice niche.

    Are some people still making a lot of money in this niche. It really feels like everything has been done and said, really no new ideas floating around...
    Also from my experience, it's hard to use adwords and Facebook to generate trafic.

    I'd love to have the opinion of some fellow warriors in the know.
    The US "dating advice" niche is comprised of many, many sub-niches and micro-niches and there are plenty of monetization models to choose from.

    There are more single people who have access to the internet via mobile devices, laptops, PCs, etc than ever before.

    I've been a dating coach for well over a decade and can tell you that not everything has been "done and said". Besides, everyone's life experience and perspective when it comes to dating is unique and different and it also depends on how you package and promote your product and /or service.

    I've sold both products and services in the dating advice niche on a global scale.

    While it is a hyper, uber-competitive niche to get into, with the right positioning, sales funnels, back-end strategy, it's still very profitable.

    But if you don't know what you're doing, you can lose your shirt real fast.

    As with any new business venture, regardless of what niche you decide to go into, make sure you do your market research. Make sure it's a niche that has lots of buyers, repeat buyers, room for growth, etc.

    There's a new millionaire being made in the dating advice niche at least weekly. And I don't see that changing anytime soon.

    RoD
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  • Profile picture of the author CPABeyondNetwork
    Of course, there's still a ton of money to be made in that niche.. Dating will always be a money making niche. If you have a right way to promote it you will earn great for sure.


    Best regards,

    CPA Beyond
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    • Originally Posted by CPABeyondNetwork View Post

      Of course, there's still a ton of money to be made in that niche.. Dating will always be a money making niche. If you have a right way to promote it you will earn great for sure.


      Best regards,

      CPA Beyond
      It looks like some of us think this thread is about dating per se when it is really about "dating advice." Or perhaps only me? Lol, I did not even know people were really making significant money promoting "dating advice." To me that is hilarious, but funnier for those who are "laughing all the way to the bank" I guess. I can see if one is a professional "dating coach," but otherwise if someone is just doing something online then I'd love to know how people are making money with "dating advice." So what I said before was only about dating/matchmaking per se, not "dating advice."

      So it looks like maybe I've been on the wrong side all these years trying to make money with the dating and matchmaking part when I should have just gone into "advice," lol.
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  • Profile picture of the author Write Now
    I have a friend that operates in that niche and he does really well. He would create ads on Plenty of Fish pointed towards other dating sites and earn money for every sign up. However, I think Plenty of Fish has begun limiting who they allow to advertise, so this may not be a viable option.
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  • Profile picture of the author laurenceh
    Hey Boris,

    I'm heavy into the niche (copywriting/marketing/project managing/affiliate managing) working with some of the "bigger players" and like Rod says, the money still being made in the niche is huge. You just need to think outside the box, really identify with your market, and make sure you stand out.

    As far as "everything already being said," Tinder hasn't been out for all that long. There are a ton of new products out there on how to meet women on Tinder. They teach how to set up your profile, what messages to send, why you shouldn't use certain photos etc.

    There's always something new to say and it's a HUNGRY niche. I've seen guys buy multiple products over periods of years and STILL grab anything you put out there. The money is there, but do your homework, and study what's working already.
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  • Profile picture of the author Rod Cortez
    Laurence brings up an excellent point. About ten years ago you had to struggle to find an information product (which does very well in the "dating advice" segment) that dealt with text game (for you newbies to pickup all that means is how to communicate with women via text to get her more interested in you and to increase conversions in actually getting a date with her).

    Today there are plenty of e-books, membership websites, videos, etc. that cater to this very specific specialized niche within the niche of dating advice. I can think of at least a dozen topics off the top of my head that have been profitable that fit under the "dating advice" niche. There are a lot of specialized micro-niches and the previous poster mentioning Tinder just gave out a solid idea, someone should run with it.

    If you're focusing on the male gender, then there's no shortage of potential customers. How many people turn 18 everyday? How many men are getting divorced and are looking for ways to get back into the dating market? How many out there are looking for that special someone to spend the rest of their life with? How many mean out there want to learn how to ask a woman out?

    How often should they call her? Should they call her right away after getting her number or should they wait? Should they text her first or call her first? Should he set up the first date a certain way? Should he offer to pick her up? When should he try and kiss her? What are some signals that shows she's interested?

    What does it mean when she tells him, "We're NOT having sex tonight?". What does it mean when her pupils become dialated? What is a "sh*t test" and how does he overcome them? What if she says "I'm seeing someone else but it isn't serious?" What if she asks you tough questions like, "How many women have you been with?"

    Believe it or not, there are a lot of men who don't know the answers to these questions.

    Yes, the dating advice niche under the umbrella of the dating market is not only vast and competitive, but there are new customers that come into it every single second. Not every minute, every single second.

    And these rabid buyers don't just purchase one product. Which is why if you're a marketer that knows how to launch a product and set up a sales funnel with a comprehensive back-end strategy, you can do extremely well. The caveat being that you have to know what you are doing or have someone guiding you.

    Regarding traffic: for me personally, my time is extremely valuable, so I no longer focus on things like SEO or social media for most things, I BUY my traffic. Facebook, Plenty Of Fish, Adwords, and other forms of PPC are not the only game in town. If you can learn about paid traffic from guys like Jonathan Mizel and Tim Gross, Charles Kirkland (to name a few) and are willing to invest in your own business, meaning you aren't afraid to take some losses before making a profit, then you should be able to do really well.

    What I see a lot of newbies do is they jump right into the dating advice market and they'll write an ebook or hire someone to write an ebook, put up a website or blog, then buy ONE form of traffic like Facebook or Google Adwords, and then they lose their shirt.

    And it's not always because they didn't deliver a good product. I've seen some exceptional dating products out in the market that didn't do well simply because of this ONE thing:

    They didn't know their breakeven numbers.

    What do I mean by that? Well, I could write a whole ebook on the topic, but the bottomline here is that they didn't figure out how many products they had sell at a certain conversion rate to figure out what their breakeven point was.

    They price their product arbitrarily and they don't perform any extensive testing to figure out what their optimal price point should be. I've seen people run tests for a few days or even a week or two, they get a few thousand visitors, don't make enough money and then they quit.

    Folks, that's just the beginning of your testing. You have to tweak your sales copy, which keywords you're going to bid on and at what cost, you have to test your autoresponder messages if that's what you're using to communicate with your visitors, and a whole bunch of other things.

    The one weakness about forum advice is that you can't really give a complete picture of what it takes to make something like work. So I'm trying to give an overview of what it takes to make it in a very competitive niche such as the dating advice niche.

    It's extremely profitable and it's a niche that I jump in and out of because I can come into it anytime and set up a profitable sales funnel because I already know what works. But it took many months and thousands of dollars of testing for me to get there.

    Can you succeed using SEO and social media? Yes, absolutely you can. I've done it, I have friends that are doing it. I have a friend who ONLY uses video websites like Youtube to drive sales. It can be done. However, I like getting instant results, so my own bias is towards paid traffic.

    This is a profitable niche, but it isn't for the faint of heart. You have to have a longterm view of your business.

    RoD
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    • Profile picture of the author boris s
      Originally Posted by Rod Cortez View Post

      Laurence brings up an excellent point. About ten years ago you had to struggle to find an information product (which does very well in the "dating advice" segment) that dealt with text game (for you newbies to pickup all that means is how to communicate with women via text to get her more interested in you and to increase conversions in actually getting a date with her).

      Today there are plenty of e-books, membership websites, videos, etc. that cater to this very specific specialized niche within the niche of dating advice. I can think of at least a dozen topics off the top of my head that have been profitable that fit under the "dating advice" niche. There are a lot of specialized micro-niches and the previous poster mentioning Tinder just gave out a solid idea, someone should run with it.

      If you're focusing on the male gender, then there's no shortage of potential customers. How many people turn 18 everyday? How many men are getting divorced and are looking for ways to get back into the dating market? How many out there are looking for that special someone to spend the rest of their life with? How many mean out there want to learn how to ask a woman out?

      How often should they call her? Should they call her right away after getting her number or should they wait? Should they text her first or call her first? Should he set up the first date a certain way? Should he offer to pick her up? When should he try and kiss her? What are some signals that shows she's interested?

      What does it mean when she tells him, "We're NOT having sex tonight?". What does it mean when her pupils become dialated? What is a "sh*t test" and how does he overcome them? What if she says "I'm seeing someone else but it isn't serious?" What if she asks you tough questions like, "How many women have you been with?"

      Believe it or not, there are a lot of men who don't know the answers to these questions.

      Yes, the dating advice niche under the umbrella of the dating market is not only vast and competitive, but there are new customers that come into it every single second. Not every minute, every single second.

      And these rabid buyers don't just purchase one product. Which is why if you're a marketer that knows how to launch a product and set up a sales funnel with a comprehensive back-end strategy, you can do extremely well. The caveat being that you have to know what you are doing or have someone guiding you.

      Regarding traffic: for me personally, my time is extremely valuable, so I no longer focus on things like SEO or social media for most things, I BUY my traffic. Facebook, Plenty Of Fish, Adwords, and other forms of PPC are not the only game in town. If you can learn about paid traffic from guys like Jonathan Mizel and Tim Gross, Charles Kirkland (to name a few) and are willing to invest in your own business, meaning you aren't afraid to take some losses before making a profit, then you should be able to do really well.

      What I see a lot of newbies do is they jump right into the dating advice market and they'll write an ebook or hire someone to write an ebook, put up a website or blog, then buy ONE form of traffic like Facebook or Google Adwords, and then they lose their shirt.

      And it's not always because they didn't deliver a good product. I've seen some exceptional dating products out in the market that didn't do well simply because of this ONE thing:

      They didn't know their breakeven numbers.

      What do I mean by that? Well, I could write a whole ebook on the topic, but the bottomline here is that they didn't figure out how many products they had sell at a certain conversion rate to figure out what their breakeven point was.

      They price their product arbitrarily and they don't perform any extensive testing to figure out what their optimal price point should be. I've seen people run tests for a few days or even a week or two, they get a few thousand visitors, don't make enough money and then they quit.

      Folks, that's just the beginning of your testing. You have to tweak your sales copy, which keywords you're going to bid on and at what cost, you have to test your autoresponder messages if that's what you're using to communicate with your visitors, and a whole bunch of other things.

      The one weakness about forum advice is that you can't really give a complete picture of what it takes to make something like work. So I'm trying to give an overview of what it takes to make it in a very competitive niche such as the dating advice niche.

      It's extremely profitable and it's a niche that I jump in and out of because I can come into it anytime and set up a profitable sales funnel because I already know what works. But it took many months and thousands of dollars of testing for me to get there.

      Can you succeed using SEO and social media? Yes, absolutely you can. I've done it, I have friends that are doing it. I have a friend who ONLY uses video websites like Youtube to drive sales. It can be done. However, I like getting instant results, so my own bias is towards paid traffic.

      This is a profitable niche, but it isn't for the faint of heart. You have to have a longterm view of your business.

      RoD

      Rod, 48h later, your post has really got me thinking. I did try to pm you but fact is I was totally blown away by the insights I got from your post.

      I realise today I'm having a real hard time getting into paid trafic (FB and adwords are not dating advice friendly, so i need to look into other sources). and I DON'T have a "comprehensive back-end strategy" as you say.

      Can anyone recommend a course or a teacher to learn to master both these aspects of my company ?? I feel if I start exploring myslef, I won't have results before 12 months !!

      Any advice is welcome
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      • Profile picture of the author Rod Cortez
        Originally Posted by boris s View Post

        Rod, 48h later, your post has really got me thinking. I did try to pm you but fact is I was totally blown away by the insights I got from your post.

        I realise today I'm having a real hard time getting into paid trafic (FB and adwords are not dating advice friendly, so i need to look into other sources). and I DON'T have a "comprehensive back-end strategy" as you say.

        Can anyone recommend a course or a teacher to learn to master both these aspects of my company ?? I feel if I start exploring myslef, I won't have results before 12 months !!

        Any advice is welcome
        Sorry for the delay, but I've been knee-deep in seminars the past couple of weeks on top of working on some other things. I also don't come here as often as I used to.

        You have a nice-looking website and though I cannot read French the first thing that came to my mind when I looked at your webpage was "where in the heck is his opt-in form?"

        I will reply to your PM in much more detail no later than 48 hours from now.

        If your blog is getting over a million views (are they unique) then you should be making some very nice cashflow, though my caveat is, where are those viewers coming from?

        RoD
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  • Profile picture of the author boris s
    @ Laurenceh, @Rod : it's encouraging to read you guys.

    You know, I've got a million views/month on my blog (leader in the french market) and i've got a fairly large product catalog (20-25 products) and client list.
    But my turnover is stagnating because I'm still not getting it when it comes to trafic buy and backend/big ticket products
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  • Profile picture of the author icoachu
    You might want to poke around subniches on Kindle.

    you'd be surprised at the demand for dating advice books for certain market segments.
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    • Profile picture of the author boris s
      Originally Posted by icoachu View Post

      You might want to poke around subniches on Kindle.

      you'd be surprised at the demand for dating advice books for certain market segments.
      thanks, some sound advice right there...
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