Amazon.com vs Fiverr.com - Amazon Sues Fiverr Peeps | Warrior Forum - The #1 Digital Marketing Forum & Marketplace

sconer

9 years ago

Originally Posted by DABK

but it didn't sue Fiverr... just Fiverr people.

Suing Fiverr for that would be like suing Craigslist for prostitution.

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DavePalermo 9 years ago

I love how Amazon is suing a bunch of nobodies over stupid fake reviews.
Like you can't tell they are fake when they are all within a month or even a week of each other.
And you should know when it's not an "Amazon Verified Purchase" that it has a tendency to be bogus.

Amazon needs to really get it s*** together with some of their sellers as well.
I bought a pair of sunglasses that were fake Oakley's from some half whit seller.....

Get a grip Amazon.
Sue those guys for what?
They ain't got no money....
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conscolor

9 years ago

R.I.P amazon fake review

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trevord92

9 years ago

Since Amazon own their own site they could remove most of the fake reviews in an instant.

To me this sounds like a warning shot to people who've bought or been tempted to buy fake reviews.

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sconer

9 years ago

Originally Posted by trevord92

Since Amazon own their own site they could remove most of the fake reviews in an instant.

To me this sounds like a warning shot to people who've bought or been tempted to buy fake reviews.

That's exactly what it is.

It's also some cheap publicity as well as a play to make it look like they care about the consumer.

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patco

8 years ago

Originally Posted by trevord92

Since Amazon own their own site they could remove most of the fake reviews in an instant.

To me this sounds like a warning shot to people who've bought or been tempted to buy fake reviews.

Yes. I really do agree with you... But such reviews are all around the net

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johnben1444

9 years ago

This is case of misplaced priority.

They should be suing Fiverr and not the peeps.
To make it makes it look like a child's play.

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MikeFriedman 9 years ago

Originally Posted by johnben1444

This is case of misplaced priority.

They should be suing Fiverr and not the peeps.
To make it makes it look like a child's play.

Nonsense. To hell with those scam artists on Fiverr. Go right after them.

They can go after Fiverr too, but don't let these shitheads hide behind FIverr.
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sconer

9 years ago

Originally Posted by johnben1444

This is case of misplaced priority.

They should be suing Fiverr and not the peeps.
To make it makes it look like a child's play.

Why go after Fiverr?

Do you really think that Fiverr should be reviewing and fully understanding the policies of everyone corporation out there, and then police their own sellers to make sure that they are in line with other company's rules?

If I was selling these fake reviews from a booth at a flea market, would you blame the flea market and want Amazon to go after them?

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DABK

9 years ago

You don't need to understand any company's policies to block anyone from selling reviews.

As soon as you seee: Reviews, $ 5 a piece, you know you should stop it.

Originally Posted by sconer

Why go after Fiverr?

Do you really think that Fiverr should be reviewing and fully understanding the policies of everyone corporation out there, and then police their own sellers to make sure that they are in line with other company's rules?

If I was selling these fake reviews from a booth at a flea market, would you blame the flea market and want Amazon to go after them?

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sconer

8 years ago

Originally Posted by DABK

You don't need to understand any company's policies to block anyone from selling reviews.

As soon as you seee: Reviews, $ 5 a piece, you know you should stop it.

Why?

Why should Fiverr base their guidelines on your moral compass?

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DABK

8 years ago

Fiverr shouldn't base anything on anything I do or think.

Fiverr should do whatever is in its best interest that the laws allow. Should it come to: it's best in Fiverr's interest to not allow fake reviews, Fiverr does not need to know about guidelines. Common sense would suffice.

Originally Posted by sconer

Why?

Why should Fiverr base their guidelines on your moral compass?

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sconer

8 years ago

Originally Posted by DABK

Fiverr shouldn't base anything on anything I do or think.

Fiverr should do whatever is in its best interest that the laws allow. Should it come to: it's best in Fiverr's interest to not allow fake reviews, Fiverr does not need to know about guidelines. Common sense would suffice.

I am sorry, but I don't understand what you are saying.

Fiverr did nothing wrong, they are operating within the law. They also did what is in their best interest, they allowed the sale of legal services which made them money- profit.

I see no reason why Fiverr should care about Amazon's rules and policies.

I'll ask this question again, since you never answered it: Would you support Amazon suing a flea market if one of the tables was selling fake Amazon reviews? Do you think the flea market administrator should be going around and checking with all corporation's policies to make sure that the sellers in their flea market are adhering to them?

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quadagon

8 years ago

Originally Posted by sconer

Why?

Why should Fiverr base their guidelines on your moral compass?

They shouldn't go on moral judgement but laws on the land. What these people were doing was commit fraud.

Originally Posted by sconer

I am sorry, but I don't understand what you are saying.

Fiverr did nothing wrong, they are operating within the law. They also did what is in their best interest, they allowed the sale of legal services which made them money- profit.

I see no reason why Fiverr should care about Amazon's rules and policies.

I'll ask this question again, since you never answered it: Would you support Amazon suing a flea market if one of the tables was selling fake Amazon reviews? Do you think the flea market administrator should be going around and checking with all corporation's policies to make sure that the sellers in their flea market are adhering to them?

Flea Markets get fined and shut down all the time allowing illegal activities to take place, like piracy. If Amazon found a flea market that was committing this kind of fraud then why not. Let's remember that this is mass fraud 1100 reviewers with 100's and 1000's of (here that word again) fraudulent reviews.

As for fiverr if they are letting it happen then they are responsible in the same way peer2peer software and torrent sites were/are responsible for the illegal activity that takes.

What Amazon needs to do next is remove the books from sale and go after the 'authors' - most of which won't have authored their own books.

Then go after the guru's who teach this shit.

Then go after the teaching programs that have you do review exchanges to falsely inflate your book reviews.

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sconer

8 years ago

Originally Posted by quadagon

They shouldn't go on moral judgement but laws on the land. What these people were doing was commit fraud.

What these people were doing is practicing their Constitutional rights.

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quadagon

8 years ago

Originally Posted by sconer

What these people were doing is practicing their Constitutional rights.

No constitutional right here in the UK, still fraud.

Now I'm not knowledgeable on state law but I'd imagine freedom of speech has limits in law like liable, slander, false representation, misrepresentation, fraud, trade description etc

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sconer

8 years ago

Originally Posted by quadagon

No constitutional right here in the UK

That's sad.

Now I'm not knowledgeable on state law but I'd imagine freedom of speech has limits in law like liable, slander, false representation, misrepresentation, fraud, trade description etc

This entire forum is full to the top with people who falsely represent themselves. You can call it fraud in the same way. Get over it.

Remember, this is nothing more than a civil lawsuit. I can sue you right now for misrepresenting yourself as a quadagon.

If Amazon cares that much about fake reviews, they can do many things to curb it. One of the easiest ways is to only allow reviews from verified buyers, like most other online retailers do it. I think this lawsuit is more about getting some good publicity like I said above.

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quadagon

8 years ago

Originally Posted by sconer

If Amazon cares that much about fake reviews, they can do many things to curb it. One of the easiest ways is to only allow reviews from verified buyers, like most other online retailers do it. I think this lawsuit is more about getting some good publicity like I said above.

Some of them that are being sued are over verified reviews. With kdp select free days and countdown promotions it was easy to achieve.

Scammers just had to add the value of the book to the gig price if it was on sale.

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sconer

8 years ago

Originally Posted by quadagon

Some of them that are being sued are over verified reviews. With kdp select free days and countdown promotions it was easy to achieve.

Scammers just had to add the value of the book to the gig price if it was on sale.

Like I said, Amazon can figure out ways to curb this if they really think it's such a problem.

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nettiapina

8 years ago

Originally Posted by sconer

What these people were doing is practicing their Constitutional rights.

Are you seriously claiming that selling a fraudulent reviews, and basically adding those reviews to the end of the actual product description is free speech protected by constitution? You can't seriously think that such position makes any sense.

If those people were posting the reviews on their own website or handing them out on the street that would be completely different. It might still be some sort of fraud, but at least they'd not directly try to scam buyers.

In my opinion Fiverr should just be a good netizen, and police their listings a bit better. It's should not be that hard.

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trevord92

8 years ago

Originally Posted by nettiapina

In my opinion Fiverr should just be a good netizen, and police their listings a bit better. It's should not be that hard.

Agreed.

It's not just happening with Amazon - Reviews is a complete category on Fiverr with lots of options available. Google will doubtless eventually swat the ones that are offering fake reviews as will Facebook - they're used to using software to do that kind of thing (Amazon should be as well).

It should also be a relatively easy option for Fiverr to introduce - at a minimum it could be something in their terms of service that says the gig provider confirms that their gig doesn't break any terms & conditions (that may be there already, not read through their entire T&C). Then a quick routine that picked up all the gigs that mentioned the words review and Amazon/Google/etc to put them in a queue that went through an extra authentication process. A basic coding task.

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sconer

8 years ago

Originally Posted by trevord92

Agreed.

It's not just happening with Amazon - Reviews is a complete category on Fiverr with lots of options available. Google will doubtless eventually swat the ones that are offering fake reviews as will Facebook - they're used to using software to do that kind of thing (Amazon should be as well).

It should also be a relatively easy option for Fiverr to introduce - at a minimum it could be something in their terms of service that says the gig provider confirms that their gig doesn't break any terms & conditions (that may be there already, not read through their entire T&C). Then a quick routine that picked up all the gigs that mentioned the words review and Amazon/Google/etc to put them in a queue that went through an extra authentication process. A basic coding task.

I asked early but didn't get an answer. Why should Fiverr make rules based on your moral compass of what is right and wrong?

Why should Fiverr run their business based on the policies of other companies??

Maybe I have a website called Hamazon.com that welcomes fake reviews. Why shouldn't Fiverr have sellers that provide those?

Also, I find it amusing that a man who has been a member of this forum for the last decade is complaining about fake reviews and misrepresentation on other websites

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kilgore

8 years ago

My guess is that Amazon didn't go after Fiverr for two reasons:

Lack of standing. I think it would be hard for Amazon to prove that Fiverr has harmed them. Clearly Fiverr is breaking the law by abetting this sort of illegal behavior, but civil and criminal law are two different beasts. For instance, it would be illegal for my neighbors to sell drugs out of their house, but while the police could go after them, it would be hard for me as a private citizen to do so, even if they're bringing down my property values.
Big pockets. Fiverr is well-funded and has a team of lawyers on call. This is in contrast to most -- if not all -- of the people that Amazon is suing who likely won't even bother defending themselves if for no other reason that they don't have the resources to do so. In short a Fiverr lawsuit would be costly and drag on.

That said, for those who want to see Fiverr taken down, it's not unlikely that a suit such as this will make regulators at the FTC (and elsewhere) more likely to take on this case. And it'll certainly be hard for Fiverr to disavow knowledge of this activity taking place on their site.

Originally Posted by sconer

I asked early but didn't get an answer. Why should Fiverr make rules based on your moral compass of what is right and wrong?

Why should Fiverr run their business based on the policies of other companies??

First, I do think companies should be ethical. And while there are certainly gray areas when it comes to business ethics, I'm pretty sure that most people regard profiting off of people lying and committing fraud as unethical.

But aside from ethics, Fiverr is likely breaking the law. For fun reading you can read the FTC's "Guides Concerning the Use of Endorsements and Testimonials in Advertising" at https://www.ftc.gov/sites/default/fi...mentguides.pdf. Without going into detail,while there is nothing specifically about providing fake reviews on a service such as Fiverr, it's clear that the FTC would consider reviews such as those posted as product endorsements. And based on my reading, it's not the fact that they are fake that is problematic, the problem is the lack of disclosure about the relationship of the endorser to the products being endorsed. This is why affiliate marketers like me have disclosure statements on our page.

That said, does this mean that if the fake reviewers are breaking the law, Fiverr is? I have no idea. But it seems a sufficiently gray area that if I were CEO, I would rather lose my cut of a relatively small amount of $5 gigs rather than risk legal action.

Originally Posted by sconer

Maybe I have a website called Hamazon.com that welcomes fake reviews. Why shouldn't Fiverr have sellers that provide those?

Because it's illegal. It's not the terms of the website that's important: it's the law.

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sconer

8 years ago

Originally Posted by kilgore

First, I do think companies should be ethical.

That's fine, you are entitled to your opinion, but it is 100% worthless. No one cares how you think they should run their company.

And while there are certainly gray areas when it comes to business ethics, I'm pretty sure that most people regard profiting off of people lying and committing fraud as unethical.

Then this entire forum which you take part of is unethical, as I cited many times above. Why would you take part in this?

But aside from ethics, Fiverr is likely breaking the law. For fun reading you can read the FTC's "Guides Concerning the Use of Endorsements and Testimonials in Advertising" at https://www.ftc.gov/sites/default/fi...mentguides.pdf. Without going into detail,while there is nothing specifically about providing fake reviews on a service such as Fiverr, it's clear that the FTC would consider reviews such as those posted as product endorsements. And based on my reading, it's not the fact that they are fake that is problematic, the problem is the lack of disclosure about the relationship of the endorser to the products being endorsed. This is why affiliate marketers like me have disclosure statements on our page.

If that were true, then the Warrior Forum would be committing even more illegal acts than Fiverr.

Be serious, the first WSO tells me how it will give me 10 high quality PR8 backlinks for $15. You, me, and everyone with a pulse at the Warrior Forums knows that is a blatant lie, outright fraud. yet we all allow it to happen. Why? Because the Warrior Forum isn't responsible, just like Fiverr isn't.

Because it's illegal. It's not the terms of the website that's important: it's the law.

No, it is NOT illegal.

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kilgore

8 years ago

Originally Posted by sconer

If that were true, then the Warrior Forum would be committing even more illegal acts than Fiverr.

Be serious, the first WSO tells me how it will give me 10 high quality PR8 backlinks for $15. You, me, and everyone with a pulse at the Warrior Forums knows that is a blatant lie, outright fraud. yet we all allow it to happen. Why? Because the Warrior Forum isn't responsible, just like Fiverr isn't.

Maybe the WF is committing illegal acts. As I said above about Fiverr, I really don't know if they are or they aren't. It's clearly illegal under FTC rules to endorse a product without proper disclosure. Does that mean that Fiverr or the WF or anyone else is breaking the law by providing a marketplace for such activity? I really don't know.

As for me, I never buy, sell or even visit the WSO section, though I don't doubt that what you say is there is bought and sold. Even so, I don't think that basing your legal theory on what happens in the WSO section is going to get you very far...

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rjd1265

8 years ago

Originally Posted by kilgore

Maybe the WF is committing illegal acts. As I said above about Fiverr, I really don't know if they are or they aren't. It's clearly illegal under FTC rules to endorse a product without proper disclosure. Does that mean that Fiverr or the WF or anyone else is breaking the law by providing a marketplace for such activity? I really don't know.

As for me, I never buy, sell or even visit the WSO section, though I don't doubt that what you say is there is bought and sold. Even so, I don't think that basing your legal theory on what happens in the WSO section is going to get you very far...

They names specific sellers in the lawsuit, not Fiverr.
Amazon Complaint Re Reviews

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sconer

8 years ago

Originally Posted by kilgore

Maybe the WF is committing illegal acts. As I said above about Fiverr, I really don't know if they are or they aren't. It's clearly illegal under FTC rules to endorse a product without proper disclosure. Does that mean that Fiverr or the WF or anyone else is breaking the law by providing a marketplace for such activity? I really don't know.

As for me, I never buy, sell or even visit the WSO section, though I don't doubt that what you say is there is bought and sold. Even so, I don't think that basing your legal theory on what happens in the WSO section is going to get you very far...

No, it might not "get me very far". But it is showing the hypocrisy of all of those people here lambasting Fiverr for allowing paid reviews while patronizing this forum which helps scammers actively steal from members. Far worse, and they know it.

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sconer

8 years ago

Originally Posted by nettiapina

Are you seriously claiming that selling a fraudulent reviews, and basically adding those reviews to the end of the actual product description is free speech protected by constitution? You can't seriously think that such position makes any sense.

Yes, and it makes perfect sense. I use Amazon all the time and I take the reviews with a grain of salt. They are just other people's opinions, which they are entitled to. And the last time I looked, it's not illegal to lie.

In my opinion Fiverr should just be a good netizen, and police their listings a bit better. It's should not be that hard.

Yet you post on Warrior Forum in which you KNOW is at least half filled with scammers. People who will fraudulently take money from others under the guise of being professional SEO's and marketers.

Fake reviews on Amazon don't hurt people (ie. taking their money) nearly as much as the typical WSO on this forum. This forum is a travesty to the internet, it doesn't police any of the scams at all, yet you are complaining that Fiverr should police for misrepresented opinions???

Click on any random WSO and I guarantee it has at least one fake review on it. Half of the WSO's are filled with fake reviews.

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Kay King

8 years ago

"operating within the law"...is not a given - at least for their US office. The services may be legal in Fiverr's headquarters (in Israel, I think). Not so much in the US (office in NY) where consumer protection and truth in lending laws might be used if the practice gets too much attention.

Fiverr issued a statement read on network news a couple days ago in which they claim they do not allow gigs that violate Amazon or other sites terms and that those gigs are removed immediately when found or reported to Fiverr.

Then the reporter pulled up Fiverr and pointed out several ads offering "reviews"....

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sconer

8 years ago

Originally Posted by Kay King

"operating within the law"...is not a given - at least for their US office. The services may be legal in Fiverr's headquarters (in Israel, I think). Not so much in the US (office in NY) where consumer protection and truth in lending laws might be used if the practice gets too much attention.

At one point the residents of NY were worried about it being illegal to buy a 32 ounce soda. I don't really care much about NY's stupid laws.

Fiverr issued a statement read on network news a couple days ago in which they claim they do not allow gigs that violate Amazon or other sites terms and that those gigs are removed immediately when found or reported to Fiverr.

Fiverr is free to make that policy if they choose. Just because they choose to pull listing that violates other company's policies, it doesn't mean that they are liable for them if they slip thru.

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Michael J Anthony

8 years ago

Originally Posted by Kay King

Fiverr issued a statement read on network news a couple days ago in which they claim they do not allow gigs that violate Amazon or other sites terms and that those gigs are removed immediately when found or reported to Fiverr.

Then the reporter pulled up Fiverr and pointed out several ads offering "reviews"....

Those reviews pulled up by the reporter must not have been "found" or "reported" by anyone..yet. LOL

Originally Posted by sconer

Maybe I have a website called Hamazon.com that welcomes fake reviews.

This is a good idea. You should create Hamazon.com or something and, as a policy, welcome fake reviews. You'd probably clean up. LOL.

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sconer

8 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael J Anthony

Those reviews pulled up by the reporter must not have been "found" or "reported" by anyone..yet. LOL

Nor should they be expected to be pulled yet.

It's just like eBay, there are WAY too many listings for them to police themselves, they rely on people reporting the listings, and many slip thru. So at any given time you will find listings that are illegal or against the rules.

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quadagon

8 years ago

Originally Posted by sconer

And the last time I looked, it's not illegal to lie.

There are loads of situations where lieing is illegal, you should look harder.

Here's a start purgery, misrepresentation, false representation, plagerism, copyright violation, impersonating a police officer, impersonating a doctor, fraud.

I actually agree that something should be done about testimonials in the WSO section but you can't say because it happens here it's ok for it to happen on amazon.

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sconer

8 years ago

Originally Posted by quadagon

There are loads of situations where lieing is illegal, you should look harder.

Here's a start purgery, misrepresentation, false representation, plagerism, copyright violation, impersonating a police officer, impersonating a doctor, fraud.

As I said, lying in itself is not illegal. None of those things you stated above are what's happening at the fault of Fiverr.

I actually agree that something should be done about testimonials in the WSO section but you can't say because it happens here it's ok for it to happen on amazon.

Well no, that's not it. My point is that it is MUCH worse here. I can't describe how much worse the scamming is here. Yet you are saying that Fiverr should be blamed when they actually haven't done anything wrong at all.

If you actually cared about fraud and misrepresentation, you would never mention Fiverr or Amazon again, you would focus on this forum since it is so much worse.

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DABK

8 years ago

Where I am fake reviews are illegal: it is illegal to misrepresent. It is illegal to say something is good if you have not used it.

It is also illegal to help people perform illegal acts/actions.

If any of the buyers are from around here, Fiverr abetted illegal activities.

Originally Posted by sconer

I am sorry, but I don't understand what you are saying.

Fiverr did nothing wrong, they are operating within the law. They also did what is in their best interest, they allowed the sale of legal services which made them money- profit.

I see no reason why Fiverr should care about Amazon's rules and policies.

I'll ask this question again, since you never answered it: Would you support Amazon suing a flea market if one of the tables was selling fake Amazon reviews? Do you think the flea market administrator should be going around and checking with all corporation's policies to make sure that the sellers in their flea market are adhering to them?

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sconer

8 years ago

Originally Posted by DABK

Where I am fake reviews are illegal: it is illegal to misrepresent. It is illegal to say something is good if you have not used it.

It is also illegal to help people perform illegal acts/actions.

If any of the buyers are from around here, Fiverr abetted illegal activities.

Where are you from in which it's illegal to say something is good if you have not used it?

Right now I am saying that ShopRite brand shampoo is great.

I've never actually used it, so I guess I just committed a crime where you are from, huh?

It's nice that you're supporting such a horrible lack of free speech.....

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quadagon

8 years ago

Originally Posted by sconer

Where are you from in which it's illegal to say something is good if you have not used it?

Right now I am saying that ShopRite brand shampoo is great.

I've never actually used it, so I guess I just committed a crime where you are from, huh?

It's nice that you're supporting such a horrible lack of free speech.....

It's not a freedom of speech issue. The first amendment does not cover commercial speech and the supreme court acknowledges:

"commercial speech that is false or misleading is not entitled to any protection under the First Amendment,"

As these 'reviewers were paid for their opinion they fall under commercial speech.

Assuming that you are talking about us law.

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Braznyc

9 years ago

It's not suing Fiverr directly, but Fiverr will get the message.

Amazon is doing the right thing: people work hard to sell and have genuine reviews, then comes the crooks to cheat.

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quadagon

8 years ago

They have they are suing the fraudsters. Then they'll go after the 'authors'.

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WareTime

8 years ago

wonder how many warriors are fiverr review writers LOL

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footfoot

8 years ago

Fiverr lucky to escape unscathed pushing this fraud.

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conscolor

8 years ago

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neteater

8 years ago

wrong move, they should instead sue seller .

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troy23

8 years ago

Good on them.
Long may it continue.

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agmccall

8 years ago

What if I were to contact a fiverr seller and have them write an "honest" review, and they purchase the book, although I would be paying extra, for the gig.

Isn't that the same as contacting Amazons top reviewers and "gifting" them your book for a review?

al

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rjd1265

8 years ago

Read the whole lawsuit.

Basically Amazon is suing any Fiverr seller who had a successful transaction in posting fake reviews.

They in turn, will also be cancelling or modifying any seller accounts on Amazon who took action in these fake reviews.

My thoughts: (50/50)
1. Who Cares: Every ad you see has some form of "lying" in it.
2. Good: You should run your business honestly and deceiving other buyers is poor ethics

On a side note, the 3 main sellers they named in the lawsuit now show up on Fiverr as "Seller not found"

Ryan

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nicheblogger75

8 years ago

I don't know about the legal intricacies of the lawsuit, but I for one am glad that Amazon did this.

When I shop on Amazon I read those reviews and that can and does affect whether or not I make a purchase.

If I purchased some piece of crap product because a bunch of idiots posted fake reviews, I wouldn't be a happy camper, especially if it was a high ticket item.

Amazon is only protecting their business and I believe that they actually care about the consumer also.

As for the morons who think it's a good idea to sell fake reviews for $5, they deserve everything they get.

There are so many ways to make money ethically online I see absolutely no reason why somebody would even engage in selling fake reviews for $5. What a stupid thing to do. Anybody who did/does that must be too stupid to make money online the right way and so maybe it's best they just go and get a job digging ditches or something instead of defrauding consumers for $5. It's like the scum that sell fake solo ad traffic. You pay top dollar for clicks and then get junk from a bot. It all comes down to fake reviews because that's how people find sellers to buy from. The bottom line is that fake reviews are dangerous, they are fraudulent, and they cost consumers a lot of money. Any marketplace would be much better off without them.

As for Fiverr, if they allowed it to happen they should be held responsible too. I wouldn't care one way or another if Fiverr disappeared from the Internet tomorrow. I could go on Fiverr right now and find about 50 Gigs that were fraud or borderline fraud in about 5 minutes. If Fiverr doesn't want to police it's own marketplace and take proactive steps to eliminate fraud then they shouldn't be allowed to operate at all.

And what's with all of the WF bashing? If you don't like this awesome forum then leave.

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sconer

8 years ago

Originally Posted by nicheblogger75

I don't know about the legal intricacies of the lawsuit, but I for one am glad that Amazon did this.

When I shop on Amazon I read those reviews and that can and does affect whether or not I make a purchase.

If I purchased some piece of crap product because a bunch of idiots posted fake reviews, I wouldn't be a happy camper, especially if it was a high ticket item.

And that would be YOUR fault. Buyer beware. Due diligence is your responsibility.

Believing a review left on Amazon is the same exact thing as believing a review left on a WSO thread saying that the thread starter actually did give them 25 high quality PR-8 links for $8.

And what's with all of the WF bashing? If you don't like this awesome forum then leave.

Who is bashing? It's funny the way you say "As for Fiverr, if they allowed it to happen they should be held responsible too." yet you don't think the Warrior Forum should be held to the same standards. Is that because you yourself are one of the many WSO scammers? Why else would you expect Fiverr to be held responsible for fake reviews being sold on their website but not expect Warrior Forums to be held responsible for the massive amounts of scams being sold daily.

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Jonathongs Banned 8 years ago

I think fiverr is most sensitive site and the moderation team don't allow any fake review or fake people. They are always active against scam.
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kilgore

8 years ago

Originally Posted by agmccall

What if I were to contact a fiverr seller and have them write an "honest" review, and they purchase the book, although I would be paying extra, for the gig.

Isn't that the same as contacting Amazons top reviewers and "gifting" them your book for a review?

The relevant difference comes down to disclosure. Amazon gives people products to review under their "Vine" program, but each of those reviews is clearly marked "Vine Customer Review of Free Product" and while I'm not sure it's universal often you see statements like "Received for review by the Amazon Vine program" within the review itself such as Andrea Polk's review here:

Amazon.com: LG LAP340 Wireless Soundplate... .

If all these Fiverr sellers mentioned within their reviews that they were compensated for providing their reviews, they likely wouldn't be doing anything illegal. Of course, they still might be violating Amazon's TOS, but that's another story.

Originally Posted by sconer

Who is bashing? It's funny the way you say "As for Fiverr, if they allowed it to happen they should be held responsible too." yet you don't think the Warrior Forum should be held to the same standards. Is that because you yourself are one of the many WSO scammers? Why else would you expect Fiverr to be held responsible for fake reviews being sold on their website but not expect Warrior Forums to be held responsible for the massive amounts of scams being sold daily.

What gives you the impression that we don't want the WF to be held to the same standards? I can't speak for Nicheblogger75, but I certainly would love to see these scams and fake claims cleaned up -- by the WF itself, the FTC or whoever else. And judging by the numerous threads bemoaning the state of this site, I know I'm not the only one. That fact is, however, that there's very little any of us can do -- and just because some people are running shady deals around here doesn't mean that everyone is or that this site has no value to honest entrepreneurs.

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nicheblogger75

8 years ago

Originally Posted by sconer

And that would be YOUR fault. Buyer beware. Due diligence is your responsibility.

Believing a review left on Amazon is the same exact thing as believing a review left on a WSO thread saying that the thread starter actually did give them 25 high quality PR-8 links for $8.

Who is bashing? It's funny the way you say "As for Fiverr, if they allowed it to happen they should be held responsible too." yet you don't think the Warrior Forum should be held to the same standards. Is that because you yourself are one of the many WSO scammers? Why else would you expect Fiverr to be held responsible for fake reviews being sold on their website but not expect Warrior Forums to be held responsible for the massive amounts of scams being sold daily.

So basically you are saying that all reviews are worthless? How else should potential buyers get information on whether or not a product is good then? Buy it? That would defeat the purpose completely.

I never said that the Warrior Forum should not be held to the same standard. Of course they should. If the mods discover that anybody has either posted a fake review or that a seller has paid for reviews the WSO should be taken down immediately and the involved parties banned from the site for life.

I have published one WSO which is a list of legitimate solo sellers that I made specifically so that people would NOT get scammed, so the answer to your question is no, I am not one of the "many" WSO scammers, and the fact that you would insinuate that based on your speculation is ludicrous. I got scammed many times when I first started buying solo ads, and there is nothing I hate more than being ripped off because I purchased a product/service based on phony reviews.

BTW, I've purchased quite a few WSOs over the years and 90% of them, if not more, have been pretty good for the price. I don't believe that "WSO scammers" are as big a problem here as you seem to think.

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sconer

8 years ago

Originally Posted by nicheblogger75

So basically you are saying that all reviews are worthless?

They are worth exactly what you paid for them.

You can't depend on a review, any adult knows that, or should know it.

How else should potential buyers get information on whether or not a product is good then? Buy it? That would defeat the purpose completely.

How did people figure out how to buy things before the internet?

You are starting to sound like an entitled liberal.

I never said that the Warrior Forum should not be held to the same standard. Of course they should. If the mods discover that anybody has either posted a fake review or that a seller has paid for reviews the WSO should be taken down immediately and the involved parties banned from the site for life.

I can find 50 of them right now, positive reviews for sellers who sold 25 PR-8 backlinks for $9.50. Reporting them does nothing.

But this goes further than that. What you are saying is that anyone who has bought those scams (which must be in the tens of thousands by now) could sue Warrior Forums, and you would want them to win. That is what you are saying by agreeing that Fiverr should be sued for the fake reviews sold on their website.

I have published one WSO which is a list of legitimate solo sellers that I made specifically so that people would NOT get scammed, so the answer to your question is no, I am not one of the "many" WSO scammers, and the fact that you would insinuate that based on your speculation is ludicrous. I got scammed many times when I first started buying solo ads, and there is nothing I hate more than being ripped off because I purchased a product/service based on phony reviews.

Then why aren't you going after Warrior Forums right now for allowing it to happen RIGHT NOW?

BTW, I've purchased quite a few WSOs over the years and 90% of them, if not more, have been pretty good for the price. I don't believe that "WSO scammers" are as big a problem here as you seem to think.

It's a HUGE problem here.

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kilgore

8 years ago

Originally Posted by sconer

They are worth exactly what you paid for them.

You can't depend on a review, any adult knows that, or should know it.

How did people figure out how to buy things before the internet?

You are starting to sound like an entitled liberal.

I can find 50 of them right now, positive reviews for sellers who sold 25 PR-8 backlinks for $9.50. Reporting them does nothing.

But this goes further than that. What you are saying is that anyone who has bought those scams (which must be in the tens of thousands by now) could sue Warrior Forums, and you would want them to win. That is what you are saying by agreeing that Fiverr should be sued for the fake reviews sold on their website.

Then why aren't you going after Warrior Forums right now for allowing it to happen RIGHT NOW?

It's a HUGE problem here.

All right, you win. You can't trust anybody. Everything you read is a lie -- especially reviews. The Warrior Forum is filled with scammers, liars and cheats. Yadda, yadda, yadda. And of course anybody who disagrees with you is an entitled liberal

Fun times.

Can we close and lock this thread already? It's beyond helping anybody at this point.

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sconer 8 years ago

Originally Posted by kilgore

All right, you win. You can't trust anybody. Everything you read is a lie -- especially reviews.

I know you are being sarcastic, but you are also very correct.

You need to verify all information, ESPECIALLY information you get from the internet.

I have been using Amazon since it's inception, long before I knew that people could pay other people to leave false reviews. But I still never completely trusted the Amazon review system, if for no other reason than people are idiots. Have you ever read thru the reviews? You will see people give a 1 star negative review for a $20 iPhone charger because an iPhone doesn't come with it!

The Warrior Forum is filled with scammers, liars and cheats.

Yes, it is. But we are expected to do our own due diligence. Suing Warrior Forums is not the right thing to do.

And of course anybody who disagrees with you is an entitled liberal

No, only the people who feel that they are entitled and have a right to an accurate review system.

That's just silliness on your part. And I noticed how you ignored my question about how we all bought products before Amazon's review system was born.

Can we close and lock this thread already? It's beyond helping anybody at this point.

Why would you want to lock a thread? Are you really that mad that the thread isn't going your way? That's very childish of you.

This thread was about Amazon suing the sellers of fake reviews. It was taken off track b the people who want to blame Fiverr for it instead.
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rjd1265

8 years ago

Originally Posted by nicheblogger75

As for Fiverr, if they allowed it to happen they should be held responsible too. I wouldn't care one way or another if Fiverr disappeared from the Internet tomorrow. I could go on Fiverr right now and find about 50 Gigs that were fraud or borderline fraud in about 5 minutes. If Fiverr doesn't want to police it's own marketplace and take proactive steps to eliminate fraud then they shouldn't be allowed to operate at all.

They need a moderator, not to disappear.

I use them daily for my software company and most of the sellers do a great job. I use them for graphics, articles, video content and editing.

I agree there are many scams on there, but that is on any site...even here. You know...the pay me $7 and I will show you how to make $200 a day bullshit.

I am sure this will really open up Fiverr's eyes and within days you will see most of the scams, fake reviews and "SEO" services disappear.

The 3 main people named in the lawsuit already shut down their Fiverr accounts. Either because they are scared shitless, Fiverr themselves shut them down or they came to an agreement with Amazon.

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visimedia

8 years ago

paid review, kinda in a grey area of business. hard to decide if it's legit or not, 1 side it must be a user based , the other side it's like an ad.

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jeffreydale

8 years ago

I heard a lot of the sellers have moved over to Market Source to sell their Amazon gigs now. This is just a hiccup in the road, these guys aren't gonna stop selling, it makes them way too much money.

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nicheblogger75

8 years ago

Originally Posted by jeffreydale

I heard a lot of the sellers have moved over to Market Source to sell their Amazon gigs now. This is just a hiccup in the road, these guys aren't gonna stop selling, it makes them way too much money.

Unfortunately you're probably right. There are lots of other Gig sites that they could move to. The only thing is I think that many of these sites will probably sit up and take notice of what is going on with Fiverr and they might be a little more hesitant to let it go on.

Somehow I have a feeling that this is just the tip of the iceberg and Amazon is just getting started. I guess maybe I totally underestimated what a big business selling these reviews is. I didn't realize that so many people were making big money doing it. I wouldn't do it no matter how much money I could make from it, but that's just me.

If you think about it what Amazon is doing is totally the right move. There are almost no downsides for them. They are eliminating fraudulent reviews, making their site a more trusted marketplace, but not only that they are getting some great publicity. If anything, I think doing this type of thing will only increase their popularity because consumers will believe that Amazon really cares about their experience, which I actually think they do.

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writeaway

8 years ago

They are basically just hitting low hanging fruit.

Those gigs are OBVIOUS and they got dinged.

Not surprising at all.

In fact, it was just a matter of WHEN.

The BIG QUESTION is whether Amazon will bring down the Hammer on REVIEW EXCHANGES.

That's the 100 Million Dollar Question...

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