I don't understand why the plethora of marketers who have sand in their butt cracks over opting in

it reminds me of someone who get's a book on 'sleight of hand' tricks, and then is somewhere where some guy is performing tricks - and instead of just enjoying the show and observing how he does his thing, they feel tricked and ripped off, heckle, etc.

or like buying a wso and never taking action and then buying another, whats the point ?

I don't really get it either. A person can always just unsubscribe. I've unsubscribed from a hundred different lists. It is no big deal.

It is a weird trait of human nature. It is just there and it ain't gonna change. I wouldn't get worked up over it any more than getting worked-up over most people having two eyes and a nose.

Once you have paid for it, you should be entitled to get the product. Unless the sales letter states that you will have to sign on to the list to get it, the price they ask for was paid and you should be able to get it. Once I pay the cost as for in the sales letter, telling me that I have to sign on to your list is no different than telling me that I have to pay an additional dollar or more. It is an additional cost. And some people just resent that, and I understand that very well. And I am sorry that you can't understand that.

I dont see what the big problem is. I quite like having sand in my butt crack. But thats just me.

I actually opt in with new lists every day...you can
get a ton of good information that way...

on the other hand, I opt out of lists everyday as well...
when I feel they are no longer useful.

I think it's all in the asking. If I feel like you are upfront in asking for my info -- then I have no problem. Also, I usually do not opt in for freebies with a marketer whose info I am not interested in for the long haul anyway OR to at least look at their stuff for ideas for my own business.

My product registration page is the highest opt in rate I've ever achieved (100%).

What's that sound?

"The Penny Drops."

Do you think you could be perhaps a bit more honest in your characterization of what people are really complaining about? I think we both know what you just wrote left out a very crucial component. For the sake of those not familiar with the other thread that this OP is obviously referring to, the major part he left out is that the opting in was required by the seller only after the payment was made by the buyer. No disclosure of this was made on the sales page. So the buyer (me in this case) paid under the terms mentioned on the sales page (that did not include anything about list subscribing), and was then required to confirm after opting in to the seller's list in order to receive the product for which I'd paid. I paid and was not granted access to the product until after I'd confirmed the opt-in. This is known as forced opt-in, and it's amazing to me that the OP failed to include this absolutely critical difference. Very telling, isn't it?

This is NOT about cases where the seller only makes opting in to his/her list OPTIONAL.

It's a shame I had to do for the OP here what he should have been honest enough to point out himself. If we're going to debate something, can we all agree to do so honestly? I'd hate to see this forum degenerate into people cherry-picking only the aspects of the other side that help them score points. It's disingenuous and serves no purpose.

We're all marketers, but all marketing practices are not equal in terms of how ethical they are.

John

What I dont get is why you felt the need to start a rant opposite the other rant.

You could have easily put your thoughts in the other thread.

Oh wait... you did.

So why start a new? Did you not scream loud enough in the other one to be noticed?
Right back at you.

edit: Yes I know you didnt cry or scream in the other and I see your point. However, people should discuss practices. Conversations like the other one, made me change some of my practices - for the better.

Surely moaning about people moaning is just as irrelevant?

You ever buy something in one of those big chain stores and they want to check your receipt and bag as you leave the store?

Do you let them?

I don't, because as soon as I pay for the product it's mine. And they don't have the right to make me jump through hoops to get it.

I think that's the same way people feel about those opt-in forms -- I have already purchased the product and now someone wants to put another roadblock in my way before I can get what is legally mine.

Of course we understand building a list -- that's a fundamental of marketing online. But there are ways to do that without pissing off your customers. And while YOU may not care about the process, it's obvious others do, so why not build your list in a way that doesn't alienate some of the people who just gave you money?

Jay Jennings

Funny no one ever complains about all those sellers that AUTOMATICALLY add you to a list by parsing the data from Paypal without even asking your permission.

There's plenty of warriors who use scripts like DLguard to do this. Isn't it worse to be added to a list without even knowing it's happening? Many WSOs do this.

It depends on how it is done.

When a marketer on their thank you page says, "You will not get this product until you sign up" then there is something wrong. Have an opt in box on your thank you page, and let people chose. In my experience over 90% will sign up.

It is also intersting to see how many say you can't have the product until you sign up, but then deliever the product before you confirm.

I will normally opt in but don't tell me I can't have what I have paid for until I do.

That is what many people object to, not getting what they paid for.

Checking my butt crack now.

Supposedly is the key word here. If whining were a business strategy, there would be some multi-billionaires here.

Okay, so I spent way too many hours reading the "Picturesque Speech" column in my granny's Reader's Digest collection.

Where do I go to complain about the butt-crack around my sand?

If you squint very hard...don't look at her look at me...I am on the beach with sands in my butt.