Marketing cliches don't make good posts

23 replies
For those of you that slept through freshman English class . . .

Or were more focused on the gross pizza splatter on the teacher's blue perma-pressed shirt . . .

A cliche is a trite stereotyped expression or very common thought that has lost all its originality and impact after long overuse.

In simpler terms, its a device used to simplify communication.

Cliches are rampant in this forum, more so than any other forum I've visited.

So what? Why does it matter, you say?

Cliches, while often true, are rarely helpful unless they spur one to appropriate action.

IM cliches are a form of shorthand communication, but are nearly always useless because they don't lay out the details. Cliches should never be considered ample substitutes for solid detailed real world money making advice.

Here's a popular WF cliche: "the money is in the list." We've all given that advice at times, but is it really useful to someone who has no experience in actual list building? When you tell a newbie to build a list, is that going to be enough for him to do it?

What I believe this forum needs is more detailed personal experience-based instruction and fewer marketing cliches as in down to earth, rubber meets the road, I did it my way instruction (how was that for 3 cliches in a row?)

Here's another IM cliche: "set it and forget it passive income." Most members understand the principle, right? But how does that advice hold any usefulness for a newbie that has no online business experience? It's meaningless because it carries no details, it's lacking the guts of how to actually set things up.

"If you can believe it, you can achieve it." Great advice right? Let me ask you this - How does believing you are Taylor Swift, or LeBron James, or Smokey the Bear make it so? How does believing you are a millionaire cause money to appear in your bank account? If you think I'm saying mindset is not important . . . you're missing the point. Of course it's important, but merely giving that advice to a novice doesn't help much when they have no clue what goes into the right business mindset and approach in the first place.

I hope this thought about cliches makes some sense . . . especially to those giving advice to new members with no former business experience.

When you post a response to a question, realize that merely throwing out a marketing cliche is not particularly helpful to anyone.

For those of you starting threads that ask a question, the best responses will come when the questions asked are focused and specific. It's best if just one question is asked per thread, IMO - you will get more helpful and detailed answers.

Questions like "How do I market my product?" are so broad they make responders hesitant because meaningful answers can't be given in a short post. Be respectful of other people's time.

The best to all of you,

Steve
#cliches #good #make #marketing #posts
  • Profile picture of the author Janice Sperry
    You make some great points for thread starters and responders alike.

    I had never really thought about how pervasive the cliches are until you pointed it out. Like you point out many of the cliches have some truth behind them but they seldom tell the whole story or give enough details to really assist someone. Just adding a sentence or two could make a big difference.

    It may be sidetracking but may I also add two simple suggestion for thread starters?

    1. If you are asking a question - use a question mark (?)!!!
    Many experienced members will not click on a thread if they think someone started a thread to give suggestions on a topic. They don't need suggestions on that topic because they are experts already. However, if it is a QUESTION they may visit the thread to see if they can offer some help.

    2. Ask the full question so we know what you are asking!!!
    A cryptic partial sentence will not encourage people to view your thread.

    On the main page right now there is a thread with the title "Card payment".

    The thread is actually a question not a statement. It is also a question about using a debit card with Payoneer. How is someone supposed to guess that? I wasted my time opening the thread because I have no experience with Payoneer.

    Sorry for the rant but it seems like we are seeing more and more of these poorly written thread titles.
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  • Profile picture of the author newbim
    So can you tell me how to market or not?? Jus' kidding.

    I completely agree. I think that making money online is seen as the easy option. Someone has an expensive month, and immediately jump online to solve their money woes. I'll hold my hand up to having done this in the past.
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  • Profile picture of the author newbim
    (Sorry, posted too quickly)

    .... It's soo easy to put too much of an onus on the mindset (although it is a vital part of the game), and when you see so many people claiming to make so much money online, it's easy to believe that you're just no good at it.
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  • Profile picture of the author webmarke
    Originally Posted by Steve B View Post

    For those of you that slept through freshman English class . . .

    Or were more focused on the gross pizza splatter on the teacher's blue perma-pressed shirt . . .

    A cliche is a trite stereotyped expression or very common thought that has lost all its originality and impact after long overuse.

    In simpler terms, its a device used to simplify communication.

    Cliches are rampant in this forum, more so than any other forum I've visited.

    So what? Why does it matter, you say?

    Cliches, while often true, are rarely helpful unless they spur one to appropriate action.

    IM cliches are a form of shorthand communication, but are nearly always useless because they don't lay out the details. Cliches should never be considered ample substitutes for solid detailed real world money making advice.

    Here's a popular WF cliche: "the money is in the list." We've all given that advice at times, but is it really useful to someone who has no experience in actual list building? When you tell a newbie to build a list, is that going to be enough for him to do it?

    What I believe this forum needs is more detailed personal experience-based instruction and fewer marketing cliches as in down to earth, rubber meets the road, I did it my way instruction (how was that for 3 cliches in a row?)

    Here's another IM cliche: "set it and forget it passive income." Most members understand the principle, right? But how does that advice hold any usefulness for a newbie that has no online business experience? It's meaningless because it carries no details, it's lacking the guts of how to actually set things up.

    "If you can believe it, you can achieve it." Great advice right? Let me ask you this - How does believing you are Taylor Swift, or LeBron James, or Smokey the Bear make it so? How does believing you are a millionaire cause money to appear in your bank account? If you think I'm saying mindset is not important . . . you're missing the point. Of course it's important, but merely giving that advice to a novice doesn't help much when they have no clue what goes into the right business mindset and approach in the first place.

    I hope this thought about cliches makes some sense . . . especially to those giving advice to new members with no former business experience.

    When you post a response to a question, realize that merely throwing out a marketing cliche is not particularly helpful to anyone.

    For those of you starting threads that ask a question, the best responses will come when the questions asked are focused and specific. It's best if just one question is asked per thread, IMO - you will get more helpful and detailed answers.

    Questions like "How do I market my product?" are so broad they make responders hesitant because meaningful answers can't be given in a short post. Be respectful of other people's time.

    The best to all of you,

    Steve
    Another great post Steve B. I always enjoy reading your threads and comments because they are always thoughtful and precise.

    I mentioned that to say this..."The reason people are using cliches on this forum is not because they don't know any better. Instead...It's because they are not really trying to help the newbie OPs.

    They are simply submitting a quick comment to get exposure for their sig.

    They simply put in a generic comment that the newbie OP's will never be able to use because their comment has no meat.

    I like to call their comments... "Dive By Comments"

    They simply show up to post as many comments on as many threads as possible and have no interest (or no clue) of how they can help other people.

    This is something that we all have to deal with and I would suggest forum readers to never reward the people who use "Drive By Comments" by clicking on their signature ads.
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  • Profile picture of the author Greg guitar
    Good thoughts. I'd just like to add that a penny saved is a penny earned, but it's still just a penny, so let's not get too hung up about it, lest we fail to see the forest for the trees, and please don't be taking any wooden nickels.
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  • Profile picture of the author gingerninjas
    I completely agree with you here and absolutely believe that real life examples to back up any thread post is so valuable. If you think about it, we are mostly all here to improve our skill set, offer advice from experience or enhance our offering, so the more we share real life experience rather than sweeping cliches the better. I look forward to reading more posts that provide a honest insight into plenty of scenarios our WF members are looking to explore. I find some of the more niche questions so valuable, and while I have only been here for a few weeks it has given me so much information in this short time. Thanks again
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  • Profile picture of the author katrim
    Very useful post and I'm first in line to dust up and try to provide more value to the community that's given me so much training and information along the years. I feel that at least some part of that clichés happen because the same questions pop up time and time again.

    Sometimes it's actually hard to LISTEN (understand) what the person's asking.For example I see replies that are obviously regurgitated or even have little to do with the questions asked.

    Sometimes It can be a long, unformatted block of text that's hard to read and follow.

    Sometimes it's because the one posting isn't a native English speaker and it's hard to understand...

    Anyway, my point is that I feel at least some of these clichés are due to various communication problems and don't all have a malicious (aka shameless self-promotion) intent. Fluid communication is not that simple.

    Maybe we should have an experiment, day a week where we do Spartan rules Short, to the point, no fluff, just value. Both in the questions and replies.

    Now that would be interesting.

    Anyway, I salute this post for pointing it out and hope it leaves us better warriors than it found us.
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  • Profile picture of the author Brent Stangel
    For those of you that slept through freshman English class . . .
    Hey, I resemble that remark.

    What I believe this forum needs is more detailed personal experience-based instruction and fewer marketing cliches as in down to earth, rubber meets the road, I did it my way instruction
    Most people on this forum have none.
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    • Profile picture of the author Robscom
      Originally Posted by Brent Stangel View Post


      Most people on this forum have none.
      I agree, and I think that's why so many give the general advice that they researched or read elsewhere.

      So if you have little-to-no experience, but you don't want to post cliches or 500-word-articles, how can you post things that are helpful to the forum?

      I post about things I have experience with (in my brick-and-mortar job), but I don't have much else to contribute, I feel.

      I post questions, but I don't know if that is particularly helpful.

      Any suggestions?
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  • Profile picture of the author BigFrank
    Banned
    The saddest part of this behavior is that the people who do nothing more than post trite clichés, mind-numbing platitudes, spiritually-based mumbo-jumbo and worthless bromides are so self-absorbed and clueless that they truly believe they are adding value to the forum and actually doing something to make people's lives better, when in truth they are doing more harm than good, to both.

    Additionally, most of this is proffered by folks that have never had any success in business, either on or off line and posting their thoughts is their only way at attempting to feel that they have something to contribute to the world around them.

    Spouting nonsense doe not enhance your credibility, nor does it provide anything of substance that can be used by anyone to reach an increased level of success.

    The things that are put forth as the 'secrets of success' are things that any moderately educated individual should know by now, unless they have been holed-up in a cave for most of their formative years.

    Stop reading this nonsense being put forth by smug, clueless individuals that have never done anything in their own lives of any merit, but are ready to tell you what you need to do and how you need to think to reach a level of success that they will never achieve, themselves.

    Looking to others to show you the road to success, by adopting their mindset and personal belief system, is the fastest way to wind up in the ditch called failure.

    Rah-rah-shish-boom-ba! Yeah, that'll put money in your pocket. :-)

    Cheers. - Frank
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  • Profile picture of the author SiteNameSales
    I'm a great believer in free markets. Let the market decide what is a cliche and what has useful information. If you can communicate with others who place value on your work (or curated content for that matter), it doesn't matter what label you place on the information.

    The real issue is that developing a good, solid blog devoted to internet marketing is hard work for a very, very competitive environment. Getting a significant number of people to read your stuff is a challenge unless you are considered one of the top shelf gurus.

    So I'm saying, "let it all hang out." Forum comments, Facebook posts, tweets, twats, periscope sessions, hangouts, snapchats, pins and instagram pics.

    Let the market decide. You be the judge.
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    • Profile picture of the author BigFrank
      Banned
      Originally Posted by SiteNameSales View Post

      Let the market decide. You be the judge.
      I believe the OP's post was related to posting this kind of crap in the forums.

      I have already judged most of it to be worthless drivel. If I went to anyone's blog and saw that kind of stuff posted, I'd be gone, for good, instantly - as would anyone with an IQ over room temperature. No one wants to read claptrap, unless they have very low expectations.

      Cheers. - Frank
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      • Profile picture of the author MikeAmbrosio
        Originally Posted by BigFrank View Post

        I believe the OP's post was related to posting this kind of crap in the forums.

        I have already judged most of it to be worthless drivel. If I went to anyone's blog and saw that kind of stuff posted, I'd be gone, for good, instantly - as would anyone with an IQ over room temperature. No one wants to read claptrap, unless they have very low expectations.

        Cheers. - Frank
        Claptrap it is. But if no one wanted to read it, you wouldn't see it everywhere.

        Kinda like all that Viagra spam - if it weren't for the clueless, the spam wouldn't be profitable - and there would be less spam.

        But you know what they say: To each their own. One man's crap is another man's treasure. You gotta take the bad with the good. Etc. and so on...

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        • Profile picture of the author BigFrank
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          Originally Posted by MikeAmbrosio View Post

          Claptrap it is. But if no one wanted to read it, you wouldn't see it everywhere.
          Well, I can't agree with that, at all. It's no different than graffiti. It's not there because you want to see it. It's there because someone else thinks you should see it.
          Kinda like all that Viagra spam - if it weren't for the clueless, the spam wouldn't be profitable - and there would be less spam.
          I think you mean that is it 'weren't for the 'limp-dicked.' Viagra spam exists because a certain segment of the population has a need for the product, but in an effort to target those particular individuals, we are all subjected to the annoyance of spam.
          But you know what they say: To each their own. One man's crap is another man's treasure. You gotta take the bad with the good. Etc. and so on...
          In my world crap is crap and I get to judge, as I am the master of my universe. :-)

          Besides, it's all good and you really shouldn't overthink it as everything happens for a reason and at the end of the day you shouldn't get all bent out of shape over anything, anyway.

          Cheers. - Frank
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          • Profile picture of the author MikeAmbrosio
            Originally Posted by BigFrank View Post

            Well, I can't agree with that, at all. It's no different than graffiti. It's not there because you want to see it. It's there because someone else thinks you should see it.
            Well, I can't agree with that at all either. Graffiti is there because of low IQ wannabe's who think what they put up is awesome, whereas those who spout all those cliches...

            Um, maybe you're right.
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    • Profile picture of the author Steve B
      Originally Posted by SiteNameSales View Post

      Let the market decide what is a cliche and what has useful information . . . So I'm saying, "let it all hang out." Forum comments, Facebook posts, tweets, twats, periscope sessions, hangouts, snapchats, pins and instagram pics.

      SiteNameSales,

      Thanks for your alternate viewpoint.

      You may have missed my intent.

      My comments were directed specifically to comments and posts on this forum. I was not talking about curated content, blogs, tweets, pins, and pics as you describe.

      To me, a cliche, regardless of where it is posted, is mostly meaningless shorthand that holds little or no value when the person asking a question is looking for enough of an answer to actually solve a problem.

      That's all that was intended.

      Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author SiteNameSales
    Ok, I step back a bit. Nevertheless, I guess what I'm saying still has relevance. People can choose to hang out on this forum or not and people can contribute post that are worth considering or not.

    I don't read every single post here. In fact, I glance through the headlines most of the time seeing if there's a topic where I can make a contribution.

    I'm just saying B.S. is to be expected on a forum like this and in a niche that has a large proportion of B.S. slingers to begin with. That aside, I wouldn't want to discourage anyone from contributing if they so desire just because you are I might think they don't have anything particularly interesting or original to say. Those posts are easily scanned, but others might not be so inclined to see them as useless.

    Yes, there's no doubt that some just want to get the posts noticed or whatever. But I don't to want to be the one to decide who or what is worthy of consideration.

    We agree in general and I enjoy your posts in general and I'm looking forward to the next one.
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  • Profile picture of the author boblyle
    I couldn't agree more Steve. There are many posts and threads on this forum with the same responses and very little "meat " or value. It would be great if more of the long standing SENIOR members could give solid advice that helps the newbie instead of the standby "Go learn it by yourself like I did" responses. I haven't been a member of this forum long but there is more B.S. than there is quality. I come here to look for answers and comment very little because I feel I have little to contribute. I find your posts always give good solid advice as well as a few others. Keep up the good work
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  • Profile picture of the author Happy Steve
    Thanks for your post, I agree that a lack of details usually leads to people dismissing your message leading to failure of the marketing campaign.
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  • Profile picture of the author agmccall
    and just when I came up with the "Secret Sauce" for Internet Marketing

    al
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  • Profile picture of the author Froggys
    Upvote for this, agree 100%, every sentence of your post is real and good!
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  • Profile picture of the author mb2590
    Wooo! Go Steve! There should be a forum built around this post. My very first year I know I heard and read "the money is in the list" over 1500 times and though the though was conditioned, the actual result was not. All ever ever wondered was "How the hockey sticks do I build a list?" It's funny because there are several components of building a list. You need tools, you need outsourcing if you don't want to write your own emails, you need lead magnets, you need so much. I finally grasped the concept of list building last year and I started in 2014. It should not take a year to learn what a list is or how to build one. Great post!
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  • Profile picture of the author kurioso
    Originally Posted by Steve B View Post

    For those of you that slept through freshman English

    What I believe this forum needs is more detailed personal experience-based instruction and fewer marketing cliches as in down to earth, rubber meets the road, I did it my way instruction (how was that for 3 cliches in a row?)

    Steve
    That was the first thing that came in mind after checking the wso section and other threads.
    Even some veterans (aged account still doesn't mean authority) are coming up with a cliche only camouflaged with an article of 1000 words instead of merely one or two sentences.

    In the end the're only building up for "their product" and members to blindly follow their mindset but still lack the finer details since most have no experience that is needed to achieve something online.

    Is this one of those cliches,.....?
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