How many of you would want to do consulting?

27 replies
So I have a poll type question.

I'm seriously considering putting together in a book or video or something, my experience of starting and running my own consulting firm...which ended up being extremely successful. But before I do all the work to put this together, because I'm a perfectionist and would actually put a lot of work into it, I wanted to sort of take the temperature on the community here on Warrior Forum, to see how many of you would even consider something like that valuable or of interest.

I realize WF doesn't represent the entirety of those seeking opportunity or training in doing their own biz, but felt it's a starting point.

Your feedback would be most appreciated and I'll totally create this thing and throw it on the WSO section at a discount if enough people show interest...just don't want to waste my time creating something quality that no one wants, ya know? I'm running a couple businesses now and time is precious, but the idea popped into my brain in the shower and I just had to ask and see what people think.

Thanks for your time!!! I'll buy you a virtual beer
#consulting #question for opportunists
  • Profile picture of the author Jeff Burritt
    Banned
    Yes, I already do this a little, but have considered making it more of a focus.
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    • Profile picture of the author John Westbrook
      Originally Posted by Jeff Burritt View Post

      Yes, I already do this a little, but have considered making it more of a focus.
      Cool, thanks for the reply Jeff! I learned so much from consulting and kind of love the whole thing. It's not for everyone, people who don't want human contact probably wouldn't like it, but there are ways to even limit that while building a strong business. And it's a way to make a great living that can fund all the online-only ventures one may want to dabble in and learn...while strengthening your perceptions of business to better help you sift through the BS out there online. I'll stop rambling
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  • Profile picture of the author Jeff Burritt
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    Thanks John for your feedback. I've often seen successful consultants say it is absolutely a great job. Maybe because it doesn't even feel like a job.

    Also, couldn't help smile a bit about that 'limiting the human contact' part. I know what you meant, but it just seems a bit funny. I wonder if psychologists feel the same way
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    • Profile picture of the author John Westbrook
      Originally Posted by Jeff Burritt View Post

      Thanks John for your feedback. I've often seen successful consultants say it is absolutely a great job. Maybe because it doesn't even feel like a job.

      Also, couldn't help smile a bit about that 'limiting the human contact' part. I know what you meant, but it just seems a bit funny. I wonder if psychologists feel the same way
      Haha, yeah I have a close friend who's a psychologist actually, he doesn't get burned out on people, because he manages his own psyche and I guess that's something they teach in school or you'd learn from someone you're shadowing.
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  • Profile picture of the author kilgore
    A while before I started my own business, I used to make my living as an independent IT consultant. Maybe it's different in the IT world than with other types of consulting, but in my experience there's really not a lot to teach. To be a successful consultant you either have the skills or you don't. You either have an existing client-base to draw upon or you don't. The whole point of consulting is you're already some sort of an expert, right?

    This isn't to say that there's nothing to learn. For instance, legal and tax issues always come to mind when starting any type of business. But more than any other types of business that I know, successful consulting relies on word-of-mouth referrals and networking. Who you know (and really who knows you) is 100 times more important than your marketing or other business skills.

    All that doesn't mean that there's no market for what you're doing -- but I think you need a good angle. I also think it could be tough to overcome the attitude prevalent among many consultants that they already know it all (example number one being me!) And needless to say you had better deliver actual quality. Consultants are not a naive audience who you can easily fake with platitudes or second-hand information that you've pieced together from a bunch of random Google searches or wikipedia articles.
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    • Profile picture of the author John Westbrook
      Originally Posted by kilgore View Post

      A while before I started my own business, I used to make my living as an independent IT consultant. Maybe it's different in the IT world than with other types of consulting, but in my experience there's really not a lot to teach. To be a successful consultant you either have the skills or you don't. You either have an existing client-base to draw upon or you don't. The whole point of consulting is you're already some sort of an expert, right?

      This isn't to say that there's nothing to learn. For instance, legal and tax issues always come to mind when starting any type of business. But more than any other types of business that I know, successful consulting relies on word-of-mouth referrals and networking. Who you know (and really who knows you) is 100 times more important than your marketing or other business skills.

      All that doesn't mean that there's no market for what you're doing -- but I think you need a good angle. I also think it could be tough to overcome the attitude prevalent among many consultants that they already know it all (example number one being me!) And needless to say you had better deliver actual quality. Consultants are not a naive audience who you can easily fake with platitudes or second-hand information that you've pieced together from a bunch of random Google searches or wikipedia articles.
      I guess I've learned there's always someone who wants to know what I know...and vise versa. I just want to see how many respond to this post.

      I bet you've asked "is it plugged in" a lot in your IT consulting. There are always teachable moments, even if simple

      It's our experience that often blinds us to the learning opportunities, because things become so second nature that we forget they are valuable lessons someone is wanting to learn from someone who has real world experience.
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      • Profile picture of the author kilgore
        Originally Posted by John Westbrook View Post

        I guess I've learned there's always someone who wants to know what I know...and vise versa. I just want to see how many respond to this post.

        I bet you've asked "is it plugged in" a lot in your IT consulting. There are always teachable moments, even if simple

        It's our experience that often blinds us to the learning opportunities, because things become so second nature that we forget they are valuable lessons someone is wanting to learn from someone who has real world experience.
        I wonder if we have the same definition of consulting. To me consulting is helping businesses achieve strategic objectives. In the IT world that might mean helping a business conceptualize and build a key application in terms of their strategic objectives. Or perhaps it could mean working with them to architect and deploy their technology stack given the needs they have and the resources they have to meet those needs.

        What you've described (i.e., "Is it plugged in?") is more of an operational issue. How do I fix User X's computer. And while a consultant might help a business design and deploy systems to help streamline their operational needs, if he or she is doing day-to-day operational work (such as fixing individual users' computers), they're playing less the role of a consultant and more the role of a part-time worker (even if they're being on a 1099 or corp-to-corp basis).

        The reason I bring this up is (1) I'm a conceited know-it-all who likes to nitpick little points and (2) you need to be clear about who you're potential customers are. To me -- and I'd imagine to most actual consultants -- consultants are more than just extra operational help who may or may not be experts in their chosen field. That sort of person falls more into the freelancer category; that sort of person will have different needs than an actual consultant; and in truth, that sort of person might be more receptive to the types of products you're proposing -- though my guess is they'll also have lower expectations about what might be reasonable to pay for such products.

        Consultants are experts -- and usually both in their subject matter, but also in applying their subject matter to strategic business objectives. And as such consultants are generally keenly aware of where their own strengths and weaknesses lie. Thus, they'll have higher and more specific expectations for the products they purchase -- but will probably be willing to pay more if it's really meeting a need for them.

        Moreover, I get that you don't think the Warrior Forum is just a starting point for you to get some insight about a new business direction, as starting points go, it's not a very good one -- at least if you're truly targeting potential consultants. There just aren't that many experts here -- and the ones that are here tend to already have successful businesses, so they don't seem like the types of people you'd want feedback from anyway.

        Then again, maybe you're not really after experts. Maybe you're looking more at helping people develop freelancing businesses, people whose talents might be useful on an operational level, though probably less so on a strategic level. In that case, the Warrior Forum might be a decent start for you. You just need to be clear (at least to yourself) about who you're actually trying to serve.
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        • Profile picture of the author John Westbrook
          Again, thanks for your feedback!
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  • Profile picture of the author art72
    While I have a way to go before I feel qualified to comfortably give others (businesses especially) advice, I do see the demand and the potential. In fact, it's part of my overall mission.

    Looking at most successful marketers, most offer consulting services at some level, be it from a B2C or B2B standpoint. Obviously, this is a broad subject covering coaching, 1 on 1, training, tutorials, as well as complete marketing and management systems for bigger business entities that will hire outside their firm to have fresh eyeballs evaluate their employee performance, management, etc. etc.

    Guys like Alan Weiss, Frank Kern, Ryan Levesque, among several others all come to mind, they specialize in teaching, which to me is consulting at its core. Granted, to do so at a performance based or results based earning structure, I feel there is a HUGE untapped market.

    Lastly, a family friend started a small tax firm some 20 years ago that consisted of 3 people, himself, and 2 women who answered phones, set appointments, handled office tasks, etc...

    Fast forward 20 years this guy found an angle, whereby offering 'tax grievance' service that saved companies say $1M in taxes for $100,000 - enabled him to create a consultancy that sold itself, and paid for itself. (*At his time of death last year he was worth $50M, and had humble beginnings.)

    Me... I am neck deep in learning A - Z's of internet marketing, and while I am not hitting any major home runs, the idea is to be well-equipped (and confident) that I can recognize, locate, and consult any business across multiple marketing channels to increase exposure, increase profits, and sell more goods and services.

    At times, I want to quit... but, in reality, to have a keen grip on the many key areas of IM, as Ryan Levesque puts it will certifiable increase my value when I do offer consultations and web-based services.
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  • Profile picture of the author jbsmith
    I've always done *some* consulting, my approach is to typically take is to use consulting to teach a topic and get results as well as immediate feedback...then turn the learnings into courses or wider coaching products. Consulting for me is a chance to work very closely in a market to get early champions and develop course material.
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  • Profile picture of the author George Schwab
    Originally Posted by John Westbrook View Post

    So I have a poll type question.

    I'm seriously considering putting together in a book or video or something, my experience of starting and running my own consulting firm...which ended up being extremely successful. But before I do all the work to put this together, because I'm a perfectionist and would actually put a lot of work into it, I wanted to sort of take the temperature on the community here on Warrior Forum, to see how many of you would even consider something like that valuable or of interest.

    I realize WF doesn't represent the entirety of those seeking opportunity or training in doing their own biz, but felt it's a starting point.

    Your feedback would be most appreciated and I'll totally create this thing and throw it on the WSO section at a discount if enough people show interest...just don't want to waste my time creating something quality that no one wants, ya know? I'm running a couple businesses now and time is precious, but the idea popped into my brain in the shower and I just had to ask and see what people think.

    Thanks for your time!!! I'll buy you a virtual beer
    A virtual beer , yummy!

    to be honest: not the course about it, but the actual consulting has Higher outcomes...

    i've done it offline for a while, then went back online, then went back offline....

    these days: personal contacts 1:1 works BEST

    why? because its instant, you can answer all questions on the spot, cure all
    objections, give proposals for this year.....etc....

    online yeah, quantity also counts, however personal contact are

    MORE valuable, no contest, they buy if they like it, and they buy BIG
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  • Profile picture of the author Brent Stangel
    Would you be interested in learning how to setup your own successful consulting biz?
    I voted no. I don't like people.

    I'll take a virtual Jack Daniels...make it a double.
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  • Profile picture of the author gingerninjas
    I'd say it's a great idea. Are you consulting for a niche or sector in particular or will it be general for a marketing consulting? A video would be my pic if you're looking to get virtually 'in front' of people...
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  • Profile picture of the author Winning34
    Consulting is too much like a job for my liking. I don't like trading my time directly for money. It's not an efficient use of my time and it's not scalable. I also don't particularly want the hassle of dealing with customers and all their after-sales questions and problems, chasing up payment etc etc.

    I prefer setting up automated scalable sources of passive income and building assets.
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    • Profile picture of the author John Westbrook
      Thank you for the great feedback. Just to clarify, because based on a few of the responses I think the message was muddled, I'm asking if you would be interested in learning how to setup your own consulting, from someone who's done it successfully for years and learned a thing or two. I'm not asking if I should do consulting or not.

      Also, I especially liked the last reply about time for money trades. Excellent points, my only suggestion is that everything is a trade of time for money...just some are as you said scalable. The reason I point this out is because often a consulting gig can be transformed into something scalable...it depends on how you handle it. Many discount consulting right away because they want an automated system, but often the quickest path to creating an automated system is actually through consulting for a variety of reasons, not least of which is heat it teaches the consultant and the way it uncovers hidden gyms of automation opportunity in markets where one may otherwise be blind to those.
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  • Profile picture of the author KenW3
    I voted no - The old proverb is true

    Those who can, do
    Those who can't, teach
    Originally Posted by John Westbrook

    I'm asking if you would be interested in learning how to setup your own consulting
    Consulting is an exercise in frustration - so is teaching. From firsthand experience, I can tell you that someone who knows how to successfully make money online, then sells multi-thousand dollar weekend seminars, will get attendees that want the education, want the consultation, want to apply the knowledge, then ... buy the course, take the class, listen and learn the method, then go home and never even open the class manuals again, never spend even one hour a week trying to follow a process.

    Yes, the one in two hundred that applies and benefits from the method can make the effort to consult somewhat rewarding but I stand by my vote. Apply what you know for yourself and your family and save your consultation and education for your employees.
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    • Profile picture of the author John Westbrook
      Originally Posted by KenW3 View Post

      I voted no - The old proverb is true



      Consulting is an exercise in frustration - so is teaching. From firsthand experience, I can tell you that someone who knows how to successfully make money online, then sells multi-thousand dollar weekend seminars, will get attendees that want the education, want the consultation, want to apply the knowledge, then ... buy the course, take the class, listen and learn the method, then go home and never even open the class manuals again, never spend even one hour a week trying to follow a process.

      Yes, the one in two hundred that applies and benefits from the method can make the effort to consult somewhat rewarding but I stand by my vote. Apply what you know for yourself and your family and save your consultation and education for your employees.
      Interesting outlook. I disagree with the idiom, which was penned by Bernard Shaw (not a proverb). It was a clever line and sometimes is the case, but sadly is used in appropriately or with gravity that it doesn't warrant. But more often than not, those who teach are those who accomplished something exceptional that others are interested in learning from. I respect your vote and am interested in hearing more from the community.
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  • Profile picture of the author KenW3
    Recollection of the idiom occurred due to venue, caused by reading posts with signatures where people have obviously not applied the consultation sold through their links

    Originally Posted by John Westbrook

    more often than not, those who teach are those who accomplished something exceptional that others are interested in learning from.
    just saying ... be[a]ware: offering proven solutions to others can be beyond frustrating. I have learned that the help others want is seldom the help they need.

    Accomplishment of something exceptional is not a prerequisite to starting a consultation business. All industries have a learning curve. Any individual further along the curve will have knowledge to offer those who walk the road behind them.
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  • Profile picture of the author CityCowboy
    I think Consulting is among the top things that someone can do, it signifies that you have gained a lot of expertise and wisdom in your field of study.

    Consulting for me is very lucrative, most and even starters tend to start pricing their consulting services at 100$ per hour!

    In some fields it's difficult to gain expertise in and know it all, in other fields it doesn't take much time for you to become an expert.

    When it comes to my field (health care), it's difficult to gain expertise, respect and authority - because obviously people will prefer to consult with a Doctor or a medical professional than me.
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  • Profile picture of the author Wile E Coyote
    You're going about this in the complete wrong direction, in my opinion.
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  • Profile picture of the author Wile E Coyote
    Wow, sorry, not used to how the Feed Comments go. Anyway...

    You're going about this in the completely wrong direction.

    First, you're polling the completely wrong audience. The Warrior Forum (as mentioned a couple of times in this thread) is primarily split up in to distinct groups.

    One are people who are experts, and would otherwise have the capability to do reasonable consulting work, these guys are generally content with this business structure and if they wanted to do consulting/coaching, they would not be on the WSO section, they'd get a much higher-tier program (Dan Kennedy's High Ticket Consulting comes to mind) and learn themselves.

    The next section of people are the 'wanna-be experts'. These are the people who buy WSO courses, or read blogs, or get information from wherever and then have the balls to try and charge $2,000/mo for $5 SEO arbitrage. They have conceptual knowledge only, not applicative knowledge. Not "consulting" knowledge. These are the guys selling "proven, from $0 to $5000, Business-in-a-Box" scams that some of them don't do themselves anymore. Most of the WSO sellers unfortunately fall in this category.

    The last section are people in the Warrior Forum aren't even close to your target market as they are just starting out. They have no fundamental knowledge of anything, and they don't have the capacity to consult.

    If you're thinking a bunch of experts are buying things off the WSO section, you're about 7 years too late to the WF. I'm sure there are some people with successful businesses (however you or they define this) who buy cheap WSOs to get a nugget or two, but these guys really aren't your target market.

    Could it be valuable? Sure. But you're not polling the right people. Most of the people who have the ability to consult are already doing it. And honestly, most people who are already doing it aren't going to be interested in what you have to say, because they already have a system to do it.

    You'd be better off writing a WSO on what you do - that leads into consulting that YOU would do for a specific service.

    P.S. - For those of you who don't believe consulting is scalable, I'll share how I currently consult (or JV really) with my clients. There are three specific things I get in writing before consulting starts. 1. What they will end up with. We formulate what they are now, and where they will be in X time. 2. I get partial ownership of their company - forever. 3. We agree on guaranteed monthly minimums for X time period - so I get paid. I currently take no less than 5% of a company in ownership and I have quarterly meetings for monthly guarantees in payouts. It's more involved than the typical consulting route, but I "do" nothing for them. My team "does" nothing for them. I look at their structures, their finances, and their funnels and tell them where their problems are and exactly how to fix them. I don't edit a single page for them though. That's not how consulting works (for me that is). We have monthly meetings and they have access to me anytime over the month. However, they don't tend to use much because the system I use (which I have adopted in my business) is pretty much streamlined and straight forward.This is extremely scalable, but you're taken well pruned clients and only those who fit your bill to the T. Most consultants/coaches are picking up whoever they can get in their funnel - and that's how most fail.
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    • Profile picture of the author John Westbrook
      Interesting opinion, thanks for sharing your feedback!

      I'm polling many audiences around the web, so it's interesting to see the varied replies. I've personally dealt with many people here on WF who are the right candidate for such a course that teaches them how to setup their consulting biz, I'm just curious how many are here like that.
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  • Profile picture of the author DIABL0
    I do some consulting. It's 1on1 and trading your time for dollars. If you can be doing other tasks that will result in more money and your time is limited, it is going to be extremely important that you charge what you time is truly worth.

    Additionally, you better make sure you have the skills needed to be able to solve the client's problem(s).
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  • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
    Those who can, do
    Those who can't, teach
    My grandfather, a career professional chef who ran the kitchen in one of the top steak houses in the city in its day, always said that quote was incomplete.

    Those who can, do.
    Those who can't, teach
    Those who can't do or teach become critics.

    Oh, and I answer 'no'. I've done the consulting gig and stepped away several years ago.

    I'm reaching the age where I'm looking at more passive models. The last thing I need is to start another support agency or true consulting gig from scratch.

    Like you, John, I am exploring the idea of creating courses to pass along what I've learned over the years.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Westbrook
    Great replies everyone, thanks for the feedback.

    It would appear the results are in here on this site, most of you said you would not want to learn about how to do your own consulting biz.

    What I find interesting is many said no because they'd already tried it and didn't like it. I also heard a lot of "trading time for dollars" comments. That's also interesting to me, because poking around online, trying to setup online biz opps, trying this or that training course online...well I'm not sure how it's not trading time for money. Like I said earlier, but will rephrase a bit here, everything is a trade...a trade of energy. We often want to trade our time, talent, expertise, ideas, for the energy of money. Yet many of us don't like the idea of trading the energy of time for the energy of money. I can relate, I would rather spend my time with my family than with a client. But if you love doing something, you want to trade time for doing that thing. And if you get paid for it, well that's just perfect it would seem.

    So what I'm getting at is, could it be the problem is not so much with trading time for money, but rather with spending time doing something you don't enjoy?

    I love writing. I'm a poet. If someone came to me and said, "John, if you write poetry for just 5 hours a day, 5 days a week, I'll pay you $20,000 a month" I would shit myself and sign on the dotted line. "But John, that's not scalable" Why the **** do I care? If I'm doing what I love to do, for only a few hours a day and getting paid to do it, paid enough to enjoy a comfortable...hell, beyond comfortable...style of living, why would scalability matter?

    Unless I'm afraid I won't be able to write poetry in a month, that somehow I'll break and then I'm at risk...but even the most scalable businesses have risk. Or maybe I'm just greedy? I honestly can't understand any reason why that would be a bad or undesirable thing.

    I would rather that, in fact, than have a scalable business which I don't love that pours money in my bank but have no ******* clue what makes me happy or how to enjoy the extravagant life I'm living. Maybe because I've gotten to the bottom of life, where I don't know how I'll buy basic food or pay rent or whatever...and I've had to face some serious demons, and realize what actually gives me value. Whatever the reason, I know that money only solves a very limited set of problems for a person or a family. I can hear the naysayers out there who will say, "but even if you didn't love that scalable business it's still shit tons of money and doesn't matter cuz it buys you the time to figure yourself out."

    I actually, from experience, disagree with this idea. We don't learn about what we love and who we are from that sort of a place. It's when you can become nothing that you can become anything.

    Of course, these are my personal beliefs and experiences talking. We are all different. And I hope I didn't get too off course.

    The point is, it's not as simple as "trading time for money". If consulting can't match up to what you love doing or who you are or what makes you happy, than of course don't do it. But I guess for me the first question before you do anything, Internet Marketing or some online business included, is..."does this make me happy and honor who I am and what I love doing?"

    I do think, probably more often than not, most people don't know how to answer that question. And if that's the case, you gotta back up and start there. What makes you happy and why? And if you answer "making money makes me happy", you are missing the point. Pretend money doesn't exist. Pretend we are like birds or squirrels who just go collect their food and water from their surroundings...now, what makes you happy. What do you love doing?

    The reason many fail at finding a way to turn their passion or love into a sustainable income or life, is not because there's a limit on opportunity. It's because they listen to fear and become their own stumbling block. I know this, because I've done it and sometimes still do it. The greatest adversary I've ever had to face...to this day...is myself.

    Thanks everyone for participating.

    Namaste.

    John
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    • Profile picture of the author Steve B
      Originally Posted by John Westbrook View Post

      If someone came to me and said, "John, if you write poetry for just 5 hours a day, 5 days a week, I'll pay you $20,000 a month" I would shit myself and sign on the dotted line. "But John, that's not scalable" Why the **** do I care? If I'm doing what I love to do, for only a few hours a day and getting paid to do it, paid enough to enjoy a comfortable...hell, beyond comfortable...style of living, why would scalability matter?

      John,

      I find your scalability argument above pretty far fetched. Who is going to pay you $20K /month, month after month, to write poetry for 25 hours of "work" per week? No one.

      Let me ask you this: if you spent 50-60 hours a week writing poetry that you would sell online through your own marketing and promotion to earn $3K/month would scalability matter? That's more realistic and more comparable to what many online business owners face. Would you still want to write poetry for a living if it didn't monetarily provide you what your want?

      Scalability becomes critical when you work long hours and you don't earn what you feel you need to. You might end up hating writing poetry because you dislike the fact that you are not being paid what you think you are worth.

      I'm just saying that even running a semi-successful business online takes a lot of time and effort for most people. And these business owners are tired of trading their long hours of work for less than ideal "wages."

      As far as consulting as a business model, I think many people shy away from it, not because they hate the face-to-face interaction of working with people, but because they don't want to deal with all the other perceived negative aspects of the consulting model - trying to please know-it-alls, having to keep sometimes inconvenient consultation schedules, dealing with late or non-payment issues, always trying to drum up new clients, and on and on.

      My own preference for a business model is to make digital assets one time and then sell them over and over again for years to come. It's not a totally passive business model because it does require promotion, of course, but when you build up a very happy and supportive clientele and audience, many will buy again and again without any "convincing."

      To each his own of course... For me at least, consulting has too much baggage surrounding it that I don't particularly relish including my own time offered to solve client problems. But that's just me.

      Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author TimMartin072
    Consulting is a wonderful occupation but requires an ample amount of experience in one field or another. You cannot be an expert in different industry at the same time.
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