All-In-One: Outsourcing Secrets

15 years ago

This is going to rock Allen

Can't wait to read this thread as it grows and get some tips.

...Basically I have a few tips.

1) Best Jobs Philippines :: Philippine job search, job bank, employment and recruitment is a hot place to find people in the Philippines who will work for less.

2) If you find a guy who's REALLY good, pay him twice as much so he'll be happy.

3) Let the person who's working for you figure stuff out on his own and direct him here and there as you go. You don't want to train someone to contact you with every problem he's having. You want to correspond 2 times per day at the most, or else you might as well be doing the work yourself

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Dan C. Rinnert

15 years ago

Before you outsource a project, you need to put together a clear and detailed project description. The better your description, the more accurate an estimate providers will be able to give you. A detailed and clear description also helps to avoid misunderstandings. Providers are not mind readers; they don't know what you want unless you spell it out for them. Keep in mind that aspects that may seem obvious to you may not seem that way to someone else.

For your first, and perhaps first few, projects, you might want to have a friend or family member review your project description and make sure it is clear to them. A second set of eyes can be a good benefit to making sure you don't overlook anything important!

Some Outsourcing Sites:

Elance
iFreelance
GetaFreelancer
Guru.com
Odesk
Rentacoder
Rent a Ghostwriter
ScriptLance
WarMarks
Your Man in India

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Lance K 15 years ago

For bigger projects, make it known in your listing that you expect daily status updates. Not only will this keep you up to date on what's getting done, but it will also give your outsourcers a chance to get clarification/guidance on any issues that pop up.

Just swap instant messanger details and make sure you touch base every day. As long as you make it known that this is an expectation before accepting a bid, all should go well.
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- ctutt 14 years ago
  
  Lance, thanks for this tip. I'm sure many of us would not have even thought of it.
  
  Thanks
  
  1 reply
  
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  JAIDEEP2959 14 years ago
  
  You can outsource to people who are native English speakers residing in Asian countries like India and Pakistan. As cost of living there is low, you can get your project done at much less price.
  
  If you are outsourcing on Elace.com or Getafreelancer.com, make sure you check the reviews of the members before assigning the project.
  
  It is better to talk over a phone with the person before assigning him/her work.
  
  Good Luck.
  
  Thanks
  
  3 replies
  
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  jamespitt 14 years ago
  
  I have secrets to tell. Just pm me. Thanks
  
  Thanks
  
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  Get your totally free outsourcing guide here..
  
  Send me a PM if you want to hire top-calibre outsourced staff.
  
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  maywebdesigns 13 years ago
  
  The best advice I can give is to be specific, clarify and re-clarify because the truth is in most cases you will be outsourcing to someone in a foreign country and it is easy to underestimate how cultural differences can hamper communication
  
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  SoundsGood 11 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by MarketMaster13
  
  The best site i have had great success outsourcing with is oDesk.It has great and talented contractors.They did me a great job.
  
  The problem is there are thousands (and thousands) of people or companies to choose from. It's impossible to know which one can truly do a great job for you.
  
  Thanks
  
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mbphoenix

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Dan C. Rinnert

Before you outsource a project, you need to put together a clear and detailed project description. The better your description, the more accurate an estimate providers will be able to give you. A detailed and clear description also helps to avoid misunderstandings. Providers are not mind readers; they don't know what you want unless you spell it out for them. Keep in mind that aspects that may seem obvious to you may not seem that way to someone else.

For your first, and perhaps first few, projects, you might want to have a friend or family member review your project description and make sure it is clear to them. A second set of eyes can be a good benefit to making sure you don't overlook anything important!

Some Outsourcing Sites:

Elance
iFreelance
GetaFreelancer
Guru.com
Odesk
Rentacoder
Rent a Ghostwriter
ScriptLance
WarMarks
Your Man in India

I am so glad I found this thread. Just starting my first outsourcing project and was kinda nervous about it. But this will help a lot.

Thanks
1 reply

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tbone3 14 years ago

Remember, the whole concept of outsourcing is about leveraging OTHER PEOPLE'S TIME.

If you are just starting out in internet marketing and don't have the money to outsource, you can still leverage other peoples time...for FREE!

You can do this by getting INTERNS. Interns will work for you for free in exchange for a reference and new skills.

I'm a professional accountant, and I currently have two accounting interns do all of my clients' accounting work (I charge my accounting clients for this of course), while I work full-time in internet marketing.

I am also looking to get a local marketing intern to do some my internet marketing for me too

To get your own intern, just put an ad in craigslist.
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bo4610 11 years ago

[QUOTE=Dan C. Rinnert;1165020]Before you outsource a project, you need to put together a clear and detailed project description. The better your description, the more accurate an estimate providers will be able to give you. A detailed and clear description also helps to avoid misunderstandings. Providers are not mind readers; they don't know what you want unless you spell it out for them. Keep in mind that aspects that may seem obvious to you may not seem that way to someone else.

For your first, and perhaps first few, projects, you might want to have a friend or family member review your project description and make sure it is clear to them. A second set of eyes can be a good benefit to making sure you don't overlook anything important!

YOu nailed it bro!
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Danielle Murphyx

Banned 10 years ago

I wanted to add freelance.com to the list.

Originally Posted by Dan C. Rinnert

Before you outsource a project, you need to put together a clear and detailed project description. The better your description, the more accurate an estimate providers will be able to give you. A detailed and clear description also helps to avoid misunderstandings. Providers are not mind readers; they don't know what you want unless you spell it out for them. Keep in mind that aspects that may seem obvious to you may not seem that way to someone else.

For your first, and perhaps first few, projects, you might want to have a friend or family member review your project description and make sure it is clear to them. A second set of eyes can be a good benefit to making sure you don't overlook anything important!

Some Outsourcing Sites:

Elance
iFreelance
GetaFreelancer
Guru.com
Odesk
Rentacoder
Rent a Ghostwriter
ScriptLance
WarMarks
Your Man in India

Thanks

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Web Junkie

15 years ago

Originally Posted by JasonParker

1) Best Jobs Philippines :: Philippine job search, job bank, employment and recruitment is a hot place to find people in the Philippines who will work for less.

This website is really cool man...thanks for the link! I've used rentacoder for individual tasks, but I see that it is quite inexpensive to hire a full time employee. I just have a quick question-

Would you suggest paying the outsourced employee via paypal or is there another method that you guys are using?

Thanks so much,

Rich

Thanks
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Steve Diamond

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Dan C. Rinnert

Before you outsource a project, you need to put together a clear and detailed project description. Providers are not mind readers; they don't know what you want unless you spell it out for them. Keep in mind that aspects that may seem obvious to you may not seem that way to someone else.

...you might want to have a friend or family member review your project description and make sure it is clear to them. A second set of eyes can be a good benefit to making sure you don't overlook anything important!

Originally Posted by Mohsin Rasool

{Dark secret of the industry in the words of a senior employee}

On another day, i was talking to this senior coder in a big outsourcing firm here...as i have checked his recent script, and i saw many security checks were simply ignored...I mentioned that...and his answer was very surprising...he said... we deliver what client asks for!...if he do not ask we do not do...in fact he was saying..
if client is clueless about the aspects of security of the script/site they are coding, they are not going to take those measures...they will only do if client is smart, have knowledge about that, and ask for that.... and it is not what he wanted to do..he said this is company practice to get things done, and just do what is asked...

Solution, to this issue i recommend to my fellow warriors is that if you have no idea about programming/coding..and you are going to get something built/coded...please have some friend or buddy onboard...who have knowledge about that..and let him help you fine-tune your project descriptions and specs...and also let him inspect the delivered work to you, before you approve the same...just to be on the safe side...

I'd like to triple-underline these points in bright orange and to add another dimension. A friend, family member, or buddy is not going to be able to help much, especially if they know little or nothing about computer security issues, about data design, about coding best practices, etc.

For any reasonably complex project, consider hiring a professional requirements analyst or business analyst to be your second pair of eyes. The analyst will make sure that your specification is coherent and sensible, that it will actually accomplish the goals you have in mind. The analyst will make sure that appropriate security measures are built into the specifications. Finally, the analyst will review the finished product and make sure that it actually conforms to the specifications and incorporates the requested measures. The analyst's final report on those points will be your ammunition in case you have to deal with a developer whose work is faulty or incomplete.

Steve

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JasonParker

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Web Junkie

This website is really cool man...thanks for the link! I've used rentacoder for individual tasks, but I see that it is quite inexpensive to hire a full time employee. I just have a quick question-

Would you suggest paying the outsourced employee via paypal or is there another method that you guys are using?

Thanks so much,

Rich

I personally make sure the person can accept PayPal first because that's how I keep my records when it comes tax time. Plus you can just set up a subscription link and it'll pay them every month or weekly.

Thanks

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mrxxg

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Web Junkie

This website is really cool man...thanks for the link! I've used rentacoder for individual tasks, but I see that it is quite inexpensive to hire a full time employee. I just have a quick question-

Would you suggest paying the outsourced employee via paypal or is there another method that you guys are using?

Thanks so much,

Rich

Xoom.com is another good option.

Thanks
1 reply

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cyberchick 14 years ago

Hi Warriors,

1. I believe one of the most important aspects of outsourcing is to look after your key staff. I have sacked a couple of writers in the past because they promised to keep to deadlines and then didn't. Problem is, when they do this your business suffers - your reputation is on the line and that's simply not good enough.

On the other hand, I have writers who have been with me for months and I tend to look after them. I give them bonus pay for urgent project deadlines, when they do a particular great job and at the end of the year.

Your staff are people like you and me, regardless where they live and work. Treat them with respect as you would like to be treated, and chances are they will stay with you for the long-term.

2. Use templates and project management tools. I use a very simple system. I use Google Docs spreadsheets for keeping track of the individual writers, Gmail, GTalk and Skype to communicate and a cloud based website for my backups.

When I outsource link building and other marketing aspects of my business I always use PDF guides and or videos to show the staff what I want done exactly.

This eliminates unnecessary to and fro by email and saves time and money.

All the best
Monika
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eugenedm

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Web Junkie

This website is really cool man...thanks for the link! I've used rentacoder for individual tasks, but I see that it is quite inexpensive to hire a full time employee. I just have a quick question-

Would you suggest paying the outsourced employee via paypal or is there another method that you guys are using?

Thanks so much,

Rich

If you're going to outsource to the Philippines or India, the best way to pay them is through Paypal. It's simple and fast.

Thanks

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nileearls 12 years ago

which site is best ?
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- waltershore 12 years ago
  
  I think to to get started for the newbies data entry outsourcing is the best option. It is also helpful for the people who don't have technical expertise in specific field. Almost anyone can do simple data entry, form filling work.
  
  Thanks
  
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Jag82

15 years ago

Important - I will encourage you to sign a non-disclosure agreement (NDA) with your freelancer so avoid any misunderstanding in future.

Jag

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Jason Johns

15 years ago

Hi warriors,

As someone who is on both sides of the outsourcing fence one of the biggest tips I can offer is to make sure you know exactly what you want and when you want it by.

If you don't provide the freelancer with details they aren't psychic. Once you get to know them you can provide them with less information because they will have an understanding of your business. But the more info you can give them, the better.

I'd also say you need to value the good ones. Good outsources are hard to find and I am sure we all have stories about how we've been let down by them. Sometimes this is because of things outside their control, e.g. illness, other times it's for other reasons, but value a good outsourcer and they will work well for you.

If hiring from any of the above sites, always check their feedback and portfolio first.

If your budget is limited then you may need to look elsewhere. You can get some great work done by people on the forums at Digital point. I've hired a lot of people from their for things like SEO, writing and development and had some very good results for bargain prices.

All the best

Jason

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John Taylor

15 years ago

A few tips..

1. Be sure you know exactly what you want and
don't take shortcuts writing your specification.

2. Ask to see examples of the freelancers previous
work and be sure to check it out.

3. Put a question in your request that requires a
specific answer. If the answer isn't in the bid, you
have probably got a canned response or a bot.

4. Do your due diligence before selecting a bid. Be
sure to look at the freelancers profile, especially
any feedback and ratings.

5. Give freelancers small projects to begin with to
"audition" them, their talents and their ability to
deliver to your spec and within time.

6. Wherever possible use a freelance site that has
an escrow system that keeps your cash until the
project is signed off to your satisfaction.

7. Maintain communication. If you're not hearing
from your freelancer regularly then ask them for
progress reports.

8. Keep records of ALL communication in case of
disputes. If you communicate off the freelance
site, be sure to record messenger chats in your
history file. (I cut and paste them into a project
folder) and if you use voice record the call and
retain it as an MP3.

9. Where good progress is made, the quality of
the work is good and the freelancer shows some
initiative, be sure to praise them.

10. Pay on time and where appropriate make an
extra "bonus" payment to show your appreciation.

11. Keep in touch with the good freelancers between
projects. You'll get a better response when you need
their help.

John

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Susan Hope 15 years ago

Don't forget the "Warriors for Hire" forum when you are looking for outsourcers and then still follow the great advise given by everyone in this thread on being specific, keeping records, etc.

Sue
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friendlytf 13 years ago

good advice
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Hamish Jones

15 years ago

The main piece of advice I could offer would be to make sure that you are as detailed as possible in what you require from the project.

You may need to take in to account that for some people English is a second language- avoid jargon and country specific language when writing your assignment requirements.

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jayguy

15 years ago

Clarity and specificity of project is key when outsourcing. Milestones also help the project stay on track and encourage timely completion.

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lakshaybehl

15 years ago

Hiring freelancers can be like kissing frogs... You don't meet the ideal one everytime you hire a new one. But does that mean your quest for outsourcing stop? Well, you know the answer yourself. Just because one freelancer from Philipines didn't meet your expectations doesn't meanthe next one won't. There are some real gems to be uncovered. And those that go through the gruelsome task of kissing the frogs will one day certainly have some real nice gems secretly tucked away in their arsenal.

There are people all over this planet working for wages far below what you'd have paid to them. And they are happy, and they are talented and can achieve much more satisfaction with the work you assign to them as compared to what they are doing now. So while $3/hour may seem lame to you, its not- an Indian graduate with no experience but quite a lot of skills like- English speaking abilities, Content Research on the Internet, Transcription will be hired by a local company for a full time job at a measly $500/month, and will feel they are lucky. When they could have had the freedom to stay at home and work haldf the time for twice the money, and have a sort of security in terms of repeat clients.

The question is- What do you do once you find a right freelancer?

Answer- Always do more than what is expected of you. For a $100 project completed on time, pay out $125. While those extra $25 maybe next to nothing to you, for the other person it can be a lavish dinner at a 3 Star for their family.

Keep your grail quest on- For there is not one aspect of your business that can't be or shouldn't be outsourced or automated. Except of course the collection of money.

NOw, if you are just starting out, and if you are short on cash, don't worry. Find a plan that you can execute and start making some money. Then once you have some money coming in, start outsourcing.

Regarding what to outsource- well, whatever you don't WANT to do yourself. Note that I didn't say what you'e not good at, for if there is something you are not good at but still want to be able to do it someday, its better if you acquire that skill ASAP. Acquiring skiulls isn't all that difficult, we're not talking world records here. We're talking about small, simple skills like being able to close a deal. Being able to convert your prospects. Being able to motivate people to take action- to help someone realize the value of a new strategy that can help them. Maybe creating videos with your presentations in them. Maybe automating your business- whatever you want to do or be able to do, acquire those skills are work on it. All Other stuff needs to be outsourced. Life is too short to work on something that you do not want to do. There's so much you'd want to do and there's so much money you can make doing what you want to do. Outsource ALL ELSE.

-Lakshay

P.S. Might I suggest using a service like Escrow.com for payments, especially to new freelancers. Even if you are hiring someone off the Warrior Forum, do not make the mistale of sending money in advance. They can know you are willing to pya, but Escrow will hold the money while the work is being done satisfactorily.

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Mukul Verma

15 years ago

Here are a few tips (will do my best not repeat what is already said)

1. Your outsource employee in a investment
spend time training them, if you want them
to produce better results. If you give them
sometime and expect them to fill in the gaps
it may take twice as long.

2. Look at hiring full time vs contract. If you
are dropping more then $500 to $1000 a month
on contracts, you may look at seeing if it works
better part time.

Next, if you do invest in training them well, you
want to keep them.

3. Know local holiday and customs. Example
in the Philipines they have 13th month where
at Christmas the employer gives 1 month
bonus. They will not ask since they dont
want to lose there job, but keep with the customers

4. This is a test I did. I hired a newbie for a
posting job vs a experience link builder. I paid
$120 USD compared to $200 USD for the month.
Newbie out performed the expereince, since they
dont have it stuck that there way (or the last job)
is the only way to do it. This is for more experience
Internet marketers know how to train

5. Invest the time to interview OR (like I do) have
one of your outsource employee pick resumes and
you interview.

6. Expect everything not to be perfect. Hiring
someone hear also often has issues. Look at the
cost/benefit ratio when hiring. It is still a great
deal.

7. (personal rule) I hire in call center for phone,
live message or customer support my business
cannot run without for a day. I will hire direct
for marketing and other functions that would
not impact my business if the employee leaves
(I did have a marketing guy quit instantly for
a better paying job half way through a trip).
It is hard to quit and someone else can back
it up, if you are away or busy.

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JasonParker

15 years ago

I just started working with this Warrior for outsourcing. So far it's one of the best outsourcing experiences I've ever had. We're getting a TON done just in a couple days:

http://www.warriorforum.com/warrior-...g-75-week.html

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TiffanyLambert

15 years ago

My own outsourcing tips, since I've played both sides of the field are:

1.) Copyscape everything. They'll say they understand what plagiarism is, but either they don't, or they don't care.

2.) Find a whole bunch of freelancers, give them all a small job, and pick the ones who rise to the top to work with on larger projects.

3.) If you use Elance, etc., use the escrow feature.

4.) Tell them up front what you expect with formatting your text. When I was selling $20 per page text, I kept hearing about others who sold $10 per page text. Problem is, their text was size 14 point font and double spaced. Mine was 12 point font, single spaced, so the buyer actually paid the same amount because with the other person, they only got about 200-250 words. With me, they got 400-500 words.

5.) Be the squeaky wheel. I'm a great writer, but I will admit I used to suck at deadlines. The squeaky wheel got the grease with me, which is horrible because I should have been taking care of my patient clients. I just needed the annoying ones off my back, so BUG your freelancer even before they're late for a status

tiff

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Jag82

15 years ago

Originally Posted by TiffanyDow

1.) Copyscape everything. They'll say they understand what plagiarism is, but either they don't, or they don't care.

Tiffany, I owe you a favor on this one. Had I not read this tip,
I may not even know I've been ripped off.

I just got some articles that I've outsourced back.

When I read through the articles, it gives me the
feeling that the content has been swiped off different
places and assembled together.

Totally incoherent. So remembering your copyscape
tip, off I went to do a check!

And true enough, much of the content is plagiarized!
Word for word somemore!

I think it is fair to say I won't be working with that
guy I've outsourced to anymore.

Thanks again Tiffany.

Jag

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Andyhenry

15 years ago

The same thing actually goes for code as well.

I spend a few grand on some software development once and found out it had pieces of someone elses software pasted in to it - so I couldn't legally use/sell it without paying a license to someone else.

The programmer swore that it was all original - but I had a friend check it out and even after I'd called them on the copied code and they said they'd rewritten the affected area - I still found a bunch of ***** at a part where they'd cut out the copyright message from someone elses code.

If you get software created - make sure you have someone who can take a look and spot any obvious copying.

Sometimes just doing a search for comment characters will find the copied code sections.

Andy

Originally Posted by Jag82

Tiffany, I owe you a favor on this one. Had I not read this tip,
I may not even know I've been ripped off.

I just got some articles that I've outsourced back.

When I read through the articles, it gives me the
feeling that the content has been swiped off different
places and assembled together.

Totally incoherent. So remembering your copyscape
tip, off I went to do a check!

And true enough, much of the content is plagiarized!
Word for word somemore!

I think it is fair to say I won't be working with that
guy I've outsourced to anymore.

Thanks again Tiffany.

Jag

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Marhelper

15 years ago

Great idea Allen. I have found the best outsourcing site to be "Get a Free Lancer." When you use the service you should open the bidding up for 7 days or more and ALWAYS get references and make sure the work is done BEFORE paying. I have found some of my best workers through GAF.

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Steve Robertson

15 years ago

Hello Warriors,

Speaking as someone to whom Warriors outsource work, the sites such as Elance don't work for me.

These sites give almost all the advantages to the service buyer and almost none to the freelancer. By setting up a system where there is open competition for projects, these sites force freelancers to endure cutthroat competition and accept ridiculously low fees so they can land their first few jobs and establish a reputation on the site. The only relief from this would be for those who endure this injustice long enough to establish an excellent reputation that allows them to win bids even when theirs is not the lowest.

And the sites have the temerity to charge the freelancers for this disservice!

Many freelancers have spent countless hours developing their skills. And a skilled technician should be able to charge a fair amount for their time.

I think Warriors would be better served to do business directly with other Warriors. The "Warriors for Hire" section is a good start, but it omits some types of freelancers. I just looked through there and didn't find a single listing that started with the words "Video Producer." There were plenty starting with the word "Content," and I suppose video could be considered content, but it doesn't make much sense for someone to have to hunt through all the "Content" listings to find a video maker.

Steve Robertson

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ejunkie

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Steve Robertson

Hello Warriors,

Speaking as someone to whom Warriors outsource work, the sites such as Elance don't work for me.

These sites give almost all the advantages to the service buyer and almost none to the freelancer. By setting up a system where there is open competition for projects, these sites force freelancers to endure cutthroat competition and accept ridiculously low fees so they can land their first few jobs and establish a reputation on the site. The only relief from this would be for those who endure this injustice long enough to establish an excellent reputation that allows them to win bids even when theirs is not the lowest.

And the sites have the temerity to charge the freelancers for this disservice!

Many freelancers have spent countless hours developing their skills. And a skilled technician should be able to charge a fair amount for their time.

I think Warriors would be better served to do business directly with other Warriors. The "Warriors for Hire" section is a good start, but it omits some types of freelancers. I just looked through there and didn't find a single listing that started with the words "Video Producer." There were plenty starting with the word "Content," and I suppose video could be considered content, but it doesn't make much sense for someone to have to hunt through all the "Content" listings to find a video maker.

Steve Robertson

My sentiments exactly.

Couldn't agree more.

Most such bidding sites are like black holes for otherwise talented newbies (even veterans) who get sucked into it with its mediocre (almost inhuman) monetary benefits, and internecine bidding wars.

Thanks

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Johnny Slater

15 years ago

When you outsource make sure that the person you hire has a working understanding of what you want done. I don't mean just that they can write well, or are a good programmer, or a good graphic designer, but that they know exactly what you want done and know enough to be able to do the required work without messing up anything you have existing.

I have seen more than once where someone hired a programmer to integrate two different web scripts and it ended badly. This is very important if you are dealing with software, make sure that the person you hire has a good understanding of your existing software in order to integrate something else into it without totally messing up what you already have up and running.

If you have an article directory and want to add something to it, hire someone who understands what an article directory is. If you have a membership site and want a blog or forum directly integrated make sure you hire someone who understands membership scripts as well as forums and blogs. It's not enough that they know how to write code. Just because someone is a programmer doesn't mean they understand how all programs work.

The same goes for other stuff as well. Just because someone makes killer graphics doesn't automatically mean they will undersand your target market or will know how best to handle your needs.

You need be very clear in getting the outsourcer to understand your needs, but making sure that they also understand anything you already have existing that they must work with is a very important issue as well.

Thanks

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Mohsin Rasool

15 years ago

Hi Guys,

As I run my own small outsourcing firm and have direct contact with many
freelancers and outsourcing firms in this industry...

I see three mistakes which create huge trouble for the client , yeah the customer!

1. #1 Mistake: 500pages html pages post to Blog $35 only
Yes, it is too good to be true... When you are getting someone to do a BIG job for
a very little Price... you are asking for a big trouble, waste of time and waste of energy..

They will take your project, try to do it, will get fed up with it...2 days time stretch to
2 weeks and then 2 months without project completion!!!

So it is not always better to go for the lowest (unimaginable, unreasonable) bid/price...
Sometime poeple just need money and they are wiling to do anything for $10...but
just after they have got your project, they gonna rethink, and they gonna be tired...

Oh also sometime (and most of the time) they are new to the market, they just have
no idea what job they are taking, so they take the job for e.g.$15, start the work and
then they realize oh ..that is so much work...and now they are not going to tell you the
truth but waste your time and energy, and you are going to get very frustrated really!!!

So lowest price is not always the best solution to your outsourcing needs!!!

2. #2 Mistake Regarding Design :
When you want something to be Designed, do not simply explain in words via email,
or worse talk over skype(he/she is not going to understand)... as both you and your
designer cannot speak on the same communication level, he/she does not know your
terms and vice versa...

I have seen the best solution to this ... Open Word doc... and start drawing the
layout boxes with simple descriptions... Logo Here, Sign Up button here... and so on..
and send that to your designer..or simply draw by hand on a paper (just the draft idea)
and scan it and email your designer... this is going to save a week of back and forth emails of understanding your idea....

3. #3 Mistake Regarding Projects Descriptions and Specifications :

As already mentioned and advised by many Warriors above , that you must be
specific and detailed in your description...no short-cut and no exception...
If you really want the work completed as per your expectations and within
the time frame...give the all details to the outsourcing guy at the start of the
project so he/she tells you correct idea of the date of completion...

You can write, you can draw, you can record video, you can give reference links,
and the examples sites or blogs you like...so turn around time of your project becomes
fast and short...

BONUS TIP: Oh i was about to skip this very important advice i can give to
my fellow Warrior Friends regarding the Coding/Software stuff....{Dark secret of
the industry in the words of a senior employee}

On another day, i was talking to this senior coder in a big outsourcing firm here...
as i have checked his recent script, and i saw many security checks were simply
ignored...I mentioned that...and his answer was very surprising...he said...
we deliver what client asks for!...if he do not ask we do not do...in fact he was saying..
if client is clueless about the aspects of security of the script/site they are coding,
they are not going to take those measures...they will only do if client is smart, have
knowledge about that, and ask for that.... and it is not what he wanted to do..he said
this is company practice to get things done, and just do what is asked...

Solution, to this issue i recommend to my fellow warriors is that if you have no idea about
programming/coding..and you are going to get something built/coded...please have some
friend or buddy onboard...who have knowledge about that..and let him help you fine-tune
your project descriptions and specs...and also let him inspect the delivered work to you,
before you approve the same...just to be on the safe side...

best wishes,
Mohsin
PS. Allen thank you very much such great threads...i really love to see all great
stuff at one place...thank you!

[ 6 ] Thanks
1 reply

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liveurlyf

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Mohsin Rasool

Hi Guys,

As I run my own small outsourcing firm and have direct contact with many
freelancers and outsourcing firms in this industry...

I see three mistakes which create huge trouble for the client , yeah the customer!

1. #1 Mistake: 500pages html pages post to Blog $35 only
Yes, it is too good to be true... When you are getting someone to do a BIG job for
a very little Price... you are asking for a big trouble, waste of time and waste of energy..

They will take your project, try to do it, will get fed up with it...2 days time stretch to
2 weeks and then 2 months without project completion!!!

So it is not always better to go for the lowest (unimaginable, unreasonable) bid/price...
Sometime poeple just need money and they are wiling to do anything for $10...but
just after they have got your project, they gonna rethink, and they gonna be tired...

Oh also sometime (and most of the time) they are new to the market, they just have
no idea what job they are taking, so they take the job for e.g.$15, start the work and
then they realize oh ..that is so much work...and now they are not going to tell you the
truth but waste your time and energy, and you are going to get very frustrated really!!!

So lowest price is not always the best solution to your outsourcing needs!!!

2. #2 Mistake Regarding Design :
When you want something to be Designed, do not simply explain in words via email,
or worse talk over skype(he/she is not going to understand)... as both you and your
designer cannot speak on the same communication level, he/she does not know your
terms and vice versa...

I have seen the best solution to this ... Open Word doc... and start drawing the
layout boxes with simple descriptions... Logo Here, Sign Up button here... and so on..
and send that to your designer..or simply draw by hand on a paper (just the draft idea)
and scan it and email your designer... this is going to save a week of back and forth emails of understanding your idea....

3. #3 Mistake Regarding Projects Descriptions and Specifications :

As already mentioned and advised by many Warriors above , that you must be
specific and detailed in your description...no short-cut and no exception...
If you really want the work completed as per your expectations and within
the time frame...give the all details to the outsourcing guy at the start of the
project so he/she tells you correct idea of the date of completion...

You can write, you can draw, you can record video, you can give reference links,
and the examples sites or blogs you like...so turn around time of your project becomes
fast and short...

BONUS TIP: Oh i was about to skip this very important advice i can give to
my fellow Warrior Friends regarding the Coding/Software stuff....{Dark secret of
the industry in the words of a senior employee}

On another day, i was talking to this senior coder in a big outsourcing firm here...
as i have checked his recent script, and i saw many security checks were simply
ignored...I mentioned that...and his answer was very surprising...he said...
we deliver what client asks for!...if he do not ask we do not do...in fact he was saying..
if client is clueless about the aspects of security of the script/site they are coding,
they are not going to take those measures...they will only do if client is smart, have
knowledge about that, and ask for that.... and it is not what he wanted to do..he said
this is company practice to get things done, and just do what is asked...

Solution, to this issue i recommend to my fellow warriors is that if you have no idea about
programming/coding..and you are going to get something built/coded...please have some
friend or buddy onboard...who have knowledge about that..and let him help you fine-tune
your project descriptions and specs...and also let him inspect the delivered work to you,
before you approve the same...just to be on the safe side...

best wishes,
Mohsin
PS. Allen thank you very much such great threads...i really love to see all great
stuff at one place...thank you!

I got a lot of of dis and am really grateful for the insight...

Thanks

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AmyBrown

15 years ago

Use project management solutions to keep both you and your outsourcers on track. It's easier to have everything in one place rather than having bits and pieces in email, IM and Skype.

Basecamp: Project management, collaboration, and task software: Basecamp
Huddle: Project Management Software, Online Collaboration and Document Sharing ~ Huddle
dotProject: dotproject - Open Source Software :: Open Source Project and Task Management Software (open-source)

I prefer Huddle and in my experience it's been easier for people to learn to use.

[ 2 ] Thanks
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Maria Gudelis

15 years ago

Originally Posted by AmyBrown

Use project management solutions to keep both you and your outsourcers on track. It's easier to have everything in one place rather than having bits and pieces in email, IM and Skype.

Basecamp: Project management, collaboration, and task software: Basecamp
Huddle: Project Management Software, Online Collaboration and Document Sharing ~ Huddle
dotProject: dotproject - Open Source Software :: Open Source Project and Task Management Software (open-source)

I prefer Huddle and in my experience it's been easier for people to learn to use.

Ditto on that Amy...only difference is that I prefer basecamphq

At the bare minimum if you can't pay up for those resources...then use google docs!

The other STRONG tactic to use that makes your life VERY EASY is to provide video and text tutorials of what you want them to do...that way:

1. If you have to change talent up - easy to do as the training is just - here go to this link - watch the videos and read the word doc. on 'your checklist'

2. If you grow your business, easy to hire more as well as you can also point to the training you have provided

If going after 'software development' - I only deal with a very reputable resource or company so that the IP is protected (especially if creating a product for someone else and private labeling it to them)

**** Not sure if this was mentioned - just like with employees...FIRE FAST! If someone isn't working out - you have to say next - it is your business, your bottom line you must be very aggressive here...this is one area where 'being nice' can kill your business, your own food on the table gets hit if you know what I mean!

great thread!

[ 2 ] Thanks

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seasoned

15 years ago

I was actually writing a book that includes a few sections on this. I am talking about mainly programs/websites here....

Some cultures don't even honor NDAs, and NDAs should cover patentable info, and/or company/customer/vendor specific information. So don't expect NDAs to be THE solution. If you are REALLY worried, you can allocate key parts to different people.

BE PRECISE in how data relates, write out text, and mockup screens. Realize that some things MAY vary between what you do, and what they must do. Dropdown lists, for example, may look different, etc... BTW it must have some TEXT that you can cut and paste. If you provide only screen shots, they must retype and that wastes time and leaves a potential for errors.

GIVE THEM A TESTBED, if needed!

If you can, state what technologies and environment it should use! Is it Java? PHP? Will it use active Directory? Is it a website? Client? Standalone program? etc...

GET SOURCE! Examine it CAREFULLY! Check to see if there are any licensing requirements.

AND, despite what people say, complex programs may not be done in a day. If they speak of CRUD, MVC, libraries, etc... They may be using existing software or licensed software. In such a case you won't have COMPLETE rights, which is fine as long as you understand it, but you may not have ANY rights. Some require you to provide source to customers, some require per copy fees, etc....

Try to compile the product using ONLY source on a VIRGIN computer(one they didn't touch that never had the application on it). THIS will catch any patches they made, etc...

And if you can't do something like compile, or install, it means you can't support it if you sell it, and may not be able to ever move to another system. So you really SHOULD learn!

One more thing. NEVER assume they understand you, even if they say they do. Try to give examples and make it VERY clear.

Steve

Thanks

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George Wright

15 years ago

This comes from Tammy. I'm posting her idea, which she uses for other projects.

Get permission to post a "help wanted" index card or flyer on the student resource board at local private colleges. These are "for profit" colleges that have a lot of students who are looking for extra income.

Of course you could do this with JR. Colleges and State Colleges but our experience is with for profit colleges.

You will find students skilled in any IM related field you can think of. 99% of them don't know it

They are taking graphic arts, writing, website development, etc so they can work jobs that need those skills.

Tammy had a project she needed completed. She was contacted by a teacher and the teacher asked her if she could make it an assignment for the class.

The students are working for a GRADE.

George Wright

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arepb

15 years ago

As referenced in the 4 Hour Work Week, request (demand) someone with English speaking abilities. Sometimes this means putting in your RFP that the VA will have to conduct business over the phone (which may or may not be the case). Doing so ensures you have someone with better English skills than someone who can simply write a note or email message.

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MarkWrites

15 years ago

Don't be afraid to give a high quality writer or VA a raise now and then. In the past when I have hired out some consistent work and it was being done exceptionally well, I've voluntarily bumped up the pay out so that they are making at least a little bit more than the vast majority of workers doing the same thing. This helps keep them happy, makes them feel appreciated, and hopefully stops them from looking too hard for better paying jobs. The small expense this creates for me is nothing compared to paying over and over for subpar results while looking for the right person.

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Brent Turner

15 years ago

From an outsourcee's point of view.

If you're an outsourcer, here's one tip which is worth pure gold:

Treat your outsourcees with respect, praise their good work, correct them on their mistakes in a friendly way and just be friendly and nice to them in general.

They are FAR more likely to go to greater lengths to please you if you treat them well than if you don't.

We refused to work with someone recently because they were rude and disrespectful. We have no time for people like that.

[ 8 ] Thanks
1 reply

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seasoned

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Brent Turner

From an outsourcee's point of view.

If you're an outsourcer, here's one tip which is worth pure gold:

Treat your outsourcees with respect, praise their good work, correct them on their mistakes in a friendly way and just be friendly and nice to them in general.

They are FAR more likely to go to greater lengths to please you if you treat them well than if you don't.

We refused to work with someone recently because they were rude and disrespectful. We have no time for people like that.

Realize that it IS a two way street though. With a GOOD resource, you aren't doing THEM a favor, you are helping one another.

[ 1 ] Thanks

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documaker

Banned 15 years ago

[DELETED]

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seasoned

15 years ago

Originally Posted by documaker

You don't have to hire offshore to avoid those kinds of costs. You need only hire independent contractors (freelancers). However just to append to your list regarding employees:

1. Are harder to fire.

Actually freelancers are harder to fire because they're hired under a contract. Employees usually have to sign some bizarre "pre-nup" agreement that disallows the employee from bringing a termination to court. In that regard, employees are **easier** to fire.

Sorry, I meant under the LAW! Employees sue ALL THE TIME, and people even sue on their behalf. HEY, I have been a consultant. Although I haven't been fired, I have seen plent that were. One time I was on a project and saw another project cancelled and DOZENS there were let go with NO notice!

Originally Posted by documaker

2. Must have benefits.

Freelancers, offshore **and** onshore are free from this requirement.

Yeah, but EMPLOYEES aren't. Don't beliieve me? Just ask MICROSOFT! They tried to use a loophole, and they LOST!

Originally Posted by documaker

3. Have payroll costs.
See #2

4. Require you to have an EIN.

See #2

5. Can subject YOU to liability.

See #2

AGAIN, I'm talking about employees.

[quote=documaker;1171255]6. Require YOU to have insurance.

Some outsourcing companies require freelancers to have insurance as well. Working with a no-insurance freelancer is a risk some business are too big to take.[quote]

NOBODY requires you to have insurance for you. I meant you have to have insurance to cover THEM!

Originally Posted by documaker

7. Often require YOU to provide resources.
This actually depends on what's stipulated in an outsourcing contract. Freelancers quite often come with their own resources and are thus required to use them.

Again, employees don't have outsourcing contracts!

Originally Posted by documaker

In the end, freelancers, independent contractors, outsourcing service providers, whatever you wanna call them are **always** cheaper than employers because they don't come with all the red tape.

My point is that they are less expensive than they appear at first. By some estimates, they both cost roughly the same. That is because a consultant costs roughly twice as much, and the support for an employee generally costs as much as their salary.

Steve

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dbarnum 15 years ago

Get lots of outsourcing tips at my Warrior blog:

WarriorForum - Internet Marketing Forums - Moving Ahead with Warriors Blog

Plus the latest heads up for the many Warrior writers out there with outsourcing companies:

Ghostwriting Do's and Don'ts

Get a short 2-page PDF document from which you'll learn about 14 common errors that show up in many ghostwritten documents. Also included are three short steps to success for your ghostwriting endeavors. Download by clicking: Ghostwriting Errors

Podcast

Listen in to a short discussion about ghostwriting and overcoming the common errors that ghostwriters make in the podcast at the link below. Download the short PDF above that accompanies this, a helpful guide to follow while the tips are shared on the podcast:

Moving Ahead Blog: Writing Tips with Free Download and Audio (Podcast) - Ghostwriting Do's and Don'ts

Thanks,

Warrior (& team) For Hire!
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documaker

Banned 15 years ago

[DELETED]

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seasoned

15 years ago

Originally Posted by documaker

HEY, what HAPPENED to THE original LIST?

Anyway, I think you're forgetting the costs of employee maintenance, benefits, 401K, and all the other goo that makes red tape stick.

I would LOVE to know WHO got rid of that list, and WHY!!!!!!!!!!! Anyway, NO! I didn't forget ANY of that! I mentioned it ALL in a post someone decided to delete for NO reason! I didn't advertise, insult, speak politics, or ANYTHING esle spamming or insulting, etc...

Steve

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Bev Clement

15 years ago

As Vince Runza said, "We're ghostwriters, not mind readers"

When you hire a person be it a writer, coder, VA, we can't read your minds. If you know what you want then let us in on the secret, if not then you might not get what you thought you wanted.

Be as specific as possible.

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Doctor Article

15 years ago

As a freelance writer myself, I would, if I'm honest, tend to recommend using one of the dedicated content writing sites for articles, blog posts, and etc. The quality is far more consistent than what you face with other options such as GAF. Also, you have the benefit of predetermined deadlines and customer support. Most importantly, you avoid having to jump through all the hoops associated with freelance sites, just as you don't have to wait for bids to come in. I would mention a few sites but not sure if I'm permitted to do so. Having said that, I suppose a lot depends on what sort of quality you're after, as a lot of writers, myself included, have moved away from the freelance sites.

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DyLan Lee

15 years ago

The reality is that if you are doing article marketing it can be a lot of work if you are aggressively doing it. That is why I want to show you exactly how to outsource your article marketing so you can maximize your results and put this traffic generation strategy on total autopilot.

Secret #1:

Make sure you do a lot of article marketing first before you start outsourcing it. The reason is this - if you don't know how to do it and don't know your metrics then you will be in big trouble when you get someone to do it for you as you won't have a benchmark for success.

If you just outsource it and forget about it - you're not going to know what quality level to expect and what kind of results you should expect from your article marketing.

Secret #2:

Make sure you don't cheap out on getting people to write your articles. This is the biggest mistake that people make when they do article marketing. You're not looking to get as many articles as possible onto the Internet.

You're looking to get as many qualified visitors as possible to your site from your articles. There is a big difference! The first way you can just hire anyone to write bad articles because you don't care.

The second way is the right way - pay big money for the best articles and you will get way more visitors to your site. Would you not rather have more traffic & better traffic even though you had to spend a bit more?

In the end your profit will be higher and you will help more people.

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Peter Temp

15 years ago

It is very cool to hear about outsourcing here. I am using getafreealncer.com and some guys from Sri Lanka to work on my projects.

I had tried with eufreelancer.com too but did not get impressions as getafreealncer.com where I have got good hard working providers. However, there are spammers everywhere, we have to identify them correctly with above mentioned secrets.

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Andyhenry

15 years ago

The thing I've found has made the most difference in getting great outsourcing results is something I've never seen anyone else talk about.

It's called modeling.

If I need a new piece of software created I no longer bother with pages and pages of specifications - I just open up MS Powerpoint and I build a model of what I want.

By model, I mean something that looks just like what I want, and behaves like I want.

So if I want a login screen and then particular things on the next page - I create a slide of the the login screen then when I click my mouse some login details appear, then next click, then next screen appears (as if I've just logged in).

So, in this way I model the look and behaviour of what I want (It usually takes a few hours to do).

Then I give this to the programmer and say ' make it look like that and do what that does' but with a real database and backend.

Then the only things to discuss are limits and parameters for the values.

As long as they create a tool that looks like I showed and behaves like I showed - it's a perfect job with ZERO bugs and zero ammendments.

I've done this about 30 times over the last 4 years and spent about $100k on software development and it's saved me at least the same again because I always get the right thing first time.

Andy

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nothing to see here.

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seasoned

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Andyhenry

The thing I've found has made the most difference in getting great outsourcing results is something I've never seen anyone else talk about.

It's called modeling.

If I need a new piece of software created I no longer bother with pages and pages of specifications - I just open up MS Powerpoint and I build a model of what I want.

By model, I mean something that looks just like what I want, and behaves like I want.

So if I want a login screen and then particular things on the next page - I create a slide of the the login screen then when I click my mouse some login details appear, then next click, then next screen appears (as if I've just logged in).

So, in this way I model the look and behaviour of what I want (It usually takes a few hours to do).

Then I give this to the programmer and say ' make it look like that and do what that does' but with a real database and backend.

Then the only things to discuss are limits and parameters for the values.

As long as they create a tool that looks like I showed and behaves like I showed - it's a perfect job with ZERO bugs and zero ammendments.

I've done this about 30 times over the last 4 years and spent about $100k on software development and it's saved me at least the same again because I always get the right thing first time.

Andy

Well, I DID say:

BE PRECISE in how data relates, write out text, and mockup screens. Realize that some things MAY vary between what you do, and what they must do. Dropdown lists, for example, may look different, etc... BTW it must have some TEXT that you can cut and paste. If you provide only screen shots, they must retype and that wastes time and leaves a potential for errors.

Still, the more info you can cover, and the more precise, the better your experience will be.
You would be SHOCKED at how much even working, and seemingly identical, routines can vary.

Steve

Thanks
1 reply

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Andyhenry

15 years ago

Originally Posted by seasoned

Well, I DID say:

BE PRECISE in how data relates, write out text, and mockup screens. Realize that some things MAY vary between what you do, and what they must do. Dropdown lists, for example, may look different, etc... BTW it must have some TEXT that you can cut and paste. If you provide only screen shots, they must retype and that wastes time and leaves a potential for errors.

Still, the more info you can cover, and the more precise, the better your experience will be.
You would be SHOCKED at how much even working, and seemingly identical, routines can vary.

Steve

These are not screenshots - they're interactive powerpoint slides. There's a difference - I've sold a lot of software from demonstrating the same thing and people forget it's a model and think it's the real software and want it right there and then.

I agree that the coding behind can vary wildly - which is why I always give new programmers test projects and look after the ones that work well.

Andy

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nothing to see here.

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Joseph Ratliff

15 years ago

When outsourcing any part of your business or individual tasks...no matter how low on the priority list...

Pick up the phone and call the person or agency you're using and talk to someone...interview them to get a "gut feel" of how they will perform. Our intuition is a powerful thing, it's best to use it when involving others in your business.

If it's not possible to phone the other party(ies)... at least make some sort of contact and perform initial screening to get the best "gut feel" you can. It doesn't work as well as talking to them personally, as tone and inflection are lost, but it's better than nothing at all.

Thanks

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JasonParker

15 years ago

John Jonas just launched an outsourcing site yesterday where you can hire Filipinos at Find a real, online job! | Home I haven't looked at thoroughly, but it seems similar to Best Jobs Philippines :: Philippine job search, job bank, employment and recruitment

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MisterMunch

15 years ago

Keeping an Outsourcer folder is a great tip.

Have a folder and put a page for every article writer you hire. Give him stars, and a short review for every job he does. Also keep a note of every scam artist or bad writer you step upon.

For outsourcing backlinks you can keep the same folder for each and every service you use. Also have a list of each project and track the keywords. Write the date the job is completed for that keyword, and track back a month later to see how it went. If great, give the service a star in their reviews.

By doing this over time you will have a great overview of who is good, who is bad, what services is great and what services do not work.

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dandimit

15 years ago

Daniel Pereira and I just did a 3 CD audio training set about outsourcing...we love it.

A cool easy way to learn a little about it is the book:
The 4 Hour Work Week By Timothy Ferris.

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James Pateman

15 years ago

I would agree with JasonParker's comment about sourcing from the Phillipines. Their english is excellent.

regards,
James Pateman

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jeffmull 14 years ago

A few points about outsourcing software.

1) Specify that the code must be fully commented/documented. That means that each step of the code has comments within it that explain what is happening.

You must assume that whoever wrote the original code, if it is a freelancer, will not be available to support or modify it later down the road. If code is commented, than another programmer can more easily understand what is going on, so it will take them less time and money to do the work.

If code is properly commented, you should be able to look at the source code and get some inkling of what is happening - even if you don't know anything about programming.

2) If I'm doing a long-term project that is business-critical, I prefer to use a local programmer that I can get on the phone with - in my time zone - if there are issues. If it's a simpler script, I really don't care where the programmer is.

Jeff Mulligan
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iw433

14 years ago

Thanks you, thank you. An excellent thread, well worth reading.

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Mukul Verma

14 years ago

How do you find training outsource employee around marketing your business. I have been doing this with my outsource employee, but thinking of duplicating and making a program around it. Would there be interest in training videos for your outsource employee. As well training people on outsourcing properly?

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David B.

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Mukul Verma

How do you find training outsource employee around marketing your business. I have been doing this with my outsource employee, but thinking of duplicating and making a program around it. Would there be interest in training videos for your outsource employee. As well training people on outsourcing properly?

I would be be.

Great thread by the way.

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Marx Vergel Melencio

14 years ago

This could possibly help:

Outsourcing Tips

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Curleyjohn

14 years ago

How about making these ALL in One threads sticky? Or give them a section of their own?

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vivekg

14 years ago

Monica, I completely agree with you, If the person is not performing or meeting guidelines its better to let him go that's what even I do.

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stephan231

14 years ago

I really like the outsourcing idea but I really hate same time when I know that I will waste much time finding a serious bidder there when posting any project which always makes me give up when trying outsourcing!

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hollypowell

14 years ago

I have been outsourcing since January 2009 and thru trial and error in trying to find the best solution for staying organized...

I use pelowork for all the projects
I use skype for communication

With 9 folks on my outsource team--it's the easiest way for me to keep track of everything.

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grayambition 14 years ago

I wrote the following "Warrior Writers Outsourcing Manifesto" due to issues I experienced with a writer I hired from this forum. Here's the thread where I originally submitted it: http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...vSJF2ZWTrFJoMq

Kezz suggested that I post it in here. I wasn't previously aware of the All in One threads, and was blown away by the volume of valuable tips and info.

This was written about article writers, but a lot of it should apply to other types of outsourcing projects.

Hope my little list adds something to the great value that's already in here!

------------

1. Never hire a writer based solely on their reputation, feedback, or reviews. Even if the entire Warrior membership sings the writer's praises, that doesn't mean he or she is the right writer for you.

2. Never get sucked in by a writer's sales pitch. It's just that. A pitch.

3. Always ask to look at writing samples. Ideally, the samples should be in a format similar to what you want. If you want articles, get article sample. If you want reviews, get samples of those. If you want an ebook... well, you get the idea.

4. Always ask if the writer is a native English speaker (if that's any kind of an issue for you).

5. Always ask if the writer will be personally doing the work.

6. If the writing will be outsourced, get the following information:
- Are all writers native English speakers (maybe it doesn't matter to you, but you should know)
- What kind of quality control takes place?
- Does the "head" writer proof all articles?
- Who makes edits, if required

7. Always place an initial order for ONE article and use that article to determine whether the writer meets your needs. Don't start with a package of 10 or 20 articles, no matter how attractive the discount may be.

8. If possible, provide the writer with samples of articles on the topic and in the style you want. Or at least write a few paragraphs to give the writer an idea of your style.

10. Don't make assumptions.

11. Under the heading "don't assume," specifically instruct the writer NOT to use a spinner (unless of course that's part of your project).

12. Be clear about your expectations regarding SEO and keyword density. There's debate on this topic; again, the important thing is to make your expectations clear. Yes, you should be this specific (if it's important to you): "Try to use the keyword once within the first 20 words, then once in the second paragraph and once in the final paragraph. Don't use the keyword more than 4 times in a 500 word article unless you don't see a way to make the writing flow naturally without using it." Of course, you don't have to use my example; replace it with whatever kw density formula you choose.

13. Confirm the timeline for project completion and agree about intervals at which communication and updates should take place. The writer might think it's fine to accept your work and disappear into a cave for 10 days, while you're expecting regular updates and draft in two days.

14. Speaking of drafts, make sure you get them, at least until you've worked with the writer enough to know that you instructions will be followed. Find out upfront if the writer will be willing to make edits, and if so, how many.

15. Confirm research expectations. Even if the writer says that he or she can write about a particular topic, find out if it's an area they're already familiar with. If it's not, ask how they plan to research it and how much research do they expect to do. Yes, this is often related to price - you won't get as much research for a cheaper article, but the point is to make sure you're both on the same page. And whether the writer is doing research or not, instruct him or her to ask you questions or simply not write about anything that's unclear. Tell them that leaving information out is preferable to misstating facts or writing muddled or confusing conclusions.

16. Encourage the writer to communicate any questions, problems or issues.

17. Be very clear about what constitutes an acceptable end product for you.

The key to most of the above is communication. Ask questions and make yourself clear at the beginning, and you'll be more likely to end up with a product that pleases you. Keep in mind that the writer would much prefer to give you a product you're happy with. If you're not happy, you're not going to be a repeat customer.

Well, I was gonna do a top 10, but hey, top 17 has kind of a ring to it, doesn't it?
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- Lyanna 13 years ago
  
  Be wary of super-cheap writing services, that's all I can say. A good article can take up to two hours to write, you know.
  
  The lower end writing services are around $1 per 100 words. if the price is much lower than that then you either got a real good bargain or a terrible writing service.
  
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Andy Fletcher

14 years ago

I posted this advice in another thread but that's likely to get buried so here's my top outsourcing tips -

When you use oDesk you have to setup a fail fast filtering process to get through the applicants as quickly as possible and save your sanity.

Here's some tips from my experience doing this. I hired link builders but everything applies equally well to article writers etc.

- Specify a project price or hourly price and instantly reject anyone that bids over. No questions, instant reject.
- Specify a code word in your job ad as follows. "The first word of your application must be ABCDEFGH or your application will be rejected". Then if the first word isn't ABCDEFGH instant reject, no questions.
- Issue a short trial assignment that is easy to evaluate. Should take applicants no more than 10-15 minutes to complete. (Don't use this to get free work) I asked for a couple of links to be placed and my standard report to be filled in. Article writers could ask for a paragraph on a topic etc. Make the assignment mind numbingly simple to understand and, you guessed it, instant reject anyone who doesn't.
- Hire more than you need to do the work for a paid trial, eg 1 week of 20 hours link building. Provide standard briefs and report formats and fire anyone that needs their hand held for more than a couple of questions. Remember, smart people seek clarification (that's good), dumb people just suck up your time (that's bad).
- Any that make it this far should be hired for the rest of the first month with regular work and if they are still showing themselves to be great workers bump their pay significantly to stop them spending time looking for greener grass.

And as a final thought. Absolutely do not try to hire people off oDesk for odds and ends assignments. If you just need a couple of hours link building done or five articles written you are going to spend way more time recruiting and managing than just doing the work yourself or paying a bit more and going to a specialist agency.

---

If you want to read the original thread (there's some great stuff in there by ramone_johnny as well) it's here -

http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...odesk-not.html

Hope that helps someone,

Andy

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andybeveridge

14 years ago

I mirror those who have the views about respect. Remember that those who work for you are real people. You should have the same attitude with your list as well.
Understanding and respect go a long way, whatever your nationality. I would rather pay someone an unannounced bonus for good work and keep that person happy.
This worked very well for me in an offline business a few years ago. Just letting people know that they were valuable to me, kept them happy and prepared to do that little bit extra when it was needed.
Great thread by the way.

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imintern

14 years ago

My single sentence advice to warriors especially those who are new to IM and are not sure how outsourcing works or those who are wondering if it is for them -

Join an Outsourcing Platform like GAF/ODesk/Elance, go through the jobs already posted, post a job for yourself and get started.

I guarantee you once you get a couple of jobs done the precious tips and ideas given by various warriors in this thread will begin to make more sense.

By the way, I waited for a long time before I actually was able to convince myself that being an one-man-army is not a good idea and I should outsource - I couldn't explain how it helped my business to grow. Take action now. Outsource.

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DamianLeon

14 years ago

It's much more cost effective to have a full time person in the Philippines who can do most things reasonably well - once you get to 3K or more say a month in steady income- they can be had for between 400-600 dollars per month and are very happy for this as that's the normal salary for such a position in their currency (outside Manila) - You can get someone on elance.com (in the Philippines) to create you a bestjobs.ph account, and I would put people on a week trial say before committing. Remember- slow to hire fast to fire- as you need to follow the Henry Ford motto and hire people that can do the job BETTER than you

Damian

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Mukul Verma

14 years ago

I just completed my outsource ins and outs guide. I am looking for 3 more people who can review and give me testamonials in the next couple days. It is 41 pages based on my expereince in outsourcing aiming to make it easier for people who looking to outsource. PM me fast if you are interested.

Cheers,
Mukul

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tyroneshum

14 years ago

I think linking my Mass Outsourcing secrets would be enough to explain things:

Mass Outsource

Thus, I believe that starting with your right search will make all things easy with outsourcing. Find a suitable firm to train and shortlist great virtual staff for you and then proceed to your own training and testing process straightaway - getting it free within my website could be a good opportunity for you too so feel free to check it out.

Good luck with outsourcing!

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147Ideas

14 years ago

Outsourcing is, without doubt, the most powerful tool in the armoury of a small/growing business. It allows rapid growth. However there are some small caveats.

1) Be prepared to work closely with people in the early stages. The more time you can give at the start - rather than expecting someone to come and solve all your time management problems in an instant - the better the relationship will grow.

2) Always be looking to 'promote' outsourced people. Have them train new people and reward them. If you teach them well, they will replicate your teaching method with the new people you bring on board.

3) Don't become over reliant on having outsourcers do absolutely every small job. Sometimes a small job can still be done more cheaply by you when factoring in a job that takes 10 minutes to explain which could be done by you in the space of 3 mins (things like booking tickets etc).

One thing's for sure, hiring outsourcers will really test whether your business 'system' is working well. If you don't have good processes in place before you hire, having more people work on a shoddy business model will simply magnify the problems rather than solve them.

It's no magic bullet.

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website design

14 years ago

Invest time in the beginning sorting through and testing the applicants.

1. Require a trial example in your project description to see who's motivated... 2. then hire a few people for a small test run... 3. pick the best and offer them a larger amount of work.

Track and record all progress. Fire quick and have backups of potential workers to step in to fill the gaps. Reward excellent work with bonuses.

If you have a large project that covers a wide variety of work then farm it out to different specialized groups. This way you have fewer problems with people stealing your business ideas.

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Marx Vergel Melencio

14 years ago

Below are some tips for testing out full time or part time assistants.
　
A. Create a list of tasks you need your assistant to do on a daily basis.

B. Ask your assistant to extensively research then develop a write-up containing:

i. a description of each task,
ii. a summarry of benefits which can be gained after properly completing each task,
iii. a step-by-step guide in properly doing the task, and
iv. a set of pointers and tips which can (1) speed up task completion and (2) improve the overall quality of results from the completed task.

You can determine their content research, analysis, writing and communication skills off the bat. You can even pinpoint areas where you can train them further or ask them to extensively research and learn based on what they've written for each task you need done.

Plus, your assistant learns (1) what each task is all about, (2) why you're asking them to do those tasks, (3) how to complete those tasks properly step-by-step and (4) how to speed up task completion and improve the overall quality of results from each completed task, even before they start working as your assistant! They can even use what they wrote, or the version of their write-ups once you corrected it or added useful content to it, as reference material.

It'll be best to require them to send daily email, IM and mobile SMS notifications at the start of their work shift to you and their manager/supervisor.

Also, a detailed daily work progress/status report template should be filled out and emailed along with their completed tasks to you and their manager/supervisors.

The template could contain the following headers: Date, Task, Output, Time Started, Time Completed, Problems/Issues (if any), and Suggestions/Recommendations (to improve results and expedite task completion).

Email, IM or mobile SMS notifications should be sent 8 hours before the start of their work shift in case they can't go to work on any particular day due to valid reasons like health emergencies among others. If you assigned someone to supervise them on a daily basis as well as delegate tasks to your other assistants, this person could also be required to delegate tasks supposedly for the assistant who called in sick on that particular day to other available assistants in your team, of course for added pay. This will be great to determine which assistant in your team is the most hardworking and dependable.

Tell them failure to do any of the stuff above will result to poor performance grades and warnings which could eventually lead to their suspension, demotion or termination.

Also have a performance charting system which can easily show the performance grades of an assistant per day, week and month. You can ask your manager to do this if you have one. The performance charts can also be viewable to everyone in your team to promote healthy competitiveness. Rewards and incentives for good to exceptional performance will also be very motivational and inspiring. Don't take for granted the positive effects of inspiring words coupled with material rewards and incentives.

Hope this helps.

Best Regards,

Marx

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Marketing Cheetah

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Marx Vergel Melencio

Below are some tips for testing out full time or part time assistants.
　
A. Create a list of tasks you need your assistant to do on a daily basis.

B. Ask your assistant to extensively research then develop a write-up containing:

i. a description of each task,
ii. a summarry of benefits which can be gained after properly completing each task,
iii. a step-by-step guide in properly doing the task, and
iv. a set of pointers and tips which can (1) speed up task completion and (2) improve the overall quality of results from the completed task.

You can determine their content research, analysis, writing and communication skills off the bat. You can even pinpoint areas where you can train them further or ask them to extensively research and learn based on what they've written for each task you need done.

Plus, your assistant learns (1) what each task is all about, (2) why you're asking them to do those tasks, (3) how to complete those tasks properly step-by-step and (4) how to speed up task completion and improve the overall quality of results from each completed task, even before they start working as your assistant! They can even use what they wrote, or the version of their write-ups once you corrected it or added useful content to it, as reference material.

It'll be best to require them to send daily email, IM and mobile SMS notifications at the start of their work shift to you and their manager/supervisor.

Also, a detailed daily work progress/status report template should be filled out and emailed along with their completed tasks to you and their manager/supervisors.

The template could contain the following headers: Date, Task, Output, Time Started, Time Completed, Problems/Issues (if any), and Suggestions/Recommendations (to improve results and expedite task completion).

Email, IM or mobile SMS notifications should be sent 8 hours before the start of their work shift in case they can't go to work on any particular day due to valid reasons like health emergencies among others. If you assigned someone to supervise them on a daily basis as well as delegate tasks to your other assistants, this person could also be required to delegate tasks supposedly for the assistant who called in sick on that particular day to other available assistants in your team, of course for added pay. This will be great to determine which assistant in your team is the most hardworking and dependable.

Tell them failure to do any of the stuff above will result to poor performance grades and warnings which could eventually lead to their suspension, demotion or termination.

Also have a performance charting system which can easily show the performance grades of an assistant per day, week and month. You can ask your manager to do this if you have one. The performance charts can also be viewable to everyone in your team to promote healthy competitiveness. Rewards and incentives for good to exceptional performance will also be very motivational and inspiring. Don't take for granted the positive effects of inspiring words coupled with material rewards and incentives.

Hope this helps.

Best Regards,

Marx

Markx, isn't that a bit harsh. Won't this demotivate them. Few people in this thread suggested to nice and humble with outsourcers and tell them everything (even your angerness) in a polite way.

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mikeallen50

14 years ago

Outsourcing is the best way to get things done these days. If you are intended to outsource your work or any thing. There are infinite number of firms and companies ready to do the job for you.

I want to mention a firm called sales-marketing-outsourcing which provides outsourcing in different verticals. They are open to new verticals as well.

Whenever you think of outsourcing sales or marketing departments to concentrate more on production, you must need a reliable expert to handle outsourcing.

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bolcitybol

13 years ago

hello,

this is alok.it is my site which is gives you more space at no cost for ads.I hope you like it.

please drop suggestion.

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mcmillad

13 years ago

Always use the recommended means of communication. Usually that means using the sites platform to communicate with your programmer. I have had times when the programmer tries to use personal email to communicate and then you have no acceptable record in a dispute.

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LastWarrior

13 years ago

In communicating to my outsourcer, I came up with the idea of using
a similar Camtasia-like program. Because I didn't know how to use
Powerpoint, I opened several windows that each had relevant
information I wanted to share with the OS. I then recorded what I
wanted and then just switched to each relevant page as I was talking
and moving the mouse around to point things out.

It worked great and will do similar again when the need arises.

LastWarrior

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FreeLinkJuice

13 years ago

I tend to keep it simple when it comes to online stuff. (Perhaps the secret to my success (smile).

Anyway -- when it comes to outsourcing I think everyone should look at Fiverr.com (that's 2 "R"s).

You can find some amazing people there that will deliver great services (and products) for a mere 5 bucks.

If you haven't been there go soon.

That's my 2 cents.

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George

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jdjenkins 13 years ago

There's lots of good info here which will help many people out. I would just add that some people may be a bit nervous about just starting any kind of outsourcing; but I would suggest just go and do it - find 1 or 2 freelancers to write a couple of short articles for you.

Getting started in outsourcing in a very small way like this will give you confidence to lead into bigger projects. Also this kind of low-cost and low-risk beginning is a good way to practise finding and negotiating with freelancers; and you don't have huge deadlines while you start to look at ways to organise projects and communication.
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- toytruck 13 years ago
  
  Just want to share a few tips based on my experience:
  
  ~ Look for someone with the following basic criteria:
  
  English skills of 5 (self-rated and passed English Test). You may also test his/her communication skills through Skype call.
  
  Feedback score of 4.5-5
  
  ~ Choose someone who has a high speed internet and can work on your preferred office hours.
  
  ~ Set your required weekly hour limit and specify that you prefer a candidate who is willing to work online (instead of billing you for offline work).
  
  ~ Review portfolio and samples of previous work. This will give you an idea of their skills & capabilities.
  
  ~ Interview qualified applicants. In my case, I ask them situational questions to measure their knowledge on specific subjects.
  
  ~ Select the best candidates, give them a test project then hire the one who delivers the best work.
  
  ~ Once hired, be sure your assistant fully understands the project before you begin. Clearly define the project descriptions, set your expectations, deadlines, etc)
  
  ~ Create a To-Do List for your assistant and ask him/her to send you a daily progress report.
  
  ~ Set weekly meetings with your assistant to discuss project status and to evaluate his/her job performance.
  
  Hope these helps
  
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sitemarketer

13 years ago

If you are considering outsourcing programming overseas, this is my story, having hired six different programming *teams* for large PHP projects. They were all large companies.

Five of them were from India with disastrous results. One entire company, when the project was nine months in, 95% complete, and paid up-to-date, just vanished off the face of the planet, totally unreachable for a year. Then they contacted me to ask if I had any new work for them.

The inside information that I had at the time on Indian firms is that the turnover is huge, with programmers continually looking for new jobs and then using the new offers to renegotiate contracts, over and over again. I will never work with an Indian firm again and I'm half Indian.

For the past five years, I've been working with a Ukrainian company and they are all kinds of awesome and have incredible programmer loyalty and retention. They train their staff, send them to English lessons, have project managers and testers, etc. My initial programmer there from five years ago is now my project manager and when I needed to scale to 15 programmers in three shifts around the clock, they were able to accommodate.

They also work on a schedule that overlaps mine, so we have the mornings to discuss things and work together. Now, they're PHP programmers mostly and not up-to-speed on all the latest and greatest like node.js, mongodb, knockout.js etc., but if you hire your own guys through them, you give them time to learn whatever you want, and they love working on things where they learn.

So, my two cents is to consider Ukrainian programmers. They seem to be treated well and are able to do some pretty complicated stuff.

John.

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sal64

13 years ago

The following strategy is based on how I used oDesk to build my team... on my terms... for the hours I reqire... and for very little money. I hope you can also use it accordingly.

Enjoy!

Ok...

I posted my first project for a casual VA and listed the many tasks I wanted done. To my surprise, I had 56 candidates in as little as 72 hours.

With so many well credentialled candidadtes, and not much work, I coniously decided that I would test a few out with smaller tasks. Then I would slect full timers accordingly.

This is where I had my AHA moment and my Outsourcing epiphany! As I began to look through my shortlisted candidates and their resumes, I soon discovered that most of them posessed different core skills. Some were better at SEO... whilst others were better at web design etc. So here's what I did next...

I broke my business down into specific areas such as customer service, seo, design, graphics and so on. I then hired multiple candidates for this position and assigned each one a very small task to complete.

So rather than commiting to one person, or to a monthly contract, I was able to get most things done for less that $100. I deliberaetly assigned tasks which I knew would be required again int he future, and that were based on the individual's core skill.

The upshot was that I found 3 providers at between $3 to $6 per hour which I still work with today.

But here's the real kicker for all you noobs and start-ups...

All providers are employed on a part-time casual basis. Which means you only pay for the work you need... rather then running around like a headless chicken trying to find enough work to justify your minimum monthly commitment.

If you only need 3 hours work on any given week, that's all you pay for, and as you get busier and your business grows, you can ramp up the hours and/or hire more personell.

The other great advantage of this approcah is that you get things done quicker, as you have multiple workers working on tasks simultaneously.

So here's what this approach can do for you...

Start outsourcing on a shoestring budget and without commiting hundreds or thousands of dollars up front.

Build a personal team of workers that are reliable and professional.

Quickly dismiss someone who does not perform,and replace them quickly.

Add to your team as required.

Employ real specialists based on the work you have available so that you are assured of quality results every time, without having to commit to minimum hours for each employee.

Bottom line: It's flexible, affordable and scalable to YOUR business needs.

wishing you best of success!

Sal

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Allan_Gardyne

12 years ago

8 Reasons To Hire A Reporter Instead of an Amateur From Odesk

(Yep, this is original and exclusive - I just wrote it.)

If you're hiring an outsourced writer, as well as using Odesk, Elance, folk in Philippines, etc., consider giving the task to a newspaper journalist/reporter/feature writer. It could be someone who writes for your local newspaper.

I've done it, and it worked beautifully. I hired a journo to write articles for a website I was creating. I simply phoned the newspaper, asked to speak to a particular reporter, told her I'd like to hire her to research and write a bunch of articles, and arranged to meet. Eight years later, the low-maintenance site I created is still generating useful revenue and the journo's fees have been paid for many times over.

Think of all the advantages of hiring a journalist...

1. You can easily see and compare multiple examples of their work - just look in the newspaper.

2. Their first language is English (assuming you live in an English-speaking country).

3. Most journalists have a plain, easy to understand writing style. Some can add a touch a humor. Good ones know how to connect with their readers. If you get the right person, almost no editing is required.

3. Professional journalists understand and respect copyright laws. They won't waste your time with stolen or "spun" junk.

4. Journalists know how to write an eye-catching headline, maybe even better than you.

5. They know how to write a powerful intro which encourages your visitors to read more.

6. They know how to tell an interesting yarn.

7. They know how to be concise.

8. They're used to writing fast and meeting deadlines.

9. They're experienced at doing careful research.

10. They're also experienced at interviewing experts, so they can create a genuinely USEFUL article, not just regurgitate stuff they've read somewhere.

One disadvantage...

For the journo I hired (a New Zealander), I probably paid 10 or 20 times what I might have paid someone hired on Odesk. But the work was very good, the experience was pleasant, and the project still makes money.

Just a thought... what if you could track down a reporter/journalist/feature writer in the Philippines? You should be able to get really good outsourcing, at a bargain price. An outsourced journalist would be good at finding other journalists.

Note to mods: It would be really handy if you outsourced cleaning up this thread. The L-O-N-G quoted sections and thank you messages could be deleted, for a start.

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Kayla Mashman

12 years ago

Hey guys,
I am new. I have learned a lot of from over the post.
Thank you so much all are,
worrylessenjoymore.com

Thanks

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Victoralexon

12 years ago

Here are a few websites where you can find people to outsource tasks to:

www.fiverr.com, www.odesk.com, www.elance.com, www.freelancer.com, www.vworker.com, www.guru.com, www.thecontentauthority.com, www.iwriter.com, www.textbroker.com, www.textbroker.co.uk and www.constant-content.com.

Also check out the 'Warriors for Hire' section of this forum.

You could also start a thread in the 'Wanted - Members Looking To Hire You' section.

Thanks

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Noel Cunningham

12 years ago

Great thread Allen, this will be a very valuable resource... Here are my little tips.

1. Pay Bonuses : a little incentive goes along way to increasing productivity so give your employees bonuses for results
2. Train Them Well : most outsourcers will need to me trained specifically for the tasks which you give them so be prepared for an initial learning curve. I set up a "Training Area" for my VA which is like a mini-membership site of training pdfs and video tutorials. It's a great resource and can be used to train in other employee's down the line.
3. Treat them with Respect : often we have to remind ourselves that our outsourced employee's are real people so treat them well and they will work very hard for you!

Thanks

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Chris-

12 years ago

I have done lots of outsourcing on oDesk.

The way I do it is to only use fixed-price jobs, that way I never pay until I am 100% satisfied, plus I like to reward effeciency, and I know very well that if I paid per hour, many workers would do the work slower, so I'd rather pay them more for their time if they do well, rather than paying more if they do the job worse

One trick is, even though the minimum budget is $5, you can make a fixed-price job of $5, and say that you'll pay $1 per completed task, then pay them $1 at a time, and there is no problem if the total is less than $5.

Hope that helps

Chris
PS. (for more great tips like this, see my sig.

Thanks

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marketwarrior06

Banned 12 years ago

Its an interesting thread

Actually there is no secret of outsourcing. its not necessary that everyone will be successful in outsourcing. I know some people who totally hate outsourcing their jobs. Because they have some very bad experience. But there are some other companies which are based on Outsourcing. So you have to be lucky enough to get the best employee

Thanks

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Jeff Burritt

Banned 12 years ago

A note about communication when outsourcing a website or software development:

I have personally hired some cheap programmers on odesk. Both for websites and software. In many cases I was not happy with the result, and I found the process of communication to be tiresome. Again, this is my personal experience.

But when I decided to spend more money, I found the quality of the product to be better, but it still took a lot of time communicating.

So, unless you are well versed in the technical programming verbage and very clear on the type of software/website you want, I recommend finding a programmer which speaks your native language very well. And has many previous customers which also speak your language. It may even mean finding a programmer in your same country.

Like in many things, communication is key.

So, if you don't have much to spend. And you need to outsource web design or software development, and you don't have much experience in outsourcing before, then I still recommend odesk, but:

1. Look for someone with excellent language and communication skills
2. Look for someone with many happy customers who share your native language.
3. Consider, even if you have to spend more, hiring a programmer from your same country.

Thanks

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ExpertSEOServices

12 years ago

I always make sure I interview thoroughly before hiring.
Its always a good idea to get the freelancer to complete a short task or test to make sure they can complete the job before hiring.

Thanks

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interactivex

12 years ago

Freelancer.com - better for projects
vworker.com - best for programming project work
oDesk.com - better for hourly
Elance.com - a bit more expensive
Staff.com - greater level of service but full time only
Guru.com - more US workers

Best recommendation - try lots of people with small amounts of work until you find someone great then keep them full time if possible!

Thanks

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The Copy Warriors

12 years ago

OK so, here's a tip I want to offer on one of the most hotly discussed topics on the forum.

This is the topic of getting people for cheap.

There are basically two sides to this debate:

1. The "gurus" who tell you you can make a decent income outsourcing everything for $5 an hour, even though you can tell that most of the stuff done on their own websites probably cost a lot more than that.

(Hint: these people are selling a dream, not a reality; it's not in their interests to tell you you need to pay for quality, because people don't want to hear that anything will be hard, expensive, time-consuming, or complicated)

2. The freelancers who bitch and whine about low rates and how everyone who tried to minimize costs is a slave-driving evildoer who will end up with running their business into the ground with poorly-done work that makes customers run away in terror.

(Hint: these people are mostly freelancers who can't hack it in the game, don't have the chutzpah to sell themselves, and wish that high paying gigs would just fall into their lap like presents on Christmas day)

So, who's right here?

I PROPOSE THE FOLLOWING:

NEITHER OF THEM ARE RIGHT!

The truth is this, and if you don't think you can remember this, then tattoo it on the back of you hand:

You can outsource work for cheap if it's in an area you have a DEEP understanding of yourself, and can make precise and clear technical instructions to the contractor; otherwise, ask around for recommendations and hire someone who charges more.

It's really as simple as that.

If you understand the skillset you want to outsource, you can make any corrections to the work the low-priced constractor produces.

If you DON'T possess the skillset yourself, it's better to hedge your bets and hire an expert who has proven reviews all over the internet and an established reputation in his or her field.

I'm sure I'm going to get tons of flame from gurus who want to sell you their "make a million outsourcing everything" e-book and freelancers who want you to pay them a billion dollars for work that's average at best, but believe me, what I have said here is the straight-up honest to goodness truth on the matter.

Thanks

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John Jonas Phil VA

12 years ago

Learn as much as you can about outsourcing before taking the plunge! It's better (and cheaper) to learn from other people's experience than to learn from your mistakes. I know there's a free ebook and resources on outsourcing to the Philippines available at jonasblog.com or replacemyself.com. Learn from whatever resource you can find so when you do start outsourcing, you'll be more confident and you'll know what you're doing.

Thanks

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eAvenue

12 years ago

I own an outsourcing company here in Manila, we provide our services in many ways.

You can hire eAvenue staff by the hour
hire eAvenue to complete a complete project for you
or hire an eAvenue to work on your project full time on an ongoing basis

I am happy to help people figure out their outsourcing needs.

I am also happy to talk to people about working with outsourced employees. I have been using outsourced employees for the last 10 years and would be happy to help.

James

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zylun

12 years ago

Hiring a freelancer for a specific project perfect only if the business or temporary or is set only for a short term, but if your business is long term its better to get a person a single person employed (to you) offshore, for faster ROI.

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John Romaine

12 years ago

Here's a work order template taken from my Web Design Business Startup Kit. Its designed for web design specifically, but with a few amendments could be used for any service delivery. (writing, graphic design, logos etc)

I always use a work order when hiring virtual assistants, as it clarifies the task required and reduces the likelihood of any misunderstandings.

Just amend it to suit your needs.

Also, another great resource that I use often is called Expert Rating. Its a great way to filter potential applicants by having them do a test as part of the hiring process.

You can find out more here ExpertRating - Online Certification and Employee Testing

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razul

11 years ago

Maybe someone can benefit from this snippet that I use for my Virtual Assistant Job Ads:

Your qualifications/Abilities/Skills/Attributes:

- Excellent attention to detail (Essential) e.g. if I say 400 words maximum it must be adhered
- Ability to multitask and take on multiple projects (Essential) e.g. do one task while another is loading
- Excellent ability to understand/interpret & follow English written instructions (Essential)
- Verifiable touch typing speed greater than 40 wpm with almost zero mistakes (Essential)
- Previous experience as an administrative assistant
- Great MS Word, Excel & PDF creation Skills
- Ability to use Dropbox or Google Docs or Evernote
- Broadband Internet connection (of satisfactory stability)
- Strong understanding of Internet and online communication tools
- Ability to meet deadlines (defined in my time zone)
- Strong communication skills
- Satisfactory English Speaking Skills
- Excellent English Writing Ability e.g. no frequent grammatical or spelling mistakes in our correspondence
- Honest
- A complete Elance profile (Preferred)
- References or an established reputation on Elance (Preferred)
- Ability to voice your own ideas, show initiative (Not Essential) e.g. meet my minimum specifications of a job and add more things that you think I may benefit from

Thanks

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TroyCo

11 years ago

The best way to communicate with video is screenr.com its free, you can shoot screen capture videos with sound and just send the link to your outsourcer, there is an upgrade with a monthly fee but the free version works for smaller operations

Thanks

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maricar

11 years ago

We have been outsourcing for a while. The most important thing is that they understand and speak English well. You need to train and work with them until they can perform tasks. It is a good idea to let them work out problems before asking you. Only as a last resort. We use skype and make videos for training.

Thanks

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Fazal Mayar

11 years ago

Like everyone here says, make sure you know to who you outsource and your strategy too to achieve your goals

Thanks

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vedremo

Banned 11 years ago

I just read this article about outsourcing - not so much "outsourcing secrets" as real world experience - How to hire staff - What I

I have had similar experience to the author of the article. Can be cost effective for minimal viable product, especially if you're relying on your own finance and not raising capital.

In my experience in house production is far better. Contractors/freelancers/odeskers/onlinejobs.ph'ers are usually just looking to get the job done, rather than having a vested interested in your business and long term goals.

Thanks

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Justin Humphries

10 years ago

Before you hire someone, give them a "test" job - something NEW they have to create (not from their portfolio) so you can see how they do. Get a few of these and pick the best option.

Also, if you are going to hire someone long term (personal assistant, etc) then you should hire them on a trial basis first, tell them if they do a good job the first 30 days then you will keep them on, maybe give them a raise, whatever. That way they know they have to perform for you and you know you have the option of finding someone else if it doesn't work out.

It also gives them an out if they realize it's not for them. You want to find someone who does a great job but also works well with you and what you need - not everyone will fit that criteria on the first go.

Thanks

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elijahdean24

10 years ago

I use odesk and leave the job bid open for 4 days and use the newbies depending on the task, what I have found out is just because is new on odesk does not mean that they are new to their trade I have received some of my best work from people who were new to odesk with no reviews and sometimes they did the work for free because they just wanted the feedback and ratings

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kevingiles

10 years ago

Do Everything yourself until you are making Good Money....THEN out-source the things that you do not enjoy doing. You will know how much to pay someone else to do it because you know how long it takes to get it done!

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