There's NOTHING Wrong With Having A Job.

16 years ago

Andy,

Your subject line scared me half to death. Thankfully I had enough strength left to read the post.

You are correct in your conclusions.

George Wright

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CDarklock

16 years ago

Originally Posted by Andyhenry

The implication is usually that if you're making your money online, but you need to keep working to keep the money coming in - you're not as successful as you think, and you've basically still got a job and are kidding yourself that you haven't.

Some people want a job.

There are people in this world who can't do anything if they don't have a prescribed schedule laid down and enforced by someone else.

There are other people who can't do anything unless someone else tells them what to do.

There are others who can't do anything unless someone else needs it from them.

And there are still others who simply need to get their hands dirty with actual work.

We're fooling ourselves if we believe the propaganda that anyone and everyone is capable of owning and running their own totally-outsourced business that puts money in their pocket without any action on their part. Some people, if they tried that, would be miserable. And anything that makes you miserable is most definitely NOT success.

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R Hagel

16 years ago

I agree completely, Andy. And I've said the same thing.

One problem is that lots of folks assume that if they like something or want to live a certain way, then EVERYONE should want the same thing.

It's like your mom saying, "I'm cold. You should put on a sweater."

We see the same attitude here. "This is what I believe about IM and success. You should do the exact same thing."

I'd make the suggestion that those who can't get out of their own heads and see that others have different values, beliefs and likes might want to learn how to do it... really quick. Because those who can step outside of themselves and see problems from another person's viewpoint tend to be the best product creators and marketers.

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Frank Donovan

16 years ago

Hi Andy

Well said. Of course, you're absolutely right. Everyone has their own idea of what constitutes success and they certainly shouldn't simply accept other people's values.

As Bob Dylan put it: "A man is a success if he gets up in the morning and gets to bed at night, and in between he does what he wants to do. "

It would be hard to argue against that.

Frank

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Steven Wagenheim

16 years ago

Andy, I wish you could see me standing up and applauding right now.

I remember all the people here who told me I was crazy working such long
hours at my business. It didn't seem to matter to them that I enjoyed doing
it. In their eyes, I was a failure because I worked 7 to 11 everyday.

Well, today, I work 1 or 2 hours a day at most, spend most of my time
recording songs or playing video games and don't have to answer to
anybody but myself.

I am so glad you said this because it's something I've wanted to say for
a long time but didn't because coming from me it wouldn't carry the
same weight here.

Thank you, thank you, thank you.

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Andyhenry

16 years ago

Hi Steven,

I know what you mean, I was guilty of this in the past. I guess when you get excited about something like IM and you learn how to outsource, systemize and automate so that you only need to spend a relatively short amount of time on the things you like - it seems strange to see people saying they're working really long hours and they like it.

I guess when most people start out in IM, they're focus is on getting more money and more time, so the idea of wanting to spend a lot of time on things seems crazy - especially if you don't have to.

But the truth of things is - we're all individuals and what one person may enjoy in short bursts, another person loves to spend hours doing.

It's part of the attraction of working online - you can choose your model, and choose how you scale it based on what you want to end up with while enjoying the journey.

Long hours does not equal success, but since we all have 24 hours a day to fill - why not use as many of them in what gives you pleasure - whether that's an activity working for someone else, or yourself - you still get the enjoyment and one way is as valid as the other.

With communities like the WF we're all looking out for each other and forget sometimes that our vision of a perfect life may not be the same for anyone else.

We live and learn.

Andy

Originally Posted by Steven Wagenheim

Andy, I wish you could see me standing up and applauding right now.

I remember all the people here who told me I was crazy working such long
hours at my business. It didn't seem to matter to them that I enjoyed doing
it. In their eyes, I was a failure because I worked 7 to 11 everyday.

Well, today, I work 1 or 2 hours a day at most, spend most of my time
recording songs or playing video games and don't have to answer to
anybody but myself.

I am so glad you said this because it's something I've wanted to say for
a long time but didn't because coming from me it wouldn't carry the
same weight here.

Thank you, thank you, thank you.

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Kim Standerline

16 years ago

I've said it all along,

I love my job and no matter how successful I became at IM it never ever occurred to me to give it up. In fact getting busy offline was one of the original reasons I decided to slow down online at the beginning of the year.

People think I'm nuts because I'd sooner go out to work rather than just make money online, but the truth of the matter is I like to go out and interact with other people. If I just worked from home I'd become a reclusive slob who never got dressed from one day to the next.

Well said Andy.

Originally Posted by Steven Wagenheim

Andy, I wish you could see me standing up and applauding right now.

I remember all the people here who told me I was crazy working such long
hours at my business. It didn't seem to matter to them that I enjoyed doing
it. In their eyes, I was a failure because I worked 7 to 11 everyday.

Well, today, I work 1 or 2 hours a day at most, spend most of my time
recording songs or playing video games and don't have to answer to
anybody but myself.

I am so glad you said this because it's something I've wanted to say for
a long time but didn't because coming from me it wouldn't carry the
same weight here.

Thank you, thank you, thank you.

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Jack Chua 16 years ago

Each person has different approach towards having a job. There are those who don't need to be dictated and just do their own style of accomplishing a certain task while others depend so much on what the boss tells them to do. In my own point of view, each person may seem to be having a different relationship with their job and it would greatly affect their performance and the results of their tasks. We never assume that a person is happy with his job because he stayed that long because we never know his own reason for staying.
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Andyhenry

16 years ago

I meant to say it but I'll add it now as CDarklock alluded to it.

Some people wouldn't be able to have their version of success WITHOUT having other people send them a flow of work.

Some people don't want to think about what to do, they just want to do what they love.

If you're a painter, you may not get inspired easily - but when someone commissions you to do work, you love the fact that you get paid to paint (whatever it is).

I often thought in the past that if someone would pay me just to play my drums - that would be heaven, and although I still like the idea (and have been paid many times to play), I do have other activities that I have a passion for, so my plans have changed.

But - in the same way that some people are happy to work fixing cars because they love mechanics and fixing problems, many people actually need direction and want to be given things to do.

There is no one right/best answer for everyone.

When people start to see success on their own terms, sometimes their excitement clouds their vision and they think they know what's best for everyone else.

I've seen people try to 'fix' the lives of homeless people - only to end up realising that their version of 'fixed' just wasn't what they wanted and they were actually extremely resistant to being given someone elses picture of success.

Andy

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Killer Joe

16 years ago

Originally Posted by Andyhenry

I've seen people try to 'fix' the lives of homeless people - only to end up realising that their version of 'fixed' just wasn't what they wanted and they were actually extremely resistant to being given someone elses picture of success.

Andy

Andy, that remids me of this story...

Years ago a friend of mine drove past a homeless person on their way to work for months on end. One day she came home from work and told me that she gave the homeless guy $200 worth of clothing she bought for him the day before. She was so happy.

The next day after work she was teed-off beyond belief because the homeless person was no longer in possession of any of it.

Great post, btw.

KJ

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Clint

16 years ago

Hi Andy,

The last Job I has was in a factory.

The mane resin was to get around people in person (the internet marketing seen kinda takes that form you a lot of the time)

This is my story. Earning a living is not the only reason for having a Job.

Clint S.

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patfl

16 years ago

That's very true and it can get even more complicated when people get confused with their goals.

"I want to be rich" can hide other things, like insecurity, lack of self-esteem etc that won't disappear when you get what you apparently wanted.

Us humans are really messed-up animals...

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don15432

16 years ago

I believe that most people in this world want to be led and don't want to take the risk of upsetting the masses. That's fine because someone has to work for people like us because if everyone were entrepreneurs how would anything get done. We lead, they follow, and everyone is happy.

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Simo

16 years ago

Hey Andy,

I am in the midst of moving back into a corporate role after working for 5 years in Real Estate. You post validated a number of things for me.

A number of my friends are saying "stick with it... you'll hate working in a job" etc

We are the only ones who truely stand in our own shoes.

I am giving up Real Estate to follow my passion in IM. A job serves me better to achieve this. The Real Estate lession has been a great one and I have been enriched by it. Time to go apply my learning and passion to IM.

Thanks for sharing a great post

Cheers,

Andrew

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AverageGuy

16 years ago

most people in IM can NOT earn enough money as a regular job, so, what's wrong to have a regular job? as long as you can afford the possible "loss" of IM, then do it. otherwise, a regular job is better. IM is not for everyone, just like every other business.

david

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Steven Fullman

16 years ago

Thanks, Andy.

I suspect people don't NECESSARILY want to leave their jobs.

Rather, they want to be able to quit...if "it" hits the fan.

It's more about freedom of choice, less about current unhappiness.

Thanks for the brain fodder, Andy

Steve

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pheonix44

16 years ago

Nothing wrong with a job

Just kidding, even though I would never work for someone else again it did give me an opportunity to do the things I am doing now. I also met many girls when I worked but not so much now, so having a job had benefits. I am now able to do so much more though, it is just that its all in my hands now to make it happen.

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Banned 16 years ago

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pheonix44

16 years ago

Yeah, when bound by someone else, you simply can't do as much. Sadly, people NEED to be bossed around by the Television and their bosses because they lost the ability to think.

Did you know that JOB stands for Just Over Broke?

Yeah I knew what it meant, there is actually a good blog post I read about this on a good blog, check it out.

10 Reasons You Should Never Get a Job

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n00b

16 years ago

Like Steven said, it's all about freedom of choice.

The nice thing about residual income is that it is great in case of emergencies, so I do think everyone should have some source of residual income or a really great savings for those emergency situations that pop up. I guess what I'm saying is that if you have the knowledge and ability to have residual income and you don't because of your job, then that is irresponsible. I'm not trying to pass judgment, I just worry for people who don't think ahead or think "big picture".

My father-in-law is a workaholic. He will never stop. He came to visit us once and was up at 5:00 am doing yard work because he just can't stand not to work (btw, he did not pass that gene on to my hubby

). Right now he trades his time for money selling something that he is passionate about, but he has also built up a residual income so that when he collapsed from blood clots and had to spend a month in the hospital, his regular bills were still paid from that residual.

If you have a job because you love it, great! There is nothing more wonderful than being able to do what you love and get paid for it.

However, if you're staying in a job that you hate because of fear, then that's a different animal. Having a job you love is admirable, but when I see people on here posting things like, "I can't wait to quit my job. I'm already making more with my business, but I need to wait until I have $1 million in the bank, then I'll do it." That's when I cringe. That's a fear mentality.

Live the life you love and don't make decisions based on fear, they will never serve you!

If you want to be doing something else with your life than what you're doing right now, I highly recommend Timothy Feriss's "The 4-Hour Work Week". The part where he talks about worst-case vs best-case vs what-will-probably-actually-happen scenario completely changed my life.

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Andyhenry

16 years ago

Originally Posted by n00b

If you want to be doing something else with your life than what you're doing right now, I highly recommend Timothy Feriss's "The 4-Hour Work Week". The part where he talks about worst-case vs best-case vs what-will-probably-actually-happen scenario completely changed my life.

If you asked me 10 years ago if I thought it was possible to travel the world as I do and be making more money than ever while doing it, I'd have thought you were crazy (at the time I had massive debts and couldn't even see that they would ever be gone).

Sometimes you naturally focus on your problems and it's required to create a plan to move forward, but when you get sucked in to thinking they are part of you and represent failure - it can be a long time or take something very drastic before you come up for air and realise life's too short to get dragged down by anything, especially material issues which can be dealt with.

I like Tims book, but I've met a lot of people who've read it but still don't think the concept is possible or say "it's ok for other people", but I'm living proof that it's a viable way to go if you really want to.

I'm sure at some point I'll settle down again, but right now I couldn't tell you where I'll be living in 1 month let alone 1 year or more - I'm completely open to anything coming my way.

Many people read books about success and making money and leave the information in the same place as if it were fiction, and never do anything about it because they don't believe it can happen.

Sometimes just believing is enough to get the universe turning its cogs and driving your dreams towards you.

Andy

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Katie Rich

16 years ago

Originally Posted by Andyhenry

Sometimes just believing is enough to get the universe turning its cogs and driving your dreams towards you.

Andy

I think the universe and I fell out somewhere along the way

How did you change your mindset Andy?

In a few short weeks I have gone from having a very good job which I loved to being unemployed (which I hate!). I know I now have the time to concentrate on IM, but the overlying problems of losing my home and lifestyle and paying bills are blocking my motivation to do anything other than just sit here and panic!

I love working. I need something to get up for in a morning, a reason to shower and dress and get out there. Being home for the last few weeks has drained my energies. Some days I just look at the weather, open another bill, and hibernate. Not positive I know, but I can't motivate. I have even tried odesk and elance, to find a reason to get up and get going, but so far I have not been successful.

I used to work all day and return home full of energy and enthusiasm for IM, sometimes working far into the night, reading learning and putting things into practice. So yes, I agree that there are those of us out here who do need a 'job'.

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Andyhenry

16 years ago

Originally Posted by Katie Rich

How did you change your mindset Andy?

In a few short weeks I have gone from having a very good job which I loved to being unemployed (which I hate!). I know I now have the time to concentrate on IM, but the overlying problems of losing my home and lifestyle and paying bills are blocking my motivation to do anything other than just sit here and panic!

Here's a story I once heard that sums it up:

One day a farmers horse went crazy and bolted, knocking down his barn door and fence.

His neighbors gathered and said "oh, isn't this a terrible thing!"

He replied...... "Maybe"

The next day, his horse returned, bringing with it 5 wild horses.

His neighbors all stopped by and proclaimed "My, how lucky this is"

He replied...... "Maybe"

A few days later, while trying to break-in one of the wild horses his son was kicked and broke his leg.

The neighbors gathered.... "Oh no, how unfortunate this is"

He replied...... "Maybe"

A day later, the military came to his village and were conscripting all young men in to military service - The farmers son was excused because he was injured.

The neighbors heard and said "Oh, how lucky this is"

He replied...... "Maybe"

So, as you can see - the moral of the story is simple - You have no idea what the Universe has in store for you, so you can't really define anything as good or bad.

Things happen - and you never really know that something that seems at the time to be bad, won't turn out to be the exact thing you needed to open up an opportunity you never knew was coming.

Just keep positive, remember that opportunities are in abundance and the loss of a job often leads to brighter futures and the chance to ask yourself what you really want to do now that you can choose again.

Andy

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Steven Wagenheim

16 years ago

Originally Posted by Andyhenry

Here's a story I once heard that sums it up:

One day a farmers horse went crazy and bolted, knocking down his barn door and fence.

His neighbors gathered and said "oh, isn't this a terrible thing!"

He replied...... "Maybe"

The next day, his horse returned, bringing with it 5 wild horses.

His neighbors all stopped by and proclaimed "My, how lucky this is"

He replied...... "Maybe"

A few days later, while trying to break-in one of the wild horses his son was kicked and broke his leg.

The neighbors gathered.... "Oh no, how unfortunate this is"

He replied...... "Maybe"

A day later, the military came to his village and were conscripting all young men in to military service - The farmers son was excused because he was injured.

The neighbors heard and said "Oh, how lucky this is"

He replied...... "Maybe"

So, as you can see - the moral of the story is simple - You have no idea what the Universe has in store for you, so you can't really define anything as good or bad.

Things happen - and you never really know that something that seems at the time to be bad, won't turn out to be the exact thing you needed to open up an opportunity you never knew was coming.

Just keep positive, remember that opportunities are in abundance and the loss of a job often leads to brighter futures and the chance to ask yourself what you really want to do now that you can choose again.

Andy

Andy, this is so true about my very own life. I won't bore you all with
the details, but the worst thing that ever happened to me (at the time)
turned out to be the best.

I had a job that I really LOVED. I was the QA manager and also did lots
of programming. I couldn't wait to go to work.

Well, I lost that job because of downsizing.

I was devastated.

Had I not lost it, I would have never gotten into IM and having the even
better life that I have now.

You really DON'T know if something is good or bad until you've played it
all out.

This great life I have now????

Who knows?

Maybe down the road IT may turn out to be my WORST thing.

You just don't know.

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jacktackett

16 years ago

Its something I try to teach my children - different isn't bad - its, well, different. Just because you like to do something doesn't make it the right way for everybody else. Also just because you don't like to do it doesn't make it wrong for anyone else.

Now I am an entrepreneur so instead of driving backhoes I will let slip to my 8 yr old to think about owning the backhoe and letting others drive it.

His response?

But where's the fun in that daddy?

Indeed - glad I have someone to remind me of that every once in a while.

And glad you're around Andy to remind all of us!

Great post.
thanks,
--Jack

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smisen

16 years ago

Thank you so much for posting this! I still have a full-time job, even though I make more than enough online that I could quit if I wanted to. I'm a marketing representative for a candy company, so every day, I get to go in and play on the company's website or make fun new publications or go to trade shows.

Plus, I've tried being online full-time before and it just doesn't work for me. At that point in my life (maybe things are different now - this was about 2 years ago), I didn't have the focus to be able to get the work done that I needed to without the structure of a job forcing me to prioritize. I'd wind up watching TV in my pajamas at 8:00pm wondering where the day went and why I hadn't accomplished anything.

That's not to say that I'll always keep a full-time job. I'm thinking about doing some traveling in the future that would require me to leave the position. And I'd love to get into more volunteer work and do that as my primary job throughout the day.

But I really don't ever see a point in my life when I'll be happy working just a few hours a day - it's just not who I am

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Kim Standerline

16 years ago

I think you summed up how I feel about my job much better than I did lol.

Another reason I don't want to give my job up (to be honest), is my pension. I'm 51 at the moment and as a nurse (working in management at the moment) I can retire at 55. (NHS pension plan is pretty decent).

My plan is to retire from what is a fairly high powered job when I'm 55, then go back to my roots on the wards for a few hours a week until I'm 60. (I hate being idle).

If I decide I don't want the hassle of ward work again, I'll definitely go down the volunteer route. The basic premise for me is that I get out of the house and interact with other people etc.

My choice is IM isn't something I want to need to depend on for a living. I've always looked upon it as a very lucrative hobby.

Kim

Originally Posted by smisen

Thank you so much for posting this! I still have a full-time job, even though I make more than enough online that I could quit if I wanted to. I'm a marketing representative for a candy company, so every day, I get to go in and play on the company's website or make fun new publications or go to trade shows.

Plus, I've tried being online full-time before and it just doesn't work for me. At that point in my life (maybe things are different now - this was about 2 years ago), I didn't have the focus to be able to get the work done that I needed to without the structure of a job forcing me to prioritize. I'd wind up watching TV in my pajamas at 8:00pm wondering where the day went and why I hadn't accomplished anything.

That's not to say that I'll always keep a full-time job. I'm thinking about doing some traveling in the future that would require me to leave the position. And I'd love to get into more volunteer work and do that as my primary job throughout the day.

But I really don't ever see a point in my life when I'll be happy working just a few hours a day - it's just not who I am

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MichaelHiles

16 years ago

A lot of internet marketers would view what I do in the offline arena as "having a job".

Sure, I am busy a lot of the time.

Who cares. I enjoy what I do. I get paid extremely well for it. I like to interact with people and most of all... I realize that the work I do is meaningful far beyond the money I am paid. I help businesses improve, in many cases... even stay in business. I help put food on the table for the owner's family, the employee's family, etc...

My work has intrinsic meaning beyond "autopilot profits". I have a purpose in life far greater than sitting around the house in my boxer shorts, running to the PC every couple of hours to answer support emails and check to see if someone bought my ebook.

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elaine drennan

16 years ago

Hi Andy,

I have enjoyed reading this thread.

I think the reason some people feel that you have not "made it" unless you are completely surviving on a residual income is because they were TOLD in all those sales letters that success is: earning millions - while you sleep - with absolutely no effort required.

The happiest Internet Marketers are those who accept that this is simply not the case. We understand that there IS work involved but it's not a PROBLEM to us to work - at least a few hours every day - because we love what we do.

Elaine

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Pat Ordenes

16 years ago

Cheers Andy,
This really resonates for me...
I recently quit my design job, to pursue my 'design-job' online...
people have questioned the decision, simply because it just seems that I've swaping mediums. This is not the case. I get way more freedom and flexibility online, AND the clients I have online are SO much better to work with, appreciate what I do for them and their business, and most of the time, I learn something from them...
Nothing wrong with having job at all... I guess the word gets a has reputation.

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carolvally

16 years ago

This thread reminds me of a story I heard:-

The American businessman was at the pier of a small coastal Mexican village when a small boat with just one fisherman docked. Inside the small boat were several large yellowfin tuna. The American complimented the Mexican on the quality of his fish and asked how long it took to catch them. The Mexican replied "Only a little while."

The American then asked why didn't he stay out longer and catch more fish? The Mexican said he had enough to support his family's immediate needs. The American then asked, "but what do you do with the rest of your time?" The Mexican fisherman said, "I sleep late, fish a little, play with my children, take siesta with my wife, Maria, stroll into the village each evening where I sip wine and play guitar with my amigos, I have a full and busy life, senor."

The American scoffed, "I am a Harvard MBA and could help you. You should spend more time fishing and with the proceeds buy a bigger boat, with the proceeds from the bigger boat you could buy several boats, eventually you would have a fleet of fishing boats. Instead of selling your catch to a middleman you would sell directly to the processor, eventually opening your own cannery. You would control the product, processing and distribution. You would need to leave this small coastal fishing village and move to Mexico City, then LA and eventually NYC where you will run your expanding enterprise."

The Mexican fisherman asked, "But senor, how long will this all take?" To which the American replied, "15-20 years." "But what then, senor?" The American laughed and said "That's the best part. When the time is right you would announce an IPO and sell your company stock to the public and become very rich, you would make millions."

"Millions, senor? Then what?" The American said, "Then you would retire. Move to a small coastal fishing village where you would sleep late, fish a little, play with your kids, take siesta with your wife, stroll to the village in the evenings where you could sip wine and play your guitar with your amigos."

Go with what works for you!

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Steven Wagenheim

16 years ago

Originally Posted by carolvally

This thread reminds me of a story I heard:-

The American businessman was at the pier of a small coastal Mexican village when a small boat with just one fisherman docked. Inside the small boat were several large yellowfin tuna. The American complimented the Mexican on the quality of his fish and asked how long it took to catch them. The Mexican replied "Only a little while."

The American then asked why didn't he stay out longer and catch more fish? The Mexican said he had enough to support his family's immediate needs. The American then asked, "but what do you do with the rest of your time?" The Mexican fisherman said, "I sleep late, fish a little, play with my children, take siesta with my wife, Maria, stroll into the village each evening where I sip wine and play guitar with my amigos, I have a full and busy life, senor."

The American scoffed, "I am a Harvard MBA and could help you. You should spend more time fishing and with the proceeds buy a bigger boat, with the proceeds from the bigger boat you could buy several boats, eventually you would have a fleet of fishing boats. Instead of selling your catch to a middleman you would sell directly to the processor, eventually opening your own cannery. You would control the product, processing and distribution. You would need to leave this small coastal fishing village and move to Mexico City, then LA and eventually NYC where you will run your expanding enterprise."

The Mexican fisherman asked, "But senor, how long will this all take?" To which the American replied, "15-20 years." "But what then, senor?" The American laughed and said "That's the best part. When the time is right you would announce an IPO and sell your company stock to the public and become very rich, you would make millions."

"Millions, senor? Then what?" The American said, "Then you would retire. Move to a small coastal fishing village where you would sleep late, fish a little, play with your kids, take siesta with your wife, stroll to the village in the evenings where you could sip wine and play your guitar with your amigos."

Go with what works for you!

Carol, I hope everybody reads this...brilliant and so funny.

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FredJones

16 years ago

Originally Posted by carolvally

This thread reminds me of a story I heard:-

The American businessman was at the pier of a small coastal Mexican village when a small boat with just one fisherman docked. Inside the small boat were several large yellowfin tuna. The American complimented the Mexican on the quality of his fish and asked how long it took to catch them. The Mexican replied "Only a little while."

The American then asked why didn't he stay out longer and catch more fish? The Mexican said he had enough to support his family's immediate needs. The American then asked, "but what do you do with the rest of your time?" The Mexican fisherman said, "I sleep late, fish a little, play with my children, take siesta with my wife, Maria, stroll into the village each evening where I sip wine and play guitar with my amigos, I have a full and busy life, senor."

The American scoffed, "I am a Harvard MBA and could help you. You should spend more time fishing and with the proceeds buy a bigger boat, with the proceeds from the bigger boat you could buy several boats, eventually you would have a fleet of fishing boats. Instead of selling your catch to a middleman you would sell directly to the processor, eventually opening your own cannery. You would control the product, processing and distribution. You would need to leave this small coastal fishing village and move to Mexico City, then LA and eventually NYC where you will run your expanding enterprise."

The Mexican fisherman asked, "But senor, how long will this all take?" To which the American replied, "15-20 years." "But what then, senor?" The American laughed and said "That's the best part. When the time is right you would announce an IPO and sell your company stock to the public and become very rich, you would make millions."

"Millions, senor? Then what?" The American said, "Then you would retire. Move to a small coastal fishing village where you would sleep late, fish a little, play with your kids, take siesta with your wife, stroll to the village in the evenings where you could sip wine and play your guitar with your amigos."

Go with what works for you!

Love the story - I only wish I never end up wasting those 15-20 years. After 2-3 years more I shall nkow, and then decide whether to retire from job, or from IM, or from both

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DavidO

16 years ago

You've hit on something really important here... there's an underlying attitude with marketers and entrepreneurs of all types: It says that anyone who has to have a "job", work for someone else, is a loser.

I know, nobody says that but that's the implication. I've done both and I can tell you there's nothing superior about having your own business. It suits some temperaments better but that's all.

Having a good job and being successful at it has its own equal benefits.

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Buildingfutures

16 years ago

Fantastic post Andy, and I must say, I agree.

In my life, I've wanted nothing more than to do the job that I love, and to possibly have a very nice lifestyle to go with it.

My chosen profession does not pay more than 70k a year, with its median or average job pay being about 45-55k a year.

I want to be a 3-D animator for a gaming company, and I'm already on my way to learning how to do exactly that. I'm in college to learn the program, I'm self-teaching myself another program, and I plan on having a badass demo reel by mid-December.

But even still, I want to have extra money coming in from somewhere, that way I can have something to fall back on, or treat myself and my girl when I want to, and not have to worry about if I'll be able to afford groceries or the car payment, or rent, or whatever!

I admit, I haven't created that income yet, but dammit I'm working on it!

A job is nothing to be ashamed of. I wouldn't know what to do with myself if I didn't have a job or something to occupy the majority of my day. I get too bored too easily.

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MattSanti

16 years ago

This question is open up to all warriors, but what do you feel was/is your largest stumbling block to succeeding in regards to your business?

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Andyhenry

16 years ago

I like that story too - I saw it used on an advertising campaign on TV once too.

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JonMills

16 years ago

Well Said Andy

If a person loves what they do.. more power to them

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John Romaine

16 years ago

You gotta do what you love - bottom line.

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bobsstuff

16 years ago

I think part of having a J-O-B is your personal interpretation
of the words "job" and "work". Are they positive or negative.

You go to a job to work, but you may work at many things that
are not a job. A job implies being paid by someone else to do
their work. Work on the other hand can be any project you
undertake. If I "work" in my garden or work on restoring a
treasured antique, it is not a job, but it is definitely work.

Many people go to their job. The lucky ones go to work. I think
IM can either be a job or work. It is a job to those who are a
slave to it and work to those who love what the are doing (like
Steven).

I believe having a job as a means to an end is important to most
people, but moving on to work you enjoy is the direction to aim
for.

Of course, I'm just playing with words and the next thread could
be "WORK is a four letter word" and you need to change your
attitude to play and if your work is play you'll never have to
work another day in your life.

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Bob Hale

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Steven Wagenheim

16 years ago

Originally Posted by bobsstuff

I think part of having a J-O-B is your personal interpretation
of the words "job" and "work". Are they positive or negative.

You go to a job to work, but you may work at many things that
are not a job. A job implies being paid by someone else to do
their work. Work on the other hand can be any project you
undertake. If I "work" in my garden or work on restoring a
treasured antique, it is not a job, but it is definitely work.

Many people go to their job. The lucky ones go to work. I think
IM can either be a job or work. It is a job to those who are a
slave to it and work to those who love what the are doing (like
Steven).

I believe having a job as a means to an end is important to most
people, but moving on to work you enjoy is the direction to aim
for.

Of course, I'm just playing with words and the next thread could
be "WORK is a four letter word" and you need to change your
attitude to play and if your work is play you'll never have to
work another day in your life.

Bob, beautifully said.

I'm just going to add this and then I'm going to hibernate in my recording
studio and crank out another tune.

I'm going to do what I want with my life and the hell with what anybody
thinks about it.

How's that for defiining your "work" and "play"?

I'm outta here.

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Clyde Dennis

16 years ago

This is closely related to my theory that there are two types of people:
Those who live inside out, and those who live outside in.

Those in the inside out camp tend to 'focus' on figuring out what activities provide the 'Juice' they need to feel the way they want to feel. Then regardless of conventional wisdom and/or prevailing public opinion, they arrange their lives so that they are able to do those activities as often and as much as they can.

Those in the outside in camp tend to drift a bit. Changing their goals on a nearly daily basis, depending largely on what outside entity suggests they ought to. Giving almost no consideration to the idea that their life can and is 'EXACTLY' the way they've chosen for it to be.

Not saying either way is better or worse than the other. I just know which way works for me.

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Jon Tees

16 years ago

Alot of people just need that social interaction that only comes from going to a physical work place. There's nothing wrong with it. Many people are outgoing and social they are basically "people, people." so find exclusively working from home especially when they are working alone isolating. A steady paycheck is also a plus, as many times its a crap shoot (for most people) as to whether or not they're going to make enough money to cover all of their expenses especially when they depend on commissions. The only thing is people may be weary of you if you are mentoring them as they may associate having a full/part time job in addition to running an internet business as a sign of you being unsuccessful. They may question how and what you are going to teach them about making money from home, when you yourself still have a day job.

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Sophist 16 years ago

Well put and I have to agree. It's all an individual thing. Not everybody is meant to work from home. Not everybody is meant to work 2 seconds a day. Not everybody is meant to sit in a beach chair day in and day out in Tahiti checking emails while sipping mai tais.

Some people like working on cars and love getting up to go work at the autoshop. Some people love engineering and look forward to going to work everyday for their company. Some people are just alright with what they do, but their company is amazing, and so they love going to work. Im a consultant by day and when I get into those stints where I have to live out of a hotel for the next month I could just die. But when I get back to NYC I absolutely love going into work. Im a social person so I get cabin fever when Ive been away or inside for too long....especially in nyc where there's so much to do and the guy in the cubicle next to you is your co-worker by day but a huge club promoter at night. Or the secretary is also a junior committee member for the Met and always has invites for you. Working at home....or remotely should I say is great....but you gain a lot from social interaction.

So I say all that to say, be an individual and do what works best for you. Not everybody wants to own the company and work from home and vice versa. Just do you.

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MichaelHiles

16 years ago

I think most of the studies done show that people live longer if they have a daily purpose, meaningful work, and routine.

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pwnzor

16 years ago

I agree completely... if you can maintain yourself by writing articles every then grats.

If you maintain yourself with residual income then grats..

Who cares either way your successful, if you like what you do then do it. Who cares what others think.

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Raydal

16 years ago

Originally Posted by Andyhenry

Ok,

So this is sort of a rant but more of a comment to people who get into arguments from various angles of this subject.

The basic discussions seem to go along the lines of "xxxx writes content for people and makes good money", "but writing for other people is the same as having a job", "yes - but he works from home and makes all of his money from work which comes from online" - "yes, but if it's not residual - it's no different to having a job".

The implication is usually that if you're making your money online, but you need to keep working to keep the money coming in - you're not as successful as you think, and you've basically still got a job and are kidding yourself that you haven't.

There's something very important missing from this argument.......

Personal beliefs, values and goals.

If I am a writer and I love writing and want nothing more than to spend all of my time writing - perhaps the situation above is my dream.

Many peoples egos get involved when it comes to stating or justifying their situation/aspirations or actions.

The simple reality is - No-one has the right to judge you for your choices.

If you want to spend your time earning a living online doing what you love - who can tell you that you're a failure?

Anyone who thinks they can is really just telling you about themselves.

Andy

Hi Andy,

You covered a lot of separate issues in this post, hence a "rant" I guess.

1. The issue of the definition of a job as earning money by having to
continually work is implied in your discussion. Whatever you may love to
do, I'm sure anyone would prefer "money coming in even after you can't
do the thing you love to do anymore" as being an ideal situation.

2. Then there is the issue of judging what other people do. Well, for sure
to each his own. Personally I don't strive to be rich even though I
have helped a couple people get rich.

3. I think entrepreneurs still revel in not having to work for anyone
and living life on their terms as most people here aspire to be. This
is the reason why this "not having a job" will always appeal to this group.

For sure most people find working for themselves a lot tougher than
it's made out to be. It takes a lot of discipline, hard work and
commitment, but you'll seldom hear this advertised.

However you may define it, I would want to know that if I'm
disabled that my family can still go on living on the work
I've already done.

-Ray Edwards

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DAS_Matt

16 years ago

If you're happy with what you are doing who gives a flip what others think. Many people don't want the hassle that goes with running their own business entirely. Running your own business can be a VERY LARGE pain in the neck. Some people don't want that. I can understand that.

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