OK, PayPal does NOT suck... here's why...

19 replies
OK Guys,

Recently, I've read a couple threads; (old and new); that have painted PayPal as being unscrupulous and/or bad for business.

I've been with them primarily for the past 10yrs with all of ONE problem with 'my' account and I've done nothing but IM related stuff. Yet, as a part of business maintenance, one should always do due diligence with all of their business partners on a regular basis.

So, I just got off the phone with them and figured I'd report back my experience. There was some useful information given that I figured I'd share with my fellow Warriors.

OK, so I called the number on the back of my debit card; had an initial "grrr" moment when the automated system wouldn't recognize my keypad signal, (that may have had something to do with it being VOIP -- not sure), but when I decided to use my voice the system understood me.

They asked for verification of my SSN; which in my case of having a business account would be my EIN, (take note here.. NEVER [as much as possible] do business with your SSN). I did that and since this is a unique number, the system was immediately able to pull up my account.

The automated system then gives you a series of (limited) choices; which was another "grrrr" moment, but this is the same with most all automated telephony systems. So, from my experience with them; (which is once you get to the "main menu" section 9x out of 10, pressing 0 [that's zero] will flag the automated system to transfer you to a live rep); I pressed 0 and was politely given the "one moment while I transfer you" message.

The rep was nice. BJ was his name; yeah right. But, this is understandable; them not giving out real names... so no "grrr" moment.

I told BJ, "Yeah, I'm under the impression that I have the option of being assigned an account rep. I'd like to exercise this option, please."

BJ: (clearing his throat nervously cautious) "Well, there is certain criteria that is involved with having a personal account representative assigned to you. Right now, your account is flagged for my department."

me: "hmm.. So, what is that criteria?"

BJ: (again clearing his throat nervously) "Well, you'd need to be doing a volume of about $100K per month in order to have this feature enabled."

I guess he was anticipating me being offended or something. I kinna knew this would be the deal, but just wanted the info straight from the horse's mouth.

BJ: (continuing) ".. why do you ask?"

me: (explaining) "Well, I'm about to have a fluctuation in the amount of transactions I'm doing; which will change over time; due to a business venture I'm about to be involved in."

I was purposely ambiguous to see his reaction and naturally I could hear the caution level raise in his voice, (again - take note here.. NEVER be ambiguous about what you're doing IF you don't want to make them paranoid).

So, in order to calm BJ down, I then gave more detailed information. He calmed down.

me: ".. so with that I just wanted to make sure everything was on the up and up with you guys."

(communication skill here I was taught... notice how I DID NOT say, ".. up and up with you guys so you don't think I'm doing anything wrong"... once you plant that negative vibe in someone's head, its associated with you by YOUR association. From that point, no matter WHAT you do that negative vibe will be associated with you in the back of their mind. If you negate it from YOUR speech and allow them to come to such a conclusion on their own, they'll justify it as paranoia more reliably and quickly based on your actions, from that point forward).

So, I then asked BJ to tell me what I could do to make sure my business ran smoothly. Here's where some 'very' useful information was divulged.

BJ: "Well, there's no actual set amount that would trigger our risk department to look into your account. Its kind of a case by case basis. Its called explosive growth and this is what will raise a flag. This may cause them to want to contact you for more information and they'd basically ask you about what you just explained to me, here today. So, what I can do is put a notation on your account..."

You have to take into account that these reps are trained on a regular basis on WHAT TO SAY. Based on the "time of day" that you call, you'll get a different "caliber" of rep.

I purposely called at 1pm PST because, from my corporate experience, this is the best time to call. This is when everyone has already finished the morning rush; they've gone out and more than likely had lunch; maybe even a shot to get them through the rest of the day; and the more laid back and "nice" people (who work jobs like phone reps) are the ones that take on this shift. So, your chances of having a positive (and highly informative) experience is exponentially compounded.

I then asked BJ if there was anything else that he could tell me; as I'm trying to be proactive and blah blah make myself look more positive and legit calm them down make them look the other way "oh he's cool" line of talking...

He asked me if I wanted to have him ask his Supervisor if there was anything he was missing. Again, this is internal code; see, all these calls are already monitored and recorded from the time you say "hello". The Supervisors are right there on the floor in eye shot of the reps and a hand motion about 5mins. ago already had the Supervisor paying attention to BJ's current call. My account was already up on the Supervisor's screen and he was going through it.

So, of course I said "SURE, please do."

If I had fallen into the trap of either trying to prove nice and appreciative about BJ giving me the information and it being enough 'cause I don't wanna offend BJ... OR said something like "oh, there's no need. You've given me enough information"... then that Supervisor would have placed his/her own notation on my account ... some internal jargon about "keep an eye on this dude".

Call me paranoid if you want; but I worked in high end call centers like this before and you might be surprised about the level of psychological analysis that's done based on how people respond to certain things.

And as I anticipated, BJ was pleased that I chose to have him talk to his Supervisor. And as I anticipated, they were going through my account history to further profile me and my risk level; they had me on hold for more than 5min.

OK, so this is getting rather long ... bottom line is, BJ came back with no new information, (because it wasn't about trying to get new information -- it was about profiling me and my account)... and told me that a notation had been put on my account and..

.. to make sure my phone numbers were up to date; as we basically call ALL phone numbers listed on the account if we need to contact you.

And there you have it. PayPal is highly professional and doing exactly what they should be doing, IMHO. With the level of volume they do each day; I would WANT them to be hard a**es when it came to who they did business with. I WANT them to be "overly security conscious"; because I don't want any 'outside' ninny influencing my business heartbeat -- my money.

Full disclosure and age old tried and proven business practices are the keys here, people. Follow that model in your business and you'll have NO problems with the likes of the PayPals out there; I know I never have.

Just found this link on the PayPal site; should prove extremely useful...

Hope this helps...
Peace, Love & Prosperity
  • I also called paypal ahead of my first products going live. After the long wait to talk to some one, a rep came on and I let her know that I was about to start having a higher influx of money going into the account.

    We talked for a while, and I let her know of my reservations dealing with paypal and their ability to limit or suspend an account. She told me that I had done a good thing by calling, and that she was putting a note on my account that she had spoke to me. She also told me she would call me before limiting my account.

    I have had a lot of transactions, but never had a problem.
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    • Profile picture of the author Jill Carpenter
      I've never had issues, but like all other things it's not good to have all your eggs in one basket.

      I'm planning to figure out additional payment options should there ever be an issue where I can't just use paypal.

      "May I have ten thousand marbles, please?"

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      • Profile picture of the author tecHead
        Originally Posted by avenuegirl View Post

        I've never had issues, but like all other things it's not good to have all your eggs in one basket.

        I'm planning to figure out additional payment options should there ever be an issue where I can't just use paypal.
        I get the whole "all eggs in one basket" concern some people have; this is why I use more than one bank. Yet, all of the other alternatives out here are more expensive than PayPal; which is why I've stuck with them.

        Shoot, I used to SELL merchant accounts and the whole "..we charge you even when you're not making transactions.." just didn't/doesn't fit with my bottom line. Not to mention having to worry about PCI compliance; and that's about to hit a lotta people over the head really hard, too.

        I have issues with paying out over 7% of my hard earned money. Rolling reserves just make absolutely no sense to me. Amex charging 3.5% is a kick in the teeth. Credit checks to determine your level of risk PLUS Internet commerce, (card not present), transactions are still considered high risk. Processing banks snatching your funds as they see fit; with little to no vendor protection from fraud. International AVS is more of a pain in the a** than not.

        OK, I'll shut up now.
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      • Profile picture of the author achivement84
        Originally Posted by avenuegirl View Post

        I've never had issues, but like all other things it's not good to have all your eggs in one basket.

        I'm planning to figure out additional payment options should there ever be an issue where I can't just use paypal.
        I agree that , but also i never got any problem from dealinng with paypal.

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  • Profile picture of the author Noah Fleming
    Nice post. Great solid information. I've used PP for about 4-5 years now without issue.
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  • Profile picture of the author Quentin
    Excellent post and I did some investigations a while ago for people having problems with their paypal accounts.

    In all cases it was because they had disregarded many of the things you have noted.

    1. Used the wrong account type. If your in business should be using business or premium.
    2. Using business language etc when contacting them. Yelling and screaming will never get you anywhere
    3. Keeping your contact info up to date. This was a major error by most of them.

    Excellent post.

    I have been with them for 10 years also and had a few bumps along the way but simply dealt with them like any other business problem and got them solved in a timely manner.

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    • Profile picture of the author Kay King
      and the more laid back and "nice" people (who work jobs like phone reps) are the ones that take on this shift
      That's because most people WANT the day shift - and it goes to those with the most seniority in most companies. For businesses that run 24 hrs/day, the day shift workers are likely to be more experienced.

      Good post!

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      • Profile picture of the author Kevin Riley
        I just had somebody run over $900 in orders on my PayPal late yesterday. It got flagged as a possible unauthorized use. Trying to resolve it, I ran into a snag due to a missing address.

        Called up PayPal in Tokyo this morning. Nice lady took care of me. All it ever takes is communication.
        Kevin Riley, long-time Warrior living in Osaka, Japan

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  • Profile picture of the author tecHead
    How to setup your PayPal Account properly
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  • Profile picture of the author Charann Miller
    I've found PayPal to be very responsive and helpful, they stay on the phone until my issue is resolved so I've been happy to give great feedback regarding their services.

    I you ever have any questions or concerns regarding your PayPal account, just call them, it beats waiting days to hear from them via email.
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  • Profile picture of the author tecHead
    How PayPal works

    Question :
    How can account holders verify if their product is in compliance with the Acceptable Use Policy?

    Answer :
    Account holders with questions about the Acceptable Use Policy can send a description of their product or service and their business URL to aupviolations@paypal.com.

    Question :
    What does it mean if a seller or buyer is Verified or Unverified?

    Answer :
    Verification increases the security of our payment network for sellers and buyers. Verification gives PayPal additional evidence of a member's identity and lets others know that you have completed this process.

    Account holders become Verified when they complete our verification process. To become Verified, log in to your PayPal account, click the Unverified link, and follow the instructions.

    Question :
    How do I become Verified?

    Answer :
    To become Verified, you must:

    1. Confirm your email address.
    2. Add a credit or debit card to your account.
    3. Link and confirm your card.

    To become Verified, log in to your PayPal account, click the Unverified link, and follow the instructions.

    Note: Members in China also have the option to link and confirm a China bank account to become Verified.

    Just bringing the information to you
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    • Profile picture of the author Tina Golden
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      • Profile picture of the author wordwizard
        Thanks for the great info!

        I've been very happy with PayPal too. And I'ave also had very positive experiences when calling them with questions I had.

        Very friendly and professional. Love them. And yes, the other options are much more expensive and complicated.


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  • Profile picture of the author JD Nunes
    I once got a PayPal account suspended, but it was my own fault for doing multi-level marketing with it, which is against their terms of service. But the bad thing is, they consider resale rights to be multi-level marketing LOL, so better watch out. And yeah, they are pretty understanding when you're up-front with them. I told them I was going to have a product launch which may bring in lots of sales at once, and they told me not to worry and that my account will be fine.
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  • Profile picture of the author Karan Goel
    Well, my experience has also been good. When my $230 were struck, I just called them and within 26 hours, I got my money back.
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  • Profile picture of the author zapseo
    I wonder if paypal has written up a case study on having decent customer service.

    It seems to me that, for a while there, the people you talked to were not all that on the ball.

    And somewhere along the line, it changed. People can, and do, forget. I don't remember the bad interactions any more. They are gone from my memory. But I vaguely remember being unhappy with them at some point. Maybe it was hard-to-use voicemail; maybe it was "pablum" answers to my questions, answers without substance or nuance.

    Now they can pull up my account when I call. They walk me thru different things. They show me where to find different things in my account.

    I (knock on wood) have never had any significant problem with PayPal (that I can remember). And I can only give the highest praise for their customer support now.
    (I've had to call them a few things since they changed their interface. Some things are better -- some things are not. I dislike not having the running business totals on the right, based upon the transactions. I like to see specific detail. OTOH, seeing the 4 different "transactions" they make to pay my hosting account ... hiding that is great; having the little "+" marks so I can see all reactions wrt to a particular transaction -- awesome.)

    Live JoyFully!

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  • Profile picture of the author DAS_Matt
    Damn useful post and thread. People should pay attention here.
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  • Profile picture of the author Silas Hart
    I was so close to joining in on the large lawsuit against PayPal, that if my business were creating a stream of income of more than $10,000 a month online, which my business does Not currently do, then I would probably seek a more well organized and professional merchant/transaction service. I'm doing a couple grand a month on eBay and I feel like I'm walking on eggshells with PayPal-- and PayPal is owned by eBay. What got my money back was legal threats, not PayPal who was willing to give money back. Keep in mind, everything was done legitimate, and I was just selling items on eBay when someone decided to file a dispute against a $600 laptop. Provided everything requested, but PayPal still chose to reimburse the buyer and the money was removed not only from my PayPal account but from my bank account as well. Their only claim was "I didn't getit" Nothing else! I had shipping information with weight, they signed for the package, I was "protected" as a Seller. $600 was a lot for a kid paying his own way through college, but I'm not going bore anyone with a personal story. If you want to read some sick stories, check out PayPalSucks.com

    I encourage EVERYONE to use PayPal defensively and to always have a back up plan. I would in no way shape or form use PayPal if I was expecting several large transactions.

    Hopefully WF has no real affiliation to PayPal as I'm sure this would probably become my last post here.
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  • Profile picture of the author actionplanbiz
    What the hell. you are like some mastermind or something? you just went through that like a Mcgyver on a mission.

    interesting testimonial but still heard some bad ones
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