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Strategies to Populate a Directory Website. Where to begin?

by kenc138
26 replies
Hi everyone,

I am currently developing a directory website for a niche in desperate need of an aggregated data application. There are a few competitors, but the websites are low quality and in need of upgrades.

One thing I keep thinking about, though. How am I going to get this thing populated quickly and early? The more I think about it, people won't pay the monthly sub if the directory seems inactive.

I need some solid strategy ideas on how to get this thing populated quickly.

I was thinking of a data mining/data entry service to scrape the web and enter the info into the database. Email marketing campaign perhaps? Software? WSO?

Frankly, I'm not sure where to begin so I thought I'd reach out to WF. You guys are far more adept at this sort of thing than I.

Thanks,
Ken
#begin #directory #populate #strategies #website
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  • Profile picture of the author OptedIn
    You're right, no one will buy into an empty directory.

    My last local business directory was populated by buying a high-quality list of 14k businesses in my county and the four that surround it. A simple CSV upload produced an instant, up-to-date directory. These were 'Bronze" level basic listings that provided basic information.

    I then contacted the listed companies and attempted to upsell them to Silver, Gold or Platinum level listings, each one offering more options to better serve their needs. Additionally, I had special offers for a full range of ancillary services, if they did upgrade their listing

    This is just another example of the first rule of business needing to be applied, whether you think there is a free lunch, or not.

    "You have to spend money to make money." Of course, you want your cash outlay to be an investment and not just money spent.

    Good luck!
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    • Profile picture of the author kenc138
      This is great info. Guess the next step is to look for a qualified company to purchase a list from. Thanks for this.
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      • Profile picture of the author OptedIn
        Originally Posted by kenc138 View Post

        This is great info. Guess the next step is to look for a qualified company to purchase a list from. Thanks for this.
        There are many to choose from, but the quality ranges from excellent to putrid. lol Like everything else in life, you get what you pay for and if something seems to good to be true, well, it generally is.

        If you PM me, I will be happy to supply you with my list broker. I am not an affiliate and make nothing for the referral. I will warn you in advance, they are the most expensive company, but I have always been satisfied with the numerous number of lists I have bought from them, over the years. I have found over a long business career that if you just bite the bullet and make a good investment on your first purchase, usually a second source and a repurchase won't be required. I have never saved money when attempting to save money. In the end it will bite you in the ass and you will regret your decision to not do it right, the first time

        BTW - they are also very good at supplying opted-in email addresses to many of their list, too.

        Cheers.
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        "He not busy being born, is busy dying." - Bob Dylan • "I vibe with the light-dark point. Heavy." - Words that Bob Dylan wishes he had written.

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    • Profile picture of the author SuboxoneDoctor
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      • Profile picture of the author OptedIn
        Originally Posted by SuboxoneDoctor View Post

        @optedin When you contacted the list what was the best way to do so? Telephone to drive home the message and make sure they heard it (plus ancillary upsells)?

        Email to speed things up?

        Both, in any particular order ?
        Well, both are required and there are techniques for putting either method first. Personally, I love to call people, but at the same time I'm cold calling, realizing that I can only reach so many people in a day, I prime the pump by emailing and working to get them to call me. The order and ratio have more to do with your own personal skills and comfort level. One of the big problems in marketing and selling is trying to replicate what others have done. It's fine to use the same tools, but precisely how you use them, searching for that model which will work best for you, is what will bring you more success.

        Any advice for phone campaigns for directories?
        This ain't rocket science. I write all of my own scripts for any particular project, but they are written more along the lines of an introduction. While selling is the ultimate goal, I never make that the purpose of my call.

        I generally just introduce myself, acknowledge the fact that they're busy running their business and that I'm not calling to sell them anything. I quickly explain that we have placed their business in the directory at no cost to them, but that it is in everyone's best interest that the information be correct. I ask for their email so that I can send them a link to their listing, along with a user ID and password. I tell them to review the listing and with their credentials they can log in and make any chances required. I also tell them that it's fine to call me and I'll do it for them.

        At this stage the selling comes more into play. Either they will ask me why the info is so limited and how can they get more info about their company into their listing - or - I will ask them if it would be to their benefit to have a particular type of info added, based on the type of business and then present the options available to them.

        Keep in mind. This money is just to cover your time for the call. An up-sell is only going to be $29.95 to $99.95 per year. No one is getting rich selling directory listings. The magic lies in the fact that you are building that one-on-one relationship. At this point, I'm still not going to go out of my way to attempt to sell them anything beyond a higher level listing, unless they decide not to purchase a paid listing, at all.

        If they purchase a paid listing, I again instruct them to add the additional info and to call if they need help with anything. I'll check on their progress in a few days to see how they made out. If things look good, I'll call with a "nicely done." If things are incomplete, I ask if I can be of service. It's in the point of contact that I will look for their pain points in any aspect of marketing their business that might offer potential for me to get additional work. If they mention a few things, I might offer to help them with the smallest problem, first, bang that out and go back for more. If they are desperate for serious help, I'll jump right in and offer my services to make their boo-boo all better.

        I always approach selling as a long-term process. I have been much happier having a limited number of clients that depended on me for most of what they needed, as opposed to many little jobs where I had to deal with many more people. While I can fake it, very well I might add, I don't play well with others and have a low threshold for aggravation from clients. So - I nurture those with the greatest opportunity for me that I feel I can mold into clients that produce as few problems as possible. That's referred to as 'sanity preservation.'

        Seriously, my way may not work for you at all, but it's not hard to develop your own technique to success. It's NOT about the directory. It's about the relationships you establish by 'doing' a directory and the potential income derived from the ancillary services you choose to offer, although you still want to strive to produce an attractive, reliable source of information.

        BTW - while you won't make a ton of money on listings, every time an automatic renewal payment winds up in your PayPal from work you did a year ago, that usually will bring a smile to your face.

        One last thing. After every successful job you complete, ALWAYS as for 3 referrals. Put your clients to work for you. It makes building a business that much easier.

        Sorry if I missed any points. I haven't had my morning coffee, yet. Based on that shortcoming, I think I did OK. lol

        Always happy to try and answer specific questions.

        Cheers.
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        "He not busy being born, is busy dying." - Bob Dylan • "I vibe with the light-dark point. Heavy." - Words that Bob Dylan wishes he had written.

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        • Profile picture of the author regibiz65
          WOW! Thanks for this information OptedIn. Seems like you have mastered selling to Local businesses. I haven't been at WF in quite a while because I've been busy working on my directory site. (www.exposeyourbusinessonline.com) Now that I'm almost done, I knew WF will be the best place to get information on how to start promoting and monetizing it and you guys didn't disappoint.

          By the way, do you mind if I PM you reqesting the company you buy your "List" from?

          Very good info. Thanks again.
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          Small Business Directory - Serving NJ, NY & PA
          http://www.exposeyourbusinessonline.com

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  • Profile picture of the author Steve B
    Originally Posted by kenc138 View Post

    How am I going to get this thing populated quickly and early?

    Ken,

    One of the standard questions for any business or marketing plan, in advance of going to the trouble of creating a site, is how am I going to get traffic to my site? It's a question that needs serious thought and consideration prior to any other action taken.

    That question will lead you to do marketing research to find out about your prospects and potential customers. Who are they, what do they want, what problems are they seeking solutions for, what will they buy, who are the competitors in the niche, and how am I going to find them online? Until you know (through research) the answers to these questions, you don't really know that you have a viable business model in a money niche.


    Originally Posted by kenc138 View Post

    I was thinking of a data mining/data entry service to scrape the web and enter the info into the database.
    Scrape the web? So you're going to add businesses to your directory without their knowledge or opt-in? If that's the plan, I would suggest you prepare for a lot of very upset business owners, web site owners, and even trademark issues that could present a host of legal issues for you.

    Permission in advance for the use of someone's name, business, and other contact information to be placed on your site is always advised.

    Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author OptedIn
      Originally Posted by Steve B View Post


      One of the standard questions for any business or marketing plan, in advance of going to the trouble of creating a site, is how am I going to get traffic to my site? It's a question that needs serious thought and consideration prior to any other action taken.
      I can't agree with this, based on personal experience. Not in relation to running an online business directory. Your points are certainly valid for creating a site where you are actually attempting to sell something beyond the business listing, but to sell listings, alone - nothing wrong with getting it up and moving on from there.

      That question will lead you to do marketing research to find out about your prospects and potential customers. Who are they, what do they want, what problems are they seeking solutions for, what will they buy, who are the competitors in the niche, and how am I going to find them online? Until you know (through research) the answers to these questions, you don't really know that you have a viable business model in a money niche.
      Again, these questions simply don't apply to this business model.

      Scrape the web?
      Highly inefficient and not so easy to do these days. Many sites now detect scraping and will kick you within minutes of you starting to scrape.

      So you're going to add businesses to your directory without their knowledge or opt-in? If that's the plan, I would suggest you prepare for a lot of very upset business owners, web site owners, and even trademark issues that could present a host of legal issues for you.
      That's just ridiculous Steve. I have run over a dozen directories over the years with the addition of hundreds of thousands of businesses, without permission of any of them. You're basically talking about an online phone book. No one has ever contacted me and complained that they were given a free listing in my directory. Actually, many, upon discovering their inclusion have written to say thanks for the free listing. Who doesn't like free advertising?

      Additionally, putting a name, address and phone number of any business that can be obtained in numerous ways in an online directory will never encounter trademark issues or legal issues of any kind. This is considered 'public information.' Should someone discover that they are in your directory and choose not to be, they will write and ask that you remove them. I have never had this happen, once. Ever!

      Permission in advance for the use of someone's name, business, and other contact information to be placed on your site is always advised. Steve
      Possibly - but entirely unnecessary for this business model.

      Cheers.
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      • Profile picture of the author kenc138
        OptedIn,

        I went ahead and contacted infoUSA, and they sent a data sample that looks very good. I'll probably move forward with them.

        Can you recommend what to do as far as getting pictures on the site?

        It would look odd having a page of great listings with a bunch of empty avatars/profile images. I appreciate your help with this.
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        • Profile picture of the author OptedIn
          Originally Posted by kenc138 View Post

          OptedIn, I went ahead and contacted infoUSA, and they sent a data sample that looks very good. I'll probably move forward with them.
          That was the company I was going to recommend. I think you will find them quite reliable.

          Can you recommend what to do as far as getting pictures on the site?

          It would look odd having a page of great listings with a bunch of empty avatars/profile images. I appreciate your help with this.
          You are probably going to have to start out with something generic. I guess there are a lot of things you could consider using, but don't know how satisfactory you will find any of them.

          Additionally, it depends on the platform you are using to build your directory on as to what options are available to you, especially in a bulk upload scenario.
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          • Profile picture of the author kenc138
            Roger that. I'll keep looking around. There's an answer out there somewhere. If I find a good solution, I'll keep you posted in case you could use it in one of your future projects.

            Thanks again!
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            • Profile picture of the author OptedIn
              Originally Posted by kenc138 View Post

              Roger that. I'll keep looking around. There's an answer out there somewhere. If I find a good solution, I'll keep you posted in case you could use it in one of your future projects.

              Thanks again!
              I appreciate that, but I'm formally retired, except for involvement in charitable interests. The only project I foresee on the horizon is the big, dirt nap. :-)

              Do post it here, though. I could be of use to a future visitor.
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      • Profile picture of the author Steve B
        Originally Posted by OptedIn View Post

        I can't agree with this, based on personal experience . . . these questions simply don't apply to this business model.

        OptedIn,

        It's fine to disagree, I have no problem with that, it's what forum discussions are all about and sometimes opinions differ sharply.

        I have owned and operated two business directories ... not as many as you ... but enough to give me some first-hand experience with this business model.

        We're talking about a specific niche directory here as Ken stated - not a general directory that any and everyone might have an interest in. My personal belief is that a business and marketing plan is appropriate for any niche business, even a directory. Why? Because directories sell listings when they get niche traffic. Targeted traffic enables the directory to attract advertisers and an audience that has an interest in that niche.

        Niche directories are no different, IMO, than any other targeted business site in that regard - they need and want traffic that is interested in what they offer. I believe market research helps the owner to understand the niche, the audience in the niche, and what they want.

        I also stand my ground on seeking permission first for listings. If the owner of the directory decides to do any kind of mailing or marketing to those he has listed in the directory (which is typically done to get participants to upgrade to a paid service) contacting these people in a marketing capacity is no different than sending emails to people that have not opted in to an email list, as far as I am concerned (especially given the fact that the contact info was scraped from the web.)

        Am I being too careful about this? Maybe - I know others do it all the time. But IMO, that doesn't make the practice right. I suggest getting an opt-in is the way to keep out of complaints and possible legal problems.

        This advice, just as the other posts I make in this forum, is my opinion based on my own experience and yours will no doubt differ.

        Steve
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        • Profile picture of the author OptedIn
          Originally Posted by Steve B View Post

          This advice, just as the other posts I make in this forum, is my opinion based on my own experience and yours will no doubt differ.
          Yes, it does and yes, I am not one to be slow, deliberate or overly-cautious. That's just not my style. That said, I'm not foolhardy, either and had I ever had one incident that you think could cause problems, I would have mentioned in the interest of caution being offered to a beginner.

          Additionally, many of my directories were niche specific including a US caterer directory with over 50,000 listings and a national tropical fish store directory with over 22,000 listings. I've tried many types. Some crashed and burned, some I sold for a handsome sum and a few are still out there floating in cyberspace. One thing I've learned. Local is better, although nowhere near as ambitious in scope or challenge. In my heyday, I was only interested in the challenges that seemed to be the most insurmountable. "Damn the torpedoes, full speed, ahead!" The last thing I would want to be remembered as would be a piker.

          Never had a bad moment. Blew a ton of money, but still enjoyed the ride and learned things that I used 'til my last day of working.

          Cheers.
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          "He not busy being born, is busy dying." - Bob Dylan • "I vibe with the light-dark point. Heavy." - Words that Bob Dylan wishes he had written.

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      • Profile picture of the author regibiz65
        I was concerned about the same issues that Ken mentioned when I was researching but I was told the EXACT same thing you mentioned. Businesses don't mind getting the free exposure so they don't complain EVER. The challenge would be getting them to upgrade or buy other services.
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        http://www.exposeyourbusinessonline.com

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    • Profile picture of the author kenc138
      Hi Steve,

      Thanks for the reply. I echo your sentiment for every business model except directories.

      The nature of such a project gives people free exposure and for many, new opportunities they wouldn't have had otherwise, especially for the niche I'm working in.

      If the information is in the public domain, I can't see the issue with aggregating what's public into a single application.

      One point I will agree with you on is getting traffic to the site. That's going to be a full time job in and of itself, but you're right, nothing beats organic growth in that regard.
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  • Profile picture of the author warlovemag
    take a look at your competitors
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  • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
    Originally Posted by kenc138 View Post

    The nature of such a project gives people free exposure and for many, new opportunities they wouldn't have had otherwise, especially for the niche I'm working in.
    I don't know the niche you are working in, but with all the Google animals running loose, I would imagine that there are many people who might question the value of such "free exposure."

    Be prepared to remove anyone who protests from your directory. If they don't want the link, and you insist on it being in the public domain, it only leaves them with disavowing your link/entry. Too many of those, and you might earn a reputation as a "bad neighborhood."

    Originally Posted by kenc138 View Post

    If the information is in the public domain, I can't see the issue with aggregating what's public into a single application.
    While IANAL, my reading over the years tells me that you are on pretty solid ground legally. There is some difference of opinion on what constitutes "public domain," though.

    The whole "it was on the Internet, so it must be public domain" argument has made a lot of IP lawyers a lot of money over the years. Back in the Made for Adsense heyday, content thieves made the same argument, that it was available to the public and the owner of the content should be happy for the exposure.

    I don't believe you have anything nefarious in mind, but often perception is more powerful than reality.

    Go forward, but tread carefully...
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    • Profile picture of the author OptedIn
      Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe View Post

      I don't know the niche you are working in, but with all the Google animals running loose, I would imagine that there are many people who might question the value of such "free exposure."
      What they see is, "Why would I not want to be in something for free, if all my local competition is? What - am I nuts?"

      Be prepared to remove anyone who protests from your directory.
      People keep bringing this up, but I just don't get. I have never, once, not a single-solitary time had anyone contact me to remove them from a directory. Additionally, whenever I would call someone and tell them they had a free listing, they were delighted.

      Of course if someone ever did protest, why would you argue with them? It takes 5 seconds to delete their entry.

      If they don't want the link, and you insist on it being in the public domain, it only leaves them with disavowing your link/entry. Too many of those, and you might earn a reputation as a "bad neighborhood."
      Seriously? I think you're really overthinking this. What are they going to do - drop everything and spend the rest of their days bad-mouthing you." Most people would ask them what the hell they were complaining about.

      While IANAL, my reading over the years tells me that you are on pretty solid ground legally. There is some difference of opinion on what constitutes "public domain," though.
      Names, addresses and phone numbers are in the public domain. That's why most counties make you register your info, so it is in the public domain. That helps people track you down for any legal issues. There is no "difference of opinion" on this.

      Go forward, but tread carefully...
      A good rule for life in general, but never allow your trepidation to keep you from moving forward with gusto.

      Cheers.
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      "He not busy being born, is busy dying." - Bob Dylan • "I vibe with the light-dark point. Heavy." - Words that Bob Dylan wishes he had written.

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      • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
        Originally Posted by OptedIn View Post

        Seriously? I think you're really overthinking this. What are they going to do - drop everything and spend the rest of their days bad-mouthing you." Most people would ask them what the hell they were complaining about.
        I was thinking more about SEO here. I may be overthinking this, but I've been reading a lot of articles recommending removal of questionable links. The method is called "disavowal" and simply means notifying Google that the link is not wanted and should be ignored.

        Enough of these, and the directory's ability to rank could be affected. Based on posts here, organic rankings and traffic seem to be the lifeblood of the model.

        Originally Posted by OptedIn View Post

        Names, addresses and phone numbers are in the public domain. That's why most counties make you register your info, so it is in the public domain. That helps people track you down for any legal issues. There is no "difference of opinion" on this.
        You're right about such basic information. And if the OP sticks to linking to a business's home page, he should be fine.

        The difference of opinion was mostly about deep linking to specific pages on a site. A quick search yields several examples:

        https://www.google.com/search?q=deep+linking+lawsuits
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        • Profile picture of the author OptedIn
          Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe View Post

          I was thinking more about SEO here.
          I never bother with SEO on directory sites. They are promoted locally through print ads in business and professional group organs, as well strategically placed billboards. Domain name, only. Big and bold. No phone number. Quite inexpensive in my area.

          Additionally, I generally combine a directory site with a classified site, a city guide, a 'best of city' site, a 'shop local' site, a 'deals' site and on more than one occasion a 24/ Internet radio station with business programming at selected times of the day, featuring things like "Spotlight on Business," "A Message from Your Local Chamber of Commerce," etc, etc. I would even sell time to local businesses to have their own show on whatever topic they wanted. You put all of this together and you become a very large fish in a very small pond, very quickly. Everyone knows your name and the potential for income is virtually limitless. The main site is the city guide. Take a certain size ad in that and get a free listing in ALL the others. It's about creating excitement - and perceived value.

          Of course, all of these sites cross-promote all of the other sites and I would give discounts to businesses that would let me place a banner ad at the bottom of their home page, linking to the city guide.

          You're right about such basic information. And if the OP sticks to linking to a business's home page, he should be fine.
          The basic listings that are free do not have any links to the business sites. Company name. address, phone number and contact person. That's it. You want a link to your website? That would be an up-sell from 'Bronze Level' - Free, to 'Silver Level' - $19.95 per year. That's 5¢ a day. I have a very polite speech I use to communicate to any business owner that if they're not willing to spend 5¢ per day in an effort to attract even just one new paying customer, should they really be in business, at all? You' might think they'd be offended, but the common response is, "Makes sense." The degree of politeness is the key.

          Believe it or not, I can be a real charmer, but what hooks them for life is the level of enthusiasm. It's POW-ER-FUL!!! :-)

          Cheers.
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  • Profile picture of the author affmarketer101
    Clone database from other directory sites, and updating with newest info ( you can hire a VA team to do it). Once you get a bunch of data, let reach to businesses ask them to confirm their business info. Then, I hope snowball effect will work and more and more people will find you are a good directory to submit their info.
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    • Profile picture of the author OptedIn
      Originally Posted by affmarketer101 View Post

      Clone database.
      Funny. Let me send you my cPanel access to my DB's to make your life a little easier,
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  • Profile picture of the author DURABLEOILCOM
    Originally Posted by kenc138 View Post

    Hi everyone,

    I am currently developing a directory website for a niche in desperate need of an aggregated data application. There are a few competitors, but the websites are low quality and in need of upgrades.

    One thing I keep thinking about, though. How am I going to get this thing populated quickly and early? The more I think about it, people won't pay the monthly sub if the directory seems inactive.

    I need some solid strategy ideas on how to get this thing populated quickly.

    I was thinking of a data mining/data entry service to scrape the web and enter the info into the database. Email marketing campaign perhaps? Software? WSO?

    Frankly, I'm not sure where to begin so I thought I'd reach out to WF. You guys are far more adept at this sort of thing than I.

    Thanks,
    Ken
    You can build up your database by using all the Free Classified sites like Craigslist, BackPage any others you can find.
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    • Profile picture of the author DWolfe
      Originally Posted by DURABLEOILCOM View Post

      You can build up your database by using all the Free Classified sites like Craigslist, BackPage any others you can find.
      You should check your advice, Back Page no longer exists. The Feds shut it down !
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  • Profile picture of the author mmsearch
    I was looking for the same answers about directories. Great info in this thread.
    Glad I found it.
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