[socialentry]

Originally Posted by DWolfe

Covid 19 is lethal like a loaded gun, but in a decade from now it may gone but this thread will still be here with people debating the same things.

eh. since when does the WF have a debate culture.

[Kay King]

Since when didn't the WF have a debate culture? As long as members stay within the guidelines of no politics, no religion, no personal insults...no problem with a lively debate.

[Jeffery]

Originally Posted by Jeffery

Because without serious focus on economics the end results are chaos, anarchy and civil disputes.

In the U.S. both economic relief and work on vaccines goes a long way to prevent chaos, anarchy and civil disputes.

Consider where the U.S, would be today if the decision makers had not provided economic relief: recession, martial law and God forbid > additional deaths not owed to the virus.

Originally Posted by Profit Traveler

That is the daily news. Thanks for pointing it out. That is where we are.

Math, Science, and Reality is not up for debate.If someone thinks the virus will pass by ignoring it they will not even be around when the paint is dry.

Some people fall off cliffs taking selfies...but they do not take anyone with them.

No, that is not what was pointed out and no that is not where we are.

To understand and know what is "true" chaos, anarchy and civil disputes are and how humans react you have to have either experienced it or lived through it.

According to your statement it is apparent that that your have "not" experienced it or lived through it.

There is a morbid side to to "true" chaos, anarchy, civil disputes, recession, martial law and God forbid > additional deaths not owed to the virus. That is not debatable and there's no reason to doubt it.

[Jeffery]

Originally Posted by socialentry

eh. since when does the WF have a debate culture.

Well, I have been a member since 2004 and there has always been a debate culture.

Though I think that you may be eluding to some people do not always agree with other people then you take it is a un-friendly debate culture?

Originally Posted by Kay King

Since when didn't the WF have a debate culture? As long as members stay within the guidelines of no politics, no religion, no personal insults...no problem with a lively debate.

^ This ^

[Profit Traveler]

Originally Posted by Jeffery

No, that is not what was pointed out and no that is not where we are.

To understand and know what is "true" chaos, anarchy and civil disputes are and how humans react you have to have either experienced it or lived through it.

According to your statement it is apparent that that your have "not" experienced it or lived through it.

There is a morbid side to to "true" chaos, anarchy, civil disputes, recession, martial law and God forbid > additional deaths not owed to the virus. That is not debatable and there's no reason to doubt it.

"We" is relative. For example some people see actions and some only see the reactions to it. I see both.


If you say that something is relative, you mean that it needs to be considered and judged in relation to other things.


Apparent? A whole lot of things are apparent on this thread for sure.

[Kay King]

Apparent? A whole lot of things are apparent on this thread for sure.

What should be apparent to YOU by now is that political rhetoric/commentary/references/inferences will not be allowed here. You don't like the 'no politics' restrictions - you don't like that mods keep deleting those posts/threads and you want to push the boundaries. That pretty much it in a nutshell?



Call me crazy, but I don't think it's a workable plan for the long term.

[Kay King]

Serious pandemic question - I don't understand this...


India is being hit hard by covid-19 - but, day after day, though india has 2-3 TIMES as many new cases as the US....the death rates are quite similar.


HOW can that be? Is there an explanation for it?

[Dan Riffle]

Originally Posted by Kay King

Serious pandemic question - I don't understand this...


India is being hit hard by covid-19 - but, day after day, though india has 2-3 TIMES as many new cases as the US....the death rates are quite similar.


HOW can that be? Is there an explanation for it?

At first blush, I'd say a difference in reporting.

[Frank Donovan]

I think there's inconsistency and/or variation in the terminology.

Virtually all the broadcast media reports in the UK refer to new "cases" of covid, but in the history of epidemiology, a "case" meant that the patient was showing symptoms and clearly suffering from a particular virus. Now it seems anyone who tests positive whether displaying symptoms or not is classed as a case. If you factor in the increased level of testing and the generally younger demographic now being tested, it might explain the relatively low number of deaths.

At least that might account for what's happening in the UK. Can't speak for India or anywhere else.

[Jeffery]

Massive genetic study shows coronavirus mutating and potentially evolving amid rapid U.S. spread

The largest U.S. genetic study of the virus, conducted in Houston, shows one viral strain outdistancing all of its competitors, and many potentially important mutations.

By Chris Mooney, Joel Achenbach and Joe Fox September 23

Excerpts:

Scientists in Houston on Wednesday released a study of more than 5,000 genetic sequences of the coronavirus that reveals the virus’s continual accumulation of mutations, one of which may have made it more contagious.

The new report, however, did not find that these mutations have made the virus deadlier or changed clinical outcomes. All viruses accumulate genetic mutations, and most are insignificant, scientists say.

~ ~ ~

The new study, which has not been peer-reviewed, was posted Wednesday on the preprint server MedRxiv. It appears to be the largest single aggregation of genetic sequences of the virus in the United States thus far. A larger batch of sequences was published earlier this month by scientists in the United Kingdom, and, like the Houston study, concluded that a mutation that changes the structure of the “spike protein” on the surface of the virus may be driving the outsized spread of that particular strain.

~ ~ ~

David Morens, a virologist at the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, reviewed the new study and said the findings point to the strong possibility that the virus, as it has moved through the population, has become more transmissible, and that this “may have implications for our ability to control it.”

Morens noted that this is a single study, and “you don’t want to over-interpret what this means.” But the virus, he said, could potentially be responding — through random mutations — to such interventions as mask-wearing and social distancing, Morens said Wednesday.

“Wearing masks, washing our hands, all those things are barriers to transmissibility, or contagion, but as the virus becomes more contagious it statistically is better at getting around those barriers,” said Morens, senior adviser to Anthony S. Fauci, the director of the NIAID.

~ ~ ~

The research shows that the virus disseminated across Houston neighborhoods in two waves, first striking wealthier and older individuals but then spreading, in the second wave, to younger people and lower-income neighborhoods — affecting many Latino city residents.

[Claude Whitacre]

Originally Posted by Jeffery

[URL="https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2020/09/23/houston-coronavirus-mutations/?arc404=true"]

Morens noted that this is a single study, and “you don’t want to over-interpret what this means.” But the virus, he said, could potentially be responding — through random mutations — to such interventions as mask-wearing and social distancing, Morens said Wednesday.

“Wearing masks, washing our hands, all those things are barriers to transmissibility, or contagion, but as the virus becomes more contagious it statistically is better at getting around those barriers,” said Morens, senior adviser to Anthony S. Fauci, the director of the NIAID.

I hope people don't interpret this as meaning that masks don't work. It means that the virus is more transmittable through the air.

And that means that masks are more important than ever. And it is now far more important that both people in a conversation wear masks.

And it means that even when you wear a mask, social distancing is important.

My wife...the love of my life...has decided that next week she is going to her grandson's wrestling match. Lots of students. Lots of parents. All yelling and cheering...inside a building. I know I can't talk her out of it.

Stupid...stupid...stupid.

[Kay King]

We have friends who are 'self quaranting' for 2 weeks - not because they were exposed (they weren't) - but because their daughter is expecting their first grandchild and they don't want to take ANY chance of harming their family or the new baby.


Very responsible - but they missed the cookout with smoked baby back ribs this weekend

[lanfear63]

Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre

I hope people don't interpret this as meaning that masks don't work. It means that the virus is more transmittable through the air.

And that means that masks are more important than ever. And it is now far more important that both people in a conversation wear masks.

And it means that even when you wear a mask, social distancing is important.

My wife...the love of my life...has decided that next week she is going to her grandson's wrestling match. Lots of students. Lots of parents. All yelling and cheering...inside a building. I know I can't talk her out of it.

Stupid...stupid...stupid.

Well "Andree the Giant", that seems very silly of her. You might try the old, "What if you catch it", you would then come home and give it to me, I fear for your life but I also fear for my own, could you live with that? argument.

[Kay King]

The latest update from CDC about the survival rates of covid patients?


CDC COVID-19 Survival Rates

• Age 0-19 — 99.997%
• Age 20-49 — 99.98%
• Age 50-69 — 99.5%
• Age 70+ — 94.6%

[Jeffery]

Originally Posted by Kay King

The latest update from CDC about the survival rates of covid patients?

CDC COVID-19 Survival Rates

• Age 0-19 — 99.997%
• Age 20-49 — 99.98%
• Age 50-69 — 99.5%
• Age 70+ — 94.6%

Very promising.
On a side note, there is talk of the side effects.
COVID-19 (coronavirus): Long-term effects

By Mayo Clinic Staff

Excerpt:

COVID-19 symptoms can sometimes persist for months. The virus can damage the lungs, heart and brain, which increases the risk of long-term health problems.

Most people who have coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) recover completely within a few weeks. But some people — even those who had mild versions of the disease — continue to experience symptoms after their initial recovery.

[Jeffery]

The Road Ahead: Charting the coronavirus pandemic over the next 12 months - and beyond
By Andrew Joseph @DrewQJoseph
September 22, 2020

Excerpts:

In this project, STAT describes 30 key moments, possible turning points that could steer the pandemic onto a different course or barometers for how the virus is reshaping our lives, from rituals like Halloween and the Super Bowl, to what school could look like, to just how long we might be incorporating precautions into our routines.

~ ~ ~

Fall starts: Will it be wrenching, or really wrenching?

Overstretched ambulance crews. Overflowing hospitals. Overstuffed morgues. The grimmest images from the spring and summer peaks could appear again this fall and winter if the country doesn’t drive its case count down urgently.

~ ~ ~

Sept. 28: A college quarantine strategy faces the test

For colleges, there’s one over-arching dilemma: How can they safely keep students on campus?

~ ~ ~

Sept. 29: At first debate, Trump and Biden square off over Covid

You can practically mouth the script: On stage at Case Western Reserve University in Cleveland (and before a limited audience), former Vice President Joe Biden lambastes Trump for the nation’s disastrous pandemic response and for failing the American people. Trump tries to convince millions of viewers that the U.S. has turned a corner — that his administration defeated the virus and is this close to a vaccine.

~ ~ ~

Oct. 2: ‘A lost generation of workers’?

Picture the cable news coverage of September’s unemployment report, a crucial proxy for the economy and the last one before the election. A flashing chart showing the pandemic’s toll on jobs, and an immediate pivot to the political implications. Trump will likely be watching.

~ ~ ~

Early October: After 100 million tests, it’s still not enough

It’s too early to say we’ve overcome all the horrors of testing, from a CDC test that didn’t work to shortages of swabs and reagents to delayed (and thus meaningless) results.

~ ~ ~

Mid-October: Can more K-12 schools get students back?

Within two weeks of schools in Cherokee County, Ga., opening in August, when local coronavirus transmission was still high, more than 1,000 students and staff found themselves in quarantine and three high schools reverted to online learning.


~ ~ ~

Mid-October: SARS-2 treatments start to arrive

The first treatments specifically crafted to fight SARS-2 could join clinicians’ armaments this fall.

~ ~ ~

Oct. 22: The FDA’s vaccine advisory committee meets in a showdown over scientific integrity

Usually, these meetings are eye-glazing to anyone beyond scientists and drug companies, yet another expert gathering in a conference room at the FDA’s suburban Maryland campus. But the topic will be Covid-19 vaccines, and given the timing — 12 days before the election — people nervous about potential White House interference in the FDA’s evaluations have this date circled on their calendars.

~ ~ ~

Oct. 23: A vaccine gets a divisive FDA emergency authorization

OK, so this one might not happen.

But if it does, imagine the juxtaposition. A spike-the-football Trump tweet, and scientists fretting that a hastily released vaccine desecrated the regulatory process.

~ ~ ~

Oct. 31: A scary Halloween indeed

Parents, it may be time to have a difficult talk with your children.

~ ~ ~

Nov. 3: A momentous election indeed

Perhaps nothing will change, or everything will.

~ ~ ~

November: Covid, meet flu

In 2018, so many people came down with the flu that Pennsylvania’s Lehigh Valley Health Network threw up tents to handle the influx of patients. In April of this year, the hospital almost had to turn operating rooms into ICUs for Covid-19 patients. The question for Lehigh Valley is: What would a double whammy look like?

~ ~ ~

Thanksgiving: Will holiday travel set us back?

Can you break a wishbone over Zoom?

The thought of people traveling for Thanksgiving and the December holidays, at the same time that college students who make it through the semester will be scattering home, makes experts anxious, to say the least.

~ ~ ~

Late November: The 250,000th American death

When the official U.S. death toll hit 100,000, the New York Times dedicated its front page to the names of the dead. When it hit 200,000, Time put a black border on its cover for only the second time ever; the first was Sept. 11. How do you memorialize a quarter of a million Americans dead?

~ ~ ~

Late November: 50,000 deaths among Black Americans

The pandemic has rumbled through the U.S. like an excavator, digging up and magnifying generations-deep inequities. We’ve had to confront the fragility of access to housing, jobs, and health care. And no disparities have been more sobering than the fact that, according to data from APM Research Lab, Black, Pacific Islander, Indigenous, and Latino Americans all have age-adjusted Covid-19 death rates triple that of white Americans.

~ ~ ~

December: The results of crucial vaccine trials arrive

Remember, one possibility is that a vaccine simply doesn’t work. But let’s say that some prove safe and effective (fingers crossed).

~ ~ ~

Dec. 31: New Year’s Eve in a very different Times Square

The pandemic has disrupted storied events, from the Olympics to the Radio City Rockettes’ Christmas Spectacular. Often, the cancellations include “for the first time since World War II.”

~ ~ ~

January 2021: One year after cases exploded in China

A year after the coronavirus came to our attention, we’ll likely still have basic questions about it, including from which animals it leapt to people. But with time, we could start getting a better understanding of one of Covid-19’s biggest mysteries: how long immunity lasts.

~ ~ ~

Jan. 20: Masks or MAGA hats

Whichever is the adornment of choice on the National Mall for the president’s inauguration could be a reflection of who won the election — and the future pandemic response.

~ ~ ~

Feb. 7: Are you ready for some (fanless?) football?

It’s the most-watched TV event every year, but the question will be how many fans will be watching at the game itself.

~ ~ ~

March: One year after major U.S. outbreaks, will long-haulers have recovered?

The more time passes, the more we’ll know about all that SARS-2 can do — and how long those effects last.

~ ~ ~

March 19: Match Day illuminates how the pandemic has remodeled medicine

In 2020, Match Day — when graduating medical students find out at which hospital they’ve “matched” for their residencies — coincided with states and cities shutting down as the pandemic took off. The following month, Kelly Ieong, a student at Stony Brook’s medical school in New York, graduated early and joined the health care workforce facing a wave of patients. She spent two months on the Covid floors at Stony Brook’s hospital before starting her residency, taking care of intubated patients and having difficult conversations with their families.

~ ~ ~

April 25: And the Oscar goes to …

James Bond and Vin Diesel, who both know a thing or two about worldwide calamities, were clearly on to something.

~ ~ ~

April: Vaccines, round 2

The vaccine reinforcements could arrive starting in the spring.

The first immunizations out of the gates into pivotal trials were from Moderna, AstraZeneca and the University of Oxford, and Pfizer and BioNTech. But other candidates just months behind could play a crucial role in corralling the pandemic.

~ ~ ~

May: Celebrate good times, come on?

Canceled. Postponed. Virtual. That was what happened in 2020 to traditional rites of spring, like proms, graduations, and the beginning of wedding season.

~ ~ ~

June: We need Americans ‘lining up to get the vaccine’

Finally, vaccines are widely available. Will Americans roll up their sleeves?

~ ~ ~

July: As office employees return, what will greet them downtown?

More than a year after companies en masse told office employees to work from home, more and more workers will come back.

~ ~ ~

July 6: The U.S. withdraws from the WHO — maybe

Whether the U.S. goes through with its plan to leave the WHO depends on the election. A President Biden would reverse Trump’s decision to withdraw.

~ ~ ~

July 23: The 2020, erm 2021, Olympics begin in Japan

Fans heading to the Olympics will need passports, luck if they want to snag tickets to see Simone Biles compete, and — perhaps? — proof of vaccination.

~ ~ ~

August through December, and beyond: Living with SARS-2

Let’s start with what won’t happen to the coronavirus: It gets wiped off the earth. The only human disease ever eradicated was smallpox. SARS-2, it seems, has joined the ranks of endemic viruses.

[Claude Whitacre]

Originally Posted by Kay King

The latest update from CDC about the survival rates of covid patients?


CDC COVID-19 Survival Rates

• Age 0-19 — 99.997%
• Age 20-49 — 99.98%
• Age 50-69 — 99.5%
• Age 70+ — 94.6%

That sounds credible. And it's that last figure that bothers me. If you are 70 or older, there is a 5.4% chance, if you test positive for Covid...that you will die.

That percent goes up rapidly as you age. And it goes up rapidly if you have a condition like obesity, diabetes, if you smoke, or have most other conditions that weaken your immune system.

My wife is 73 years old, and has some health issues. My best guess is that, if she gets it, she has a 15% chance of dying, and a much higher chance of long term damage to her lungs or heart.

For younger folk, it's not a big risk.

These stats are far worse than any flu we have seen in our lives. As I've said before, most years, my wife and I get the flu. For a few days we are miserable, and then we get better.

It never occurred to me that we might die from the flu

From this? I think about it every day.

[Kay King]

That's interesting - I saw those numbers as a BIG positive for every age group. The 15% that is your 'guess' is only a guess - you could make it 25% or 5% and it wouldn't affect reality in the least.



I ran into a site where preventive med experts talked about flu vs covid - and this was printed last february....interesting to read it today with the facts we have now:

Influenza rarely gets the sort of attention that 2019 Novel Coronavirus is getting, even though it kills more Americans each year than any other virus, the doctorspointed out. Familiarity breeds indifference, one physician reminded the news outlet.

“When we think about the relative danger of this new coronavirus and influenza, there’s just no comparison,” said William Schaffner, M.D., a professor of preventive medicine and health policy at Vanderbilt University Medical Center. “Coronavirus will be a blip on the horizon in comparison.”

Wonder where he's hiding these days?

[kenmichaels]

Neanderthal genes linked to severe COVID-19

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-020-2818-3

Here is the accelerated article preview PDF

A group of genes passed down from extinct human cousins is linked with a higher risk for severe COVID-19, researchers say. When they compared the genetic profiles of about 3,200 hospitalized COVID-19 patients and nearly 900,000 people from the general population, they found that a cluster of genes on chromosome 3 inherited from Neanderthals who lived more than 50,000 years ago is linked with 60% higher odds of needing hospitalization. People with COVID-19 who inherited this gene cluster are also more likely to need artificial breathing assistance, coauthor Hugo Zeberg of the Max Planck Institute for Evolutionary Anthropology said in a news release. The prevalence of these genes varies widely, according to a report published on Wednesday in Nature. In South Asia, roughly 30% of people have them, compared to roughly one in six Europeans. They are almost non-existent in Africa and East Asia. While the study cannot explain why these particular genes confer a higher risk, the authors conclude, "with respect to the current pandemic, it is clear that gene flow from Neanderthals has tragic consequences."

[Claude Whitacre]

Originally Posted by kenmichaels

Neanderthal genes linked to severe COVID-19

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-020-2818-3

Here is the accelerated article preview PDF

A group of genes passed down from extinct human cousins is linked with a higher risk for severe COVID-19, researchers say. When they compared the genetic profiles of about 3,200 hospitalized COVID-19 patients and nearly 900,000 people from the general population, they found that a cluster of genes on chromosome 3 inherited from Neanderthals who lived more than 50,000 years ago is linked with 60% higher odds of needing hospitalization. People with COVID-19 who inherited this gene cluster are also more likely to need artificial breathing assistance, coauthor Hugo Zeberg of the Max Planck Institute for Evolutionary Anthropology said in a news release. The prevalence of these genes varies widely, according to a report published on Wednesday in Nature. In South Asia, roughly 30% of people have them, compared to roughly one in six Europeans. They are almost non-existent in Africa and East Asia. While the study cannot explain why these particular genes confer a higher risk, the authors conclude, "with respect to the current pandemic, it is clear that gene flow from Neanderthals has tragic consequences."

Dan Riffle is NOT going to be happy about this!

[Dan Riffle]

Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre

Dan Riffle is NOT going to be happy about this!

Comparing our brow ridges, methinks someone might be projecting...

[Princess Balestra]

Brow Ridge is where a special kind of cowboy goes to nevah ride & only whispah.

Plus also, evolootionary scientists now understand way more 'bout the moment when Neanderthals an' hoomans diverged.

Like regulah species of the globe, Neanderthals marked their territory.

No surprise what they used to let evrywan know they'd been around, but bcs they way smartah than monkeys they also marked stuff with real basic symbols an' etchings.

One such symbol resembled what we now recognise as the letter h.

It survives later Neanderthal archaeology an' shapes up ovah time into what we know today.

Question is, did the Neanderthals addin' in an extra flourish to their signature consider 'emselves so above the regulah Neandertals that their messagin' prevailed simply bcs of a quirksy flourish?

All I know is, Brow Ridge be echoin' with the sound of chaps a-flappin' — an' this wouldna worked out too well if'n we'd all stayed Neandertal an' they'd been wearin' caps.

Call me stereotypically indoctrinated, but I demand a wide hat brim from the guys out on the range whisperin' to bison an' stuff.

Out in the Arizona Dessert, if'n you ain't got a wide brim hat, likely you gonna die.

Which brings me to my point.

Popular mytology has it how you can FRY A FRICKIN' EGG on a car roof out in the de-ssert.

tbh, I would wanna hope how both Claude & Rifflepops might function as servicable Brow Ridge Adonises in this respect.

Cos I can't cook for schmuff, an' I demand an easy life.

If'n what you sayin' is how I could fry an egg real easy on your brows out in the Arizona De-ssert without gettin' no hairs caught in the albumental periphery, could be you mighta positioned yusselves at the forefront of the ultimate side hussle.

THEY LAUGHED WHEN THEY SAW MY FOREHEAD ...
BUT WHEN THEY TASTED MY BREAKFAST!

[Claude Whitacre]

Originally Posted by Princess Balestra

Claude & Rifflepops m

I know Riffle has a Neanderthal brow. It's where the saying "Riffles have ridges" comes from. Scientific fact.





added later; THEY LAUGHED WHEN THEY SAW MY FOREHEAD ...
BUT WHEN THEY TASTED MY BREAKFAST!

Ha!

Originally Posted by Dan Riffle

Comparing our brow ridges, methinks something might be projecting...

Fixed it for you.

[lanfear63]

Trump and Melina test Positive for Corona Virus. Let's see how this pans out.

Story here:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-54381848

[lanfear63]

Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre

I know Riffle has a Neanderthal brow. It's where the saying "Riffles have ridges" comes from. Scientific fact.





added later; THEY LAUGHED WHEN THEY SAW MY FOREHEAD ...
BUT WHEN THEY TASTED MY BREAKFAST!

Ha!



Fixed it for you.

The jokes are certainly not very High Brow

[Claude Whitacre]

Originally Posted by lanfear63

Trump and Melania test Positive for Corona Virus. Let's see how this pans out.

Story here:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-54381848

He's showing symptoms.

I wonder how this is going to affect the public perception of how serious this is, and how easy it is to spread?

[Jeffery]

Originally Posted by lanfear63

Trump and Melina test Positive for Corona Virus. Let's see how this pans out.

Story here:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-54381848

Best wishes and speedy recovery for Trump and Melina.
Live updates: Biden tests negative for coronavirus; Trump experiencing ‘mild symptoms’ after positive test

Excerpts minus anything political...
Oct. 2, 2020 at 11:45 a.m. CDT

President Trump is experiencing “mild symptoms” after he and first lady Melania Trump tested positive for the coronavirus, White House chief of staff Mark Meadows told reporters Friday. The first lady said on Twitter that she, too, has “mild symptoms” but is “overall feeling good.”

Democratic nominee Joe Biden’s campaign announced that he and his wife, Jill Biden, have both tested negative for the coronavirus.

With 32 days until the election …

• The president’s infection has upended the campaign. A fundraiser in Washington and a rally in Florida were scrapped, and Trump plans to remain in self-isolation at the White House.
• Democratic nominee Joe Biden wished Trump and his wife a “swift recovery” in a morning tweet. He is scheduled to campaign in Michigan on Friday.
• Vice President Pence and his wife have tested negative, according to a spokesman.
• Sen. Mike Lee (R-Utah), who attended Trump’s announcement Saturday of his Supreme Court pick, said he has tested positive for the coronavirus and will self-isolate for 10 days.
• Republican National Committee Chairwoman Ronna McDaniel disclosed that she had tested positive.

[lanfear63]

Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre

He's showing symptoms.

I wonder how this is going to affect the public perception of how serious this is, and how easy it is to spread?

Now admitted to hospital, purely as a precautionary measure (allegedly)

[kenmichaels]

Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre

He's showing symptoms.

I wonder how this is going to affect the public perception of how serious this is, and how easy it is to spread?

The last few months, including yesterday, most of the people were still not wearing masks where I live in FL

But today.... everywhere I went, everyone was wearing a mask.

It's about damn time.

I guess things just got real for a whole lot of people.

[kenmichaels]

Originally Posted by lanfear63

Now admitted to hospital, purely as a precautionary measure (allegedly)

They are reporting he took an experimental drug.
To me - THAT is just nuts.

[Jeffery]

Originally Posted by kenmichaels

They are reporting he took an experimental drug.
To me - THAT is just nuts.

I think we have to consider the source, but he does have good taste in women.

[kenmichaels]

Originally Posted by kenmichaels

The last few months, including yesterday, most of the people were still not wearing masks where I live in FL

But today.... everywhere I went, everyone was wearing a mask.

It's about damn time.

I guess things just got real for a whole lot of people.

meh, it must have been a fluke, today it's about 50/50.

Still, that's a lot better. The local news says my zipcode is a hotspot.

[kenmichaels]

Originally Posted by Jeffery

I think we have to consider the source,

True

Originally Posted by Jeffery

but he does have good taste in women.

If you say so.

[Claude Whitacre]

Originally Posted by lanfear63

Now admitted to hospital, purely as a precautionary measure (allegedly)

He has shown symptoms, but nothing that keeps him in bed. Hopefully it won't get much worse. The WH doctor said that he (so far) doesn't need supplemental Oxygen, which is good.

Originally Posted by kenmichaels

They are reporting he took an experimental drug.
To me - THAT is just nuts.

It's basically a cocktail of anti-biotics. It's really quite safe, and has been given to others. . Lots of doctors are prescribing it as a treatment.

But I have seen a complete shift in mask usage since a couple of days ago.

Now...suddenly...the virus is real and masks help. Did you see the list of others that have also tested positive?

Not wearing masks at these rallies has not paid off. I hope this starts a real shift in how this virus is perceived in the US. If it does, we could see real improvement in just a month or so.

[kenmichaels]

Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre

He has shown symptoms, but nothing that keeps him in bed. Hopefully it won't get much worse. The WH doctor said that he (so far) doesn't need supplemental Oxygen, which is good.

That man dances around questions as well as any politician.

[lanfear63]

Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre

He has shown symptoms, but nothing that keeps him in bed. Hopefully it won't get much worse. The WH doctor said that he (so far) doesn't need supplemental Oxygen, which is good.







It's basically a cocktail of anti-biotics. It's really quite safe, and has been given to others. . Lots of doctors are prescribing it as a treatment.

But I have seen a complete shift in mask usage since a couple of days ago.

Now...suddenly...the virus is real and masks help. Did you see the list of others that have also tested positive?

Not wearing masks at these rallies has not paid off. I hope this starts a real shift in how this virus is perceived in the US. If it does, we could see real improvement in just a month or so.

Some report he was given oxygen at the Whitehouse before going to the hospital. Certainly took the drugs there. And the drugs may have kicked in.

It goes to show that even the Whitehouse's level of precautions was sadly lacking or pretty much whatever you do, the risk remains..

And yesterday I received an email from our chief of operations for accounting (at the large community college where I work, currently working from home) starting.. "As we prepare to return to the workplace..."...errr, sorry...as you prepare to return to the workplace more like. Me, I'm staying put.

No cure or vaccine still, numbers going up as winter draws in. Now the President has it, in your dreams.

Also wearing a mask is something I can stand for about 20 minutes to visit a food store, not eight plus hours. I don't care what precautions they have made, how many gowns, masks, face shields, hand sanitizers bought, or cubicle glass partitions they have put up.

Until there is a cure or a vaccine. I'm staying right here at home.

Methinks, soon, the question will be asked, so are you all ready to return to the workplace, but I doubt if they will be able to enforce it, especially as myself and many others are quite capable of doing our work from home.

Are you still opening your store up each day?

[Jeffery]

Will you eat at a restaurant buffet amid the pandemic?




States have policies that pertain to "open buffets" and "closed buffets". All restaurants are supposed to adhere to state policy.


There are a few articles on the net that reviewed some of the more national restaurants and discovered that the national restaurants appear to follow state policy. Here is one from BusinessInsider.com that is an eye opener.


Technically, policy is adhered to, but some common sense self-policy is not. Customers and even employees without masks and gloves can easily contaminate salad bars, plates, tableware, Aunt Molly without social distancing.



Will you eat at a restaurant buffet amid the pandemic?

[Claude Whitacre]

Originally Posted by lanfear63

Are you still opening your store up each day?

Regular business hours. We both put on masks as soon as someone comes in. We keep it on, whether they have a mask on or not. Once the store is empty, we take off the masks.

We just ordered two signs. One says something like "Because of Covid, no public restrooms" and the other one says something like "To keep all of us safer, we request that you wear your mask".

if they don't, we'll still take their money, but we strongly prefer that they wear a mask.


The vaccine is to help you ward off the viral infection. It won't be a cure, and will only work in most cases, like any vaccine except the one for small pox, which was very effective.


The covid 19 will be with us for years to come.


My wife went to her grandson's wrestling match Friday. I was unhappy to hear that her daughter doesn't believe in wearing masks. Cheryl told me that about half the parents didn't wear masks....and it was indoors, and there was plenty of cheering...and sweat.

My wife came home and told me that she wasn't going to visit with her daughter for a while. Sad, but necessary.

Now that we know about the effectiveness of wearing a mask, I feel better about our chances of getting the virus.

I feel worse about my chances of getting on a stage again to sell my courses.

I suspect that late night TV will be different for quite a while.

My guess is that a few years from now, this will be a good story to tell young people....like how my grandparents used to talk about the depression.

To me, wearing a mask is a minor inconvenience. Hospital workers wear a mask for full shifts, along with a lot of other gear. I suppose I can withstand a mask.

Originally Posted by Jeffery

Will you eat at a restaurant buffet amid the pandemic?

Not in any restaurant.

[Odahh]

Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre

The vaccine is to help you ward off the viral infection. It won't be a cure, and will only work in most cases, like any vaccine except the one for small pox, which was very effective.


The covid 19 will be with us for years to come.


Not in any restaurant.

from what i understand with the roll out of the vaccine the highest risk groups//meaning the elderly will be among the first to get the virus an possibly the only gru we try to get to 100 percent ..while we perfect the medical treat meants to bring the death rate down to zero..

i say we as it looks like the strategy the world may employ ..

interestingly enough ..earlier in the thread i mention a long term stratagy for people to protect themselves from covid would be to eat healthier and get blood tests regularly tom ake sure vitamine levels are where they should ..

outside the experimental antibody cocktail ..that mimic the antibodies found in survivors of covid the doctors put the president ..on zink,vitamin d , melatonin , an aspirin and pepcid ac ..

i have been paying attention to the vitamin d and zinc information ..on the other hand i don't tehink the vitamin d is the stuff you can get from the vitamin store .. i think it is medical grade .. still not expensive but not the same ..

as for the economic stuff i am not as worried as I was .. as it looks like the central banks starting with the fed will implement a digital currency based UBI ..

[Jamell]

There might be a second wave but all we can do is be proactive and make adadjustments and evolve .j

[Jeffery]

Originally Posted by derekwong28

This just in, the WHO has just declared coronavirus as a pandemic

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-51839944

"WHO chief Dr Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus said the number of cases outside China had increased 13-fold over the past two weeks.

He said he was "deeply concerned" by "alarming levels of inaction" over the virus."

FYI, Published 11 March 2020 - That is old news - Not just in.[/QUOTE]

Originally Posted by derekwong28

In the meantime, China declares victory over coronavirus

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/03/10/a...hnk/index.html

"As the coronavirus spreads around the world, China has been increasingly vocal about what it appears to feel is a lack of appreciation from the global community for its efforts to contain the outbreak, and preventing the crisis from being even worse than it may turn out to be."

FYI, Published 11 March 2020 - That is old news - Not just in.

Originally Posted by derekwong28

It is sending help to Italy and other countries.

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/dipl...lp-italy-fight

FYI, Published 11 March 2020 - That is old news - Not just in.

[Dan Riffle]

Originally Posted by Jeffery

FYI, Published 11 March 2020 - That is old news - Not just in.

There's thread glitch. Derek didn't recently post that. A moved thread under a different name is linked to an earlier page in this thread. It's weird, but it's 2020, so it's actually normal.

[kenmichaels]

A promising coronavirus cure just failed in drug trials

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/med...ls/ar-BB19PS88

edit:

It appears as if I can only post in this thread, without my post becoming ghosted or
flagged for review. Anyone know what the deal is? Is this a glitch or something else?

[Mark Singletary]

Originally Posted by kenmichaels

It appears as if I can only post in this thread, without my post becoming ghosted or
flagged for review. Anyone know what the deal is? Is this a glitch or something else?

All new threads are pre-approved. Sometimes it takes a while for approval. If the thread isn't approved for some reason, you should get an email to the address in your WF account. But you should be able to post in already open threads with no problem.

Mark

[Claude Whitacre]

Yesterday in the US.

58,000 new cases.

915 new deaths.

Over the last month, the new cases has gone up...the deaths have gone down a little.

No matter what you hear, we're still in this folks.

[kenmichaels]

Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre

No matter what you hear, we're still in this folks.

Yeah, we haven't "rounded the corner" and it's definitely not just "disappearing".


---

So I figured if anyone was going to perish it would be Chris Christie, he has all kinds of issues plus he's morbidly obese. Looks like the Regeneron stuff might actually work. I was thinking it could be a game changer, untill I relize each dose is coming in at $1500 bucks. Vaccines arent like other products where you can save money by bulk. I know they keep saying it's going to be free, but I dont see how. I just dont. Can someone who does explain it?


Regeneron CEO says U.S. secured 300,000 doses of antibody cocktail

Washington — Dr. Leonard Schleifer, the founder and CEO of Regeneron Pharmaceuticals, which developed the antibody cocktail heralded by President Trump, estimated Sunday that a $450 million contract the company won from the federal government over the summer will secure roughly 300,000 doses of the treatment.

"They bought from us several hundred thousand, maybe around 300,000 doses, which they are going to make it for free," Schleifer said in an interview with "Face the Nation." "We can't do this alone. We need the entire industry."

Transcript: Regeneron CEO Leonard Schleifer on "Face the Nation"
The Trump administration announced in July it signed a $450 million contract with Regeneron to supply the treatment. But with the number of new coronavirus cases outpacing the doses of the drug available, Schleifer conceded the federal government, together with ethics experts at the Food and Drug Administration, will have to decide who receives the limited supply.

[Kay King]

alarm, conjecture, conspiracy? It's a cycle that needs to be broken when it comes to covid-19.

The numbers are down again as of yesterday - they go up and down and we've talked about that before. They are not going to magically go to 0.

There are treatments that seem to be working - so now we are going to predict shortages and rationing? Or is the head of the drug company angling publicly for another 450 million deal?

There are improvements - people are wearing masks and social distancing....it doesn't matter if the covid-19 pandemic is 'over' - we have to get on with our lives and learn to deal with it.

A few of us can shelter in place, have everything we need delivered - but most people can't live like that if they wanted to.

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/c...ekly/index.htm

The deaths by age group are interesting - but the GRAPH halfway down the page is encouraging.


Also, the W.H.O. now says a 'shutdown' is not the best idea due to the huge amt of financial damage it does.....and a new study of 200k students shows schools are NOT 'super spreaders" and that transmission among students and staff has been very low.

Statistics involving 200,000 schoolkids from 47 states in the last two weeks of September yielded an overall coronavirus infection rate of just .13 percent among students and .24 percent for staffers, according to Brown University economics Professor Emily Oster and her team of number-crunchers.

The figures translate into what would be roughly 1.3 infections for a school with 1,000 kids in the two-week period, and 2.2 positive tests for every 1,000 staffers in the same time frame.

“I think it was thought the minute we get people together in schools, there would be these huge outbreaks — and that hasn’t come to pass,’’

The scenarios - and even the facts - are changing - and we need to adapt to the changes.

[lanfear63]

Originally Posted by Kay King

alarm, conjecture, conspiracy? It's a cycle that needs to be broken when it comes to covid-19.

The numbers are down again as of yesterday - they go up and down and we've talked about that before. They are not going to magically go to 0.

There are treatments that seem to be working - so now we are going to predict shortages and rationing? Or is the head of the drug company angling publicly for another 450 million deal?

There are improvements - people are wearing masks and social distancing....it doesn't matter if the covid-19 pandemic is 'over' - we have to get on with our lives and learn to deal with it.

A few of us can shelter in place, have everything we need delivered - but most people can't live like that if they wanted to.

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/c...ekly/index.htm

The deaths by age group are interesting - but the GRAPH halfway down the page is encouraging.


Also, the W.H.O. now says a 'shutdown' is not the best idea due to the huge amt of financial damage it does.....and a new study of 200k students shows schools are NOT 'super spreaders" and that transmission among students and staff has been very low.





The scenarios - and even the facts - are changing - and we need to adapt to the changes.

I have told my bosses that I will take early retirement if we have to go back to work, (all been working from home since mid March) and guess what, in a recent meeting it was announced that we will have to return to work starting November. But just one day a week in rotation, so there will just be a hand-full from each departments in the offices. We will have to sign in each day we go in, get our temperature taken, walk around wearing gloves and a mask all day, stand in line for the Restroom etc, you know, like working in a hospital.

I do not want to do any of that, I hate wearing a mask for 40 minutes or more, let alone for 8 hours.

I do not want to increase my chances of catching it and possibly dying from it. Strong protocols you may say they have. Erm, did not the Whitehouse? I will be 64, end of this month. A Higher risk.

It's fall, moving into winter and new infections are going up by thousands, we had 3 consecutive days of 50k per day, new infections. Unprecedented. We have got nowhere with this, no cure or Vaccine, to say, it's all stuff and nonsense and we should get back to work and deal with it increases the spread of the virus and will just cause more deaths.

We have all learned to work from home and I can do about 98 percent of the tasks that I can do at work, at home. So it's not for me. If they make it mandatory for all, which does not seem to have been said so far, then I'm out. I hope they make allowances so I can continue working from home. i have one year left to go for "Full" retirement benefits.

[Kay King]

It's fall, moving into winter and new infections are going up by thousands, we had 3 consecutive days of 50k per day, new infections.

Who is 'we'? Past 2 days in US new cases in the 40k range BUT more critically, deaths between 300-400 for two days. The death rate has been declining and taht critical to getting back to work. As the US opens up little by little we see spikes in new cases but the death rate has continued to decline little by little and that is great news.

I am ALL for working at home when and if it is possible for your job. My d-in-law is also a university employee - they tried going back to work by alternating weeks. She and her two assts would each 'put in' one week at the office every three weeks. After a month it wasn't any more efficient than working from home so she's working at home again. The VP's idea was someone would be there for 'emergencies' with computer systems but it was pointed out we live 10 minutes from her office so she can respond quickly if needed.

I think you are smart to consider YOUR age and circumstances and make decisions for what you are willing to do. I also hate the masks but I don't complain because so many workers are wearing masks 8 hrs a day on critical jobs that I can't whine about wearing a mask in public.

To say 'we have all learned to work from home' ignores the plight of tens of thousands of small businesses and employees who are NOT able to make money staying at home. At this point in the pandemic I don't believe either you or I have the right to decide what those people are allowed to do.

So while I agree with your take on what is best for you - and I decide my own level of risk as well - the stict lockdowns and limitations on businesses and schools has to end or we will create more problems than we solve.

As I've said several times in this thread - do what works for YOU but don't advocate for everyone else to stay home. Many cannot do that and feed their family....and studies now are showing the fear about opening schools is not the reality.

IMO we are at the point where the country needs to re-open while those most at risk need to stay sheltered until the danger is over as much as it ever will be. I go to the local large grocery and have to make my way around the large carts of the 'pickers' who are readying grocery lists for delivery and pickup. People ARE being careful but it's time to focus on our personal well being and allow other businesses the right to re-open and survive if they can. Some businesses re-opening now are quickly closing permanently as all customers are gone. The re-opening may be as painful this year as the closings were....


I know someone will now post stats of new cases and etc but my position is we are past the 'OMG - look what's happening!' stage and need to focus on 'how do we manage from here' that starts to move ahead again.

[kenmichaels]

Originally Posted by Kay King

I know someone will now post stats of new cases and etc but my position is we are past the 'OMG - look what's happening!' stage and need to focus on 'how do we manage from here' that starts to move ahead again.

Such as agreeing that covid 19 is real and dangerous?

Or perhaps, masks work and are helpful?

--

Why do you keep referencing locking everything down? I haven't heard anyone advocate that for months. (Only temp and very specific community lock downs)

Whats has been advocated for months now is masks, fresh or heavily circulated air, distancing, and good hygiene.

---

I agree tho, the OMG faze should have been over a long time ago.
We've had plenty of time to get things situated.

Edit: I know about 100 people who have caught covid. Only two have died.
Most got pretty sick and the majority had to get some help. I think the fact that only two
died is very positive and says a lot. If it wasn't for the unknown long term side effects, my kid
would be in school. But we don't know, it looks like we're starting to get an idea,
and its not good.

I think any parent having their kid in school... AND doing sports is asking for trouble.

That's what I'm worried about, stuff liek that. Not locking everything down.

My kid is 11, I should not saddle him with 80 years of a weak heart or
half lung capacity or diminished cerebral capability. So masks, distancing and home school until further notice. And just so you know... my kid sprained his ankle the other day
so we spent hours in the hospital getting x-rays and whatnot. Everyone wore masks
and I'm not losing sleep over it. The science says masks work and I believe it.