Books for Client Attraction For New Web Design Firm?

Tanda Copywriting

4 years ago

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trent001 4 years ago

Thank you. Yes I feel marketing is my biggest issue...
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DABK

4 years ago

Why would they not be relevant to you?

What do you mean, people ask for too many testimonials?

You do not have credibility. Lots of testimonials would help with that?

You seem to have a huge positioning problem: if you position yourself right and your funnels are properly set up, there should be no haggling.

They perceive you as not offering enough value to justify the prices you're asking for.

If you're selling websites to companies that do not have a website, you're going to have a harder time than if you sold your services to people who already have a website:

you have to convince them that they need and want a site
and
that you are the one to buy it from.

If they already have a site, you only need to convince them to buy from you.

What, exactly, do you sell: websites? websites that convert visitors into buyers? marketing systems?

By the way, all of the above can be one website. It's just what you put in it and how you present it.

Where and how do people find you?
What's your funnel like?
When do you talk price?
What credibility signs do you have on your landing pages? on your other pages?

Originally Posted by trent001

Hey fellow warriors,

I've started a new web design firm and since I'm based in Russia, I struggle to get clients in the West.

People ask for too many testimonials, websites and still struggle to pull the trigger. They also hag on the price a lot.

Any books to recommend? I know there are a lot of great books by authors like Dan Kennedy, Jay Abraham and so on for marketing, but I'm not sure what will be most relevant for my situation and where to start? I already have sales training in the past, and also through books like SPIN Selling and Challenger Sale...

Thank you

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trent001 4 years ago

Hey, thank you DABK I'll try to answer your questions:

(1) Why would they not be relevant to you?
I'm not saying they wouldn't, I'm just not sure where to start? There are a lot of materials by those two and others like them.

(2) What do you mean, people ask for too many testimonials?
As in, literarily everyone I've spoken to wants to see several past projects, and they seem very demanding or, if not, the prices they accept are very low.

(3) You do not have credibility. Lots of testimonials would help with that?
Yes, I don't have credibility. I've got 3 projects I can show, but they're Russian websites from my immediate circle, in 3 different industries (construction, restaurant, and cleaning service). What can I do?

(4) What, exactly, do you sell: websites? websites that convert visitors into buyers? marketing systems?
So I want to sell websites to freelancers and consultants that showcase their full credibility and allow them to charge more from their clients, and of course get clients more easily. I've gone after both those who have websites already (but bad ones) and those who don't have websites.

(5) Where and how do people find you?
They don't find me. I go after them. It's really hard to rank for SEO in terms of web design and related terms. So what I do is that I use automated messages on LinkedIn to connect with my target audience.

(6) What's your funnel like?
So it's connection -> video message with Loom on their website about things that could be better, or why a website could help them get more clients -> follow-up -> if no answer I send them a free training illustrating what I can do with my Russian client, problem being the client isn't really in the same target audience. My goal is to get them on a call. So if they respond on Linkedin, I send them a link to book a time to discuss their specific situation, and if they dont respond, by the time I send the training, they will find a link to book a time there on the website after going through it.

(7) When do you talk price?
On the sales call. Usually towards the end.

(8) What credibility signs do you have on your landing pages? on your other pages?
The three testimonials translated from Russian.
Examples of work (3)
Results for one of the project (documented growth in clients/prices)

What is very frustrating is that from 200 videos or so created and sent, I only got 1 client, and that for a low price too :/
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Frank Donovan

4 years ago

Originally Posted by trent001

Hey fellow warriors,

I've started a new web design firm and since I'm based in Russia, I struggle to get clients in the West.

That's not surprising - all else being equal, people will tend to prefer dealing with a service from their own country. Other than any language and cultural concerns, there's the simple matter of convenience to overcome.

To combat these obstacles, you'll need to be exceptionally good or offer exceptional value. Even then, you'll probably need to back that up with some credible word-of-mouth recommendations.

Your three past projects in the construction, restaurant and cleaning industries aren't particularly relevant to your intended clientele of freelancers and consultants. They don't sound immediately transferable to those businesses.

One other way to break into a crowded market would be to specialize. Pick an industry - or better still, a niche within an industry - and concentrate on that. Become an expert in the specific needs of that market and show your prospects you fully understand it. Explain why your tailor-made service would be better for them than any home-grown generalist.

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trent001

4 years ago

"One other way to break into a crowded market would be to specialize. Pick an industry - or better still, a niche within an industry - and concentrate on that. Become an expert in the specific needs of that market and show your prospects you fully understand it. Explain why your tailor-made service would be better for them than any home-grown generalist."

So how can I start doing this and get those first few customers? What would be your advice?

The reason why I picked the freelancer market is because freelancers always complain they can't get good rates on places like Upwork, and imo that\s because they lack credibility and proof, so if we build them a solid website that displays what they can do, that will lead to higher prices and make it easier to get more clients.

So if we want to get more specific, it is freelancers who are already making some sort of income and have past projects, and want to showcase that credibility more effectively.

Thanks
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DABK

4 years ago

My responses in bold below in bold.

Originally Posted by trent001

Hey, thank you DABK I'll try to answer your questions:

(1) Why would they not be relevant to you?
I'm not saying they wouldn't, I'm just not sure where to start? There are a lot of materials by those two and others like them.
Dan Kennedy's The Ultimate Marketing Plan (not an affiliate link) is a good place to start.

(2) What do you mean, people ask for too many testimonials?
As in, literarily everyone I've spoken to wants to see several past projects, and they seem very demanding or, if not, the prices they accept are very low.
How do they find you? Do you go after them? They find your facebook page? What's the info they see there? What's the next thing they do?

(3) You do not have credibility. Lots of testimonials would help with that?
Yes, I don't have credibility. I've got 3 projects I can show, but they're Russian websites from my immediate circle, in 3 different industries (construction, restaurant, and cleaning service). What can I do?
What's stopping you from creating 3 sample sites in English? Or, better yet, make a sample one per industry you approach. At the very least, it shows you can make them. You still have to convince them you can make them in time, without creating headaches.

But, it's best to position yourself better, where they ask you to work with them, not the other way around.

(4) What, exactly, do you sell: websites? websites that convert visitors into buyers? marketing systems?
So I want to sell websites to freelancers and consultants that showcase their full credibility and allow them to charge more from their clients, and of course get clients more easily. I've gone after both those who have websites already (but bad ones) and those who don't have websites. Maybe you should aim higher and only approach those that seem to be making good money? Lots of freelancers and consultants are broke. Or close to it. You need to have those sort themselves out and the ones that can afford you to stay. That is the job of your funnel. If you are getting only the ones that can pay little, your funnel and advertising/ marketing are to blame.

(5) Where and how do people find you?
They don't find me. I go after them. It's really hard to rank for SEO in terms of web design and related terms. So what I do is that I use automated messages on LinkedIn to connect with my target audience.

Why do you not make friends first? Why do you not post things they would find useful, comment on their posts? Yes, it is work. But it would get you better results. Also, why are you not being friendly on Facebook freelance and consultant groups?

(6) What's your funnel like?
So it's connection -> video message with Loom on their website about things that could be better, or why a website could help them get more clients -> follow-up -> if no answer I send them a free training illustrating what I can do with my Russian client, problem being the client isn't really in the same target audience. My goal is to get them on a call. So if they respond on Linkedin, I send them a link to book a time to discuss their specific situation, and if they dont respond, by the time I send the training, they will find a link to book a time there on the website after going through it.

Where is your website in all of this?

(7) When do you talk price?
On the sales call. Usually towards the end.

If they haggle at that point, you have not shown them that you give them value equal with their payment or they just cannot afford more.

Weed out the ones who cannot afford earlier, offer more value to the others.

(8) What credibility signs do you have on your landing pages? on your other pages?
The three testimonials translated from Russian.
Examples of work (3)
Results for one of the project (documented growth in clients/prices)

What is very frustrating is that from 200 videos or so created and sent, I only got 1 client, and that for a low price too :/

1 in 200, seeing that you get them through automated linkedin messages and your follow-up is not surprising.

You get credibility from publishing articles on LinkedIn, for instance. Well, you can, if the articles are good.bon your site too.

Show them you know what you are doing,.

By the way, what happens if they are not happy with your work? Is that info easy to find on your site?

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Kay King

4 years ago

That's not surprising - all else being equal, people will tend to prefer dealing with a service from their own country. Other than any language and cultural concerns, there's the simple matter of convenience to overcome.

My first thought was this: 'why do you feel you have to target western countries?'. Can you explain your reasoning for that?

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trent001 4 years ago

It's simple... the Russian market is much smaller. I could make it work, but why would I? I've gone to University in the States, my English is good (with a heavy accent, but nevertheless good), and I can hire web designers locally and export outside. People earn like $300-400/mo in Russia... and these are good designers that I could use. I can easily make nice profit margins if I can sell for $3-4K outside. I have what it takes to be successful, I just need to figure out a marketing strategy that works, at least that's what I think.
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- DWolfe 4 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by trent001
  
  It's simple... the Russian market is much smaller. I could make it work, but why would I? I've gone to University in the States,.
  
  Please use the Classic feature on the forum. Just high lite your name in the Black Bar. You will see a drop down block. One click your done. Then you can quote the specific individuals reply.
  
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  You can earn 10% average annual returns on your investments - https://app.groundfloor.us/r/m2aa7b
  
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max5ty

4 years ago

A lot of responses you should carefully consider...

my two cents -

look at why people don't want a website.

We've got a ton of website builders people can use for free. We've had every Tom, Dick, and Harry preaching everyone needs a website...now tons of them have been built and they sit empty. Lonely places where only a few dare to stop in. Desolate places full of empty dreams and lost opportunities.

So...

be different.

Tell me what I want to hear. I want you to tell me how your website is different. I want you to tell me how paying you for a website build is going to change my business. I want answers...

too lazy to look it up but I remember a couple of months ago reading how a major car rental company was taking their website builder to court for a million bucks because it didn't deliver (Hertz and Accenture?)

We have Google Business Profiles. We have Facebook Business Pages. What are you offering that makes it imperative I have a website?

Tell me something. Give me something that makes sense.

Don't think it's a "western" thing...think it's more of a "we've heard this line before" thing.

Also, just because you like doing something doesn't mean there's any money in it.

My grandma loves to knit those things you put under your lamp on the end table...but nobody uses them anymore except a couple of old ladies at her church. Ok, that's not a conversation I'm going into great detail with her because it wouldn't do any good...but it's an example of what isn't working.

Have you looked into offering Google Business Profiles first...and then showing them how a website compliments it?

Have you explained to them how having a simple page that makes people opt-in for something will continue to bring them new customers?

Myself, I would suggest you step back and look at a new approach

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trent001 4 years ago

So I'm 100% happy to share how I've tried to approach this niche. People fall into two categories...

Freelancers on LinkedIn without a website who are 2nd degree connections -> I send them a video on their profile, where I basically ask them if they have been thinking about ways to charge their customers more, so they can either work less for the same money and have more free time, or make more money for themselves. I then tell them that I noticed they don't have a website, and an important factor when people make decisions if to work with them or not is credibility, and that they will google them, etc. and they may find their LinkedIn profile, but that often isn't enough. People who show they've invested into their reputation are more trustworthy, can charge more and can get work more easily. Then I ask them if they'd be interested to discuss the possibiltiy of getting a website built for them, and if they say yes, then I send them a link to book.

Freelancers on LinkedIn also 2nd degree WITH a bad website -> I go on video on their website, and typically start by congratulating them on something. For ex, congrats on being a freelancer for the past 3 years, most people don't last that long yadda yadda. Then I say that I noticed they have a website, and nowadays clients look for certain credibility markers on the website, and for them, some are missing. I go through what is missing, and I ask them if they'd be interested in having the problem taken care of for them.

Most don't answer after like 3-4 messages of follow up. Those who do, most by far are no's. There are a couple who are extremely offended that I'm pitching them something, and tell me I shouldnt use linkedin for that. And then there are a couple who want to find out more or schedule a call.
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max5ty

4 years ago

@trent001 -

You may not like my answer...I'm a little old-fashioned when it comes to business...

Have you built a website for yourself that brought in a lot of money and was successful? You say you can...why not do it for yourself?

Myself, and I'm sure everyone on Linkedin gets bombarded with people wanting to show us how to make more money.

Have you done it?

If not, why wouldn't you put together a website and show everyone how you do it?

Today you could build a website "Plumbers In Moscow" and start collecting leads.

Leaky sink? We have 24-hour service...call 000-000-0000.

you then sell those leads to plumbers, electricians, house sitters, dog walkers, mechanics, now you have the documented proof you can get results.

Or, put together a website and sell something. Once it's successful, you've got proof. There are so many things you can sell these days that it's ridiculous.

I know not everyone has a lot of money to start...but if you need to, get a job until you can buy an $8 domain name and a $10 a month website.

Too many people want to use other people's money to practice their skills. We don't want to pay for someone to practice...we want results.

Once you've got a record of success, you don't need to waste your time with all the outbound marketing...you'll have people looking you up.

This may surprise you, but I've found that when people take the skills they have and use them for themselves to profit...they usually end up not bothering with trying to sell others on their skills...but of course, everyone is different.

I do congratulate you though on at least getting out there and wanting to do something. You're a step ahead of a lot of people. Just stop and think of how you're being perceived when you approach business owners

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trent001

4 years ago

Originally Posted by max5ty

@trent001 -

You may not like my answer...I'm a little old-fashioned when it comes to business...

Have you built a website for yourself that brought in a lot of money and was successful? You say you can...why not do it for yourself?

I'm not sure I follow you here. Yes, I have built my own website and 3 others for clients. These are not the kind of websites I'm trying to sell though, apart from, perhaps, my own.

The question is if I build a solution for their problems, is it not? Their problem, if they don't have a website, is that they lack a way to showcase their credibility to potential clients, and therefore make it harder to land clients, and harder to charge more. And if they do have a website, their problem is that it's outdated OR it doesn't properly showcase their credibility (for example, no testimonials, headline is confusing, etc.)

So how can these websites "bring a lot of money"? They are not meant to "bring a lot of money" by themselves. I mean, if you don't drive traffic to them, there will be no money made from them. But if you reach out to your client, and they ask if you have a website, you can say yes, here it is, and you can also see some of my past work and projects. In that way, yes it does make money.

Originally Posted by max5ty

Myself, and I'm sure everyone on Linkedin gets bombarded with people wanting to show us how to make more money.

Have you done it?

If not, why wouldn't you put together a website and show everyone how you do it?

Today you could build a website "Plumbers In Moscow" and start collecting leads.

Leaky sink? We have 24-hour service...call 000-000-0000.

you then sell those leads to plumbers, electricians, house sitters, dog walkers, mechanics, now you have the documented proof you can get results.

Or, put together a website and sell something. Once it's successful, you've got proof. There are so many things you can sell these days that it's ridiculous.

I know not everyone has a lot of money to start...but if you need to, get a job until you can buy an $8 domain name and a $10 a month website.

Too many people want to use other people's money to practice their skills. We don't want to pay for someone to practice...we want results.

Once you've got a record of success, you don't need to waste your time with all the outbound marketing...you'll have people looking you up.

This may surprise you, but I've found that when people take the skills they have and use them for themselves to profit...they usually end up not bothering with trying to sell others on their skills...but of course, everyone is different.

Doing such things wouldn't be a problem, except that this is a different business. I'm not doing lead gen for service businesses where I get a listing up, rank it to the top and then wire up a phone number to transfer leads to a particular provider. So sure, I could do this, but to what end? It's a different business. Are you suggesting that I should change my business from web design agency to lead gen?

Originally Posted by max5ty

I do congratulate you though on at least getting out there and wanting to do something. You're a step ahead of a lot of people. Just stop and think of how you're being perceived when you approach business owners

Thank you!

Thanks

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Johnny12345

4 years ago

Trent,

You're selling websites. The problem is, nobody really wants a website. Just as someone who buys an electric drill doesn't really want a drill -- they want HOLES.

It seems that you're probably focusing on selling features (the thing), instead of the benefit (what it will do for them).

And that's a problem.

ALL businesses want more customers. Hold that thought in your mind. Because that is the key to it all. You need to sell powerful marketing machines -- NOT websites.

That means, you're going to need good SALES COPY and content. Why?

Because a website is like a drinking glass. All the glass does is hold the beverage. But the beverage is the star.

So -- in my opinion -- if you're going to sell websites (instead of leads), here's what you need to do:

1) You need to have (at least) a small -- but really good -- portfolio of websites. Nice websites. If you're selling in the United States, they MUST have sales copy and content that is in perfect English. (Mistakes that seem small to a native Russian speaker will stick out to US natives.)

2) You need to explain to your prospective clients how the websites you build will help them bring in more customers (that's ALL they care about).

Sales copy and content are what sell -- not super-fancy website design. You could also include a squeeze page and freebie for that business (so they can capture leads and get more customers).

Again, that's what they care about.

In a nutshell...

Don't give them a website. Give them a MARKETING MACHINE that captures leads and helps them sell more of their stuff.

3) You need a website for your business. (Otherwise, you're like a Michelin star chef who doesn't eat his own food.)

4) You need to drive traffic to your website. That can be PPC traffic (always TEST on a SMALL SCALE first!) or SEO (content marketing) traffic. Then, you need to capture the lead and sell them. Give them a helpful freebie in exchange for their email address so you can get leads. (Then, BOTH be helpful... and also sell your service.)

Finally, you need to explain to them why you are a BETTER CHOICE than the other web designers out there. In other words, what is your competitive advantage? You need to make them an irresistible offer and demonstrate your expertise.

To do that, you can -- for example -- include BONUSES (like the opt-in form and freebie I mentioned). People like to get something extra for free. That's how you SELL.

Do those 4 things -- and DO THEM WELL -- and your chances of success will significantly improve.

(Sorry if my comments seemed at all blunt. I'm just trying to help you succeed.)

Good Luck!

John

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trent001

4 years ago

Originally Posted by Johnny12345

Trent,

You're selling websites. The problem is, nobody really wants a website. Just as someone who buys an electric drill doesn't really want a drill -- they want HOLES.

It seems that you're probably focusing on selling features (the thing), instead of the benefit (what it will do for them).

And that's a problem.

ALL businesses want more customers. Hold that thought in your mind. Because that is the key to it all. You need to sell powerful marketing machines -- NOT websites.

That means, you're going to need good SALES COPY and content. Why?

Because a website is like a drinking glass. All the glass does is hold the beverage. But the beverage is the star.

So -- in my opinion -- if you're going to sell websites (instead of leads), here's what you need to do:

1) You need to have (at least) a small -- but really good -- portfolio of websites. Nice websites. If you're selling in the United States, they MUST have sales copy and content that is in perfect English. (Mistakes that seem small to a native Russian speaker will stick out to US natives.)

2) You need to explain to your prospective clients how the websites you build will help them bring in more customers (that's ALL they care about).

Sales copy and content are what sell -- not super-fancy website design. You could also include a squeeze page and freebie for that business (so they can capture leads and get more customers).

Again, that's what they care about.

In a nutshell...

Don't give them a website. Give them a MARKETING MACHINE that captures leads and helps them sell more of their stuff.

3) You need a website for your business. (Otherwise, you're like a Michelin star chef who doesn't eat his own food.)

4) You need to drive traffic to your website. That can be PPC traffic (always TEST on a SMALL SCALE first!) or SEO (content marketing) traffic. Then, you need to capture the lead and sell them. Give them a helpful freebie in exchange for their email address so you can get leads. (Then, BOTH be helpful... and also sell your service.)

Finally, you need to explain to them why you are a BETTER CHOICE than the other web designers out there. In other words, what is your competitive advantage? You need to make them an irresistible offer and demonstrate your expertise.

To do that, you can -- for example -- include BONUSES (like the opt-in form and freebie I mentioned). People like to get something extra for free. That's how you SELL.

Do those 4 things -- and DO THEM WELL -- and your chances of success will significantly improve.

(Sorry if my comments seemed at all blunt. I'm just trying to help you succeed.)

Good Luck!

John

Hey, sorry if I'm misunderstanding you...

I don't feel like I'm selling them websites at all. I'm selling them a solution to a problem.

Problem: Can't charge clients higher prices OR too difficult to convince a client to buy

I've spoken with a few freelancers, and these, literarily, seem to be their biggest problems. Now what's the source of their problems? Their clients don't trust them right? They have low credibility. So the only clients they get is off Upwork and similar sites.

Solution: Have a website which properly displays your credibility... clear USP in your headline, clear CTA + lead magnet, portfolio pieces, testimonials, significant achievements, automated billing (clients pay you thru website), and so on.

So I don't see how I'm selling a drill... Seems to me like I'm selling holes. Also, do you feel my English has any issues, in terms of copy?

1) I do have 4 (and soon they'll be 5) websites in my portfolio.
2) I feel I do that already?
3) Yep, I do have one.
4) Ok, I think you're correct here, I don't really have traffic except from LinkedIn outreach atm. Do you suggest I try to run some Google ads?

Thanks
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Johnny12345

4 years ago

Originally Posted by trent001

So I don't see how I'm selling a drill... Seems to me like I'm selling holes. Also, do you feel my English has any issues, in terms of copy?

1) I do have 4 (and soon they'll be 5) websites in my portfolio.
2) I feel I do that already?
3) Yep, I do have one.
4) Ok, I think you're correct here, I don't really have traffic except from LinkedIn outreach atm. Do you suggest I try to run some Google ads?

Trent,

So, you're saying you are doing everything right, but you still have no sales.

That math does not add up.

Remember, I said you have to do all 4 things -- and DO THEM WELL.

But, let's assume you are correct. (I hope you are.)

In that case, either your traffic source is poor (it is), and/or your sales pitch is falling flat.

So, choose a better traffic source and split-test your sales copy.

If you're doing everything else correctly -- problem solved.

Warning: If you're new to PPC traffic, take the advice I gave you. TEST ON A SMALL SCALE until you have a winning ad. PPC, in the wrong hands, can burn cash rapidly.

A SAFER approach would be to use content marketing. It's typically much slower, but it can work very well. It's also free.

Best,

John

P.S. You mentioned Russia, so I almost automatically cautioned to watch for mistakes in English. (Note: The second sentence in your original post caught my eye. But you were probably just rushing. No biggy. I've done it, too.)

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savidge4

4 years ago

Originally Posted by trent001

Problem: Can't charge clients higher prices OR too difficult to convince a client to buy

If you are having to "Convince" then what you have done before that point isnt working. You are communicating with a poorly targeted prospect, OR you have not developed enough trust. Its that simple.

Platforms remove those things, This is exactly why there are "talented" people on them, because they do not understand the dynamics of selling.

I am pretty certain unlike everyone else here, I sell websites to business' that do not have one. there are simply more business' without than there are ones with one. Selling to companies that has websites is just a numbers game, and being the at the right place at the right time.

Selling to a business without a site... its more complicated. You have to have the ability to demonstrate how a website will increase business. HOW specifically will the investment create a return.

You have a website right? ( yes you do, you have answered that ) How exactly has that website made you money? It hasnt correct? BUT lets just say it has, You built a website for yourself, you implemented this and that and the other, and over the course of X days, or X weeks or X years, you have increased your business Z fold. THAT is a testimonial. You right now have a portfolio of sites that you cant do this with - except your own, and being blunt, your own site aint getting you no work.

So what is a guy to do? Notice above I did not speak of "Testimonies" I said "Demonstrate". I personally leverage Google maps to do this. you can see a rough idea of that here ( https://www.warriorforum.com/main-in...l#post11687801 )

The issue then is how do you do this in the States, and you are in Russia, and the simple answer is YOU CANT, Unless, you get work where you live.

That leaves you again with Testimonials.

Lets use fishing as a analogy shall we. You want to go out and fish for whales. but you have no whale bait. So you need to start with a net and catch a minnow, you then hook the minnow and catch a bigger fish, and then use that to catch an even bigger fish, and then again and again, until you have Whale worthy bait.

Your just starting ( and congrats on that BTW ) you have to have patience, you are not ready for your ideal client, you have to build up to get there. In the meantime you have to find low level jobs that match in build principle ( form and function ) to those of your ideal Whale client.

A portfolio full of websites unlike what you are trying to sell is like an artist painting blue images and trying to sell to clients that want red. Your "Portfolio" needs to match what it is you are trying to sell. Your testimonials have to be relatable to the clients you are trying to sell to.

Technically, you dont have a portfolio at this point. All you have is YOUR website that obviously is not getting YOU business, and you are trying to sell websites to business' to GET business. Do you see how this is broken?

The minute you are trying to "Sell" and you are having to "Convince", you didnt sell enough. You have not crossed that line where they understand whats in it for them, and that you have the ability to provide that - TRUST

Stop trying to sell $2500 websites... your not there yet. Sell $600 sites, and master the craft of building a site that becomes an asset for the site owner ( it produces leads and sales ) and as YOU get better, THEN you can charge more... PATIENCE

YOUR business development is NOT a NOW thing.... its about building a reputation, and that simply takes time. Without putting in the time, you will be yet another talent on a platform shrugging their shoulders

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trent001

4 years ago

Originally Posted by savidge4

If you are having to "Convince" then what you have done before that point isnt working. You are communicating with a poorly targeted prospect, OR you have not developed enough trust. Its that simple.

Platforms remove those things, This is exactly why there are "talented" people on them, because they do not understand the dynamics of selling.

I am pretty certain unlike everyone else here, I sell websites to business' that do not have one. there are simply more business' without than there are ones with one. Selling to companies that has websites is just a numbers game, and being the at the right place at the right time.

Selling to a business without a site... its more complicated. You have to have the ability to demonstrate how a website will increase business. HOW specifically will the investment create a return.

You have a website right? ( yes you do, you have answered that ) How exactly has that website made you money? It hasnt correct? BUT lets just say it has, You built a website for yourself, you implemented this and that and the other, and over the course of X days, or X weeks or X years, you have increased your business Z fold. THAT is a testimonial. You right now have a portfolio of sites that you cant do this with - except your own, and being blunt, your own site aint getting you no work.

So what is a guy to do? Notice above I did not speak of "Testimonies" I said "Demonstrate". I personally leverage Google maps to do this. you can see a rough idea of that here ( https://www.warriorforum.com/main-in...l#post11687801 )

The issue then is how do you do this in the States, and you are in Russia, and the simple answer is YOU CANT, Unless, you get work where you live.

That leaves you again with Testimonials.

Lets use fishing as a analogy shall we. You want to go out and fish for whales. but you have no whale bait. So you need to start with a net and catch a minnow, you then hook the minnow and catch a bigger fish, and then use that to catch an even bigger fish, and then again and again, until you have Whale worthy bait.

Your just starting ( and congrats on that BTW ) you have to have patience, you are not ready for your ideal client, you have to build up to get there. In the meantime you have to find low level jobs that match in build principle ( form and function ) to those of your ideal Whale client.

A portfolio full of websites unlike what you are trying to sell is like an artist painting blue images and trying to sell to clients that want red. Your "Portfolio" needs to match what it is you are trying to sell. Your testimonials have to be relatable to the clients you are trying to sell to.

Makes sense... so you recommend that I work for lower prices to build the portfolio. It makes sense, it even works as a justification for the lower price, so they don't assume bad quality.

Originally Posted by savidge4

Technically, you dont have a portfolio at this point. All you have is YOUR website that obviously is not getting YOU business, and you are trying to sell websites to business' to GET business. Do you see how this is broken?

On the one hand sure, but then my clients don't know that do they? I never understood when people say these things in sales, because it's not like the client knows if your website is getting you business or not. I have a friend here who owns a Google ads business, and if you see his website, you wouldn't think he has any clients... it's literarily a headline + contact form. But he is always fully booked.

Originally Posted by savidge4

Stop trying to sell $2500 websites... your not there yet. Sell $600 sites, and master the craft of building a site that becomes an asset for the site owner ( it produces leads and sales ) and as YOU get better, THEN you can charge more... PATIENCE

YOUR business development is NOT a NOW thing.... its about building a reputation, and that simply takes time. Without putting in the time, you will be yet another talent on a platform shrugging their shoulders

Makes sense, thank you!

Thanks
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savidge4

4 years ago

Originally Posted by trent001

because it's not like the client knows if your website is getting you business or not.

Of all the people you have contacted, what percentage of those have you given your link to your website ( verbally or in e-mail etc )? I am going to guess if not 100% then damn close to it. In your instance a website is PROOF that you will have the ability to deliver, what it is you are communicating to them. It is beyond clear from my seat right now, that is not happening - or you would have not made this post.

YOUR website is a TOOL. Once you have a potential client on the phone, they, A) should have looked at your site already, or B) be instructed to do so. YOUR website is the physical proof of concept. That website is the last mile of the sales pitch, it is the tool that pushes the level of trust over the top for them to say "Yes". Anything less and your site is failing you, YOU should know that, and THEY do know that. The potential client damn well knows your site sucks or is awesome, and if it has the ability to perform as you are presenting. And again, it is very clear yours does not. So YES they know if your site is getting business or not.

There are specifically 4 things a website should do.

Get visitors through the door
Get people to call
Get people to buy / fill out a contact form
Give information for one of the first 3 to happen

Nothing less, and nothing more. Notice #4 states "Give information for one of the first 3 to happen" This is VERY important. Depending on the business, you want ONE of those 3 to happen - and ONLY ONE. If in any instance it requires one to get to the other, a phone call to see if the store is open, being a good example, the website has FAILED.

There are 6 questions that a website must answer. Who What Where Why When and How ( my 5 w's and an H rule )

In YOUR case Who you are, What you do, Where you went to school, Where the website will be hosted ( hopefully not Russia ) and physically where you are at. Why would they need to use your services. When can they expect a finished product. And lastly How, this can be a number of things, in your case with Wordpress or whatever you may be using.

Originally Posted by trent001

I have a friend here who owns a Google ads business, and if you see his website, you wouldn't think he has any clients... it's literarily a headline + contact form. But he is always fully booked.

That is called a landing page... The potential client was linked here from another page first, or is coming from an e-mail. That other page or that e-mail did all of the sales for him, His "Website" is just cementing the deal. Because the guy sells ads, the expectation that there is just an opt-in on that pages is expected from the end user, and it works. You could use some lessons from that guy.

You WANT to build websites, but you fundamentally do not understand how they should work, and what exactly they should do. You have a lot of learning to do. Coding is easy, but getting that code to invoke a physical action... Now thats the stuff legends are made of. Walk in the Store, Pick up the Phone, or pull out your credit card

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Oct356

4 years ago

I had a similar situarion recently. I have a major education and workout experience from serial of the highest ranking employers in my industry. Now I was starting my own studio, and I wanted to work with a certain wealthy clientele. However, I still needed testimonials from my intended client peers!

So what I did, is to identify a couple of them with big networks and followings, and offer my services dirt cheap.
I made them a tailored offer, based on what info I could digg up on their situation and likely needs. packaged this as an immense value stack, but still priced so I cover my actuall costs. When closing I pointed out that the deal came with the obligation to be used in my marketing, this was also in the contract.

Obviously I went way beyond, and gave an exceptional service. I ended up with raving fans who actively market me to their b2b relations of similar people. My first referred client covered all my costs with this approach, highly recommend it.

If this somehow is impossible for you, I would do some made up websites for imaginary businesses, that your ideal client can relate to.

In regards to you being Russian, I would actually put in the effort to develop a British or European accent. This is meant in the best of ways, so don't take this the wrong way. People automatically trust you more, if they associate you with something reputable and trustworthy. What isn't better than a high end British consultant? Trustworthy an reputable.

Also, where do I hire good Russian designers?

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trent001

4 years ago

Originally Posted by Oct356

I had a similar situarion recently. I have a major education and workout experience from serial of the highest ranking employers in my industry. Now I was starting my own studio, and I wanted to work with a certain wealthy clientele. However, I still needed testimonials from my intended client peers!

So what I did, is to identify a couple of them with big networks and followings, and offer my services dirt cheap.
I made them a tailored offer, based on what info I could digg up on their situation and likely needs. packaged this as an immense value stack, but still priced so I cover my actuall costs. When closing I pointed out that the deal came with the obligation to be used in my marketing, this was also in the contract.

Obviously I went way beyond, and gave an exceptional service. I ended up with raving fans who actively market me to their b2b relations of similar people. My first referred client covered all my costs with this approach, highly recommend it.

If this somehow is impossible for you, I would do some made up websites for imaginary businesses, that your ideal client can relate to.

In regards to you being Russian, I would actually put in the effort to develop a British or European accent. This is meant in the best of ways, so don't take this the wrong way. People automatically trust you more, if they associate you with something reputable and trustworthy. What isn't better than a high end British consultant? Trustworthy an reputable.

Also, where do I hire good Russian designers?

Wow this is a very smart strategy... I will have to research if there are any influencers that I can link up with, present the concept for them and do one website for free even, and build case studies based on the work I do for them.

Regarding Russian designers. The way I've linked with a few is by going to local universities here, and asking around. In your case if you're not from Russia, I guess places like Upwork are your best bet.

Thanks

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Jason Kanigan

4 years ago

Originally Posted by trent001

Hey fellow warriors,

I've started a new web design firm and since I'm based in Russia, I struggle to get clients in the West.

People ask for too many testimonials, websites and still struggle to pull the trigger. They also hag on the price a lot.

Any books to recommend? I know there are a lot of great books by authors like Dan Kennedy, Jay Abraham and so on for marketing, but I'm not sure what will be most relevant for my situation and where to start? I already have sales training in the past, and also through books like SPIN Selling and Challenger Sale...

Thank you

It's not about sales. FILTER.

"Have you ever hired an outside consultant before?"

"Do you have any feelings or impressions about hiring a consultant/designer outside of North America?"

"Are there any circumstances in which you'd consider hiring a web designer from outside of the US?"

The answers to these questions are far more important than any technical expertise you have.

Filter for people who are already comfortable with the idea of hiring a contractor from outside the US. People who have done it before and even hire frequently.

If you have an Upwork profile I'd use that. It gives a feeling of certainty.

Another option is to filter for business owners/potential clients who are from other countries and now live in the US. I work with a Ukranian who lives here and he is always trying to rope in Ukranian contractors somehow.

Filtering for the right kind of prosective client is far more impactful than desperately trying to convince them of how technically competent and safe you are.

You could even prep a FAQ pdf on the subject, or shoot a short video addressing the issue. "Here are questions we get all the time..." and if you can get client quotes to use in answer even better.

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DABK

4 years ago

This deserves more than one thanks: getting the right people to contact (or to contact you) is half the battle.

Saves lots of time.

Silly example to make it extra clear:
You sell bracelets and I never wore or bought a bracelet and do not intend to start now.

No matter how pretty your bracelets, how many testimonials you have, what great sales lettter, how great website, I am not buying. Your offer should not come my way. It's pure waste of time.

It would be worse if I did sometime buy but far cheaper or far different bracelets and engage with you because there's a 2% chance I might think I might buy. Then, I waste your time not just your funnel / ads.

You should not even talk to people who are not likely buyers... Your funnels / articles, etc. should be the only things involved till they're about to buy.

Originally Posted by Jason Kanigan

It's not about sales. FILTER.

"Have you ever hired an outside consultant before?"

"Do you have any feelings or impressions about hiring a consultant/designer outside of North America?"

"Are there any circumstances in which you'd consider hiring a web designer from outside of the US?"

The answers to these questions are far more important than any technical expertise you have.

Filter for people who are already comfortable with the idea of hiring a contractor from outside the US. People who have done it before and even hire frequently.

If you have an Upwork profile I'd use that. It gives a feeling of certainty.

Another option is to filter for business owners/potential clients who are from other countries and now live in the US. I work with a Ukranian who lives here and he is always trying to rope in Ukranian contractors somehow.

Filtering for the right kind of prosective client is far more impactful than desperately trying to convince them of how technically competent and safe you are.

You could even prep a FAQ pdf on the subject, or shoot a short video addressing the issue. "Here are questions we get all the time..." and if you can get client quotes to use in answer even better.

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trent001

4 years ago

Originally Posted by Jason Kanigan

It's not about sales. FILTER.

"Have you ever hired an outside consultant before?"

"Do you have any feelings or impressions about hiring a consultant/designer outside of North America?"

"Are there any circumstances in which you'd consider hiring a web designer from outside of the US?"

The answers to these questions are far more important than any technical expertise you have.

Filter for people who are already comfortable with the idea of hiring a contractor from outside the US. People who have done it before and even hire frequently.

Thank you, this seems to be very useful, would save me a ton of time. Would you recommend that I ask them this question straight up, upon connecting with them on LinkedIn, before sending them any other messages?

Thanks
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Jason Kanigan

4 years ago

Originally Posted by trent001

Thank you, this seems to be very useful, would save me a ton of time. Would you recommend that I ask them this question straight up, upon connecting with them on LinkedIn, before sending them any other messages?

You're going to have to learn how to start a conversation.

In sales, most starters are so bad there is no "rest of the call".

On LI I have found two or three sentences as a starter works. The "data dump" of who you are and what you do does not go over well--they'll never read it.

Put yourself in their headspace. What would stand out?

"Thanks for connecting--I help this type of person with this pain point--but I don't know if that's something you're concerned about?"

Some type of opener with this structure. You can test various things, client types and pain points, but I would run with one same thing for at least a month so you can get real data and feedback.

Those who respond will give you opportunities to use those questions I provided above.

I'm not just going to give you a full sales process, an extremely valuable asset, for free but this is a beginning.

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DABK

4 years ago

Me, I would ask that after I asked them about their pain points.

Are you losing clients because you can't show them your past projects?

I help freelancers all over the United States showcase their accomplishments. I am a Russian-based web designer.

If you want a website that helps you make more sales, call me.

That kind of thing. You can just mention the Russian part or lay it thick. Based on the results you get.

Originally Posted by trent001

Thank you, this seems to be very useful, would save me a ton of time. Would you recommend that I ask them this question straight up, upon connecting with them on LinkedIn, before sending them any other messages?

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trent001

4 years ago

Originally Posted by DABK

Me, I would ask that after I asked them about their pain points.

Are you losing clients because you can't show them your past projects?

I help freelancers all over the United States showcase their accomplishments. I am a Russian-based web designer.

If you want a website that helps you make more sales, call me.

That kind of thing. You can just mention the Russian part or lay it thick. Based on the results you get.

Nice thank you. Appreciate all the help you guys have been giving me, means a lot. After the holidays I will restart going after them. Should my first area of focus be this direct sales thing, or shall I do this, but put my main focus on the positioning aspect we were discussing earlier in the thread?

By the way, I've started the Dan Kennedy book you recommended and I'm enjoying it. I do feel differentiation is key here because there are so many people who can make websites...

Thanks
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Jason Kanigan

4 years ago

Originally Posted by trent001

Nice thank you. Appreciate all the help you guys have been giving me, means a lot. After the holidays I will restart going after them. Should my first area of focus be this direct sales thing, or shall I do this, but put my main focus on the positioning aspect we were discussing earlier in the thread?

By the way, I've started the Dan Kennedy book you recommended and I'm enjoying it. I do feel differentiation is key here because there are so many people who can make websites...

"Should I do the things you guys suggested... or should I do something else?"

Last month a guy reached out to me on LI about health insurance specifically for business owners. I had a conversation with him, did a bit of due diligence and saw it was a good package, and bought. Did I care that he was differentiated? No. I cared that he was THERE when I needed it.

Timing is important. And for timing to work for you, you must be consistently doing outbound lead generation behaviors.

Get conversations with qualified prospects and you will make sales.

Anything else right now is a distraction.

Get good at starting conversations. DABK pretty much said the same thing I did.

Thanks
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DABK 4 years ago

Yes, DABK said the same thing, emphasizing (but the bold-lettered text was not bold in the final form) that I would start with their pain point, throw in the Russian part right after.

Starting with the Russian part creates waste, in my opinion. Putting it farther down creates waste too.

Also, it is important. It bears repeating.

Thanks,

Originally Posted by Jason Kanigan

Get good at starting conversations. DABK pretty much said the same thing I did.
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AmandaDMosley

Banned 4 years ago

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DABK 4 years ago

No? Really? Who'd have thunk it?

I know you're new, but if you are not after wasting your time, posts like this will not get you anywhere.

I am being helpful, not mean. Ask anybody who's had success on a forum.

Originally Posted by AmandaDMosley

Hello, you can search it online on google search.
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