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Unread 15th Jan 2010, 09:15 PM   #201
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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Hi AP,

Thank you for all of your posts!

I just landed a lawyer as a client and on the mindmap that I used for the presentation, I wrote that I'll train their secretary to properly answer incoming phone calls.

The only problem is ... I don't know what type of script to train her with!

Ooops!

Will the resources you post on Monday contain information on this?

Is the focus of your script to get someone to opt into their newsletter or special report on their website?

Sorry for putting you on the spot.

I think you gave me a little too much confidence. =)

Thanks again!
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Unread 15th Jan 2010, 10:44 PM   #202
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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Originally Posted by AP View Post


Would you like to know how to Position yourself Out of State?
Originally Posted by entrepenerd View Post

Yes, please
Agreed.

"You can have everything in life you want if you will just help enough other people get what they want."
~ Zig Ziglar
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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 06:29 AM   #203
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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I am very curious about landing page or website setup.

I am developing some postals (printing and sending them next week) but I am having difficulties choosing the correct setup for website. Have sales copy, video, PDF offer, etc etc.

Any tips from you guys?

People make good money selling to the rich. But the rich got rich selling to the masses.
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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 10:46 AM   #204
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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AP,

Time and again I've seen long winded discussions like this end up in a WSO.

So, I ask you, is this leading to a WSO? Aside from that, why would someone who makes $600,000 a year ($50K a month) do a WSO or even spend time spilling the beans here?

Just wondering.

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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 11:43 AM   #205
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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Comments in Blue.

Originally Posted by greff View Post

AP,

Time and again I've seen long winded discussions like this end up in a WSO.

So, I ask you, is this leading to a WSO?

NO.

Aside from that, why would someone who makes $600,000 a year ($50K a month) do a WSO

You would have to ask David Preston, Willie Crawford, and many others why they do WSO's.

What WSO? If I ever did come out with a WSO, don't buy it.

Have you seen all the crap WSO's here lately? I would charge $997 for my WSO if I had one, and that would be a STEAL.

Would I come out with a WSO and give out the valuable info I've given already? Shouldn't I save the best?

or even spend time spilling the beans here?

Only a Poverty mentality would make that statement. An Abundance Mentality understands there is so much business out there it's Unbelievable.

It doesn't hurt to Pay it forward. I can get members started down the right path.

I have less than 40 clients, and there are Millions of businesses in the US alone.


600k is not a lot of money. I made over 700k in 2000, and have yet to get back to that level (I've been lazy), so I feel I'm still trying to get back to where I was 10 years ago. 600k may may be a lot to you, but not me. Ask Frank Kern, Mike Filsaime, Eben Pagan, Russell Brunson, how they would feel if they made 600k.

A little disappointed, wouldn't you say. Ya think they're any smarter than me? :confused:

Just wondering.

Do you believe the info I have given here is valuable?

If so, why question it? It's FREE. Take it for what it is.

Learn as much as you can. I've studied the best of the best. Paid hundreds of thousands over the last 30 years from the Top people in the industry.

Gary Halbert, Dan Kennedy, Rich Schefren, Ken McCarthy, Jay Abraham, and countless others.


If it will make you Happy, I will STOP posting.
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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 11:52 AM   #206
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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Originally Posted by greff View Post

Aside from that, why would someone who makes $600,000 a year ($50K a month) do a WSO or even spend time spilling the beans here?

Just wondering.
Well he's not doing a WSO, so that eliminates the first question, but the second part is what MORE successful people SHOULD be doing...passing along their knowledge to help others.

Sometimes people can feel good providing helpful information without charging for it...I think the problem with society is everyone changing into this "Whats In It For Me" attitude...even when helping charities!

You get what you give in the end.
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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 12:19 PM   #207
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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Dexx, AP, one question:

It's all about positioning, right?

What about website style, positioning?

Corporate?

People make good money selling to the rich. But the rich got rich selling to the masses.
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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 12:29 PM   #208
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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AP is a Perry Marshall follower, or was. Helping others with no agenda is something he teaches and practices.

Why do any of the successful marketers share and help others here? Because it is the right thing to do for people of a certain caliber, (and a rare caliber at that. Instead of being paranoid that he might somehow make you buy something (that would make you successful) try taking what he says at face value and use what you can to help your business... and pass it on at such time as you run into someone that would be helped by that information.

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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 01:07 PM   #209
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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AP

I just have to respond too. It's Saturday and I've spent more hours on this thread. I, for one, am so grateful for your posts. And I'm sure so many are. Usually there are over 1000 online here? .... I was just thinking... if they are missing this thread, they're missing a lot.

Thanks for the giving. Just thank you. thank you. thank you.

I have lots of hope, still. And it's posts like this, (although this one is pure gold), from guys like you, who probably make more differences in lives than you'll ever realize.

It takes a lot of work but I'm here to work and to learn. How can we learn here without the teachers like yourself who are so generous.

It will come back to you, I'm sure. Thanks again from a late boomer bloomer. (not late to sales or marketing or experience...but maybe some new success....and I hope to follow the giving-ness too.) and when I do, I'll be here first thing...
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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 03:47 PM   #210
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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Originally Posted by Ghalt View Post

@AP and others

What do you DO for $1497 each month? What value am I, as a customer, getting each month?

I know that for organic rankings it takes time to build...so if you promise a set of, say, 5 keywords to get them ranked for the top, then obviously they won't be ranked the first month.

So how much effort/what activities does each client get each month for that money?
I guess the more importantly the question is what do you want for $1497 each month? I mean, do you want 100 phone calls? Do you want 5 new client ? Do you want 1000 new website visitors?

If someone is paying $1500 per month for services, there are a huge number of services that can be rendered. For example, depending on a keyword you can rank the clients website high and have enough revenue to invest time and resources into measuring and monitoring conversion for that website.

If that fee is invested monthly for period of time, such as six months or more, one could have their clients' website ranking number one all over the Internet for many keywords, have a website that converts well with a call to action, and ultimately makes the business owner profitable with his investment into Internet marketing services.

If that were the case, the marketing expert would invest a great deal of time and effort or resources into creating and distributing quality content throughout the Internet. The over time ultimately results in rankings and in turn more business.

The level of activity is typically that trade secret of the expert, however as long as the expert's expectations are aligned with the client, the activity isn't important, it's the end result.

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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 03:57 PM   #211
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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Originally Posted by scottgallagher View Post

I guess the more importantly the question is what do you want for $1497 each month? I mean, do you want 100 phone calls? Do you want 5 new client ? Do you want 1000 new website visitors?

If someone is paying $1500 per month for services, there are a huge number of services that can be rendered. For example, depending on a keyword you can rank the clients website high and have enough revenue to invest time and resources into measuring and monitoring conversion for that website.

If that fee is invested monthly for period of time, such as six months or more, one could have their clients' website ranking number one all over the Internet for many keywords, have a website that converts well with a call to action, and ultimately makes the business owner profitable with his investment into Internet marketing services.

If that were the case, the marketing expert would invest a great deal of time and effort or resources into creating and distributing quality content throughout the Internet. The over time ultimately results in rankings and in turn more business.

The level of activity is typically that trade secret of the expert, however as long as the expert's expectations are aligned with the client, the activity isn't important, it's the end result.
I believe that as AP is stating it, the $1495 per month is the 'consuting' fee, which just covers the ideas, help, strategy, implementation, training, set up, etc.

Anything else like the cost of SEO, web design, copywriting, PPC, newsletters, and so on would be an additional cost separate from the $1495 consulting fee.

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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 07:52 PM   #212
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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I need help !!!!

Just starting out in the offline area and Ive found myself in a lucky position from getting a whack of ref's from my first job (which was for a friend).

Ive done 4 consults at $200 each for an hour. I just started talking about what I did for the other co. (All these people are in the same building) - went into Adwords keyword tool and gave them a lesson on keywords and the importance of them and how people find you, targeted prospects etc... And the time was up just as I started going.

To me, I feel I didnt provide anything at all. Yet, each one of them told me Ive given them way more than their $200 worth.

However, these people dont have the $$ to give me $5k upfront and $1500 a month.

But... 2 of them asked me back for another 1/2 hour consult for $100 and Im pretty sure will want another one soon cause they plan on doing things on their own and will need many hours of help and someone to fix their mistakes!.


HERE IS WHERE I NEED HELP

I want to go LEGIT. Meaning, set up a business name, tax# (I can do this easy enough online)

Most of all, I NEED HELP WITH THE CONTRACTS AND LEGAL STUFF

How do you guys do your contracts? Do you need a lawyer? Are there templates somewhere on the net?

Also, Do I need a lawyer? What questions do I need to ask him to cover my ass?

Are there any good consultant tax breaks for me? or can my client expense my fee? (thats a good selling point if there is - softens the blow)

Where do I go for this info? Who do I talk to?

WHAT DO I NEED TO KNOW?

Ive seen the light and want to work towards the big clients. For now, I will gladly take a $200 per hour consult fee for brushing up my skills and gaining experience.
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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 08:03 PM   #213
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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Contracts? Legal Stuff?

You don't even know what you'd be contracting services for yet, heh

I havent used any contracts myself (yet), but I did register a business name and setup a business banking account to accept cheques in that name.

As far as taxes go, sure you get plenty of tax breaks, probably more than most businesses since consultants are constantly promoting and moving around.

I'd probably google some "how to get started in consulting" type websites if I was you, maybe buy some books on the topic...really at the end of the day there's no "set way" for setting up a consulting business...just general things to have access to (like the business account)

You will want to keep track of payments tho, since I'm sure those businesses will be claiming you as an expense to the government.
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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 08:13 PM   #214
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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Originally Posted by SpyGuy View Post

I need help !!!!

Just starting out in the offline area and Ive found myself in a lucky position from getting a whack of ref's from my first job (which was for a friend).

Ive done 4 consults at $200 each for an hour. I just started talking about what I did for the other co. (All these people are in the same building) - went into Adwords keyword tool and gave them a lesson on keywords and the importance of them and how people find you, targeted prospects etc... And the time was up just as I started going.

To me, I feel I didnt provide anything at all. Yet, each one of them told me Ive given them way more than their $200 worth.

However, these people dont have the $$ to give me $5k upfront and $1500 a month.

But... 2 of them asked me back for another 1/2 hour consult for $100 and Im pretty sure will want another one soon cause they plan on doing things on their own and will need many hours of help and someone to fix their mistakes!.


HERE IS WHERE I NEED HELP

I want to go LEGIT. Meaning, set up a business name, tax# (I can do this easy enough online)

Most of all, I NEED HELP WITH THE CONTRACTS AND LEGAL STUFF

How do you guys do your contracts? Do you need a lawyer? Are there templates somewhere on the net?

Also, Do I need a lawyer? What questions do I need to ask him to cover my ass?

Are there any good consultant tax breaks for me? or can my client expense my fee? (thats a good selling point if there is - softens the blow)

Where do I go for this info? Who do I talk to?

WHAT DO I NEED TO KNOW?

Ive seen the light and want to work towards the big clients. For now, I will gladly take a $200 per hour consult fee for brushing up my skills and gaining experience.


it's always best to hire a lawyer. and I see your in Canada so it might be very different then here in the US.

A good place to start in getting some understanding on legal documents is
Docstoc ? Documents, Templates, Forms, Ebooks, Papers & Presentations

There are some free and paid ones.

The legal documents i use are:

Non Disclosure Agreement : You can't tell my "Secrets" to others
Limited Liability Contract : I'm not responsible for your failures
Marketing Services Contract : How much to pay me and what i give you in return

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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 08:31 PM   #215
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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I spent almost three hours on this thread alone. What I read was pure gold. I took lots of notes and will implement many of these.

Funny how AP noted that you approach these businesses like talking to a hot chick..
I realized that it was basically the same concept here. Who would of thought that my early days as ladies man actually help me to get deals today.

Seriously, the biggest AHA moment was that I was selling myself so short. I was marketing myself as an SEO firm that helps you get traffic from the internet. I couldn't be so wrong. Infact I totally forgot that I earned a bachelors degree in marketing!!! I'm not just an SEO expert, I need to present myself as a marketing consultant as a whole

Typically when I meet businesses I tell them an SEO expert and 99% have no idea what SEO is. That's when i explain to them what it is and why they need it for their business. Even then they are still confused, but then again I want them to be so they will hire me. It'll be so much easier if i say i'm a marketing consultant that will help increase your bottom line.

Good example was i was at clients business and he was telling he was running a print campaign on magazine. The only thing i said was "Make sure you put your website url and facebook url". What I should of done was told him let me manage that for you to ensure it works with your internet marketing campaign. I would of made myself more Valuable to him. You see to the client, i'm just the Web Designer and internet marketer.

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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 08:43 PM   #216
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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Love the thread (thanks AP and everyone who contributed), thanks to it I decided to offer some IM to offline crowd as well. While I do see some interest I'm having hard time putting together some kind of package with tangible results. Best something lower budget starting from $500+ that I can sell on the phone + email
Any ideas?

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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 09:10 PM   #217
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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Originally Posted by Thomas W View Post


Non Disclosure Agreement : You can't tell my "Secrets" to others
Limited Liability Contract : I'm not responsible for your failures
Marketing Services Contract : How much to pay me and what i give you in return

Ya Thomas... thats the stuff I need to learn about.

If anyone is brave enough to post an example of their contract letters that would be awsome.

I want to make sure my ass is covered. (that didnt sound right did it? )
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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 09:15 PM   #218
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I don't use a contract and I don't tell them what I do.

They pay based on me selling me. and a verbal one month money back guarantee.

after a month, they won't ever cancel. If one ever does, I'll refund and move on.

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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 09:23 PM   #219
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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Originally Posted by DogScout View Post

I don't use a contract and I don't tell them what I do.

They pay based on me selling me. and a verbal one month money back guarantee.

after a month, they won't ever cancel. If one ever does, I'll refund and move on.
DogScout

What if you made a silly mistake that caused problems for the clients biz. And they ended up taking you to court.

As well, I have a hard time believing that a $5k+ client wouldnt want some sort of contract.

Dont they ask for one?
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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 09:59 PM   #220
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No one has wanted a contract yet.

Lawyer: "Did you give him your account log-in info?"
Client, "yes"
Lawyer, "to do work on your account without you having a contract?"
Client, "Yes"
Judge, "Case dismissed."


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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 10:03 PM   #221
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The clients I have that are not contemplating bankruptcy are OK because of my humble efforts. As I learn more (and I have a ton to still learn,) their position will only get better and better. It is unlikely they would even consider suing me at this point no matter how bad a mistake I made.

(I might point out, when a relationship was 1st developed, none of my clients were sure they would be in business in a year and were reluctant to sign a contract they could not honor. (even though they could include a contract in a legal bankruptcy, they are highly honorable and ethical persons and would be uncomfortable using a legal shield to not pay something they had personally promised.) I am not 'cleaning up' with these clients (yet) but the income is never ending. As far as they are concerned when they stop paying, everything will go back to the way it was before they hired me. Both want to pay me more that they are now. I suspect they will have that opportunity soon.)

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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 10:07 PM   #222
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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Originally Posted by DogScout View Post

The clients I have that are not contemplating bankruptcy are OK because of my humble efforts. As I learn more (and I have a ton to still learn,) their position will only get better and better. It is unlikely they would even consider suing me at this point no matter how bad a mistake I made.
I believe in signing a legal contract - especially for larger clients with bigger budgets.

I understand that you are providing massive value to your clients and they are happy - but you never know what future will bring..........especially if you'll make a "bad mistake".
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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 10:07 PM   #223
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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Originally Posted by SpyGuy View Post

DogScout

What if you made a silly mistake that caused problems for the clients biz. And they ended up taking you to court.

As well, I have a hard time believing that a $5k+ client wouldnt want some sort of contract.

Dont they ask for one?
A) What kind of silly mistake could you truly make? You're basically going to help them bring in more leads and build a list of customers they can market to...at the end of the day you're a marketing consultant their to provide advice...its up to them if they want to follow it.

As long as what your saying MAKES SENSE, I doubt that a contract would be necessary EXCEPT to ensure YOU dont get screwed over. (i.e. You setup all the marketing / website stuff for them and then they dont pay)

Thats why I take a setup fee + 50% upfront...to protect ME from losing out.

B) I do have NDAs that I havent made anyone sign yet, just havent had that "vibe" to need to, plus I have client heads spinning so much they can barely explain what I do to each other...let alone competitors...

That and really...nothing you're going to tell them is THAT big of a secret...hell they could come to Warrior Forum and learn the same stuff...but chances are they wont because they are busy people...

So even IF someone decided to take your ideas and run with them...move on to a new business. Not like you invested anything other than some time talking to them.
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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 10:09 PM   #224
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Originally Posted by Joseph. View Post

I believe in signing a legal contract - especially for larger clients with bigger budgets.

I understand that you are providing massive value to your clients and they are happy - but you never know what future will bring..........especially if you'll make a "bad mistake".
Can you give me an example of a "bad mistake?"
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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 10:27 PM   #225
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Originally Posted by Joseph. View Post

I believe in signing a legal contract - especially for larger clients with bigger budgets.

I understand that you are providing massive value to your clients and they are happy - but you never know what future will bring..........especially if you'll make a "bad mistake".
When I get a big client, I (or they) may feel differently. I'll cross that bridge when I come to it. Even then, the contract will NOT outline what I do. (What I do changes as their situation, position etc changes.) It is easy to 'promise' the front page for 5, 10 or 50 keywords. Just pick non-commercial uncompetitive keywords. They don't know any better & That's what most of the competition does. I don't do that, I under promise (control expectations) and over deliver what they are expecting. I promise results. Not how the watch will be built (which they wouldn't understand anyway, and if they did would pay far more for less than I would end up doing) .... just that they will be able to tell what time it is.

I cannot imagine a mistake I could not rectify to an excess of their satisfaction.

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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 10:28 PM   #226
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Hi, AP:

Can you please send me your url?

I've got quite a few leeds I can send you.

We do 100% online marketing in our own niche, but I'm constantly running into other business people who are looking for your type of services.

Thanks.
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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 10:45 PM   #227
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Originally Posted by Fernando Veloso View Post

Dexx, AP, one question:

It's all about positioning, right?

What about website style, positioning?

Corporate?
Positioning get's me in the door, people will listen.

However, I have to walk the talk when I get in front of them. I need to be confident in what I can do for them. People (especially bus owners) can see right thru you.

That's why I Target businesses I know I can help.

For me, getting the money is so easy. The hard part is Implementing everything I promised
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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 10:48 PM   #228
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Originally Posted by Tanner View Post

I believe that as AP is stating it, the $1495 per month is the 'consuting' fee, which just covers the ideas, help, strategy, implementation, training, set up, etc.

Anything else like the cost of SEO, web design, copywriting, PPC, newsletters, and so on would be an additional cost separate from the $1495 consulting fee.
I do incorporate certain Service items in my monthly agreement.

Local Maps, VRE (Virtual Real Estate listings) Onpage SEO, some website redesign work upfront is included.

Management of PPC, Direct Mail campaigns, etc... are extra.
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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 10:51 PM   #229
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Originally Posted by DogScout View Post

AP is a Perry Marshall follower, or was. Helping others with no agenda is something he teaches and practices.

Why do any of the successful marketers share and help others here? Because it is the right thing to do for people of a certain caliber, (and a rare caliber at that. Instead of being paranoid that he might somehow make you buy something (that would make you successful) try taking what he says at face value and use what you can to help your business... and pass it on at such time as you run into someone that would be helped by that information.
Big fan of Perry.

Most think of Perry as the Adwords PPC guy. That is so far from the Truth.

Perry is actually a great marketer. He, Frank Kern and many other mentor under Dan Kennedy, as do I.
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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 11:02 PM   #230
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I do a letter of agreement - sounds like intemadating than "contract"

I also offer no more than 2-3 levels of service with different price points and let the business decide what level or service and support they want and are willing to pay for.

Lucky for me it hasn't been a problem and I stay as busy as I want to.

Good luck.

Tim

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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 11:03 PM   #231
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Originally Posted by Thomas W View Post

I spent almost three hours on this thread alone. What I read was pure gold. I took lots of notes and will implement many of these.

Funny how AP noted that you approach these businesses like talking to a hot chick..
I realized that it was basically the same concept here. Who would of thought that my early days as ladies man actually help me to get deals today.

Seriously, the biggest AHA moment was that I was selling myself so short. I was marketing myself as an SEO firm that helps you get traffic from the internet. I couldn't be so wrong. Infact I totally forgot that I earned a bachelors degree in marketing!!! I'm not just an SEO expert, I need to present myself as a marketing consultant as a whole

Typically when I meet businesses I tell them an SEO expert and 99% have no idea what SEO is. That's when i explain to them what it is and why they need it for their business. Even then they are still confused, but then again I want them to be so they will hire me. It'll be so much easier if i say i'm a marketing consultant that will help increase your bottom line.

Good example was i was at clients business and he was telling he was running a print campaign on magazine. The only thing i said was "Make sure you put your website url and facebook url". What I should of done was told him let me manage that for you to ensure it works with your internet marketing campaign. I would of made myself more Valuable to him. You see to the client, i'm just the Web Designer and internet marketer.
Always be pursued, not the pursuer.

Either you're chasing them or they chase you.

If I chase them, my Positioning, the monies I can demand etc... go Way down.

Ain't gonna do it.

Quick story. Back in June 09 I met with a prospect and we both clicked. He loved what I had to say, loved my ideas and wanted to go with me. I told him at the end of our conversation that if he wanted to pursue this marketing system I had for him, then he had to contact me. I would NOT call him.

I thought for sure my phone would be ringing the next day. 2 weeks, nothing. 4 weeks, 6, 8, nothing. Then in October he calls. He said "you weren't kidding, you REALLY weren't going to call me?"

I said "Yep, I wanted to but I promised you I wouldn't." He said "why don't we meet tomorrow and sign that agreement, I'll have a check ready for you."

We still joke about that today.

Edit: If I would have called him back, I would have lost the Leverage I had. Positioning won out.
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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 11:17 PM   #232
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Positioning is power. He he speaks first loses, he who speaks last wins.

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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 11:26 PM   #233
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Originally Posted by Dexx View Post

Can you give me an example of a "bad mistake?"
Suppose you mess up your client's direct mail campaign - there is a typo in url of your client's landing page. $10,000 of your client's money down the drain.

Wouldn't you want to have some sort of a contract to protect you from liability?

A far more likely scenario, however, is that your client demands more services/value from you and thinks that "it was included as well".

A simple contract outlining deliverables would solve that.
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Unread 16th Jan 2010, 11:27 PM   #234
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So no package deals, ha... So what you are promising? I can't deliver any of you, so go figure how do I sell me
Would I be talking more clients, or more traffic, or ... ? AP, you mentioned that you mail prospects ... do you write them that you can help them grow or more specifically like make 10K more in a month?

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Unread 17th Jan 2010, 12:02 AM   #235
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Originally Posted by Joseph. View Post

Suppose you mess up your client's direct mail campaign - there is a typo in url of your client's landing page. $10,000 of your client's money down the drain.

Wouldn't you want to have some sort of a contract to protect you from liability?

A far more likely scenario, however, is that your client demands more services/value from you and thinks that "it was included as well".

A simple contract outlining deliverables would solve that.

Thats my "better safe than sorry" way of thinking as well Joseph (Must be the Paranoid Toronto air we breath ).

To me, having a contract means protection from the scum who dont know how to play nice.

..... if I could only get my hands on an example (cough cough)

For those that do use agreements etc... where did you get yours from?
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Unread 17th Jan 2010, 12:15 AM   #236
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Originally Posted by debukur View Post

So no package deals, ha... So what you are promising? I can't deliver any of you, so go figure how do I sell me
Would I be talking more clients, or more traffic, or ... ? AP, you mentioned that you mail prospects ... do you write them that you can help them grow or more specifically like make 10K more in a month?
I don't every guarantee anything having to do with income, number of visitors, etc for a variety of reasons. If you do you'll find yourself on the wrong end of a lawsuit when the 10k you promised turns out to be 8k one month.

Again the only thing I guarantee is my performance - you will have a website that has XYZ and it will be done by this date. Everything else is up to Jesus (bible belt joke).

Tim

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Unread 17th Jan 2010, 05:42 AM   #237
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Originally Posted by TimCastleman View Post

Positioning is power. He he speaks first loses, he who speaks last wins.
Tim, this is so true, one of the first sales tactics I was ever taught! Silence is POWERFUL!

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Unread 17th Jan 2010, 06:39 AM   #238
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Out of interest,

If you have some one on the phone, and you have convinced them to buy, and they are ready to, do you get them to post a cheque, or do you go meet them, sign an agreement and then collect a cheque?

Just wondering people's approaches to actually getting the money.

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Unread 17th Jan 2010, 07:18 AM   #239
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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Originally Posted by SpyGuy View Post

Thats my "better safe than sorry" way of thinking as well Joseph (Must be the Paranoid Toronto air we breath ).

To me, having a contract means protection from the scum who dont know how to play nice.

..... if I could only get my hands on an example (cough cough)

For those that do use agreements etc... where did you get yours from?
SpyGuy (and Joseph), to my mind putting all kinds of CYA language in a contract is a bad move. It puts the good clients on alert and the bad ones on a hunt for loopholes.

Simple, plain language documents like letters of agreement, NDA, etc. work best. If you really are worried, talk to a good insurance agent, especially one familiar with insuring small businesses. Ask them about "Errors and Omissions" coverage. Basically, if you get sued for screwing the pooch, you file a claim just like if you get in a car accident. It's not quite that simple, but that's what the agent should be explaining to you.

E&O isn't all that expensive, either.

The other policy that might help you sleep better is an umbrella liability policy. You can get these pretty cheap for $1-$5 million in coverage. They kick in when you get a judgment or something that's larger than your regular policies cover.

That way you can cover your butt without handing a brand new client a laundry list of stuff that might go wrong...

But as DogScout and others have pointed out, if you're careful in what you promise and you manage expectations, you should be fine. Remember, many of your clients will have been on your side of the table at some point, too.
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Unread 17th Jan 2010, 11:34 AM   #240
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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@ Endgame,

I always find it is more effective to meet with the business owner - not just to collect the cheque, but also to assess the business in order to suggest strategies and tactics that will help them.

I find it enhances both your credibility and your rapport with the prospect, which in turn can lead to referrals from them which are of course like gold dust.

Cheers

Simon
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Unread 17th Jan 2010, 11:38 AM   #241
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I've found that in my experience it is a HUGE advantage when you can be sitting down with these people in person.

Of course you don't need to, and many do just fine handling things over the phone, but my clients appreciate being able to deal with someone local who they know is in a nearby town.

I think so many companies have been taken for rides by "mysterious internet companies" that being there in person helps with the trust factor greatly.

Matt

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Unread 17th Jan 2010, 12:21 PM   #242
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EndGame,

As far as collecting the money, I setup a business account before I started and have taken about 99% of all payments via card. Its safer, quicker and standard to all business owners.

Then you don't sit and wait for a check, you can just take payment over the phone and mail out a reciept! Easy!

Also, for residuals, again having a business account helped. I setup what you call standing orders at the bank. I send out a standing order form to my clients or give it them if they are local and don't start any work until it is filled in and sent to the bank.

A standing order makes sure you are paid automatically each month, no chasing monthly payments or missed payments and it is an automatic thing, kind of like a direct debit. It is also free to do!

I setup a new business account when I first started for free and pay about £40 a month for a credit card terminal in the office for payments. (Check out STREAMLINE!) They do the terminals!

Makes the job miles easier, adds professionalism and of course, every business owner has a debit or credit card for instant payment!

I cannot recommend this enough!!!!!!!!

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Unread 17th Jan 2010, 01:15 PM   #243
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I see where you are coming from but two things can avoid that:

1) They client signs off on any marketing material prior to it going out. This is no different than blaming a newspaper's advertising unit for a typo/mistake in an ad that they designed but the BUSINESS APPROVED of.

If they sign off on a marketing piece (email, flyer etc.) that had an error that they missed...that's not your fault, and the person who signed off on it would be held accountable for not reviewing it properly. (I get the approval in writing by email usually of a "go ahead" just like when you get any designs created and finalized yourself)

2) You don't need a "contract" in order establish what is, and is not, included. When I get my car serviced, I dont expect free repairs, I expect them to inspect the area they state they will inspect (tire pressure, oil, etc.)

If I'm having a website created for a client, before accpeting payment, I send a confirmation email of what exactly will be on the website. (Video player, autoresponder form, 5-10 Pages of Content* (provided by the client).

If they decide they want additional pages, etc. I let them know in advance it will be $45 per additional page (with them still providing the content for the page...$45 to add a blank page in Wordpress and Paste in text...cha-ching$$)

I do the same thing with monthly services (i.e. monthly report on search enging ranking for keyword, promotion of keyword, video submission to 25 media site etc.)

But like I said, everyone has their own way of running their businesses, I just haven't found a need to use a contract other than just payment terms.

~Dexx



Originally Posted by Joseph. View Post

Suppose you mess up your client's direct mail campaign - there is a typo in url of your client's landing page. $10,000 of your client's money down the drain.

Wouldn't you want to have some sort of a contract to protect you from liability?

A far more likely scenario, however, is that your client demands more services/value from you and thinks that "it was included as well".

A simple contract outlining deliverables would solve that.
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Unread 17th Jan 2010, 01:15 PM   #244
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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AP,
Thank for your invaluable contribution to this thread and forum (others too!). This has been a great education and has helped me build my business plan. I have a couple of questions that I hope others have as well so we can all benefit from your input. Of course, I would love to hear from everyone here, not just AP:

1. You said earlier that you should always be the pursued, not the pursuer. Well, when starting out you have to be the pursuer, so if you were starting your consult biz today what marketing methods would you use to get clients with a $500 budget?
2. Again, when just starting out, what is your opinion about pursuing a vertical market (dentist, attorney's, insurance agents) vs. a mass market approach?

I hope your can answer these questions from the perspective of someone that does NOT have any clients and therefore, no referrals or testimonials. In other words, someone that is not being "pursued" and needs to get paying clients in the next 30 days to pay the mortgage.

I've read this thread but I hope these questions have not been asked already. If they have would someone please point them to me.

Thanks again
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Unread 17th Jan 2010, 01:48 PM   #245
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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I'm sure AP has his own thoughts, but here's mine:
(responses in green)

Originally Posted by Zach View Post

AP,

1. You said earlier that you should always be the pursued, not the pursuer. Well, when starting out you have to be the pursuer, so if you were starting your consult biz today what marketing methods would you use to get clients with a $500 budget?

You never "have" to pursue anyone, what you do "have" to do is make them aware that you exist. Which is not the same thing.

As someone starting out I would find a way to build credibility within your market. Create a free report on whatever marketing you want to focus on, and use that to attract leads. (You can also buy some great PLR ones here in WF)

I would also do some free work with local charities / fundraising groups to use as examples of work + generate referrals + gather testimonials for credibility.

You could also contact family / friends who own businesses and offer to help them with some marketing strategies in exchange for just testimonials of results when they are happy (with the added benefit of referrals most likely)

This helps get your name out, positions you as someone that knows what they are doing, and doesn't make you come off as a salesman since people will HEAR about you before they meet you.

Become "the guy that everyone keeps talking about" and you'll get your leads.

Also attend networking events and provide useful tips / info to businesses (quality advice at no cost), when they start asking questions, you book a meeting time to talk further about their needs...voila!

PS - Develop a Unique Selling Proposition (USP) that makes you stand out from the rest of your competition and make prospects ears stand up when they hear it!




2. Again, when just starting out, what is your opinion about pursuing a vertical market (dentist, attorney's, insurance agents) vs. a mass market approach?

It is always better to focus on a niche market than a mass market, and gain authority and trust as an expert within it.

For example if you decide to focus on working with insurance companies to increase sales, you could help them build better realtionships with their existing clients using email follow-ups that can also upsell them on insurance packages.

Then you focus on becoming a speaker at an insurance agent type event or seminar to provide tips to other insurance agents on how to increase sales etc. and mention the results you had gotten for other insurance companies (increased enrollment in critical insurance coverage etc.)

From there (assuming you arent drowning in business) you EXPAND into Law Firms (even better if you pick a niche like Family Law etc.) and then you can use the work you did with the insurance companies (and videos / pictures of you speaking at events) to establish yourself even higher as an authority on helping businesses increase sales etc.

My .02 cents

~Dexx

I hope your can answer these questions from the perspective of someone that does NOT have any clients and therefore, no referrals or testimonials. In other words, someone that is not being "pursued" and needs to get paying clients in the next 30 days to pay the mortgage.

I've read this thread but I hope these questions have not been asked already. If they have would someone please point them to me.

Thanks again
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Unread 17th Jan 2010, 04:26 PM   #246
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Originally Posted by SpyGuy View Post

Thats my "better safe than sorry" way of thinking as well Joseph (Must be the Paranoid Toronto air we breath ).

To me, having a contract means protection from the scum who dont know how to play nice.

..... if I could only get my hands on an example (cough cough)

For those that do use agreements etc... where did you get yours from?
Andrew,

That must be it - it's the air

My post count is not high enough to reply to your PM - shoot me your email.
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Unread 17th Jan 2010, 04:35 PM   #247
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Originally Posted by Dexx View Post

I see where you are coming from but two things can avoid that:

1) They client signs off on any marketing material prior to it going out. This is no different than blaming a newspaper's advertising unit for a typo/mistake in an ad that they designed but the BUSINESS APPROVED of.

If I'm having a website created for a client, before accpeting payment, I send a confirmation email of what exactly will be on the website. (Video player, autoresponder form, 5-10 Pages of Content* (provided by the client).

If they decide they want additional pages, etc. I let them know in advance it will be $45 per additional page (with them still providing the content for the page...$45 to add a blank page in Wordpress and Paste in text...cha-ching$$)

~Dexx

That seems to make sense and covers all my concerns.

Do you send your clients a "Welcome Letter" confirming the agreement and thanking them?

I would assume if this is done and the client doesnt respond requesting changes, it is as good as a contract.

Same goes for the "pre-approvals" of work before going live.


Thanks Dexx
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Unread 17th Jan 2010, 05:29 PM   #248
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Originally Posted by SpyGuy View Post

Do you send your clients a "Welcome Letter" confirming the agreement and thanking them?

I would assume if this is done and the client doesnt respond requesting changes, it is as good as a contract.

Same goes for the "pre-approvals" of work before going live.


Thanks Dexx
Well the agreement is discussed in person, where I've already written out what they will be getting (marketing blueprint), and then really my invoice just includes the basics.

Careful though, "not responding" doesnt mean it is approved, just wait until they give you a Yay or Nay when a decision is required on anything.

This why I make sure to get paid in advance, so if they want to take their time responding to stuff, thats their money going to waste...not MY time AND money.

A service I use to manage all my client communication is Basecamp, might want to check it out. I upload all marketing files and material, scheduled tasks, and delivery dates...and both sides can see what is needed, whats been done, and who is responsible for what and when.

~Dexx
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Unread 17th Jan 2010, 06:04 PM   #249
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Dexx - your comments were very helpful! Thank you!
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Unread 17th Jan 2010, 06:14 PM   #250
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Re: Offline Marketers: What services are you offering for monthly fees?
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I own a web development and online marketing company.

For our customers we provide monthly SEO/SEM work consisting of:

1.) Keeping their content fresh - updating their blogs, articles, etc weekly for their site visitors.
2.) Social media work. Keeping their business profiles active on all of the most heavily visited social networks.
3.) Backlinking. You can never have enough quality back links.
4.) Forum & Blog posts, yahoo answers, etc.

Of course we do the initial on page work to optimize for their selected keywords. You need to continue to work on a monthly basis to keep the high google page rank because you always have competitors out there trying to outrank you. Plus our off page work generates a great deal of income for our clients aside from the organic traffic alone.

We have clients that pay as low as $300 a month up to $3000 a month.

I've lost too many friends, but I've won too many bets..
JohnZags is offline  
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