As John Reese Says

14 years ago

I value John Resses' opinion greatly (would be foolish not to) but I'll carry on with my own testing.

So far social media has given me a lot, if it changes in the New Year so be it, but like anything else your own testing is more much valuable.

What works for one marketer might not work for another, there's so many factors to consider.

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JeffLam

14 years ago

Predictions are predictions, and even Gurus are not prophets!

However, that being said, he does make a solid point and his status as a very successful person definitely back ups his business acumen.

I'm guessing he said that because he thinks more social services are aimed towards attracting internet users that are of a certain target audience (e.g., teenage kids, young adults) and who want to use these sites for fun and interesting stuff rather than buying stuff.

However, I beg to differ, at least for now, as I feel that it really depends on how YOU, as the seller of your product or service, writes the copy and design of your social page.

If your social page and your article/copywriting is good enough to entice the readers to read more, then push all the triggers for them to want to purchase something, why not?

Afterall, social sites not only get traffic from users who browse the social sites alone: Google picks them up too.

And if a user searches for something and come across the information they want in a social site, a good copy is what you need to get a buyer!

Well, that's my views of course.

And that's provided that Google does NOT carry out radical changes like totaly eliminating all social services from their searches, which there MAY be a rumour but I have no comments on that.

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Michael Silvester

14 years ago

Hi Mate,

I agree with John in a way...

Social media traffic is low quality Sh*tty traffic
on its own. But its what you do with it that can
convert it into better quality traffic.

The trick is NOT to sell to social media traffic.

What you have to do is build a relationship/value
with them and then convert them into a sale.

The only way you can do this is by offering
something of value in exchange for their email
details.

From there you can build value through email.

Otherwise...John is right. Social Media leads
on their own are crap.

But you can fix that

Take Care,

Michael Silvester

P.S Grab Em, and Warm Em UP!

[ 1 ] Thanks
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Louise Green 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Silvester

What you have to do is build a relationship/value
with them and then convert them into a sale.

Exactly! Treat them almost as good as you treat your list and you're onto a winning formula.
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simonjwarner

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Silvester

Hi Mate,

I agree with John in a way...

Social media traffic is low quality Sh*tty traffic
on its own. But its what you do with it that can
convert it into better quality traffic.

The trick is NOT to sell to social media traffic.

What you have to do is build a relationship/value
with them and then convert them into a sale.

The only way you can do this is by offering
something of value in exchange for their email
details.

From there you can build value through email.

Otherwise...John is right. Social Media leads
on their own are crap.

But you can fix that

Take Care,

Michael Silvester

P.S Grab Em, and Warm Em UP!

I cant improve on this! Wise words!

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sgboston23 14 years ago

As others have stated - you are not directly selling to facebookers and myspacers. You are building trust, building a relationship. Creating an identity - and staying transparent. Eventually you make a few offers to them, but without seeming like a spammy affiliate marketer. Keep it simple.
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- k_ghanekar 14 years ago
  
  I just want to know about this topic.I read all replies and like them.Thanks for all reply.It not a topic about argue.I like John Reese and as i use facebook and twitter,thats why i m more anxious about this topic.
  
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JEL0221

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Silvester

Hi Mate,

I agree with John in a way...

Social media traffic is low quality Sh*tty traffic
on its own. But its what you do with it that can
convert it into better quality traffic.

The trick is NOT to sell to social media traffic.

What you have to do is build a relationship/value
with them and then convert them into a sale.

The only way you can do this is by offering
something of value in exchange for their email
details.

From there you can build value through email.

Otherwise...John is right. Social Media leads
on their own are crap.

But you can fix that

Take Care,

Michael Silvester

P.S Grab Em, and Warm Em UP!

I agree 100%. I have used social media in the past and it does not convert well whatsoever, but I was trying to sell directly to them.

In the future I only intend to use social media to build a list and a relationship with people.

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ZhaoAnXin

14 years ago

I kind of disagree.

If you're sending cold social media traffic to an offer it probably won't convert well.

But that's the wrong way to go about it.

For example - I'll use one of those friend adder programs for myspace, and spend a week targetting people by keyword. send friend requests and a note to 400 of them a day who are interested in that keyword.

With myspace you can sort your friends into folders, so I do that.

So if I'm targetting the keyword apple everyone I add based on that keyword goes into the apple folder.

Then after I've added everyone I can think of, I use the program and pull in the ID's of everyone in the apple folder (people interested in apples who have accepted my invite) and send them a message.

First I send them a message thanking them for accepting and asking them what they're up to. If they reply I reply back.

Then over the next few days I send out other random messages to the apple group, or leave relevant youtube video comments or image comments on their profiles (videos of apples, pictures of apples).

Then after a week or two of that I pull them all back into the friend adder program and send them a mail pushing them to my opt in offer.

Then, there's an entire opt in sequence that theygo through before they're shown any offer.

This works pretty well for me and I don't have to pay for PPC, and it ends up working out with higher conversions (I'm only guessing) than cold PPC traffic anyway.

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Alminc 14 years ago

People on social media sites are not buyers, they are looking
for entertainment, so yes My Majesty agrees with John
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SuzanneH

14 years ago

Here's an excerpt from John's blog where he clarifies:

2. My statement that "Social Media sucks."
Anyone that read all of my comments in the report about Social Media knows that I recommend everyone use it. It's great for building backlinks, syndicating content, and building relationships -- and, yes, finding new customers. I think social bookmarking and doing trackbacks (with great content) is a must.

Most of my 'sucks' comments were aimed at Twitter and Facebook. The sites most people think of when thinking of Social Media. These are the sites that I feel many people are wasting far too much time on. YES, you should definitely use them. No doubt about it.

But when compared to other Internet Marketing strategies (PPC, building a list, creating products, making offers, working on copy & conversion, SEO, creating & distributing content) it doesn't produce as much money. Therefore, I believe one shouldn't spend as much time using those sites.

This is exactly why I mention people should use these sites for a max of one hour per day.

Twitter and Facebook have become the new AOL Chatroom. Even if you feel you're using them "in the name of your business" it's too easy to waste hours of time chatting and socializing with people on them. If you don't actively limit the amount of time you use them, they WILL hold your business back.

I use social media as one way to keep in contact with my website visitors (I have a content website). I don't try to make sales -- what I'm aiming for (besides wanting to help them lose weight and get fit) is generating word-of-mouth. I'll put up links to my latest blog posts to get them back to the site. What's great, especially with Facebook, is that we can then talk about the article.

But, yeah, if you're just farting around, and not getting other work done; it's a waste of time.

But wait! Just thought of something. One thing Gary Vaynerchuk does once in awhile is ustream live streaming, and sometimes he's just hanging out with the people who are watching. He'll talk about all kinds of things, play some music, etc., answer all kinds of non-business related questions.

What that does, I think, is help establish him as someone who's accessible, someone who cares -- and the whole social media thing helps to establish you as an expert. (If you want to see someone who does social media well, check out Gary Vaynerchuk.)

Suzanne

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Anonymous Affiliate

14 years ago

Social media is OK to bring traffic to your blog, where you will be building your relationship with your readership and from there you'll try to pitch them into something. But it's poor traffic if you're driving them to a sales page.

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mfleisch

14 years ago

I believe that social media, if used properly can generate traffic. The way I use social media is slightly different though. Instead of using my Twitter account to only push products or my Fan page to make "recommendations", I provide something of value 98% of the time. That way, when I make suggestions for products or services that would be of benefit, I usually get people to respond.

A great example is offering information about your particular niche. Every so often, if you are giving a webinar or free download, make your followers aware of it. I guarantee that you'll have a high click through and conversion. Don't expect to sell in a single step though - use a two step sales process.

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Mukul Verma

14 years ago

John is in the Internet Marketing effectively game, which social media may not produce the best results.

If you are in the relationship building and community involvement (I agree max 1 hr a day) then social media can be great. However if get addicted, which is it easy to do, then your profit vs time spent is not worth it compared to other avenues.

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nicholasb

14 years ago

Social media has made me bank, when used right it is one of the most important things you can use,

Just ask gary vaynerchuk

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AP

14 years ago

YouTube- Broadcast Yourself.

He may want to check out the above video.

I set up a customized Twitter page and Facebook for all my Offline clients. I never thought they would get any serious traffic, but who knows.

I set them up because it's cool and the clients like it.

I also use software for them to get followers. I build up 1k-2k followers and leave it alone.

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joetheseo 14 years ago

Sure you can use social media for traffic. You have to remember you're marketing to young people though, for example if I send out a viral video on "truck covers" no one will care. But if I social networked a site about "Fixing your PS3", the social media sites may be more effective.

I just use social media to get my site indexed faster.
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nofearman

14 years ago

Originally Posted by AP

YouTube- Broadcast Yourself.

He may want to check out the above video.

I set up a customized Twitter page and Facebook for all my Offline clients. I never thought they would get any serious traffic, but who knows.

I set them up because it's cool and the clients like it.

I also use software for them to get followers. I build up 1k-2k followers and leave it alone.

Your VIDEO actually CONFIRMS John's assertions. The video demonstrates what I strongly believe, that Social Media (primarily SM Networking like Twitter and Facebook) is 99% HYPED UP CRAP! The media is in love with SM so we are lead to believe there is this great opportunity to apply to business and it is just NOT there YET. It's primarily HYPE, JUST LIKE THIS VIDEO.

If you are on Linkedin check out my discussion in eMarketing Group "Social Media for Business is CRAP". Over 700 comments in only 2 months.

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AP 14 years ago

[DELETED]

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- Ehanson 14 years ago
  
  I agree and disagree on this one.
  
  It's all about the way you look at social media traffic. Sending them to a salespage is not going to be effective because that is not why Digg, Youtube, Facebook and many other social sites were created. The point of those sites is to connect with people you already know and be a part of a larger online community.
  
  YouTube is becoming a great alternative to Google Search and Facebook is becoming one of the unofficial dating sites on the net. Google may even implement social search in the future. (At least those are the rumors going around)
  
  "The video demonstrates what I strongly believe, that Social Media (primarily SM Networking like Twitter and Facebook) is 99% HYPED UP CRAP! The media is in love with SM so we are lead to believe there is this great opportunity to apply to business and it is just NOT there YET."
  
  Impending rant coming on. As social sites grew (mostly amongst gen Y'ers like myself) the media tried to market to my generation by becoming visible within those sites and thus the domino effect happens:
  
  Oprah gets on Twitter, other talks shows get on Twitter also to stay competitive and than the NY Times sets up a Facebook account and on and on it goes. Before you know it every corporation has jumped on the bandwagon.
  
  Now the original purpose of those sites has changed because of media executives and the early adapters have moved somewhere else because these sites loose their "cool" appeal. The media will jump on any bandwagon if they think it is making money. You can thank venture capitalists and media executives for all the hype. But they would have jumped on anyway due to the "adapt or die" mantra.
  
  Anyway, despite the fact that social media can be a big waste of time for direct marketing/ affiliate marketing tactics it is great to use if you have a band, sell iPhone Apps, are a video game developer, sell Facebook virtual gifts (in fact the gift store makes millions per year), are promoting a movie, etc...
  
  It's about word of mouth and not selling if you have a product. Sell by not selling. In fact Digg users hate ads and Facebook ads aren't making much revenue. Social traffic works for certain niches. I've bought products and visited websites based on what others said about them at social sites.
  
  Use social sites wisely because I've gotten a site indexed on the first page of Google because of a Digg submission and now have sustained a first page ranking within my niche for a couple years. It would have taken me longer to make money with that site if I didn't use Digg.
  
  This the way the net is heading, at least I believe.
  
  Thanks
  
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GMHouse

14 years ago

I believe that Social media does drive traffic and that depends on what your market is. If you are providing low quality content of a broad category then no traffic will be the rule. I have never seen a succesful sales campagain that didn't provide quality and targeted content.

The prediction is accurate up to the point of what you put into it.

Gary

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nosmokingsecret

14 years ago

I have find that the kind of social media "facebook" has produced sales for clickbank products.
If clickbank can convert then why not other aff programs

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oneplusone

14 years ago

In the UK a husband and wife used a Social Media facebook campaign last week to sell over 500,000 copies of a product in ONE WEEK.

You can study the campaign here:

SEM Blog - Social Media Lessons from Rage Against The Machine V X-Factor

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Andrew S

14 years ago

Originally Posted by k_ghanekar

Hi
I just go through income.com blog and found a a report "Internet marketing 2010:The road ahead."When i read it,i found that John says that Social media marketing cannot be used for generating traffic.He says that there is only 1% chance to get a lead who will buy product from you through social media.
How much of you believe this?

Kundan

This is totally true, social media traffic conversion rates are abysmal.

I think it's overrated personally.

And I also think social media consultants are overpaid unless they're linkbaiting.

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MarkAse

14 years ago

As for Facebook, I agree with him 100%. I'm not on there to buy anything, in fact the only time I've even looked at an ad and remembered it was while we were searching for plane flights to Latin America and the ad talked about the exact flight we were looking for.

Twitter has been incredibly successful for me in terms of business-business, but has not lead to much business-consumer as of yet. Given the time Twitter takes from my day(15 minutes or so) I won't be giving up any time soon as I think the service and users will continue to evolve over time.

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InternetMarketingIQ

14 years ago

He's just one dude selling shovels to the Gold Rush.

If you can figure out how to make money from something then do it. John Reese makes his money with automated tools and selling information to people who want to buy into what he believes.

The Web is not built around one persons opinion. If you like what he says then believe it, if not then do your own thing.

Lots of lemmings chasing after opinion to opinion and never getting anything done.

John Reese made $500,000 from Adsense scraping content in 2004-5 then Google shut it all down.

He must have been a genius.

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Michael Kohler

14 years ago

That is really confusing. Is he talking about direct linking to a product, linking to a review site, a squeeze page... you simply can't say something general like that when most of us use social media and have had results that, I am assuming, are above 1%.

Reece markets through his list primarily, and does JV's with other people's lists, so his traffic might be 1% because he may not waste his time doing social media marketing.

Yes, there are tools that get people to join your Twitter feed and Facebook, and those automated systems may not bring the most targeted visitors, but I have heard other marketers that claim that Twitter is alive and well for marketing (Robert Plank and Lance Tamashiro) that claim they get a good deal of traffic.

So, I guess it comes down to testing. If it works, then you will make money. If not, your account will be low or empty. We just need to keep testing to see what continues to pull in profits, and do that, despite whatever the gurus may say.

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Zach Booker

14 years ago

The phrase "those who can't do teach" summarizes most of the perceived guru's.

John is different though and I think all the hate in this thread is more towards guru's and their advice, which normally costs money and isn't true, than John. John has made a lot of money outside the internet marketing niche and continues to now.

Does he make as much as some people online? Not even close. But due to the caliber of product and his history of giving back I do listen when he makes the odd blog post.

John is 100% right in this case though, imo. Social media can not be an effective and/or reliable tool in generating traffic unless you really take time and put in a lot of effort to build a bond with your followers. (Which simply can't be done in multiple verticals.)

For people selling physical products, it can be highly effective, but for most internet marketers selling the latest product about growing big carrots and other vegetables it just isn't worth the effort.

All the hype and misconception also comes from the social media gurus a.k.a the people who don't make a thing online so they decide to launch a product based on a theory, that may sound good, but produces no results.

Zach

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AffiliateInABox1

14 years ago

Originally Posted by k_ghanekar

Hi
I just go through income.com blog and found a a report "Internet marketing 2010:The road ahead."When i read it,i found that John says that Social media marketing cannot be used for generating traffic.He says that there is only 1% chance to get a lead who will buy product from you through social media.
How much of you believe this?

Kundan

What is he basing that off of? It\'s a very broad statement, and quite inaccurate. I know of 4-5 different ways at this very moment (and 2010) how to get leads to purchase from you from social media. It requires work of course, but is doable. Now -- if he is talking about simply placing blaring advertisements in their face, that may be another thing. But picking a number out of the air without any support... well, I\'d say read the entire thing, put it in context, and decide for yourself.

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LetsGoViral

14 years ago

1% is still good...sort of. Of course targeting targeted forums, discussion groups and building relationship with existing customers is the way to go. If you have money - paid traffic is the way to go (adwords, ypn, etc...)

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johnng 14 years ago

I believe Social Media sites are there for social contacts. Any businesses will require social contacts. Isn't that true? If there are enough contacts, there will be traffic, I believe!
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- A Bary 14 years ago
  
  Ok, for some reason I didn't receive this report from J. Reese (or maybe it is lost in the 1000 emails I receive daily )
  
  Anyone has a link to download it??
  Thanks
  
  Thanks
  
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um1001

14 years ago

While I would probably entertain anything John said as valuable, I wouldn't take it as gospel. I do like to test. Having said that, I can also make a similar claim. Social media does very little for me besides providing another backlink and a (albeit small) chance of going viral. Not all traffic is gold though.

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Zach Booker

14 years ago

Internet Marketing 2010: The Road Ahead

Zach

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BIG Mike

Banned 14 years ago

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nofearman

14 years ago

Originally Posted by BIG Mike

I didn't read the report, but I can't really agree on either point. Used properly, social media sites can and do provide a phenominal number of qualified leads, backlinks (leading to ranking higher in SERPS). Obviously the product also plays a roll in this - and with the right product, it can easily go viral through social media.

I'd say re-read the report and see if that's what he's really saying. Just given the fact that so many marketers use social media successfully, it would seem to contradict that.

I don't think you can quote all of SM . SM is a big umbrella under which there are SM sharing tools (YouTube, Flicker, etc), SM Niche sites, Linkedin, Forums, etc, then there are the "free-for-all", discombobulated, unfocused, dirty laundry posting social "network" sites like Twitter and Facebook, in which a solid case of a "frigin waste of time" can be made.

It was John's PDF (and my own experience) that started me on the Linkedin discussion in the eMarketing Group that now has the Record for MOST commented discussion ever on Linkedin, currently at over 800 comments.

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lexilexi 14 years ago

People are in different "modes" when they use the internet - such as research, price comparison, check messages, self-promotion, shopping, idle banter, trying to get a date.

A user in each of these (and other) modes will display marked behavioral characteristics - and it's good to have a firm grasp of these in order to target your campaigns. One of the best ways to do this is very simple - to observe your own habits, and those of other internet users you know.

Social media can send a lot of traffic, but much of this traffic is from people looking for sensory stimulation. They want to be entertained by images or videos, blinky things or other surprises. Make them go "wow" and you can get insane numbers of pageviews.

There are then ways to monetize this traffic if you know what you are doing and if you understand the kinds of things these people click. Chances are, it won't be info-product sales though. PPV / CPA has been known to work. You want to know what converts best on Social Media? It's easy: Have a look at any advertisement that is long-running on Myspace, facebook, etc etc. If it's long running, someone's banking off it. If what John Reese said was strictly true, no-one would advertise on Myspace.
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Ronak Shah

14 years ago

Well, if it really sucked then so many businesses won't come up with twitter apps and facebook apps.

It's just that facebook and twitter are fun to use that we tend to hangout a lot on these sites. That's how we waste most of our time.

If you've a plan and you implement that plan effectively for both of these sites along with all other web 2.0 sites, I am sure you're going to make money.

I've myself sold products and services on twitter alone.

Twitter rocks if you are targeting the right group of customers. Same with facebook.

If you know who you are targeting, you could end up with loads of qualified leads and customers.

Those who don't really know to do it well suck at it.

John only means to say that a marketer must not spend too much time on facebook and twitter as there are much better ways to get targeted traffic.

I think if you know how to create a fan page on facebook and get 5000 or more people to be a fan of it, you're really going to make a handsome amount of money.

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greff

14 years ago

Any post that includes what John Reese says gets a ton of replies. That is interesting in itself.

I think John means that for the time invested in Social Networking you might as well buy an ad on a good website or build your list or do some Adwords.

Whenever I hear someone say they are doing great via social networking I am happy for them but I must wonder what they consider "great". I wonder what they are comparing it to. Previous big success? I think not.

Also, I think it makes a lot of difference as to what you are selling. If you are pushing a high end product (travel, autos) then one sale will pay for a lot of time invested. Two makes it profitable. Three makes it "great".

I also would like to say "Show me the money". I, too, think that Twitter and Facebook are big time sucks. But I do use Twitter for other reasons. It can be very valuable for research, for example. However, I can't find one good use for Facebook except keeping track of my kids.

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DogScout

14 years ago

I think it is entirely dependent on the niche. While shoes may do well, specialty shoes may not.
I can see social media doing better in a wider niche as everything before did better in a narrower niche.

In any case, people are more driven by other non-invested parties, so the ability to 'convert' or 'enlist' the hyper-responsive on your social media site could very well viralize something that if you tried selling would fall flat dead.

?

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kevinfar

14 years ago

I agree with some of the comments in the begging stating that you need to warm them up and build a relationship with them.

People hanging in social media sites want entertainment and you will not be giving them entertainment if you to sell them stuff immediatly.

Also, someone raised a point about being accessible. I agree. This is make one seem as the type of guy that will answer your questions and help you if you need any assistance and for me, that is always better than the guy who just introduces himself in his sales letter.

However, it's really easy to get carried away and lose a LOT of time doing unproductive things.

Therefore you have to find a real good balance in there.

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cityofangels

14 years ago

I think the key is with social media is that you don't just want traffic--you want targeted traffic. I've seen what Twitter and Youtube can do for businesses--given the business owner new clients based on those two methods. Having traffic or followers isn't enough--you need for them to be targeted--the people who are ready to buy your products. I believe social media is really great at that if setup properly.

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As John Reese Says

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