40 replies
I have a site which I would like to sell on Flippa. I would love some advice.

Currently the site does about $500/mo in revenue. It has a 3 domains that come with it that are all between 9-11 years old, one of which has a DMOZ listing. I have a very stale forum that at one time was quite active. The reason it is stale is because I didn't want to maintain it anymore, and took it into a backend membership site, and sort of hid it in there.

The forum has over 55,000 posts. The backend has videos, how-manuals and guides, brochure templates, industry website templates, etc., all for people who want to start a certain kind of niche business.

The site could actually use a facelift, I could probably get it to revenue of $700/mo with about 25 hours of work on it. ( Currently I spend about 15 minutes per month on the site).


Question:

1) What do you think a site like that should be valued at?
2) Should I fix up my site before then, or should I sell as is, to showcase the fact that I've neglected the site and that it still produces 500/mo consistantly.
3) When selling a site like this, what do you set as a reserve price, and how long should the auction be?

Thanks.
#flippa #strategies
  • Profile picture of the author writerhere
    The ideal pricing strategy that people use on flippa is - 24-30 times the current monthly revenue will become the price of the website. You can always start a bargain from that amount.
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    • Profile picture of the author Rita012
      Originally Posted by writerhere View Post

      The ideal pricing strategy that people use on flippa is - 24-30 times the current monthly revenue will become the price of the website. You can always start a bargain from that amount.
      Thanks. Is the 24-30 the reserve price then?
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    • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
      Banned
      Originally Posted by writerhere View Post

      The ideal pricing strategy that people use on flippa is - 24-30 times the current monthly revenue will become the price of the website. You can always start a bargain from that amount.
      Actually, it's 10-12 x monthly income and in this economy, the ones that are selling faster with revenue are the ones listed at about 6 x monthly income.
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      • Profile picture of the author Rita012
        Well, just to keep you all updated. I spent some good quality time on Flippa today to see what sites have sold for in the past.

        There's some good revenue producing sites there that are selling for dirt cheap. Personally for me, it's just not worth it to sell it for a year's revenue. I'd rather hold onto it so that it keeps producing revenue for me.

        Maybe I'll revisit when the economy turns around.

        I appreciate the advice anyhow.
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        • Profile picture of the author Droopy Dawg
          The good thing is you now have a formula... so why not recreate this same setup (different niche/theme), and in about 6 months or so... sell it!

          rinse/repeat

          DeShon

          Originally Posted by Rita012 View Post

          Well, just to keep you all updated. I spent some good quality time on Flippa today to see what sites have sold for in the past.

          There's some good revenue producing sites there that are selling for dirt cheap. Personally for me, it's just not worth it to sell it for a year's revenue. I'd rather hold onto it so that it keeps producing revenue for me.

          Maybe I'll revisit when the economy turns around.

          I appreciate the advice anyhow.
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  • Profile picture of the author writerhere
    from ur description, I see that its a quite old forum and its doing well. So I think you should go for the top margin of 30times the monthly revenue.

    btw can u send me the link of the forum, I might be interested.
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  • Profile picture of the author Andy Hart
    30 times the monthly revenue????

    I'd wait for a few site flipping pro's from here to comment before you go listing.

    I'm not a pro but I have read tons on site flipping and 9 - 12 months is more common, sometimes more but I have never heard of 30 times the monthly revenue.

    Don't go pricing your site just based on monthly earnings, you have some things that are very appealing to site buyers, such as aged domains and a DMOZ listing, people pay good money for those alone, just those 2 things mentioned could enable you to command a high price, so don't go go trying to make a site valuation based solely on monthly income.

    But as for the 30 months revenue, I'd have to totally disagree with that advice.

    Thanks
    Andy
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    • Profile picture of the author kschmandt
      Originally Posted by Andy Hart View Post

      30 times the monthly revenue????

      I'd wait for a few site flipping pro's from here to comment before you go listing.

      I'm not a pro but I have read tons on site flipping and 9 - 12 months is more common, sometimes more but I have never heard of 30 times the monthly revenue.

      Don't go pricing your site just based on monthly earnings, you have some things that are very appealing to site buyers, such as aged domains and a DMOZ listing, people pay good money for those alone, just those 2 things mentioned could enable you to command a high price, so don't go go trying to make a site valuation based solely on monthly income.

      But as for the 30 months revenue, I'd have to totally disagree with that advice.

      Thanks
      Andy

      I am no expert on flipping sites but I have a friend who is. He just launched and already flipped www.etycoon.net which is a site devoted to this topic. From what he tells me he used to be able to get 12is months revenue pretty easily but with the economy like it is now 8-10 is good.

      I would say value is in the eye of the beholder. If someone has an idea and feels that they can make a mint off of your site they may pay more that its "worth". Remember though, its worth whatever someone is willing to pay.

      As for when to sell. I would say your circumstances would dictate that more than anything. If you need the money or could use it better elsewhere then go for it. If you have time and would like to make more in the long run put in the effort and get more for it.

      I hope that helps.

      Kris
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      Hmm something interesting to say...
      |click here
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  • Profile picture of the author Sheryl Polomka
    I have to agree with Andy, unless forums change it from 10 months revenue to 30 months revenue, but in my experience sites usually sell for around the 10 months revenue mark.
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    • Profile picture of the author Rita012
      I couldn't justify selling at 10 months revenue. I might as well hold onto it at that level, especially since the site takes 15 minutes a month to maintain.
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      • Profile picture of the author Andy Hart
        Originally Posted by Rita012 View Post

        I couldn't justify selling at 10 months revenue. I might as well hold onto it at that level, especially since the site takes 15 minutes a month to maintain.
        You may not have to sell it for just 10 months revenue.

        You also have to take into account many other factors:

        Site content
        site design
        domain name (aged domains can sell for a great amount)
        current members (if any)
        traffic (thats a huge one, where does your traffic come from)
        Search Engine rankings (which keywords do you rank for?)
        SEO (on and off page, you have a DMOZ listing which is another selling point)
        PageRank (PR)

        Unique and established sites are very rarely valued by just thier monthly income, there is alot more to take into account, somebody could take what you have and maximize its potential, experienced site developers know how to spot potential very well, you just need to figure out a fair price to start the auction at.

        Thanks
        Andy
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        I'm On Google + ------------- and of course Also On Twitter

        "The only thing thats keeping you from getting what you want is the story you keep telling yourself about why you can't have it"- Tony Robbins

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  • Profile picture of the author garyv
    definitely not 24 - 30 months that's way too risky of an investment. Usually right around 10. What can change that is your google pr.
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  • Profile picture of the author Nickolie0990
    I have not personally sold many sites as I write this, though I have
    considered it and if the right offer came along I would do so.

    Selling a site is no different from selling any form of web property.
    Buyers are interested in the same metrics and the more you can do to present
    your site in a good light, the more money you will make.

    If you have ever taken an interest in buying businesses in the real world (bricks
    and mortar) you might be quite surprised when you head online and investigate
    the web property marketplace. Web property can be very under priced when
    compared to their real world counterparts. This might be because the whole idea
    of buying and selling websites is very new, or it could be because of the virtual
    nature of the asset. Whatever the reason, your job when selling your
    membership site, if you want to get a high price, is to prepare a strategic
    approach to maximize the final selling price.

    Here is a list of the metrics you should collect and provide in a concise
    document, which you can give to potential buyers who demonstrate serious
    interest in your site.

    1. Revenue - How much raw money your membership site generates each
    month. Provide data for as far back as you can. If you can demonstrate
    regular income over a long period and a positive growth curve, you will get
    more for your site. Also be sure to show exactly where revenue comes
    from, so if you have different membership levels, break down how many
    members are in each level and how much money is generated. The more
    specific you are the better.

    2. Profit - Revenue is usually the most important metric, but buyers want to
    know how much profit there is at the end too. In particular, if you can break
    down the exact source of expenses, potential buyers can determine
    whether they will be able to reduce the costs after taking over the site and
    thus calculate potential profits if they become the new owner.

    For example, if a buyer already has a dedicated server for hosting, they
    could move the site to their servers and remove the hosting cost
    component of the expense figures, thus increasing the potential profit. If
    they don't know the source of expenses, then they can't do calculations
    like that, which could impact the final selling price of your membership
    site.

    3. If you treat your site like a business then you have
    accounting records. If you can generate a profit and loss statement for at
    least the previous year, and a version broken down month by month, then
    you have the ideal documents to show potential buyers all the details they
    need to know about revenues, expenses and profits.

    Warning: Don't disclose this data to just anyone, make sure they
    demonstrate their seriousness and ability to source the funds to buy your
    site. Don't put your profit and loss statements into a document you release
    to the general public, just reveal summary figures and save the details for
    the serious potential buyers.


    4. Traffic Statistics - Buyers want to know how much traffic your
    membership site gets, including unique visitors, page impressions, traffic
    sources, traffic trend data, country breakdown, how much bandwidth the
    site consumes and various other website data.

    The best way to provide most of this information is to use the Google
    Analytics service and print out reports and screenshots. Google Analytics
    has become the de-facto standard for web stats and buyers trust the data
    because it is from a third party. You can also provide data from your server
    logs and statistic packages like AWstats, Webalizer or any stats package
    currently on your server.

    5. Source of new members and conversion data - How much traffic
    you get won't matter as much as how you source traffic and
    what conversion rate you get. You need to break down exactly
    how you attract new members, how many members convert
    from a given amount of traffic by source, and if possible, how long on
    average members stay in your program given each source of traffic.

    It's possible to get quite detailed when collecting data on traffic and
    conversion and as always, the more information you can provide the
    better. As a bear minimum, include how you drive traffic to your
    site (the marketing techniques you have implemented) and
    an average number of conversions per 1,000 visitors.

    6. How much work is required to manage your site - Buyers want to know
    how automated your membership site is and whether there are people
    and/or systems in place to run the site. It's important to talk about how
    many daily/weekly hours is required from the owner in order to keep the
    site running and what exactly needs to be done. A buyer needs to consider
    whether they can do what is required, whether they are prepared to invest
    the time, and how easy it would be to hire someone to perform the roles
    for them.

    7. Attrition Rate - How long, on average, a person stays a member of your
    site is a really important metric although what buyers want to know is the
    lifetime customer value, not necessarily a time period members stay in
    your program. If you have a well developed membership site, perhaps with
    different priced levels of membership that you move people through (a
    sales funnel), you can ramp up the lifetime value of each customer. This is
    an area where experienced Internet marketers shine. Your resources and
    data collection practices will dictate how much information on attrition and
    customer value you can provide.

    The above seven points represent the main metrics buyers care about, however
    there is a lot more information you can provide if necessary. If your website is
    well established and brings in more than six figures a year, expect smart buyers
    to want a lot of detailed information. They need to be sure they know what they
    are buying, especially if they are going to spend tens or hundreds of thousands
    of dollars.
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    • Profile picture of the author Rita012
      Thanks everyone. Great tips!
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  • Profile picture of the author Taylor French
    Woooah! 24 months? Not on Flippa. On Flippa, it's about 6 months revenue unless the site is very well known and respected, then it's maybe 12 months.
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  • Profile picture of the author webcosmo
    i can tell you about the forum. you wont make 700 per month from that for sure. possibly you can sell it for 700-1500.
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  • Profile picture of the author yommys01
    If the earning has been consistent for 8 months then you can easily sell for between x10-x12 of the monthly earning ( the monthly earning should be after expenses ).
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  • Profile picture of the author SeanSupplee
    From what I hear its 8 times what the site is making. Otherwise if your just selling the domain names you can value them based on many factors.
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  • Profile picture of the author GoGetta
    I doubt you would get 24-30 times monthly revenue!

    However I would aim for 12-18 months!

    Normally its 10x but you have a few more selling points, i.e aged domains so you will probably be able to ask for more!

    GoGetta
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  • Profile picture of the author cashcow
    I've sold sites for up to 18X monthly earnings but those were sites that were totally passive and had earnings track records of over 1 year.

    Yours seems like it is not very passive (it is stale because it takes time to maintain) but it does have a lot more features in the multiple domains, videos, manuals etc...

    I guess the only way to find out for sure is to list it with a reserve of what you want to sell it for and see what happens. It only costs $19.

    Lee
    Signature
    Gone Fishing
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    • Profile picture of the author Rita012
      Well... for $19 I'll do a test run. I'm going to set the reserve at 15K, as it is just not worth it for me to sell below that price. I've got a ton of high quality unique content in the backend that took many years to create. Whoever buys the site would also get all the manuals, videos, templates, etc.

      If you like, I'll report back on this thread and let you know how it goes.
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  • Profile picture of the author cashcow
    Yes, please do report back. Love to see how it goes - hope you get what you want for it!

    Lee
    Signature
    Gone Fishing
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  • Profile picture of the author mattalways
    Value can be determined from a number of things. As pointed out above, it's not just about monthly earnings, but if you don't explain very carefully to the Flippa community why your price is higher than the 9 - 12 monthly earnings (Which is stupid, why would you sell that cheap unless you knew it was going down hill?), than they will think you're crazy because the majority over there are very stupid and just go by what the site says they should pay lol.

    The aged domains are worth money. What was the Google pagerank? That could play into it. I've sold sites making a few dollars a month for around the $800 mark, so selling this for 5 - 7 k just makes no sense to me. Keep it if that's the price they are willing to pay.
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    Quit wasting your money! If you need a website, get me to do it right! I'll probably even do it for less! Design/Development/Software, I'm your guy! matt@snidge.com
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  • Profile picture of the author Droopy Dawg
    Do some "Flippa Recon", and look at past auctions and see how sites that brought in the same (or close to) amount that yours had.

    $500/month revenue is great... you should be able to sell it for a nice profit.

    Here's how to make it REALLY work for you...

    you can put in your listing that you will "throw in" the forum and other domains to the BIN buyer, and that's when you give the details about the forum. If nobody buys via BIN, then you can just "throw those in" to the customer with the highest bid.

    You can figure your BIN price also from your "recon".

    That's what I'd do anyway

    DeShon



    Originally Posted by Rita012 View Post

    I have a site which I would like to sell on Flippa. I would love some advice.

    Currently the site does about $500/mo in revenue. It has a 3 domains that come with it that are all between 9-11 years old, one of which has a DMOZ listing. I have a very stale forum that at one time was quite active. The reason it is stale is because I didn't want to maintain it anymore, and took it into a backend membership site, and sort of hid it in there.

    The forum has over 55,000 posts. The backend has videos, how-manuals and guides, brochure templates, industry website templates, etc., all for people who want to start a certain kind of niche business.

    The site could actually use a facelift, I could probably get it to revenue of $700/mo with about 25 hours of work on it. ( Currently I spend about 15 minutes per month on the site).


    Question:

    1) What do you think a site like that should be valued at?
    2) Should I fix up my site before then, or should I sell as is, to showcase the fact that I've neglected the site and that it still produces 500/mo consistantly.
    3) When selling a site like this, what do you set as a reserve price, and how long should the auction be?

    Thanks.
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    • Profile picture of the author steven seven
      The rule of x10 is just a guideline or so called the market expectation, everyone who is buying the site from flippa know this rule. You really cannot fool them with x24.

      I have sold a 3 months PR3 site for $5000(Average Income: $500/month) and now the buyer is so happy that the same site is making him $800-$1500/month.

      Another thing worth considering is the demand and supply and also historical data.

      Check out how well the site in particular niche has been doing. Is the niche Hot and are they many buyers and listing ? You will definately will know your number.

      General
      Revenue - $500
      Starting Price - $1500
      Reserve Price - $5000(10X)
      Buy Now Price $6000(12x)

      Steven Yap
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      make your website GLOW
      >>SiteGlow.net<<
      Cheap Hosting & Domain
      >>Tensile Membrane Structure<<
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  • Profile picture of the author Aaarrrggghhh
    I would say right now is really a bad time to list on Flippa. I am still new there but site values are just down really low. If it is something you can hold onto, even for a few months and re-check the stats at Flippa.

    Best of Luck, you have got great assets there.
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    • Profile picture of the author parker
      G'day Rita, sounds like you've got a fairly valuable site there.

      I've sold quite a few sites on flippa and have helped others sell even more.

      Your sale price depends on a LOT of factors. So while there's been some great tips in this thread, you definitely can't take a "X amount of months revenue" as a reserve price (in fact, you shouldn't use a reserve price at all - but that's another story).

      For example, I just helped a friend sell a fairly cheap site for 50x monthly revenue. Another that sold a site closer to your revenue range for 35x monthly revenue. I personally aim for an absolute minimum of 18x monthly revenue.

      Like I said, it depends on a LOT of factors... but from the basics you've told us, you should expect 24x revenue. Assuming you do it the right way.

      If you PM me I'd happily give you some more tips.

      - Yes, I do sell a course that focuses exactly on this topic (see sig) but I'd be more than happy to help a fellow Warrior in the right direction, gratis :-D
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      • Profile picture of the author Rita012
        Originally Posted by parker View Post

        G'day Rita, sounds like you've got a fairly valuable site there.

        I've sold quite a few sites on flippa and have helped others sell even more.

        Your sale price depends on a LOT of factors. So while there's been some great tips in this thread, you definitely can't take a "X amount of months revenue" as a reserve price (in fact, you shouldn't use a reserve price at all - but that's another story).

        For example, I just helped a friend sell a fairly cheap site for 50x monthly revenue. Another that sold a site closer to your revenue range for 35x monthly revenue. I personally aim for an absolute minimum of 18x monthly revenue.

        Like I said, it depends on a LOT of factors... but from the basics you've told us, you should expect 24x revenue. Assuming you do it the right way.

        If you PM me I'd happily give you some more tips.

        - Yes, I do sell a course that focuses exactly on this topic (see sig) but I'd be more than happy to help a fellow Warrior in the right direction, gratis :-D


        Parker - do you sell sites for people?
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        • Profile picture of the author alextsui
          Hello,

          I just want to jump in here and vouch for CJ Parker. (No, I'm not paid to say this This is a totally unsolicited spontaneous response from me.)

          I'm Alex, the guy that CJ mentioned who sold his site for 50x monthly revenue. I had a 2-month old Adsense site that was just earning around $10 per month.

          I had learned some site-selling techniques from CJ's Sell Your Site For More system, and decided to put up my very first Flippa listing. I wasn't expecting much since I was new to site-selling. I was hoping to just get a bit of profit and learn from the experience.

          To my utter surprise and delight, bid after bid started popping up in my email inbox. Before long I was in the top 5 of Flippa's most active listings. The auction was just for 5 days but bids kept coming until the auction time was extended 3 times. I was getting tired so I just put in a BIN (Buy It Now) price, and I sold my site for $500! (50x monthly revenue, more than 4 years' income).

          CJ's site selling tips and methods really work. I know that some of his other students have also done very well.

          If you want to know more details, CJ has a video where he reviews and comments on some very successful Flippa listings (mine is there as well ).

          Check out this video: Get Five (5x) Years Income In Less Than One Week...

          Regards,
          Alex
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          • Profile picture of the author Marketstriker
            I heard that many people who are loyal to Sitepoint have been reluctant to try Flippa. Some say that the Flippa listing fees are too high. Others report being more than satisfied with the service that Flippa provides. So what is worth?
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  • Profile picture of the author txconx
    I'd say it also depends on the niche and the domain name, not just revenue. If it's a hot niche or a premium domain name (for real, not in your imagination), you can get more than just months x revenue for it.

    PR won't matter much since it goes back to zero when the site ownership changes. However, I recently acquired a 12-year-old domain/web site that had been neglected. I moved/redirected one of my other related sites to it and within a month it was up to PR5.
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  • Profile picture of the author parker
    Just sent you a PM Rita. And thanks for the free plug Alex :-D
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  • Profile picture of the author parker
    The new fees on flippa were outrageous not so much because they were unreasonably high, but more because they were such a hike from SitePoint Marketplace.

    SPM was around $20 to sell, and that was it. Flippa is $20 to sell and then a 5% success fee, up to a maximum of $498.

    So one week, a $10k site cost $20 to sell, the next it cost $518 to sell.

    That's why users were pissed. Thing was, sellers had been getting a free ride on SPM for too long (the service was massively underpriced). Fortunately flippa came in a month or two ago with the $99 up-front fee (which does away with the success fee completely), making it far more reasonable to sell expensive sites. So now it's $119 to sell a $10k website, instead of $518.

    But either way you look at the new fees, they're kind of a moot point in my opinion:

    Flippa.com is already far more popular and professional than it ever was as the SitePoint Marketplace, meaning selling prices have increased enough to MORE than cover any extra fees.

    (that's my long-winded way of saying I heart flippa)
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    • Profile picture of the author iMikeDesigns
      CJ... Id like to ask for your advice but I can't pm you. Is there any way I can contact you? It would be very much appreciated. Im sorry to use this thread but there is no other way.

      I would like to add though, I don't agree with everyone saying that their are set it stone rules for how much you can get from a website. Ive sold sites with no earnings for 300+. Good Luck Rita!
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      • Profile picture of the author parker
        No worries mate, just post your email and I'll get in touch.

        Originally Posted by iMikeDesigns View Post

        CJ... Id like to ask for your advice but I can't pm you. Is there any way I can contact you? It would be very much appreciated. Im sorry to use this thread but there is no other way.

        I would like to add though, I don't agree with everyone saying that their are set it stone rules for how much you can get from a website. Ive sold sites with no earnings for 300+. Good Luck Rita!
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        • Profile picture of the author iMikeDesigns
          Thanks. I appreciate. My email is imikedesigns at hotmail. I look forward to hearing from you.
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  • Profile picture of the author LivingCovers
    Hmmm...cool video. So much to learn but little time.
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  • Profile picture of the author Amanda Craven
    CJ, I'd love some help too, especially as I'm one of your Diamond members and I've sent a couple of emails now and a support ticket with no response...

    Perhaps you could PM me?
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  • Profile picture of the author Dr_Matt
    Banned
    [DELETED]
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