Sidewiki marketing?

irrational comments ?? There is nothing irrational about it .. If you support this evil tool then I want nothing to do with your business. It is a invasion of privacy and google trying to force comments on my site that I do not want there..

Be my guest and support it all you want and you will find that many will not support you and even blackball you at every single corner they turn at..

James

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Marty S

14 years ago

LoL! You are TOO predictable!

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Marty S

14 years ago

For those of you not into casting black magic spells of doom on Warriors with a different opinion, and do realize SideWiki is here to stay - I have used it in a number of ways such as:

1- Making sure to have your Website Owner's message posted so that it shows up first.

2- Adding supplementary comments like updates, related videos, or recent posts that pertain to the topic discussed on the page.

3- Using your testimonials for SideWiki content. If people are using SideWiki to get more information about your offer (page), then this is a PERFECT place to post the testimonials from your current customers for anyone to see.

4- You can also use SideWiki when you find an article thief who has not given you credit for your writing. Post a message and link in SideWiki to your original and tell readers there is more and better content there.

5- Use SideWiki to add to your review blog. If you find a great service or product on the web, it takes just 2 minutes to post a positive SideWiki note about it and have it also posted on your WP or Blogger blog.

6- Make sure to have several Blogger blogs set up, because for every SideWiki you enter, you can have it posted on your Blogger blog (or WP too). When I do this the SideWiki entry gets picked up by Google within the hour!

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DogScout

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Marty S

For those of you not into casting black magic spells of doom on Warriors with a different opinion, and do realize SideWiki is here to stay - I have used it in a number of ways such as:

1- Making sure to have your Website Owner's message posted so that it shows up first.

2- Adding supplementary comments like updates, related videos, or recent posts that pertain to the topic discussed on the page.

3- Using your testimonials for SideWiki content. If people are using SideWiki to get more information about your offer (page), then this is a PERFECT place to post the testimonials from your current customers for anyone to see.

4- You can also use SideWiki when you find an article thief who has not given you credit for your writing. Post a message and link in SideWiki to your original and tell readers there is more and better content there.

5- Use SideWiki to add to your review blog. If you find a great service or product on the web, it takes just 2 minutes to post a positive SideWiki note about it and have it also posted on your WP or Blogger blog.

6- Make sure to have several Blogger blogs set up, because for every SideWiki you enter, you can have it posted on your Blogger blog (or WP too). When I do this the SideWiki entry gets picked up by Google within the hour!

Using sidewiki is akin to promoting child pornography in MY opinion. Nor am I into black magic, though if I were, no one would have access to sidewiki.

If no one used it, Google would close it and my grandchildren would not be subjected to pornography on sites for children. Using sidewiki is akin to condoning this in my eyes. MY opinion. It won't change. If someone uses it, I have no use for them. It is the same as using drugs and funding gang wars. The drug use may not be so bad to others, but the use funds ways others use it to kill people. Using sidewiki is the same.

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TheRichJerksNet 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Marty S

LoL! You are TOO predictable!

Not as much as you think ....

James
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theemperor

14 years ago

Originally Posted by TheRichJerksNet

irrational comments ?? There is nothing irrational about it .. If you support this evil tool then I want nothing to do with your business. It is a invasion of privacy and google trying to force comments on my site that I do not want there..

Be my guest and support it all you want and you will find that many will not support you and even blackball you at every single corner they turn at..

James

James - I presume then you are also against delicious.com, reddit.com, digg.com etc. etc. ?

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DogScout 14 years ago

Originally Posted by theemperor

James - I presume then you are also against delicious.com, reddit.com, digg.com etc. etc. ?

Those sites do not publish child pornography on 'child safe' sites. Sidewiki does (allow others to). Huge difference!
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TheRichJerksNet 14 years ago

Originally Posted by theemperor

James - I presume then you are also against delicious.com, reddit.com, digg.com etc. etc. ?

Wait a minute you are actually comparing google's evil sidewiki tool to social media sites ?? No way is that even in the same category. Social bookmarking sites do not invade my privacy and try to force their crap on my sites as if they own them.

You are talking about 2 totally different things.

James
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Paul Myers

14 years ago

Yes, sadly even though this is a marketing forum you will get mostly irrational comments like the one above on SideWiki.

We have already established that anyone who disagrees with Marty is irrational. Just like it was established here years ago that anyone who hated spam was an anti-commerce net.nazi. After all, it's no different than postal mail, and it will never get to be common enough to be a real problem.

Besides, it's marketing. That MUST make it acceptable to marketers... right?

Paul

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Marty S

14 years ago

Contrarily Paul, I would love a rational debate that does not include child pornography, blackballing, evil minds, email SPAM, etc etc...

Disagreeing in this forum is absolutely how any forum should function. I run a forum as well and encourage it. It's the basis for discovery and learning, but not for insults, ridicule and unsubstantiated accusations.

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Paul Myers 14 years ago

It's the basis for discovery and learning, but not for insults, ridicule and unsubstantiated accusations.

Mote, timber. Timber, mote.
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TheRichJerksNet

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Marty S

It's the basis for discovery and learning, but not for insults, ridicule and unsubstantiated accusations.

But yet you insult me by calling me irrational and you make unsubstantiated accusations that I am TOO predictable!

Talk about calling the kettle black ...

Great job Marty

James

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Marty S

14 years ago

Originally Posted by TheRichJerksNet

But yet you insult me by calling me irrational and you make unsubstantiated accusations that I am TOO predictable!

Talk about calling the kettle black ...

Great job Marty

James

Rather tame compared to what you say, no? Get real man.

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Marty S

14 years ago

And you might as well get your licks in now before all of you "respected" marketers get this thread deleted.

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theemperor 14 years ago

This is a thread I wish I never started, there seems to be a lot of emotion on this from both sides and little rational debate.

I have more questions to ask but I might take them elsewhere I think it's just going nowhere this thread
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TheRichJerksNet 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Marty S

And you might as well get your licks in now before all of you "respected" marketers get this thread deleted.

Sounds like a broken record.. Nobody would care if it was deleted as I only see one person promotiong the evil tool and that is you {look at the sig}..

I would find it rather refreshing if Allen actually blocked the use of the word myself .. SideWiki = EvilTool - That would be good and then those that do promote this evil tool using this forum would have their links blocked and not working.

James
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- Marty S 14 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by TheRichJerksNet
  
  Sounds like a broken record.. Nobody would care if it was deleted as I only see one person promotiong the evil tool and that is you {look at the sig}..s
  
  Of course the reality is quite different, but that's never mattered to you. I have always, right from the beg acknowledged its presence and and potential on the WWW and realized its probably better to protect and engage your sites with SideWiki before someone else gets there before you.
  
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Paul Myers

14 years ago

And you might as well get your licks in now before all of you "respected" marketers get this thread deleted.

Repeating the same message. Is that an attempt at subliminal control? Or the simple statement of a desire?

Google can get rid of all the ethical concerns by doing one simple thing: Display Sidewiki comments in a separate window, which does not display the URL of another person or company. They can show whatever discussions they want under their name. They have no business displaying content under my domain name without my permission, and without my having the ability to remove things I don't wish to be associated with.

That is the difference between true social media sites and vandals' tools like Sidewiki.

Paul

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Marty S

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Paul Myers

Is that an attempt at subliminal control? Or the simple statement of a desire?

No. I actually posted some useful tips for the OP who asked a valid question. Cannot say much about the rest of the content here though.

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Paul Myers

14 years ago

Cannot say much about the rest of content here though.

Apparently not. For example, you have not responded to my suggestion about how to remove the ethical issue entirely.

Simple solution. Quite rational, I think.

Paul

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Marty S

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Paul Myers

Apparently not. For example, you have not responded to my suggestion about how to remove the ethical issue entirely.

Simple solution. Quite rational, I think.

Paul

Again Paul, whether we agree with it or not, it's there. And Google has found a way around that ethical point you make (which I agree has validity), by letting SideWiki users read and post SideWiki comments on their own browser interface, not your website.

There are technical arguments with that too, but nobody has proven it unethical, and Google isn't the first or last company do such a thing. It's simply a waste of time IMHO to be arguing about it, I will let all of you do that. I am just trying to use it in ways that can help my websites and content. This however, emanates from my point of view of engaging consumers, and not blocking free and unrestricted comments.

The web is turning into a social media hub and if you can't handle a little SideWiki action now, your problems are only going to compounded as social media and social media APPs like SideWiki will become the major source of information on the internet.

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Paul Myers

14 years ago

Again Paul, whether we agree with it or not, it's there.

And, of course, that means I should just shut up and accept whatever they want to do to my reputation. It all makes perfect sense, when you put it that way.

And Google has found a way around that ethical point you make (which I agree has validity), by letting SideWiki users read and post SideWiki comments on their own browser interface, not your website.

That's such ridiculous hair-splitting that I'm tempted to think you're trolling, Marty. Except that I know you're not. You actually think that comment has meaning in the real world.

The only URL in the location bar when that extra pane is opened is that of the site the visitor went to. A significant chunk of the people seeing those comments think they are on the site in the location bar. And we're not talking about just the idiots here. This is the impression that a lot of intelligent, reasonable people have when they see it.

Google is knowingly creating the impression that the owner of the site is willingly associated with whatever is in those comments. That is unethical.

This however, emanates from my point of view of engaging consumers, and not blocking free and unrestricted comments.

Bullsh!t. You don't believe that the Internet should be completely open and unrestricted in every area any more than I do. If you did, every site you own would be an unmoderated blog. And you wouldn't be participating in a moderated forum.

The web is turning into a social media hub and if you can't handle a little SideWiki action now, your problems are only going to compounded as social media and social media APPs like SideWiki will become the major source of information on the internet.

Same response as above.

I love the "if you can't handle it" stuff, though. It suggests that objecting to something is a sign of fear or incompetence. It denies even the possibility of a real and sincere ethical objection. An attempt to rebut the argument by trivializing the person presenting it.

Smooth, Marty. Real smooth. That probably even works on the less experienced folks.

Paul

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ron.the.bull

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Paul Myers

Repeating the same message. Is that an attempt at subliminal control? Or the simple statement of a desire?

Google can get rid of all the ethical concerns by doing one simple thing: Display Sidewiki comments in a separate window, which does not display the URL of another person or company. They can show whatever discussions they want under their name. They have no business displaying content under my domain name without my permission, and without my having the ability to remove things I don't wish to be associated with.

That is the difference between true social media sites and vandals' tools like Sidewiki.

Paul

What G needs to do to make it ethical is give the site owner an opt-out. Nothing short of that is acceptable.

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Bev Clement 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Marty S

I would love a rational debate that does not include child pornography, blackballing, evil minds, email SPAM, etc etc...

Who decides what is rational, and as you have said we can't use include certain topic, how about a list of what can be included.
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DogScout

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Marty S

Contrarily Paul, I would love a rational debate that does not include child pornography, blackballing, evil minds, email SPAM, etc etc...

I was at the Disney main site, my grandson was with me, we were looking at the cruise ship thing and I opened the sidewiki on a whim. God knows I wish I had not. It is difficult to explain to an 11 year old what some man-boy-love organization is about and even harder to explain why it is endorsed by Disney.

If we are going to have a rational discussion about a product, it should include all of the ramifications of that product, not just a watered down benign, sugar coated view of it.

If someone is going to use and endorse a product that is used in a way that prevents me from protecting my child or grandchild from filth, in my own little mind, that is if not outright evil, total ignorance and blind thinking.

I makes me question the ethics or intelligence of the users. Especially in a case like this where the potential damage is so blatant and obvious. It amazes me the Google hasn't shut it down. Especially since they have threatened to pull out of China over information and human rights issues, but not addresses blatant mis-use of a product that I cannot imagine is bringing in that much money. They must have some sort of plan to rake in a ton of cash to allow what is going on to happen. Any respect for that company I have lost as well as anyone that encourages the use of that product.

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reapr

14 years ago

Originally Posted by DogScout

I was at the Disney main site, my grandson was with me, we were looking at the cruise ship thing and I opened the sidewiki on a whim. God knows I wish I had not. It is difficult to explain to an 11 year old what some man-boy-love organization is about and even harder to explain why it is endorsed by Disney.

If we are going to have a rational discussion about a product, it should include all of the ramifications of that product, not just a watered down benign, sugar coated view of it.

If someone is going to use and endorse a product that is used in a way that prevents me from protecting my child or grandchild from filth, in my own little mind, that is if not outright evil, total ignorance and blind thinking.

I makes me question the ethics or intelligence of the users. Especially in a case like this where the potential damage is so blatant and obvious. It amazes me the Google hasn't shut it down. Especially since they have threatened to pull out of China over information and human rights issues, but not addresses blatant mis-use of a product that I cannot imagine is bringing in that much money. They must have some sort of plan to rake in a ton of cash to allow what is going on to happen. Any respect for that company I have lost as well as anyone that encourages the use of that product.

Yup have to agree with this post ...

It appears that the one who yields the 500lb hammer can call the shots. It ever amazes me more that someone who wants respect or wants seasoned internet marketers to unbiasedly think that sidewiki is a good thing when there is many well respected marketers in this thread stating the problems it ... but then again I am not defending a product or service.

Yeah nothing worse that having your grandkid or child next to you searching innocent sites then end up with naked people doing fancy yoga moves together. Unfortunately I have had to bookmark sites b4 the kids show up if I want to take them surfing. If a SE is claiming human rights issues for pulling out of China then creating a product that has the potential to spam and harm their content providers and users they really need to re-examine thier PR(public relations) machine because this ol' dog aint buying it.

Obviously though a few have imbibed or bathed in the red cool-aid.

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R Hagel 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Paul Myers

Besides, it's marketing. That MUST make it acceptable to marketers... right?

Of course.

Now excuse me while I go create 500 link-filled profiles here on the forum. I might toss in a few "real" users too for sock puppet purposes. Hey, it's just marketing.

After I get done with that task, I need to send out my bot to harvest emails around the 'Net. It's just marketing.

Next on my to-do list: I need to use my bot to send out automated messages to people who post ads on CraigsList. Hey, they asked to be contacted, so they can't complain when I actually do it! It's just marketing.

And yeah: I need to go post ads -- er, I mean "discussion comments" -- on SideWiki. I'm sure the fine folks who run sites competing with mine won't mind if I post an "honest" review of their sites.

Cheers,
Becky

P.S. As DogScout said, if no one used SW, they'd consider the tool a failure and shut it down. If only spammers and porn webmaster and stalkers and other folks like that used it, they'd shut it down because the resource drain wouldn't be worth the hassle.

Promoting its use just lengthens its shelf life.
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Bev Clement

14 years ago

suggest you use the search to see what people have said before about it

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Jason_V

14 years ago

Originally Posted by theemperor

Hi

I think the Google Sidewiki is a very useful tool, and also perhaps a dangerous one if it catches on (you could say false bad things about your competition for example

)

However it is yet another social bookmarking / networking kind of tool. Firstly you can write a great intro to your site in the site wiki as the site owner. I have done this on one of my sites.

Also you can join in discussions on other sites, and just like twitter I imagine you can give useful advice, people will click to look on your profile, and may visit your site, or you could link directly to a site.

It seems pretty slow at the moment, not that many comments even on Google.com itself but I am sure it will get bigger with time.

Any thoughts on this?

As Bev said above, just do a forum search and you'll find more than you care to know about this "beloved" topic at this forum.

If/when you do the search, you'll see that the majority of the most respected marketers/Warriors here have had nothing but contempt for Sidewiki. It will have more impact if you read their comments/thoughts individually in their own words.

Originally Posted by Marty S

Yes, sadly even though this is a marketing forum you will get mostly irrational comments like the one above on SideWiki.

Yeah and spamming people's email is also a marketing technique used by people/companies. I don't see many posts/wso's/etc...Suggesting you harvest email addresses and spam people, but this is a marketing forum. Gee, wonder why that is?

We can take it to the local advertising level too. I mean, a good marketing technique is spray painting my business name, phone number, and address on the building occupied by my competition. In fact, perhaps maybe that should be a new suggested offline marketing tactic? I mean, why not? It's the same as Sidewicki.

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Marty S 14 years ago

Yup here we go again. Have fun with this until "respected marketers" once again get this thread deleted for spewing more nonsense.
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theemperor

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Jason_V

As Bev said above, just do a forum search and you'll find more than you care to know about this "beloved" topic at this forum.

If/when you do the search, you'll see that the majority of the most respected marketers/Warriors here have had nothing but contempt for Sidewiki. It will have more impact if you read their comments/thoughts individually in their own words.

Yes I can see from the search there are people coming up with solutions on how to avoid the sidewiki by adding random characters to your URL. The argument being that people are going to steal your traffic so best to block it.

I don't see how the sidewiki is a lot different to social bookmarking though. Someone could develop a "sidewiki" plugin that uses reddit to make comments about a site fairly easily.

The sidewiki may cause problems for some webmasters, but I think the development of such technologies either by Google or other players is inevitable. Infact I had the idea myself a few years ago, but realised you needed to be a big player to make it a success.

It's not the first thing to create this sort of problem for webmasters. Free blogging makes it easy for anyone to make bad comments about a product / person / website and if lucky get listed highly on the SERPs. I have seen this in action.

So given that the sidewiki is reality, I think it is fair to consider what advantages it has. Not using it for marketing won't make it go away.

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sbucciarel

Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by theemperor

Yes I can see from the search there are people coming up with solutions on how to avoid the sidewiki by adding random characters to your URL. The argument being that people are going to steal your traffic so best to block it.

I don't see how the sidewiki is a lot different to social bookmarking though. Someone could develop a "sidewiki" plugin that uses reddit to make comments about a site fairly easily.

The sidewiki may cause problems for some webmasters, but I think the development of such technologies either by Google or other players is inevitable. Infact I had the idea myself a few years ago, but realised you needed to be a big player to make it a success.

It's not the first thing to create this sort of problem for webmasters. Free blogging makes it easy for anyone to make bad comments about a product / person / website and if lucky get listed highly on the SERPs. I have seen this in action.

So given that the sidewiki is reality, I think it is fair to consider what advantages it has. Not using it for marketing won't make it go away.

But software will make it go away. Social Bookmarking sites do not infringe on my sites. They do not attach theirselves to my sites. They do not hijack my blog conversations as Sidewiki does.

But go ahead ... you got Marty on your side. He's all for Sidewiki spamming as seen in the previous threads. But Sidewiki is a legend in Google's own eyes ... hasn't gone anywhere, isn't very popular, and probably won't ever be.

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Marty S

14 years ago

Originally Posted by sbucciarel

But go ahead ... you got Marty on your side. He's all for Sidewiki spamming as seen in the previous threads.

Please direct me as to where I have encouraged this and I will happily correct any of your misconceptions.

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sbucciarel

Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Marty S

Please direct me as to where I have encouraged this and I will happily correct any of your misconceptions.

In the first discussions about this you were all gung ho and immediately there was a link in your sig about how to capitalize on Sidewiki. Obviously you were going to get rick with a great Sidewiki product.

Are you trying to tell us that your love of Sidewiki is so that you can drop by our sites and tell us what a good job we're doing ... the old atta boy thing? Who else believes this?

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Marty S 14 years ago

Still waiting for those comments sbucciarel, please provide such so we can clear things up.
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reapr 14 years ago

Sidewiki is just plain wrong! There is no way to opt out! There is no way to control the content!

Some SE's think because they own the vehicle that brought you the traffic they also own then streets that took them there and the destination too!

SE's can advertise or encourage others to spam their own storefront all they want just don't do it on mine.
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DogScout

14 years ago

Originally Posted by sbucciarel

In the first discussions about this you were all gung ho and immediately there was a link in your sig about how to capitalize on Sidewiki. Obviously you were going to get rick with a great Sidewiki product.

Is it an 'Adult' product?

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sbucciarel

Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by DogScout

Is it an 'Adult' product?

No ... doubt that it was an adult product but most likely an info product on how to exploit Sidewiki. I don't click his links, but noticed that he jumped on that bandwagon right away. Not sure if it ever made it to WSO status.

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Marty S

14 years ago

Well I left some useful tips for those who are facing reality. This has now degenerated into exaggerations and insinuations. Thank you "respected marketers" !!

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sbucciarel

Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Marty S

Well I left some useful tips for those who are facing reality. This has now degenerated into exaggerations and insinuations. Thank you "respected marketers" !!

You're the one Marty who came into this thread in your normal, combative fashion every time Sidewiki is mentioned. To insinuate that we're aren't really "respected marketers" because our opinion differs from yours is insulting, but insulting is what you do in these threads.

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TheRichJerksNet

14 years ago

Originally Posted by sbucciarel

You're the one Marty who came into this thread in your normal, combative fashion every time Sidewiki is mentioned. To insinuate that we're aren't really "respected marketers" because our opinion differs from yours is insulting, but insulting is what you do in these threads.

Exactly ... It amazing how shallow some people can be ...

James

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debra 14 years ago

You know...I hate sidewiki more than I can describe in words. Because I look at it as an open window that allows every and any preditor to do he's will without recourse.

I often have thought that maybe a petition by an organised activist group could be curcuited around. I do feel that our civil libilities rights are at risk among others.

Maybe google will listen to news media if there's enough of it.
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Paul Myers 14 years ago

Well I left some useful tips for those who are facing reality.

The 'insinuation' being that anyone who disagrees with you isn't facing reality. That our concerns don't actually have any basis in what's really happening. You've yet to substantiate that belief.

This has now degenerated into exaggerations and insinuations.

Sort of hypocritical, considering your previous comments in this thread, no?

Paul
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- Eric Lorence 14 years ago
  
  Say ... I'm just trying to find the "Spray Paint my Logo on neighbors garage door" marketing thread ...
  
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DogScout

14 years ago

Sidewiki is unethical in my estimation. It allows someone to publish content on my sites that I have no control of.

It would be like having open comments on your blog without the ability to delete or not approve spam. I have seen ads for porno and worse on family sites that Google had not gotten around to deleting yet.

When a technology is implemented that allows the avocation of child pornography on a Disney site where children frequent, even if only for the 5-15 minutes before someone flags it, is akin to abetting that activity. If ever I next get a screen shot of what I have seen, I may very well open legal action. Personally I do not want my grandchildren subjected to hate and porn on children's sites, but now it sometimes is on those sites in the sidewiki. The internet is now not safe for kids under 18 no matter what site you restrict them to. Pornographers and hate mongers use it to push their unethical, filthy and disgusting agendas. Anyone advocating use of that is slim in my eyes. Any use of it only encourages them and makes it easier for children to be subjected to filth!

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theemperor

14 years ago

When a technology is implemented that allows the avocation of child pornography on a Disney site where children frequent, even if only for the 5-15 minutes before someone flags it, is akin to abetting that activity. If ever I next get a screen shot of what I have seen, I may very well open legal action. Personally I do not want my grandchildren subjected to hate and porn on children's sites, but now it sometimes is on those sites in the sidewiki. The internet is now not safe for kids under 18 no matter what site you restrict them to. Pornographers and hate mongers use it to push their unethical, filthy and disgusting agendas. Anyone advocating use of that is slim in my eyes. Any use of it only encourages them and makes it easier for children to be subjected to filth!

I agree that this is totally unacceptable. It should work like wordpress where nothing is shown until approved, not shown and then checked afterward. This is definitely a flaw in the implementation of sidewiki.

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sbucciarel

Banned 14 years ago

Many of us here, including the Warrior Forum itself is blocking Sidewiki to prevent just this sort of spam to our sites and competition trying to discredit us.

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Marty S 14 years ago

Originally Posted by sbucciarel

trying to discredit us.

Doing a pretty good job of that yourselves!
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How to make offline videos for clients
How to add a custom thumbnail image to your Youtube video
How to CUT THE FAT in your YOUTUBE videos
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- sbucciarel Banned 14 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Marty S
  
  Doing a pretty good job of that yourselves!
  
  Meaning what Marty? That if we don't like Sidewiki spam on our sites, that somehow discredits us? Or maybe if we disagree with you, we are somehow discredited?
  
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