Article Submission Question

87 replies
Ignorant question. I'm about to start to on an article submission campaign as part of a link building strategy, but I have a practical question: can you submit the same article to more than one article submission site? Some "experts" say yes, but I find it hard to believe that's a good idea. What if more than one site grabbed the article? Don't they all require exclusive access to the material?
#article #question #submission
  • Profile picture of the author KristiDaniels
    It is not a good idea.

    Any publication worth being published in required orignal material.

    The very best require that you simply submit your bio and a proposal. They will tell you what they want you to write about.

    Any major publication will require at least first printing rights.
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    • Profile picture of the author Why9999
      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      It is not a good idea.

      Any publication worth being published in required orignal material.

      The very best require that you simply submit your bio and a proposal. They will tell you what they want you to write about.

      Any major publication will require at least first printing rights.
      Thanks for the information. I don't want to step on any toes!

      Sorry, I'm talking about places like ezine, articlesbase, etc. Are you saying these places tell me what I want to write about? I thought I actually submitted an article to them??
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    • Profile picture of the author Nicola Lane
      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      It is not a good idea.

      Any publication worth being published in required original material.

      The very best require that you simply submit your bio and a proposal. They will tell you what they want you to write about.

      Any major publication will require at least first printing rights.
      Kristi, You are confusing Print publications - that traditionally pay you to write for them - and online article directories, that you will submit to to gain exposure and backlinks.

      Your advice is great for people looking to earn money as article writers for print magazines.

      Unfortunately it is quite irrelevant for online marketers looking to market their websites/products etc.

      If you wish to know about article marketing I suggest many of the excellent threads on these boards for advice.
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  • Originally Posted by Why9999 View Post

    Ignorant question. I'm about to start to on an article submission campaign as part of a link building strategy, but I have a practical question: can you submit the same article to more than one article submission site? Some "experts" say yes, but I find it hard to believe that's a good idea. What if more than one site grabbed the article? Don't they all require exclusive access to the material?
    Most article directories in the list of "top" 50 (read: those that actually count in terms of effectiveness) require submitted content exclusivity.

    There are article directories which accept article content already published on others, yes, but I believe this would be a better method:

    ---> create a unique, freshly written article following this format from top to bottom (title, description, 2/3 body, last 1/3 body, bio box) = attention, interest, usefulness/helpfulness, curiosity, call to action;

    ---> manually and properly (don't just use a thesaurus for synonyms) spin the freshly written article from top to bottom (title, description, 2/3 body, last 1/3 body, bio box) = 2 phrase variants for each of 2 selected phrases per sentence, 2 sentence variants with 2 phrase variants per sentence, and 2 paragraph variants with 2 sentence vairiants with 2 phrase variants per ssentence per paragraph;

    ---> use an efficient article spinning tool to produce 50-100 unique versions of the spun article (tool should be capable of filtering out below 70% unique versions to provide you with versions which are each 70%-above unique);

    ---> get a list of the top 50 (top 50 if you have 50 versions or top 100 if you have 100 and so on) article directories;

    ---> gather these details for each article directory in your list = PR, Alexa rank, total number of outbound links in published article page, total number of inbound links in published article page, total number of outbound links in published article body, total number of inbound links in published article body, total number of outbound links in published article bio, and total number of inbound links in published article bio (for number of outbound and inbound links --- go to 10 most recently published articles on each directory in your list to get averages);

    ---> create a proprietary weight-per-factor system which will allow you to accurately rank your list of article directories in terms of effectiveness;

    ---> create a plan to randomize article submission frequency; and

    ---> stick to your submission frequency randomization plan then submit each of your articles following this method = version 1 to directory 1, version 2 to directory 2, version 3 to directory 3 and so on (if you have 50 unique versions - each 70%-above unique -, then your submission frequency randomization should span across 1-1.25 months).

    Hope this helps.
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    • Profile picture of the author Why9999
      Originally Posted by Marx Vergel Melencio View Post

      Most article directories in the list of "top" 50 (read: those that actually count in terms of effectiveness) require submitted content exclusivity.

      There are article directories which accept article content already published on others, yes, but I believe this would be a better method:

      ---> create a unique, freshly written article following this format from top to bottom (title, description, 2/3 body, last 1/3 body, bio box) = attention, interest, usefulness/helpfulness, curiosity, call to action;

      ---> manually and properly (don't just use a thesaurus for synonyms) spin the freshly written article from top to bottom (title, description, 2/3 body, last 1/3 body, bio box) = 2 phrase variants for each of 2 selected phrases per sentence, 2 sentence variants with 2 phrase variants per sentence, and 2 paragraph variants with 2 sentence vairiants with 2 phrase variants per ssentence per paragraph;

      ---> use an efficient article spinning tool to produce 50-100 unique versions of the spun article (tool should be capable of filtering out below 70% unique versions to provide you with versions which are each 70%-above unique);

      ---> get a list of the top 50 (top 50 if you have 50 versions or top 100 if you have 100 and so on) article directories;

      ---> gather these details for each article directory in your list = PR, Alexa rank, total number of outbound links in published article page, total number of inbound links in published article page, total number of outbound links in published article body, total number of inbound links in published article body, total number of outbound links in published article bio, and total number of inbound links in published article bio (for number of outbound and inbound links --- go to 10 most recently published articles on each directory in your list to get averages);

      ---> create a proprietary weight-per-factor system which will allow you to accurately rank your list of article directories in terms of effectiveness;

      ---> create a plan to randomize article submission frequency; and

      ---> stick to your submission frequency randomization plan then submit each of your articles following this method = version 1 to directory 1, version 2 to directory 2, version 3 to directory 3 and so on (if you have 50 unique versions - each 70%-above unique -, then your submission frequency randomization should span across 1-1.25 months).

      Hope this helps.
      Wow! Is there really a tool that would do all this?? I have never heard of such an animal. It seems too good to be true.

      I have a more fundamental question though:

      I write mostly scientific/technical/medical/health articles and what I've noticed is that only ezine, ehow and a couple others ever rank in these categories, so I've got to be honest that I'm not sure it's really worth it to submit anywhere else. My goal is to get backlinks and what good is it for me to submit to a second or third tier article site where I will be on page 13 of Google? I probably already have that with my own personal blog.

      Please let me know if I'm missing something - I admit I'm a complete newbie. I'm just trying to figure out this crazy business and get my site off PR0!
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      • Originally Posted by Why9999 View Post

        Wow! Is there really a tool that would do all this?? I have never heard of such an animal. It seems too good to be true.
        Yes, there are many article spinning tools.

        Gauge the advantages you'd get when you know software programming then hypothetically innovate on the basis of having a server-installed software running 24 hours a day 7 days a week while constantly connected to the Internet. This'll perhaps answer your questions and could possibly give you a ton of innovative ideas about online tools.

        Well, frankly === we've developed such a tool with a lot more functions than what I mentioned, but sorry = it's an inhouse tool I'm afraid.

        Originally Posted by Why9999 View Post

        I have a more fundamental question though:

        I write mostly scientific/technical/medical/health articles and what I've noticed is that only ezine, ehow and a couple others ever rank in these categories, so I've got to be honest that I'm not sure it's really worth it to submit anywhere else. My goal is to get backlinks and what good is it for me to submit to a second or third tier article site where I will be on page 13 of Google? I probably already have that with my own personal blog.

        Please let me know if I'm missing something - I admit I'm a complete newbie. I'm just trying to figure out this crazy business and get my site off PR0!
        Wider target market exposure.

        Each article directory has their own member syndication list. This means people who own other sites/blogs/community portals/etc. syndicate useful/helpful content relevant to their niches on their own sites.

        Of course, each of these sites have their own viewership.

        Now, if you submit 50 unique (each 70% unique) versions providing useful/helpful content and formatted in the way I mentioned (title = attention, description = interest, 2/3 body = useful/helpful info/advice, last 1/3 body = curiosity for more or new useful/helpful info/advice relevant to the topic, bio box = call to action) to the top 50 article directories (all unique content on each directory), then:

        ---> wouldn't you get a larger share of your target market reading your content and seeing your call to action bio box on the sites/ezine publishers/announcement boards/blogs/community sites/etc. which are included in the content syndication list of each of these 50 directories;

        ---> wouldn't you have more backlinks on these PR0-9 sites;

        ---> wouldn't it not matter even if your content isn't 100% unique (just 70%-above) since these article directories will publish it as unique content anyway (70% uniqueness is unique content) and different hordes of people who are different reader groups of the sites/blogs/community sites/etc. included in each of the unique content syndication lists of each of these article directories will be able to read your content and see your call to action bio box; and

        ---> wouldn't having each of your 50 70% unique article versions under different pennames populating the 1st to 50th results of Google after a relevant keyword search is made a more effective approach for your online/SE marketing campaign?

        More people see your content and bio box on those sites/announcement boards/ezine publishers/as RSS feeds/blogs/community sites.

        More people see your content and bio box because you hold the 1st and 50th results on Google and other search engines.

        A lot of naturally built backlinks pointing to your articles (because of content syndication) and your sites (because of your bio box) will be found by Google and other search engines.

        And, since you focus on scientific/technical/medical niches, wouldn't you need to stick to acceptable standards when innovating content information? I mean having 100% unique articles wouldn't be any different from having 70% unique articles because those niches require article authors to strictly follow acceptable standards for research analysis, formulation of "innovative" content ideas and writing down those ideas in highly comprehensible ways.

        These are just a few reasons why you can think of doing this then actually doing it once you've get everything sorted out.
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  • Profile picture of the author satrap
    If I am understanding your question correctly, there is no problem with submitting the same article to multiple directories. Some people say its best to change the article a little bit so you can rank for each individual article since they will be kind of unique because of the changes, But as far as article directories are concern, you can submit the same article to thousands of article directories.

    However if you dont want to run into problem later on and have your articled pulled down and be accused of stealing content, its a good idea to use the same name or the same pen name when registering with different article directories.

    Now as far as exclusive access thing goes, thats just few sites that require that, specially if your getting paid for the article as well. Like AssociatedContent, you can submit article there and be eligible for upfront payment, but you can not submit the article anywhere else, even on your own site, Basically you selling the rights of your article(sort of). But if you dont want to give them the exclusivity, you can submit your article for performance payment, which you get paid per thousand views(I think a $1 or so), but you keep the right to publish your article elsewhere as well.

    I hope that answers your question, sorry if I misunderstood.
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    • Profile picture of the author krharper
      I have found that submitting original, unique, quality content can't be beat for long-term results. Rather than flood the net with copies or poorly developed knock-offs, spend your time creating and submitting quality and it will pay off in the long run.
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    • Profile picture of the author Why9999
      Originally Posted by satrap View Post

      If I am understanding your question correctly, there is no problem with submitting the same article to multiple directories. Some people say its best to change the article a little bit so you can rank for each individual article since they will be kind of unique because of the changes, But as far as article directories are concern, you can submit the same article to thousands of article directories.

      However if you dont want to run into problem later on and have your articled pulled down and be accused of stealing content, its a good idea to use the same name or the same pen name when registering with different article directories.

      Now as far as exclusive access thing goes, thats just few sites that require that, specially if your getting paid for the article as well. Like AssociatedContent, you can submit article there and be eligible for upfront payment, but you can not submit the article anywhere else, even on your own site, Basically you selling the rights of your article(sort of). But if you dont want to give them the exclusivity, you can submit your article for performance payment, which you get paid per thousand views(I think a $1 or so), but you keep the right to publish your article elsewhere as well.

      I hope that answers your question, sorry if I misunderstood.
      Really? So you can submit the exact same article (with the same penname) to ezine, articlesbase and goarticles and call it a night?

      But wouldn't that be googicide if ezine and articlesbase, for example, both published the exact same article? Then you'd have identical content hit google's bots and google would flag penalize them for plagiarism, right?

      I've never seen the same article twice and isn't that maybe why??
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      • Originally Posted by Why9999 View Post

        Really? So you can submit the exact same article (with the same penname) to ezine, articlesbase and goarticles and call it a night?

        But wouldn't that be googicide if ezine and articlesbase, for example, both published the exact same article? Then you'd have identical content hit google's bots and google would flag penalize them for plagiarism, right?

        I've never seen the same article twice and isn't that maybe why??

        I believe search engine penalties for duplicate content is a myth.

        Why?

        These search engines would be better off exhausting their resources for ranking sites which publish the content first before others than answering emails from webmasters about duplicate content complaints or manually filtering (read: software couldn't possibly do this with 100% accuracy at least considering the technology we currently have) "plagiarized" content (read: actually plagiarized content which goes beyond fair use) or adding then constantly tweaking SE bot functions for determining if duplicate content found on other sites' from the same author or otherwise. After all, timely information is better in terms of content usefulness/relevance for the target reader, so first published content would just need to rank higher than the exact same content published next on a different site. In business, if there's an easier and cost-effective ethical (ethical = because content "plagiarism" shouldn't be handled by these search engines --- at least I believe they think this way --- since those are internal problems between complainants and plagiarists) method for achieving the same end result, then that must be chosen, further optimized to become easier and more effective, implemented and constantly tweaked.

        For me, this would be more of an issue regarding duplicate content:

        ---> having the same viewers reading the same content on different sites; but...


        ...submitting 70% unique versions under different pennames on different directories with different groups of site/blog/announcement board/mailing list/community site owners included in their content syndication lists would mean:

        ---> different groups of people reading 70% unique versions on different sites.

        So, I believe the latter method would be more effective in terms of widening target market exposure, improving PR and SE rankings of your articles and ultimately: your sites, and gaining higher conversions which translate to higher sales margins for you (attention, interest, usefulness/helpfulness, curiosity, call to action --- format how all content must be written IMHO) than the former.
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      • Profile picture of the author satrap
        Originally Posted by Why9999 View Post

        Really? So you can submit the exact same article (with the same penname) to ezine, articlesbase and goarticles and call it a night?

        But wouldn't that be googicide if ezine and articlesbase, for example, both published the exact same article? Then you'd have identical content hit google's bots and google would flag penalize them for plagiarism, right?

        I've never seen the same article twice and isn't that maybe why??
        What?... I dont know if your kidding or what. You haven't seen the same article twice? Do you use the same internet and same Google as the rest of us?
        I submit all my articles to more than 10 high ranking directories, and I never had any problem. How would it be googlicide if two article directories published the same article? So you think all of these directories have original content and no one article can be found on two or more article directories?...
        I am not trying to be rude, but Dud are you still with us?...
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  • Profile picture of the author KristiDaniels
    I have been published more than 500 times. One article yielded $240,000 in sales.

    Every single publication I have ever been published in has required original material and first printing rights.

    The publications with the most impact in terms of sales (including the $240K example) not only required original material and first printing rights... they also told me exactly what to write about, made me rewrite my article twice before accepting it and demanding exclusive printing and reprint rights.

    You can probably find a lot of sub-standard online only publications that will accept reprints, but you won't get very much impact from your article campaign doing that.
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    • Profile picture of the author Why9999
      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      I have been published more than 500 times. One article yielded $240,000 in sales.

      Every single publication I have ever been published in has required original material and first printing rights.

      The publications with the most impact in terms of sales (including the $240K example) not only required original material and first printing rights... they also told me exactly what to write about, made me rewrite my article twice before accepting it and demanding exclusive printing and reprint rights.

      You can probably find a lot of sub-standard online only publications that will accept reprints, but you won't get very much impact from your article campaign doing that.
      $240,000 in sales?? Good night! Are you talking about submissions to magazine and journals, right?

      And how in the world did you generate a quarter mil in sales from one article?!?
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  • Profile picture of the author KristiDaniels
    An invaluable resource for article marketing is:

    Writer's Market

    It is a book that comes out every year. You can find it on Amazon or Barnes and Noble. Here is an Amazon link:

    Amazon.com: 2010 Writer's Market (9781582975795):...Amazon.com: 2010 Writer's Market (9781582975795):...
    That book teaches you the entire process, gives you the jargon you need and most of the book is filled with publications along with editor names, addresses, FAX numbers and email addresses.

    It is the Bible of article marketing. You really shouldn't start an article marketing campaign without it.

    And it's only $20!
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    • Profile picture of the author Why9999
      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      An invaluable resource for article marketing is:

      Writer's Market

      It is a book that comes out every year. You can find it on Amazon or Barnes and Noble. Here is an Amazon link:

      Amazon.com: 2010 Writer's Market (9781582975795): Robert Lee Brewer: Books

      That book teaches you the entire process, gives you the jargon you need and most of the book is filled with publications along with editor names, addresses, FAX numbers and email addresses.

      It is the Bible of article marketing. You really shouldn't start an article marketing campaign without it.

      And it's only $20!
      Are you talking about the Writer's Digest "Bible"? I had one about 10 years ago and it is fantastic, but I'm just talking about article submission to online sites like ezine, etc to build backlinks (and some traffic and "expert recognition", etc). I don't think the book you mentioned covers that kind of article submission, does it?
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  • Profile picture of the author Chelsea
    I say YES! Go for it!! But in my opinion it's only really necessary to submit to 3-5 top ones...goarticles.com, ezinearticles.com, etc. etc. But if you have like a article submitter or something then I guess thats a different story, lol....but if doing it by hand, no prob.

    Duplicate content slaps are a myth....duplicate content on different websites is all over google...especially the first page! Just as long as you dont put duplicate content on the SAME website, you're ok!

    SO yeah, Just submit as many articles as you can period Good luck!
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  • Profile picture of the author KristiDaniels
    Writer's Market covers all kinds of article submissions.

    Remember that all publications are online now.

    You will want to avoid the ones that are ONLY online though for best results.

    Your online campaign will probably get 90% of it's results from the online version of the publication. But real publications that deliver real article marketing results have both an online and a paper version.

    You will see thread after thread about people complaining that submission only to EzineArticles.com and the other "online only" publications just doesn't yield any results.

    And that makes sense. Those "publications", if you can even call them publications, are mostly visited by your peers, not your prospects.

    Go where your prospects are reading. If you are into "health" like one poster said, you have a lot better chance reaching them while they are busy reading "Fitness" magazine than EzineArticles.com.

    Just ask your prospects if you don't believe me. Put up a survey on your site and ask them what publications they read. Make it a simple checkbox survey and ask them to check all of the publications they read. Put EzineArticles.com in the list along with the real publications.

    Once you see that 63% of your prospects read "Fitness" magazine and 0.12% read EzineArticles.com, you'll want to focus on getting published in Fitness magazine rather than EzineArticles.com.

    It's Marketing 101. Go where your prospects are hanging out.
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    • Profile picture of the author Why9999
      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      Writer's Market covers all kinds of article submissions.

      Remember that all publications are online now.

      You will want to avoid the ones that are ONLY online though for best results.

      Your online campaign will probably get 90% of it's results from the online version of the publication. But real publications that deliver real article marketing results have both an online and a paper version.

      You will see thread after thread about people complaining that submission only to EzineArticles.com and the other "online only" publications just doesn't yield any results.

      And that makes sense. Those "publications", if you can even call them publications, are mostly visited by your peers, not your prospects.

      Go where your prospects are reading. If you are into "health" like one poster said, you have a lot better chance reaching them while they are busy reading "Fitness" magazine than EzineArticles.com.

      Just ask your prospects if you don't believe me. Put up a survey on your site and ask them what publications they read. Make it a simple checkbox survey and ask them to check all of the publications they read. Put EzineArticles.com in the list along with the real publications.

      Once you see that 63% of your prospects read "Fitness" magazine and 0.12% read EzineArticles.com, you'll want to focus on getting published in Fitness magazine rather than EzineArticles.com.

      It's Marketing 101. Go where your prospects are hanging out.
      I really appreciate you're taking time for a newbie like me. I have been excitedly reading this post and the one you posted after - in fact, I read it to my wife. You have "blown my mind" with what you are writing and so thanks for the "mind expansion" here.

      Here's my question though: I've got a Masters in a technical field and I'm a good writer (when I don't rush) imho, but I have no credentials. My twitter page is page rank 6 because I'm good at header lines and have solid content and writing. I get thank you letters quite often from readers, etc.

      I'm not boasting, but have this question: even if I am a reasonably good writer, how can I get my foot in the door at Fitness magazine or any similar publication with no credentials?

      I realize this is probably a big question. If you can give me an idea where to read to find the answer to that question, I will research it.

      I love to write. I love to create. I love to influence. None of my other careers have really fulfilled me, because they don't have those elements within them. Writing can do all of them for me though...
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  • Profile picture of the author traceye
    It all depends on your goal with your article marketing campaign.

    Yes you are allowed to send the same article to as many directories as you like as long as you are the original author. That's what article directories are for in many cases anyway, for other people i.e. blog owners, ezine authors etc to come and get content for their own sites/purposes in return for giving you a backlink.

    That's why you'll see things like 'most published' on places like eza. People WANT to get their articles distributed lots of places.

    If your primary goal is backlinks, then do you really care how many times the same article is reprinted elsewhere? No, you would WANT it to be published numerous times on as many different sites as possible. This is a quick and easy way to get massive backlinks to your site without writing tons of articles.

    Now, of course many people want use article marketing for TRAFFIC directly from the article directories instead of backlinks. That's the people who will write original articles and submit them only to, say, eza and then bookmark and send backlinks to the article to try and get it ranked high. In this case, writing original articles for each directory would be beneficial if that is your goal.

    Since you mentioned that your goal was backlinks however, then it makes sense to send your article to as many places that will accept it.

    Hope that helps
    Tracey
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    • Profile picture of the author Why9999
      Originally Posted by traceye View Post

      It all depends on your goal with your article marketing campaign.

      Yes you are allowed to send the same article to as many directories as you like as long as you are the original author. That's what article directories are for in many cases anyway, for other people i.e. blog owners, ezine authors etc to come and get content for their own sites/purposes in return for giving you a backlink.

      That's why you'll see things like 'most published' on places like eza. People WANT to get their articles distributed lots of places.

      If your primary goal is backlinks, then do you really care how many times the same article is reprinted elsewhere? No, you would WANT it to be published numerous times on as many different sites as possible. This is a quick and easy way to get massive backlinks to your site without writing tons of articles.

      Now, of course many people want use article marketing for TRAFFIC directly from the article directories instead of backlinks. That's the people who will write original articles and submit them only to, say, eza and then bookmark and send backlinks to the article to try and get it ranked high. In this case, writing original articles for each directory would be beneficial if that is your goal.

      Since you mentioned that your goal was backlinks however, then it makes sense to send your article to as many places that will accept it.

      Hope that helps
      Tracey
      Oh, my head hurts! My head is gonna explode right off the end of my neck here. Are you telling me that by just mass submitting an article I can do as much good for my site as get a high page rank site to ezine, etc.? Of course, the one ezine article will generate direct traffic to my site. But have some of you actually gotten longer term benefits from a mass submittal like this? I didn't think that would really help, but then I admit that I know nothing. Anything you can say about this would be much appreciated...
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  • Profile picture of the author KristiDaniels
    How do you generate $240,000 from a single article?

    Marketing 101 again.

    1. Select a market that has money and is willing to spend it for good information. In this case, I selected investing... specifically a form of investing where the participants spend a lot of money on information.

    2. Select the #1 publication that most of my prospects read. In my case (and in most cases), the #1 publication is read by 90% of your prospects.

    3. Write an authoritative article that covers the topic in a brand new way that has never been talked about before. Make it a bit controversial, but kill the controversy before it can start with cold hard facts.

    4. Be willing to work with the editor. This is the hardest part. They always want to gut your article. Just keep rewriting alternatives that aren't gutted and resubmitting them pretending that you are doing exactly what the editor wants. Meanwhile, send them gifts. I sent a book I knew my editor would enjoy sent straight from Amazon and a baseball glove signed by a local major league player (I found out my editor had a son who played in little league and idolized this player... and the player was local and easy to access).

    5. Make your bio a pitch. Your editor will gut this as well several times. Just keep resubmitting an even heavier pitch that is tied in with the article. Your editor will eventually accept it if your article is good enough to support it.

    6. Get decent hosting. The online version of most publications is supported with an email list. You'll get most of the traffic in a single three hour block. You need hosting that can deal with the traffic.

    I think that's about it.

    Everything else (and even the above) is covered in the Writer's Market. Get it. It really is the Bible of article marketing.
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  • Profile picture of the author KristiDaniels
    Writer's Market was designed specifically to answer your question.

    You will be blown away at the detailed instructions given for getting published the first time.

    It's only $20. Go get yourself a copy!
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  • Profile picture of the author KristiDaniels
    Mythbusters to the rescue. Click on this link:

    "this is a really long thing to - Google Search=

    Scroll to the bottom of the page.

    It sure looks like Google knows how to find duplicate content and exclude the similar results from the main search results to me.
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    • Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      Mythbusters to the rescue. Click on this link:

      "this is a really long thing to - Google Search=

      Scroll to the bottom of the page.

      It sure looks like Google knows how to find duplicate content and exclude the similar results from the main search results to me.
      Yes they know how to do it, but like I said:

      ---> they'd just rank it lower than earlier published ones;

      ---> they can't possibly determine actual "plagiarized" content which goes beyond fair use (just exact duplicate content or less than 70% unique content) since software, considering our current technology, can't possibly do this, unless of course they'd hire a lot of people to manually identify actually "plagiarized" content;

      ---> SE bots could be programmed to gather author name/penname and dates to identify if the duplicate content came from the same author of the original (which wouldn't be 100% accurate since what if the author decided to use a different penname for the author account's name?); and

      ---> in this case re: submitting the same content to different online article directories, may I add if SEs remove exact duplicate content from the results page (if = then which means they can't identify it came from the same author) but it gets accepted by those article directories, then people included in the content syndication membership list of each of these article directories will become readers of the duplicate content, anyway, but...

      ...like I said, submit 70% unique versions to each of these different online article directories, and of course:

      ---> 100% unique offline publication with content circulation across your target market will greatly help, so...

      ...it's a matter of effectively combining offline and online article marketing strategies while carefully considering time/capital investment and result effectiveness, so for the thread poster = go on: formulate the right combination, consult people with knowledge and experience in offline and online article marketing, devise a plan which would reduce your time/capital investment to a bare minimum while still being able to give you the results you need to scale it up or come up with a new plan, then take action.
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    • Profile picture of the author Zeus66
      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      Mythbusters to the rescue. Click on this link:

      "this is a really long thing to - Google Search=

      Scroll to the bottom of the page.

      It sure looks like Google knows how to find duplicate content and exclude the similar results from the main search results to me.
      HAHAHAHAAHAHA! Man, I'm so loving this person's ability to get things so wrong while being hilariously condescending at the same time!

      Of COURSE Google will list duplicate content in the SERPs. Often in the Top 10 you'll find the exact same content on two different web properties for searches. Don't listen to people spouting nonsense here, ok? Do your own due diligence.

      Here, I'll give you but one example among the millions out there...

      Go search Google for this phrase: popular hairstyles in early 20th century america

      You'll find an article I wrote back in 2005 twice in the Top 10 (#1 and about #8 or so). Identical article, posted on 2 different article directories.

      Duh. Not even a rare occurrence.

      John
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      • Profile picture of the author Why9999
        Originally Posted by Zeus66 View Post

        HAHAHAHAAHAHA! Man, I'm so loving this person's ability to get things so wrong while being hilariously condescending at the same time!

        Of COURSE Google will list duplicate content in the SERPs. Often in the Top 10 you'll find the exact same content on two different web properties for searches. Don't listen to people spouting nonsense here, ok? Do your own due diligence.

        Here, I'll give you but one example among the millions out there...

        Go search Google for this phrase: popular hairstyles in early 20th century america

        You'll find an article I wrote back in 2005 twice in the Top 10 (#1 and about #8 or so). Identical article, posted on 2 different article directories.

        Duh. Not even a rare occurrence.

        John
        I'm not picking sides here, but I actually just had this occur because my hosting account was set up wrong. I essentially had two domains looking like one domain and Google got confused and so for some searches Google would pull up both pages on page 1.
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  • Profile picture of the author KristiDaniels
    I don't care much about angles or opinions.

    The fact is that Google not only detects and penalizes duplicate content (as in doesn't even list in the main search results), it even detects and penalizes similar content.

    It's not a question for opinion, angles or democracy. It is a question that can be answered factually.

    Google is capable of detecting both duplicate and even similar content. They not only detect it, they completely exclude it from the main search results. You have to click an extra link to even see the duplicate or similar results.

    I know most Warriors say that the duplicate content penalty is a myth. Most Warriors also say to submit articles to EzineArticles. Being in the majority doesn't make you right. In both cases, the majority is wrong.
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    • Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      I don't care much about angles or opinions.
      Edit: Come to think of it, I didn't mean this: "Good for you. That makes the 2 of us perhaps." (good thing I included "perhaps") --- opinions and angles of others count for me 'cause that's how I get new data, process it then come up with my own decisions, angles, innovations, et al. Opinions and angles of those who had and are currently observing nature and the universe's physical laws, which were done in a time it was slightly but still different to what I could observe now (principle of uncertainty I suppose) and people taking the data, doing their own tests and processing it ethically to do the right things for the benefit of the majority is what makes it a better world for most of us.

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      The fact is that Google not only detects and penalizes duplicate content (as in doesn't even list in the main search results), it even detects and penalizes similar content.
      Yes, like I said: SEs can't detect actually "plagiarized" content which goes beyond fair use, and like you said: it removes exact duplicate content or similar content from the main results list (which doesn't necessarily mean "plagiarized" content since there will be instances the exact same content or similar content was published by the author of the original in different places, making such a system of these SEs possibly flawed).

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      It's not a question for opinion, angles or democracy. It is a question that can be answered factually.
      Yes, and it's a fact that there are online article directories which publish the exact content already published on other article directories, and even if SEs will remove the duplicate content (from the same author therefore not being "plagiarized" content), it's also a fact that each of these article directories has their own content syndication membership list which would be able to view the content even if it were removed from the main search results page. Anyway, you'd have 1 100% unique article appearing on the article directory which published it first, so you'd have readers from SEs and readers from the content syndication membership lists of the other directories which published it next.

      Come to think of it, if SEs can't identify plagiarized content from 100% duplicate content published by the same author (which it removes from the main results page) nor from content a certain percentage in terms of uniqueness (which would still be plagiarized if it were rewritten by a different author from an already published piece of another author in a way which goes beyond fair use but still included by SEs in the main results page, which could even rank higher than the original version), then wouldn't this defeat their purpose, which is to provide users with the best, most relevant, most accurate and most useful results?

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      Google is capable of detecting both duplicate and even similar content. They not only detect it, they completely exclude it from the main search results. You have to click an extra link to even see the duplicate or similar results.
      Yes, that's what you said earlier.

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      I know most Warriors say that the duplicate content penalty is a myth. Most Warriors also say to submit articles to EzineArticles
      Yes, that's what I said earlier.

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      Being in the majority doesn't make you right.
      I believe this is pretty condescending for professionals hanging out here in WF. I mean = isn't this obvious enough for a professional?

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      In both cases, the majority is wrong.
      Is that 100% universally accurate, or do you have certain proprietary percentaging systems which you used for different situations you've experienced in an X amount of time therefore applicable only to those situations?
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    • Profile picture of the author Why9999
      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      I don't care much about angles or opinions.

      The fact is that Google not only detects and penalizes duplicate content (as in doesn't even list in the main search results), it even detects and penalizes similar content.

      It's not a question for opinion, angles or democracy. It is a question that can be answered factually.

      Google is capable of detecting both duplicate and even similar content. They not only detect it, they completely exclude it from the main search results. You have to click an extra link to even see the duplicate or similar results.

      I know most Warriors say that the duplicate content penalty is a myth. Most Warriors also say to submit articles to EzineArticles. Being in the majority doesn't make you right. In both cases, the majority is wrong.
      Sorry, but what is so bad about ezine? And, again, thx for all the commentary - I'm asking as a newbie. I know, of course, that it's better to get paid directly for writing per your comments above, but writing to ezine could get you some decent traffic and backlinks, right?
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  • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
    Banned
    I use distributeyourarticles.com and it distributes my articles continually to many article directories. Has worked for me for a long time and I get a lot of backlinks from it.
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  • Profile picture of the author james911
    "do not submit same articles to "big articles site"
    you can sumit it to smaller one"

    accourding to SEO experts says

    but i don't think every ariticle site TOS are the same
    you can try it by yourself post your experence here
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    • Profile picture of the author Why9999
      Originally Posted by james911 View Post

      "do not submit same articles to "big articles site"
      you can sumit it to smaller one"

      accourding to SEO experts says

      but i don't think every ariticle site TOS are the same
      you can try it by yourself post your experence here
      Sorry, not sure what you're saying here cuzz the 2nd bullet point wasn't a full sentence. Can you clarify?
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  • Profile picture of the author dbadwal
    I can say some articles sites like ezinearticles, goarticles should have unique versions only. But in general for other directories: one article shouldn't be used on more than 3-4 adrticle directories. Too much repitition is definitely duplicate content issue, which is not good for backlinking strategy but can give a very little amount of traffic form here and there in the long run.
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  • Profile picture of the author Nicola Lane
    Why,

    Visit these two threads and read them all - they will give you great advice about your article marketing campaign. then read the TOS of any directory you want to submit to - that will answer your question about duplicate articles, and steer you right about your campaign:

    http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...eza-first.html

    http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...marketing.html
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    • Profile picture of the author Why9999
      Originally Posted by Nicola Lane View Post

      Why,

      Visit these two threads and read them all - they will give you great advice about your article marketing campaign. then read the TOS of any directory you want to submit to - that will answer your question about duplicate articles, and steer you right about your campaign:

      http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...eza-first.html

      http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...marketing.html
      Thank you for these threads! These answered some important questions I had and I was very misguided in my thinking. Also, I do tend to "give away the farm" so that was great advice there as well. Thx.
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  • Profile picture of the author rajput441
    Yes, you can submit your articles to various directories. However, I recommend that you use the same author name in all of them.
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  • Profile picture of the author Hamza
    It depends on the article directory, but anyway it does not worth it,

    i think submitting one article to one big directory like ezinearticles is a way enough

    GoodLuck
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    • Profile picture of the author Why9999
      Originally Posted by Hamza View Post

      It depends on the article directory, but anyway it does not worth it,

      i think submitting one article to one big directory like ezinearticles is a way enough

      GoodLuck
      I agree if you want traffic and I would guess usually the more traffic, the more backlinks you'll get, which is my primary goal at this point.
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  • Profile picture of the author sbglobal123
    hii
    tell me your question in briefly.i not understand this completely
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  • Profile picture of the author Allen Graves
    Hello everybody!

    There is absolutely nothing wrong with submitting the same article to multiple places. In fact, I suggest it.

    To me it's simple, and it is working for myself and many others.

    If you are going to rewrite an article, why not just submit THAT article to them all too. Of course, this means rewriting it where it maintains its quality information and does not simply (or should I say OBVIOUSLY) repeat the original one.

    If you submit to 10 article directories, you can rewrite the article 10 times and have ten articles sitting out there with 30, juiced links to your money site, or you could rewrite the article 10 times and have 100 articles and hundreds of juiced-up links sitting out there.

    I'll take the 100/300 deal - along with the other benefits of having syndicated content online.

    Allen Graves
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    • Profile picture of the author Why9999
      Originally Posted by Allen Graves View Post

      Hello everybody!

      There is absolutely nothing wrong with submitting the same article to multiple places. In fact, I suggest it.

      To me it's simple, and it is working for myself and many others.

      If you are going to rewrite an article, why not just submit THAT article to them all too. Of course, this means rewriting it where it maintains its quality information and does not simply (or should I say OBVIOUSLY) repeat the original one.

      If you submit to 10 article directories, you can rewrite the article 10 times and have ten articles sitting out there with 30, juiced links to your money site, or you could rewrite the article 10 times and have 100 articles and hundreds of juiced-up links sitting out there.

      I'll take the 100/300 deal - along with the other benefits of having syndicated content online.

      Allen Graves
      Gotcha. Rewriting is not necessarily a trivial task however. I add a new page to my site almost every day because my site is an informational blog.

      Here is probably the strategy I would try. Let me know what you think of this:

      1. Write a page and put it on my site.
      2. Trim and format it - my pages are usually 800-1000 words - for submission to ezine.
      3. If it is not accepted by ezine, submit the identical page to as many sites as I can stand. The reason I say this is that, from what I've seen, only ezine ranks enough in my category enough to care if there are duplicates.

      Now I have some concerns about #3 still, because even tho I can technically do it, I don't want to do anything that would pull down my page rank.

      Is that why you recommend rewrites, whereas some of the others above don't?
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      • Originally Posted by Why9999 View Post

        Gotcha. Rewriting is not necessarily a trivial task however. I add a new page to my site almost every day because my site is an informational blog.

        Here is probably the strategy I would try. Let me know what you think of this:

        1. Write a page and put it on my site.
        2. Trim and format it - my pages are usually 800-1000 words - for submission to ezine.
        3. If it is not accepted by ezine, submit the identical page to as many sites as I can stand. The reason I say this is that, from what I've seen, only ezine ranks enough in my category enough to care if there are duplicates.

        Now I have some concerns about #3 still, because even tho I can technically do it, I don't want to do anything that would pull down my page rank.

        Is that why you recommend rewrites, whereas some of the others above don't?
        Why not:

        1) create an article for article marketing purposes;

        2) create a content page for your site which provides more/new helpful/useful relevant info/advice supporting the useful/helpful relevant info/advice offered by your article (the one for article marketing);

        3) spin your article (the one for article marketing); and

        4) submit each unique version of your spun article to each of the top 50-100 article directories (version 1 to directory 1; version 2 to directory 2; version 3 to directory 3; and so on until you submit the last version to the last directory in your list ===> all unique content with your backlinks on a lot of high SE ranking high PR high traffic DF or NF article directories)?

        Reminders

        1) Write your article and content page this way: title = attention-grabbing; description = interest-provoking; 2/3 body = useful/helpful info-advice-providing; last 1/3 body = curiosity-provoking for more/new useful/helpful relevant info/advice; bio/resource box = call to action.

        2) Spin your article this way: 2 phrase variants for each of 2 phrases per sentence; 2 sentence variants with 2 phrase variants for each of 2 phrases per sentence; and 2 paragraph variants with 2 sentence varitans containing 2 phrase variants for each of 2 phrases each sentence per paragraph --- this simply means don't just use a thesaurus for synonyms) and of course provide more variation so each version = 70%-above unique.

        3) Use this to rank the article directories in your list in order of "effectiveness": PR, Alexa, total number of inbound links in published article page, total number of outbound links in published article page, total number of inbound links in published article body, total number of outbound links in published article body, total number of inbound links in published article bio, total number of outbound links in published article bio, nofollow or dofollow, and SE ranking for specific niches.

        4) Randomize submission frequency (could be according to your whims since this would make it more "humanlike" and "natural"). Don't know if this is necessary, I just do this as a precautionary measure even though I believe SE slaps/penalties for thousands upon thousands of backlinks built overnight is a myth.

        5) Ping and social bookmark each submission.

        6) Monitor target keyword search volume and article directory PR as well as Alexa rank changes.

        7) Track the overall performance of your published articles and use this data to improve your campaign further and correct problems if any.

        I believe if you follow through with number 2, you'd have more articles to submit that are as "effective" as entirely rewritten versions than you would when you just "rewrite" your freshly written articles.
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        • Profile picture of the author Why9999
          Originally Posted by Marx Vergel Melencio View Post

          Why not:

          1) create an article for article marketing purposes;

          2) create a content page for your site which provides more/new helpful/useful relevant info/advice supporting the useful/helpful relevant info/advice offered by your article (the one for article marketing);

          3) spin your article (the one for article marketing); and

          4) submit each unique version of your spun article to each of the top 50-100 article directories (version 1 to directory 1; version 2 to directory 2; version 3 to directory 3; and so on until you submit the last version to the last directory in your list ===> all unique content with your backlinks on a lot of high SE ranking high PR high traffic DF or NF article directories)?

          Reminders

          1) Write your article and content page this way: title = attention-grabbing; description = interest-provoking; 2/3 body = useful/helpful info-advice-providing; last 1/3 body = curiosity-provoking for more/new useful/helpful relevant info/advice; bio/resource box = call to action.

          2) Spin your article this way: 2 phrase variants for each of 2 phrases per sentence; 2 sentence variants with 2 phrase variants for each of 2 phrases per sentence; and 2 paragraph variants with 2 sentence varitans containing 2 phrase variants for each of 2 phrases each sentence per paragraph --- this simply means don't just use a thesaurus for synonyms) and of course provide more variation so each version = 70%-above unique.

          3) Use this to rank the article directories in your list in order of "effectiveness": PR, Alexa, total number of inbound links in published article page, total number of outbound links in published article page, total number of inbound links in published article body, total number of outbound links in published article body, total number of inbound links in published article bio, total number of outbound links in published article bio, nofollow or dofollow, and SE ranking for specific niches.

          4) Randomize submission frequency (could be according to your whims since this would make it more "humanlike" and "natural"). Don't know if this is necessary, I just do this as a precautionary measure even though I believe SE slaps/penalties for thousands upon thousands of backlinks built overnight is a myth.

          5) Ping and social bookmark each submission.

          6) Monitor target keyword search volume and article directory PR as well as Alexa rank changes.

          7) Track the overall performance of your published articles and use this data to improve your campaign further and correct problems if any.

          I believe if you follow through with number 2, you'd have more articles to submit that are as "effective" as entirely rewritten versions than you would when you just "rewrite" your freshly written articles.
          Sorry, just noticed the responses.

          The only thing that sounds overwhelming is the rewriting of the article 50-100X for 50-100 article submissions. I struggle to get one article out each day - take me about 45-60 min. usually because they are heavy research.

          But thx for the advice - let me ponder how I could do that and make it feasible.
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          • Originally Posted by Why9999 View Post

            Sorry, just noticed the responses.

            The only thing that sounds overwhelming is the rewriting of the article 50-100X for 50-100 article submissions. I struggle to get one article out each day - take me about 45-60 min. usually because they are heavy research.

            But thx for the advice - let me ponder how I could do that and make it feasible.

            Rewriting is different at least how I initially mentioned it here from spinning.

            If it takes you 45-60 minutes to freshly write an article, then you'd spend 25-35 minutes to entirely rewrite your article.

            So, you'd spend 1250 to 1750 minutes to rewrite your article 50 times and another 4 hours to manually submit each of those 50 rewrites to the top 50 article directories, but:

            ---> if it takes you 45-60 minutes to freshly write an article, then you'd spend 2-3 hours to...

            ...freshly write an article, then...

            ...manually spin it to produce 50 versions, each 70% unique...

            ...and...

            ...another 4 hours/month (5 minutes submission per article directory assuming you already have an account) to submit each of those 50 versions to each of the top 50 article directories.

            Now, determine if rewriting your article 2-3 times against spinning it once to produce 50-100+++ unique versions then submitting each version to an equal amount of article directories ranked by "effectiveness" would be more time-saving and feasible in terms of generated results.
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  • Profile picture of the author Allen Graves
    Where's James when you need him. LOL He'd have a field day in this thread.

    Marx, your strategy will probably work just fine. But again, if it were me, I would submit those 100 articles to each and every one of those 100 directories. This multiplies the branding of your business literally tenfold and gets your content in front of SO many more eyes. Plus, you will have 3,000 backlinks to your website - as opposed to 300. Do your anchoring correctly and this will allow your money site to rank for some really "big dog" keyword phrases.

    And when the syndication kicks in, I'd rather have 100 articles being syndictaed instead of just one.

    Not to mention the fact that you won't have to keep track of which article was submitted to which directory already.

    (Note: I would not submit an article to 100 article directories nor would I suggest it. At a certain point, my time overcomes the pittance of link juice and tiny amount of traffic (if any) generated from the bottom feeders.)

    Why9999, if I were you, I would do just what you wrote - except forget all that about EZA and if they accept it or not. Get that article out there! Submit to as many niche-related sites as you possibly can. This includes both general and niche article directories.

    It may take some time, but you can find them - they're out there!

    Allen
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    • Originally Posted by Allen Graves View Post

      Where's James when you need him. LOL He'd have a field day in this thread.

      Marx, your strategy will probably work just fine. But again, if it were me, I would submit those 100 articles to each and every one of those 100 directories. This multiplies the branding of your business literally tenfold and gets your content in front of SO many more eyes. Plus, you will have 3,000 backlinks to your website - as opposed to 300. Do your anchoring correctly and this will allow your money site to rank for some really "big dog" keyword phrases.

      And when the syndication kicks in, I'd rather have 100 articles being syndictaed instead of just one.

      Not to mention the fact that you won't have to keep track of which article was submitted to which directory already.

      (Note: I would not submit an article to 100 article directories nor would I suggest it. At a certain point, my time overcomes the pittance of link juice and tiny amount of traffic (if any) generated from the bottom feeders.)

      Why9999, if I were you, I would do just what you wrote - except forget all that about EZA and if they accept it or not. Get that article out there! Submit to as many niche-related sites as you possibly can. This includes both general and niche article directories.

      It may take some time, but you can find them - they're out there!

      Allen

      Well, I believe that's assuming all top 100 article directories publish already published article content on other directories, and a negation to this assumption would be EZA, Buzzle, etc.

      So, if my assumption were accurate, then it would be best for you to submit at least 70% unique article content to each of the top 100 article directories.
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      • Profile picture of the author Allen Graves
        Originally Posted by Marx Vergel Melencio View Post

        Well, I believe that's assuming all top 100 article directories publish already published article content on other directories, and a negation to this assumption would be EZA, Buzzle, etc.

        So, if my assumption were accurate, then it would be best for you to submit at least 70% unique article content to each of the top 100 article directories.
        Your assumption is inaccurate on EZA's part.

        And what are the "etc..." directories. I think there are only a couple of them???? In which case I would just submit the original to them.

        So 2973 backlinks instead if 300, LOL.

        I'm not trying to tell anybody what to do, I'm just saying what I would do. I just think that spending all that time rewriting and submitting like that is severely limiting your potential and your exposure.

        Allen
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        • Originally Posted by Allen Graves View Post

          Your assumption is inaccurate on EZA's part.

          And what are the "etc..." directories. I think there are only a couple of them???? In which case I would just submit the original to them.

          So 2973 backlinks instead if 300, LOL.

          I'm not trying to tell anybody what to do, I'm just saying what I would do. I just think that spending all that time rewriting and submitting like that is severely limiting your potential and your exposure.

          Allen

          I'm just saying:

          ---> if already 2% (EZA and Buzzle) of the top 100 article directories (I have a list) has been identified as article directories which don't publish content already published on other article directories from the top of my head (without research, just something I heard and have read here but can validate easily), then...

          ...wouldn't it be better to just spin an article following the spinning format I mentioned and writing it in the way I mentioned than...

          ...totally rewriting it 2-3 times?

          My point is:

          ---> spin it once and you'll have 50-100+++ versions to submit to the top 50-100-200-300-400-500+++ article directories (depending how much 70% unique versions your article spinning tool generates out of your spun article) than...

          ---> rewriting it once or twice or 3 times or or or, which would take more time.

          And, why not hire a group of programmers who can create such an article spinning tool and maybe even an article submitting app that can randomize submission frequency and automate everything which doesn't require manual intervention (for better results) of each spun version to any amount of article directories you store in the database?

          It's a 1-time investment which'll possibly generate good results even if you spend $1K-above for those tools.

          I think IM, like any offline business, requires planning and investment of time and resources to minimize the risks and produce the best results.

          Another good investment would be to train someone offshore to monitor your submissions using those tools and another person to write your content then spin it. After 1-2 weeks, you'll have people working with you for your article marketing campaigns and even other aspects of backlink building, and you can focus on "more" rewarding angles of your IM venture.

          Also, like Allen: I'm not telling people what to do, I'm just saying what I would do.
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          • Profile picture of the author Why9999
            Originally Posted by Marx Vergel Melencio View Post

            I'm just saying:

            ---> if already 2% (EZA and Buzzle) of the top 100 article directories (I have a list) has been identified as article directories which don't publish content already published on other article directories from the top of my head (without research, just something I heard and have read here but can validate easily), then...

            ...wouldn't it be better to just spin an article following the spinning format I mentioned and writing it in the way I mentioned than...

            ...totally rewriting it 2-3 times?

            My point is:

            ---> spin it once and you'll have 50-100+++ versions to submit to the top 50-100-200-300-400-500+++ article directories (depending how much 70% unique versions your article spinning tool generates out of your spun article) than...

            ---> rewriting it once or twice or 3 times or or or, which would take more time.

            And, why not hire a group of programmers who can create such an article spinning tool and maybe even an article submitting app that can randomize submission frequency and automate everything which doesn't require manual intervention (for better results) of each spun version to any amount of article directories you store in the database?

            It's a 1-time investment which'll possibly generate good results even if you spend $1K-above for those tools.

            I think IM, like any offline business, requires planning and investment of time and resources to minimize the risks and produce the best results.

            Another good investment would be to train someone offshore to monitor your submissions using those tools and another person to write your content then spin it. After 1-2 weeks, you'll have people working with you for your article marketing campaigns and even other aspects of backlink building, and you can focus on "more" rewarding angles of your IM venture.

            Also, like Allen: I'm not telling people what to do, I'm just saying what I would do.
            Well, thank you for the lengthy response. I guess I have to be honest that I didn't totally understand what you mean by the following:

            "---> manually and properly (don't just use a thesaurus for synonyms) spin the freshly written article from top to bottom (title, description, 2/3 body, last 1/3 body, bio box) = 2 phrase variants for each of 2 selected phrases per sentence, 2 sentence variants with 2 phrase variants per sentence, and 2 paragraph variants with 2 sentence vairiants with 2 phrase variants per ssentence per paragraph;

            ---> use an efficient article spinning tool to produce 50-100 unique versions of the spun article (tool should be capable of filtering out below 70% unique versions to provide you with versions which are each 70%-above unique)"

            There is no such article spinning tool right? I mean that would be a very large programming endeavor unless I'm really missing something. Any language is extraordinarily complex.

            Simple synonym substitution would be relatively easy but changing phrase and sentence structure is incredible involved. It takes a human about 20 years to pull all that together in any kind of a reasonable fashion, so I can't imagine how a programmer could code that in any kind of a reasonable time. But let me know if I'm missing something.

            I like your idea, but I just don't see a simple way to spin things. I believe I am a relatively fast writer, but I don't think I could spin things that quickly manually either.

            You've been doing this a lot longer than me, so let me know if there are tried and true techniques, etc. for this that help. I'd be curious...
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            • Originally Posted by Why9999 View Post

              Well, thank you for the lengthy response. I guess I have to be honest that I didn't totally understand what you mean by the following:

              "---> manually and properly (don't just use a thesaurus for synonyms) spin the freshly written article from top to bottom (title, description, 2/3 body, last 1/3 body, bio box) = 2 phrase variants for each of 2 selected phrases per sentence, 2 sentence variants with 2 phrase variants per sentence, and 2 paragraph variants with 2 sentence vairiants with 2 phrase variants per ssentence per paragraph;

              ---> use an efficient article spinning tool to produce 50-100 unique versions of the spun article (tool should be capable of filtering out below 70% unique versions to provide you with versions which are each 70%-above unique)"

              There is no such article spinning tool right? I mean that would be a very large programming endeavor unless I'm really missing something. Any language is extraordinarily complex.

              Simple synonym substitution would be relatively easy but changing phrase and sentence structure is incredible involved. It takes a human about 20 years to pull all that together in any kind of a reasonable fashion, so I can't imagine how a programmer could code that in any kind of a reasonable time. But let me know if I'm missing something.

              I like your idea, but I just don't see a simple way to spin things. I believe I am a relatively fast writer, but I don't think I could spin things that quickly manually either.

              You've been doing this a lot longer than me, so let me know if there are tried and true techniques, etc. for this that help. I'd be curious...

              It does exist, and it took us 1 month to code it (worked with 3 programmers for this tool). However, we use it as an inhouse tool.

              Here's a sample:

              [[[Jack and Jill|Jill, with her brother Jack] [went up|climbed up] [the hill|a small hill] [to fetch|to get] [a pail|a bucket] [of water.|of drinking water.]]|[[Jack and his sister Jill|Jack with his little sister Jill] [walked up|strolled up] [to a clearing on a hill|the path towards the top of the hill] [to gather|to take back home] [a jug|one small container] [of fresh water.|of potable water.]] [[Jack went down|Jack fell] [and broke his crown,|injured his head,] [and Jill came tumbling after.|and unfortunately, his sister also fell afterwards.]]|[[Jack tripped on a rock and stumbled down the hill|Jack didn't see a rock while walking down the hill, so he fell] [and had a head injury,|and bruised his head,] [and Jill sadly also tripped on a rock,|and his sister fell down next to him,] [so she tumbled down the hill, too.|and couldn't stop herself from stumbling down the hill.]]]|[[[Jill and Jack|Jack and his little sister Jill] [started to walk up|was walking up] [a hill|the clearing atop the nearby hill] [in the hopes of getting|because they needed to fetch] [some fresh water.|a large bucket of potable water.]]|[[Jill and his older brother Jack|Jill with her bigger brother Jack] [were strolling up|were walking up] [towards a clearing on a nearby hill|the path pointing to the top of the hill] [in order to take back|so as to get] [a small jug|a small pail] [of fresh drinking water.|of cold potable water.]] [[Jill went down|Jill fell] [and stumbled down,|and rolled down the hill,] [but Jack tumbled down first, breaking his crown because of this.|but her brother was first to fall and bruise his head.]]|[[Jill's foot got stuck between sharp rocks while walking home, and she rolled down the hill|Jill wasn't able to see large rocks while strolling down the hill, so she fell,] [ [but Jack was unfortunately first to get stuck between large rocks,|and his sister fell down next to him,|but her brother Jack was first to trip on large rocks,] [so this caused her to tumble down the hill, too.|so she couldn't stop herself from falling down the side of the hill.]]]

              There are also different function selection checkboxes like "replace frequently used words and phrases with synonyms", "replace numbers with words and words with numbers", etc.

              The sample above took me less than 3 minutes I think. I'll use another 2 minutes to check it (which I won't).

              So, a well researched 500++-word technical article would take around 2-3 hours (well, it won't be 500++ words = most likely 1500++ words/article, but each version would be 500++ words).

              If you also try manually spinning it as you write it, it could work for you (this technique works for others including myself). Some of my colleagues write an article first, write paragraph variations next, sentence variations afterwards, then phrase variations.

              You can try the sample above on a free spinning tool (just Google it and you'll find one). Just replace the [] and |s with the characters the free tool uses.
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            • Originally Posted by Why9999 View Post

              Well, thank you for the lengthy response. I guess I have to be honest that I didn't totally understand what you mean by the following:

              "---> manually and properly (don't just use a thesaurus for synonyms) spin the freshly written article from top to bottom (title, description, 2/3 body, last 1/3 body, bio box) = 2 phrase variants for each of 2 selected phrases per sentence, 2 sentence variants with 2 phrase variants per sentence, and 2 paragraph variants with 2 sentence vairiants with 2 phrase variants per ssentence per paragraph;

              ---> use an efficient article spinning tool to produce 50-100 unique versions of the spun article (tool should be capable of filtering out below 70% unique versions to provide you with versions which are each 70%-above unique)"

              There is no such article spinning tool right? I mean that would be a very large programming endeavor unless I'm really missing something. Any language is extraordinarily complex.

              Simple synonym substitution would be relatively easy but changing phrase and sentence structure is incredible involved. It takes a human about 20 years to pull all that together in any kind of a reasonable fashion, so I can't imagine how a programmer could code that in any kind of a reasonable time. But let me know if I'm missing something.

              I like your idea, but I just don't see a simple way to spin things. I believe I am a relatively fast writer, but I don't think I could spin things that quickly manually either.

              You've been doing this a lot longer than me, so let me know if there are tried and true techniques, etc. for this that help. I'd be curious...
              Here's a page which lists free tools (content spinner included):

              Free Useful IM Tools

              NB's a project of a long-time friend and client.
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    • Profile picture of the author Why9999
      Originally Posted by Allen Graves View Post

      Where's James when you need him. LOL He'd have a field day in this thread.

      Marx, your strategy will probably work just fine. But again, if it were me, I would submit those 100 articles to each and every one of those 100 directories. This multiplies the branding of your business literally tenfold and gets your content in front of SO many more eyes. Plus, you will have 3,000 backlinks to your website - as opposed to 300. Do your anchoring correctly and this will allow your money site to rank for some really "big dog" keyword phrases.

      And when the syndication kicks in, I'd rather have 100 articles being syndictaed instead of just one.

      Not to mention the fact that you won't have to keep track of which article was submitted to which directory already.

      (Note: I would not submit an article to 100 article directories nor would I suggest it. At a certain point, my time overcomes the pittance of link juice and tiny amount of traffic (if any) generated from the bottom feeders.)

      Why9999, if I were you, I would do just what you wrote - except forget all that about EZA and if they accept it or not. Get that article out there! Submit to as many niche-related sites as you possibly can. This includes both general and niche article directories.

      It may take some time, but you can find them - they're out there!

      Allen
      Okay. That would be a tremendous time saver. A compromise - and I realize this would be against your better judgement - would be to do one article for ezine and one rewrite for all the others. Then I would only have to do three copies: the original for my web site, the ezine and the other ten or so top article sites.

      The thing I like about it is that I can't get any penalty for that. When you've got a low PR like me, you're worried about "angering the gods"...
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  • Profile picture of the author Daniel Scott
    As much as Kristi may have been a little condescending... she's got a point.

    I mean... how many of us think about trying to get articles published in offline media?

    Certainly the credibility factor would be massive. And the traffic it could generate could be substantial... not to mention you're in "mainstream" media.

    I'm not saying EZA sucks (I love it) but it never hurts to add another weapon to your arsenal...

    -Dan
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  • Profile picture of the author KristiDaniels
    There is no such thing as "offline media" anymore. All publications are online.

    If you are article marketing, you are counting on clicks to the link, so the offline printed version of any publication is almost inconsequential.

    All marketing (article marketing and otherwise) is finding where your people are hanging out and using a message in that place to move them to where you want them to be (ie: your website).

    Even if your niche is trying to sell things incestuously to other Warriors, you are going to the wrong place when you are submitting to EzineArticles.com. Warriors hang out here, not on EzineArticles.com. You would be better off doing a WSO or posting here.

    But most of you at least attempt to market to some other niche. If you market to the bodybuilding niche, you have to start with asking yourself where bodybuilders are hanging out. They are NOT hanging out at EzineArticles.com. They are hanging out at the gym, in GNC stores, reading bodybuilding magazines, bodybuilding blogs and bodybuilding forums.

    Only bodybuilding magazines and bodybuilding blogs are relevant to a discussion about article marketing to bodybuilders (as an example).

    If you are an online business, then you will get a lot more people from the online versions of the body building magazines than the offline versions. It may give you a big head to be published in the printed version and you'll get that as a side effect, but that isn't where your bang will come from.

    It will come from people who are reading the online version of their favorite bodybuilding magazine. They will read your article that is informative, but hints at a better solution which is your information product. They then read your bio and see your link and click through. You used a special domain for article marketing or at least a tracking link or you are catching the referrer for the magazine. You hit them with a time limited special offer for the product that solves the problem that you talked about in the article (a CD, DVD, printed report, downloadable ebook, whatever it is).

    That's article marketing 101.

    That's marketing 101.

    You don't start your marketing efforts by identifying where you absolutely KNOW your prospects are NOT hanging out and focus your efforts there. That is the formula for failure, not the formula for successful article marketing.

    I have been article marketing for many years and been published over 500 times. Article marketing works if you follow marketing basics. It works very well.
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    • Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      There is no such thing as "offline media" anymore. All publications are online.

      If you are article marketing, you are counting on clicks to the link, so the offline printed version of any publication is almost inconsequential.

      All marketing (article marketing and otherwise) is finding where your people are hanging out and using a message in that place to move them to where you want them to be (ie: your website).

      Even if your niche is trying to sell things incestuously to other Warriors, you are going to the wrong place when you are submitting to EzineArticles.com. Warriors hang out here, not on EzineArticles.com. You would be better off doing a WSO or posting here.

      But most of you at least attempt to market to some other niche. If you market to the bodybuilding niche, you have to start with asking yourself where bodybuilders are hanging out. They are NOT hanging out at EzineArticles.com. They are hanging out at the gym, in GNC stores, reading bodybuilding magazines, bodybuilding blogs and bodybuilding forums.

      Only bodybuilding magazines and bodybuilding blogs are relevant to a discussion about article marketing to bodybuilders (as an example).

      If you are an online business, then you will get a lot more people from the online versions of the body building magazines than the offline versions. It may give you a big head to be published in the printed version and you'll get that as a side effect, but that isn't where your bang will come from.

      It will come from people who are reading the online version of their favorite bodybuilding magazine. They will read your article that is informative, but hints at a better solution which is your information product. They then read your bio and see your link and click through. You used a special domain for article marketing or at least a tracking link or you are catching the referrer for the magazine. You hit them with a time limited special offer for the product that solves the problem that you talked about in the article (a CD, DVD, printed report, downloadable ebook, whatever it is).

      That's article marketing 101.

      That's marketing 101.

      You don't start your marketing efforts by identifying where you absolutely KNOW your prospects are NOT hanging out and focus your efforts there. That is the formula for failure, not the formula for successful article marketing.

      I have been article marketing for many years and been published over 500 times. Article marketing works if you follow marketing basics. It works very well.



      Oh thank you so much for spending time telling us what you've already said and what most of us already know --- the info kinda lodges up here.

      Market your articles in places where your target market spends time to get relevant and useful/helpful info/advice. Wow --- isn't that a no-brainer?

      Ezine isn't ONLY the best place where you can do article marketing, considering what's mentioned above and wider exposure to your target market = effective target advertising and marketing. Another no-brainer?

      Considering the OP already knows everything above but would want to know how to optimize his EZA article marketing campaign and consequently his SEM campaign circling around EZA since thousands upon thousands of people included in his target market "hang out" in places where Google searches take them, then what?

      Yes, we have a thread with discussions re: EZA article marketing.

      Wow!
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      • Profile picture of the author Liesel
        Kristi,

        I think that you are forgetting that people use Google, Bing and Yahoo to search for information. Just because a person has a specific interest does not mean that they will ONLY go to a specific publication for information. The information on the internet is vast and people know that. Searches are done every day to find MORE information about a particular subject. So those of us who choose to submit articles to Ezine are aware that we are increasing our chances of capturing the people who are looking for more than what their standard publication provides.
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  • Profile picture of the author Allen Graves
    Nonsense!

    There are millions and millions more of them that are hanging out on the first couple of pages of GOOGLE! I'd rather place my focus there...which, by the way, is flooded with articles from - wait for it - Ezinearticles.com.

    I'm just funnin' ya.

    I am getting afraid of this thread so I'm gonna have to back out of this particular conversation.

    You guys carry on...

    Allen
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    • Profile picture of the author Why9999
      Originally Posted by Allen Graves View Post

      Nonsense!

      There are millions and millions more of them that are hanging out on the first couple of pages of GOOGLE! I'd rather place my focus there...which, by the way, is flooded with articles from - wait for it - Ezinearticles.com.

      I'm just funnin' ya.

      I am getting afraid of this thread so I'm gonna have to back out of this particular conversation.

      You guys carry on...

      Allen
      My niche would get most of its info from the search engines.
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  • Profile picture of the author KristiDaniels
    That is why you do search engine marketing.

    But just like proper article marketing, you don't target altavista, askjeeves.com and tinysearch.com. You target the search engines that your prospects use like Google, Yahoo and Bing.

    Article marketing also has search engine benefits. Having a link from authority sites in your niche (like the top bodybuilding magazine if you selling a bodybuilding information product) helps your search engine ranking.

    You might end up with traffic from altavista.com and tinysearch.com (a made up search engine), but you target the search engines your prospects use.

    That's marketing 101.
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  • Don't presume your target market (comprised of professionals) knows ABSOLUTELY NOTHING (as in 0%) nor couldn't learn ABSOLUTELY anything (as in 0%), on their own, about something they're interested in or have been doing or which can help them solve their problems or thinking of doing or which can ease their burden or which can destroy their enemies or which can end their pain and suffering or or or, and:

    ---> don't talk to them in ways which involve condescending, arrogant and sometimes even rude statements (may or may not be an inverse result of above)...

    ---> now THAT'S being a "good" person in business 101 and marketing 101. Period.

    Anyway:

    ---> having "quality" content published on "authority" sites with or without offline publications is great for target market exposure and SEM, and

    ---> having "quality" content published on EZA among other high PR high traffic high ranking online article directories is great for online target market exposure and SEM.

    So, track the performance of campaigns and weigh everything to improve and correct campaigns by slanting towards methods which give you the exact results you need at the fastest possible time and with the least time and money investment.
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  • Profile picture of the author KristiDaniels
    Is "arrogant" a code word on the Warrior forum for telling the truth instead of vomiting the standard Warrior lies?

    Off the Warrior forum, using a title like "Supreme Warrior Overlord" is the definition of arrogant and condescending.

    On here, it seems to be bantered around any time someone dares to help someone.

    That would explain why so many helpful successful entrepreneurs refuse to spend much time helping Warriors. You systematically try to chase off anyone with any success who dares to tell the truth about how that success was attained. Why? Are you afraid that newbies will pass you up in success?

    Success isn't a competition. It is a one person race. Each person individually reaps the rewards of their endeavors. Your value isn't dependent on holding others back from their success. In fact, the opposite is much more true.

    The attitude some Warriors give any time someone dares to post true answers (verses the IM standard lies meant to hold people down) is what we call "rude" in the non-Warrior world. Name calling and personal attacks are pedantic and don't help anyone.

    Redefining words for the purpose of attacking people and holding others down to a common level of success seems to be a common past-time here.

    I can assure you that it isn't a productive endeavor. In the outside world, it is your behavior that we label as "rude" and "condescending." Nobody in the real world uses those words to describe telling the truth and helping someone who are otherwise being mislead by miscreants and people who want to waste the time of others in fruitless endeavors.

    You know it's wrong. So don't it. Your mother taught you better than that.

    Article marketing to the actual publications that your prospects are reading is incredibly powerful and works. I know from experience. It is much easier than anyone would expect. But you can't waste your time doing these other things and trying to seal yourself into a bubble.

    Do you see any articles on EZA from Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos, Sergey Brin or ANY other successful article marketer who has attained serious success? You can go all the way down to the tiny million dollar a year companies. Are they using Ezine Articles for their article marketing? Of course not. You know better. That advice is a trick to hurt your fellow marketers. There is no reason to hurt them.

    Do you see Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos and Sergey Brin published in the publications their prospects read? Of course you do. You know that is the way it really works.

    Perhaps you think it isn't possible to be published in the publications your audience actually read. That isn't true at all. Every single day a brand new writer is added to the list of published authors. The book I recommended has been used by probably more than 80% of them based on my conversations with published writers.

    It works. I followed it. I was published. Just about everyone I have ever talked to who has been published was a complete unknown when they decided to try article marketing. They simply followed the steps and they were published.

    Why expend so much negative energy trying to talk people out of even trying to achieve their dreams? Instead, help them with real information about your actual experience. If you haven't yet experienced success of the type they are seeking, then don't try to teach just because you have heard the same drivel over and over and over. Instead, find someone who has achieved what you desire and follow their path. Success is much sweeter a taste than the bitter anger you are spouting. I guarantee you will be much happier if you start helping others rather than trying to insult them and belittle them.
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    • Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      Is "arrogant" a code word on the Warrior forum
      In situations which apply: a definite yes as with the rest of the "real" world.

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      ...for telling the truth instead of vomiting the standard Warrior lies?
      Duh?

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      Off the Warrior forum, using a title like "Supreme Warrior Overlord" is the definition of arrogant and condescending.
      Yes it is if the person saying this doesn't understand its entirety, what titles are for here (mainly for fun) and how titles are used by each individual here (also mainly for fun I suppose).

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      On here, it seems to be bantered around any time someone dares to help someone.
      Your observations, your "facts".

      My observations speak different facts, one of which is the rsulting fact from the observation = the number of times you had to tell this across here.


      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      That would explain why so many helpful successful entrepreneurs refuse to spend much time helping Warriors. You systematically try to chase off anyone with any success who dares to tell the truth about how that success was attained. Why? Are you afraid that newbies will pass you up in success?
      See above. Added note: perhaps a person who can think and blurt out this statement would actually be the person doing it?

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      Success isn't a competition. It is a one person race. Each person individually reaps the rewards of their endeavors. Your value isn't dependent on holding others back from their success. In fact, the opposite is much more true.
      Wow! Enlightening!

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      The attitude some Warriors give any time someone dares to post true answers (verses the IM standard lies meant to hold people down) is what we call "rude" in the non-Warrior world. Name calling and personal attacks are pedantic and don't help anyone.
      Wow! Fantastic observations!

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      Redefining words for the purpose of attacking people and holding others down to a common level of success seems to be a common past-time here.
      Wow! Amazing empirical abilities!

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      I can assure you that it isn't a productive endeavor. In the outside world, it is your behavior that we label as "rude" and "condescending." Nobody in the real world uses those words to describe telling the truth and helping someone who are otherwise being mislead by miscreants and people who want to waste the time of others in fruitless endeavors.
      Wow! Unmatched generalization skills!

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      You know it's wrong. So don't it. Your mother taught you better than that.
      Here we go again, but I won't be dragged into acting like this, so: Wow! Amazing "dragging mothers in the fray" skills!

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      Article marketing to the actual publications that your prospects are reading is incredibly powerful and works. I know from experience. It is much easier than anyone would expect. But you can't waste your time doing these other things and trying to seal yourself into a bubble.
      Yes, you said this over and over and over and over and over and and and... again and again and again and again and again and again and and and.

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      Do you see any articles on EZA from Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos, Sergey Brin or ANY other successful article marketer who has attained serious success? You can go all the way down to the tiny million dollar a year companies. Are they using Ezine Articles for their article marketing? Of course not. You know better. That advice is a trick to hurt your fellow marketers. There is no reason to hurt them.

      Do you see Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos and Sergey Brin published in the publications their prospects read? Of course you do. You know that is the way it really works.

      Perhaps you think it isn't possible to be published in the publications your audience actually read. That isn't true at all. Every single day a brand new writer is added to the list of published authors. The book I recommended has been used by probably more than 80% of them based on my conversations with published writers.
      Wow! Unrivalled big-boy-and-girl talk skills!

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      It works. I followed it. I was published. Just about everyone I have ever talked to who has been published was a complete unknown when they decided to try article marketing. They simply followed the steps and they were published.
      Yes, you already mentioned you were published 500+++ times. We already know this. Congratulations by the way.

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      Why expend so much negative energy trying to talk people out of even trying to achieve their dreams?
      Yeah, really: why do this?

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      ...help them with real information about your actual experience.
      Being a "good" person in business 101 and marketing 101, like I said.

      Originally Posted by KristiDaniels View Post

      If you haven't yet experienced success of the type they are seeking, then don't try to teach just because you have heard the same drivel over and over and over. Instead, find someone who has achieved what you desire and follow their path. Success is much sweeter a taste than the bitter anger you are spouting. I guarantee you will be much happier if you start helping others rather than trying to insult them and belittle them.
      Yeah, why not do this right away but innovate your own "methods for success" (since people have different definitions of "success" anyway, so customizing the methods would be best) and end up more "successful" starting today?

      Great talk!
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  • Profile picture of the author Allen Graves
    <ducking and dodging the crossfire>

    Anybody got any popcorn?

    Allen

    p.s. You guys be careful, remember rule #1
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    • Originally Posted by Allen Graves View Post

      <ducking and dodging the crossfire>

      Anybody got any popcorn?

      Allen

      p.s. You guys be careful, remember rule #1
      Have some.

      Will send affiliate link where you can download some right away.

      Also have different affiliate links for salt, butter and softdrink downloads.

      Just give word if you need those, too.

      They accept PayPal and credit cards BTW.
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      • Profile picture of the author Allen Graves
        Originally Posted by Marx Vergel Melencio View Post

        Have some.

        Will send affiliate link where you can download some right away.

        Also have different affiliate links for salt, butter and softdrink downloads.

        Just give word if you need those, too.

        They accept PayPal and credit cards BTW.
        Dude - great idea for a monthly membership site - you'll retire early!
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        • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
          Ms Daniels,
          Is "arrogant" a code word on the Warrior forum for telling the truth instead of vomiting the standard Warrior lies?

          Off the Warrior forum, using a title like "Supreme Warrior Overlord" is the definition of arrogant and condescending.

          On here, it seems to be bantered around any time someone dares to help someone.

          That would explain why so many helpful successful entrepreneurs refuse to spend much time helping Warriors.
          If you find this place that distasteful, you are welcome to use the exit.

          I've cut you way more slack than I should. One of your very first posts (remember the ridiculous comment about how "real" business don't use autoresponders?) was this kind of arrogant, and you haven't improved much since.

          Mellow out or leave. I don't care which it is, but one of them will happen.


          Paul
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  • Profile picture of the author KristiDaniels
    Rule #1 has already been broken!

    It isn't very well enforced here.

    In another thread, I saw people thanking name callers rather than giving infractions.
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  • Profile picture of the author AdamWB
    LOL - wow there is so much misinformation in this thread it's mind-boggling (Kristi). It's funny when someone has a successful method they've used once or twice and decide its the end-all be-all of how things are done. Typical human nature. If half the things Kristi said were actually true (which they aren't), my bank account would be shot to hell. I'm not going to go into details because it really doesn't matter, and there is enough flame in this thread anyway.

    Hopefully the OP is able to sift through the bull**** and take the good advice.

    Submitting the same article to multiple directories is not going to harm you in the long run. Your articles aren't going to get penalized by the big G, and you will still be able to get a few of them highly ranked. I've done this many times and is a staple to my current business model.
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  • Profile picture of the author Poppy61
    Hey there,

    I would not suggest you to submit the same article to multiple directories. You will definitely get better results if you change the articles to some extent about 40% and then submit to different directories. That's what I do and it has given me better results than submitting one same article to multiple directories.

    Hope this helps,
    If you have any other question regarding article writing and distribution, let me know..I am just a PM away!

    To your success,
    Poppy


    Originally Posted by Why9999 View Post

    Ignorant question. I'm about to start to on an article submission campaign as part of a link building strategy, but I have a practical question: can you submit the same article to more than one article submission site? Some "experts" say yes, but I find it hard to believe that's a good idea. What if more than one site grabbed the article? Don't they all require exclusive access to the material?
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  • Profile picture of the author runner
    Originally Posted by Why9999 View Post

    Ignorant question. I'm about to start to on an article submission campaign as part of a link building strategy, but I have a practical question: can you submit the same article to more than one article submission site? Some "experts" say yes, but I find it hard to believe that's a good idea. What if more than one site grabbed the article? Don't they all require exclusive access to the material?
    I have written and submitted optimized articles since 2005
    and have always submitted the same article version into all directories
    partly using automatic submission service.

    My articles normally rank well from directories like EzineArticles, IdeaMarketers etc.

    I have never had problems with this system, which has brought me so much good things.

    Juhani
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  • Profile picture of the author KristiDaniels
    What could the Warrior forum be if you didn't order every successful person who ever joins to tell the same old Warrior lies or get out?

    Obviously you know my choice. It is the same choice as the last 100 people who were willing to tell the truth here made when you were exceedingly rude to them and ordered them to lie to people with the Warrior myths or leave.

    Bye.
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      Note that Ms Daniels made her own choice. At no time did I ask her to change her opinions to fit any standard, much less the fictional "official WF version" of things. Other than the rules, there is no such thing.

      I did require that she adjust the tone in which she expressed her beliefs. Anyone who's been here for a while knows that I don't mind people beating each other up, most of the time. However, this nonsense of attacking anyone who disagreed with her as somehow either a brainwashed sheep or part of some WF conspiracy is beyond reasonable. And attacking the entire forum in the way I quoted above is just asking to be escorted out.

      Or, to use her preferred analogy: Offline businesses don't let people stand in the lobby and shout things like that. Why should we?


      Paul
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      • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
        Later thoughts...

        Marx,

        You need to mellow out, too.

        Daniel,

        Yeah. She had some excellent points. Most of them would make a big difference for those writers here who are capable of putting out the kind of content she described. She's talking about playing in a much bigger sandbox than most of the people here even know exists.

        Too bad she went the conspiracy theory route...


        Paul
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        • Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

          Later thoughts...

          Marx,

          You need to mellow out, too.
          Paul,

          I'm calm, I'm calm, especially since WF's now less a person who enjoys self-validation done in condescending, rude and arrogant ways (she validated this further with her last posts 'cause something I said which didn't pinpoint anyone hit her hard, but WF got the result it needs - she was banned, she didn't leave on her own -, so that's the bottomline = results that count).

          This was what I posted:

          Originally Posted by Marx Vergel Melencio View Post

          Don't presume your target market (comprised of professionals) knows ABSOLUTELY NOTHING (as in 0%) nor couldn't learn ABSOLUTELY anything (as in 0%), on their own, about something they're interested in or have been doing or which can help them solve their problems or thinking of doing or which can ease their burden or which can destroy their enemies or which can end their pain and suffering or or or, and:

          ---> don't talk to them in ways which involve condescending, arrogant and sometimes even rude statements (may or may not be an inverse result of above)...

          ---> now THAT'S being a "good" person in business 101 and marketing 101. Period.

          Anyway:

          ---> having "quality" content published on "authority" sites with or without offline publications is great for target market exposure and SEM, and

          ---> having "quality" content published on EZA among other high PR high traffic high ranking online article directories is great for online target market exposure and SEM.

          So, track the performance of campaigns and weigh everything to improve and correct campaigns by slanting towards methods which give you the exact results you need at the fastest possible time and with the least time and money investment.
          The first portion's a reminder for marketers to initially treat their target market (or everyone in general) professionally and with granted respect because this would yield the best results.

          I didn't point a finger nor accuse anyone of doing this. I just implied people sometimes do things they're not supposed to.

          The last portion's for the OP.

          I guess the first portion hit her hard?

          Anyway, to the OP and everyone who posted here: my apologies.

          Guess that's the calmest, most professional approach I could do in such a situation, but I know I'll find better ways real soon.

          Here's another one for the OP:

          I believe onsite marketing and backlink building campaigns should be done with great content which will: (1) catch the attention, (2 )provoke interest, (3) provide useful/helpful info/advice, (4) provoke curiosity for more or new useful/helpful info/advice and (5) generate needed actions from the target market.

          Backlink building campaigns include article marketing, forum posting, blog commenting, Web 2.0 marketing, social network marketing, backlink swap deals, guest blogging, etc.

          Of course it should be done where your target market hangs out, so sites where backlinks must be placed should be relevant to your niche, but since most of your target market hangs out where their SE searches take them, place your great content with backlinks on high ranking sites for your target keywords, and because the SE ranking of your sites can be improved by building great content with backlinks on high PR dofollow sites: you can also do this, and since authority sites are trusted by your target market for the information they publish: get your great content with backlinks on those sites, too.

          At least this is what I'll do, and of course everyone's always free to try other things out and see what works.
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  • Profile picture of the author Allen Graves
    OK - now that the dust is settling, I'd like to ask a question to everyone who has posted an opinion.

    Have you tried it both ways?

    You see, everyone has a strong opinion on whether or not to rewrite their articles for submission to each directory - but these opinions appear to be based on how they have been doing it rather than citing results from looking at it from both sides.

    If you are rewriting your articles for submission, I encourage you to try NOT rewriting them for each directory. Instead, rewrite them and then submit those to each directory. Your ROI, exposure and branding increases dramatically - and this is from talking to hundreds of article marketers ov er the years as well as trying it out on my own article marketing campaigns on over a dozen affiliate sites.

    For some, perhaps the difference will not be discernable. But for most, I would bet that you see a big difference relatively quickly. I tried doing the whole rewriting thing before - and my backlink growth slowed to a crawl, my direct traffic suffered because of the huge decrease in articles submitted, my bottom line was affected in most cases...for the worse.

    Plus, as I go through my daily grind, I talk to a gazillion internet marketers via email or on the phone. This comes up a lot (especially lately) and a conclusion is always made that NOT rewriting appears to be more advantageous i most cases.

    **********************************

    "It's best to rewrite at least xx% and submit each rewrite to a specific directory."

    Oh yea? Why? Have you tested it? Have you tested it LATELY? What were your results? Show me the cheese!

    Nobody has shown results or stated WHY they are stating their opinion as fact. They are just saying theor way is the way to do it.

    Again, don't just take my word for it, I am not trying to tell anybody what to do. I am just urging you to try it out for yourself. If you give it an honest effort - and you will know whether it is honest or not - I am confident that you will see a plain difference.

    *********************************

    Paul,

    I believe your "conspiracy theory" is the most appropriate. There was an obvious agenda there.

    Thanks,
    Allen
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    • Originally Posted by Allen Graves View Post

      OK - now that the dust is settling, I'd like to ask a question to everyone who has posted an opinion.

      Have you tried it both ways?

      You see, everyone has a strong opinion on whether or not to rewrite their articles for submission to each directory - but these opinions appear to be based on how they have been doing it rather than citing results from looking at it from both sides.

      If you are rewriting your articles for submission, I encourage you to try NOT rewriting them for each directory. Instead, rewrite them and then submit those to each directory. Your ROI, exposure and branding increases dramatically - and this is from talking to hundreds of article marketers ov er the years as well as trying it out on my own article marketing campaigns on over a dozen affiliate sites.

      For some, perhaps the difference will not be discernable. But for most, I would bet that you see a big difference relatively quickly. I tried doing the whole rewriting thing before - and my backlink growth slowed to a crawl, my direct traffic suffered because of the huge decrease in articles submitted, my bottom line was affected in most cases...for the worse.

      Plus, as I go through my daily grind, I talk to a gazillion internet marketers via email or on the phone. This comes up a lot (especially lately) and a conclusion is always made that NOT rewriting appears to be more advantageous i most cases.

      **********************************

      "It's best to rewrite at least xx% and submit each rewrite to a specific directory."

      Oh yea? Why? Have you tested it? Have you tested it LATELY? What were your results? Show me the cheese!

      Nobody has shown results or stated WHY they are stating their opinion as fact. They are just saying theor way is the way to do it.

      Again, don't just take my word for it, I am not trying to tell anybody what to do. I am just urging you to try it out for yourself. If you give it an honest effort - and you will know whether it is honest or not - I am confident that you will see a plain difference.



      Yes, we have tried both ways.

      Our previous WSO here involved submitting the same freshly written article to 25 article directories, with the first 3 ones being EZA, Buzzle and GoArticles - AD and AB are there, too - while the 25th's ContentCrooner (an auto-submit directory).

      At first, we got positive reviews because buyers got great results.

      ...but when demand increased, tracking/monitoring and management problems rose, especially because:

      ---> EZA and Buzzle (there may be others) don't accept submitted content already published by other article directories. There may be ways around this like submitting first to EZA, waiting for it to be published, then submitting the exact copy to the article directories which accept already published content, or using the same penname on the other directories which accept already published content as suggested by another warrior earlier.

      We closed down that WSO, refunded delayed orders and even offered to complete refunded orders 100% free. We did this while we improved our systems and overall company structure (found different problems while correcting others).

      *AD1 = set of article directories which don't accept already published content on other article directories
      *AD2 - set of article directories which do

      So now, instead of tracking AD1 and AD2 plus monitoring rule changes as well as publication time by AD1 in order to submit the exact copy to AD2, we (for our internal projects for all our clients) decided to write an article, manually spin it then process it using our software to produce 50-100+++ versions each 70% unique (dupes content duplication filters of AD1), then manually submit it much faster and easier (to manage) via our inhouse submission software (our inhouse submission software allows my colleagues to automate everything involved in submissions except things which must be done manually, like making sure the content is properly formatted, links are working fine, capchas are resolved, etc., but it does this in a way which presents it in a window which makes it faster for my colleagues to manually input such data, and our inhouse submission software has a "submission frequency" selector along with a "randomizer" function for submission frequency selections, an autoupdate function for all article directories we store in our database - it automatically updates all data for each article directory like PR, Alexa, NF/DF, total number of inbound and outbound links in article page, article body and article bio, total allowable number of outbound and inbound links in article body and article bio, total allowable number of characters in title, body and bio, and autosubmit/non-auto submit, which it then uses to calculate effectiveness rankings of each article directory following a weight-percentage system coded in it to rank all article directories we store in our database in order of effectiveness, and it automatically ssends generated CSV reports plus the submitted version as each submission is completed to our admin email and our clients' emails).

      Ahh, but I'm now thinking of a way to code it for our inhouse submission software to just submit 70% unique versions to AD1, then for all 48 or 98 70% unique versions (since 2 or more of the versions would've been submitted to AD1) to be submitted repeatedly to AD2).

      This'll make our inhouse tool more valuable.

      I reckon this would just take 16 hours of coding work.

      Thanks for the advice!

      Sorry, can't publish results we get from our internal projects = NDAs with our clients (mostly in the system security software development, tech info and travel niches as well as non-tech affiliate marketing management companies).
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      • Profile picture of the author Allen Graves
        [QUOTE=Marx Vergel Melencio;1709445]
        Ahh, but I'm now thinking of a way to code it for our inhouse submission software to just submit 70% unique versions to AD1, then for all 48 or 98 70% unique versions (since 2 or more of the versions would've been submitted to AD1) to be submitted repeatedly to AD2).[QUOTE]

        Exactly! It just makes more sense to use what you already have to create more exposure.

        At least, that's my train of thought.

        I know that keeping up with all of the directories is a huge pain in the arse - especially since they seem to always change things as soon as you get comfortable with them. LOL

        At least it makes the day go by quicker!

        Allen
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  • Profile picture of the author troy23
    You can do that, but Google will only index the one copy. Best to rewrite it a few times.
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    • Profile picture of the author Allen Graves
      Originally Posted by troy23 View Post

      You can do that, but Google will only index the one copy. Best to rewrite it a few times.
      That's not true, Troy. This is just another myth flying around out there.

      Yes, Google said this was the case, but saying and doing are two different things.

      I frequently find several copies of the same content all over the first and second pages of results for not-too-shabby keyword phrases.

      But then again, I spend quite a great deal of time going through Google results. It's funny really - Yahoo and Bing are better at indexing "only one copy" than the SE that says they do it. LOL

      Cheers
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  • Profile picture of the author zoobie
    the biggest ones won't allow you to do that.. such as Ezine, article dashborad etc.
    I will suggest you at least re write them to 30% to have some kind of uniqueness of your articles.
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  • Profile picture of the author Allen Graves
    Marx,

    I was just wondering why you are under the assumption that EZA does not accept articles that are already published elsewhere. I submit articles all the time to EZA that are already published on other directories, blogs, social sites, etc...and they accept them.

    I know Buzzle won't, and I think there are a couple others, but EZA does. You have to make sure you are using the same author name you use in the other submissions as well as your own website, though. Maybe that's the reason????

    Allen
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    • Originally Posted by Allen Graves View Post

      Marx,

      I was just wondering why you are under the assumption that EZA does not accept articles that are already published elsewhere. I submit articles all the time to EZA that are already published on other directories, blogs, social sites, etc...and they accept them.

      I know Buzzle won't, and I think there are a couple others, but EZA does. You have to make sure you are using the same author name you use in the other submissions as well as your own website, though. Maybe that's the reason????
      Allen,

      I think you're right = we didn't use the same author name all the time back then because we had data entry colleagues handling different submissions, so they use different accounts.

      So, when submitting to AD2s, the same author name under 1 account must be used for each version submitted to an AD2, right?

      Have to keep this in mind before doing coding work = each version must use same author name under same account for each submission to all selected AD2s (i.e. 50 versions = 50 author names under 50 accounts, 1 version = same author name and account, all 50 submitted to each AD2s).

      This would fit in nicely with the syntax logic translation above = I reckon it would be better for each spun version to come with a different author name so as for readers to think on the fly it was written by a different author in case they already read a different version on another article directory. I just think it'd be "weird" for them to read something talking about the same main topic and almost similar info/advice as the previous version they've read, rewritten "uniquely" by the same author, and so it wouldn't be the case if they read the same version across multiple sites with the same author name and its other versions with different author names across multiple sites.
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  • Profile picture of the author ebiz101
    Yes its easy you can submit your article to many directories.But for content quality you can spin your article content and then submit to other directories.
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  • Profile picture of the author larryburr
    I have used the same article on directories in addition to EZA and most published it. A few I skipped (such as Buzzle). I never had a problem with any I submitted to and I got a high ranking on Google (first page). Article Marketing is just one method I use and I do not have time to rewrite each article. This is for traffic and backlinking. I am not trying to get paid for an article directly. Seems we are all discussing different usages of our article. There is a lot of good and interesting material here which IMHO isn't what was originally asked for by Why9999. Yes, you can submit the same article to many directories if their TOS allow it.
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  • Profile picture of the author donmccobb
    There is really no problem submitting the same article to more than one article directory. When I have done it, I usually change the title. However, I don't think that is significant. It used to be said the Google penalized duplicate submissions, but recently I have read that isn't true either.
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  • Profile picture of the author DamianLeon
    Start with EZineArticles.com - make sure it gets accepted there- then, you can use ContentBoss to spin it at 70% unique, and you can resubmit to other sites. You can use SeNuke or Content Crooner to do that- hope that helps! Damian
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