Don't Punish Me After I Buy Your WSO

14 years ago

Amen to that

Veit
\

Originally Posted by terryrayburn

Am I the only one who can't stand to be barraged by daily "offers" as a reward for buying a WSO?

I love getting updated about your new WSO if I've already enjoyed one or more of yours before, but...

If you take my purchase and turn it into a constant "Hey, check THIS out!", "Hey, check THIS one out!", I simply unsubscribe, and then...

You have no opportunity to make sure I see your next WSO.

--Full disclosure - It's a free country, I love marketing, and I'm not arguing with your FREEDOM to bury me in "stuff". And if it's working for you, well...it's working for you. Just letting you know it's not working on me

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Marhelper

14 years ago

I hear you on that but have you just replied asking to not be "barraged." If not, then just shoot a quick email.

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terryrayburn 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Marhelper

I hear you on that but have you just replied asking to not be "barraged." If not, then just shoot a quick email.

Time is precious, and my natural thing to do is "unsubscribe".

Why take the (precious) time for this post, then?

I'm just sharing a philosophy here. Although my post sounds self-centered (as in, "this bugs ME-E-E!!"), it's really just a note to all WSOers that I might not be the only one reacting that way.
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- NancyHill 14 years ago
  
  Terry....Great feedback for marketers on here. I think it's interesting you chose the word "punish" as it implies a certain feeling you are getting that I'm sure people are not intending to give a customer. The typical teaching of lots of the gurus is to keep barraging people with emails and offers, and the ones who get annoyed will unsubscribe...maybe there is a place for a different approach that is a bit more humane. I know I appreciate feeling more like a valued person than an open wallet.
  
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MichaelHiles

14 years ago

It's called Marketing Moronitis, and it's practiced by people who haven't the foggiest clue of how to be successful.

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R Hagel

14 years ago

Geeze Terry, what did you expect when you bought the "Marketing for Masochists" WSO?

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terryrayburn

14 years ago

Originally Posted by R Hagel

Geeze Terry, what did you expect when you bought the "Marketing for Masochists" WSO?

LOL - I did order that one, but I've been trying to download it for three weeks. Forty-three PM's back and forth and it's still hanging up in cyberspace. I only get small snippets of high-pitched audio laughter from time to time.

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Ken Strong

14 years ago

Originally Posted by terryrayburn

LOL - I did order that one, but I've been trying to download it for three weeks. Forty-three PM's back and forth and it's still hanging up in cyberspace. I only get small snippets of high-pitched audio laughter from time to time.

Ah -- I see you went for the Super Pain upsell package...

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R Hagel 14 years ago

Originally Posted by KenStrong

Ah -- I see you went for the Super Pain upsell package...

That particular upsell was totally lame. But the personal coaching OTO wasn't too bad.
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Troy_Phillips

14 years ago

But Terry ... The latest overnight riches ( in your underwear ) ebook said to email my list several times a day .

As long as I have more coming in than leaving ... well you get the picture .

Over the years I have made about every fool move an email marketer can make .

While most people will except an email a day from someone that really tries to help them, very few will stay subscribed to the sales pitch a day club .

I opened this thread for the fact that I was thinking .. just another want to be marketer bitching about marketing practices .

Some valid points in this one though

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terryrayburn

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Troy_Phillips

I opened this thread for the fact that I was thinking .. just another want to be marketer bitching about marketing practices .

Some valid points in this one though

I know what you mean.

For what it's worth, I LOVE WSOs!

Second only to the regular posts from all you Warriors, they are the cheapest "continuing education" in IM one can get.

When I was a Realtor for over 20 years, I spent WAY more on "continuing education" then I will ever spend on WSOs, and though necessary, it was never as practical as (good) WSOs are.

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JonMills

14 years ago

While i agree with you bud, and I understand if you land on list some just use their lists to whore out product after product

Its a bit of a 2 edged sword

If they email to frequent, a person unsubscribes
If they email not enough, a person unsubscribes

basically my rule of thumb is unless you really want to be on a list, dont sign up for anything or if you do unsubscribe after if its that annoying.

Marketing is marketing and if you buy anything nowdays even offline and you give out your email.. its a given your going to get contacted with products unless you stipulate you dont wish to.. just the nature of the beast

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terryrayburn 14 years ago

Originally Posted by JonMills

If they email to frequent, a person unsubscribes
If they email not enough, a person unsubscribes

I'm not even talking about frequency, per se, I'm talking about that which is reflected in your first sentence:

Originally Posted by JonMills

some just use their lists to whore out product after product

Even "product after product" has its place, but not in response to buying somebody's WSO (IF they want me to know about their *next* WSO, anyway).

There are several who regularly put out good WSOs, and I actually look forward to their next one.

Pity if I didn't know when their next one came out because they buried me with a Wal-Mart pile of unrelated offers, each one with a 30-minute video to watch (and I can't even know the length of the video till it's over with).
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sodette1

14 years ago

Originally Posted by JonMills

While i agree with you bud, and I understand if you land on list some just use their lists to whore out product after product

Its a bit of a 2 edged sword

If they email to frequent, a person unsubscribes
If they email not enough, a person unsubscribes

I agree, uhm, kinda... with this caveat:

My latest mantra (and a new report that I'm writing) is this:

"It's the VALUE of what you offer, not the VOLUME."

So, if you have something valuable to offer me once a day - GREAT... send away (not impersonal, can get it anywhere crap, but real time, valuable, "thinking about me and trying to help me" information).

If you have something valuable to offer me one to three times a week - even better.

Any less than once a week and I forget who you are really.

Here's the thing though..... and it's real important.

If you send me crap and PITCH me or (what REALLY, REALLY, REALLY PISSES ME OFF!) If you SEND ME AN EMAIL WITH SOME URGENT HEADLINE OR SOME YOU'VE GOTTA READ THIS NOW HEADLINE...

And it's a pitch or push... I'm G-O-N-E!

Freakin' I trusted you and like you enough to get on your list and want to buy something from you (like a WSO) or learn something from you or get some kind of value from you - and all you do now is PITCH ME - which is really all about YOU and NONE about me.

One guy who is on here I really like and have purchased plenty of his products (years ago however) and gone to his live events even... but here are his headlines now:

Sorry.
URGENT.
... this is WEIRD
... your password
... WOW.
... Ridiculous
... SHATTERED
...
...
... an open letter to IMers
... (private) INVITATION
... SCREWED
... Happy V-Day!

etc.

I used to think these were pretty ok... and they used to be, because in each message was at least something I could take away, something of value.

Now, however... every single stupid freakin' lying one of these is a sly PITCH or sneaky link to some affiliate crap or product. Rarely even anything of his own anymore.

That's not marketing... even if it does make money... it's done and done.

I stay on the list to see if there are any of the OLD guy messages still in him... I mean, I truly like the guy and really don't think he is like this at all, having met him several times.

But I tell you, this is gotten out of hand for him and for many other marketers also.

I've gotten so disgusted with the whole thing... and the fact that what most of the clowns are pushing to me which has NO bearing at all on trying to even pretend to want to help me or be interested in my business or success... that I've stopped spending my money.

How's that?

Keep it up - pretty soon markets will find people like me who give a damn and you guys will just help us to corner even more of any market for ourselves... THANKS!

Steve

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VeitSchenk

14 years ago

I like the Zappos.com philosophy of selling: no upsells/cross-sells noone is asking for ("hey, would you like some insurance for the soles of your new shoes....")
Saw an interview with Tony (can't remember how to spell his surname...), the CEO of Zappos, and that's their rule: no needless pitching, they'd rather go for the goodwill that results from this -- plenty of referrals and growth from 0 to $1Bn in 10 years.

works for me

Veit

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JustOnePepsi

14 years ago

Opt out, then.

Don't buy more products from someone who doesn't know how to slowly build demand and trust.

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Brad Gosse

14 years ago

I don't mail my customers unless its a free update. THe only people I mail opt in.

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JohnMcCabe 14 years ago

Sometimes the piling on comes from marketers who are told they should segment their lists, so they end up with multiple lists and you end up on more than one of them. This is fine, as long as the next step is to tailor the offers to the segment.

Too many times, rather than expending the effort to tailor the messages, the marketer just blasts the same message to all the lists without bothering to de-dupe the master list. So you end up getting multiple copies of the same email, one from each list segment you are on.

This even happens with "name" marketers who should either know better or have staff people who know better. Either they don't know how to de-dupe their lists or they can't be bothered. Either way, it's annoying.

Okay, now that I have that out of my system, time for a cleansing breath and hit "post"...
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tomsmith_mcm

14 years ago

I feel your pain on this one.

I despise the daily sales pitches as much as you.

Maybe that practice works for some. However, I have found it much better (and I mean I feel better about it) to set up my autoresponder to give useful affiliate marketing information with subtle product recommendations at the end of most messages. People tend to stay on a list longer when it's not all about getting and more of a giving relationship.

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MarkAse

14 years ago

I agree there and I think there are some valuable lessons there for us as we build our lists. It's ok to promote to your list, but there has to be a balance long term of providing valuable free information as well as selling products. If I get 5 pitches in the first 5 days, I'm out of there really quick.

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timpears

14 years ago

I am with you Terry. Any more I open about 25% to 50% of my email. Sometimes I am motivated to open a few and unsubscribe. A few I actually find interesting or useful, but most of the time I just leave them unopened. If there is a whole bunch of them together in my inbox, I will just highlight them all and do a shift delete, so they don't even go to my deleted box, they just disapear into the ether.

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TheRichJerksNet

14 years ago

I can honestly say a few on this thread are my customers from my WSO and they have only got 2 emails in a year and both was about the exact "same" WSO, not a new one.

James

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Tom B

Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by TheRichJerksNet

I can honestly say a few on this thread are my customers from my WSO and they have only got 2 emails in a year and both was about the exact "same" WSO, not a new one.

James

That is because you are building the email system from scratch for each person on your list. By the time you get done, they only get 2 emails each per year.

You work too hard, James.

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TheRichJerksNet

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Thomas Belknap

That is because you are building the email system from scratch for each person on your list. By the time you get done, they only get 2 emails each per year.

You work too hard, James.

Just do not think it is right for me to send unrelated junk to them.. I am not one to be big on list anyways.. If they buy "learn how to make bozo chocolate" then why in this green earth would I send them to my new WSO on "make war and not peace" :confused:

To me they purchased a specific WSO / product and I see no need to bomb them with unrelated junk .. But this is just me ...

James

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Tom B

Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by TheRichJerksNet

Just do not think it is right for me to send unrelated junk to them.. I am not one to be big on list anyways.. If they buy "learn how to make bozo chocolate" then why in this green earth would I send them to my new WSO on "make war and not peace" :confused:

To me they purchased a specific WSO / product and I see no need to bomb them with unrelated junk .. But this is just me ...

James

I was just joking with you James. Breath buddy, breath.

I would bet that some of those people would be interested in "bozo chocolate and how it created peace."

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TheRichJerksNet

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Thomas Belknap

I was just joking with you James. Breath buddy, breath.

I would bet that some of those people would be interested in "bozo chocolate and how it created peace."

I know you was ...

James

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Troy_Phillips

14 years ago

Originally Posted by TheRichJerksNet

I can honestly say a few on this thread are my customers from my WSO and they have only got 2 emails in a year and both was about the exact "same" WSO, not a new one.

James

You could actually send more to your members James .

The one I got today about the social posting has me waiting on the one next week that says .... it's a go.

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TheRichJerksNet

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Troy_Phillips

You could actually send more to your members James .

The one I got today about the social posting has me waiting on the one next week that says .... it's a go.

Well that's my members ... I was referring to my WSO Customers, I do not think they are a "list" ... Glad you liked the email though

@Michael Mayo - Yeah all the smilies are "bald" ...

James

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Michael Mayo 14 years ago

Originally Posted by TheRichJerksNet

@Michael Mayo - Yeah all the smilies are "bald" ...

James

Hey James, Watch the Bald Jokes OK...lol :p

~Michael
PS. Terry, I'm done. You may continue now.
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Michael Mayo

14 years ago

Terry, I Totally Agree.

When people purchase my WSO's, they only receive additional emails if I have an upgrade available.

Heck, I'm receiving emails about stuff from people here that I've never requested to receive?
That alone burns my arse and ... Oh, Um... I'll leave it at that...lol
Nothing productive will come from my rant anyway.

Have a Great Day!
Michael

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Lee Wilson

14 years ago

Too many marketers don't think or care about the long term. Unsubscribe rates don't account for those that never get around to unsubscribing but hit the delete button without even bothering to read the email or stop logging into their old hotmail account. I don't care what any guru tells you or what the current consensus is, expectation is human nature and repetition guarantees expectation. What do you want your potential customer to expect in three years or four from now?

Everyone is different and it depends what the long and short term goals are, personally I'm more into sustainable businesses without having to keep moving the goal posts. The current methods rely too much on a rotating customer base of inexeperience. Sure, they will probably always exist but as time goes by, it will cost more money and effort to attract them and by that time, half of your three year old list will have given up on you.

Lee

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Michael Mayo

14 years ago

Wow! Till just now I never realized that all the smilies look like Thomas...lol

Thomas that is huge! How did you talk Allen into that? ;-)

Have a Great Day!
Michael

PS. Sorry Terry for the OT post!

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Tom B

Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Mayo

Wow! Till just now I never realized that all the smilies look like Thomas...lol

Thomas that is huge! How did you talk Allen into that? ;-)

Have a Great Day!
Michael

PS. Sorry Terry for the OT post!

Yeah, I just let Allen think they all looked like him. I had a hard time talking him out of using cigars in each smilie.

If I keep this up I will be able to take over the world. muhahaha

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Don't Punish Me After I Buy Your WSO

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