How to make a -->GOOD<-- ebook? (not enough to write about)

yao1994

18 years ago

And i forgot to mention that this is not for the IM niche.

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Vyliss

18 years ago

Length is important.. I wouldn't want to pay $97 on an e-book that contained 25 pages. If that's the first thing I see I'd be mighty pissed and would be suspicious if I got my money's worth.

You can definitely put more stuff in like stories... each chapter could have its own story, people find it easier to relate to these and if one doesn't do it, you could put in a few sub/mini stories too.

You can also find real world casestudies or do interviews that you can put in the e-book.

Sometimes people need to hear something 5 different ways to fully get it.

Hope that helps.

Pictures can pad it out more too.

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Steven Fullman

18 years ago

Originally Posted by Vyliss

Length is important...

Sorry. I must disagree...as long as we're talking ebooks, that is.

Scenario: Say I have a wowser trick that'll earn you a hundred bucks a day...EVERY DAY...

Let's also speculate that it's SO simple, I could write it out comprehensively, step-by-step, and with no room for doubt...in =< 5 pages.

Are you honestly telling me you would be pissed off spending $97 for this info???

Steve

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Danielle_B

18 years ago

Originally Posted by Steven Fullman

Sorry. I must disagree...as long as we're talking ebooks, that is.

Scenario: Say I have a wowser trick that'll earn you $97 a day...EVERY DAY...

Let's also speculate that it's SO simple, I could write it out comprehensively, step-by-step, and with no room for doubt...in =< 5 pages.

Are you honestly telling me you would be pissed off spending a hundred bucks for this info???

Steve

Steve,

I have to agree with this. Plus you need to take into account the fact that everyone's writing styles are different. Some people are very direct in their approach, don't mince words and get straight to the point at hand. Others are quite verbose and take their time working up to their point. Obviously, this will alter page value.

~D.

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Steven Fullman 18 years ago

Originally Posted by Danielle_B

...page value.

~D.

I think of it as word value!

Thanks, Danielle!

Steve
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Vyliss

18 years ago

Originally Posted by Steven Fullman

Sorry. I must disagree...as long as we're talking ebooks, that is.

Scenario: Say I have a wowser trick that'll earn you a hundred bucks a day...EVERY DAY...

Let's also speculate that it's SO simple, I could write it out comprehensively, step-by-step, and with no room for doubt...in =< 5 pages.

Are you honestly telling me you would be pissed off spending $97 for this info???

Steve

Yep, your result doesn't mean my result, if I see it is 5 pages long my initial reaction is I'll be pissed... If this *trick* takes about a day to do which probably would have been how long it took you to make it, but it made me 1 million dollars, that's a diff story, but most ebooks don't work that way...

Even if it's brilliant, I don't see why you couldnt spend a little extra time explaining the process more (case studies, how you came up with the idea, a bit of background info so I know you're not just some scammer etc).

An ebook (book) is a story, I don't want to read an instruction manual, I want to know who is talking to me and how well they can communicate with me etc.

With that said, I prefer a nice summary of the method on one page in the beginning, so I don't need to read through 20 pages of crap to get to the solution, but imagine if the first 5 pages are great then how much better will the rest of the book be!

That's how I would think, and if you're going to market to the general public, most will probably look at the page count FIRST, you don't want them to regret their buying decision within the first 10 mins or they will probably get a refund.

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Zeus66

18 years ago

Length is important.. I wouldn't want to pay $97 on an e-book that contained 25 pages. If that's the first thing I see I'd be mighty pissed and would be suspicious if I got my money's worth.

This is bad advice. Some of the best ebooks I've read were on the short side. Fill it with fluff to make it longer and THAT is what will really piss people off. If the really solid info only takes up 23 pages, so be it. Sell it for what you think it's genuinely worth.

John

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Stanley Tang

18 years ago

Put in resources (links to other sites), write case studies, integrate other people's product or your own products into the ebook.

It's quality over quantity. But of course, some people do judge an ebook by its length...

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Danielle_B 18 years ago

Perhaps you can market it as a guide, versus a full on book. Guides tend to be shorter in length but don't necessarily skimp on content.

Personally, I think padding at all is kinda' shady, but that's just my opinion. If you're using addt'l content that's relevant and helps make your point, then it's all good. But just adding extra words for fluff is.....meh....I'd feel scammed.

So yeah. A Guide!

~D.
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- ShayB 18 years ago
  
  Call it a report, a guide, a step-by-step method - whatever you want to, but don't call it an ebook.
  
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  Danielle_B 18 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Shay60654
  
  Call it a report, a guide, a step-by-step method - whatever you want to, but don't call it an ebook.
  
  Obviously, great minds think alike.
  
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  ShayB 18 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Danielle_B
  
  Obviously, great minds think alike.
  
  Of course!
  
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  Headhunting55 18 years ago
  
  It's interesting.....I notice that EVERY TIME I buy an ebook, the very first thing I do is to look at the page count. I want to see if I think i've gotten my money's worth, and I seem to gauge that by quantity, at least EMOTIONALLY.
  
  On the other hand, I will tell you that i am SICK of ebooks that have page after page of fluff and filler, where it's OBVIOUS that they just wanted to increase the page count to give the illusion of a better value.
  
  I would prefer 5 or 10 pages of tight, step-by-step how-to pages 50 or 100 pages that are half-full of fluff and filler.
  
  I think my "satisfaction" level would be influenced in positve manner if the seller stated in the sales page that "you will be getting JUST what you need -8 pages of just the steps you need to know" or something like that.
  
  it's an interesting issue.....quality/value perception and size of product.
  
  DJ
  
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  Paul Myers 18 years ago
  
  DJ,
  
  Excellent point.
  
  If I'm doing a short(ish) report, I'll tell people that in the sales letter, just as you suggest. For example, one is a mere 8000 words, and I described it just that way, a short, quick read, with just what you need.
  
  Refund rate on that one: .2% (1/500)
  
  The same day I released that, I read a salesletter that used the phrase, "a massive 6500 words."
  
  HUH?
  
  Massive?
  
  It might have been 100% rock-solid, super-valuable content, but I wasn't going to find out. There's no way 20 or so pages is "massive." One comment like that is enough for me to skip the offer.
  
  Mind you, that is NOT a lie. Giving exact word count leaves the interpretation of the adjective to the reader. It's completely true, but ridiculous. And somewhat misleading, in that most people have no clue what word counts translate to in real terms.
  
  Had the guy left out that one word, no problem. I wouldn't have cared about the word count or the page count. Just whether the thing delivered what I wanted when I ordered.
  
  As you suggest: It's all in the presentation.
  
  Paul
  
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tommygadget

18 years ago

I want people to get to the point. If you explain clearly how to implement the method, you should stop at that. I don't need your feel good stories in an ebook I already paid for. Also, I find that some newbies really do need more information, so it is best to solicit your customers for feedback so you can continue to improve your book. An ebook is always a work in progress, just get it out and get your customers to tell you what could be better or explained more.

TomG.

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lakshaybehl

18 years ago

Originally Posted by yao1994

Hey,

I just basically need to know how I can write a long enough ebook... Thing is my methods dont even need a lot of explaining. Its very effective but when i look at it its intro is 7 pages methods 14 and conclusion 2 pages. That's 23 pages but the intro is already 1/3 of the whole thing... Its got useful content but... it just doesn't seem long enough.

Maybe I should include some bull to make it longer? Do a lot of people encounter this? Whats the average ebook like? Or does it even matter?

This is my first time doing this. Next time I'm making someone else do it... I find marketing the product resonates with me more

Can anyone help?

Thank You

There we go!

Good question... Charge reasonably for it, and I do not think that length will matter that much. Maybe adfd some bonus information in a few more sections or like someone else has suggested, add some stories to make it a little larger.

Now.. add your header banner to each page and this will increase the number of pages.

Add some good copyright notices and this will also help increassing the no. of pages. Add a detailed index, a word from the author etc.

Also consider widening the margins a little.

Have a good footer image as well.

The best thing to do ... And this is a biggie...

Create an audio tyhat goes well with the ebook... Maybe simply by reading that ebook out.

And then that will definitely increase the percieved vbalue of your product.

Just a few ideas here and there.

Sure, no one will pay 97 bux for a 23 page "anything"...

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BeachCruzer

18 years ago

Originally Posted by yao1994

Hey,

I just basically need to know how I can write a long enough ebook... Thing is my methods dont even need a lot of explaining. Its very effective but when i look at it its intro is 7 pages methods 14 and conclusion 2 pages. That's 23 pages but the intro is already 1/3 of the whole thing... Its got useful content but... it just doesn't seem long enough.

If your introduction is 1/3 of your eBook, maybe you should consider restructuring your eBook. Most intros are usually a page or two at the most. It seems to me your intro should be your first chapter.

Just a suggestion.

Michael Cruz

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zeurois

18 years ago

Maybe using some good screenshots in the ebook to make your methods even more clear?

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Paul Myers 18 years ago

Do. Not. Pad. Your. Products!

Adding useless crap will just annoy people.

That said, there are some things you can add that are useful. Examples that help clarify your points can be very helpful. Checklists and worksheets are useful - if they make sense.

Pictures are sometimes useful, but only if they help make the material clearer. Process illustrations, examples, etc.

I would stay very far away from formatting changes designed to increase page count, like narrowing the page or using header graphics, larger font sizes or extra line spacing. If it's done just as padding, people will recognize it.

You may not believe it, but a lot of people prefer something that gets right to the point, gives them what they need, and skips the extraneous BS.

Folks are used to paying a premium for really good "how to" stuff. If you don't believe that, go to any bookstore and look at the prices on business books. Then go to a Lowes or Home Depot and look at what they charge for gardening guides or books of project blueprints.

Those types of books are a lot more expensive than entertainment, like novels or cartoons or cookbooks.

Put your effort into making it useful and valuable. Not bigger for the sake of appearances. You'll do much better in the long run.

Paul
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- Dave Allen 18 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Paul Myers
  
  I would stay very far away from formatting changes designed to increase page count, like narrowing the page.
  
  Paul
  
  Hi Paul,
  
  I do narrow the page for this reason alone --
  most people find it more "reader friendly".
  
  But never to pad the document.
  
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  Paul Myers 18 years ago
  
  Dave,
  
  I do narrow the page for this reason alone -- most people find it more "reader friendly".
  
  If you don't advertise it based on page count, and you explain that in the book, no problem.
  
  Some of my stuff is very focused on idea-generation, and I'll occasionally leave a wide right margin for notes. That makes sense to people, and I don't sell on page count.
  
  It's all in the presentation, as someone suggested earlier.
  
  Paul
  
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  Andrew Stevens 18 years ago
  
  Get all your main points, all the good stuff that will make your ebook stand out from the crowd, then go to a site like elance etc, and get a cheap ghostwriter to spit it out for you. Find another niche and repeat.
  
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  Andrew Stevens 18 years ago
  
  Also, i just wanted to say normally an ebook between 20-30 pages is good if your just giving the straight juice and it is real targeted and instructional. Personally I think anything can be explained in 50 pages or less. Any longer than that and a lot of people just won't read the whole thing unless it's gold.
  
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  Danielle_B 18 years ago
  
  Anyone have any tips on where you can pick up good free cover templates? I looked around on search, but there's a bizillion and you know how that goes.
  
  Solid recommendations would be great. Thank you!
  
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  Danielle_B 18 years ago
  
  Disregard...I used the search function for what I wanted and found previous threads. Sorry for the spam.
  
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dspruyt

18 years ago

I'd say.. before I started internet marketing. The person who taught me told me that a standard ebook should be about 40 - 70 pages. The thing is, it can't be too short.. and neither can it be too long.

Time is money and I believe that we want to maximize the time which we are able to learn and able to apply. I guess your ebook could consist of valid points with few examples of how can it be done.

For example, fishing. How should a person cast his rod? You could give a few examples on what the WRONG methods of casting the rod are so they get a clearer idea on what should be done. =) Hope this information is useful to you.

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TheRichJerksNet

18 years ago

Making it longer with informative information vs fluff and filler will produce you different results after purchase. Personally I dont want all the fluff and filler, I want to get to the point and be informed NOW!!

Some may disagree with this but please remember I am not a marketer, I am a web developer and this is just my opinion.

I much rather see a shorter ebook with amazing content vs a long ebook filled with half junk that has nothing to do with why I bought the ebook.

James

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LegitIncomes

18 years ago

Look at it this way. If you have a 1 page report on how to win the lottery, and it comes with the winning lotto numbers for tomorrow, how valuable is that? It's only 1 page, so it should be worthless if you go with some people's train of thought.

Don't worry about the length...worry about the content and getting straight to the point.

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TheRichJerksNet

18 years ago

Originally Posted by Josh Kulp

Look at it this way. If you have a 1 page report on how to win the lottery, and it comes with the winning lotto numbers for tomorrow, how valuable is that? It's only 1 page, so it should be worthless if you go with some people's train of thought.

Don't worry about the length...worry about the content and getting straight to the point.

I fully agree..

I will also state that my ebooks I produce are 1 page.. Course the length of that page is different in each ebook. I output by PDF using Acrobat Professional v7 and I set the page length so it fits into one page.

For example one ebook I have is 80 inches long which would be about 4 - 5 pages but it also has no filler, it gets right to the point and tells you what is what.. Others that may have wrote this would probably make it 10 pages easily but what most dont realize is this.

1. People are naturally lazy and dont like to read. (we are all guilty of this, admit it or not

)
2. People will skim though a ebook without reading every single word.
3. People want information and they want it now.

Imagine if google forced you to view todays news, latest press releases, top stories, and weather... Before you could view the actual search results that you searched for .. Would you love google if they did this on every single search or would you find a better search method ??

James

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Steven Fullman

18 years ago

Originally Posted by TheRichJerksNet

I fully agree..

I will also state that my ebooks I produce are 1 page.. Course the length of that page is different in each ebook. I output by PDF using Acrobat Professional v7 and I set the page length so it fits into one page.

For example one ebook I have is 80 inches long which would be about 4 - 5 pages but it also has no filler, it gets right to the point and tells you what is what.. Others that may have wrote this would probably make it 10 pages easily but what most dont realize is this.

1. People are naturally lazy and dont like to read. (we are all guilty of this, admit it or not

)
2. People will skim though a ebook without reading every single word.
3. People want information and they want it now.

Imagine if google forced you to view todays news, latest press releases, top stories, and weather... Before you could view the actual search results that you searched for .. Would you love google if they did this on every single search or would you find a better search method ??

James

James,

A Lot Of People Want:

a) Go Here
b) Do Precisely This
c) Then This Thing
d) Click Here
e) Reap This Reward

...which is exactly your point, I think!

If THAT takes more than 20 pages to explain, you can all but guarantee 80% of your audience won't DO it in the first place.

Probably.

Steve

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TheRichJerksNet

18 years ago

Originally Posted by Steven Fullman

James,

A Lot Of People Want:

a) Go Here
b) Do Precisely This
c) Then This Thing
d) Click Here
e) Reap This Reward

...which is exactly your point, I think!

If THAT takes more than 20 pages to explain, you can all but guarantee 80% of your audience won't DO it in the first place.

Probably.

Steve

Thanks Steve for explaining my post in simplier terms ..

See my post took many words, steve's only took a few but he spaced his out more to add filler to make it look like a longer post.. :p

James

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Steven Fullman

18 years ago

Originally Posted by TheRichJerksNet

Thanks Steve for explaining my post in simplier terms ..

See my post took many words, steve's only took a few but he spaced his out more to add filler to make it look like a longer post.. :p

James

It's all in "The Value Add", James...

Steve

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lcombs

18 years ago

Consider this...

To a professional page count is meaningless.

Word count is how the length of a piece is described.

I've bought 50 - 100 page ebooks that were only 2 - 3 thousand words.
The font and spacing made them appear much longer than they were.

So, the quality of the information + the demand will determine the value.

Also, consider this.

What sounds simple to you may not be to someone not as familiar with the topic.
You may lengthen the report and add value by adding more detail/description, etc.
Photos are always a good way increase length and value.

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tess47

18 years ago

I agree with A1Guru. I am currently working on an ebook that will be VERY beneficial to newbies, and when I get finished I believe it will be about 25 pages.

I have so much information packed into those pages that in my opinion it will be worth well more than many 50 page (and larger) ebooks I have seen on the subject.

I think the content is the most important aspect - help people do what they are wanting to do and achieve the outcome they desire. A product filled with fluff and garbage isn't the kind of product I want to make.

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