Offliners I need your advice please ..

14 years ago

How I would do it is to set up a blog and start writing posts and the call to action would be name and email address. Be a little out of the ordinary.

So write on topics that generate interest and then submit to social bookmarking sites etc. You can outsource this part of submitting.

Posts could be

Is your house about to burn down?
One step away from a heart attack!
Death makes us think about insurance
Refinancing so you can escape to Cuba
Have you insured your cat?

You get the idea.

Quentin

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zoro

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Quentin

How I would do it is to set up a blog and start writing posts and the call to action would be name and email address. Be a little out of the ordinary.

So write on topics that generate interest and then submit to social bookmarking sites etc. You can outsource this part of submitting.

Posts could be

Is your house about to burn down?
One step away from a heart attack!
Death makes us think about insurance
Refinancing so you can escape to Cuba
Have you insured your cat?

You get the idea.

Quentin

Quentin,

Seems like a great idea. I could set up a wordpress blog targeting the local geo keywords including finance & insurance. Then place relevent content posts as you suggest.
Thanks for your help.

Thanks

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Andyhenry

14 years ago

If you don't know how to generate leads for them - just tell them it's not something you can offer them.

If you BS them just to try and get their money you'll end up letting them down and ruining your relationship.

If you know how to do SEM then you can suggest some things which may help, but don't take their money if you don't know how to deliver.

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zoro

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Andyhenry

If you don't know how to generate leads for them - just tell them it's not something you can offer them.

If you BS them just to try and get their money you'll end up letting them down and ruining your relationship.

If you know how to do SEM then you can suggest some things which may help, but don't take their money if you don't know how to deliver.

Andy,

Sorry, I should have clarified from the start the fact that I already generate leads via Adwords for other offline clients. But these clients are in business categories like Plumbers and Limousine Hire, which currently only costs approx $1.30 per click.
This new client found out about my lead generation service from one of my other clients and that's why they asked me to help them.
I do know how to set up successful landing pages that convert into leads, but if I can't afford adwords I was wondering if any warrior's may have some other ideas.
Appreciate your input.

Thanks
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Andyhenry

14 years ago

Originally Posted by zoro

I do know how to set up successful landing pages that convert into leads, but if I can't afford adwords I was wondering if any warrior's may have some other ideas.

That makes sense. Thanks for the clarification.

The obvious 2 approaches are:

To make the value of the click worth more
(by setting up a system where the numbers make sense for you - either by capturing the names and using them yourself aswell as selling them to your client, or just test it out and then charge them what you need to for it to make sense)

or

Get the costs down.

The obvious course of action is to use more long tail phrases for your PPC and of course supplement that will free and low cost alternatives.

Setting up a few blogs to focus organic long tail phrase results is an obvious choice and you can then use other strategies to get them to those blogs (Articles, video etc..)

It is easy to get wrapped around the axle when you start looking at things like this though, so it may not be a wise use of your time trying to chase this traffic, so I'd use PPC first just to find out for sure what terms actually convert into buyers and then focus your efforts around those.

If you can't get enough traction from PPC it may be worth saying no, or just making an agreement that they'll pay $xx a lead and you'll send whatever leads you get to them without any promises or fixed expectations.

As long as you create a relationship that is comfortable and you haven't set expectations that you can't meet - everything will still be good and they'll appreciate your honesty and openness.

Good luck

Andy

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zoro

14 years ago

Hey Andy,

You offer some great tips. Yes, I think a combination of all or some of the things you and others have advised will be the way to go.

Thanks, Appreciated.

Thanks
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AndrewCavanagh

14 years ago

Local SEO would seem to be worth investigating.

It's strange but in many cases with keywords that cost a fortune on pay per click you can find longer tail versions of those keyword phrases where you can compete for top rankings on Google's organic search engine results.

With some keyword phrases it's not even difficult.

There are many different SEO methods you might try if the return is likely to be exceptionally high.

Many people are now using online video for SEO as an option.

You should be honest with your client and explain that the leads they want are very expensive to generate and you're not sure how well you'll do but you're willing to try a few things to see what results you can get for them.

Kindest regards,
Andrew Cavanagh

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zoro

14 years ago

Originally Posted by AndrewCavanagh

Local SEO would seem to be worth investigating.

It's strange but in many cases with keywords that cost a fortune on pay per click you can find longer tail versions of those keyword phrases where you can compete for top rankings on Google's organic search engine results.

With some keyword phrases it's not even difficult.

There are many different SEO methods you might try if the return is likely to be exceptionally high.

Many people are now using online video for SEO as an option.

You should be honest with your client and explain that the leads they want are very expensive to generate and you're not sure how well you'll do but you're willing to try a few things to see what results you can get for them.

Kindest regards,
Andrew Cavanagh

Hey Andrew,

I agree that using local geo keywords could be the way to go. I could setup a separate capture page for each different city/town etc.

I have recently received (from another warrior) a new free piece of software that will submit video's , articles, press releases all at the click of a button. So I might try that too.

Thanks for your advice, much appreciated.

Thanks

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Aaarrrggghhh

14 years ago

OUTSOURCE it. Find someone who CAN deliver what your client needs. Check out the WarriorForum JV or Classified section. Just make sure they CAN deliver too!

Best of luck...Leah

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Steve Peters Benn

14 years ago

Andy is right - don't BS them. Personally, I would be running local area adverts for the keywords on the Google Content network - and I have done this before for a local refinancing firm.

However, after finding out how their business model / sales funnel worked - I didn't want to continue to bring them in leads.

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rosetrees 14 years ago

Although I've thanked Andy's post - I don't think it's necessarily the case that the OP has promised or is bull****ing anyone.

He says they asked him to generate leads and will pay per lead. If he generates nothing, it will cost the company nothing.

Some things you could try are:

Putting entries in free local directories. Gum Tree, Craig's List or whatever applies in your local town.

Article writing is a tried and tested way of driving traffic, although I'm not sure of its effectiveness for local traffic.

Postcards in shop windows is an old fashioned way, but can work.

Maybe approach your local paper and see if you can think of a news worthy article that they might print. For example - will the company sponsor a kiddies picnic for a playgroup?
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- Andyhenry 14 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by rosetrees
  
  Although I've thanked Andy's post - I don't think it's necessarily the case that the OP has promised or is bull****ing anyone.
  
  Me neither.
  
  I'm just saying - if you don't know how to get clients for them, don't think spending their money follow random people on a forum's advice makes an adequate substitute.
  
  It's much easier to keep a relationship by delivering things you are capable of and in this case, I would suggest not promising 'increased clients' if you don't know how to deliver that.
  
  Also, theoretical knowledge is completely different to practical knowledge.
  
  This is the difference between getting sales of a clickbank product and new clients for an offline business.
  
  I get calls all the time from marketers promising to get me new clients based on looking at my websites - as soon as they say they can get new clients I know they're talkins BS because some of my sites (specifically the one they referred to in this case) are not designed to get clients - these clients are attained by physical relationships and personal meetings. Anyone who tells me getting more traffic will guarantee even a single new client just tells me they have no idea what they're talking about.
  
  It's easy to get sucked in to the IM jargon and think that if you can get traffic to a website you can promise people their phone will ring - that's a massive generalisation, in some cases just blatently wrong, and thinking that just because business owners do not necessarily understand marketing that they'll let you waste their money testing things can come back to bite you big time.
  
  Doing business is simple.....
  
  Care about what you do.
  
  Care about the relationships you build.
  
  Over-deliver on what you promise.
  
  Don't make promises you can't over-deliver on.
  
  Treat your customers like you would treat your friends. (if you don't think what you're taking their money for will actually get them business - don't do it)
  
  This way you'll make a friends out of every customer and get a lot of repeat business and referrals.
  
  The minute you start to cut corners in order to say yes to business you should say no to - you're setting yourself up for a fall.
  
  It can all be good.
  
  So in the case of someone saying they'll pay you for leads. Go ahead and try as many methods as you think will work.
  
  Just don't make any promises about what you can deliver and you won't go wrong.
  
  It's tempting for people to try and make flash promises when they start working with offline businesses so I'm going overboard here to make my point for the benefit of anyone else reading this thread.
  
  Andy
  
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sdentrepreneur

14 years ago

I run Adwords for clients in this Industry and don't pay anything near $10 a click. I have over 1,000 long tail keywords that are under $1.00 per click converting to leads.
I agree with the Blogs and Geo Keywords as well. I would also do video marketing on long tail keywords on pages where there is at least 4+ sponsored ads. Also consider Google Maps for free front page.

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Jagged

14 years ago

Are they a local offline insurance-financial client...who would target local customers? or do they target nationwide with "local" offices? It would make a difference in how to approach gaining leads...

The PPC you speak of at $30-$50 per click is for more national search terms...correct? Try using some geo-targeted search terms that narrow your results to your general area....the PPC costs should drop accordingly since your not targeting such a broad range now....

Another Idea...
Try using their website to link to....or cross promote other local "like businesses"...such as for the insurance leads....team up with various physicians, medical plaza's, pharmacys, specialty clinics, vitamin shops, medical supply, real estate, automotive parts or dealers, etc....for the finacial leads...team up with accountants, tax preparers, loan officers, real estate, investment firms, etc.....cross promote eachother. This can be done via websites (links or banners), direct mailings, cash register receipts, flyers, etc...

Sponsor local charity events....put out press releases....pushing the clients business out in front of the masses

To track your incoming leads...use a NEW phone number or a NEW email address in your promotional material...one used just for YOUR promotions...all incoming contacts via the new phone / email are leads attributed to you....& easy to prove.

~Ken

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zoro

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Jagged

Are they a local offline insurance-financial client...who would target local customers? or do they target nationwide with "local" offices? It would make a difference in how to approach gaining leads...

The PPC you speak of at $30-$50 per click is for more national search terms...correct? Try using some geo-targeted search terms that narrow your results to your general area....the PPC costs should drop accordingly since your not targeting such a broad range now....

Another Idea...
Try using their website to link to....or cross promote other local "like businesses"...such as for the insurance leads....team up with various physicians, medical plaza's, pharmacys, specialty clinics, vitamin shops, medical supply, real estate, automotive parts or dealers, etc....for the finacial leads...team up with accountants, tax preparers, loan officers, real estate, investment firms, etc.....cross promote eachother. This can be done via websites (links or banners), direct mailings, cash register receipts, flyers, etc...

Sponsor local charity events....put out press releases....pushing the clients business out in front of the masses

To track your incoming leads...use a NEW phone number or a NEW email address in your promotional material...one used just for YOUR promotions...all incoming contacts via the new phone / email are leads attributed to you....& easy to prove.

~Ken

Hi Jagged,

You have some great ideas here. Yes, the client is promoting their products on a fully national scale. But I guess I could still try Adwords using indiviual geo towns and cities in the keywords.

Much appreciated,

Thanks

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Justinfm

14 years ago

Maybe these strategies:

> Direct Mail
> Face book advertising targeted to the geographic area and other demographics of the ideal client
> Videos through youtube (with advertising of those videos) I believe YouTube PPC is still really cheap, although sometimes hard to capitalize
> Promote niche markets. You could check with the clients and find out if they can help certain people more, and create lead generation based on that segment. Example: I got an order of cigars, and their was a post card advertisement for life insurance for Cigar Smokers. When I looked closely at this, I realized it was just an individual agent who had figured out how to hit a specific niche. It's pure genius.

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zoro

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Justinfm

Maybe these strategies:

> Direct Mail
> Face book advertising targeted to the geographic area and other demographics of the ideal client
> Videos through youtube (with advertising of those videos) I believe YouTube PPC is still really cheap, although sometimes hard to capitalize
> Promote niche markets. You could check with the clients and find out if they can help certain people more, and create lead generation based on that segment. Example: I got an order of cigars, and their was a post card advertisement for life insurance for Cigar Smokers. When I looked closely at this, I realized it was just an individual agent who had figured out how to hit a specific niche. It's pure genius.

You offer some great ideas for thought.

I have tried face book for some of my other lead gen categories and had very little success. Oh Yes! I was only paying 0.80 cents per click and got tons of clicks but few conversions. I was sending them to the exact same very successful landing page I used for Adwords PPC. So for me Facebook has proven to be more expensive than adwords overall.

Thanks for your suggestions ... appreciated.

Thanks

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Fenshon

14 years ago

I believe that no matter how tough and competitive a niche is, you can still find a way to generate leads if you take some time and do proper keyword research, especially if city name is appended. Tools like semrush and keywordspy pro will help. Once you get the golden keywords, use article marketing and blog posts to rank high.

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Andyhenry 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Fenshon

I believe that no matter how tough and competitive a niche is

I believe that's what many people think - but is just not true.

There are businesses where new clients ONLY come from relationships and several months of shmoozing the right people and where a website is not going to get new clients.

I know that's hard for some people to accept because they've been told enough traffic will always mean sales - but it's NOT the case for every business.

As a general rule it's ok but it doesn't apply to ALL businesses and it always stands out to me when people make blanket statements about such things.
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zoro

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Fenshon

I believe that no matter how tough and competitive a niche is, you can still find a way to generate leads if you take some time and do proper keyword research, especially if city name is appended. Tools like semrush and keywordspy pro will help. Once you get the golden keywords, use article marketing and blog posts to rank high.

Hey Fenshon,

Yeh its only work and time isn't it. Including the local city/town in with the keyword will certainly help.

Thanks for your suggestion ... appreciated.

Thanks

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GoGetta

14 years ago

Yeh, I would just be honest with them. Explain the difference between the niches you have worked in and there niche!

Or, maybe you could look at longer tailed keyword and organic SEO?

Articles Marketing?

GoGetta

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George Chernikov 14 years ago

To add to what I just wrote - for some customers in this industry, opt-in lists aren't the way to go (depending on their age, they may be working under the assumption that giving out your e-mail means being spammed to death).

In a lot of cases, you may want to simply include an e-mail they can reach the company at with any enquiries they have and - and this is important - a phone number. Depending on the circumstances and for a variety of reasons, you will discover that some clients would rather speak to someone on the phone than put anything down in writing.
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George Chernikov

14 years ago

Zoro,

I am responsible for PPC marketing with a financial service provider, the services of which start at $60,000, and the Internet is how we generate a lot of our enquiries. To clarify, when you say lead, do they mean a converted customer (one who actually came and bought), or simply an enquiry that does or doesn't turn into a paying client?

If it's the latter, then you're in business; if it's the former, then you really need more information before you make up your mind.

Most importantly, who are they targeting? Financial service is a very broad sector. Are they going after 18-25 year old students just getting their first cars and insurance? Grandmas in their late 60s? Business people looking for a loan to start up the business? Major financial institution looking for consulting on mergers and acquisitions?

Keep in mind that, depending on who you go after, reaching your prospects online can be extraordinarily difficult. For example, if you're looking to target M&A decision-makers, you can usually forget about it - most of these guys are too busy to surf the Internet and click Google ads. On the other hand, if you're going after teenagers getting their first insurance - then sure, these guys are online more than anyone.

From experience, I end up paying up to $0.50 a click for my ads, which means I don't bid on generic keywords like "insurance", "offshore services" or "offshore banks". Instead, I go after long-tail keywords, and also make use of the content network, which can get you some exposure even if you're not bidding enough to make it to the first page (bear in mind that the content network generally converts at a lower rate than search queries).

In short, can you drive online traffic and general leads in the financial industry? In general, yes, but it depends heavily on exactly who you are going after. Depending on your budget (and whether they're paying you for leads or converted customers), you can find banner advertising a more affordable solution (for example, via Bloomberg, CNBC, etc).

Thanks
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zoro 14 years ago

(I am responsible for PPC marketing with a financial service provider, the services of which start at $60,000, and the Internet is how we generate a lot of our enquiries. To clarify, when you say lead, do they mean a converted customer (one who actually came and bought), or simply an enquiry that does or doesn't turn into a paying client? )

Hey George,

You offer some sound advise from your experince. I wish i could get Adwords at 0.50 cent a click.
The leads I would be supplying would be what I call targeted enquiries. ie, Name, Email, Phone.
Some of my other clients are very happy with these type of leads as they convert approx 30% and because the lifetime value of the customer is sufficient to allow them to pay $20 - $50 per lead.

Thanks for your imput.
- Thanks
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WarForNom

14 years ago

Rather than think in terms of insurance generically, are you thinking of particular lines of insurance?

Prospective home buyers are prospective insurance buyers, right? Same with car buyers.

Does your client sell commercial lines?

Folks who are serious about securing a business franchise seem like a good target group. In fact anyone on the cusp of starting a business is likely to have new insurance needs, both for their business and to replace the employer-supplied personal insurance they may be leaving behind as they strike out on their own.

New parents and about-to-be-parents might be ripe for both insurance and, say, financial planning attention. New empty-nesters might also be ripe to reconsider their insurance and finance situations.

Seems like Folks Who Might BUY (Car/Home/Boat/Dry Cleaning Business) Insurance this month will be easier to round up as leads than Folks Who Might Buy Some Kinda Insurance.

How about some more high-value targets? What CFO is not scrambling to limit/cut costs today? A little research should reveal where costs are rising fastest, both geographically and in terms of industries/segments, I would think.

If you brought your client just a generous handful of, say, hospital or school system decision makers who were actively seeking better quotes, and your client closed just one of them ... nice piece of business.

Can you chat with the very best of their in-house sales people about what has worked for them in terms of lead generation up till now? It could be put in terms of offering to--if possible--leverage and turbo-charge the skills and techniques they have developed locally by very efficiently (at zero cost in time to the salesman, after this one conversation) applying some version of them nationally via the net.

In fact there may be web forums where insurance types brag about this kind of stuff.

I presume you're not neglecting things like the websites (i'm not allowed to post links I guess) which are touting all sorts of ways of gathering leads. No sense reinventing the wheel.

Lots of your big competitors are offering 10 to 20 free leads as an entre to their own lead generation services. Could you scarf up some of these and bundle them for your client? A quick hundred leads right off the bat.

Maybe these thoughts are naive, self-evident or just old hat. If so please forgive an absolute newb for taking up your time.

Thanks
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BrashImpact

14 years ago

I would simply, gather up 5 to 10 good Local Keyword rich domains,
load up wordpress, Pound the content on to word press, do some
backlinking, and PFFFTTT you have a lead machine.

Go after keywords that generate target leads who are looking
for the product or service. If your wondering of how to do it
search Gene Piementel and go by his Easy Domain Cash WSO.

Generating the leads is the super easy peasy part, its converting
them through the funnel thats difficult.

Also, i would strongly consider talking to your client about running
Free Local Seminars, and generating leads that way... not the kind
of seminar where you PITCH, but the kind of seminar where you
provide tons and tons of Free Intristic Value to Potential Customers,
that you hope to then convert to Clients.

Sheeshh... At 50-80.00 a lead thats monstrous, i did one last year
for a Financial Company here in Idaho. I ran a Seminar for 3 hours,
and Dumped Big Time Usable content on the attendees. Cost about
$19 to till each seat. I took 35.00 as a lead for every person that the
company was using.

In addition, why not look at implementing a Good Referral Program for
this client, has been my notions that most companies dont even ask
for Referrals, little lown have a Perfected Funnel for Procuring referral
type customers and referrals.

Good Luck
Regards,
Robert Nelson

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zoro

14 years ago

Originally Posted by BrashImpact

I would simply, gather up 5 to 10 good Local Keyword rich domains,
load up wordpress, Pound the content on to word press, do some
backlinking, and PFFFTTT you have a lead machine.

Go after keywords that generate target leads who are looking
for the product or service. If your wondering of how to do it
search Gene Piementel and go by his Easy Domain Cash WSO.

Generating the leads is the super easy peasy part, its converting
them through the funnel thats difficult.

Also, i would strongly consider talking to your client about running
Free Local Seminars, and generating leads that way... not the kind
of seminar where you PITCH, but the kind of seminar where you
provide tons and tons of Free Intristic Value to Potential Customers,
that you hope to then convert to Clients.

Sheeshh... At 50-80.00 a lead thats monstrous, i did one last year
for a Financial Company here in Idaho. I ran a Seminar for 3 hours,
and Dumped Big Time Usable content on the attendees. Cost about
$19 to till each seat. I took 35.00 as a lead for every person that the
company was using.

In addition, why not look at implementing a Good Referral Program for
this client, has been my notions that most companies dont even ask
for Referrals, little lown have a Perfected Funnel for Procuring referral
type customers and referrals.

Good Luck
Regards,
Robert Nelson

Robert Nelson... Thanks, I appreciate your suggestions.
Three weeks ago I set up two (2) wordpress sites. One for Income Protection for Tradesman, the other for Business Public Liability and included the city/town name in the domain name. I have outsouced some SEO and article writing. Niether site is ranking yet, both are sitting on page 10 of Google Search. Needless to say so far I have generated NIL Leads.
I just don't have the time nor the finances to a lot more.

Thanks
1 reply

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paulie888

14 years ago

Originally Posted by zoro

Robert Nelson... Thanks, I appreciate your suggestions.
Three weeks ago I set up two (2) wordpress sites. One for Income Protection for Tradesman, the other for Business Public Liability and included the city/town name in the domain name. I have outsouced some SEO and article writing. Niether site is ranking yet, both are sitting on page 10 of Google Search. Needless to say so far I have generated NIL Leads.
I just don't have the time nor the finances to a lot more.

As some of the more experienced offliners have mentioned above, I think you should just come clean with your client and let them know if you can't profitably generate leads for them in an efficient and expedient fashion. There IS a reason why they're willing to pay so much per lead, and I think you've found out first hand why that is.

Alternatively, you could just tell them that you will not be able to generate any leads for them until you get some SEO done on your keyword rich blogs (of course you'd say something less technical to them, just mention that you need to do some initial work before your sites can start generating leads for them). If they're impatient and do not want to negotiate, I'd drop this deal altogether - better to let this one go, than ruin your reputation as the go-to Internet Marketing guy in your city.

Thanks

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zoro 14 years ago

Thanks WarForNom, you offer some interesting and valuable tips.
- Thanks
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Offliners I need your advice please ..

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