I can't believe this...

excoder01

14 years ago

I don't think that person is that much of a computer illiterate. After all, he/she can type and use the Internet. lol,

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rich_henderson

14 years ago

Have had some funny ones from IM beginners in my time too but have to admit Joseph, that is an absolute cracker! I guess you have to figure out whether the time spent explaining every little thing to him/her is going to be worth it in terms of your ROI, good luck, LOL

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jverley 14 years ago

LOl, funny stuff. Love that it's all in caps too.
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Terry Crim

14 years ago

That actually is the level of most people out there. You can't gadge the tech savyness of the majority of people from what you find here in the warrior forum.

Most people out there in the "real world" are not as into computers as you or I.

- T

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thebitbotdotcom

14 years ago

Wow. It sounds like he needs "PCAnywhere"...poor guy...

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Paul Myers

14 years ago

This is easily handled or people who have recent versions of Windows. Here's how I told one guy to do it:

1. Create a directory (folder) on your desktop, and name it [product name.]

2. Find the file you downloaded from me, which is called [filename]. Double-click on that. A window will open showing the files.

3. Click in that window. Then, on your keyboard, hold down the Ctrl key and tap the 'a' key. That should highlight all the files.

4. Move your mouse pointer over those highlighted files, left click and hold down the left mouse button, Drag the mouse over the new folder you created, called [product name]. Then let go of the button.

The files should be copied from the download into a format you can use. This is called "extracting."

Does the trick, for pretty much everyone.

Paul

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Midas3 Consulting 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Paul Myers

This is easily handled or people who have recent versions of Windows. Here's how I told one guy to do it:

Does the trick, for pretty much everyone.

Paul

Paul, you've got a pretty savvy bunch, many of the lot we get on
our helpdesk would fail at "create a directory/folder".

It's beyond painful.

We found the only solution was to create a video .
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HeySal

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Paul Myers

This is easily handled or people who have recent versions of Windows. Here's how I told one guy to do it:

Does the trick, for pretty much everyone.

Paul

Wow - I would have sat in a corner and drooled when I first signed on to this forum and read that.

Why is everyone so ready to see this guy ditched just for being new - it sounds like his first transaction. Maybe the seller should feel a bit good that this guy would choose his product for his first.

The advice to just send an unzipped copy is good, if the material isn't to large to go by email. Otherwise, it's not that hard to explain to someone where the folder will be or how to open it. I'm sure by this time and date it's most likely that his computer already has the capability. So spend 10 minutes on him.

I can really say I'm glad I have never bought anything from anyone who considered me too stupid to be unworthy of purchasing their products. How Godly we become after a few stupid online sales.

I guess this would be a great place and time to say THANKS to the people who helped me achieve a working knowledge of my computer and the Net. I didn't know that answering questions was such a hassle for so many people and am very grateful for the people who answered mine without thinking me too stupid to bother with because I'd never had exposure to the technology before.

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Damien Roche

14 years ago

Originally Posted by HeySal

Wow - I would have sat in a corner and drooled when I first signed on to this forum and read that.

Why is everyone so ready to see this guy ditched just for being new - it sounds like his first transaction. Maybe the seller should feel a bit good that this guy would choose his product for his first.

The advice to just send an unzipped copy is good, if the material isn't to large to go by email. Otherwise, it's not that hard to explain to someone where the folder will be or how to open it. I'm sure by this time and date it's most likely that his computer already has the capability. So spend 10 minutes on him.

I can really say I'm glad I have never bought anything from anyone who considered me too stupid to be unworthy of purchasing their products. How Godly we become after a few stupid online sales.

I guess this would be a great place and time to say THANKS to the people who helped me achieve a working knowledge of my computer and the Net. I didn't know that answering questions was such a hassle for so many people and am very grateful for the people who answered mine without thinking me too stupid to bother with because I'd never had exposure to the technology before.

I see you are/was a bit of a techno-phobe. Few of my family members are the same.

Ya know, I LOVE to hold people's hands when I'm working with/for them. That's why I'm such a damn good worker. My patience and willingness to help. BUT there is a line.

Of course, I don't know what the product is.

If, for example the product was an ebook about cooking. I would have NO problem spending a good 30 minutes instant messaging or on the phone helping this customer unzip and print out the book.

However, if this was a IM product - maybe something which contained even more technical detail than simple download instructions, I would, without a doubt, strongly advise they take a refund and forward them to some basic learning materials.

That's just my opinion. Not sure if it's the correct stance, but I would happily sleep at night knowing I'd refunded their money and forwarded them to a reliable source to learn more. (remember, that's only IF the product was technical in nature).

Helping somebody print an ebook they just bought from you is simple. I'd take that as an opportunity to provide exquisite customer care.

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Harvey Segal 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Oksa

but he has to type in ALL CAPS because he has dyslexia.

Surely you don't believe that, Micheal Oska

Harvey

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- Michael Oksa 14 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Harvey.Segal
  
  Surely you don't believe that, Micheal Oska
  
  Harvey
  
  .
  
  Fair enuogh, but as far as I know, he never lied to me befroe, Havrey.
  
  ~Micheal
  
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sbucciarel

Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by HeySal

Why is everyone so ready to see this guy ditched just for being new - it sounds like his first transaction. Maybe the seller should feel a bit good that this guy would choose his product for his first.

The advice to just send an unzipped copy is good, if the material isn't to large to go by email. Otherwise, it's not that hard to explain to someone where the folder will be or how to open it. I'm sure by this time and date it's most likely that his computer already has the capability. So spend 10 minutes on him.

I can really say I'm glad I have never bought anything from anyone who considered me too stupid to be unworthy of purchasing their products. How Godly we become after a few stupid online sales.

I guess this would be a great place and time to say THANKS to the people who helped me achieve a working knowledge of my computer and the Net. I didn't know that answering questions was such a hassle for so many people and am very grateful for the people who answered mine without thinking me too stupid to bother with because I'd never had exposure to the technology before.

Providing customer support for the product is expected. I DO have to turn off the life support after 50 emails or so, and when I do, they still have the product for free now. Mine is a lot different than just how to unzip a file. I would just throw him a link on "how to unzip a file" and be done with it.

Some of my customers buy a blog. They are newbies to the extreme. It's obvious that they'll never get it installed on their own. To avoid 50 more questions, I do it for them for no charge.

The next 50 questions involves ... how do I post to a blog? How do I get traffic .... and on and on and on.

What they are attempting to do is to make me their "mentor" or coach for no charge. While it may be a nice gesture to hold their hands and teach them the things that took me years to learn, who has the time for that? Not me.

These are rare cases for me that are this extreme, but it happens. I give them a refund, some tutorial links, refer them to Warrior Forum for marketing advice and move on.

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HeySal

14 years ago

Originally Posted by sbucciarel

Providing customer support for the product is expected. I DO have to turn off the life support after 50 emails or so, and when I do, they still have the product for free now. Mine is a lot different than just how to unzip a file. I would just throw him a link on "how to unzip a file" and be done with it.

Some of my customers buy a blog. They are newbies to the extreme. It's obvious that they'll never get it installed on their own. To avoid 50 more questions, I do it for them for no charge.

The next 50 questions involves ... how do I post to a blog? How do I get traffic .... and on and on and on.

What they are attempting to do is to make me their "mentor" or coach for no charge. While it may be a nice gesture to hold their hands and teach them the things that took me years to learn, who has the time for that? Not me.

These are rare cases for me that are this extreme, but it happens. I give them a refund, some tutorial links, refer them to Warrior Forum for marketing advice and move on.

Quite right and understandable.........but we aren't talking about life support here. We're talking about a few minutes to help a guy with his first transaction. Is it right to assume that anyone who needs 10 minutes of help is going to turn into a pain in the *ss?

It's very easy to tell people that you aren't set up to be a private mentor without alienating them when they start becoming dependent, but a few minutes to help a customer shouldn't be a problem. In fact, I prefer to have a little customer interaction - good CS can help defray the cost and time of advertising. If I had a continual string of people needing too much help, I'd be JVing with someone set up to give it to them.

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sbucciarel

Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by HeySal

Quite right and understandable.........but we aren't talking about life support here. We're talking about a few minutes to help a guy with his first transaction. Is it right to assume that anyone who needs 10 minutes of help is going to turn into a pain in the *ss?

I absolutely agree. I spend a considerable amount of time answering customer's questions and I think the OP could have probably made this guy happy in about 10-15 minutes ... and I would have.

Customer support is what makes one company successful and another a flop, IMO and I think too many people don't want to be bothered with you past the sale. They're probably missing a lot of repeat business because of that.

I only cut them off after they have indeed become a pain in the ass, not before, and even then, I try to point them in a helpful direction.

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Joseph Then

14 years ago

So, do you think I should refund this poor fella? I feel like doing so because it would take me days to make him understand how to read the ebook, right? Not a very good ROI, IMO...

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Jamian

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Joseph Then

So, do you think I should refund this poor fella? I feel like doing so because it would take me days to make him understand how to read the ebook, right? Not a very good ROI, IMO...

There's no way he can understand that in a short time, just do what is right for it. Anyway, nice share.

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crazyken

14 years ago

Hi Joseph

Hey, that email sounds like it's from my wife

only joking.
From the way the text is written and the tone of it I think that not only is his computer skills very low but maybe his intellect is too, I think you may be wasting many valuable hours of your time trying to help someone who's not really capable of understanding it.

You could always offer to print the ebook out and post it to him - for a small fee.

Good luck

Ken

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Fernando Veloso

14 years ago

Joseph,

Thats why I created this automated system: imagine Askimet BUT this one is for dumb emails.

As soon as the system detects a dumb email coming in, it sends the author ID to Paypal and automatically sends his refund with 2 nicely packaged Bonus and a link to a competitor product.

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rosetrees

14 years ago

You reply and explain:

36 hours means that he can download the file anytime within 36 hours of purchasing your product.

It sounds as if he is using Winzip - so explain that he won't have to purchase it. He can use the trial version and he will only have to unzip the product once. Once it is unzipped the product is ready to use.

After he has unzipped the product and opened it he should do a "Save As" and save it into his documents folder or to the desktop, so that he can easily find it again and open it again.

He's just confused - don't be horrible to him!

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kelsa

14 years ago

Originally Posted by rosetrees

You reply and explain:

36 hours means that he can download the file anytime within 36 hours of purchasing your product.

It sounds as if he is using Winzip - so explain that he won't have to purchase it. He can use the trial version and he will only have to unzip the product once. Once it is unzipped the product is ready to use.

After he has unzipped the product and opened it he should do a "Save As" and save it into his documents folder or to the desktop, so that he can easily find it again and open it again.

He's just confused - don't be horrible to him!

I totally agree. everyone has to start somewhere so that's not something to criticise..poor guy..he sounds like he may even have a language issue from the way he writes. At least he's trying to get somewhere!

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Ernie Lo

14 years ago

Hmm maybe refunding him is the best option. Come on this guy will never make money online at this skill level....if so it'll probably take him 50 years.

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MikeAmbrosio

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Ernie Lonardo

Hmm maybe refunding him is the best option. Come on this guy will never make money online at this skill level....if so it'll probably take him 50 years.

Not necessarily...

My brother in law works for me (almost 2 years now). When he started he knew almost nothing about computers, the internet or marketing.

In fact, just yesterday he had trouble with a zipped file

But ALSO yesterday, he brought in almost $3,000 in immediate business, a recurring order for $800 month and has more on the hook.

Never judge a book by its cover

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Ernie Lo

14 years ago

Mike I understand your point (and good on ya helping your brother in law

)but I'm sure he had a lot of help and inperson guidance from you....something the man we are talking about in this thread wouldn't have....it would too hard IMO.

However thats a decision Joseph would have to make whether he wants to invest his time helping the guy.

Originally Posted by MikeAmbrosio

Not necessarily...

My brother in law works for me (almost 2 years now). When he started he knew almost nothing about computers, the internet or marketing.

In fact, just yesterday he had trouble with a zipped file

But ALSO yesterday, he brought in almost $3,000 in immediate business, a recurring order for $800 month and has more on the hook.

Never judge a book by its cover

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sbucciarel

Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Joseph Then

So... how do I explain to him? I feel like refunding him...

There are customers that are more of a time suck than they are worth. I've had my share. I've had customers that after 50 emails asking the most basic of questions over and over, I just went into Paypal and refunded them without their request to do so and gave them the email of my installation/support guy if they wanted to pay for someone's time.

Buying a $13 or $27 product does not entitle someone to 3 months of private tutoring.

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John Atkins

14 years ago

Refund him & tell him that he should probably
attend to a basic computer & internet course before
tryin to make money online...

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entrepenerd

14 years ago

Yeah, I'd definitely refund him and explain that your product will only be useful to someone who has the basic computing skills necessary to understand how to download, save, open, and read the file.

I've had to do it in the past. It's not worth the heartache to try to drag somebody along that doesn't have the faintest idea what you're telling them to do.

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Michael Oksa

14 years ago

I don't find those e-mails funny at all.

The guy obviously is interested in getting the download, but simply doesn't know how.

Here's the thing: If it's "so easy to do", then it should be easy to explain, right? If it's NOT easy to explain, then maybe, just maybe, you should cut the guy some slack for not understanding something that is less intuitive than it should be.

I'm not suggesting you keep offering support, but a simple explanation, or even a link to a tutorial (search Google for one) may only take a few minutes, but you may have a customer for life.

Also, at least he's not screaming that you're some kind of scammer. By offering him a bit of help AND respect, you won't be giving him a reason to change his mind.

Additionally, if it's too much to handle such requests (and I understand if it is), then you may want to alter your sales copy to make it very clear it will be delivered in ZIP format.

That's my take on things, anyway.

All the best,
Michael

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kelsa

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Oksa

I don't find those e-mails funny at all.

The guy obviously is interested in getting the download, but simply doesn't know how.

Here's the thing: If it's "so easy to do", then it should be easy to explain, right? If it's NOT easy to explain, then maybe, just maybe, you should cut the guy some slack for not understanding something that is less intuitive than it should be.

I'm not suggesting you keep offering support, but a simple explanation, or even a link to a tutorial (search Google for one) may only take a few minutes, but you may have a customer for life.

Also, at least he's not screaming that you're some kind of scammer. By offering him a bit of help AND respect, you won't be giving him a reason to change his mind.

Additionally, if it's too much to handle such requests (and I understand if it is), then you may want to alter your sales copy to make it very clear it will be delivered in ZIP format.

That's my take on things, anyway.

All the best,
Michael

So you do have a normal compassionate side to your nature then! lol!

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Damien Roche

14 years ago

The ramblings of a mad man!

"I'M NOT A COMPUTER PERSON DOWN LOAD? TIME? 36 HRS?"

"THIS ZIP ? WHAT IS IT?"

LOL - it's not funny, but the way he puts it across is.

..and THIS:

"IS THERE A WAY TO GET YOUR PRODUCT FROM A DIFFERENT SOURCE THAT IS FREE? "

Oh dear, refund this jerk immediately. Good riddance.

@Oksa

You're right, you should cut him some slack and try to help. Personally, I would help by refunding him and then telling him to never buy another digital product again until he understands the basics of downloading and unzipping.

The fact that he asked where to get the product for free (and talks in all caps) says it all. I wouldn't want him as a customer.

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Michael Oksa

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Damien Roche

The ramblings of a mad man!

"I'M NOT A COMPUTER PERSON DOWN LOAD? TIME? 36 HRS?"

"THIS ZIP ? WHAT IS IT?"

LOL

..and THIS:

"IS THERE A WAY TO GET YOUR PRODUCT FROM A DIFFERENT SOURCE THAT IS FREE? "

Oh dear, refund this jerk immediately. Good riddance.

Mad man? Jerk?

I respectfully disagree.

As to the line about a free source, I took it to mean he's wondering if he can get it in a different way, but he doesn't want to pay twice.

For the record, I've seen plent of comments from mad men and jerks, and this guy isn't even close.

Another thing I forgot to mention in myprevious post...

About his use of ALL CAPS. My first guess is that he has no idea that he's shouting, but there may be another explanation. My cousin's husband KNOWS it's akin to shouting, but he has to type in ALL CAPS because he has dyslexia. For some reason, lower case letters give him trouble, but he does better in all caps. Just a thought.

All the best,
Michael

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Damien Roche

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Oksa

Mad man? Jerk?

I respectfully disagree.

As to the line about a free source, I took it to mean he's wondering if he can get it in a different way, but he doesn't want to pay twice.

For the record, I've seen plent of comments from mad men and jerks, and this guy isn't even close.

Another thing I forgot to mention in myprevious post...

About his use of ALL CAPS. My first guess is that he has no idea that he's shouting, but there may be another explanation. My cousin's husband KNOWS it's akin to shouting, but he has to type in ALL CAPS because he has dyslexia. For some reason, lower case letters give him trouble, but he does better in all caps. Just a thought.

All the best,
Michael

Oops, think I misread that part about the free source. Guess he isn't such a jerk.

dyslexia. Wow, I never thought of that! That's ignorance for ya!

I still believe the best method of dealing with this customer is to offer him a refund. If he can't download the product, I doubt he can do much else.

Like somebody mentioned above, might be good idea to forward him to that youtube vid to help him out.

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Mohammad Afaq

14 years ago

Just pick one of these tutorials and send it to him:

YouTube - how to open zip files

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wk_lee

Banned 14 years ago

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Mohammad Afaq

14 years ago

Originally Posted by wk_lee

Great but what if he tells you he can't view the video in youtube?

Did that happen???

Let's not assume here, ok

EDIT: Sorry if this post sounded kinda mean. I didn't want it to sound like I am a stupid moron who mocks people down but I guess that's how the post came out

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Jeremy Kelsall

14 years ago

When I first started Internet Marketing, not only could I not open a file, but i thought you needed to use ftp in order to put content on Squidoo...Both of those goofy threads are on the old forum somewhere.

To this day, i can't do half of the technical stuff that 99% of the other people on the forum here can do, and I think I do alright...

Just sayin...

Cut the guy a break, tell him how to open the file, pocket his cash, and move onto the next ticket

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kelsa

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Jeremy Kelsall

When I first started Internet Marketing, not only could I not open a file, but i thought you needed to use ftp in order to put content on Squidoo...Both of those goofy threads are on the old forum somewhere.

To this day, i can't do half of the technical stuff that 99% of the other people on the forum here can do, and I think I do alright...

Just sayin...

Cut the guy a break, tell him how to open the file, pocket his cash, and move onto the next ticket

Well said. I'm still very new and there are things I'm trying to do right now that are leaving me with a churn in my stomach as I try to string them together to make sense and therefore make them work...it's a very lonely feeling sat at your laptop gazing at support tickets when the responses contained in them don't even make a lot of sense because the person writing them has either a) not bothered to try to decipher the real meaning of your query and has missed the point/confused you further b) has a language incapability that impacts on their ability to make you understand or c) both...but that might just be me!! I don't know!

Worse still, is that you feel the pressure because you WANT to understand and make all the stuff gel together, to make some money. There is without doubt a level of technical ability required for this marketplace, that takes time to understand..let alone learn yourself...and that's why we have on this forum 'warriors for hire' that make a nice living from those that are less equipped to sort it all out!...

Lets take the process of purchasing domains..or purchasing domains with sites from people who have flipped them...unravelling all that needs to be done for the first time is daunting..especially when you have other domains that you have registered brand new ...and you are trying to get it to all hang together for both types of purchse (projects) between the domain registrar, hosting company and even the seller for sending you the right stuff across...talk about meltdown...but that for me is the deep end...at the moment..it won't be next time

There are those of you that could do all that in your sleep and would laugh at even the inference that I have struggled with it all...so we all have our level of comfort...and to go outside that comfort zone is scary...I have no problem doing anything difficult (if it's scary, then I just do it scared and try to both figure it out for myself and then also ask for assistance if it's available)

I am fortunate enough to have an IT/software background in my previous career, but that doesn't mean I would automatically know how to configure and install my own sites! I can probably do many things technically that a lot of you couldn't...that poor guy will have his own set of skills in life and he's just trying to expand his horizons. I do understand all of you guys that suggest to just cut and run..but who knows what opportunities could be missed when the first reaction is to do just that!

I'll shut up now

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Vogin 14 years ago

I'd devote an hour or so to help him, if unsuccessful, then a refund.
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Doolder 14 years ago

Here you're just dealing with a complete newbie who has no clue about all the internet-related stuff, but at least the guy is being polite... The fact that he writes in caps means nothing, I'd bet a lot of money that he doesn't know the meaning of it.

As stated above, this guy could easily turn into your best customer if you took the time to educate him. I'd much rather receive an email like this than an email from some lazy unmotivated fool asking why my product didn't turn him into a millionaire 5 days after the purchase...

Some people really believe in the instant multi-millionaire plug & play kit, and that's really sad in my opinion.
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Success With Dany Banned 14 years ago

That person is a perfect target for Apple computers.
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Gail Grannum 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Mohammad Afaq

Just pick one of these tutorials and send it to him:

YouTube - how to open zip files

I like the idea of sending him the link Mohammad provided to YouTube videos since it gives him another resource for his questions.

He is sounds willing to learn, just overwhelmed.

Learning to unzip a file is a skill he has to master to succeed online. You might want to say in your email if he still has problem after viewing the video, you can send in unzipped format.
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DogScout

14 years ago

If he has XP or newer, he doesn't even need Winzip to open it. XP has it's own (lousy) compression utility.

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Stuart Stirling

14 years ago

yeah, kind of feel sorry for guys like this...
he just doesn't know stuff.. we all had to learn from the start too
so we can't really pick on him.

I like the idea of sending him the products already unzipped. yes it
is time consuming.. but if you have an assistant, it shouldn't be a drama.
he'll probably be thrilled that he learned something new!

Stuart

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DogScout

14 years ago

Personally, I'd refund him AND mail him an unzipped copy. Costs you nothing and it isn't like he is likely able to use to product anyway, but on the off chance...
and you get a good nights sleep knowing you've done everything for the guy you can.

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Vijay M

14 years ago

He was obviously interested in the product enough, to fish out his cc and make an online transaction for the first time.

Could all the folks who don't want to deal with this sort of customer, please forward their contact info my way? :-)

Depending on your product, I would think he is the perfect guy to teach, nurture, suggest and upsell a few more products/services along the way.

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thatgirlJ

14 years ago

Joseph,

I'd try the video thing or an unzipped file, as others have suggested. I wouldn't just refund right away...if he doesn't get it with some basic customer service, then I would gently refund him.

It's all about the balance between what your time is worth and what the customer deserves for trying you out

Good for you to want to help this guy!

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Andyhenry

14 years ago

Hey Joseph,

I think you should take the opportunity to be a hero for this guy.

Make the product available in a format he won't have trouble with and email it to him, but also make a little camtasia video showing how to download the zip and open it.

You may get this issue again later with someone else and you'll have a video ready for them.

But more than that - this person obviously wants to learn and has chosen you as someone they trust enough to spend some money.

Do your best for them rather than dismissing them as stupid.

I know this might not be great ROI - but there's more to business than profit and there's more to making money than just taking it and having hands-off delivery.

Andy

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jacksonlin

14 years ago

LOL.

It amazes me that person knew how to purchase the ebook and then download it!

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shmeeko69 14 years ago

I suppose we all have to start from somewhere. It looks to me from the supplied text that, you could get more problems form the customer & maybe it's better to offer a refund, cut your losses & move on !

Mark :confused:
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Michael Oksa

14 years ago

Wow!

I am really, really, really happy that some of you have saved me so much time. Even though I know the basics, I don't know everything. It's easy to be high up on your mount and look down on the funny little "noobs", isn't it?

Anyway, thanks for saving me the time of purchasing anything from you. And I'm sure that's mutual. After all, you wouldn't want to waste your time either. Regardless, I certainly wouldn't want to risk becoming the subject of your ridicule for something I considered a legitimate question.

All the best,
Michael

p.s. Congratulations on your ultimate success! But I hope I continue to remember what it was like to be new and/or need a little help. How's the air up there?

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Damien Roche

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Oksa

Wow!

I am really, really, really happy that some of you have saved me so much time. Even though I know the basics, I don't know everything. It's easy to be high up on your mount and look down on the funny little "noobs", isn't it?

Anyway, thanks for saving me the time of purchasing anything from you. And I'm sure that's mutual. After all, you wouldn't want to waste your time either. Regardless, I certainly wouldn't want to risk becoming the subject of your ridicule for something I considered a legitimate question.

All the best,
Michael

p.s. Congratulations on your ultimate success! But I hope I continue to remember what it was like to be new and/or need a little help. How's the air up there?

I can understand this, but I don't think it's wise to base your purchasing decisions on assumed quality of customer care despite what has been said above. Especially since it is assumed.

For example, DLGuard is so highly spoke of because it is both a quality product and backed by some astonishing customer care. But say the customer care was non-existent, would you still purchase? Of course you would! The product speaks for itself.

Personally, I've helped newbies on this forum AS IF they were my customers and I've had absolutely NO ulterior motive - I just wanted to help. I also KNOW a few people above who expressed the same opinion as me have done the same.

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Michael Oksa

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Damien Roche

I can understand this, but I don't think it's wise to base your purchasing decisions on assumed quality of customer care despite what has been said above. Especially since it is assumed.

For example, DLGuard is so highly spoke of because it is both a quality product and backed by some astonishing customer care. But say the customer care was non-existent, would you still purchase? Of course you would! The product speaks for itself.

Personally, I've helped newbies on this forum AS IF they were my customers and I've had absolutely NO ulterior motive - I just wanted to help. I also KNOW a few people above who expressed the same opinion as me have done the same.

No, I'm basing it on how they treat other people in a public forum, that's all. The assumption is that if they are the way they present themselves to be. If they act like all noobs are losers for not knowing the basics, then that's not the type of person I feel comfortable sending my money to.

It's nothing personal, just a judgment call on my part. All any of us can do is do our best to gauge the way we may be treated by someone when it comes to customer service. There are a lot of things I don't know. And it seems to make sense to me that a lot of my purchases would be about things I don't know a lot about.

Anyway, in reality, I don't remember the last time I had to ask for support for anything. Maybe I know the basics of how to find an answer.

As a side note, the comment that I was really referring to has been removed.

All the best,
Michael

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Joseph Then

14 years ago

Hey, thanks for all the answers man. I think I'll send him a video how to use Winzip first. After that, I'll see what to do.

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Seattle Mike 14 years ago

Luckily you don't have to explain how to use micro niche finder to him yet

I like Pauls instructions and the video "how to open zips" plan.

Don't get rid of him as a customer yet. He could be a great customer for you, he needs everything.

Welcome him, thank him for trusting you enough to spend ANY money online for the first time.

Maybe a little message of encouragement followed by a list of great free links for newbies and an affiliate offer for a really good DVD course he can watch on TV. Lot easier for the non technical to watch a tv show and take notes.

This is someone who would like a step by step guide. Nothing wrong with some of the steps being products that help or make things easier.
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Black Hat Cat Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Joseph Then

Hey, thanks for all the answers man. I think I'll send him a video how to use Winzip first. After that, I'll see what to do.

Why are you making it unnecessarily difficult? Just take winzip out of the equation, and send him a link to the actual file. Since it's just a freakin' ebook, why are you zipping it up anyway?
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Dan C. Rinnert

14 years ago

There are some important lessons to be gleaned from this thread.

The first is to be able to identify the difference between a jerk and a frustrated customer. When it comes to a jerk, cut them loose. When it comes to a frustrated customer, consider that an opportunity. It's not terribly uncommon for a frustrated customer to become a loyal customer, because they'll remember the person or company that helped them out instead of tossing them aside.

Customer service matters...

The second thing is that a lack of know-how is not the same as the lack of a willingness to learn. Assuming that the OP's product was a MMO product, the buyer was clearly interested in learning about making money online. Granted, not everyone follows through, but the fact that they did make a purchase suggests a willingness to learn. And, where there's a willingness to learn, there's an opportunity.

Customer service matters...

And, even if the product was not an MMO product, the purchase still demonstrates an openness to new things. The buyer even admits never purchasing a product online before. But, by doing so, he's shown a willingness to do so. Taking the time to explain the process to him may pay off. Once he gets a handle on it, he may purchase additional products from the seller in the future.

Customer service matters...

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DogScout

14 years ago

He could turn into your best customer! As stated, he obviously need everything.

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Joseph Then

14 years ago

Update...

He sent 3 emails:

Email 1:
HI I'M NOT HAVING ANY LUCK THIS YOUTUBE.COM THAT YOU SENT HOW DO I GET THAT TO WORK? WELL SOME HOW WHAT YOU SENT WAS TALKING WITH NO PICTURE THEN I SAW IT AT THE BOTTOM OF THE SCREEN AND I DIDN'T PLAY IT BUT WHAT ONE DO YOU DO UN DO A ZIP OR? WHAT AND WHAT IF I LOSE YOUR YOUTUBE VIDEO HOW CAN I FIND IT AGAIN AS MY COMPUTER HAS BEEN LOCKING UP A LOT AND I'M AFRAID THAT I'M NOT GOING GET IT

Email 2:
I CAN FIND THE WIN ZIP AND WHEN I HIT IT THE BUY NOW WINZIP SHOWS UP IF I HIT THE DOWN LOAD ON THE BOTTOM OF YOUR EMAIL WHEN YOU PURCHATE IT IS IT DOWNLOADED SOME PLACE AND I JUST CANT FIND IT AND GET IT OUT? I FOUND YOUR VICO ONE TIME BUT THEN THAT IS NOT ANY MORE WHAT DO I NEED TO DO ?

Email 3:
HI I WATCHED YOUR VIDEO AND TRIED TO REALLY HEAR YOU . MY HEARING IS NOT GOOD SO I CAN'T HEAR YOU AND THE ILLUSTRATION IS SO BLURRED I CAN'T MAKE IT OUT AND I DON'T WANT TO LOSE IT AFTER MY TIME I HAVE A ICON WITH IT ON MY DESK TOP AND THAT IS WHERE I'M STUCK HOW DO I GET IT OR WHAT HAPPENS AFTER MY TIME

Email 4:
HI THE ZIP IN MY PROGRAM IS NOT FREE TO ACTIVATE WILL COST CAN YOU PUT IT ON SOMETHING THAT I CAN OPEN? IF NOT I'M GOING TO HAVE TO FORGET THIS

He already mentioned that he might want a refund. I thought so too, Even if I teach him how to open the file in ZIP, he will ask me about how to read the PDF!

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Michael Oksa

14 years ago

It may explain the ALL CAPS, but it may be best to issue the refund in this case, and move on.

Thank you for filling us in on more of the details, Joseph.

All the best,
Michael

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Seattle Mike 14 years ago

All I can say is It's a miracle he found your salespage and was able to figure out the order process.

Maybe it is time to refund him ;0 and tell him about a good dvd course that he should start with. Doubtful he will know what an affiliate link is.
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Aj Wilson

14 years ago

"Put Bullet In Gun..."

"Aim at head.."

" ... "

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awmi

14 years ago

Is there a small part of the population still using dial-up? The moment I saw 36 hours download I thought he or she is probably still using dial-up.

I also assume there are still parts of the country where DSL is not available.

Ps. I used NetZero for dial-up about 8 years ago and found they still exist and still offer dial-up service.

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ebony66

14 years ago

That is funny. I will give him/her their money back as I don't think it will get any better.
Good Luck!

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Jeannie Crabtree

14 years ago

When I started on the internet in 98, I was computer illiterate. I am mostly self taught, through trial and error, with some showing me how to do some things.

This is how it is in a couple niches I am in. It only happens once in a while. People, especially older ones don't know too much, except to get their email and hopefully answer it.

I have even had people call me on the phone to see if I would send something rather than them order online, download, etc. Or they have a friend or relative do the ordering.
Some are afraid they are going to be ripped off when things don't go right.

It takes patience. That is why I don't want to teach new ones. My nerves get frazzled.
But I can handle the occasional email like this and go back and forth a few times.

It also looks like this customer is frustrated and possibly English is not his first language?

Looks like Paul has a template he just copies and pastes into an email. You research once, put it on your site or in a template to use in an email and you are good to go.

As to the 36 hours, that could be set as the expiration time in DLguard or something similar.

Jeannie

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Zentech

14 years ago

Do what the others suggested, and if he still can't manage, refund him and get him out of your hair.

Customers like this can suck the life out of you.

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JayPeete

14 years ago

If you have the time, go above and beyond. Give him a call and see if you can help him. If you can help him you will be a hero and probably gain a life long customer.

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Nikhil V Nair

14 years ago

Try to make things as simple as possible.No need to zip it.Just let him download the pdf file.Give instructions how to install adobe reader and how to open that file.

It is a good idea to make the book available in another format also.Probably in a doc format.

Assuming that all our customers have same knowledge as we have is the worst mistake we can make online.There is a big difference between you and him.That is why you are selling and he is buying

Everything you think you know about your user is probably wrong.

The users aren't who you think they are.

They do things differently than you think.

They have different reasons for needing your product than you think.

Some of the excellent points from the book Landing Page Optimization by Tim Ash

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LindaC

14 years ago

Don't just dismiss this customer with a quick refund. I remember when I first started online and made my first online purchase. I had some questions and the seller took time to answer my emails. Now, when he has a new product to sell...I buy it.

My Best 2 U,

LindaC

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tehnolife

Banned 14 years ago

Funny guy...realy funny. Probably it was drunk or it was at the computer a 7 years old boy/girl!

But look at the good part of the story!

She/He knows how to use the E-mail!

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olapeju

14 years ago

he may eventually become a good list. let him attend tutorial on simple computer programming. you may as well volunteer to teach him he will forever be grateful and be ready to buy your products for this simple free training

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Joseph Then

14 years ago

OK, my take is that I'll refund him.

It's just a discussion where you land on 2 different schools of thoughts:

1) Help the noob who is your client/list and get him as a loyal customer.
The downside is that you will spend TIME.

2) Skip the noob and work on those who knows can give you money.
The downside is that you may lost a noob.

Both sides has its own merits. I choose (2).

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tehnolife

Banned 14 years ago

Is your choose, I think it's the good one, but if you have time, is good to help him!

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eaglechick

14 years ago

He might be an elderly person who is not well versed in PC's - maybe a bit of kindness up to a certain level is in order. I personally think if you're a very patient guy and have a good support team the elderly market can be profitable. Some of them have great skills and free time on their hands and have the ability once they've mastered their PC and the net to become your most loyal customers. Just think about all the cookies and knitted jerseys you'll receive in the mail (only joking) but I really feel for the elderly.

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crazyken

14 years ago

Hi Joseph

Thank you for keeping us all updated with events, I think you have made the correct decision to refund him and cut him loose - it's good to over deliver with customer service but you can only help so much, there comes a point where you have to say "hey, this is costing me more time than what it's worth".

Secondly I have to say, what a great thread, I can't remember a time when have I read comments where I agree with one post and then another opposite point of view hits me and gets me re-thinking the situation, not once but many times over - even the humourous ones

Looks like I'll be spending a lot more time on the forum, seems like the best way to get a real education.

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Danny Boy

14 years ago

If this person is a customer of yours you have an obligation to assist him if you are willing and able. The way i would approach this is to use the variety of comments here to show how much of a beginner this person really is and do a test case of how you helped him get into the internet business.

Simply teach him [it would depend on your generosity, willingness, and ability to do this] how to make his first $1,000. You will have a dynamic product to sell [obviously there are a lot of details to sort out] but there are many newbie's out there [and growing] that are looking for a single strategy that simply works backed up with real tangible proof.

Take the confusion out of it all and do yourself and him a favour and use his situation as a test case. Just another point of view Joseph.

Dan

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sbucciarel

Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Danny Boy

If this person is a customer of yours you have an obligation to assist him if you are willing and able.

Simply teach him [it would depend on your generosity, willingness, and ability to do this] how to make his first $1,000. Dan

Yeah ... absolutely. For a $27 product (or whatever it is), why not just close down your own business so that you can tutor people full time for free.

Seriously, there's a limit on how much time can be spent on one customer. A refund is the right thing to do.

Information is free. How much time would it have taken this customer to type in How to Unzip Files in Google? There are so many tutorials on just about everything and those with the curiosity and intellect to learn, can easily do so without being such a time suck on others.

I help when I can but there comes a time when a line has to be drawn, so I can get back to business.

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createyouwealth

14 years ago

I would suggest that you just simply send him the pdf file to his email address, that way it builds a relationship in the long run and he will buy from you again. And also he should be learning as he gets more familiar with the whole buying and unzipping process so when he purchases from you again it wouldn't be a problem.

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HeySal

14 years ago

Sounds to me like he doesn't have a very user friendly computer - most have the capability of extracting files right on "my documents" these days.

Just send him the PDF without the zip -- he's obviously really trying hard for this one. Encourage - he needs it and will be grateful for the help.

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ACGroup1

14 years ago

THAT'S TOO FUNNY!!! I would send the ebook to him as a PDF attachment. I mean he sent an email, hopefully receiving one isn't too complicated

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lina75

14 years ago

Well I really thought that when someone decide to sell something online, They ought to know that there will be customers like this and I think one should try their level best to help their customers unless you put a disclaimer stating that a certain level of Computer understanding are required but if your sales page says it is ok for newbies than please help the poor fellow.

If a simple request like this cannot be entertained and deep inside you felt that it is a waste of your time that I think it describe what type of a person you're inside and it is just a matter of time before ...

Furthermore some of the replies here shows the character of fellow warriors deep down...scary to say the least.

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JohnWiz 14 years ago

Hilarious!

Sounds like you almost gave the guy a heart attack...
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- Harvey Segal 14 years ago
  
  Joseph
  
  Give him a refund and if he asks when you decided on this
  say "You had me at HELLO"
  
  Harvey
  
  .
  
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Aira Bongco

14 years ago

I agree with Michael here.

While the guy may give you a headache (because he gave me one) in reading his email, it is still better to take some time and explain things to him. As Michael suggested, if you are being lazy, you can simply refer him to a tutorial if you do not want to type a long explanation.

And instead of seeing these people as a burden, why not view them as an asset? These guys know very little things online and for them you are an expert. Now imagine if you can really help them. They will refer you to their friends and get more sales in the process.

I guess this is a wake up call that not all people online are like us who lives and breathes online culture. So let's open our eyes.

EDIT: With the email updates, I guess you should refund him. This will surely take so much of your time.