Stuff Like This Makes it Harder For All Internet Marketers

14 years ago

I'm assuming that he didn't mention, in his sales copy, that there was a possibility of THIS happening? ....the disturbing thing to me, though, is the fact that you haden't used it for months....what about the people that paid $295, and used it religiously every day, only to find that they couldn't use it one day?.... (I mean, you are both paying customers...but, talk about swiping the rug out from some else's feet....not cool)

Originally Posted by mmixon

I purchased an automated article posting software from an Internet Marketer (one that some might say is a Guru), in June or July of last year. I will not mention his name because it is not my intention to discredit him on this forum, although he deserves to be discredited.

The software was $295.00 I think, and came with all the bells and whistles, and a salespage showing all the software could do and all the training videos and text training it offered. I felt it was something that could really get the job done for me. It also came with promises of more and new linked article websites coming soon plus lifetime updates.

I have not used to in several months, and decided to crank it back up to post new articles linked to my affiliate blogs. I tried to download the latest update and could not find a link, so I called the guy. He said he was no longer supporting that software, that the software was no longer available, that he had a membership website now for xxx a month that did the same thing, only better :-)

Would I have paid $300 for software that would not be updated or supported (basically obsolete) in a year? Absolutely not! Do I feel cheated? Absolutely! Would I buy anything from this guy again? Never!

My point being that stuff like this is what gives all internet marketers a bad name. Is it little doubt that we must hype the heck out of everything that is sold to overcome the sour experiences that others leave behind in their wake?

A sucky way to start off the week, but I wanted to vent, and the cat is tired of hearing my bitching.

Mickey

Thanks

Signature

"the Next Squidoo, HubPages, Suite101, and eHow"
1,001 Free eBooks You Must Read to Succeed (at Just About Anything!)
"WritingTactics: Top Best Article Writing Online"

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2420348].message }}

webwriter

14 years ago

You have every right to vent!

For the seller who cheated you: what goes around comes around.

It's a shame that the ad for that hyped-up garbage was even allowed.

You have my sympathy.

Thanks

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2420349].message }}

MeghanK

Banned 14 years ago

[DELETED]

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2420354].message }}

John Durham

14 years ago

Originally Posted by MeghanK

Selling any type of software is a dangerous game. It is sad this happened to you (he should give you a discount to his membership site).

But, unfortunately, that is the name of the game when it comes to software. It gets outdated very quickly.

I have been burned many times like that (So I try to get my money's worth right from the get-go)

Yer Back! Good for you!

Thanks

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2420357].message }}

opiniones

14 years ago

Originally Posted by mmixon

I purchased an automated article posting software from an Internet Marketer (one that some might say is a Guru), in June or July of last year. I will not mention his name because it is not my intention to discredit him on this forum, although he deserves to be discredited.

Even if it might mean saving someone $295?????? :confused:

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2420359].message }}

mmixon 14 years ago

Thanks for all the discussion Ladies and Gents. I feel better already! Something about all being in this together, I think. Opinones, it is against the tos to call out another member by name. He is not selling that software anymore anyway, but I feel sure if he did it once he will do it again. Word will get around.
- Thanks
Signature
http://popgoesthebiz.com/ Websites, Mobile Marketing and Social Media Marketing for Business and Political Candidates.
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2420382].message }}

sbucciarel

Banned 14 years ago

I've gotten burned lots of times buying expensive software only to find that the vendor disappeared and stopped supporting it and it no longer worked.

Had one group sell software that was supposed to have lifetime updates, and then take his site down and start the site under a new name so he didn't have to update for free anymore.

Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2420464].message }}

John Durham

14 years ago

Originally Posted by sbucciarel

I've gotten burned lots of times buying expensive software only to find that the vendor disappeared and stopped supporting it and it no longer worked.

Had one group sell software that was supposed to have lifetime updates, and then take his site down and start the site under a new name so he didn't have to update for free anymore.

Just goes to show that most of the sites on the internet were just somebodies scratch pad... and they dont even have anyone checking up...just floating around in cyber space because someone never bothered to take them down.

Thanks

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2420485].message }}

Steven Carl Kelly

14 years ago

Did it stop working? That wasn't clear to me in the OP.

Thanks

Signature

Read this SURPRISING REPORT Before You Buy ANY WSO! Click Here
FREE REPORT: Split Test Your Landing Pages the Easy Way

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2420475].message }}

Kael41

14 years ago

Is this software still being advertised? Ouch man, sorry to hear about it.

Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2420486].message }}

JDArchitecture 14 years ago

What happened sucks, but if you expected support and updates, I don't understand making that kind of investment without checking the publisher's history and stability.
- Thanks
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2420521].message }}

Publisher Point

14 years ago

Did the software stop working? And did he promise updates for X amount of time in the sales letter?

If either answer is yes, then yeah, he sucks. If not, then you technically didn't get ripped off....it's just bad support.

Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2420548].message }}

mmixon

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Publisher Point

Did the software stop working? And did he promise updates for X amount of time in the sales letter?

If either answer is yes, then yeah, he sucks. If not, then you technically didn't get ripped off....it's just bad support.

When someone promises Lifetime updates, I would expect the software to be updated longer than a few months; and promises new functionality to be added soon, which was not done, yes you have been ripped off! And yes, the software still works, but many of the links are dead.

Point being that he did not do what he promised. My guess is that after he released the software, it didn't work as well as he had hoped, or it didn't sell as well as he thought it would, he changed his mind or whatever, so he pulled the plug and left everyone hanging. He could have made things right by offering a discount on his membership website, offering another product off the shelf as compensation, etc., but he chose not to do so. Classic case of sell it and forget it. Not good.

Thanks

Signature

http://popgoesthebiz.com/ Websites, Mobile Marketing and Social Media Marketing for Business and Political Candidates.

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2420651].message }}

Broyde

14 years ago

I think what Mickey is trying to do is tell those of us in this business to have a heart and be considerate of other people's time and efforts that is represented by their money.

So Mickey it seems as if somehow the internet marketing world needs to get some better guarantees that exist beyond 30 or 60 days.

My experience with the internet tells me that the seasoned internet buyer will be testing just about everything before he buys. It seems like a strange thought, but can you imagine a world where a product are paid for only after it has already proved itself; and that is almost how the internet is already.

Now the internet needs some convenient ways of building a businesses loyalty to its customers. Its like how some companies keep money in reserve for different purposes. There could be a going out of business fund so that consumers can be kept safe.

Thanks

Signature

Say "Goodbye" To Writing Autoresponder Email Messages Forever!

[FREE WSO] Convert More Opt - Ins.------- Seven MUST KNOW Opt - In Practices-- --> FREE WSO <--

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2420551].message }}

Michael Oksa

14 years ago

The situation is not a good one, but he could have, at the very least, offered to give you a FREE membership. After all, that seems to be the current equivalent to "lifetime updates".

I understand that may not be the ideal solution, and clearly not what you expected, but the fact that he is asking you to PAY for the forum (read: the "lifetime updates" you already paid for) is a bunch of hooey.

On the surface, it may seem that stuff like this makes it harder on all of us, but I look at it a bit differently. It will, eventually, make it better for the honest marketers out there. I feel I'm in the minority on this, but I belive it's true. The good guys and gals will be trusted, get repeat customers and create raving fans. I can think of a few people who fit that bill, and I always purchase (and recommend) their stuff with confidence.

All the best,
Michael

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

"Ich bin en fuego!"

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2420569].message }}

mrmanpower

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Oksa

The situation is not a good one, but he could have, at the very least, offered to give you a FREE membership. After all, that seems to be the current equivalent to "lifetime updates".

I understand that may not be the ideal solution, and clearly not what you expected, but the fact that he is asking you to PAY for the forum (read: the "lifetime updates" you already paid for) is a bunch of hooey.

On the surface, it may seem that stuff like this makes it harder on all of us, but I look at it a bit differently. It will, eventually, make it better for the honest marketers out there. I feel I'm in the minority on this, but I belive it's true. The good guys and gals will be trusted, get repeat customers and create raving fans. I can think of a few people who fit that bill, and I always purchase (and recommend) their stuff with confidence.

All the best,
Michael

I agree with this one. just goes to show that in the long run. customer support and honesty will make you MORE Repeat sales. most of the guru big launches now have been (most of the time) taking care of their customers and providing crazy value.

I believe since IM is so saturated now with bad products etc that once a reliable one comes in. the price tag is never questioned.

all the best,

F

Thanks

Signature

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421617].message }}

schabotte

14 years ago

But its not just software... it is anything you buy.

How many times have you bought something with a 1 year warranty only to have it break down but not be worth the cost to mail it back to the company to replace or repair. I've lost count of the number of low cost electronics items I've bought that fell into this category.

Or here in South Florida, the number of roofing companies that were offering 5 and 10 year warranties on their roofs who went out of business right after the three hurricanes that swept through the area several years back.

But no matter what the situation, it still sucks when you expect a level of performance and don't get it.

Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2420589].message }}

Kay King

14 years ago

Had one group sell software that was supposed to have lifetime updates, and then take his site down and start the site under a new name so he didn't have to update for free anymore.

I've run into this too - makes me wonder "whose" lifetime the offer is referring to - the sellers, mine or or the flea on his dog

kay

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

Saving one dog will not change the world - but the world changes forever for that one dog

***

One secret to happiness is to let every situation be

what it is instead of what you think it should be.

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2420631].message }}

Michael Oksa 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Kay King

I've run into this too - makes me wonder "whose" lifetime the offer is referring to - the sellers, mine or or the flea on his dog

kay

Good point!

The seller may think of it as the lifetime of the product. So that means it could happen at any time. Once they are sick of promoting, updating or doing anything at all with it, it's lifetime is effectively over.

The buyer, however, assumes that lifetime means as long as they live. Or, at worst, as long as their current hard drive lasts.

It is this difference in interpretation that's the problem, and the onus is on the seller to explain what 'lifetime' means in each case.

All the best,
Michael
- Thanks
Signature

"Ich bin en fuego!"
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2420647].message }}

Rough Outline

14 years ago

You should be entitled to a refund, that's absolutely awful!

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

Get Kinetic Text / Animated Explainer Videos For Your Site Now

Click Here to See Video Samples

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421039].message }}

Mike Grant 14 years ago

Lifetime updates = the life of the software.

TBH, if he discontinued the product, I don't think he did anything wrong. It's not like you bought it last week, or even a month ago.

This is common practice.

Hell, even Microsoft does this.
- Thanks
- 2 replies
Signature
Speed Kills Manifesto - The Single Most Overlooked Tactic - Proven to Increase Conversions 100% Overnight, Traffic 240% in 3 Days
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421094].message }}
- Steven Carl Kelly 14 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by mgtarheels
  
  Lifetime updates = the life of the software.
  
  That's the way I've always considered "lifetime updates". As long as the software didn't stop functioning, then I would find it hard to consider myself ripped off -- but I don't have all the facts (I'm only hearing one side of this story) because I have no idea what the site promised.
  
  If the OP wants to PM me the URL of the website, I'll go back a year and take a look at what the site looked like back then to see what it promised.
  
  Thanks
  
  Signature
  
  Read this SURPRISING REPORT Before You Buy ANY WSO! Click Here
  FREE REPORT: Split Test Your Landing Pages the Easy Way
  
  {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421240].message }}
- awmi 14 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by mgtarheels
  
  Lifetime updates = the life of the software.
  
  I found that out the hard way after I read the fine print for a defective video card.
  
  Thanks
  
  1 reply
  
  {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421607].message }}
  
  Mike Grant 14 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by awmi
  
  I found that out the hard way after I read the fine print for a defective video card.
  
  Yeah, it's a feel-good sales tactic.
  
  Thanks
  
  Signature
  Speed Kills Manifesto - The Single Most Overlooked Tactic - Proven to Increase Conversions 100% Overnight, Traffic 240% in 3 Days
  
  {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421621].message }}

TristanPerry

14 years ago

Really sorry to hear about this, OP. It seems very unfair and it's a bad way to do business.

Unfortunately that's the problem with "lifetime updates" though - after a while there's absolutely zero incentive to the developer to upgrade the software since it's basically working for free. In my eyes "lifetime updates" is a marketing idea and unfortunately not sustainable nor practical in software development lifecycles.

Thanks

Signature

Plagiarism Guard - Protect Against Content Theft

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421312].message }}

mmixon

14 years ago

Thanks for all the suggestions. Wikipedia says A ripoff (or rip-off) is a bad financial transaction, and a scam involves wrongdoing such as fraud. Dennis Miller jokes about seeing an ad in the National Inquirer: "Learn how to avoid ripoffs - send $5 to..."

I was not scammed, but I did not get what I purchased and the seller had no problems at all under-delivering on his product. Clearly, this was a bad financial transaction that I will not repeat (along with how many others).

When we sell online, and are not able to meet our obligations, don't come back and try to justify your actions by saying well, it did not sell as i thought, or I never could get it to work so I discontinued the product, etc. That does not make things okay, it is just an excuse, and an attempt to justify bad behavior, and it hurts everyone's credibility.

Thanks
2 replies

Signature

http://popgoesthebiz.com/ Websites, Mobile Marketing and Social Media Marketing for Business and Political Candidates.

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421331].message }}

Mike Grant

14 years ago

Originally Posted by mmixon

Thanks for all the suggestions. Wikipedia says A ripoff (or rip-off) is a bad financial transaction, and a scam involves wrongdoing such as fraud. Dennis Miller jokes about seeing an ad in the National Inquirer: "Learn how to avoid ripoffs - send $5 to..."

I was not scammed, but I did not get what I purchased and the seller had no problems at all under-delivering on his product. Clearly, this was a bad financial transaction that I will not repeat (along with how many others).

When we sell online, and are not able to meet our obligations, don't come back and try to justify your actions by saying well, it did not sell as i thought, or I never could get it to work so I discontinued the product, etc. That does not make things okay, it is just an excuse, and an attempt to justify bad behavior, and it hurts everyone's credibility.

How did you not get what you purchased and how did he under deliver?

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

Speed Kills Manifesto - The Single Most Overlooked Tactic - Proven to Increase Conversions 100% Overnight, Traffic 240% in 3 Days

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421527].message }}

Michael Oksa

14 years ago

Originally Posted by mgtarheels

How did you not get what you purchased and how did he under deliver?

Read the thread.

He's not saying he didn't get the software he paid for, so he got what he purchased. BUT the underdelivery is clearly explained.

The buyer understood LIFETIME updates to mean he wouldn't have to buy a new version, that his $295 would include a lifetime of updates for the software.

Where does Microsoft ever say "lifetime updates" for any of their software?

Just curious,
Michael

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

"Ich bin en fuego!"

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421549].message }}

Mike Grant

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Oksa

Read the thread.

He's not saying he didn't get the software he paid for, so he got what he purchased. BUT the underdelivery is clearly explained.

The buyer understood LIFETIME updates to mean he wouldn't have to buy a new version, that his $295 would include a lifetime of updates for the software.

Where does Microsoft ever say "lifetime updates" for any of their software?

Just curious,
Michael

Maybe you should read the reply I quoted.

Here, I'll help you and paste what he said:
I was not scammed, but I did not get what I purchased and the seller had no problems at all under-delivering on his product. Clearly, this was a bad financial transaction that I will not repeat (along with how many others).

I cannot find Microsoft's but they used to term it Lifetime Updates, and now it's termed Lifecycle Updates.

How about Oracle? Is that good enough for you?
http://www.oracle.com/global/br/corp...chnologies.pdf

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

Speed Kills Manifesto - The Single Most Overlooked Tactic - Proven to Increase Conversions 100% Overnight, Traffic 240% in 3 Days

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421582].message }}

Michael Oksa

14 years ago

Originally Posted by mgtarheels

Maybe you should read the reply I quoted.

Here, I'll help you and paste what he said:
I was not scammed, but I did not get what I purchased and the seller had no problems at all under-delivering on his product. Clearly, this was a bad financial transaction that I will not repeat (along with how many others).

I cannot find Microsoft's but they used to term it Lifetime Updates, and now it's termed Lifecycle Updates.

How about Oracle? Is that good enough for you?
http://www.oracle.com/global/br/corp...chnologies.pdf

I see what you mean. I took it to mean something differently, but it isn't what the OP said. I used what's known as a "thought process" and was able to understand the essence of the OP's message.

He clearly got the software component of what he paid for, but he did not get the LIFETIME UPDATES which he ALSO paid for. I would be willing to bet that the idea of lifetime updates increased how much the seller charged, and also convinced a lot of people to buy. Surely you can see how some people may be upset by that.

Thank you for illustrating my point so beautifully. So, Microsoft does NOT offer lifetime updates, I appreciate the verification.

No, Oracle is NOT good enough, because that's not the example you used, nor is it the one I was referring to. Just sayin'.

All the best,
Michael

Thanks
2 replies

Signature

"Ich bin en fuego!"

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421625].message }}

TristanPerry

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Oksa

I see what you mean. I took it to mean something differently, but it isn't what the OP said. I used what's known as a "thought process" and was able to understand the essence of the OP's message.

He clearly got the software component of what he paid for, but he did not get the LIFETIME UPDATES which he ALSO paid for. I would be willing to bet that the idea of lifetime updates increased how much the seller charged, and also convinced a lot of people to buy. Surely you can see how some people may be upset by that.

Thank you for illustrating my point so beautifully. So, Microsoft does NOT offer lifetime updates, I appreciate the verification.

No, Oracle is NOT good enough, because that's not the example you used, nor is it the one I was referring to. Just sayin'.

All the best,
Michael

Indeed. I definitely feel sorry for the OP and it does sound like the software vendor acted badly here.

We can argue technicalities all day long, but the title of this thread is 100% true IMO: the way that this seller acted makes it harder for all IMers.

Thanks

Signature

Plagiarism Guard - Protect Against Content Theft

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421637].message }}

Mike Grant

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Oksa

I see what you mean. I took it to mean something differently, but it isn't what the OP said. I used what's known as a "thought process" and was able to understand the essence of the OP's message.

He clearly got the software component of what he paid for, but he did not get the LIFETIME UPDATES which he ALSO paid for. I would be willing to bet that the idea of lifetime updates increased how much the seller charged, and also convinced a lot of people to buy. Surely you can see how some people may be upset by that.

Thank you for illustrating my point so beautifully. So, Microsoft does NOT offer lifetime updates, I appreciate the verification.

No, Oracle is NOT good enough, because that's not the example you used, nor is it the one I was referring to. Just sayin'.

All the best,
Michael

Again, how'd he not get what he purchased?

The product was discontinued, thus the updates were discontinued. You didn't prove a point. What you did prove was that you made an assumption that was completely inaccurate.

Here, microsoft declares what their lifetime support is and how long it lasts:
Support Statement for Visual Basic 6.0 on Windows Vista and Windows Server 2008

Thanks

Signature

Speed Kills Manifesto - The Single Most Overlooked Tactic - Proven to Increase Conversions 100% Overnight, Traffic 240% in 3 Days

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421652].message }}

Alan Petersen 14 years ago

Happened to me as well a couple years ago. Paid $97 for a new software from a well-known marketer and his partner. They said we would get lifetime updates if we got in as "charter members".

The software was clunky but they promised we would love what was coming. Well that was a change to a subscription business model which I never got an email about.

I stopped getting emails so a few months later I went to check the site and noticed it had changed to a web-based software with a monthly subscription and I was left with the clunky PC software version. :p

My emails to the dude were ignored so I chalked it up to lesson-learned. I should have refunded when it was all clunky but thought I would wait till they made it better (I used to trust them).

I think they dumped the "charter members" email database so we would forget and not notice the changes. The lifetime of that version of the software was about 6-months. Might have been less since the emails stopped so took me a couple months to go check the website. They probably took the money they made from the charter members to get the new and improved web-based software program.

I don't see the name of the well-known guru associated with the new version just the lesser-known guru so not sure what happened there but yea I'll never do business with them again. They're not going to lose any sleep over it but makes me feel all warm and fuzzy.
- Thanks
Signature

The Asset - My CIA Thriller Fiction Book For Your Kindle
Fictive Universe - Internet Marketing for Fiction Writers
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421537].message }}

Steven Carl Kelly

14 years ago

I really can't tell for sure whether the OP got what he paid for or not. I guess he didn't get what he "expected" (which isn't the same thing at all).

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

Read this SURPRISING REPORT Before You Buy ANY WSO! Click Here
FREE REPORT: Split Test Your Landing Pages the Easy Way

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421631].message }}

Mike Grant

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Steven Carl Kelly

I really can't tell for sure whether the OP got what he paid for or not. I guess he didn't get what he "expected" (which isn't the same thing at all).

Exactly.

He got a product with lifetime updates and is upset about how the updates were discontinued after the product was discontinued.

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

Speed Kills Manifesto - The Single Most Overlooked Tactic - Proven to Increase Conversions 100% Overnight, Traffic 240% in 3 Days

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421655].message }}

Michael Oksa

14 years ago

Originally Posted by mgtarheels

Exactly.

He got a product with lifetime updates and is upset about how the updates were discontinued after the product was discontinued.

I agree that the OP didn't get what he expected. That much is clear and may be a good piece of common ground to work from. As in, who creates the expectations, and who is responsible for false ones.

However, he doesn't appear to be upset about the updates being discontinued after the product was discontinued; he appears to be upset that the product was discontinued after being led to believe he would only have to make a one-time purchase to get a lifetime of updates to that software.

Also, from what I gather, the period of any updates at all only lasted for a few months. Therefore, comparing that to Microsoft is comparing apples to oranges. If Microsoft started releasing a new OS every few moths with "lifetime updates" and stopped updating or support older versions, people would be upset, and rightfully so.

Anyway, I think the seller in this case IS taking advantage of buyers, and can now hide behind some technicality of one definition of the word 'lifetime' and how it applies to software.

Simple solution. Instead of saying "free lifetime updates", the seller says "free updates for the life of the software". That makes it more clear and avoids many unnecessary understandings.

All the best,
Michael

Thanks
4 replies

Signature

"Ich bin en fuego!"

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421697].message }}

Steven Carl Kelly

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Oksa

Anyway, I think the seller in this case IS taking advantage of buyers, and can now hide behind some technicality of one definition of the word 'lifetime' and how it applies to software.

Simple solution. Instead of saying "free lifetime updates", the seller says "free updates for the life of the software". That makes it more clear and avoids many unnecessary understandings.

Well, I'm unable to make that determination, Michael. I can't be as sure as you are that the seller in this case is taking advantage of anyone, and is hiding behind anything.

I have only the OP's description of what was on the site, so I have no idea how the seller described the updates. For all I know, the seller DID say "free updates for the life of the product" but the OP may have interpreted it incorrectly.

I can't say that the seller should re-word anything, because I have no proof whatsoever of how the seller originally worded it. I have only one side of this story. I asked for the original URL via PM so I could take a look for myself, but the OP hasn't provided it.

That's why I say it is clear the OP didn't get what he expected. Whether or not his expectation was reasonable or not is completely up in the air, because we have no idea -- not the slightest -- of what the original offer looked like.

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

Read this SURPRISING REPORT Before You Buy ANY WSO! Click Here
FREE REPORT: Split Test Your Landing Pages the Easy Way

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421716].message }}

Mike Grant

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Steven Carl Kelly

Well, I'm unable to make that determination, Michael. I can't be as sure as you are that the seller in this case is taking advantage of anyone, and is hiding behind anything.

I have only the OP's description of what was on the site, so I have no idea how the seller described the updates. For all I know, the seller DID say "free updates for the life of the product" but the OP may have interpreted it incorrectly.

I can't say that the seller should re-word anything, because I have no proof whatsoever of how the seller originally worded it. I have only one side of this story. I asked for the original URL via PM so I could take a look for myself, but the OP hasn't provided it.

That's why I say it is clear the OP didn't get what he expected. Whether or not his expectation was reasonable or not is completely up in the air, because we have no idea -- not the slightest -- of what the original offer looked like.

What part of central FL? Daytona Beach here.

Thanks

Signature

Speed Kills Manifesto - The Single Most Overlooked Tactic - Proven to Increase Conversions 100% Overnight, Traffic 240% in 3 Days

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421722].message }}

Mike Grant

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Oksa

I agree that the OP didn't get what he expected. That much is clear and may be a good piece of common ground to work from. As in, who creates the expectations, and who is responsible for false ones.

However, he doesn't appear to be upset about the updates being discontinued after the product was discontinued; he appears to be upset that the product was discontinued after being led to believe he would only have to make a one-time purchase to get a lifetime of updates to that software.

Also, from what I gather, the period of any updates at all only lasted for a few months. Therefore, comparing that to Microsoft is comparing apples to oranges. If Microsoft started releasing a new OS every few moths with "lifetime updates" and stopped updating or support older versions, people would be upset, and rightfully so.

Anyway, I think the seller in this case IS taking advantage of buyers, and can now hide behind some technicality of one definition of the word 'lifetime' and how it applies to software.

Simple solution. Instead of saying "free lifetime updates", the seller says "free updates for the life of the software". That makes it more clear and avoids many unnecessary understandings.

All the best,
Michael

However, he doesn't appear to be upset about the updates being discontinued after the product was discontinued; he appears to be upset that the product was discontinued after being led to believe he would only have to make a one-time purchase to get a lifetime of updates to that software.

What? That's exactly what he got. He paid once, and received a lifetime of updates to that software. Unfortunately for him, the lifetime of the software wasn't to his liking, but that doesn't mean the dev failed to deliver.

The comparison to Microsoft was to show that it's not just IMers, or people trying to get one over on another. It's extremely common in software dev and the biggest companies in the world employ such business tactics.

Thanks

Signature

Speed Kills Manifesto - The Single Most Overlooked Tactic - Proven to Increase Conversions 100% Overnight, Traffic 240% in 3 Days

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421717].message }}

dougp 14 years ago

Sorry to hear that op, but hope you learned one thing. Purchasing any software that automatically submits to networks is always risky business. Many networks constantly upgrade their algorithms to make automated software obsolete. What i would recommend is first mastering the marketing technique that you are trying to implement, and then scale and outsource it to manual workers on freelancer services once you get things going.

Doug
- Thanks
Signature
FREE GUIDE: 30 Day Blueprint to Massive LinkedIn Traffic
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421720].message }}

NicheMayhem

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Oksa

I agree that the OP didn't get what he expected. That much is clear and may be a good piece of common ground to work from. As in, who creates the expectations, and who is responsible for false ones.

However, he doesn't appear to be upset about the updates being discontinued after the product was discontinued; he appears to be upset that the product was discontinued after being led to believe he would only have to make a one-time purchase to get a lifetime of updates to that software.

Also, from what I gather, the period of any updates at all only lasted for a few months. Therefore, comparing that to Microsoft is comparing apples to oranges. If Microsoft started releasing a new OS every few moths with "lifetime updates" and stopped updating or support older versions, people would be upset, and rightfully so.

Anyway, I think the seller in this case IS taking advantage of buyers, and can now hide behind some technicality of one definition of the word 'lifetime' and how it applies to software.

Simple solution. Instead of saying "free lifetime updates", the seller says "free updates for the life of the software". That makes it more clear and avoids many unnecessary understandings.

All the best,
Michael

I agree with this entirely. Matter of fact, XP was released how many years ago? Still turn on my old XP computer, which I turned into essentially a media server, and have periodic updates. Sure, an OS is not quite the same as some random software but how 'bout we think about how you can buy a complete OS for a 3rd of the price the OP paid for this software he mentions.

Any software developer who simply drops support on one of their products is not only lazy but completely disregarding the acquired customer they have by doing something like this.

I totally feel the OP got burned and is rightly disgusted by this. To read through a sales copy and assume lifetime updates are meant to refer only to the developer and not the customer is ridiculous. The OP read it and thought: "I won't ever have to worry about buying another software to complete this task again, great" just like any other rational human being would and consider themselves before the friggin' developer.

I hope this guy crashes and burns because your name in the software game is incredibly important, there are 10 other names out there who develop the same thing for less and probably are much more decent and fair in their practices as well as give a darn about who buys from them.

As a business person it is your job to consider the customer before you consider yourself and your own interests. If lifetime updates only means a few moths because the developer got lazy or had a better idea, it is solely the responsibility of the developer to make good on false claims however they can and make a point of doing so. This sort of thing is straight up selfish and inconsiderate no matter how you look at it because the customer is supposed to be important and valued.

Business ethics 101 stuff and to the OP, sorry for your misfortune because you got burned by an obvious amateur.

[ 1 ] Thanks
1 reply

Signature

Whether you think you can, or think you can't, YOU'RE RIGHT!! <~~Henry Ford

Check out my video gigs on fiverr!

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2423975].message }}

Aussie_Al 14 years ago

Sorry to hear about it - but it does happen

I must have gone through 3-4 different companies selling Myspace software before I found one that actually did deliver on lifetime updates and not go out of business or not reply to emails for an update

Chalk it up to another lesson learned in the life of an IMer

That said I personally think you will be better off - creating quality articles and focus on posting them to 1-2 of the best article directories as opposed to 100's of junk article directories..just my 2 cents
- Thanks
Signature
Punk Lyrics
A-1 Survival
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2423988].message }}

Steven Carl Kelly

14 years ago

Generally speaking, Tampa.

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

Read this SURPRISING REPORT Before You Buy ANY WSO! Click Here
FREE REPORT: Split Test Your Landing Pages the Easy Way

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421724].message }}

Mike Grant 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Steven Carl Kelly

Generally speaking, Tampa.

Ah, right on. I'm in St Pete a lot. Anyway, Im out for the night. Have a good one.
- Thanks
Signature
Speed Kills Manifesto - The Single Most Overlooked Tactic - Proven to Increase Conversions 100% Overnight, Traffic 240% in 3 Days
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421748].message }}

Michael Oksa

14 years ago

While I was referring to a specific seller, my point was meant to be more general.

Setting expectations is done by the seller and the wording I suggested was just one way that a seller could make things more clear. That is a good thing right?

Now, if the seller has done what they can to be clear, and the buyer still doesn't get it, then the balance tips toward the buyer, but it's impossible to say where that point is; for both buyer and seller alike.

~Michael

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

"Ich bin en fuego!"

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421783].message }}

Steven Carl Kelly

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Oksa

Now, if the seller has done what they can to be clear, and the buyer still doesn't get it, then the balance tips toward the buyer, but it's impossible to say where that point is; for both buyer and seller alike.

Precisely.

There have been instances in my own online marketing efforts where I've done my level best to make things perfectly clear and still reasonable, intelligent people misinterpret my intent. 99 out of 100 completely understand, but the 1 out of 100 (unfortunately) misinterpret it.

Again, not saying the OP is right or wrong, just saying that I don't have enough information. I do sympathize, however, with the OP's disappointment that his expectations were not met. I just don't know if his expectations were appropriate or not.

[ 1 ] Thanks
1 reply

Signature

Read this SURPRISING REPORT Before You Buy ANY WSO! Click Here
FREE REPORT: Split Test Your Landing Pages the Easy Way

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421813].message }}

phmoisan 14 years ago

Would it be a good idea to send an email to the customers that bought the software, saying you will no longer support it, but for a little fee, they might continue using the features on the web site ? New customers would naturally pay full price.

Having worked for software development companies for 20 years, I know it it time consuming to support old software, especially with new technologies coming out faster and faster, and the people who knew your software inside and out are gone after 2, 5 or 10 years, and nobody knows that older version anymore.

And there's also the situation of OSs changing all the time.

One last point, I read recently that operating systems will soon ( a few years ? ) be a thing of the past, everything will be run from the web.
- Thanks
Signature

Philippe Moisan
my blog Video Marketing Champions

my blog Be Proactive Now
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421844].message }}

Xplasma

14 years ago

That's the problem with these kind of things, you can pay a lot, and not get much. You should ask him for free membership on this website.

Thanks

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2421848].message }}

Robert Puddy

14 years ago

Had a similar situation with LFM recently...

We rebranded the software from launch formula marketing to login frequency marketing which was more inkeeping with the strategy behind the software, we spent a whole year adding functionality to LFM

And then offerred the new version to existing owners at 10% of the retail price to move over to the new software

One owner sent me a an email saying "so much for lifetime updates"

The original sales letter said 1 year of updates, I actually delivered 4 years of free updates before we rebranded and charged them.

I over delivered on the promise and still got someone bitching about broken promises

Robert

Thanks
2 replies

Signature

Testing and tracking is a great way to give yourself a pay raise & itâ€™s easier than ever with hitsconnect

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2422942].message }}

Edk 14 years ago

I notice a lot of technicalities back and forth. Let's be done with that. When you buy you want value for your money. I've been burned no less than anybody else. But people who deliver what I consider poor value have certain clear and defined traits. I know how to avoid 80% to 90% of them. That's a good enough percentage for me.(No I can't say what the traits are. I'm not selfish but if these things are broadcast, it just makes it a little harder to sort the wheat from the chaff. Not much harder, just a little.)

To give an example from another field. I used to do housepainting. If you meet a customer in that line of work who says:"You do a good job for me here, I know several other people..." That customer will really make your life a misery. No exceptions.

There are similar patterns in IM. The message is: one should just spot the signs that give the under-deliverers away; and act on what one's observed.
- Thanks
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2423013].message }}

Steven Carl Kelly

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Robert Puddy

The original sales letter said 1 year of updates, I actually delivered 4 years of free updates before we rebranded and charged them.

I over delivered on the promise and still got someone bitching about broken promises

My point exactly. It happens... a lot.

Thanks

Signature

Read this SURPRISING REPORT Before You Buy ANY WSO! Click Here
FREE REPORT: Split Test Your Landing Pages the Easy Way

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2423720].message }}

mattlaclear

14 years ago

Guess when he said he offered lifetime support he meant the lifetime of the software and not your own. Pretty typical occurrence when you're purchasing software. The next time you purchase software and the vendor promises lifetime support understand that he or she really means about 6 weeks worth of support.

Thanks

Signature

Free Training for SEO Providers in the United States - https://happyseoclients.com/happy-seo-clients-training/

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2423735].message }}

mogulmedia

14 years ago

Mickey - Come on I think you need to name and shame this seller. It's all he/she deserves and might stop one of us from getting ripped off in the future too...

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

Converting sales copy and professional press releases -> Here <-

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2423785].message }}

Michael Oksa

14 years ago

Originally Posted by mogulmedia

Mickey - Come on I think you need to name and shame this seller. It's all he/she deserves and might stop one of us from getting ripped off in the future too...

As much as Mickey may want to do exactly that, it is against the rules of the forum. In fact, the very first rule prohibits him from doing so.

~Michael

Thanks

Signature

"Ich bin en fuego!"

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2423816].message }}

rts2271

14 years ago

Fad tech is like anything else fad, fleeting and has a higher hyped value then a real return. Buy your software from a software company, not a carny pitchman. If it's real software it will have a company, reputation and real people backing it.

Due diligence people.

Thanks

Signature

Ralph Smith
Mercenary development and deployment.

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2423788].message }}

talfighel

14 years ago

Although this is a negative thing that had just happened to you, let this be a lesson so that in the future it may not happen again.

Tal

Thanks

Signature

Home Business "TOP PICKS"!
Home Business Tools And Resources!

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2423798].message }}

Mini Michael

14 years ago

It sucks really, but perhaps there should be a forum or place were you can spill the beans discredit people giving bad content or service in the IM business. For those people who have heard of Jeremy Clarkson of Top Gear fame try telling him to be nice about a car or person that doen't live upto his, her or it's hype. Have a look at the kind of things he is prepared to say:

"Supercars are supposed to run over Arthur Scargill and then run over him again for good measure. They are designed to melt ice caps, kill the poor, poison the water table, destroy the ozone layer, decimate indigenous wildlife, recapture the Falkland Islands and turn the entire third world into a huge uninhabitable desert, all that before they nicked all the oil in the world" Jeremy Clarkson.
(sorry if the quote upsets any one)

If we started to name and shame, how long do you think people would contiue to sell bad content or software. Not long I'll bet.

Mick.

Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2423878].message }}

Michael Oksa 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Mini Michael

If we started to name and shame, how long do you think people would contiue to sell bad content or software. Not long I'll bet.

Mick.

If we started to name and shame here, how long do you think it would take before competitors would start making false accusations against one another?

~Michael
- Thanks
Signature

"Ich bin en fuego!"
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2423891].message }}

MilesT

14 years ago

Pfft. I recently bought a software product thinking it would speed up my workflow. Bought from a well-known marketer.

The product did not do what I was lead to believe it would do (not even close) so I requested a refund. No answer. Requested again 4 days later. No answer. Again about a week later. No answer.

Read the sales letter again and realized they only gave refunds if your complaint met one very specific situation. Thats it! No guarantee on the product at all.

This was clearly my fault for not reading the letter more carefully, and, being lulled into thinking that guarantees come with EVERY product produced by respectable Internet Marketers. Wrong.

It would have been nice to at least get a response telling me I didn't read the letter correctly, but I didn't even get that. Grr.

Take Away? - Read the freaking letter and know what you're getting into, fully knowing that in IM, almost anything goes at any time.

Thanks

Signature

http://www.RedHeadline.com
Internet Marketing's Top Daily News (Updated today)

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[2424448].message }}

Stuff Like This Makes it Harder For All Internet Marketers

Trending Topics

Been a while! Any of you Old Timers here?

How much does the rebranding affect CR ?

Are billboards still effective in driving customers?

Boat and Jet Ski Rentals...... Door Hangers Effective?

Clickbank low cost recurring