Article Marketing -- 900 words or not?

78 replies
Attention All

I'v just been PM'd by a 6 figure guru who's name I will not mention because I'm not here to start a war but to share & help.

However this person has been pissed off by a statement I made.

Allow me to become more clear.....

I said "Article should be no more than 400 words"

This statement was made in regards to CTR(Click through Rate)

If you want to write a 900 word article and post in on EZN articles then that's fine!

I have nothing against that

However why are you writing an article about whatever niche your in?

What is the sole purpose of writing that article in regards to CTR?

Answer: to get your link in your resource box clicked. Right?

So if your going through the trouble to create and article for this purpose why not increase the chances of getting this link clicked by keeping the number of words to a minimum but enough to convey your point across.

Guys having your article over 400 words Will reduce your CTR, period!

I can lie to you; someone else can lie to you but numbers don't lie!


Kindest


Manie
#400 #900 #article #marketing #words
  • Profile picture of the author Zeus66
    It depends a lot on HOW you write your articles. You can get a good CTR with longer articles, but you have to know how to keep the reader engaged. It takes more talent than a shorter article (not in all niches, but most) if your goal is getting traffic.

    There are good reasons to write longer articles, though. Remember - people write articles for several reasons. It isn't always just to get backlinks and click-throughs.

    John
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    • Profile picture of the author tpw
      Originally Posted by Zeus66 View Post

      It depends a lot on HOW you write your articles. You can get a good CTR with longer articles, but you have to know how to keep the reader engaged. It takes more talent than a shorter article (not in all niches, but most) if your goal is getting traffic.

      There are good reasons to write longer articles, though. Remember - people write articles for several reasons. It isn't always just to get backlinks and click-throughs.

      John
      I get great CTR on long articles... My numbers don't lie either... But the level of CTR does depend on the article itself...

      If your articles fail to tell a story that readers want to read, then you are best to aim short...

      But if your story is good, people will read it to its conclusion... If people liked the article and leave it wanting more, your CTR will be good...

      The strength of your story-telling ability will determine the word count that is right for you...

      But, if you limit yourself to 400 word articles, it will be hard to find publication in newsletters, which I consider one of my strong points... Most newsletter publishers are looking for a story that will easily fit inside of their pre-designed template... If you are seeking publication in newsletters as I am, then you should target a nice fit in a newsletter template, which will be 700-1200 words...

      I seek publication in newsletters, because that allows me to reach a larger number of readers in one shot... More exposure means more sales potential...

      If you want to stick to 400 words, that is fine for you... That is also good for me, because it means that there will be one less competitor for me to face when I am sitting on the newsletter publishers' short-list of articles to make publication...

      You should always try to write the kinds of articles that work best for you, taking into account your own strengths and weaknesses... If your weakness is telling a story people want to read, then 400 word articles will make more sense for you...

      For me, I will stick to my strengths, so that I can reach the audiences I want to reach with my articles...

      p.s. Every time you see my name grace the pages of your favorite newsletters, realize that I have accomplished a goal consistent with my own writing abilities, my strengths and my weaknesses...
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      • Profile picture of the author Coby
        Originally Posted by tpw View Post

        I get great CTR on long articles... My numbers don't lie either... But the level of CTR does depend on the article itself...

        If your articles fail to tell a story that readers want to read, then you are best to aim short...

        But if your story is good, people will read it to its conclusion... If people liked the article and leave it wanting more, your CTR will be good...

        The strength of your story-telling ability will determine the word count that is right for you...

        But, if you limit yourself to 400 word articles, it will be hard to find publication in newsletters, which I consider one of my strong points... Most newsletter publishers are looking for a story that will easily fit inside of their pre-designed template... If you are seeking publication in newsletters as I am, then you should target a nice fit in a newsletter template, which will be 700-1200 words...

        I seek publication in newsletters, because that allows me to reach a larger number of readers in one shot... More exposure means more sales potential...

        If you want to stick to 400 words, that is fine for you... That is also good for me, because it means that there will be one less competitor for me to face when I am sitting on the newsletter publishers' short-list of articles to make publication...

        You should always try to write the kinds of articles that word best for you, taking into account your own strengths and weaknesses... If your weakness is telling a story people want to read, then 400 word articles will make more sense for you...

        For me, I will stick to my strengths, so that I can reach the audiences I want to reach with my articles...

        p.s. Every time you see my name grace the pages of your favorite newsletters, realize that I have accomplished a goal consistent with my own writing abilities, my strengths and my weaknesses...
        Very well said. Thats what I was trying to say but you said it better. Stick to your strengths and the goal in mind. Those that aren't as good at engaging the reader like yourself are best to aim short (or actually hire someone like you to write it for them, lol) so that it's more of a teaser and hopefully this will make up for the lack of engagement. I think anyone can make a short article interesting enough to get a click but the real skill is keeping the reader engaged to get them 'pre-sold' and get the click and hopefully get your article spread around. Just have to find what fits and works and run with it.
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      • Quick disclaimer: I am by no means an expert (this is evident by my post count lol)

        First off I have to say that this is really a helpful thread. Whether it was manie's intention or not he started a great discussion that has helped shed some light on a variety of factors concerning "article marketing." His original post may have been a bit heavy handed by taking a factual tone but I have to admit I'm not surprised. Now I don't claim to understand the logic behind Mannie's thought processes but this is an IM forum where you PRACTICALLY HAVE TO TYPE EVERYTHING IN CAPS AND MAKE OUTRAGEOUS CLAIMS in order to get people to read your thread. Okay maybe not all the time but sometimes you do....

        In terms of article length and purpose I can't agree with mannie entirely. Keep in mind I am no where near the writer that some of you are. Article writing really is an art form when you think about it. There is more to it then just CTR (and this is where my perspective will differ from mannie's). You can use your articles to establish a "connection/relationship" with your reader, if you can do that in 400 words go for it (i know i can't). Articles that I had the most success with were longer ones (700-1000 words) where the reader signed up for my list. I try not to break down my process into subgoals. For example: post article until I can get a decent CTR, then mess around with my squeeze page until I can get the highest opt-in. CTR isn't a goal for me, sales/opt-ins is where it's at. I post my articles with the goal of making that connection and creating enough curiosity/trust (whatever the situation calls for) that the reader will continue on to my site and request more information from me which will lead to more opportunities to sell. Depending on your niche and the behavior of your market you could very well have a CTR that is through the roof but sales that are non-existent at the same time (I think this is the disclaimer that maybe mannie should have made).

        I like that someone also suggested to test, test, test, which should really be the mantra of any GOOD marketer, however.....as a mediocre marketer I would like to qualify that statement further. Testing is appropriate when you will use the information gathered to improve and refine your processes. Now you might think this is crazy but what if you test and don't use the information? How many people and new IMers do you think will buy a product/download and never use it? Or even use it correctly? It's important to realize that testing is a skill that needs to be learned just like many of the other aspects of IM, but the question really is how high on the priority list is split testing for new IMers (wish I could conduct a survey lol)? Testing also consumes time, and depending on your situation time may not be a luxury you can afford. Yes you could save yourself time in the long run by testing, but if you don't know what you are doing (and I imagine many people don't) it's possible you could end up wasting time. Testing also has limitations that aren't always apparent. Exactly how much control do you have over every single variable involved? Which variables are important enough to test? Can you even manipulate the variables of interest? Will you be able to gather sufficient data to even make a meaningful conclusion? These are just a few considerations that should be made before deciding to conduct a test. Let me reiterate the point, I do believe that you should test whenever it's appropriate. Sorry for being a little off topic with that last part.

        P.S. Seeing as how this is an article marketing thread that has some awesome writers please try not to rake me over the coals because of my poor gramar. Yes I'm aware I use "then" and "than" interchangeably; end my sentences with prepositional phrases; have a genetic disposition for comma splices and run-on sentences. But hey nobody is perfect (or is it no one lol).
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        • Profile picture of the author tpw
          Originally Posted by untouchable_newbness View Post

          P.S. Seeing as how this is an article marketing thread that has some awesome writers please try not to rake me over the coals because of my poor gramar. Yes I'm aware I use "then" and "than" interchangeably; end my sentences with prepositional phrases; have a genetic disposition for comma splices and run-on sentences. But hey nobody is perfect (or is it no one lol).
          I would never rake you over the coals for a misspelling...

          I have been writing professionally for over a decade, and I still overlook spelling mistakes in my own work sometimes...

          I blame MS Word and other spellcheckers, because although they are good at identifying misspells, they aren't worth a darn determining whether I have use the word properly or not...

          For example, I know "mother lode" is spelled that way, yet in an article I got published on a major website, I spelled it "mother load". Even the publisher's editor missed my spelling mistake, but many of the readers of that article were quick to point out my error.

          Some people indicated that would prevent them from buying from me, but those folks probably would never had bought from me anyway... LOL

          Besides that, if they are that much more perfect than I am, we probably would not get along so well anyway...
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      • Profile picture of the author Manie Amari
        Originally Posted by tpw View Post

        I get great CTR on long articles... My numbers don't lie either... But the level of CTR does depend on the article itself...

        If your articles fail to tell a story that readers want to read, then you are best to aim short...

        But if your story is good, people will read it to its conclusion... If people liked the article and leave it wanting more, your CTR will be good...

        The strength of your story-telling ability will determine the word count that is right for you...

        But, if you limit yourself to 400 word articles, it will be hard to find publication in newsletters, which I consider one of my strong points... Most newsletter publishers are looking for a story that will easily fit inside of their pre-designed template... If you are seeking publication in newsletters as I am, then you should target a nice fit in a newsletter template, which will be 700-1200 words...

        I seek publication in newsletters, because that allows me to reach a larger number of readers in one shot... More exposure means more sales potential...

        If you want to stick to 400 words, that is fine for you... That is also good for me, because it means that there will be one less competitor for me to face when I am sitting on the newsletter publishers' short-list of articles to make publication...

        You should always try to write the kinds of articles that work best for you, taking into account your own strengths and weaknesses... If your weakness is telling a story people want to read, then 400 word articles will make more sense for you...

        For me, I will stick to my strengths, so that I can reach the audiences I want to reach with my articles...

        p.s. Every time you see my name grace the pages of your favorite newsletters, realize that I have accomplished a goal consistent with my own writing abilities, my strengths and my weaknesses...
        Great Points! I love your analysis!

        @Coby thats fine post as much as you like m8t. Its taken me 12weeks to kick up a s**t storm..... but it all good; because we are all learning

        Keep it coming......

        Kindest

        Manie
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    • Profile picture of the author wilsonusman
      Originally Posted by Zeus66 View Post

      It depends a lot on HOW you write your articles. You can get a good CTR with longer articles, but you have to know how to keep the reader engaged. It takes more talent than a shorter article (not in all niches, but most) if your goal is getting traffic.

      There are good reasons to write longer articles, though. Remember - people write articles for several reasons. It isn't always just to get backlinks and click-throughs.

      John
      This is an excellent comment, this can go both ways.

      I mean some people are good at keeping the attention of people
      online, but we all know we got less than half a second to do
      that. I typically hate reading long articles online, but when I know
      the blogger/writer I will read the whole thing.
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  • Profile picture of the author ~kev~
    Originally Posted by Manie Amari View Post

    However why are you writing an article about whatever niche your in?

    What is the sole purpose of writing that article in regards to IM?
    I only post articles on my own sites. Why do I post articles? To establish my sites as authorities in their field.


    Originally Posted by Manie Amari View Post

    Answer: to get your link in your resource box clicked. Right?
    Uhhh, no. Once you have an authority site, people link back to you.
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    • Profile picture of the author Manie Amari
      Originally Posted by ~kev~ View Post

      I only post articles on my own sites. Why do I post articles? To establish my sites as authorities in their field.




      Uhhh, no. Once you have an authority site, people link back to you.
      Hi, thanks for your comments; much appreciated.

      Just to inform; I was writing this post from an affiliate marketer's prospective.

      But yes your point is valid.

      Thanks again.

      Kindest Regards


      Manie
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      • Profile picture of the author ~kev~
        Originally Posted by Manie Amari View Post

        Just to inform; I was writing this post from an affiliate marketer's prospective.
        My blog targets my Amazon Affiliate account.

        I suspect that your talking about posting articles in some kind of article directories. Which is something that I do not do.
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    • Profile picture of the author COBSolutions
      Originally Posted by ~kev~ View Post

      I only post articles on my own sites. Why do I post articles? To establish my sites as authorities in their field.




      Uhhh, no. Once you have an authority site, people link back to you.
      Sorry, will have to disagree, had it been so easy, sites with real content would have been authority sites, but you will invariably find many junk sites just with huge number of backlinks appearing in SERPs, so this theory need not be true always, one needs to promote what you are posting on your site as well.
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  • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
    Manie, maybe the only reason you write and post articles is for the resource link clicks. That's cool.

    Some of us have other motives at times, ones which longer articles facilitate. For example:

    > Longer articles of high quality have a better chance of being syndicated, especially by desirable syndicates. This leads to enhanced reputation and authority, very desirable backlinks that are hard to get any other way, and wider syndication. Eventually, this leads to more clicks, opt-ins, etc.

    > Sometimes the motive is simply to provide something useful, such as a case study or tutorial. These are impossible to do well in a 400 word filler piece. Again, they lead to enhanced reputation and eventually higher sustained profits.

    I'm not knocking well-written teasers like the 400 word articles you describe. They have their place.

    But to state that anyone going over 400 words is, as some of my military friends say, "screwing the pooch" as a blanket statement of fact is simply inaccurate. It may be true for you, in your business, so in that context it would be a fair statement.

    Numbers lie all the time if the context surrounding those numbers is inaccurate.
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  • Profile picture of the author sonyakey87
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    • Profile picture of the author Matthew Olson
      If your goal is to get the highest click through rates then yes, I agree that 400 words or less is ideal.

      This has been my experience after publishing thousands of my articles: The highest CTR has always been with articles that are 400 words or less.

      Other factors that have increased my CTR include:

      - Short paragraphs
      - Short sentences
      - Strategic use of bold and italics
      - A resource box that flows out of the last paragraph like a conclusion

      Matt
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      • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
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        • Profile picture of the author Manie Amari
          Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

          Undoubtedly. I don't think anyone could seriously, or plausibly, dispute this.

          But if you want to make a good living through article marketing, and to set up gradually increasing residual income from work already done, then aiming for the highest possible CTR is really a very short-sighted and counter-productive approach.
          Ok Alexa that is a good point and I agreed. If this is what you were divulging then I see you point.
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      • Profile picture of the author Manie Amari
        Originally Posted by Matthew Olson View Post

        If your goal is to get the highest click through rates then yes, I agree that 400 words or less is ideal.

        This has been my experience after publishing thousands of my articles: The highest CTR has always been with articles that are 400 words or less.

        Other factors that have increased my CTR include:

        - Short paragraphs
        - Short sentences
        - Strategic use of bold and italics
        - A resource box that flows out of the last paragraph like a conclusion

        Matt
        Thanks Matt for your contribution. This is all I was trying to convey.

        To the other warriors that disagreed thank you to for your contribution. I'm still learning so I'm open to and welcome all your thoughts.


        Kindest

        Manie
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      • Profile picture of the author bretski
        It's funny....folks are missing out on huge chunks of information and knowledge by following set guidelines and what they have read on forums. Those that are successful share some but not all...oftentimes it is just a matter of "pearls before swine" so what's the sense?

        There is a lot of valuable information in this thread from those far more experienced than me...people I respect and try to learn from. Those that I want to be like ('cept for the baldness...that's just a genetic defect) and someday I will.

        There is even MORE valuable information if you venture off of page 1 of this forum and use the search function.
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    • Profile picture of the author Kay King
      When you bluntly state a number as a "fact"...new marketers reading your statements may believe there is one way to write articles. It definitely isn't the only way and may not be the best way for anyone except yourself.

      How long do you measure your CTR? A few days, weeks, months?

      I have long articles published years ago that still bring traffic because they were good enough to be republished on some very good sites. They definitely aren't 400 words.

      I can write 400 words and get a high CTR if that's my goal - but can also write longer, detailed articles that get picked up by other sites and produce CTR for months or years. It's not one size fits all - it's what fits your business model.

      Instead of posting your results as limits that should apply to everyone, the better answer would be to explain how you reached your conclusions as they apply to YOUR articles.

      kay
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      • Profile picture of the author Manie Amari
        Originally Posted by Kay King View Post


        I can write 400 words and get a high CTR if that's my goal - but can also write longer, detailed articles that get picked up by other sites and produce CTR for months or years.

        kay
        Hi, Good points you made, however this thread was about CTR.

        That's is the only point of this thread.

        I originally made a reply to another persons thread, which resulted in an unfriendly PM.

        I'm still learning and I'm not an article marketing expert.

        What I do know and can attest to is that when I keep my articles around that 350-450 Mark I get a high CTR. Added that i do a couple of sneaky tricks i get a high CTR. That's it. Nothing more nothing less.
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        • Profile picture of the author marketguy
          i am an article marketer and have an opinion, but i will not give mine yet.

          instead, let me break down what you do when you post an article in reverse order:

          - you fill out your resource box (in my case to get the person to my site)
          - you post your article in the article box
          - you post a short description
          - you post a title

          see a pattern here? let me go through it in the real order

          - title (needs to be interesting enough for the customer to want to read the description)
          - description (needs to be interesting enough for the customer to want to read the article)
          - article (needs to be interesting enough for the customer to want to click through to your site)
          - resource box (provides the links for the customer to do so)

          now to my opinion. if i can get my customers apatite wet with 250 words, why would i use 1000? specially since i could break 1000 words into 4 articles and get 4 times the back-links.

          is my logic flawed?
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          • Profile picture of the author Zeus66
            Originally Posted by marketguy View Post


            now to my opinion. if i can get my customers apatite wet with 250 words, why would i use 1000? specially since i could break 1000 words into 4 articles and get 4 times the back-links.

            is my logic flawed?
            Yes. It's true some of the time, but in the long run the most successful articles I've ever written were all much longer than 250 words. It's the difference between just writing for the minimum and then having to write a lot of articles vs. writing for effect and having that one article have staying power. I'm talking about impressing readers and people in your niche who look to places like EZA for really good content for their own web pages. 250 words will never do that for you. Even 400 won't 90% of the time.

            This thread is proving the point - yet again - that article marketing is not a one-size-fits-all proposition. You can succeed in a number of ways.

            John
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            • Profile picture of the author Kay King
              this thread was about CTR.
              So was my answer. CTR isn't always about having the highest percentage when an article is published. Sometimes the goal may be long-term CTR from one article.

              CTR with very short articles may well be higher initially (if the articles are reasonably well written) but I've found the short articles peak and then decline rather quickly in CTR.

              So you make the decision of what is most important. For affiliate marketing, a fast, high CTR rate is probably what you want. For other IM methods, you may want a lower initial CTR that holds its own over a longer period of time.

              It's the difference between just writing for the minimum and then having to write a lot of articles vs. writing for effect and having that one article have staying power.
              That's it exactly....and there is no one size fits all.

              kay
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              • Profile picture of the author Manie Amari
                Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

                So was my answer. CTR isn't always about having the highest percentage when an article is published. Sometimes the goal may be long-term CTR from one article.

                CTR with very short articles may well be higher initially (if the articles are reasonably well written) but I've found the short articles peak and then decline rather quickly in CTR.

                So you make the decision of what is most important. For affiliate marketing, a fast, high CTR rate is probably what you want. For other IM methods, you may want a lower initial CTR that holds its own over a longer period of time.



                That's it exactly....and there is no one size fits all.



                kay
                Yes that's is true but like YOU said, one size does not fit all.

                But wait I don't remember saying that....

                Looking back on the thread I can clearly see that I didn't post that.

                .... Maybe my words were taking out of context.
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                • Profile picture of the author Kay King
                  "Article should be no more than 400 words"
                  Your words, not mine.

                  What you did was post an almost identical comment in another thread and then start this thread on the same topic.

                  .... Maybe my words were taking out of context.
                  No, they weren't. What others are telling you is that CTR is relative when article marketing. The highest CTR for a new article isn't always the goal of article submission. Syndication and long term results from articles can also play into length considerations.

                  Posting "this is what works for me" is great - posting "should be no more than" as solid fact will result in other experienced article marketers telling you that's just not true for everyone.

                  kay
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                  • Profile picture of the author tgro03
                    I agree that for the most part, a shorter article is probably best. Don't forget the majority of people online are only 'skimmers' they don't like to read. Keep it short, and interesting, and in most cases you should do well.
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                    • Profile picture of the author thetruth23
                      Originally Posted by tgro03 View Post

                      I agree that for the most part, a shorter article is probably best. Don't forget the majority of people online are only 'skimmers' they don't like to read. Keep it short, and interesting, and in most cases you should do well.
                      Buyers read.

                      If you're a good enough writer, your articles should be able to keep the readers attention, no matter the length!
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                  • Profile picture of the author Ray Erdmann
                    Originally Posted by Kay King View Post


                    posting "should be no more than" as solid fact will result in other experienced article marketers telling you that's just not true for everyone.

                    kay

                    Article should be no more than 400 words
                    IS NOT A FACT, but rather an unsupported OPINION based on one person's perceived perception of what works for them in their business.

                    The OP's remark is about as much a 'fact' as me sitting here and saying:

                    "All new homes built in 2010 should be no more than one single-story tall"
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                • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
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                  • Profile picture of the author ebizman87
                    Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post


                    And if you didn't want a lot of experienced, successful Warriors
                    Are you referring yourself in the "experienced, successful Warriors" list or other members?

                    Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post


                    you shouldn't have started the thread, shouldn't have made the statements you made, and shouldn't have adopted (especially in other threads) the tone of someone giving advice.
                    Who gave you this kind of authority to say such things?

                    And guess what tone that you've been adopting here, the tone of a MOD in this forum.
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                    • Profile picture of the author Alfred Shelver
                      Originally Posted by ebizman87 View Post

                      Are you referring yourself in the "experienced, successful Warriors" list or other members?

                      Who gave you this kind of authority to say such things?

                      And guess what tone that you've been adopting here, the tone of a MOD in this forum.
                      Alexa Is very much in my opinion an expert in article writing, and in that case affiliate marketing.

                      She can correct me if Iam wrong but she is 20, and makes a full time living online. She is highly university educated. In conclusion someone that I would listen to rather than Ignore as she is very helpful and gives great advice that's backed up by her own successful experience.

                      She is not being confrontational just for the heck of it and if someone is misleading in there advice she is just giving another point to think about.
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                      • Profile picture of the author DomenicoGrecojr
                        There is no set rule for writing articles. Just like a squeeze page - there are several ways you can create one - with long and short copy.

                        You can write 10 articles a day with 300 words each.
                        You can also write 1 article a day focuing on 1000 words but spend a long time on it with kick-ass information.

                        The advantage of the 1,000 word quality article is that it will do well in the search engines (provided you did good keyword research) and it has a much better chance of getting re-published. If it gets re-replublished by an authority website it will put your counter on a spin.

                        But if you write 300 articles and do 10 of them each day, you will get more visitors but not much chance of having them re-published on other websites.

                        If you want to establish yourself as an authority and want to impress, then I would go for the 1,000 word article a day. But it's tough.

                        NO ONE can disagree that you need to test and find the perfect strategy for your niche. What works for me might not work for your niche.

                        But there are some elements which are important no matter what niche you're in:

                        - Keywords inserted in the right places
                        - A very good title
                        - A good bribe in the resource box for high CTRs
                        - Short sentenced paragraphs so that it's pleasant to the eyes
                        - Submit the articles to as many places as you can
                        - Place the article on your website first
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                    • Profile picture of the author Justin Jordan
                      Originally Posted by ebizman87 View Post


                      And guess what tone that you've been adopting here, the tone of a MOD in this forum.
                      You do realize there's a thread stickied at the top of this forum that begins with "You Are A Moderator" yes?
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                      • Profile picture of the author ebizman87
                        Originally Posted by Justin Jordan View Post

                        You do realize there's a thread stickied at the top of this forum that begins with "You Are A Moderator" yes?
                        YES, I do exactly saw that sticky thing but I didn't see anything relevant being applied here based on that thread
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                        • Profile picture of the author tpw
                          Originally Posted by ebizman87 View Post

                          YES, I do exactly saw that sticky thing but I didn't see anything relevant being applied here based on that thread
                          EbizMan... I have to stand up for the other members here... the original poster suggested that his way was the only right way and all other opinions were wrong, and that is the reason he drew a lot of fire from other members...

                          The problem is that some people will read that and believe him out-of-hand, without ever understanding the big picture...

                          The original poster was chastised for making such a blanket statement, which could actually confuse and derail new people...

                          While many of the dissenting comments were correctly applied, we must remember that some of us practice being diplomatic, while others simply speak their minds immediately without concern for diplomacy...
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                          • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
                            Banned
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                            • Profile picture of the author tpw
                              Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

                              It was because of that problem (which we've seen here so often before, and is precisely how popular misapprehensions become popular misapprehensions) that I said what I said above in post #6, on the previous page, in support of other members who were demurring from the OP's "mistaken-opinion-presented-as-absolute-fact".
                              Many of the things people fear about IM are the result of

                              Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

                              OP's "mistaken-opinion-presented-as-absolute-fact"
                              that quickly become accepted as fact, when there is no evidence to support the original opinion...

                              We call them Internet Marketing Myths.

                              One such myth that is purported by many to be absolute undeniable fact is the "Duplicate Content Penalty"...

                              Another is that the syndication of content triggers the imaginary "Duplicate Content Penalty"...

                              I could literally list a dozen IM Myths here, but to do would risk turning this thread into a fire-fight about what is myth and what is real... LOL

                              But then again, I may have triggered that right now, by mentioning a couple of the article marketing myths... So shoot me if it happens in this thread...

                              p.s. If you are interested in an evidence-based analysis of the Duplicate Content Penalty, you may enjoy reading the following: http://article-blog.thephantomwriter...ntent-penalty/
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                              Publish Coloring Books for Profit (WSOTD 7-30-2015)
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                              • Profile picture of the author Kay King
                                Threads like this are always useful if only to sort out people who are self promoting and posturing rather than discussion or helping.

                                In the end - every person in this thread that makes a living through writing is saying the same thing: test it, write the length that is right for YOUR purposes. Most write long, medium and short articles - depends on the purpose of them.

                                You stated your opinion and I stated mine. Difference is I included some helpful information along with my opinion and even got a few thanks for it.
                                P.S. Next time you want to quote me, look for something that will help others or don't bother. Please and Thank you.
                                Wow - how helpful that attitude is. :rolleyes:
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                                • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
                                  Originally Posted by Manie Amari View Post

                                  Hi, Good points you made, however this thread was about CTR.

                                  That's is the only point of this thread.

                                  I originally made a reply to another persons thread, which resulted in an unfriendly PM.

                                  I'm still learning and I'm not an article marketing expert.

                                  What I do know and can attest to is that when I keep my articles around that 350-450 Mark I get a high CTR. Added that i do a couple of sneaky tricks i get a high CTR. That's it. Nothing more nothing less.
                                  Manie, had you phrased things this way in the beginning, you likely wouldn't have been called out at all. Even those of us who disagreed with the original context tend to agree that well-written, short 'teaser' articles do generate high CTR.

                                  On a side note, unfriendly Private Messages happen from time to time. Often the best bet is to simply delete them and chalk it up to someone having a bad day, poor manners, whatever. Unless there is a compelling reason, it's often better to keep Private Messages private.

                                  I do give you props for keeping your cool here, though...
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                                  • Profile picture of the author Manie Amari
                                    Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe View Post

                                    Manie, had you phrased things this way in the beginning, you likely wouldn't have been called out at all. Even those of us who disagreed with the original context tend to agree that well-written, short 'teaser' articles do generate high CTR.

                                    On a side note, unfriendly Private Messages happen from time to time. Often the best bet is to simply delete them and chalk it up to someone having a bad day, poor manners, whatever. Unless there is a compelling reason, it's often better to keep Private Messages private.

                                    I do give you props for keeping your cool here, though...
                                    Thank you so much for your comments.

                                    I try to be cool always

                                    If you would have seen the message I got then you would know how I feel. However, I turned it around by posting a thread about it.Despite the immediate reaction, some beginners or others here you don't really use article marketing will take a bit of good education pie....

                                    .....which is great! Because someone learned something


                                    Kindest


                                    Manie
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                                • Profile picture of the author Coby
                                  Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

                                  Threads like this are always useful if only to sort out people who are self promoting and posturing rather than discussion or helping.

                                  In the end - every person in this thread that makes a living through writing is saying the same thing: test it, write the length that is right for YOUR purposes. Most write long, medium and short articles - depends on the purpose of them.





                                  Wow - how helpful that attitude is. :rolleyes:

                                  This thread is getting out of hand and way off subject.

                                  I also love how I've posted the things that actually work for me and haven't sided with a long or short article yet keep getting quoted for petty things then those quoting me fail to leave some helpful advice. So that others (and myself) can learn from the criticism.

                                  I'm all for helpful criticism but If its not helpful why waste everyone's time?

                                  I don't pretend to know the answers I was just trying to help with the long vs short argument. I am majoring in Entrepreneurship and have already have a few years worth of English and writing classes. I've also had a few articles picked up by blogs/newsletters. Does this make me an expert? No! Do I claim to be an expert? No! Do my methods work for me? Yes! Could they work for you? Possibly. Do I write short articles? Yes! Long ones? Yes!

                                  Because as I keep saying I write both. I write to say what I want to say and accomplish my goal. Sometimes I do break longer articles down into two articles. Sometimes I only write articles for my personal newsletter. Others are for directories and my site. Some are ghost written for others.

                                  What I keep trying to get across is that you have to decide what your goal is beforehand. Then you have to write it according to your style and ability not based on word count (exception would be directories that have minimum or maximum word count). Then you have to test it to see what works for you.

                                  Not everybody can write a long engaging article like Alexa can. Some people have a hard time writing an email. For those people, writing a long article would probably be very detrimental to their conversion rate (assuming they even got some CTs). Also, some subjects are going to be hard to write long articles for. Also, just because an article is 'Long' doesn't mean it is good and vice versa. Anyone can take a PLR article or their own article and inflate the word count to make it longer. Would that be more effective? Doubt it. You can also do the opposite and chop a long article into a really short one. I don't think that would make it any more effective either.

                                  So with that out of the way can we please keep the pettyness to ourselves and try to help each other. I personally think Manie was very polite seeing as how he was PM'd by a "6 figure marketer" and griped at for a comment he made (personally I think that is very rude). I understand some may have read the post and took it literally (I know what he said please don't repost it). But what would you have said if you received the same PM? We have made a big fuss over TWO words "must be", if it makes you feel better just pretend he said "should be" or "could be". I know I have personally seen several others on this forum say the exact same thing but no one jumped down their throat or the throats of those who came to offer their opinions.

                                  ***This is intended for the whole forum and not necessarily aimed at one person*** Yes I quoted Kay, but not because I don't like her or disagree with her.

                                  I personally think I have a very helpful attitude I just don't like people being negative b/c it affects the whole group. I think you might find a few people on here who agree that I have helped them or provided them with helpful information (I mean the forum as a whole not necessarily this thread). I'm not here for self-promotion b/c as you can see in my sig file I'm not selling articles or article marketing courses (although I have several on my hard drive that I could sell). I guess I am giving away an article submitter so I could see how it could be misunderstood.

                                  Lets stick to the long vs short argument and stay professional so we can all learn to become better marketers. If your method works, great! Tell us what you do and how you do it! If your thinking about disagreeing with someone or saying their opinion is wrong just hit the back button a few times and move on or you could start your own thread.

                                  Thanks for reading. Hope we are still friends

                                  ***edit, just noticed that the requote of kay quoting me didn't show up. Sorry if this causes confusion*** (I still like you though, Kay :p)
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            • Profile picture of the author marketguy
              Originally Posted by Zeus66 View Post

              Yes. It's true some of the time, but in the long run the most successful articles I've ever written were all much longer than 250 words. It's the difference between just writing for the minimum and then having to write a lot of articles vs. writing for effect and having that one article have staying power. I'm talking about impressing readers and people in your niche who look to places like EZA for really good content for their own web pages. 250 words will never do that for you. Even 400 won't 90% of the time.

              This thread is proving the point - yet again - that article marketing is not a one-size-fits-all proposition. You can succeed in a number of ways.

              John
              i use 400 words usually, but have to admit, that my goal has not been to get the article syndicated onto other blogs
              my goal has been to write interesting and informative pieces, so the customer will want to go to my sites.
              maybe i should re-think my strategy.
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          • Profile picture of the author Manie Amari
            Originally Posted by marketguy View Post

            i am an article marketer and have an opinion, but i will not give mine yet.

            instead, let me break down what you do when you post an article in reverse order:

            - you fill out your resource box (in my case to get the person to my site)
            - you post your article in the article box
            - you post a short description
            - you post a title

            see a pattern here? let me go through it in the real order

            - title (needs to be interesting enough for the customer to want to read the description)
            - description (needs to be interesting enough for the customer to want to read the article)
            - article (needs to be interesting enough for the customer to want to click through to your site)
            - resource box (provides the links for the customer to do so)

            now to my opinion. if i can get my customers apatite wet with 250 words, why would i use 1000? specially since i could break 1000 words into 4 articles and get 4 times the back-links.

            is my logic flawed?
            Thank you for your input. Great point! & no I don't think it is at all.
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        • Profile picture of the author bretski
          Originally Posted by Manie Amari View Post

          Hi, Good points you made, however this thread was about CTR.

          That's is the only point of this thread.

          I originally made a reply to another persons thread, which resulted in an unfriendly PM.

          I'm still learning and I'm not an article marketing expert.

          What I do know and can attest to is that when I keep my articles around that 350-450 Mark I get a high CTR. Added that i do a couple of sneaky tricks i get a high CTR. That's it. Nothing more nothing less.
          You should have made that the title of the post about CTR and not "Article Marketing -- 900 words or not?"

          You state that you are still learning yet you come off like you're an expert stating your opinion as "fact" in this post and the other that you copied and pasted your opening post to. Do you know other people's CTR? Is CTR as important as bounce rate, conversion or even whether or not your article gets syndicated?

          I could write an article and make my anchor text "Free Beer" and I bet my CTR would be through the roof but in the end it doesn't mean a thing. This is just an example...
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          • Profile picture of the author ebizman87
            Originally Posted by bretski View Post


            You state that you are still learning yet you come off like you're an expert stating your opinion as "fact" in this post

            [/B]
            I'm not sure the OP intentionally wrote it or it was a mistake by him but...

            there're plenty of people here who like to comment on all article related posts thinking that they're experts..
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      • Profile picture of the author AnniePot
        Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

        When you bluntly state a number as a "fact"...new marketers reading your statements may believe there is one way to write articles. It definitely isn't the only way and may not be the best way for anyone except yourself.

        How long do you measure your CTR? A few days, weeks, months?

        I have long articles published years ago that still bring traffic because they were good enough to be republished on some very good sites. They definitely aren't 400 words.

        I can write 400 words and get a high CTR if that's my goal - but can also write longer, detailed articles that get picked up by other sites and produce CTR for months or years. It's not one size fits all - it's what fits your business model.

        Instead of posting your results as limits that should apply to everyone, the better answer would be to explain how you reached your conclusions as they apply to YOUR articles.

        kay
        As a point of interest, one of the very first articles I ever published on EZA on 10/27/2005 is 2,085 words long. It has been syndicated thousands of times.

        In today's report received from EZA, it continues to be one of my best read and highest syndicated articles. And it receives hundreds of click-throughs every month.

        The best of every possible worlds I should think
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  • Profile picture of the author Coby
    So much bashing in this thread! Aren't we here to help one another. You can still disagree with Manie w/o trying to make him look like an idiot.

    Obviously, if you've been article marketing you have a set routine and pattern you follow. If it works for you, GREAT! Just because someone has a different way to skin a cat doesn't make it the wrong way.

    My dad used to always tell me that if you didn't have anything nice to say don't say nothing at all. (don't get mad at me for saying that, get mad at dad, lol)

    Anyways, I think all methods here are very useful, helpful, and very likely to work exactly as everyone is saying.

    I personally have to really get engaged to read a long article and I would dare say much of the population is in the same boat. (blame tv for our lack of attention span?)

    Now, if you are a great or even expert writer like John (zeus) and Alexa you could probably write a 3000 word article and keep the reader engaged.

    However, for those of us with lesser skills or affiliate marketers (where CTR is a big part of the biz model) we can't keep the readers engaged for as long so shorter articles are needed.

    Here is my personal strategy:
    I write my article completely, not worrying about length or corrections. Just get it done. After I write it I go back and edit the punctation and grammar mistakes I missed. Then after the 'proofreading' I go back and try to eliminate extra words. Or in other words I try to make it less wordy so I can say the same thing w/o the unneeded words (blame my high school english teacher for that). This usually will get it to the 400 to 600 range. However, I've also wrote much longer articles. The reason being I write articles for my site first and for submission second. Meaning I'm writing to post on my site not to submit to directories. However I think not submitting my articles to directories and just posting them on my site wouldn't get the full effect just as doing the opposite and only writing them for directories wouldn't get the full effect. So my 2 cents is this "write the article for what you plan to do with it and how you want it to look/sound vs. following some set guideline. I think some folks in this thread are being a little rough on Mr. Manie for no reason. We are all here to grow, learn, and share.

    Can't we all just get along? lol. If your method of writing articles works for you, great! Doesn't mean that doing it a different way won't work just as well for someone else.

    Don't hate me for this . . . . plz? lol
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    • Profile picture of the author Ray Erdmann
      FFS people....do any of you ever test, Test, TEST every aspect of your business or do you just decide to chicken-peck your ass to success?

      I don't care how many articles you have syndicated, I don't care what your CTR is and I don't really care what NICHE you're in...

      Why?

      Because it all boils down to your own writing style and the point you're trying to get across to me, the reader.

      Hypothetical Example:

      Let's say Steven W. writes from a very analytical point of view. His articles are full of 'nothing but the facts' and he references reliable, trusted 3rd party authority sites to backup the point he's trying to make with whatever article he's decided to write, and REGARDLESS of how or where I myself happen to have stumbled across it.

      While I'm an analytical type of person as well, a fact-full article of any length, whether it's 200 words or 2,000 words is NOT going to wet my appetite simply because after a few paragraphs, all those facts are going to start becoming a bore and I'm going to either "x" out of the page I'm on, or instantly hit the 'back' button!

      On the other hand, let's say Zeus66 writes an article on the very same topic as Steven has and even uses the same keywords but writes in a way that is more 'conversational', which happens to include a subtle mix of facts, blunt reality and humor. Doing that, at least from my POV as the reader of said article is going to be something that 'connects' with me on a logical, human nature and because of that, I'm going to go and click-through Zeus's article WAY MORE TIMES then I would on Steven's, or anyone else's for that matter!

      THEREFORE

      Not only would you want to test the following in your articles:
      1. Keywords
      2. Title
      3. Resource Box

      But it would severely benefit you if you also focused on:
      A. Article Length
      B. Writing style

      HOWEVER...and this is just my honest opinon....

      Before attempting to test, test, and further test article length and writing style, you would be doing yourself a HUGE advantage by further analyzing your targeted customer base...more specificaly, creating a 'customer profile' of the person whose life you're trying to improve for whatever reason (acne, money, debt relief, etc., etc.,) through your article writing efforts and then, through consistent 'testing', finding the right way to sale to them!

      It's one thing to research keywords to find those that meet your specific requirements, such as monthly searches, competiting pages, exact matches, etc., etc., but when those 'specific keywords' target a 'broad customer base', you might as well go fishing for bull-frogs in the Red Sea!

      If you feel like marketing to, or even are successful at marketing to a broad customer base, then by God, I'm happy for you and I sincerely wish you continued success!

      On the other hand, if you're not making any money and have been at this now for sometime and your article marketing isn't giving you the type of positive response you were anticipating, then look CLOSER at the way you're conveying your message. Often times, it's not the topic you've written about or how long the article itself was, but rather it was HOW you relayed your message that's hurting you!
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  • Profile picture of the author Slin
    I can say, that when I am buying a product in a niche, or researching one, I hate long articles.

    They are usually long, boring, over drawn, and filled with useless information.

    Kind of like most college papers I have to write and read.

    Like one day I was researching some ideas to get past my bodybuilding problem (after gaining 20 pounds I haven't been able to gain anymore, I found the answer though)

    One article was 800 words, full of in depth research, and a long boring talk about how my muscle works, long scientific explanations (that I had no way to verify anyway) and some boring information at the end.

    The other article gave me the same method in 276 words, without the reasons why it worked, gave it straight forward, gave me some courage (hyped it up a bit) and got me on my way.

    Guess whose site I visited?

    When I write shorter articles I can achieve ctr rates up to 40% or so, the most I've had with long articles is 30%
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    • Profile picture of the author Tina Golden
      So much bashing in this thread! Aren't we here to help one another. You can still disagree with Manie w/o trying to make him look like an idiot.
      Coby, I didn't see anyone in this thread bashing Manie. They merely pointed out some flaws in his original statement and showed other ways that could be effective for article marketing.

      We're all (well, mostly) adults on this forum and we should be able to disagree without someone thinking people are getting "bashed".

      Tina
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      • Profile picture of the author Coby
        Originally Posted by TMG Enterprises View Post

        Coby, I didn't see anyone in this thread bashing Manie. They merely pointed out some flaws in his original statement and showed other ways that could be effective for article marketing.

        We're all (well, mostly) adults on this forum and we should be able to disagree without someone thinking people are getting "bashed".

        Tina
        Yes but people can disagree professionally.

        Thanks for your 2 cents Tina I'm sure lots of people found value and helpful information about article marketing in your post. Appreciate the participation We all know you would never try to make someone look dumb.

        You stated your opinion and I stated mine. Difference is I included some helpful information along with my opinion and even got a few thanks for it.
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        • Profile picture of the author Tina Golden
          You stated your opinion and I stated mine. Difference is I included some helpful information along with my opinion and even got a few thanks for it.
          Hmmm, must have missed that in the rules, Coby. Have another thanks for pointing out the error of my ways. :rolleyes:

          Tina
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          • Profile picture of the author Coby
            Originally Posted by TMG Enterprises View Post

            Hmmm, must have missed that in the rules, Coby. Have another thanks for pointing out the error of my ways. :rolleyes:

            Tina
            No problem Tina! Thanks for the Thanks. But seriously, why post if it doesn't help anyone (Like i'm doing here . . . take the thanks away i don't deserver it) Its all in fun. I just said how it looked to me, as you did.
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          • Profile picture of the author marketguy
            Originally Posted by TMG Enterprises View Post

            Hmmm, must have missed that in the rules, Coby. Have another thanks for pointing out the error of my ways. :rolleyes:

            Tina
            lol, good for you!

            coby: thanks come naturally, they are not an indication of status and if they where, please look at tina's thank count. just sayin'.
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            • Profile picture of the author Coby
              Originally Posted by marketguy View Post

              lol, good for you!

              coby: thanks come naturally, they are not an indication of status and if they where, please look at tina's thank count. just sayin'.
              Thanks but I was referring to this specific post. Your post is another helpful post about article marketing, lol.

              On another note, I was using the technique you revealed earlier market guy for searching for backlinks and I found a few blogs that had posted my articles to them.

              As I stated earlier I just write to get what I'm saying out regardless of the length. Well, I noticed the articles that were being reposted weren't the long ones or the short ones but the ones that were in between, but to be fair they are some of my more engaging work. lol.

              I wasn't advocating either method (short vs long) because I use both. I was simply trying to poing out that people should write for their audience and their intended goal and that saying one method was "wrong" was not completely fair and for saying that those who sided with either method was "wrong" is also not completely fair either. Some people have gone out of their way in this post (at least IMO) to make it appear as though one way was completely wrong and anyone who thought otherwise was "dumb".

              For example, if you are promoting an affiliate product then you are probably looking to make quick cash, thus writing a shorter article (that can literally take just a few mins) with a higher CTR would be beneficial (granted you make have to write several). However, if like Zeus, Alexa, and others have stated, they write for long term effect and although they may see a lower CTR with their "long" articles they are actually getting more traffic due to increased exposure (such as the articles of mine that I noticed were reposted to a few blogs). This is great also. There is some good info in this thread it just mixed w/a few one liners and what not that do not contribute at all in a helpful manner.

              Maybe I'm wrong? But I don't think you would want someone to come into a thread you wrote when you were looking for information and just quote another participant and leave a line or two pointing out how some one or two sentences in their post (that is a few paragraphs long) was wrong or to try to make it look like they don't know what their talking about. (which their is a good chance I don't at any time, lol. I do not claim to know much of anything really)

              Maybe I'm off base, but I don't see how that could help anyone. If you disagree with something you can simply hit the back button and the thread will probably disappear shortly (especially if it IS as bad as you think). However, adding a line or two (that really has no relevance to the post) only brings the thread back to the top of the first page. This also doesn't help to cultivate a "community" and make give the wrong impression to new people coming into this forum.

              I'm sorry if we aren't all as smart, but if your going to point that out then please contribute some info with your statement and we will all benefit and become smarter for it.

              Just something to keep in mind.

              P.S. Next time you want to quote me, look for something that will help others or don't bother. Please and Thank you.

              Everyone have a great night

              And sorry to hijack your thread Manie
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              • Profile picture of the author marketguy
                Originally Posted by Coby View Post

                On another note, I was using the technique you revealed earlier market guy for searching for backlinks and I found a few blogs that had posted my articles to them.
                And i got no thanks from you? :rolleyes:
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        • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
          Banned
          Originally Posted by Coby View Post

          Yes but people can disagree professionally.
          Naaah ... they don't call us Warriors for nothing. You'll get used to it.
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  • Profile picture of the author Alfred Shelver
    I think the main reason there is a bit of an outcry from the more senior members (look at the post counts of all the people disagreeing) Is very evident .

    It is dangerous to state specific points as fact, Because IM is such a subjective subject with limitless external factors at work.

    Eg1
    Just take this example: 400 words gives the best CTR and lets say that CTR is 30% and you have had 200 article views that would be an awesome 60 site visits.... sounds great and it is.

    Eg2
    You write a 1000 word article CTR is only 15% same 200 views so only 30 site visits, but some Authority sites and very Niche specific heavyweights site decide to take your article, and you still have only 15% CTR on those sights, but you have exponentially more views you can just Imagine how that could mean 100s more site visits but yes a lower CTR.

    I just feel that it is important to look at all possibilities and those of you writing only 400 word articles why do you not try writing to be syndicated you never know that might just be the boost you need.
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    • Profile picture of the author ebizman87
      Originally Posted by Cathy Shelver View Post


      Eg2
      You write a 1000 word article CTR is only 15% same 200 views so only 30 site visits, but some Authority sites and very Niche specific heavyweights site decide to take your article,..
      Is there a guarantee that your articles will be picked up by authority or niche specific sites?
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      • Profile picture of the author tpw
        Originally Posted by ebizman87 View Post

        Is there a guarantee that your articles will be picked up by authority or niche specific sites?
        There are no guarantees in life or online marketing...

        However, it can be reasonably guaranteed that if you do not step up to a greater potential, then you will not achieve the greater rewards... If you want your articles to be picked up by authority or niche specific sites, then you must provide them the kind of content they want to publish... And if you never do, you never will...

        The only guarantee I can actually give you is that sometime in the near future, my wife will try to convince me that I am wrong about something, while I will stand firm in my conviction that she is wrong...
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        • Profile picture of the author ebizman87
          Originally Posted by Coby View Post


          I don't write to see my name in lights... I write to generate new sales...
          Well said. What we want in the end is SALES .It doesn't matter what method that you used as long as you make money, it's enough

          However, at certain times changes or modifications are need to improve on a method that we're using to make money.

          Originally Posted by tpw View Post

          [b]
          The only guarantee I can actually give you is that sometime in the near future, my wife will try to convince me that I am wrong about something, while I will stand firm in my conviction that she is wrong...
          I guess this is what's happening in this thread just like Coby said

          Originally Posted by Coby View Post


          If your method of writing articles works for you, great! Doesn't mean that doing it a different way won't work just as well for someone else.
          This image best describes the situation..

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      • Profile picture of the author Alfred Shelver
        Originally Posted by ebizman87 View Post

        Is there a guarantee that your articles will be picked up by authority or niche specific sites?
        This is IM the only guarantees here are Clickbank money back guarantees (those are good)

        But there is from the experience of others a far better chance on a longer article thats well written than a shorter well written article.

        I will try it and let you know.
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  • Profile picture of the author Kevin_Hutto
    I have found that article quality is way more important than length... If the article really impresses the reader and or presells them, then they are much more likely to convert/opt in once they hit my site/LP...
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  • Profile picture of the author thetruth23
    Coby, I think it might have something to do with the 'matter of fact' approach from the OP as to why we're seeing such disagreement and debate.

    As Cathy mentioned a couple of posts up:

    It is dangerous to state specific points as fact, Because IM is such a subjective subject with limitless external factors at work.
    Very few things are ever set in stone, especially in IM, and I think its important for newbies to understand that, rather than having people claiming this is true or that is true which can end up misleading many.
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  • Profile picture of the author Barry Unruh
    Here is the difference in theories going on here.

    Alexa, Kay, and others who enjoy long articles are creating relationships with customers, website owners, and bloggers which will pay them for years.

    Marie and his backers are creating CTR to get an affiliate sale.

    Your choice of strategy is based upon the results you want.

    Check back in 5 years and one group is going to still be cranking articles out like there is no tomorrow, the other group is going to be serving their loyal following. Where do you want to be?
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  • Profile picture of the author thetruth23
    Guys having your article over 400 words Will reduce your CTR, period!
    What does this line suggest, Ray? Unsupported opinion or an attempt at presenting 'fact'?

    Anyway, that's my last involvement in this thread as it's just turned into people nit-picking now, and its gotten me doing the same.

    Stop trying to outsmart each other, peeps! We all know you're geniuses!
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  • Profile picture of the author TheAnnoyingOrange
    This is why testing should become second nature to EVERY SINGLE marketer out there. What works for some might not work for others. There are literally thousands of different variations that could change who, why and more importantly IF people click through to your website.

    Different niches/styles of writing/keywords/length of articles/syndication by publishers and WAY more factors influence your CTR and article overall.

    Testing is and always will be the key; find out what works for you, duplicate it and stick to it
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  • Profile picture of the author Chris Worner
    In my relatively short experience compared to the senior posters in this thread, the longer and the higher the quality of the article(assuming I hired a good ghost writer) the worse the click-through rate, however, my conversions shot through the roof.

    Go figure!

    Chris
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    • Profile picture of the author tpw
      Originally Posted by skyfox7 View Post

      In my relatively short experience compared to the senior posters in this thread, the longer and the higher the quality of the article(assuming I hired a good ghost writer) the worse the click-through rate, however, my conversions shot through the roof.

      Go figure!

      Chris
      In the end, that is what it is all about, isn't it? Sales conversions?

      I write to find an audience and to generate CTRs that lead to more sales... If we are not making money from the process, we should either fix our processes, or turn to different forms of advertising...

      I don't write to see my name in lights... I write to generate new sales...

      After more than a decade, I am still writing articles... Hopefully, that will tell you whether my writing works toward helping me to accomplish my goals...
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      Bill Platt, Oklahoma USA, PlattPublishing.com
      Publish Coloring Books for Profit (WSOTD 7-30-2015)
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  • Profile picture of the author Abhik
    IMHO, the length of article or the word count do not affect your CTR.
    Infact, you can get a pretty good CTR if your ad placement is Good.
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  • Profile picture of the author good2go4
    I have always been a chatty writer if working for myself and so the word count for me is irrelevant - I write what I have to say, that is it. But reading through all of these threads concerning CTR maybe I need to take a more business like approach to things if I want to improve sales rather than build reputation. Maybe there is a reason that my clients have strict word counts and after ten years writing I have only just worked out what that was, lol.
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  • Profile picture of the author Janice Sperry
    Here is what I have determined in my article writing for several different niches.

    * Shorter articles get a slightly better CTR.

    * Longer articles get better conversions and get syndicated more often.

    * Stinky articles are less effective than good articles for CTR and syndication regardless of the length. (I never purposely write a stinky article but it happens.)

    The above is from MY testing and may not be the experience of others.

    There are so many other things besides the length that affect stats. In no particular order:

    The topic of the article
    Current trends
    Where the article is posted
    The competition
    The audience
    Your ability to get it viewed by your target audience
    Your reputation
    The reputation of the site where it is posted
    The niche
    The language
    On and on.....

    Too be honest I just dont have the energy to pay too much attention to article length and testing anymore. I find that if I write with a natural voice and make it my goal to give value to the reader the rest takes care of itself. Could I do better by continuing to test? Probably, but that would also take time away from creative thinking, improving an article, and simply writing more.

    None of my comments should be taken as fact. Your niche, writing skills, goals, etc will be different so results can vary.
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  • Profile picture of the author magnd
    make your articles straight to the point.

    integrate your key terms well
    and

    make it solve a problem
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  • Profile picture of the author pista05
    Article should be no more than 400 words

    Dam right it is the only person who wants articles over 400 words is the article directory owner who will gain more clicks to his adsense.

    Keep it short and simple and get that link to your site
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    • Profile picture of the author Tina Golden
      Originally Posted by pista05 View Post

      Article should be no more than 400 words

      Dam right it is the only person who wants articles over 400 words is the article directory owner who will gain more clicks to his adsense.

      Keep it short and simple and get that link to your site
      Only had time to read the OP, right? LOL.

      Long, short - it doesn't matter if it achieves what you want from it. Some people only want some quick backlinks so it would make absolutely no sense put too much effort into it. Longer, well written articles may get more backlinks in the long run but they are not the quick way of doing it.

      The only reason that anyone said anything is that it was phrased as a "this is the only way to do it right" statement. Neither short nor long is the only way to do it.

      If you can't write well and engage the reader, writing a longer piece certainly won't achieve anything. Longer articles work very well for those who can keep the reader's attention but not everyone can do that. If it's going to be dull and dry, then for god's sake, please keep it short...lol.

      Tina
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  • Profile picture of the author madz280
    Banned
    [DELETED]
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    • Profile picture of the author Kay King
      Come on people; let us respect each others opnions.
      How about using good forum protocol yourself and stop bumping year old threads? Not a good practice.
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