ClickBank - I Smell Something Fishy...

150 replies
And I don't live near a Seafood Market!

So, several months ago, I started promoting a couple new clickbank products and was getting decent traffic and conversions. To this day, I am still getting the same traffic, but the conversions suck!

When I started my conversions were like this:

PRODUCT 1 - 1:62
PRODUCT 2 - 1:49
PRODUCT 3 - 1:72

As of last week, conversions for the past 90 days were as follows

PRODUCT 1 - 1:114
PRODUCT 2 - 1:127
PRODUCT 3 - Not even worth mentioning

These are not seasonal products, the traffic is the same as when I started, and it comes from the same places.

So, I set up a new Clickbank account and changed a couple of my links around to go to the new account and guess what? Yup, my conversions are right back in line with when I first started.

Anyone else ever experience anything like this? Seems weird that the conversion rate magically changes with a new hoplink, but maybe I just read too much into things.

Jeremy
#clickbank #fishy #haddock #smell
  • Profile picture of the author John Piteo
    That's really strange. It's not the Internet marketing niche by any chance is it?

    John
    Signature
    Want to Create a Profitable Online Course?

    CrashCourseTraining.com

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[240201].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author SusanUSA
    This is so strange, Jeremy! I have noticed the same kind of swings with my own eBooks! I can't account for it . . . please keep us posted with anything you find out about this!

    Stay well!
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[240213].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Hamida Harland
      I know of a guy on another forum who has experienced the same thing - every time his conversions drop he switches all his hoplinks to another account and then conversions go back to normal. Different accounts seem to be affected at different times. But still people deny there's anything strange going on :confused:
      Signature
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[240225].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Seattle Mike
        I did a test earlier this year...

        Run through your affiliate link a few times on each product and see how often your id doesn't show on the order page. Tested 8 different products about 5 times each and found 1/3 of the time my CB id wasn't making it all the way to the order page.

        CB tracking isn't perfect. One of the gurus had an ebook that talked about this. CB merchants get a few sales without an affiliate showing up in the stats every month even if they aren't promoting it themselves.

        Don't know why a new hoplink account has better results. Need to test that.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[240252].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author warriorjohn1444
        Banned
        This have been happening to me for some time too until i eventually began to switching my hoplinks to another account, and things improved again. Its saddening.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[570422].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author KevL
    Very strange - you contacted clickbank to ask their take on it?
    Signature
    SEO Kev
    Small business SEO / Web Marketing Tips.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[240245].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author affiliateppc
    Signature

    Do You Want a FREE Copy Of My Latest eBook Where I Show You Step By Step How I Average $500 Per Day Promoting Earth4Energy? It's Easy, All You Have To Do Is Follow Me On Twitter http://twitter.com/freddieonline

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[240258].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author athena08
    This is really scary stuff...so easy for this to be going on without your knowledge. You would think Clickbank with all its affiliates would try to do a better job.

    Perhaps Clickbank should be notified by those of you who have noticed this funny business going on. Then maybe they will work on correcting it for the benefit of all.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[240264].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Jeremy Kelsall
      Contacting them won't do much good, I'd imagine.

      They would never admit to anything being "wrong" lol

      I know I'll be switching my affiliate links up every now and again...Looks like I'll just be getting more checks from clickbank lol

      Originally Posted by athena08 View Post

      This is really scary stuff...so easy for this to be going on without your knowledge. You would think Clickbank with all its affiliates would try to do a better job.

      Perhaps Clickbank should be notified by those of you who have noticed this funny business going on. Then maybe they will work on correcting it for the benefit of all.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[240280].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author matthewd
        Originally Posted by Jeremy Kelsall View Post

        Contacting them won't do much good, I'd imagine.

        They would never admit to anything being "wrong" lol

        I know I'll be switching my affiliate links up every now and again...Looks like I'll just be getting more checks from clickbank lol
        That's exactly right... back when this first happened to me I contacted them to see what the deal was and they claimed it was not on their end. It HAD to be something on my end even thought I sent them links to a ton of thread on a bunch of different forums discussing it. Then they blamed the economy AND me... *******s.

        Every once in a while there is another day that looks fishy to me... for example, take a look at this screenshot of one of my affiliate accounts:

        I understand a normal fluctuation going down to $150 or so and up to $350 or so... but those occasional $35-$50 days are abnormal.

        I haven't tried switching links though... maybe I should give that a go.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[241117].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author Louis Raven
          Originally Posted by matthewd View Post

          That's exactly right... back when this first happened to me I contacted them to see what the deal was and they claimed it was not on their end. It HAD to be something on my end even thought I sent them links to a ton of thread on a bunch of different forums discussing it. Then they blamed the economy AND me... *******s.

          Every once in a while there is another day that looks fishy to me... for example, take a look at this screenshot of one of my affiliate accounts:

          I understand a normal fluctuation going down to $150 or so and up to $350 or so... but those occasional $35-$50 days are abnormal.

          I haven't tried switching links though... maybe I should give that a go.
          WOW Matthew I'd keep an eye on that. Do you always get such irregularities or was that a one off?

          Louis
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[241276].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author matthewd
            Originally Posted by Louis Raven View Post

            WOW Matthew I'd keep an eye on that. Do you always get such irregularities or was that a one off?

            Louis
            Lately that seems to be about a once a week thing... back before they start changing thing that NEVER happened. All of that crap started happening to me as soon as they started changing their stuff around.

            Any suggestions on checking for/preventing hackers since you have the first hand experience?
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[241337].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author Jeremy Kelsall
              Started happening to me about the same time.

              I don't think it has anything to do with hackers or cookie stuffing though. I just don't think that ClickBank is crediting all of our sales correctly. Hopefully, they will get it sorted out soon.

              Originally Posted by matthewd View Post

              Lately that seems to be about a once a week thing... back before they start changing thing that NEVER happened. All of that crap started happening to me as soon as they started changing their stuff around.

              Any suggestions on checking for/preventing hackers since you have the first hand experience?
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[241350].message }}
              • Profile picture of the author matthewd
                Originally Posted by Jeremy Kelsall View Post

                Started happening to me about the same time.

                I don't think it has anything to do with hackers or cookie stuffing though. I just don't think that ClickBank is crediting all of our sales correctly. Hopefully, they will get it sorted out soon.
                Yeah, since it is happening all over the place I think it is just Clickbank.

                I don't think it's the economy either b/c my sales in networks outside of Clickbank have been going up.
                {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[241354].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author sladezer0
        Originally Posted by Jeremy Kelsall View Post

        Contacting them won't do much good, I'd imagine.

        They would never admit to anything being "wrong" lol

        I know I'll be switching my affiliate links up every now and again...Looks like I'll just be getting more checks from clickbank lol
        When it comes to understanding your online profits better - don't throw out at least contacting them!
        Signature
        Download the Hottest Ebooks & Software on the Net! | www.ebookfreek.com

        ~ The only regrets in life arise from the risks you never took ... Jason Aurelius Sawicki
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[570678].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author visit_faraz
    I was wondering how to protect ourselves from this cookie stuffing thing.

    Is it even possible?

    bye,
    faraz
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[240284].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Jeremy Kelsall
    I never even thought about cookie stuffing, but I don't think that's it...

    I think someone is shaving some of the sales off lol

    Seriously, I can't think of any other explanation.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[240348].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author aikay77
    Banned
    Guys,

    Why not just switch over and promote products from paydotcom.com instead?
    The carry the same products and you get paid instantly!

    My two cents.

    Ronald
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[240377].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Hamida Harland
      Originally Posted by aikay77 View Post

      Guys,

      Why not just switch over and promote products from paydotcom.com instead?
      The carry the same products and you get paid instantly!

      My two cents.

      Ronald
      There's NO comparison between Clickbank and Paydotcom - I couldn't even find similar products to those I promote at Clickbank. They definitely don't have the same products and you don't get paid instantly.
      Signature
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[240455].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Chris Lockwood
        Originally Posted by Hamida Pall View Post

        There's NO comparison between Clickbank and Paydotcom - I couldn't even find similar products to those I promote at Clickbank. They definitely don't have the same products and you don't get paid instantly.
        You certainly don't get paid instantly with Clickbank, either, even if your sales are properly credited.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[241066].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Chris Lockwood
        Originally Posted by Hamida Harland View Post

        There's NO comparison between Clickbank and Paydotcom - I couldn't even find similar products to those I promote at Clickbank. They definitely don't have the same products and you don't get paid instantly.
        You don't get paid instantly with either one.

        Some products are at both places, like some of mine, but since they are different companies, I'm not sure why you would expect all the same products to be at both places.


        As for the original post, that is weird. If Clickbank was intentionally doing something fishy (which I highly doubt), why wouldn't they do it across the board? Why would they make it so you could use a different account and get different conversion rates?
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[570659].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author Harvey Segal
          Originally Posted by Rebtl View Post

          No sooner had you said that than he PM'd me with a suggestion for my problem.

          I'll let him discuss it with you all if he sees fit
          Just to clarify I was responding to this problem

          Originally Posted by Rebtl View Post

          I have 278 dollars sitting in my clickbank account, and since I never did enough sales to get my 5 credit cards to overcome their "security system" (most of those were paypal sales, I think I have 3 real credit cards) They will not give me my money.

          Does anybody know of a way I could get them to pay me that money?
          If you have a similar problem please PM me.


          Harvey
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[570668].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Bishop81
    what about just putting a link rotator in your pages. Have it switch to a different id every X clicks or something.
    Signature

    I'm tired of my signature... Deleted.

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[240405].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Chris Lockwood
    Somewhat different issue: my account is registering sales of my products, but for the past several days, I've gotten few or no of the emails I usually get when a sale is made.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[240436].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Louis Raven
    Exact same thing happened to me (not CB though).

    know what it was? Hackers!

    You see they are smart enough to know if you think something is wrong, you'll spot them and end their cash-flow.

    When I was hacked they'd change the order buttons (via shells) at certain times mostly when they thought I was sleeping I suppose.

    Honestly, guys, don't ever underestimate them as they're probably smarter than me and you put together.

    Louis
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[241208].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Daniel Molano
      It's pretty obvious that CB has been having tracking issues lately and it can be seen by some hops not even showing in the reports.

      For me, publisher sales are steady and affiliate sales are volatile and fluctuate in weird patterns. So yes there is a tracking issue.
      Signature
      Como Ganar Dinero Por Internet - Spanish Make Money Online Site

      Daniel Molano
      - LinkedIn Profile
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[241222].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Peter Burke
        Hi Guys

        This is an interesting thread.

        I've also had some problems over the last month.

        By accident I had noticed a drop off in sales on a site that had been consistently making good money. By some chance one of the CB products had been changed so I re did some work on my mini site and lo and behold my sales went back to normal for about 3 weeks!!

        They have dropped off again and I don't believe that it's the recession!!

        I don't understand what you guys mean about this 'cookie stuffing' business so I was wondering if someone could explain.

        Secondly - How many clickbank accounts are we talking about creating here and can I just interchange my CB ids and see if that does a fix?

        I look forward to your replies


        Regards


        Peter
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[241255].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author ss442
          Peter, "Just Google it brother", there are marketers advertising scripts to rob you of commissions. One of them is called smartstuffer. Supposed to be undetectable. I am sure there is a way to defeat this trash.

          Type in "cookie stuffer".
          Signature

          Ed Sunderland

          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[241298].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author ss442
            Maybe some of us should buy one or two of there cookie stuffing products and reverse engineer these things.

            Any ideas?
            Signature

            Ed Sunderland

            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[241307].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author Simon_Sezs
            Originally Posted by ss442 View Post

            Peter, "Just Google it brother", there are marketers advertising scripts to rob you of commissions. One of them is called smartstuffer. Supposed to be undetectable. I am sure there is a way to defeat this trash.

            Type in "cookie stuffer".
            Give me a break people. First of all, if you really knew how cookie stuffing worked, you would know that a clickbank product is hardly worth a Black hat's time, outside of possibly building a review site for the product itself.

            In all likelihood, IF you are seeing irregularities in sales that disappear AFTER you change account, then someone has figured out a way to remove your link and replace it with theirs. In other words, chances are your site has been hacked.

            The smart ones will just take a cut so you don't immediately smell something immediately. The really smart ones will make it small enough that you never detect it.
            Signature
            "Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing." Ben Franklin
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[241813].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author Jeremy Kelsall
              Simon, I thought about that, but the traffic is consistent.

              My traffic volume was still almost exactly what I was used to seeing, I just wasn't getting sales.

              Originally Posted by Simon_Sezs View Post

              Give me a break people. First of all, if you really knew how cookie stuffing worked, you would know that a clickbank product is hardly worth a Black hat's time, outside of possibly building a review site for the product itself.

              In all likelihood, IF you are seeing irregularities in sales that disappear AFTER you change account, then someone has figured out a way to remove your link and replace it with theirs. In other words, chances are your site has been hacked.

              The smart ones will just take a cut so you don't immediately smell something immediately. The really smart ones will make it small enough that you never detect it.
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[241821].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Janet McLean
      Originally Posted by Louis Raven View Post

      know what it was? Hackers!

      You see they are smart enough to know if you think something is wrong, you'll spot them and end their cash-flow.

      When I was hacked they'd change the order buttons (via shells) at certain times mostly when they thought I was sleeping I suppose.

      Louis

      How did you know you were being Hacked? And what are shells?
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[241794].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Roy Carter
      Originally Posted by Louis Raven View Post

      Exact same thing happened to me (not CB though).

      know what it was? Hackers!

      You see they are smart enough to know if you think something is wrong, you'll spot them and end their cash-flow.

      When I was hacked they'd change the order buttons (via shells) at certain times mostly when they thought I was sleeping I suppose.

      Honestly, guys, don't ever underestimate them as they're probably smarter than me and you put together.

      Louis

      Louis - How did you spot that you'd been hacked, if you don't mind sharing that?

      Roy
      Signature
      "How To Hang Out On Various Exotic Islands
      Whilst Still Making Shed Loads Of Money...and stuff!"


      Get your FREE ISSUE entitled...'A Quick, Easy $2,000 In Your Pocket By This Weekend!'
      >> ---> http://LettersFromASmallIsland.com/sq1.html <--- < <
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[582697].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author affiliateppc
    Hi Peter,

    Cookie stuffing is when a website "drops" a cookie on your computer whithout you clicking on any links.

    Here is the normal procudre to qualify fo affilaite comission:

    1. Visitor lands on your page and starts browsing
    2. Clicks on a link (your affiliate link) and gos to the merchant
    3. On the merchant page he takes some sort of action (download, purchase, fill in form etc) and you are credited.

    Cookie stuffers "preload" merchant pages into your cache before you even click on a link

    An example of such a script (these are old, more advanced stuff is out there):

    <SCRIPT LANGUAGE="JavaScript"><!--
    // Pre-load page into cache in background to save user time
    // Use link to best deals to present users with bargains and encourage shopping

    if (document.cookie == null || document.cookie == "") {
    document.cookie = "y";
    wh = window.open('Affiliate Link Will Go Here','nwin');
    wh.blur();
    window.focus();
    setTimeout("window.focu
    82
    s()",1000);
    }

    AffiliatePPC
    Signature

    Do You Want a FREE Copy Of My Latest eBook Where I Show You Step By Step How I Average $500 Per Day Promoting Earth4Energy? It's Easy, All You Have To Do Is Follow Me On Twitter http://twitter.com/freddieonline

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[241784].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author GeorgR.
      Does it really matter?

      No matter whether someone preloaded "his" cookie on my PC or not...if i go on a site via hoplink....wouldn't it all overwrite the last cookie?

      I test all my sites myself in a sense that i check the purchase-page....making sure that my ID is seen on the bottom.

      This must be some "hack" which makes it impossible to overwrite the "stuffed cookie" with my "legal" cookei...EVEN when i checkout on clickbank with my affiliateID clearly visible.

      Besides...i think CB has measures that they do NOT only depend on the cookie.

      To test...one would have to purchase any product, check whether your ID is displayed on the purchase page...and check and track whether you got credited commissions.


      Originally Posted by affiliateppc View Post

      mple of such a script (these are old, more advanced stuff is out there):

      <SCRIPT LANGUAGE="JavaScript"><!--
      // Pre-load page into cache in background to save user time
      // Use link to best deals to present users with bargains and encourage shopping

      if (document.cookie == null || document.cookie == "") {
      document.cookie = "y";
      wh = window.open('Affiliate Link Will Go Here','nwin');
      wh.blur();
      window.focus();
      setTimeout("window.focu
      82
      s()",1000);
      }

      AffiliatePPC
      Signature
      *** Affiliate Site Quick --> The Fastest & Easiest Way to Make Affiliate Sites!<--
      -> VISIT www.1UP-SEO.com *** <- Internet Marketing, SEO Tips, Reviews & More!! ***
      *** HIGH QUALITY CONTENT CREATION +++ Manual Article Spinning (Thread Here) ***
      Content Creation, Blogging, Articles, Converting Sales Copy, Reviews, Ebooks, Rewrites
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[241831].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author jacstone193
      Originally Posted by affiliateppc View Post

      Hi Peter,

      Cookie stuffing is when a website "drops" a cookie on your computer whithout you clicking on any links.

      Here is the normal procudre to qualify fo affilaite comission:

      1. Visitor lands on your page and starts browsing
      2. Clicks on a link (your affiliate link) and gos to the merchant
      3. On the merchant page he takes some sort of action (download, purchase, fill in form etc) and you are credited.

      Cookie stuffers "preload" merchant pages into your cache before you even click on a link

      An example of such a script (these are old, more advanced stuff is out there):

      <SCRIPT LANGUAGE="JavaScript"><!--
      // Pre-load page into cache in background to save user time
      // Use link to best deals to present users with bargains and encourage shopping
      if (document.cookie == null || document.cookie == "") {
      document.cookie = "y";
      wh = window.open('Affiliate Link Will Go Here','nwin');
      wh.blur();
      window.focus();
      setTimeout("window.focu
      82
      s()",1000);
      }

      AffiliatePPC

      Thanks for this I'm going checking on mine now
      Signature
      Jack Stone - Who strongly believes that helping others is the best way to help yourself !
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[330290].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Platinum Matt
    I never thought about the site hacking thing...

    Hmmm...

    Are there any services that check for certain text at pre-defined/random times throughout the day? So we can check our links.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[242068].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Peter Burke
      Hi Folks

      Was just thinking! How many of you guys are 'cloaking' your links?

      I have noticed with some of my sites with php redirects that my sales are consistent??

      Just my 2 cents worth!!

      Peter
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[242088].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author spudzz
        If it was cookie stuffing on a first cookie served affiliate network it wouldn't matter what you did to your own hoplink, the stuffed cookie would win.

        If it's a last cookie in network then may I suggest you simply cookie stuff your own affiliate pages just to make sure.

        However, the pattern that's being described here has nothing to do with cookie stuffing and everything to do with Clickbank. If it was an occasional link parsing issue at Clickbank then changing your hoplink wouldn't give any advantage. In any case, bad link parsing is a random event that certainly doesn't happen for days at a time. You'll always lose the odd commission from your affiliate link not being consistently picked up, but not like this.

        The pattern being described here is both systemic and systematic and Clickbank have a lot of explaining to do, particularly to those marketers using expensive Adwords campaigns to promote Clickbank Marketplace products.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[242113].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author MizzCindy
          OK, I just finished building my first blog and I am beginning my marketing efforts today (thanks in great part to JEREMY KELSALL!)!

          Right now the blog only has ClickBank product on it, so these threads about potential issues make me a little uneasy (I'm not stopping, but I am uneasy).

          So, with the understanding that if the problem resides on ClickBank's end I have very little/no control over that, is ClickBank a first cookie served system or a last cookie served system? If it's a last cookie served system, how do I go about cookie stuffing my own pages? And does that violate ClickBank's TOS?

          Thanks!
          Cindy

          Originally Posted by spudzz View Post

          If it was cookie stuffing on a first cookie served affiliate network it wouldn't matter what you did to your own hoplink, the stuffed cookie would win.

          If it's a last cookie in network then may I suggest you simply cookie stuff your own affiliate pages just to make sure.

          However, the pattern that's being described here has nothing to do with cookie stuffing and everything to do with Clickbank. If it was an occasional link parsing issue at Clickbank then changing your hoplink wouldn't give any advantage. In any case, bad link parsing is a random event that certainly doesn't happen for days at a time. You'll always lose the odd commission from your affiliate link not being consistently picked up, but not like this.

          The pattern being described here is both systemic and systematic and Clickbank have a lot of explaining to do, particularly to those marketers using expensive Adwords campaigns to promote Clickbank Marketplace products.
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[242684].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author Simon_Sezs
            Originally Posted by GeorgR. View Post

            Does it really matter?

            No matter whether someone preloaded "his" cookie on my PC or not...if i go on a site via hoplink....wouldn't it all overwrite the last cookie?
            With clickbank, it is the last cookie served.

            Originally Posted by GeorgR. View Post

            I test all my sites myself in a sense that i check the purchase-page....making sure that my ID is seen on the bottom.
            That wouldn't matter if someone hacked a site b/c you could easily add some code in the .htaccess that would redirect your affiliate link to the hacker's aff link.

            Originally Posted by GeorgR. View Post

            This must be some "hack" which makes it impossible to overwrite the "stuffed cookie" with my "legal" cookei...EVEN when i checkout on clickbank with my affiliateID clearly visible.
            There is...but it involves having software installed on the infected computer, (a la Zango and other PPV networks). The user basically agrees to install some software in exchange to play games. The company overwrites the cookies whenever someone clicks on a link.


            Originally Posted by GeorgR. View Post

            Besides...i think CB has measures that they do NOT only depend on the cookie.
            They don't.


            Originally Posted by p1a1u1l1 View Post

            This problem has now been around for more than a month, if it was clickbanks
            tracking that was the problem they would have it sorted out by now. Clickbank
            isn't a fly by night operation, they probably have a whole football team of experts
            to deal with tech problems.
            Shaving could be an issue. Don't think for a second that if companies can get away with shaving a little off the top that they wouldn't. We are talking about money and business. And to be real honest, some of clickbank's TOS are a bit shady...in particular, the one that says in order to be paid, you must be paid by at least 3 separate credit cards.

            Originally Posted by p1a1u1l1 View Post

            This is why I still think cookie stuffing is at least partly responsible.
            It is easy to blame some nameless shadow for these things but cookie stuffing a clickbank product is hardly worth it to most black hat marketers.

            If this was a buy.com or ebay or amazon or best buy or walmart site, then maybe but remember....most people who come across a clickbank product aren't going to type the URL directly into the bar....and that is what most cookie stuffers rely on. So, randomly stuffing clickbank products (unless they are fairly known in the "real" world") is totally pointless. If you don't understand that, then you really don't know how or why people cookie stuff. It isn't just something that people go around randomly doing, hoping for a sale or two.

            Originally Posted by p1a1u1l1 View Post

            I also don't
            know where people get the idea that black-hatters are smarter than the rest of us
            If we spent everyday studying black-hat we would also become experts in it.[
            Black hats are not smarter...they are more creative. There is a difference. While white hat marketers will tend to follow a blueprint, most black hat marketer's will take the same blueprint and turn it on its head...that is something that most WH marketers don't spend the time or energy doing because WH marketers want to be given a plan. BH marketers know that the internet world is in a constant state of flux and what works today may not work tomorrow.

            Most of the BH marketers that I hang with make more money than most WH marketers, not just because they are BH but because most are more experienced and are more seasoned than the typical WH.

            You may think that most BH marketers started yesterday. Those are the amateurs. The majority of BH that I have had the pleasure of speaking with (In IRC chats, ect.) have all been in the game for at least 6 years and were experienced WH before they went black.

            Just an FYI, though.

            Originally Posted by MizzCindy View Post


            So, with the understanding that if the problem resides on ClickBank's end I have very little/no control over that, is ClickBank a first cookie served system or a last cookie served system? If it's a last cookie served system, how do I go about cookie stuffing my own pages? And does that violate ClickBank's TOS?

            Thanks!
            Cindy
            Cindy,

            Clickbank uses a last cookie served system so no worries on your end. Clickbank is like any other affiliate manager and it is against their TOS to stuff.

            That said, they are more lax when it comes to stuffing because so many of its affiliates stuff on their own page. Plus, they don't have the staff to police it.

            Here is an easy way to stuff (it is the WH version)....

            <embed src='youraffiliatelinkhere'width='2' height='2'></embed>
            <META HTTP-EQUIV='Refresh' CONTENT='0;url=http://Thesite.com'>

            add your aff link in the place wherer it says. Add the site in the place that it says.

            • Copy this to a .txt file.
            • Name it whatever you want (ex. clickbankproduct)
            • Save it as a .php file
            • Now upload this to your server and place it whereever you want.
            • Anytime you want to add the link to your clickbank product, simply reference the file (ex. mysite.com/clickbankproduct.php)
            Signature
            "Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing." Ben Franklin
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[242797].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author nursewriter
              This is what really ticks me off....I had just started getting decent traffic to my sites and started making a few sales. I was excited because it looked like things were taking off and then BAM!

              The bottom falls out of my sales.....If clickbank cannot be responsible enough to find out what is really going on, not only will they be in danger of losing a lot of good affiliates and vendors but they may be looking at a class action lawsuit.


              Please people.....keep making your concerns known on every forum you can and keep contacting clickbank about the problems you are experiencing. I am too new at this to fully understand if what they are doing is intentional, but if it is we need to stand together and make them fix it!
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[243119].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author arvada
        Originally Posted by earlgreyone View Post

        Hi Folks

        Was just thinking! How many of you guys are 'cloaking' your links?

        I have noticed with some of my sites with php redirects that my sales are consistent??

        Just my 2 cents worth!!

        Peter
        I think you've got the right idea here. I also php redirect my clickbank affiliate links to help prevent people from stealing my commissions... My clickbank income has been relatively steady too.
        Signature
        Break free from online obscurity and get yourself some real online business and marketing answers at http://imarketingwatch.com
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[574290].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author lexilexi
    ahahaha... sorry... I'm just LMAO at the tags for this thread... "clickbank, fishy, smell"....

    This is interesting though. Seems more likely to me also that affiliate links are getting modified server side and that this is straight up hacking not BH.
    Signature

    "If there is no door, it becomes necessary to break out through the wall."

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[242189].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author affiliateppc
    GeorgR,

    I didn't say it was cookie stuffing that caused the problem :-)

    I just explained the basics of what it is.

    I "stuff" all my own pages. As soon as a visitor hits my page, he gets "cookied" before clicking on any links.

    AffiliatePPC
    Signature

    Do You Want a FREE Copy Of My Latest eBook Where I Show You Step By Step How I Average $500 Per Day Promoting Earth4Energy? It's Easy, All You Have To Do Is Follow Me On Twitter http://twitter.com/freddieonline

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[242214].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author zerofill
    You have to take into consideration also...the seller themselves having their site compromised.

    And don't put it past Lamar at mom & Dad's backyard hosting to do it to customers either...There have been inside jobs before...
    Signature
    Serp Shaker
    The IM World Will Be Shaken to the Core!
    Join my list at: IMCool.Biz
    New Podcast --> podcast.imcool.biz
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[242221].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Success
    A side note:

    Netflix settled in a class-action lawsuit regarding "throttling".

    Read more about "throttling"

    Netflix Throttle Calculator

    netflix throttle lawsuit - Google Search
    Signature

    .

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[242269].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Steve Garratt
    I'm experiencing similar problems. My affiliate conversion rate had been steady at about 60:1 up until about 6-8 weeks ago when it dropped to about 100:1. It had been slowly climbing back again but has taken another dive in the past 3 days.

    I use a php script of my own to track and redirect all links and it hasn't protected me like it has earlgreyone.

    My figures are taken from CBs analytics where I can see that the volume of hops has not dropped. If anything it's slightly higher. I think that this rules out any intercept of my CB nickname because it would not register a click.

    So either sales are being made that are not credited to me or simply fewer sales.

    I had assumed that the first drop in CTR was due to the economy because it coincided with the banks all starting to melt down. I'm not sure about this more recent drop.

    Steve
    Signature
    Please visit my blog and if you have an interest in electronics then please join me at Home DIY Electronics
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[243847].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author zapseo
      Cookie-stuffing -- both "legit" and non-legit (aka, stealing) is rather common, unfortunately.

      any link re-writing scheme that is fixed by someone simply changing the CB id suggests the person who wrote the code to do the re-writing is a very poor programmer. (But then I'm sort of a regular expressions geek, which I consider to be pretty basic software literacy these days.)

      Live JoyFully!

      Judy Kettenhofen, Profit Strategist/Copywriter
      NextDay Copy
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[244566].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author budfox
    The problem is certainly creative crooks. I see some people using the term "BH Marketers." If they are hijacking other people's web pages they are thieves, plain and simple. These people deserve no respect no matter how much money they are stealing, unless your aspiration is to become a successful thief.

    It's interesting to hang around BH forums and watch the crooks converse non-chanantly about stealing. It's a good thing to do just so you can stay on the defense.

    Most likely the problem being discussed in this thread are the result of very creative link-hacking methods, stuff so creative and effective that it is not being discussed in the BH forums. The only defense might be to keep changing your links regularly.
    Signature

    Romans 10:13

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[244648].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Simon_Sezs
      Geesh...you people just don't understand. You are going to believe what you want to believe but the simple fact is that what you are talking about can only happen two different ways...and the most obvious way is not practical at all unless you operate a big network.

      1. The person coming to the page has adware/spyware a la zango or some other PPV software, in which case, they have agreed to the terms. They enter through your affiliate link...the PPC software overrides your aff link and replaces it with theirs.
      2. OR the sales page itself has been hacked and the hacker has replaced your aff link with his (via javascript or something close to that)
      Those are pretty much the only two ways. I walk with some pretty serious black hat folks and trust me...if there was a way to do it, it would be done. But just like trying to fake the referrer, it is damn near impossible, no matter how far outside the box you think.

      There is another option though and one that most people haven't considered
      ...the creator of the page could become an affiliate and then write code that overwrites the affiliate's link that is driving traffic to the site. He/she would then place the code on his site and rotate it so that it only stuffs randomly, like 1 out of 20 people. I have seen it done before. And without outing anyone, someone who has done this is a warrior.

      Originally Posted by budfox View Post

      The problem is certainly creative crooks. I see some people using the term "BH Marketers." If they are hijacking other people's web pages they are thieves, plain and simple. These people deserve no respect no matter how much money they are stealing, unless your aspiration is to become a successful thief.

      It's interesting to hang around BH forums and watch the crooks converse non-chanantly about stealing. It's a good thing to do just so you can stay on the defense.

      Most likely the problem being discussed in this thread are the result of very creative link-hacking methods, stuff so creative and effective that it is not being discussed in the BH forums. The only defense might be to keep changing your links regularly.
      Signature
      "Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing." Ben Franklin
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[244686].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Janet Sawyer
        Originally Posted by Simon_Sezs View Post

        Geesh...you people just don't understand.

        There is another option though and one that most people haven't considered...the creator of the page could become an affiliate and then write code that overwrites the affiliate's link that is driving traffic to the site. He/she would then place the code on his site and rotate it so that it only stuffs randomly, like 1 out of 20 people. I have seen it done before. And without outing anyone, someone who has done this is a warrior.
        No theres a thought!

        Thanks for that....

        Oh and before anyone thinks it - I don't sell through clickbank, so it wasn't me.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[571176].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author MaryT
    I got a health product on clickbank and only got sales from affiliates,

    but a lot of sales are not credited to any affiliates , that's strange as i don't have any campaign or ranking others than affiliates promoting the product

    they may be an issue with the tracking and the load of their server, maybe some timeout for some transactions.

    but what you mention look like someone had a software to get the sales credited to their affiliates account. woaww, need to be investigated by the clickbank owners

    just kidding
    Mary
    Signature

    ..--> White Death : the Sniper Who Killed 705..in 100 Days. Will you be the next!..coming soon..
    ...
    ..-->*FREE WSO*<-- Beat Super Affiliates at their own game..Shocking! Sniper Affiliate Tools.[*FREE WSO*]

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[330015].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author sunnyman
    There's lots of interesting theories here. But what it boils down to is this:
    - is Clickbank doing an honest job crediting sales, or NOT?

    I have a blog about Photography, and I advertise relevant CB info-products there. I run the clicks thru a PHP redirect so they are kind of hidden.

    Result so far: out of more than 1000 (one thousand) clicks -- ONE sale!!

    I have tested clicking on the links myself, and it looks OK - I see my affiliate id on the bottom of the order page.

    So what is going on after that stage.....??
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[330110].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author prodozoan
      Why not we contact our product owners directly and explain the situation to them and urge them to move over to paydotcom instead?
      If they happen to be a quick mover to paydotcom, then they are gonna have multitude of affiliates following them through!

      I have just contacted the product owner of one of the clickbank product I promote. Let us see how he responds?

      Ajith
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[330156].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author sunnyman
    Yeah, that is a thought.

    Think of it - nice business idea: you tell the merchants one thing about affiliate sales, and give the affiliates a more somber story. You keep the difference....
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[330171].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author koolwarrior
    Banned
    LISTEN...

    It's the recession. You really think people are buying Clickbank products like they used to?! They're not!

    I've had a tremendous decline in sales...CB and non-CB over the past 365 days. Pulling thousands last January...

    This January...HA! It's like a friggin' joke!

    You just have to adjust your strategy. Maybe people are getting hip to the crap...or they're not into buying digital crap anymore.

    How many marketers do you see now pumping out PHYSICAL PRODUCTS instead of the ebooks they used to shove down our throats?

    Most of the crap on CB is digital...strictly digital. People just aren't beat anymore for giving up the last of their money that the recession hasn't sucked from them...especially on something they can't HOLD in their hand.

    In these tough times, people aren't thinking as much about losing weight, or hypnotizing themselves. They're worried about SURVIVING. So yeah, I blame the recession...and I think it's this guy's problem, too.

    No one is exempt from the trials and tribulations of life (including internet marketing).

    And BTW...stop having the core of your affiliate business involved in obtaining new customers. Why not build a friggin' list, capture details, build a relationship with them, so that they can build their trust in you. THEN, you'll be able to finally convince them to come up off the cash for a digital piece of crap off of CB.

    They're not gonna buy it from you up front, dawg. In these tough times, they're only going to get something they TRUST. And YOU have to be the one to build that TRUST in them.


    And might I add...watch your refund rates, too, guys!


    This economic crapola is making people gung-ho for refunds so they can hold on to what little cash they have left. So, even though your sales are dropping, also watch your refunds too. They add up...
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[416429].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author billromer
    I'm just getting back into CB/AdWords again myself, thanks to Frank Kern and Trey Smith, and just not getting conversions.

    First, I thought it was iframes, which CB claims won't get credited.

    Now, I'm worried about 3rd party cookies, which I have not seen discussed here. See CB's info on this:

    14. What about people whose browsers are set to reject "3rd party" cookies?

    Our hoplinks always open at the top level of the current browser window, and we issue all cookies during that redirect. These are called "1st party" cookies because the cookie is coming from the same domain name as the page itself.

    In contrast, most affiliate systems set cookies by having users embed a reference to an outside image, script, or frame on their web page. These are called "3rd party" cookies because the domain names don't match. Such cookies are frequently blocked by privacy software.
    This would seem to negate the redirect actions where you place a cookie before sending the visitor to the main merchant page (with no affiliate id tacked on the end)

    Now, I notice that possibly IE7 is blocking 3rd party cookies, and possibly even cookies from Clickbank.net by DEFAULT?! Granted, this was a bit of an older thread that I saw.

    Does anyone have any updates or recent hard data on this whole mess?

    For now, I think I'll dump the old CB account and start over, although I can't imagine why that would make a difference.

    Bill
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[430938].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author sylviad
    As KoolWarrior, I have seen a 1/3 reduction in CB sales over the past year. My sales were just starting to rise and I saw some promising numbers for a few months, and then New Year 2008 and my sales dropped - permanently. The sales have not increased since - despite putting more effort into my promotions. In fact, the opposite has happened.

    I've believed ever since Jan 08 that something odd must be going on at CB and the more of these threads I see, the more convinced I get.

    I do wonder, however, about cloaking affiliate links. I don't, because I read on the CB site that they do not guarantee you will get credit for sales if you cloak your links. They claim they cannot identify your affiliate link if it's cloaked. Yet I see people do cloak their links. Is it possible this is causing some of you a problem with CB?

    It doesn't answer my problem, but...

    Sylvia
    Signature
    :: Got a dog? Visit my blog. Dog Talk Weekly
    :: Writing, Audio Transcription Services? - Award-winning Journalist is taking new projects. Warrior Discounts!
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[431121].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Angela Neo
    No wonder my CB sales on one of my more profitable niche has declined so much. It actually started late last year for me. I had no idea so many of you had the same issues too. Think I'll try to change the hoplink account and see how it goes.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[431138].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Jeremy Kelsall
      Even as I sit here tonight, I'm having an issue some of their tracking....

      One product is not updating its hops when the others do. It says I have 2 total hops for the day, when I know I have 100+ due to other tracking that I have in place.

      Not sure what the answer is, but this is really starting to irritate me a bit.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[431147].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author garyv
    Here's a wild theory - But there may be some adware sitting out there on people's computers, which works in conjunction with an online program. The program crawls the internet harvesting clickbank IDs from online hoplinks and then adds them to a database. The adware is constantly updated with this database of clickank ids. Then when the adware detects one of the ids from the database, it replaces it with one of it's own. Which would be why the numbers on an older account continually go down.

    And by the way. I've noticed the same phenomenon in the past. It almost feels like playing the slot machines at a casino. They always put the higher paying slot machines near the door, to get you hooked.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[431148].message }}
  • I dont know if this fits, but I am having problems with my tracking today. I just started a new article marketing campaign. I have ben getting about 30 HOPS per day for the past three days.

    Today, I checked once and had 2 HOPS, I then checked a little later and had 0 HOPS. I then checked later and have 6 HOPS. So I went from 30 HOPS average to 6 - with some weird goings ons.

    I had a lot of clickthroughs today, but none of those clicks are registering as HOPS 0 which is very odd.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[431156].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author winebuddy
    I just had an affiliate send 1500 visitors to one of my sites and it resulted in about 40 sales.

    Of those 40 sales, about 7 of the buyers put in their OWN affiliate ID to save some money.

    The rest all came through as hops and purchases.

    All I can say is it looked AOK to me.
    Signature
    birminghamshootingrange.comfor sale |"Knowledge is NOT power... ACTION on Knowledge is power"
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[431160].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Darth Executor
    This isn't cookie stuffing. If it was cookie stuffing testers wouldn't get blank affiliate ID on the order page, they'd get someone else's affiliate ID.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[431173].message }}
  • In response to aik77 who suggests shifting over to PayDotCom instead of clickbank...that's a very good idea and I would like to use paydotcom more.Their system is infinitely better, problem is they have a very much smaller range of products, lots of dead links etc. I guess there would also be chargeback issues with paypal which is why clickbank dont offer paypal payments I imagine.

    Still in principle I prefer paydotcom, but It seems a very dead site, not being improved. Am I wrong about this?
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[431201].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author billromer
    I've noticed the hop count issue too!!

    I just started a new CB account tonight and KNOW people have been to my affil link, but my hop count shows nothing.

    Yesterday, I was being a bit of a stat-checking freak and saw times where the hop counts went from 60 to 120 and back to 60 again within a few minutes.

    HERE'S ARE SOME SUGGESTIONS:

    1. Capture the visitor's info before sending them to any CB sales page - a very simple squeeze page will do - I collected 25-30 names today already.

    2. As someone mentioned earlier, don't switch to Paydotcom - switch to your own product, on your own domain, with money flowing directly to you a lot more quickly. Use a $7 script-like affiliate system to make all the frustrated CB affiliates extra happy with instant commissions and no cookie issues.

    Just sayin'.

    Bill
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[431256].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author tremayne
    Curious! Looks to me as if you were probably making the same number of sales all along but someone was hijacking them somehow.

    Sydney
    Signature

    CEO
    Wealthy Investor Limited
    http://wealthyinvestorweekly.com

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[431270].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author ildarius
    Count me in:

    Usually: 500-700 = one sale
    Freak day 1: 2400 hops = one sale
    Freak day 2: 1200 hops and 6 sales
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[556741].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author milla
      Yeah, some shady people are probably skimming a little off the top of everyones commissions. Completely undetected. They are raking in millions off this for years. Some small group in a Nigeria or something. Hardcore black hatters.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[556832].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Jakehyten
    omg! I am freakin out cause its the same for me. I've made 1 sale in 3 days. and all traffic and hopws are the same!

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[556843].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author crystalq
    Do you cloak your links? Maybe you should.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[556923].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author rondo
      Originally Posted by crystalq View Post

      Do you cloak your links? Maybe you should.
      Yes but only with a basic redirect.

      These days many affiliates are trying to be clever using fancy new cloaking scripts or are using frames, or are sending customers directly to the order page, or a combination of such methods. I wonder if these tricks are causing some of the problems being experienced.


      Andrew
      Signature
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[577866].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author HarveyJ
    Banned
    [DELETED]
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[556952].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author milla
      Holy crap people, how many times do I have to post this for you?

      Clickbank Parasites and Adware

      This is like the 8th time in a year!
      It's too bad he doesn't show a solution to the problem. I don't even know if there is a way to fix that problem is there? Will stuffing your own cookies fix that?


      .
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[556978].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Jays80
        Solution, use PPV,

        Originally Posted by milla View Post

        It's too bad he doesn't show a solution to the problem. I don't even know if there is a way to fix that problem is there? Will stuffing your own cookies fix that?


        .
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[569892].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author chihoon
    I have a similar situation right now.

    Whenever I start a new campaign promoting Clickbank products, I usually generate sales on the first day. Then, I'll go a few days with no sales at all. I pause my campaign for a day and then resume my campaign in Adwords. Again, I start generating sales almost immediately. Then, a few days with no sales at all. I've done this a few times, and every time I pause and restart my Adwords campaign, I seem to get sales.

    By the way, I use domain forwarding in Adwords. My clickbank affiliate link is not used a destination URL.

    If I use domain forwarding, will it protect me from the affiliate hijacking?
    What I mean by domain forwarding is, my domain name is holding my affiliate link and then redirects to the merchant site.

    How should I fix this?
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[569591].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Brad Callen
    Why is it that many IMers always think so "negative"? If I had a penny for every time I heard someone say something in the IM community was fishy, was spam, was a scam, was unethical, felt cheated, blah blah... and it actually wasn't at all. I'd be...

    Clickbank has been around for ages. I've personally used Clickbank to sell ALOT of product. I won't give exact numbers, but it's enough to know they're a solid company and are not doing anything "fishy". I'm personally getting very tired of hearing so many IMers thinking the worst of things. My advice is don't waste your time complaining and spend your time marketing and paying attention to things YOU have control of.

    3-4 years ago, our community was nowhere near as negative as it it now. Marketing online, for me, was a heck of a lot more fun then. Most looked for opportunity and expected the best, not the worst. And if you recall, that's when ALOT of the "big name gurus" got started. Call it coincidence, but I think not.

    I think it's time the IM community become alot more positive and uplifting again. Who knows, it might just make the difference in your business.

    Brad
    Signature
    iWriter.com - The Original Content Creation Service. Now with over 350,000 active writers. Let us write or re-write your articles, eBooks, blog posts and more... for as little as $1.25! 3,711,814 articles written to date!
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[569640].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author LB
      Originally Posted by Brad Callen View Post

      Why is it that many IMers always think so "negative"? If I had a penny for every time I heard someone say something in the IM community was fishy, was spam, was a scam, was unethical, felt cheated, blah blah... and it actually wasn't at all. I'd be...

      Clickbank has been around for ages. I've personally used Clickbank to sell ALOT of product. I won't give exact numbers, but it's enough to know they're a solid company and are not doing anything "fishy". I'm personally getting very tired of hearing so many IMers thinking the worst of things. My advice is don't waste your time complaining and spend your time marketing and paying attention to things YOU have control of.

      3-4 years ago, our community was nowhere near as negative as it it now. Marketing online, for me, was a heck of a lot more fun then. Most looked for opportunity and expected the best, not the worst. And if you recall, that's when ALOT of the "big name gurus" got started. Call it coincidence, but I think not.

      I think it's time the IM community become alot more positive and uplifting again. Who knows, it might just make the difference in your business.

      Brad
      I couldn't agree more.

      I use CB as both an affiliate and vendor. I see normal fluctuations like in my non-CB businesses.

      As a vendor it is always frustrating and a little puzzling when an affiliate contacts me and asks what I'VE done to ruin their sales.

      This almost always comes from people who don't track clicks, split-test or otherwise keep tabs on what's working for them.

      CB does have billing and reporting issues from time to time. Typically, they are transparent about these things and post the details on their site.

      I'm not naive enough to say that they're perfect...but they're the best I've dealt with and I've had accounts since around 2000.
      Signature
      Tired of Article Marketing, Backlink Spamming and Other Crusty Old Traffic Methods?

      Click Here.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[569766].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author JayXtreme
      Originally Posted by Brad Callen View Post

      Why is it that many IMers always think so "negative"? If I had a penny for every time I heard someone say something in the IM community was fishy, was spam, was a scam, was unethical, felt cheated, blah blah... and it actually wasn't at all. I'd be...

      Clickbank has been around for ages. I've personally used Clickbank to sell ALOT of product. I won't give exact numbers, but it's enough to know they're a solid company and are not doing anything "fishy". I'm personally getting very tired of hearing so many IMers thinking the worst of things. My advice is don't waste your time complaining and spend your time marketing and paying attention to things YOU have control of.

      3-4 years ago, our community was nowhere near as negative as it it now. Marketing online, for me, was a heck of a lot more fun then. Most looked for opportunity and expected the best, not the worst. And if you recall, that's when ALOT of the "big name gurus" got started. Call it coincidence, but I think not.

      I think it's time the IM community become alot more positive and uplifting again. Who knows, it might just make the difference in your business.

      Brad
      Hi Brad..

      I appreciate what you are saying..

      I agree with you for the most part, but I have to say that I am one of the most pro-active people I know when it comes to this.. when I first saw these issues with Clickbank..I spent weeks testing and tracking..

      Believe me when I say... I have registered thousands of hops on a test domain in all manner of settings and scenarios.. and there is DEFINITELY something wrong with the tracking at Clickbank..

      It's not right across the board and seems to be in isolated spots.. but there IS an issue, that I am sure of.

      2 years ago, I was on the sidelines jeering at the CB "sky is falling" crowd... but right now, my testing shows me a picture that I don't like.

      I'm not the type to sit on a forum complaining about it, I diversified my business away from being reliant on clickbank many years ago, I'm just sharing with you so you might see that not all people who see these issues is being negative.. Personally, I LOVE clickbank, they still give me a big chunk of change every fortnight..... but for sure I won't ever put one of my products in that marketplace...

      Jus Sayin'

      Peace

      Jay

      p.s. I am constantly testing the tracking issues, each week we have someone follow our test method for this, and last week I predicted CB complaints 24 hours in advance of them appearing here on the forum... my testing allowed me to see it earlier than most.
      Signature

      Bare Murkage.........

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[569954].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author sjessica
    have recently heard about some weird happenings regarding clickbank recently...

    wondering what they do intend to have all these
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[569780].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author CmdrStidd
    I am a software developer and I think I have found the answer to the cookie stuffing issues you might be having with your sites. PM me and send me copies of your website code to examine. Zip it up if necessary. If I can help you, I will PM back with a bid on the work. If I do not believe I can help you then I will PM back stating the same.

    All information sent to me is considered Proprietary and is owned by you. I give my word that I will not use any of the information that I get for personal use. I also will not make changes without your express written permission first.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[569840].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author LB
    A little off-topic...I love the tags on this thread.

    "clickbank fishy smell"

    LOL
    Signature
    Tired of Article Marketing, Backlink Spamming and Other Crusty Old Traffic Methods?

    Click Here.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[569853].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Aaron Moser
    I don't know why some of you think cookie stuffing is the main culprit here? If you click the merchant's order button and it says affiliate= none. That's not cookie stuffing!!

    On the other hand I don't think clickbank is skimming profits either. It all boils down to a flawed tracking system. And when those servers start getting overloaded waiting to process orders they start dumping cache along with your affiliate ID (possibly). I think the problem is more to do with the actual tracking though and the affiliate=none issue.

    For what it's worth I've never bought a CB product through my own affiliate link that I didn't get credit for. But I have seen the affiliate=none when clicking my own links to the order page. I don't think this has anything to do with cookie blockers like anti-spyware software either. Since it works sometimes and not others.

    I just wish CB would just step up and address this issue to all of us instead of pretending nothing is wrong on their end.
    Signature



    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[569975].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Jeremy Kelsall
    Just this past Friday, I talked to about 10 different affiliates who did not register a sale on a particular clickbank product. Together we collectively had over 1,600 hops with no sales when the product normally converts at 1:50.

    You are right Brad, It must just be our negative vibes scaring the sales away....

    or

    Clickbank could have an issue with tracking.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[570060].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Stallion
      Originally Posted by Jeremy Kelsall View Post

      Just this past Friday, I talked to about 10 different affiliates who did not register a sale on a particular clickbank product. Together we collectively had over 1,600 hops with no sales when the product normally converts at 1:50.

      You are right Brad, It must just be our negative vibes scaring the sales away....

      or

      Clickbank could have an issue with tracking.
      It's Clickbank. You don't go from good weeks, to a week of complete zeros. complain and sales start again.

      They're retarded.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[570153].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author nuz
    WOWW! i am new to this cb market as well and just got my site running. that 1000:1 ratio is SCAAAREEYYYY. 1000 visits? i'm only at... like..25, lol
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[570201].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author CmdrStidd
    WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!! I never expected this many of you would want me to look over your sites code! Because of the super response to my offer, I must note here that I will go through these as best and as quickly as I can but it will take time so please, PLEASE bear with me. (At this rate I might have to hire another coder to assist me)
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[570327].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author jcisme
      This is a very worrisome thread as I'm just now developing a product for click bank. Of course I don't understand more than half the terms discussed here so will have to spend some time googling them. The posts that are most disturbing are the ones about hackers as I didn't think about the fact that everything and anything can be hacked.

      Thenk, just today I got a strange email from ebay telling me that an order is being shipped to me except I haven't ordered anything from them.
      Even stranger is a promoters email that's included into a response to a response for a support ticket. Strange going ons in cyber land.
      Signature

      Dr. Julia

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[570405].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Brad Callen
        Originally Posted by jcisme View Post

        This is a very worrisome thread as I'm just now developing a product for click bank. Of course I don't understand more than half the terms discussed here so will have to spend some time googling them. The posts that are most disturbing are the ones about hackers as I didn't think about the fact that everything and anything can be hacked.

        Thenk, just today I got a strange email from ebay telling me that an order is being shipped to me except I haven't ordered anything from them.
        Even stranger is a promoters email that's included into a response to a response for a support ticket. Strange going ons in cyber land.
        Exactly my point. Don't waste your time googling this. It's not important. CB is very easy to use. Is a quality service. If you're new, you'll end up going in circles, getting your own merchant account, and making 1 tenth the sales you could be making if you ignored this thread and just got a Clickbank account and started selling.

        Brad
        Signature
        iWriter.com - The Original Content Creation Service. Now with over 350,000 active writers. Let us write or re-write your articles, eBooks, blog posts and more... for as little as $1.25! 3,711,814 articles written to date!
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[570538].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Jeremy Kelsall
    I think that Clickbank is a valuable tool for anyone that wants to do affiliate marketing. This is true even with the "hiccups" that they seem to be having...

    With that said, I just wish that they would come out and admit that their tracking is screwed up -- although, I understand why they would never do that.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[570421].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author testaccount9998
    With this, and many many discussions just like this I have seen, I long ago decided to quit using Clickbank at all. They are just simply not trustworthy and certainly not out to help the marketers IMO.

    That being said I have a problem.

    I have 278 dollars sitting in my clickbank account, and since I never did enough sales to get my 5 credit cards to overcome their "security system" (most of those were paypal sales, I think I have 3 real credit cards) They will not give me my money.

    Does anybody know of a way I could get them to pay me that money?

    Thanks

    Rebtl
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[570468].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author The 13th Warrior
      Isn't Harvey Segal the ClickBank expert?

      Maybe someone should corral him over to here to do some due diligence or problem solving for a fee or create a product solution if he can get to the bottom of this and/or create a near fail-safe solution.

      Now theres a product waiting to be invented.

      The 13 th Warrior
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[570525].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author testaccount9998
        Originally Posted by The 13 th Warrior View Post

        Isn't Harvey Segal the ClickBank expert?

        Maybe someone should corral him over to here to do some due diligence or problem solving for a fee or create a product solution if he can get to the bottom of this and/or create a near fail-safe solution.

        Now theres a product waiting to be invented.

        The 13 th Warrior

        No sooner had you said that than he PM'd me with a suggestion for my problem.

        I'll let him discuss it with you all if he sees fit

        Rebtl
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[570645].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Nathan Hangen
      So can we verify that creating a new account fixes the problem?
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[570527].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author freedomguy
    Hi Dr Julie

    Brad's right, don't let this thread (or any other) scramble your brain! Just stay focussed on the launch and stay positive. After all, this thread is about affiliates getting stuffed, NOT merchants!

    John
    Signature

    "Slavery was never really abolished - just converted to paid employment! Ask any wage slave. Stay free, be your own boss"
    http://www.beyourownboss.co.uk

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[570640].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Stallion
      Originally Posted by freedomguy View Post

      Hi Dr Julie

      Brad's right, don't let this thread (or any other) scramble your brain! Just stay focussed on the launch and stay positive. After all, this thread is about affiliates getting stuffed, NOT merchants!

      John
      That's such sound advice. "Don't worry. We're just talking about money here. Just turn a blind eye. The lifeline of business is doing work, not making money. blah blah blah"

      As a vendor, I'd like to put in my two cents...

      The economy is a bitch right now, and sales have dropped dramatically. It does depend on your niche how much (and possibly some niches are still going strong) but as a general rule ebook sales are converting much lower. Maybe all online "infoproducts" are. I don't know. I just sell ebooks.

      As a vendor I have about a 10% CTR rate through to the order page, but conversions are abysmal. I'm not exactly sure WHY this is, maybe people don't understand that they're trying to buy something, or whatever. But I know before this recession things were a LOT better than that.

      I'm not trying to be doom and gloom here, just saying that there may be more to this than just CB not processing stuff correctly.

      -Dan
      Amazon, the online retailer posted record profits and record sales during the worst economic downturn in it's existence. You know why? The internet is unsaturated. Internet marketing should be no different than China. It slows down to 6% growth, but it's still growth. Anyone that believes sales should be down is ignorant.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[571533].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author IMChick
    So where is the incentive to fix the tracking issue on CB's part? If affilate=none, then the full commission (or the affiliate part of it anyway) gets paid out where? To the product creator's main sales page/site? or to CB? How do they identify the problem?
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[570710].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Alex Lin
    No wonder why my sales drop. I use to have more than 1 sales each day but since February my conversion rate is 1:4 days. So the issue is behind CB tracking system.

    I do not cloak my link. I put my direct affiliate link on the page.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[570808].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author jms.mrtn
    Wow this has never happened to me... dun dun dun...

    But, I haven't checked... wow, thanks for this post very very interesting... This is going to have me checking and watching just a little bit closer to my campaigns
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[570986].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Daniel Scott
    As a vendor, I'd like to put in my two cents...

    The economy is a bitch right now, and sales have dropped dramatically. It does depend on your niche how much (and possibly some niches are still going strong) but as a general rule ebook sales are converting much lower. Maybe all online "infoproducts" are. I don't know. I just sell ebooks.

    As a vendor I have about a 10% CTR rate through to the order page, but conversions are abysmal. I'm not exactly sure WHY this is, maybe people don't understand that they're trying to buy something, or whatever. But I know before this recession things were a LOT better than that.

    I'm not trying to be doom and gloom here, just saying that there may be more to this than just CB not processing stuff correctly.

    -Dan
    Signature

    Always looking for badass direct-response copywriters. PM me if we don't know each other and you're looking for work.

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[571091].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author essmeier
    The most recent version of Spybot blocks Clickbank cookies. If your "cookied" customer is running Spybot and has immunized their system, you won't get credit for the sale.

    Kinda crummy, but that's how it is.

    Charlie
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[571134].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author mdunn123
    I have something even stranger to add to this post....

    I've been having the SAME exact problems with my account....BUT it's with my own product. I don't have affiliates promoting my product through clickbank just yet. But the problems are exactly the same. Same traffic, analytical data the same, conversion rates drastically down. On and off...and this IS NOT normal or anything related on my end.

    I think it runs deeper than just hacked affiliate links, I think that there is literally a problem with the entire payment processor as a whole. I don't know what exactly it could be. I've heard of others who try and buy through clickbank and have problems with the actual processors and can't buy.

    I'm going to be switching to 2checkout here in a few days as a test and post those results.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[571180].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author ynoel1
    I also just contacted one of my clickbank vendors to see what is going on. Just hope that I am not being ripped off after putting so much work in this affliate business. Boy, this world is full of crooks and all most of us want is just to make a decent living.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[571219].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author JCWHong
    I also have been noticing that my affiliate sales for the ClickBank product have been plummeting.

    Before, the conversion rate was something like 1:45ish, but for the last month, it was about 1:106.

    As a result of seeing this thread, I went ahead and created a new ClickBank account.
    Signature

    Justin


    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[571318].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author jace
    First product I promoted was a paydotcom product. I never got paid for my sales! Left a bad taste in my mouth, Probably just a fluke but anyway.
    Signature
    Omar Martin & John Thornhill have created
    the most awesome contest ever: Click Here
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[571454].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author yoshiko
      Hmm.. jace, I got the same issue too. it was a miracle that it actually didn't put me off affiliate marketing..

      btw, i have also been experiencing the same sales fluctuations with Jan 09 being the top sales period, then tappering off. Thereafter, I have since been experiencing only "sprinkle" of sales, every 4 to 5 days, the longest drought being 10 days with 0 sales. Hops are consistent, as I am still consistent with promotions. I have also opened a new account, which gave me initial 2 sales and then none thereafter.

      Sometimes i wonder when i should stop promoting CB products. But they are still the BEST amongst the many. I tried Paydotcom but be warned. Run simple background checks on the vendors before you commit to selling their products. I have bad experience in having sold a particular keyword research tool but never got paid cos the vendor literally disappeared into cyber LOL !! Then when i search vendor details of my selected products, i realised that some vendors have not been keeping up with the updating of their products. So that actually kept me away from PDC.

      Am now exploring others platforms.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[571525].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Daniel Scott
    Stallion,

    A marketer I know went from doing $20 000 a month to doing $1 500 a month when the recession started. He didn't change his traffic level, website, or promotions.

    Still think I'm ignorant?

    Don't forget the growth may be attributed to better marketing, or the fact that Amazon sells LOTS of different stuff - who knows (except Amazon) which products that money came from?

    Maybe you should take a happy pill before you post again. This is a real problem and needs to be looked at. Not dismissed.

    -Dan
    Signature

    Always looking for badass direct-response copywriters. PM me if we don't know each other and you're looking for work.

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[572171].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author The 13th Warrior
      Originally Posted by Daniel Scott View Post


      A marketer I know went from doing $20 000 a month to doing $1 500 a month when the recession started. He didn't change his traffic level, website, or promotions.

      This is a real problem and needs to be looked at. Not dismissed.


      Wheres Sherlock Holmes and the CSI forensic team when you need them. :-)

      I wonder if this is maybe a wake-up call......if one is a business starter, either sooner or later create Recession/Depression proof income streams/niches for some level of insurance, back-up, a "batten down the hatches" in one's arsenal, for continued financial solvency.

      What have people been proven to buy when times are bad, but since they did not have the internet in '29, strategies or what worked then from '29 to the 70's may be theoretical only.

      Certain Mail-Order principles may still apply.

      But this is a unique time, despite what smoke any President or Congress, lawmakers may say, hope based on fantasy,Santa Claus , wishing wells, elves is simply dopey.

      Why is it such a unique time?

      Among the cheif reasons, how are you going to have jobs, when the U.S. doesn't make products and is making less as the day goes on?

      Or if there is a new U.S. industry, it will soon be outsourced to China, so how do you compete against slave labor?

      In order to have jobs, like ANY market , you have to either make or sale stuff to OTHER people who want your stuff, at a competitive price and competitive quality...so what, I ask you, since we in the U.S. is making less and less, is the U.S. economy and GNP going to stimulate jobs and Income "INTO" the U.S. by being a "sales Affiliate" of China, Mexico and any other industrial slave labor country producing products as good and much cheaper the us?

      For INCOME <<<< INTO >>>> the U.S., to swell the GNP, you gotta sell stuff to other countries, so why would they buy from us, when we are making less, higher prices, less quality(toyota/Honda vs Ford-Chevy), more and more Outsourcing, and simply being an AFFILIATE salesman of China and others...Wal-Mart, MegaOmni-Affiliate God.

      HELL, WE are NOT BUYING OUR OWN STUFF, HELLOOOOOOOOO...

      "Job creation".....?, ...please......

      Why would anyone need to buy thru an affiliate if I got the funds to buy bulk and deal DIRECT with the factory(China), cutting out all middleman, wholesalers, etc.,especially since its cheaper that way, hence, more jobs gone.

      And if I got my own shippers, the other shippers are out of a job.

      Politicians will NOT go against their corporate buddies/twins.

      These guys are sick, still eating lobster in a famine, greed knows no boundaries or shame, especially if one has been doing that all their life, thats how they make their living, off taxpayers back.

      And what are they teaching in grade school, colleges and business schools to deal with the realities of the 21st century and beyond..? Answer: not a Go****n thing, when they come out a can't find a job or the industry they studied just evaporated, a lot of pissed off students with loans they can't pay back.

      Especially when they are going to compete for the same menial jobs that their parents and maybe even grandparents are going to need to survive.

      How hilarious is that?

      Politicians empty speeches, injecting false pride to the crowd based on what?

      Yesteryears strategies won't work much today, new ones have to be formed.., form a strategy based on not having producers or manufacturers in the equation.

      "Bounce back"...,bounce on what..? How do you bounce off a hole, that gets deeper? Even Kobe needs a solid floor to launch from to have a chance at the basket.

      Whose even more sick than the con-men politicians is the people that believe, show up, listen to them, and cheer based on hopeful wishing and emotion, not on real world realities and practices that MUST be implemented and work to face todays and tomorrow issues and realities....we are like children sitting on a fake Santa Claus who represents a Fake, asking for what we want for Christmas, jesus christ, man.....

      Some hard realities and necessities people are not going to do or like:

      1) More protectionism of products,

      2) Equal trade, we are buying equitable to what you buy from us

      3) Cutting government by 50%-75%, eliminating use-less departments..., a department should be created on a task force bases with no additional money, solve the problem or put others on the temporary task force to solve the problem, if you can't solve the problem in a timely reasonable fashion, you probably should be immediately fired with no more of a guarantee of pension or benefits than any other citizen.

      4) Repeal the IRS, state should only solicit for projects that everyone needs, like when you get an estimate for re-piping your house, only pay the estimate, and only when it can be completed in the time alloted. Less taxes, more money to spend, more cash flow, don't need a degree from Harvard to know that.

      5) Reward loyal business and manufacturers who buy U.S. goods and parts, stay in the U.S., employ U.S. workers, penalize heavily anyone who moves out and try to sell their stuff back to the states.

      6) Eliminate dependence on Foreign Banks, International Banks, and The Federal Reserve, it is no excuse or reason to be in debt to anyone.

      7) Corrupt politicians should lose their pension and benefits, be sued/repossed personally for what they cost taxpayer , do them like the IRS do us, confinscate thier stuff 1st, then, let them prove their innocence to get it back...,also, and/or be imprisoned under Federal law, no provisions, the higher the power and trust, the harder the sentence.

      8) Reward inventors and problem solvers--they need not have reputation or know someone, if a professor has a solution over what a political department or task force cannot solve, that citizen should be heard and amply rewarded. Any politician showing favor or nepitism, when a citizen has THE solution, that politician should lose his job, benefits, and fined like an IRS audit.

      9) Govt. departments should be only in a small monitoring or as needed case, not careers, for if it is a career, then the wrong people are employed to solve the problem.

      10) Education based on reality, skills that meet todays and tomorrows challenges, not expired , evaporated philosophy thats 70 years behind.

      11) Serious penaltys for fraud, whether its a corporation, political or individual, a punishment that will deter enough people, corporations should be confinscated, restructed and sold to the public for the good. Do these folks like you do terroist, drug cartels and mafias.

      This will never happen cause theres money to be made amongst this chaos, corruption and confusion, thats how leaders get to be mult-millionaires to a job that only pays $96,000 or more.

      When it gets worse, States are going to seriously start seceding from the union because they are giving up taxes , getting into a deficit and not getting anything equitable in return from the Federal Gov., essentially going broke feeding and fattening someone else along with corruption and mis-management of funds, like a person with no job or income STILL trying to live the high life, buying ferrari's, giving away money to friends, eating $800 plate dinners, giving tax money and projects to their friends, when the gov. continues in this vein, then the stuffs going to hit the fan.

      The 13 th Warrior
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[574250].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Stallion
      Originally Posted by Daniel Scott View Post

      Stallion,

      A marketer I know went from doing $20 000 a month to doing $1 500 a month when the recession started. He didn't change his traffic level, website, or promotions.

      Still think I'm ignorant?

      Don't forget the growth may be attributed to better marketing, or the fact that Amazon sells LOTS of different stuff - who knows (except Amazon) which products that money came from?

      Maybe you should take a happy pill before you post again. This is a real problem and needs to be looked at. Not dismissed.

      -Dan
      "Still think I'm ignorant?"

      Absolutely. Knowing a marketer doesn't constitute proof because I know plenty of marketers and I'm sure there's a lot of them here on the warrior forum that will attest that their profits have been growing during this economic down turn.

      Amazon is an ONLINE RETAILER. RECORD PROFITS! That means people went online, and bought stuff. Consumers are still the ones living in the economy and they bought.

      You can stick that happy pill up your backside.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[574449].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Lewis Turner
    Banned
    [DELETED]
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[573814].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author rddube
      Hello everyone,

      I use CB as an affiliate and recently just tested out some of my links, because activity had fallen to 0. Have any of you tested your links as if you were a real customer?

      Turns out that when I try to reach the payment screen, IE sends me a message that it can't access that page?? I tried from several computers and for the past 2-3 days, but still can't get to place an order?

      Any suggestions?

      Tks
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[574093].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author jeffm2009
    This is really shady and it looks like it is fairly common. I bet most people don't even notice/realize it's happening to them. Maybe it's just part of doing business with CB...
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[574324].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Daniel Scott
    Stallion,

    Is such an attitude really necessary?

    All I am saying is that your example is completely scientifically invalid. I am sure some things are selling better; some things are not.

    There are plenty of statistics to show that we are in trouble at the moment. I'm happy for Amazon but they are hardly indicative of the whole online market or the whole economy.

    Again, this is a complex situation. Just because Amazon are doing well doesn't mean there isn't a problem.

    -Dan
    Signature

    Always looking for badass direct-response copywriters. PM me if we don't know each other and you're looking for work.

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[574537].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author The 13th Warrior
      Originally Posted by Daniel Scott View Post


      I am sure some things are selling better; some things are not.
      There it is.

      The things that are selling better , and marketers that are marketing those things that they know why they are selling, are drowning in cash.

      Seems like anyone can have a system set for profit in fair times, but which marketers have it set up for bad times or even the worst, for maybe even the long haul?

      Who has that philosophy and practice laced in their various systems of income?

      Is it even possible, or are some surviving based on luck or choice of niche?

      It's like living in a county with a solid history of flooding, but never having any life jackets, rafts, life boats, boats or any other emergency equiptment to deal with the realities of that area.

      The 13 th Warrior
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[574968].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author The 13th Warrior
        If someone came out with a "Don't Let ClickBank Steal Your Money" an insiders method of getting every last penny ClickBank owes you--an instruction manual/seminar/webinar/videos solving most of your ClickBank problems and issues, would probably sale a million in 2 days.....or make Frank Kerns launches look like childsplay.

        Most especially if they got a relationship with CB technical staff, like James Martell, Ken McCarthy and others who are on a roladex for when Google is solicited to drop by as guest speakers.

        Better beat Harvey Segal to it first, though. :-)

        The 13 th Warrior
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[575035].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Davion Wong
    That is not uncommon. I have seen this happening to me. I would think that people are more cautious in their spending habits these days.

    But I do notice that if the niche is a desperate one for example, relationship, it is not as price-sensitive. In other words, people are still spending on those products they feel are necessary. You really have to relook the niche you are promoting in.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[575006].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Lewis Turner
    Banned
    [DELETED]
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[575029].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Fabian Tan
    For some reason, CB hoplinks on my side only show up blank pages...

    Fabian
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[575099].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author daneg33
    I noticed that if I follow through a sales page with my aff id in it (clickbank product), by the time I get to the sales page, the ID is blank!!!
    Signature

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[575236].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Harvey Segal
      Originally Posted by The 13 th Warrior View Post

      If someone came out with a "Don't Let ClickBank Steal Your Money" an insiders method of getting every last penny ClickBank owes you
      Originally Posted by The 13 th Warrior View Post

      Better beat Harvey Segal to it first, though. :-)
      If you mean "Don't Let ClickBank KEEP Your Money"
      then your premonition has come true.

      I have a free book which can help.

      I usually ask people to PM me if they want to know
      as I'm not clear on the forum rules about showing
      a link in the body of a post. Anyone know ?

      OK I'll risk it.


      Free book: ClickBank for Newbies
      http://www.supertips.com/r/cbn.htm

      Harvey
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[575694].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author The 13th Warrior
        Thanks for the book.

        Don't know if Dormant Domains is the answer to these guys query.

        Keep seeing this "ClickBank" problem brought up in forums more and more, don't know if a definative cause, answer and solution is to be had.

        Has this been discussed in "ClickBank only" forums?

        Surely its come up a lot, based on the frequency/history it comes up here in Warrior Forum.

        The 13 th Warrior
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[576783].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author Harvey Segal
          Originally Posted by The 13 th Warrior View Post

          Thanks for the book.

          Don't know if Dormant Domains is the answer to these guys query.
          It was an answer to the question of ClickBank 'keeping' your
          money until your sales meet the Customer Distribution Requirement.

          Harvey
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[576917].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author stevecl
    well, just check my clickbank analytics to see how many hops i had got and it is now showing that i have recieved none. There was some there earlier, and yestersays data has completely disappeared aswell. LOL

    Steve
    Signature

    I started with nothing and still have most of it left!

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[576929].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Wendell
    Originally Posted by Brad Callen View Post

    Why is it that many IMers always think so "negative"? If I had a penny for every time I heard someone say something in the IM community was fishy, was spam, was a scam, was unethical, felt cheated, blah blah... and it actually wasn't at all. I'd be...

    Clickbank has been around for ages. I've personally used Clickbank to sell ALOT of product. I won't give exact numbers, but it's enough to know they're a solid company and are not doing anything "fishy". I'm personally getting very tired of hearing so many IMers thinking the worst of things. My advice is don't waste your time complaining and spend your time marketing and paying attention to things YOU have control of.

    3-4 years ago, our community was nowhere near as negative as it it now. Marketing online, for me, was a heck of a lot more fun then. Most looked for opportunity and expected the best, not the worst. And if you recall, that's when ALOT of the "big name gurus" got started. Call it coincidence, but I think not.

    I think it's time the IM community become alot more positive and uplifting again. Who knows, it might just make the difference in your business.

    Brad
    With all due respect, Brad Callen. It's easy for you to talk. But you are a VIP at CB. You're a protected species, if you will. Clickbank will go out of their way to make damn sure you're happy with their services, as they need your endorsement, precisely for issues such as this. But just because you're making tons of money without any obvious drop in income, that doesn't mean that all our concerns are groundless. The reason why people weren't complaining about this years ago is because years ago this problem was not nearly as endemic as it is now and because people were less internet savvy. And like it or not, there's no smoke without fire. Intelligence should surely tell you that if so many people are so concerned about this, then something surely has to be wrong.

    Besides, you make the bulk of your money selling your own products on CB, not CB affilliate products as an affiliate. It isn't the same.

    And there's just no getting away from it. There is definitely a problem with Clickbank's tracking. I too have had enough experience as a CB affiliate to know.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[577687].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Bruce Hammond
    Really weird, and for most annoying.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[577708].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author JOEWEBHOG
    Hello Warriors;
    I am looking for a good copywriter/ghostwriter with good english grammar. I have projects daily and need some reliable people. I need ebooks and articles. Please send prices for both and your email address. I have been a member of WF since 11/07 but have not used it much in the past and I am restricted until I make a certain amount of posts... I can't even reply via PM... ~~~
    You can also contact me directly at joewebhog1ATgmail.com.
    Thanks!
    JoeWebHog
    Signature

    Patrick Gomulka (aka JoeWebHog)
    WestCoastWebSolutions.com

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[578144].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Daniel Scott
      Originally Posted by JOEWEBHOG View Post

      Hello Warriors;
      I am looking for a good copywriter/ghostwriter with good english grammar. I have projects daily and need some reliable people. I need ebooks and articles. Please send prices for both and your email address. I have been a member of WF since 11/07 but have not used it much in the past and I am restricted until I make a certain amount of posts... I can't even reply via PM... ~~~
      You can also contact me directly at joewebhog1ATgmail.com.
      Thanks!
      JoeWebHog
      Make a new thread dude. This is a discussion on Clickbank.

      Man, some people.
      Signature

      Always looking for badass direct-response copywriters. PM me if we don't know each other and you're looking for work.

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[578148].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author terryd
        Originally Posted by Daniel Scott View Post

        Make a new thread dude. This is a discussion on Clickbank.

        Man, some people.
        Agreed.........can you give infractions for that crap?
        Signature

        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[578170].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author Janet Sawyer
          Originally Posted by terryd View Post

          Agreed.........can you give infractions for that crap?

          Yep, you sure can just hit the "fart" button..... infraction cards! state your reason and it will be dealt with.

          And now folks! returning you back to the main post.......
          Clickbank - I smell something Fishy.........
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[578286].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Kiwigal
    Thanks for the free info Harvey much appreciated.
    I think JOEWEBHOG is totally disorientated..huh
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[578210].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author JOEWEBHOG
    Relax guys... I am just trying to get through the silly restrictions so I can communicate with a few warriors in the WSO. How about cutting me some slack...
    Thanks!
    Signature

    Patrick Gomulka (aka JoeWebHog)
    WestCoastWebSolutions.com

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[578231].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author terryd
      Originally Posted by JOEWEBHOG View Post

      Relax guys... I am just trying to get through the silly restrictions so I can communicate with a few warriors in the WSO. How about cutting me some slack...
      Thanks!
      If everyone ignored the "silly restrictions" then we would end up with lots of idiots posting useless threads...........how about reading the rules??
      Signature

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[578243].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Pheobe
        Very interesting reading. I was having the same problem, same traffic/hops for each product, no sales for 6 days. Normal consistent conversion rate 1:65.- 1-100 depending on product.

        I opened a new account changed all my links and had immediate sales for all products back to normal for three days and then stopped completely for the past 4 days.

        Something is very wrong!!
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[578312].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Wendell
    Something has to be done so that CB takes this whole thing seriously. Their lack of response is deafening. Yet they cannot afford to ignore this.

    Every seasoned affiliate comes to the Warrior forum to keep themselves informed. They can't miss what's been said in this and on numerous other threads that have addressed the same issue. And the consensus among the CB affiliates who have posted here is that there is something clearly wrong with CB's tracking process.

    So they ignore this whole issue at their own peril. The explosion of CPA networks is already threatening to relegate them to history. They either shape up or die.

    Why doesn't someone from their management team come here -- the premier IM site on the internet bar none --, if only to reassure us that they're working on the issue?

    But their silence tells me everything. It tells me that they're not here because if they were, they would grudgingly have to admit (assuming they were on the level) that they do have a problem and legal eagles everywhere would be flexing their muscles, if indeed they are not already doing so.

    Even so, it's time for CB to act. They must get their house in order or they risk increasingly becoming irrelevant. Lack of strong competition in the past has made them complacent over the years, but their halcyon days have now ended with the advent of new and more creative forms of affiliate marketing.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[578541].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author GeorgR.
    i complained about clickbank for the longest time, i also had my streaks of 5-6 days w/o a sale. But RIGHT NOW i get sales, so i know its working. The last "outage" was back end of last year, as far as i remember.

    In conjunction with my products/WSOs (which mostly deal with clickbank) i do consistant testing using different browsers - but i personally NEVER had it happen that the "affiliateID" is not shown at checkout.

    The affiliateID is even set with higher than norm security settings, thsi with FireFox or IE.

    So, i strongly suspect two things:

    ) You use some antispyware/AV program which block cookies (I know for sure that Kaspersky does NOT)

    ) You promote a "zombie" site - i saw some customers who wanted to promote Clickbank sites, but they did not link to the original vendor page but instead to a "intermediary" site which was NOT the original vendor. And this site stole the commission since it inserted THEIR affiliate link.

    So..if you sell products from clickbank, ALWAYS get the links right of marketplace and dont assume that the sites coming up in google are also always the original vendor pages.
    Signature
    *** Affiliate Site Quick --> The Fastest & Easiest Way to Make Affiliate Sites!<--
    -> VISIT www.1UP-SEO.com *** <- Internet Marketing, SEO Tips, Reviews & More!! ***
    *** HIGH QUALITY CONTENT CREATION +++ Manual Article Spinning (Thread Here) ***
    Content Creation, Blogging, Articles, Converting Sales Copy, Reviews, Ebooks, Rewrites
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[578556].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author yoshiko
    Pheobe, I did the exact same thing you did. And I got the exact same results that you did. 2 sales with the new account and then nothing thereafter..

    This is not right. Fishy is understatement of the century, especially with money and livelihood is at stake.

    CB is playing with fire. CB should know that successful and happy affiliates are the main reason they even exist. Without us affiliates, where is CB?
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[578588].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author jasonl70
    maybe they use some sort of 'rolling blackout' approach... it's been driving me crazy for a while.

    Some of the most respected businesses and ceo's in the world turned out to be crooks - it certainly isn't out of the question that CB isn't isn't on the up-and-up. Not when the entire industry has so many shady people who don't like to pay affiliates.
    Signature

    -Jason

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[578637].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Wendell
    Originally Posted by GeorgR. View Post

    i complained about clickbank for the longest time, i also had my streaks of 5-6 days w/o a sale. But RIGHT NOW i get sales, so i know its working. The last "outage" was back end of last year, as far as i remember.
    Allow me to rearrange that sentence and then tell me again what you think is going on.

    "i also had my streaks of 5-6 days w/o a sale. i complained about clickbank for the longest time. NOW i get sales, so i know its working."

    If you had the problem and complained "for the longest time," then OF COURSE CB will have rectifuied YOUR concerns. If they wean out those who protest loudly, they can continue to screw the rest without losing any sleep.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[578723].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author cgj1981
    Thank you too all for contributing to this thread as reading about terms like cookie stuff, more about link cloacking and affiliate tracking hacking as well as more about ClickBank has certainly made me and am sure a lot of other readers wiser
    Signature

    CJ
    The USA is land of all the Marketing Gurus and the best place to make your Fortune Online.
    For everyone who wants to Live and Work in the US,
    We tell you exactly how to make it happen!

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[578740].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Fabian Tan
    I think the bottom line is: CB need to get their act together.

    Are there times when someone has typed in an affiliate hoplink and see aff=none? Yes.

    Are there many of us complaining of dropped conversions? Yes.

    I have my thoughts about the 'rolling blackout' theory too.

    CB needs to come out with some explanations.

    Fabian
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[582529].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author captivereef
    my sales have rally fallen off, lately as well. I started a new campaign a few weeks back and was making a sale per day for every 80 or so visitors. Now its so sporadic its sad!

    Another product that is seasonal and should sell like crazy right now is not. But it was a few weeks ago???? And its only a $10 product so the price should not be driving people away.

    Also i have almost 5000 hops for a popular IM product and one sale from those hops, seems weird???

    I redirect from my own domains for all the products i promote.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[582605].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author JonathanBoettcher
    Does anyone else wonder why Clickbank's website seems stuck in the 1990's? Might have something to do with why their tracking is goofy - I mean they've got a pretty good thing going on there, but I haven't really seen much change or innovation from them in quite a few years. If they were putting something back into development, improving their product and service, chances are we'd have a far higher quality system by now.

    /2 cents
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[582718].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author yoshiko
    Check this thread out guys. Someone is finally taking up the issues with CB big time. This other thread http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...clickbank.html

    While I hope something can be done at CB, I don't hope to see the demise of the biz. It would be a pity as it does have top notch, best affiliate products in almost all categories. The best part is that the payment management system (before all these issues happened) is pretty efficient for both affiliates and vendors.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[582805].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Baystreet
      Are the problems limited to being an affiliate and not getting credit for sales?

      Or does this affect the owners of the products as well? Are customers paying for and downloading their products but Clickbank is not giving credit for the sales to the product owners?
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[582818].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author captivereef
    if i open a new CB account can i use my same name and information? Will anything happen to the $700 i have in my current account?
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[582865].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Hamida Harland
      Originally Posted by captivereef View Post

      if i open a new CB account can i use my same name and information? Will anything happen to the $700 i have in my current account?
      I use the same name and information for a number of CB accounts - all get paid into the same bank account as well so your $700 will be fine.
      Signature
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[582873].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author LB
      Originally Posted by captivereef View Post

      if i open a new CB account can i use my same name and information? Will anything happen to the $700 i have in my current account?
      You can have as many CB accounts as you like. Funds are tied to the account where they were first credited and cannot be transferred. Multiple accounts just means multiple checks.
      Signature
      Tired of Article Marketing, Backlink Spamming and Other Crusty Old Traffic Methods?

      Click Here.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[582874].message }}
  • {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[582889].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author The 13th Warrior
      Originally Posted by Fabian Tan View Post


      I just found a related post on Harvey Segal's forum:
      Hey, maybe there's a way for Mr. Segal to become a $100 million-multimillionare+.....

      ....do like PlentyoFish dude, sense you know ClickBank in and out, simply duplicate everything they do and got, except plug all the gaping holes they have in their system.

      Assemble a task force to make it happen, take the best systems of ClickBank, Paydotcom,LinkShare, etc., give affiliates and vendors what they been beggin for....

      ....the way Gates left IBM eating dust wondering what happened...

      ...tryin to make you a Billionaire, don't think you deserve it??? :-)

      C'mon, lets move on it, "The New MicroSoft/Google of Order Processing for Internet Vendors, Marketers and Affiliates......" :-)

      ...somebodys going to do it , soon, especially in an ecomomy that will demand better value for better service, people looking for more bang for their precious buck, lots of people just lookin for the right ship to come along to jump on so they can jump-off the Titanic their currently on.

      The "Titanic" attitude of companies thinking they are the "ONLY" game in town and that you either like it or lump it , is going to evaporate soon as the ecomomy exposes more weaknesses and folks taking a 2nd look at what they have and asking themselves," Do I REALLY need this, is there a better alternative?"

      Quality service at a fair price will always rise to the top, people are going to develop a more definitive definition and clarity for what really is of value.

      Like the title of that new book says, businesses should ask themselves, "What would Google Do?"

      The 13 th Warrior
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[583434].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author captivereef
    thanks i thought so but did not want to shoot myself in the foot!
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[582896].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author ArthurRose
    Banned
    [DELETED]
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[583588].message }}

Trending Topics