aWeber lightboxes - it's all about timing!

22 replies
I thought people knew this, I thought this was very basic stuff, but I have recently been convinced to the contrary on numerous occasions, when visiting other people's sites. People who are involved in Internet marketing. People who should know better. So I thought I would just run this past people again.

I am talking about the famous aWeber lightbox popup webform, the one that's earned us so much money in recent times by automating the lead collection process. You know the one, it pops up in the middle of the screen, fading the rest of the page to black, and cannot be blocked, you can either close it, or enter your email details for whatever mailing list or freebie or other lead collection incentive is on offer. It can be very effective, and pays for itself very quickly.

But why oh why are people still setting the timer for the webform to pop up the instant the page opens?!

You must be crazy!

Do you know what happens when you do that? The visitor is served up an email form before even seeing your site, before engaging with your content, before forming ANY impression that they might have some benefit from you and your service. And do you know what they do?

They swat the pesky fly away, every single time!


I know I do.

This is BASIC stuff, it's in the aWeber docs, for crying out loud! It's lightbox webform 101. The people doing this must have signup rates that are through the floor, or down through the cellar, more like.

You need to experiment and do split testing with timings. Maybe it needs to be 20 seconds, maybe it needs to be 45 seconds - whatever time is necessary for the user to engage with your content.

But the one delay you should NOT set is ZERO SECONDS! Please, stop doing this! I honestly don't care too much about your conversion/signup rate, it's your business!

But you are building lightbox-blindness in the Internet user, and doing ALL of us a disservice.

You know it makes sense...

* Steps down from soapbox whilst retaining sense of dignity *
#aweber #lightboxes #timing
  • Profile picture of the author ZaraK
    I do too. Lock me out of your page immediately and I just move on to the next guy.

    But very few Internet Marketers do customer-centric marketing, from what I can see, both from viewing sites and discussions here on this forum. They are all convinced that the annoying tactics work because they've tested and split-tested and get conversions and it works for Billy Bob who is driving a Ferrari so therefore it must be working.

    What they don't know is how many MORE customers and conversions they might have if their marketing were more customer friendly.

    Irritating customers and prospects is bad marketing, period.
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  • Profile picture of the author mikemcmillan
    <<You need to experiment and do split testing with timings. Maybe it needs to be 20 seconds, maybe it needs to be 45 seconds - whatever time is necessary for the user to engage with your content.>>

    You are right Markowe. I don't see how anyone could argue that fact. It is about testing and I don't think there is a "right" amount of time to set the delay for. It has to be tested on every site.
    Not just for the lightbox type form but for a regular hover-over form the same thing is true. A proper delay can have a huge effect on opt-ins. --Mike
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    • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
      Mike, you're right. The optimal time lag can even change depending on the entry page (home page vs. internal page).

      I used to start testing by looking at the average time spent on the page, and setting the timer for a couple of seconds shy of that. Problem was, that meant letting a lot of people go by without the pop in order to get a decent average.

      I don't use aweber, so I don't know if this is workable with that system. What I want to try next is setting the pop to appear when the visitor scrolls past a certain point on the page.
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  • Profile picture of the author I.M.Retired
    They swat the pesky fly away, every single time!
    That's exactly what I do with the horrid pesky pop-up that appears at the bottom right corner of the Warrior Forum every time I visit. Works like a charm!

    You bring up an excellent point, however, about the aWeber form! I certainly do a fast smack-away on anything that pops up in my face whenever I visit a website.
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  • Profile picture of the author markowe
    Glad it's not just my impression!

    To turn this from a grumble into a piece of advice:

    Try opening your own site (or individual pages, which as someone says might need a different delay) and imagining you are a first-time visitor (or even better, find some guinea-pigs!).

    See how long it takes you to "figure out" what the site is about.

    See how long after that it takes for you to pick up ONE benefit for yourself from the content. If a visitor doesn't benefit from the site content in any way (or doesn't get given time to!), WHY would they be inclined to sign up for the newsletter? Conversely, if they get a useful tidbit from your site, it will drastically increase their inclination to sign up for more.

    Whatever the time you come up with, it certainly isn't going to be zero seconds. 20 seconds is probably too short, as well. You are probably looking at a range 30-40 seconds at least.

    "But they will lose interest and go away in that time!" I hear you cry!

    The fact is, testing has proven beyond doubt that regardless of the niche, longer delay periods generally have a better conversion rate. And if the visitor DOES go away before the lightbox appears, perhaps the site content is not good enough to keep them engaged! Or maybe they just aren't really a good lead, as they may not be interested in your subject matter.

    Whatever the case, trust me, longer is better - try it at least.
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  • Profile picture of the author pippipaw
    Hi, I recently was advided to set up a lightbox to improve my sign ups as I had only gained 11 subscribers out of 150,000 page impressionfrom by having a sign up from in the side bar. I have put the pop up delay at 30 seconds and set it up so it will only appear once every 30 days for visitors.

    However, I have had 1000 impressions since yesterday and I only got 1 subscriber, that a conversion rate of 0.1%. I think that is quite lame.

    Would it be possible to get some advice on what to do from you guys, the site is www [dot] hairygoon [dot] com
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    • Profile picture of the author James Clark
      When I first started made the same mistake. Recently, installed a footer ad. And I set it to pop-up at "100" seconds. Wow! everyday I get opt-ins. Sometimes it just the little things that you do.

      Monday I"m going to reset the lightboxes. Can tell you this. When the footer ad was set at five seconds. Did not get one sign-up. Depending on the niche, you can set it a "200" seconds".

      Like the medical niche. People are nervous anyway when they are reading about their health. Sometimes you have stop and look up words. (LOL)

      My suggestion is to play around with the setting and don't fall in love with your ideas. If they don't work get rid of them, quickly.
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  • Profile picture of the author Neil Morgan
    I have my own modal popup and tested this a while back. I tested every interval from zero to 60 seconds in steps of 5 seconds.

    So which pulled the most subscribers?

    The instant one.

    Test. You might be surprised.

    Cheers,

    Neil
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  • Profile picture of the author Neil Morgan
    On a more general point, I've learned over the years not to base too much on my personal preferences. I could write a book about the times I did that and killed sales and subscriptions.

    Cheers,

    Neil
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  • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
    Banned
    Originally Posted by markowe View Post

    You know it makes sense...
    I do.

    I hate these things anyway, and I'm not really someone you wanted posting in your thread, as I don't normally ever go back again to sites that had one (so you lose me), but even so, I know what you're saying makes perfect sense.

    To set it for 0 seconds is obviously crazy.
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  • Profile picture of the author Neil Morgan
    To set it for 0 seconds is obviously crazy.
    Not always. There are no absolute certainties in this game.

    If I followed this advice I'd be getting less subscribers. It's just a fact that I can't argue with however crazy it seems.

    Cheers,

    Neil
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  • Profile picture of the author Neil Morgan
    If you think about it, you probably can't look at the delay in isolation from the rest of the subscription process.

    Imagine visiting a site and they instantly offered you something free that you really, really wanted. I bet your negative feelings about the instant nature of the popup would be quickly forgotten.

    In other words what you're offering is probably more important that the process and if people are focusing on the process, maybe it's your offer that needs strengthening.

    Cheers,

    Neil
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  • Profile picture of the author Monta
    Originally Posted by markowe View Post

    I thought people knew this, I thought this was very basic stuff, but I have recently been convinced to the contrary on numerous occasions, when visiting other people's sites. People who are involved in Internet marketing. People who should know better. So I thought I would just run this past people again.

    I am talking about the famous aWeber lightbox popup webform, the one that's earned us so much money in recent times by automating the lead collection process. You know the one, it pops up in the middle of the screen, fading the rest of the page to black, and cannot be blocked, you can either close it, or enter your email details for whatever mailing list or freebie or other lead collection incentive is on offer. It can be very effective, and pays for itself very quickly.

    But why oh why are people still setting the timer for the webform to pop up the instant the page opens?!

    You must be crazy!

    Do you know what happens when you do that? The visitor is served up an email form before even seeing your site, before engaging with your content, before forming ANY impression that they might have some benefit from you and your service. And do you know what they do?

    They swat the pesky fly away, every single time!


    I know I do.

    This is BASIC stuff, it's in the aWeber docs, for crying out loud! It's lightbox webform 101. The people doing this must have signup rates that are through the floor, or down through the cellar, more like.

    You need to experiment and do split testing with timings. Maybe it needs to be 20 seconds, maybe it needs to be 45 seconds - whatever time is necessary for the user to engage with your content.

    But the one delay you should NOT set is ZERO SECONDS! Please, stop doing this! I honestly don't care too much about your conversion/signup rate, it's your business!

    But you are building lightbox-blindness in the Internet user, and doing ALL of us a disservice.

    You know it makes sense...

    * Steps down from soapbox whilst retaining sense of dignity *
    You're absolutely right and I have seen this mistake on so many sites, hopefully this advice will help some people.

    Cheers,

    Dave
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    • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
      Originally Posted by Neil Morgan View Post

      If you think about it, you probably can't look at the delay in isolation from the rest of the subscription process.

      Imagine visiting a site and they instantly offered you something free that you really, really wanted. I bet your negative feelings about the instant nature of the popup would be quickly forgotten.

      In other words what you're offering is probably more important that the process and if people are focusing on the process, maybe it's your offer that needs strengthening.

      Cheers,

      Neil
      Neil, this makes sense, and it's really obvious...

      ...after someone says it.

      One of the big arguments against popups in general is that they interrupt the flow in the visitor's mind, causing a disconnect, right?

      And we generally accept that people are coming to our pages for information and solutions, right? At least when they come to pages where the desired outcome is a sale of some kind...

      What happens to that interruption and disconnect when the information/solution offered in the popup aligns perfectly with what the visitor is seeking?

      Now, they have a potential answer staring them in the face without having to read through some web page (and, if it's a traditional sales page, a very long web page). Might they even be glad to see the popup?

      If you can make the match close enough, it sure sounds worth testing to me...
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  • Profile picture of the author Bill Guthrie
    Along these lines, lots of product sights (especially in IM niche), are getting ruthless about the "Wait! Don't Go" redirects when I'm trying to leave their site. I had to battle through 4 of those damn things the other day.

    By the way, any recommendations on that software? I can't wait to bug the crap of people too!

    All best,
    Bill
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  • Profile picture of the author jrichy88
    I'd be interested to know what sort of conversions IMers are getting for optins. A typical squeeze page from experience is around 20%. What about visitors to a blog? and how much does having a lightbox increase your optin conversions by?
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    • Profile picture of the author James Clark
      Originally Posted by jrichy88 View Post

      I'd be interested to know what sort of conversions IMers are getting for optins. A typical squeeze page from experience is around 20%. What about visitors to a blog? and how much does having a lightbox increase your optin conversions by?
      Well, there is a lot of interesting information in the thread. From my perspective all of you are correct. It just a matter of what works for you and your business.

      Based of my experience, people in general buy stuff from IMers because they are famous and everyone knows their name. But, there are tons of people who know how to sell.

      When I was a Sales Manager not one candidate who applied for a sales job could get by me or any other manager in the company if he or she didn't know how to close. But after getting the job something happens to them in the process, and that is why they get fired.

      I have tested it in a number of Blogs and the results are different. But the whole idea is the results you get. Please, I'm not suggesting that where I set mind is the place for everyone.

      IMers are fast thinking, and must be separated from the rest of the people of the world because we are risk takers. We screw up a lot of stuff and that is why we need sales funnels.
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  • Profile picture of the author markowe
    Neil and Bill, I can see how that might work in a very limited number of cases. Of course, test, but it seems certain that many never have. How an instant "get my free ebook" pop-up can convert on an MMO blog is beyond me.

    Re: conversions, my main squeeze form (not a popup) converts at almost 50%. Not too shabby, I reckon!
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  • Profile picture of the author jamesrich1
    I had a site for male enhancement where I had the lightbox pop up immediately and got 25% conversion. How long should I set the timing out?
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  • Profile picture of the author markowe
    I think it must also depend on your traffic - if it is presold then maybe visitors are expecting that offer to pop up, i.e. the popup answers their need immediately. But if I have gone to a site on a Google search, looking for some information, then the irrelevant popup offer is an obstacle to my finding the information I came for and I want to swat the popup as soon as humanly possible. I am thinking primarily of the IM niche, that's why I mentioned well-known IMers, who are presumably marketing to other IMers - I suppose there's no telling in other niches without trying... But if the traffic is THAT presold, then why is the popup even needed, why can't the offer just be on the squeeze page? It's what they came for, right? Maybe conversions would be even better than 25%!
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    • Profile picture of the author Mohammad Afaq
      Well all my tests go against your "opinion" so I guess I will keep doing what I am doing right now. You don't like it, but apparently the people who land on my sites do

      IMHO, I don't think it matters what I think or what you think or what bill gates thinks.

      It all comes down to what my target audience thinks.
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