If You Could Change One THing About Internet Marketing What Would It Be

49 replies
I was talking with a friend of mine last night about this and it ended up being like a two hour conversation, so I thought I'd bring it to the WF where great minds gather.

I am curious to know what you would change about the current internet marketing model/atmosphere?

P.S. we ultimately decided on government and big corporate interference being our main thing.
#change #internet #marketing #thing
  • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
    Banned
    Originally Posted by Thomas Michal View Post

    P.S. we ultimately decided on government
    Yes, I'd like to see more and better enforced regulation of the whole "internet marketing" industry: it might help to weed out more of the scammers and would effectively be a great boost for ethical marketers. I think it may gradually happen, but it always seems to be "too little, too late" and our collective reputation suffers a lot because of that, too.
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    • Profile picture of the author Dave Rodman
      Banned
      I would also hope for less gov't interference. The internet has grown so rapidly because of the lack of regulation. Once gov't gets involved, it just makes doing business that much more expensive. Scammers are gonna scam and you can't protect people from making bad decisions...it's gonna be here or someplace else.

      Look at Internet Poker. I still believe Big Casino was FAR BEHIND online so they had DC politicians regulate the industry so they could catchup/purchase competitors.
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    • Profile picture of the author Kev3l173
      Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

      Yes, I'd like to see more and better enforced regulation of the whole "internet marketing" industry: it might help to weed out more of the scammers and would effectively be a great boost for ethical marketers. I think it may gradually happen, but it always seems to be "too little, too late" and our collective reputation suffers a lot because of that, too.
      yes scammers hurt us. it sucks when someone is searching for something and they get scammed on the first try. it discourages them to try again.
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  • Profile picture of the author AFI
    I would like to to be easier to get traffic!! GRR.
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  • Profile picture of the author Chris Dolan
    Get rid of all those flabby bs claims of Clickbank Sales - I suspect 90% of them are pure lies. I know some big marketers lie and there really is no need. Its just like theft.
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    • Profile picture of the author jtie
      Originally Posted by Chris Egan View Post

      Get rid of all those flabby bs claims of Clickbank Sales - I suspect 90% of them are pure lies. I know some big marketers lie and there really is no need. Its just like theft.
      I definately agree with this one. As a graphic designer it pisses me off how many clickbank screenshots i get asked to edit. But at the end of the day I charge $20 for it and people still wanna pay, it only takes 5 mins :S

      You would really be suprised how many edits i do
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  • Profile picture of the author Marvin Johnston
    I'd like to see society get off the "government is the solution" kick. More often than not, the "solution" is either the problem or it creates another problem. So needless to say, I disagree with Alexa ... for the first time .

    It would be wonderful to see less noise/hype/spam and more content in the IM world. That couldn't help but to eliminate some of the barriers to trust, and that would be a good thing.

    Marvin
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  • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
    The privacy climate, which is just out of freakin' control.

    I have people trying to sell me things who are hiding behind a $30 a month virtual address and WHOIS privacy. They're using a pen name. And they say "well, I don't want to put my family at risk."

    Then, when I order their $7 downloadable ebook, they require my shipping address and phone number. And I just want to say "hey, you know what? You're a jerk."

    Because I don't want some anonymous jackhole to have MY information, either, and in the interest of protecting their family - they've made themselves anonymous. They're no more trustworthy than the random psycho they think is trolling the internet looking for mailing lists to join. They have no real accountability.

    And as far as I'm concerned, if you want to be anonymous, you don't get to run a business. In the offline world, this has been established from day one, and there are all kinds of laws that make damn sure your business can be tracked down and sued if you misbehave. If you're not going to put yourself on the line the same way an offline business does, you don't get to ask your customers for that level of information, either.
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    • Profile picture of the author Thomas Michal
      Originally Posted by CDarklock View Post

      .

      And as far as I'm concerned, if you want to be anonymous, you don't get to run a business.
      I couldn't agree more with this, If you can't openly represent yourself in business you probably aren't up to anything good, or are a debt collector.
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  • Profile picture of the author Bill Farnham
    Originally Posted by Thomas Michal View Post

    I am curious to know what you would change about the current internet marketing model/atmosphere?
    The attitude of newcomers who think this is an anything goes get rich quick scheme.

    They come, they buy product after product, complain and moan, apply almost nothing of what they've paid money for, and then they're gone leaving nothing behind them other than wasted time on the part of those who tried to help them. Except the money they wasted.

    Here's the deal...if you don't understand that the lowliest of phrases, "Do you want fries with that?" is an upsell, you don't belong in the IM community.

    ~Bill
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    • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
      Originally Posted by Bill Farnham View Post

      Here's the deal...if you don't understand that the lowliest of phrases, "Do you want fries with that?" is an upsell, you don't belong in the IM community.
      Technically, "Do you want fries with that?" is a cross-sell. "Would you like to super-size that?" is an upsell.
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      "The Golden Town is the Golden Town no longer. They have sold their pillars for brass and their temples for money, they have made coins out of their golden doors. It is become a dark town full of trouble, there is no ease in its streets, beauty has left it and the old songs are gone." - Lord Dunsany, The Messengers
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      • Profile picture of the author Bill Farnham
        Originally Posted by CDarklock View Post

        Technically, "Do you want fries with that?" is a cross-sell. "Would you like to super-size that?" is an upsell.
        LOL. If your order goes from $3.00 for a hamburger to $4.50 for a hamburger and fries technically it's an upsell.

        Here's what I'm waiting for...

        I go to the counter to place my order, and as soon as the clerk tells me the price I say "No thanks" and turn to walk towards the door where I'm greeted by another clerk who asks me if I want the same order for half price.

        Of course I'll say "No thanks" again, as another clerk will be waiting outside by my car to give me an additional 50% off if I buy at that time...

        ~Bill
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        • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
          Two things...

          1. All cheats, liars, scammers, crooks and other assorted ne'er-do-wells should be given a swift, fair trial and then shot.

          2. Change the general attitude from entitlement to contribution.
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  • Profile picture of the author 82ana
    If there isn't enough red tape with the likes of Google and others.
    Govt.s are kinda useless and same goes for big corporations. I'm not jaded, this is the reality.

    We do however need a sort of society or union that represents us and solves our disputes when we have some, sort of an internet police. Content piracy is a huge pain in the *** and so are these BS "info" products not jut for IMers but everyone that surfs the net.
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    • Profile picture of the author Kay King
      I am shocked that people want govt interference/regulation and this statement blew me away

      society or union that represents us and solves our disputes when we have some
      If you are working for yourself - why do you need an entity or a group to protect you? This is an employee mindset. You don't need a big daddy enforcer - you need cajones:p

      If I could change one thing about IM - it would be to create a barrier to entry. There would have to be some level of knowledge/common sense/achievement reached in order to become an IMer. New marketers would be in apprentice mode until they proved themselves.

      Clearly, only a theoretical solution as it's not possible. I think only about 10% of those who steal your products or whatever do it intentionally. The other 90% are too lazy, too greedy or too stupid to know better.

      IM isn't like other lines of work. Although it's referred to by marketers as a "profession" - there is no entry requirement. Age, knowledge, education, experience, training, language skills - there is no barrier to entry to become an "IM professional".

      There are people posting advice and critiques here who have never built a website. There are those claiming earning huge $$$ amounts quickly is possible who have never earned $10 themselves.

      It's an odd "profession" and the way to handle it is to keep your business on a higher level and deal with those who do the same. Cream rises to the top - dirt settles to the bottom. It's the way of things....

      kay
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      • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
        Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

        If I could change one thing about IM - it would be to create a barrier to entry.
        Given that you don't want a trade union or watchdog agency involved with IM, exactly how do you expect to define and enforce that barrier?

        There are already several barriers to entry which are being ignored or skirted by most IMers. Most IMers don't get the licenses, file the tax forms, declare business activities, expose valid contact information, or meet legal disclosure obligations.

        But unless someone is checking these things who has the power to enforce them, there's no reason to do them.

        Cop didn't see it, I didn't do it.

        And the central factor of checking and enforcing these things is valid and correct contact information. Without that, none of the rest matters. If you can fire up a business as Joe Spitzelschmidt from West Butthole, Iowa no matter who or where you really are... well, you can't require or enforce anything.
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        "The Golden Town is the Golden Town no longer. They have sold their pillars for brass and their temples for money, they have made coins out of their golden doors. It is become a dark town full of trouble, there is no ease in its streets, beauty has left it and the old songs are gone." - Lord Dunsany, The Messengers
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        • Profile picture of the author Dave Rodman
          Banned
          Originally Posted by CDarklock View Post

          Given that you don't want a trade union or watchdog agency involved with IM, exactly how do you expect to define and enforce that barrier?

          There are already several barriers to entry which are being ignored or skirted by most IMers. Most IMers don't get the licenses, file the tax forms, declare business activities, expose valid contact information, or meet legal disclosure obligations.

          But unless someone is checking these things who has the power to enforce them, there's no reason to do them.

          Cop didn't see it, I didn't do it.

          And the central factor of checking and enforcing these things is valid and correct contact information. Without that, none of the rest matters. If you can fire up a business as Joe Spitzelschmidt from West Butthole, Iowa no matter who or where you really are... well, you can't require or enforce anything.
          Well, she put a disclaimer that it's only theoretical since it couldn't be done.

          But besides, those ones you named aren't really what I would consider a significant barrier. Not compared to any other business you want to start.
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          • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
            Originally Posted by Dave Rodman View Post

            But besides, those ones you named aren't really what I would consider a significant barrier. Not compared to any other business you want to start.
            They're significant enough for the overwhelming majority of IMers not to do them. If we actually made it possible for governments to track and identify those people who don't do them, that majority of IMers would either do them (not a huge deal) or quit IM (yay, fewer no-action losers).

            I pay $60 annually for my business licensing. That's less than half my monthly web hosting bill. If you can't justify that kind of expense for your business, you don't really have a business in the first place.
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            "The Golden Town is the Golden Town no longer. They have sold their pillars for brass and their temples for money, they have made coins out of their golden doors. It is become a dark town full of trouble, there is no ease in its streets, beauty has left it and the old songs are gone." - Lord Dunsany, The Messengers
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            • Profile picture of the author Dave Rodman
              Banned
              Originally Posted by CDarklock View Post

              They're significant enough for the overwhelming majority of IMers not to do them. If we actually made it possible for governments to track and identify those people who don't do them, that majority of IMers would either do them (not a huge deal) or quit IM (yay, fewer no-action losers).

              I pay $60 annually for my business licensing. That's less than half my monthly web hosting bill. If you can't justify that kind of expense for your business, you don't really have a business in the first place.
              Well most IM'ers that are starting out wouldn't even meet the IRS definition of a business, so you can make the argument that it's just a hobby.
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              • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
                Originally Posted by Dave Rodman View Post

                Well most IM'ers that are starting out wouldn't even meet the IRS definition of a business
                I seriously doubt that.

                "Trade or Business" Defined -

                The term trade or business generally includes any activity carried on for the production of income from selling goods or performing services.
                If you're not carrying on any activity for the production of income from selling goods or performing services, I'd say you're not an IMer at all.
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                "The Golden Town is the Golden Town no longer. They have sold their pillars for brass and their temples for money, they have made coins out of their golden doors. It is become a dark town full of trouble, there is no ease in its streets, beauty has left it and the old songs are gone." - Lord Dunsany, The Messengers
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                • Profile picture of the author Dave Rodman
                  Banned
                  Originally Posted by CDarklock View Post

                  I seriously doubt that.

                  "Trade or Business" Defined -

                  If you're not carrying on any activity for the production of income from selling goods or performing services, I'd say you're not an IMer at all.
                  Business or Hobby? Answer Has Implications for Deductions

                  I'm not even sure what point you're trying to prove. If you buy/sell baseball cards, you're basically carrying out the same activity whether or not you do it for a business or hobby. If you've got a full-time job, you're not making much money, and you haven't taken the loss against other income....I would have a hard time believing someone would be able to prove you're operating a business.

                  And that's how most IM businesses start. Once they start making more than hobby money, they start to get their ducks in a row.

                  But either way, a $60 business license is not a big barrier to entry.
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                  • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
                    Originally Posted by Dave Rodman View Post

                    I would have a hard time believing someone would be able to prove you're operating a business.
                    If you think it matters whether something can be proven, what you are actually saying is that it is okay to lie as long as you can get away with it.

                    I don't believe that, and in general, I don't like people who do.
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                    "The Golden Town is the Golden Town no longer. They have sold their pillars for brass and their temples for money, they have made coins out of their golden doors. It is become a dark town full of trouble, there is no ease in its streets, beauty has left it and the old songs are gone." - Lord Dunsany, The Messengers
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                    • Profile picture of the author Dave Rodman
                      Banned
                      Originally Posted by CDarklock View Post

                      If you think it matters whether something can be proven, what you are actually saying is that it is okay to lie as long as you can get away with it.

                      I don't believe that, and in general, I don't like people who do.
                      You can't say whether or not something is a hobby or business if you a) Don't know the state/local laws in which they reside b) Don't know anything about their business/hobby

                      So in other words, you have no clue what paperwork is required for someone to legally operate as a business.
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                      • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
                        Originally Posted by Dave Rodman View Post

                        You can't say whether or not something is a hobby or business
                        But I can say that honest people tend to say "that's not true" instead of "you can't prove that."

                        Which doesn't prove anything, of course.

                        Might not mean anything at all.

                        Just my opinion.
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                        "The Golden Town is the Golden Town no longer. They have sold their pillars for brass and their temples for money, they have made coins out of their golden doors. It is become a dark town full of trouble, there is no ease in its streets, beauty has left it and the old songs are gone." - Lord Dunsany, The Messengers
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                        • Profile picture of the author Dave Rodman
                          Banned
                          Originally Posted by CDarklock View Post

                          But I can say that honest people tend to say "that's not true" instead of "you can't prove that."

                          Which doesn't prove anything, of course.

                          Might not mean anything at all.

                          Just my opinion.
                          The premise of your argument is that the person knows they have a business AND knows they are required to file paperwork. That's on top of your assumptions that they ARE REQUIRED to file paperwork, not knowing where they are operating out of.

                          I simply stated that most people that don't file paperwork likely didn't even know they were supposed to. And if you audit most people's businesses after the fact, they wouldn't even look like a business. They would look like a hobby.
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  • Profile picture of the author ryanbiddulph
    Nothing.

    I embrace thing as they are. Might not be happy about it, but it is what it is and I roll with it.

    RB
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  • Profile picture of the author Michael Oksa
    I would change the attitude of everybody who assumes ALL ineternet marketers are scammers. The VAST majority of us are honest, hard-working people trying to feed our families.

    Furthermore, I would instantly ban everybody from the WF that thinks that way. I mean, you do understand this IS an IM forum, right?

    All the best,
    Michael
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    • Profile picture of the author Dave Rodman
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Michael Oksa View Post

      I would change the attitude of everybody who assumes ALL ineternet marketers are scammers. The VAST majority of us are honest, hard-working people trying to feed our families.

      Furthermore, I would instantly ban everybody from the WF that thinks that way. I mean, you do understand this IS an IM forum, right?

      All the best,
      Michael
      Just from anecdotal evidence, I don't think most people view IM'ers as scammers. I think they view them as salespeople who want to sell you something. Kind of like a car dealer. Outside of the dealership, most salesman are just normal people. But inside the dealership, you have to keep them on their toes or else you'll get taken advantage of.
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    • Profile picture of the author paulie888
      Originally Posted by Michael Oksa View Post

      I would change the attitude of everybody who assumes ALL ineternet marketers are scammers. The VAST majority of us are honest, hard-working people trying to feed our families.

      Furthermore, I would instantly ban everybody from the WF that thinks that way. I mean, you do understand this IS an IM forum, right?

      All the best,
      Michael
      This would be a truly welcome change, and I can't wait for the day when the general public reverses its more or less blanket opinion about internet marketers.

      I still cringe today when I see friends (with no interest or knowledge of IM) browse the internet, come across some scammy looking site with Ferraris and mansions, and remark automatically without even thinking that "these are all scams." It is sites like these that have been primarily responsible for giving internet marketers a bad name, in my opinion.

      I get a little sick when I think about how extensively they're advertised over the internet via banner ads, even on popular sites like Yahoo and other mainstream ones. I wish there was a way to change this quickly, but I'm not naive enough to think that this phenomenon can be completely eradicated.

      Paul
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  • Profile picture of the author Thomas Michal
    When I said government and big corporate interference... I meant we decided that they are a problem not a solution.

    sorry about that.

    Although I do think there should be some transparency.

    Oh and I also think the U.S. government needs to realize the "internet" isn't America
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  • Profile picture of the author jasonmorgan
    I am shocked that people want govt interference/regulation and this statement blew me away
    Well, when you have individuals making claims that are false unfortunately you need some level of regulation. This ties into what you mentioned as changes you'd like to see. You're asking for regulation (a barrier) but not mentioning government as being the regulatory body.

    back on track...

    Some sort of magical way to limit people and businesses to only being able to own a single web site. Magical Merlin sauce keeps it all in check so nobody can cheat.

    I think it would be cool if you only had one shot at a web site... what would you do wit it?
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    • Profile picture of the author Thomas Michal
      Originally Posted by jasonmorgan View Post

      I think it would be cool if you only had one shot at a web site... what would you do wit it?
      I currently own 30 domains 11 which are active sites I would have no idea what I'd do if I could only have one site. Actually I'd probably just come up with a slightly above average idea that has a remotely addicting concept and mass market it to typical stereotypes worldwide .
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  • You know, I don't think I'd change a thing because
    it provides such a huge opportunity for all of us
    to be successful.

    On a personal note, the one thing I'd WOULD change
    for myself is that I would have started much earlier.

    I would have paid attention, bought stock, listened,
    learned and jumped in when it all began...

    "If only I knew then what I know now."
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    • Profile picture of the author Stella241
      I remember starting affiliate marketing in 2006. It was relatively easy then to make money with Adwords and Clickbank. I made money promoting a Clickbank product called DataEntry Bank. It showed you how to make money with Adwords. I made money in my sleep. Clickbank pulled DataEntry BAnk from their productline.

      Fast forward to 2010 and now when there is an ebook on affiliate marketing, it's so much harder to implement. I've hardly made a cent since 2006. You know, the odd $200 here and there but that's about it. Where am I going wrong? Is it harder to make money online or am I just thick?
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      • Profile picture of the author Thomas Michal
        Originally Posted by Stella241 View Post

        I remember starting affiliate marketing in 2006. It was relatively easy then to make money with Adwords and Clickbank. I made money promoting a Clickbank product called DataEntry Bank. It showed you how to make money with Adwords. I made money in my sleep. Clickbank pulled DataEntry BAnk from their productline.

        Fast forward to 2010 and now when there is an ebook on affiliate marketing, it's so much harder to implement. I've hardly made a cent since 2006. You know, the odd $200 here and there but that's about it. Where am I going wrong? Is it harder to make money online or am I just thick?
        Well like everything in evolution only the strong survive, you must adapt and change. Have you updated the way you market? or have you not stayed up with current trends in marketing?

        I didn't get in to IM until 08' and I can easily say I market products almost completely different than I did then. I couldn't even imagine how much change has happened since 06'
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  • Profile picture of the author Titanphil
    I wish people would be honest and just say that IM takes hard work and studying the system. Everything you read always says that it is so easy to do everything. It takes time to learn. Thats what they forget to mention.
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  • Profile picture of the author jasonmorgan
    I would change the attitude of everybody who assumes ALL ineternet marketers are scammers.
    maybe you missed this post...

    As a graphic designer it pisses me off how many clickbank screenshots i get asked to edit. But at the end of the day I charge $20 for it and people still wanna pay, it only takes 5 mins :S
    Let's not play coy, we both know many of the IM claims made here are bogus. This is not a forum packed with thousands of IM millionaires.

    If it's happening here it's happening all over the interwebz. That is why people think internet marketers are scammers.
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    • Profile picture of the author Dave Rodman
      Banned
      Originally Posted by jasonmorgan View Post

      maybe you missed this post...



      Let's not play coy, we both know many of the IM claims made here are bogus. This is not a forum packed with thousands of IM millionaires.

      If it's happening here it's happening all over the interwebz. That is why people think internet marketers are scammers.
      I concur. There's not as much full-blown scamming going on as there is "Posturing". For example, I sell physical products and use Amazon as a channel for doing that. I could set myself up as a Amazon expert by showing the $35K deposited into my account. Most people would assume that I did it by affiliate marketing and not selling my own product.
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    • Profile picture of the author Michael Oksa
      Originally Posted by jasonmorgan View Post

      maybe you missed this post...



      Let's not play coy, we both know many of the IM claims made here are bogus. This is not a forum packed with thousands of IM millionaires.

      If it's happening here it's happening all over the interwebz. That is why people think internet marketers are scammers.
      Maybe YOU missed the word ALL. So, don't YOU play 'coy'. I know you know better, and you have your reasons.
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    • Profile picture of the author Kay King
      Given that you don't want a trade union or watchdog agency involved with IM, exactly how do you expect to define and enforce that barrier?
      I don't expect to define it - it was a hypothetical answer to a rather broad question. It wasn't a suggestion for action.

      I don't think we need more watchdog agencies than we have already. I earn my living online and I don't want more regulations, more disclaimers, more paperwork.

      There is only one barrier to being an internet marketer: Either you earn money online or you don't. You can support yourself or you can't. You'll have a decent full or part-time income or you won't. Anything else is blah, blah, blah - including my opinions

      kay
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      • Profile picture of the author Dan C. Rinnert
        I'd fix the Internet ATMs. They don't seem to work as advertised. You're supposed to be able to put up a website, go to bed and then wake up the next morning with enough money in your bank account to buy a mansion, a new car and a pretty nifty boat.

        But, instead you wake up and your car is missing from the driveway, there's a notice of foreclosure stapled to your front door and the bank calls to tell you the check you used to order that cool captain's hat has bounced.

        So, I'd fix that.
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  • Profile picture of the author Clubland
    Well, what can i say to this.

    I do not encourage scammers, but i do charge them for my work.

    If you had a skill, and you charge for it. Then whoever asks you, and pays for it. You would still do it, even though you think that it is immoral and wrong.

    I know what they do is wrong, and i think they should be shot. But, if they need your skill set and willing to pay big money, then i would most definately do it.

    But, if you really think about it. There are many jobs out there like that. For example, these terminally ill people who go to Switzerland to die. People pay for that to be done. And does the person who gives them the lethal injection complain, no, just collects the pay check every month.

    I know that is a bit off subject, but really. Everything in this world is either moral or immoral.

    Show me something that hasn't got both. Even religions are the same, and i am not going there. Because that would change this conversation a lot.
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    "Affiliate marketing has made businesses millions and ordinary people millionaires." - Bo Bennett

    "The Internet is the Viagra of big business." - Jack Welch

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  • Profile picture of the author jasonmorgan
    Maybe YOU missed the word ALL. So, don't YOU play 'coy'. I know you know better, and you have your reasons.
    Hey, we are both in the same boat. Perception that a lot of internet marketing is a scam hurts us both.

    So I'll add JohnMcCabe's request to my list.

    All cheats, liars, scammers, crooks and other assorted ne'er-do-wells should be given a swift, fair trial and then shot
    I think anybody who is running an honest business wants the same thing.
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    I'm all about that bass.

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    • Profile picture of the author Michael Oksa
      Originally Posted by jasonmorgan View Post

      Hey, we are both in the same boat. Perception that a lot of internet marketing is a scam hurts us both.

      So I'll add JohnMcCabe's request to my list.



      I think anybody who is running an honest business wants the same thing.
      I agree 100%.

      I think all the scammers and cheats should be eliminated. However, I didn't want to just repeat what everybody else was saying. So, I approached it from a different angle.

      There will always be people who assume that any time anybody is trying to sell them anything that the seller is somehow trying to scam them. That may be true in some cases, but as long as we were talking about completely hypothetical wishes, that's what I wished for. BUT, that doesn't mean I disagree with the other comments.

      All the best,
      Michael
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      "Ich bin en fuego!"
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  • Profile picture of the author Thomas Michal
    I think another thing I'd like to change is everyone expecting everything to be free.
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  • Profile picture of the author tandren544
    I would have given myself more money to start with hahahahaha
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  • Profile picture of the author jake244
    Originally Posted by Thomas Michal View Post

    I was talking with a friend of mine last night about this and it ended up being like a two hour conversation, so I thought I'd bring it to the WF where great minds gather.

    I am curious to know what you would change about the current internet marketing model/atmosphere?

    P.S. we ultimately decided on government and big corporate interference being our main thing.
    Big government is a huge concern of mine as well.
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