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Is Siber Systems-Roboform shooting itself in the foot?

by tboneman
41 replies
I'm reading all over the net where Siber Systems has dropped its longtime pledge of 'pay for it once, use it for a lifetime' for Roboform. Now, they want a $20 annual renewal fee. That may or may not be true (the annual part). I have personally run into the upgrade fee. When I tried to upgrade RoboForm to use with the new Firefox (v4), no go unless you pay the upgrade fee.

So I'm doing what a lot of people are doing...going back to an older verion of Roboform, which works just fine. In fact, if I never get another update to Roboform I will be perfectly content to run it the way it is.

How some companies can be so stupid. They have the number one product of its kind and they insist on pricing themselves directly into their competition's strong suit. Most other users I've read on the various forums never gave Roboform a thought. It's always been there, always a part of their daily online experience, a product they can't be without, and simply the best password/private info minder out there.

Now, they're starting to look around. They're angry. They feel like they've been lied to. I know I feel that way.

I can empathize with a company being squeezed into doing something to increase its revenue. This isn't the way to do it. Long time customers should continue to get free updates. New customers would have to accept the annual renewal fee, but at least they'd know it going in. And if Jon Leger can get $77 a year for one or more of his programs, as an example, Siber Systems should certainly be able to get $20 a year for Roboform.

But not from longtime customers who were promised never to have to pay for the product again.
#foot #shooting #siber #systemsroboform
  • Profile picture of the author Tired of the Bull
    I couldn't agree more. This is the third time I've purchased software with the promise of "Pay Only Once" or "Free Lifetime Updates" only to have the company change its policy after they have my money. I've been waiting patiently for Siber Systems to release a decent version of Roboform for Android (I already own desktop and portable versions) and instead they make this announcement. I actually found this thread while researching alternatives to Roboform so I can start the process of dumping the software that I paid $100 for a "Lifetime" product. If I find a decent App for Android my years as a Roboform user will end.
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  • Profile picture of the author Diane S
    Originally Posted by tboneman View Post

    I'm reading all over the net where Siber Systems has dropped its longtime pledge of 'pay for it once, use it for a lifetime' for Roboform. Now, they want a $20 annual renewal fee. That may or may not be true (the annual part). I have personally run into the upgrade fee. When I tried to upgrade RoboForm to use with the new Firefox (v4), no go unless you pay the upgrade fee.

    So I'm doing what a lot of people are doing...going back to an older verion of Roboform, which works just fine.
    I could not get my current Roboform to work when I upgraded Firefox to version 4. Says right on the sales page of Roboform that previous versions will not work with Firefox 4. How the heck are you getting it to work? I am going back to IE, which allows my Roboform to work, whenever I need to log in somewhere. It is not how I want to do things. Yes, I have learned that 'lifetime' has a 'special' meaning in the world of IM. I think it means 'as long as I feel like it.'
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    • Profile picture of the author tboneman
      If you still have a copy of an earlier version of Roboform, try to install it over top of what you have. It gets tricky because it's probably an add-on to Firefox. I must have 8 or 9 versions that I save just in case something like this happens.

      I did not upgrade, and will not upgrade Firefox, unless or until older versions of RF will work with it. I'm not all that excited about still another Firefox upgrade anyway. 3.6 is good enough for me, at least for now.

      FWIW, when we installed I think it was a version6+ of Roboform and it asked for the registration number, we gave the original number. RF immediately said the number was invalid for the new version but would work on version 3...did we want to install version 3? Bet me we did. It works great.

      I suspect Mozilla is getting a lot of heat about this. Let's see what happens.
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      • Profile picture of the author Diane S
        Originally Posted by tboneman View Post

        If you still have a copy of an earlier version of Roboform, try to install it over top of what you have. It gets tricky because it's probably an add-on to Firefox. I must have 8 or 9 versions that I save just in case something like this happens.

        I did not upgrade, and will not upgrade Firefox, unless or until older versions of RF will work with it. I'm not all that excited about still another Firefox upgrade anyway. 3.6 is good enough for me, at least for now.

        FWIW, when we installed I think it was a version6+ of Roboform and it asked for the registration number, we gave the original number. RF immediately said the number was invalid for the new version but would work on version 3...did we want to install version 3? Bet me we did. It works great.

        I suspect Mozilla is getting a lot of heat about this. Let's see what happens.
        Sounds like what I need to do is go back to Firefox 3.6. Roboform was working well for me on there. Thanks for the info.
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  • Profile picture of the author GarrieWilson
    They should have just stop upgrades w/ the desktop version and do only the anywhere. Or called version 7 something different.
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  • Profile picture of the author Aj Wilson
    I cant remember what Im paying for roboform ...
    but $20 bucks a year or whatever it is ...

    Im more than happy to pay as it's a small price to pay
    for the Convenience and Security RoboForm Offers.

    Overall, 'cant live without it' type thing ...

    but if they up'd it to $XX per month or something
    rediculous ... I'd be pissed.
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    • Profile picture of the author Kay King
      I think xsitepro showed the way to do upgrades. There is a version and upgrades are free for that version - and then when it goes to another version, you pay again.

      Roboform is great and the shot in the foot was not thinking about long term when they started.

      kay
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      • Profile picture of the author Diane S
        Okay, I am back to Firefox 3.6 now and my Roboform is working again. I followed these directions:

        How to Downgrade from Firefox 4 to Firefox 3.6/3.5

        I also followed the instructions for how to use Firefox 3.6 forever....
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        • Profile picture of the author zehron
          Originally Posted by Diane S View Post

          Okay, I am back to Firefox 3.6 now and my Roboform is working again. I followed these directions:

          How to Downgrade from Firefox 4 to Firefox 3.6/3.5

          I also followed the instructions for how to use Firefox 3.6 forever....
          Thanks for the link. I had the same issue with RoboForm on Firefox 4. Following these instructions I'm back on 3.6 and RF works again.

          I think I'll stay with that until I hear they've fixed this issue.

          I came close to paying the upgrade fee. You saved me some bucks.
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        • Profile picture of the author bobby_shahzad
          We have to understand the maintenance costs associated with a software specially when it depends on a browser that updates every year.
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  • Profile picture of the author Brad Swinehart
    Personally, I think the new Roboform does not live up to its expectations anyway. Unless I missed them somewhere, the previous versions had MORE features. I apologize if I missed them. However, I checked every drop down and tab to make sure I did not miss something.

    The new version just seems like it was rushed to capitalize on the new version of Firefox.

    I tried the trial for 10 days after upgrading to Firefox 4 and then I upgraded my Roboform as I always do thinking it was free and had no idea it wasn't until i started reading.


    1. The date(s) my log in is created (I have hundreds of them)
    2. The date that the password was last changed or user name was modified.
    3. The URL of the log in

    All this information was always useful to me. For instance, one of our hosts moved to another server. We kept the same log in information, but the server address changed and I easily found the change when I needed it.

    I am back to Firefox 3. 6 and Roboform 6.10.*

    I certainly am not paying for something that does not even have the features it used to have and some added features that I will never use.

    The doors of opportunity have widened for anyone looking for an opportunity.

    I see more competition coming Robo's way very soon. I am sure someone is drawing it up right now.
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    • Profile picture of the author TeaRowz
      I submitted a support ticket to Roboform on 3/24/11 in which I stated:

      "I own two version 6 Roboform licenses that clearly came with free lifetime upgrades. I cannot upgrade to the latest Firefox 4 browser because my Roboform version won't attach to it. I would need to pay for the upgrade to Roboform 7. As everyone knows, browser upgrades are necessary for Internet security. So in effect, my online security is being risked, and being held hostage by the forced Roboform upgrade."

      "No explanation that I've seen given by RoboForm or by SiberSystems circumvents the fact that there has been a serious breach of the contracts made with owners of previous version licenses. It is neither ethical or honest to go back and change the terms of a license agreement. At the very least, those owners of previous version licenses (including those purchased before 9/1/10) should be 'grandfathered in', and not be charged for any future upgrades."

      "There are those who would like to see a class action lawsuit filed against Roboform. My remedy, if Roboform won't reinstate the free lifetime upgrade policy, will be to ditch Roboform, and instead use LastPass. And I will be sure to voice my opinion of this matter at various influential online venues."

      _____________________________________________

      Roboform's reply:


      "We are sorry, but we cannot convert your license from version 6 to version 7."

      "We can give you one year of RoboForm Everywhere for free."

      "Just go to XXXXXbuy.roboform.com, click Continue to confirm the choice of 1 RoboForm Everywhere 7 license, select USD Paper Check / Money Order payment option."

      "Do not send the check to us, instead inform us and we will activate the order for for free."

      _____________________________________________


      I will not be accepting the "free" Roboform Everywhere 7 license.

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  • Profile picture of the author danemorgan
    I may be the odd man out here. I saw the message and jumpped. I had the desktop version but had been considering the online vrsion anyways because I need it for more devices. This new system works perfectly for my needs and I suspect it is going to be a great model for a lot more people needs going forward.

    That said I do think they should nurse along the single instance version long enough to make it more palatable for people who may not be in that same position yet. Refusing to release an update that is compatible with FF for people who aren't ready to make the jump is a mistake.

    Ultimately I think most people will find the online version more and more attractive as time goes on and i have to say i'm very happy with the change.
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    • Profile picture of the author jwmore
      I, too, contacted RoboForm and got almost the exact same response. I have declined their offer for an upgrade to ver. 7 for a year free. If I accept that offer, I will be agreeing to their "NEW" terms and conditions. I bought RoboForm with a free upgrade stipulation and that is exactly what I want.

      I have been searching around and there is a lot of bad attitudes out there right now toward Siber Systems/RoboForm. I can see a glut of complaints headed their way. I haven't complained to the BBB YET, as I am awaiting a response to my last email to them.

      Jack
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  • Profile picture of the author SocialMediaOwls
    As an owner of a software corporation that has millions of users and adopted the "pay once and have it forever" policy 10 years ago.....you always wonder "How much more could we have made if we had charged per year instead of a one time fee?"

    I don't blame RoboForm, it's worth a try and if it fails, you can always revert back. They have no real competitor out there so it is a risk they can take
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    • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
      The only thing that bugged me was the idea that they nagged me into updating to the newest version without telling me it was a demo, then disabling it and demanding payment. I went back to the previous version instead.

      Had they told me it was a new version and would require a new fee, I might have considered it.

      Now I have the radar going for a suitable replacement. Not a priority, but if I stumble over it...
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      • Profile picture of the author Enfusia
        All companies have to make money. We are all here on this forum to make money. But they should have considered their pricing structure to account for future needs.

        I personally would never do a one off product that I was going to upgrade for life (if I was the seller). What motivation would I have to improve it or support it. Of course I would do it because I had given my word. But I would not be truly motivated to do so.

        If they had said $9.95 a year up front then we would not even be having this conversation and everyone would be ecstatic about RoboForms low price.

        Patrick
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      • Profile picture of the author SocialMediaOwls
        Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe View Post

        The only thing that bugged me was the idea that they nagged me into updating to the newest version without telling me it was a demo, then disabling it and demanding payment. I went back to the previous version instead.

        Had they told me it was a new version and would require a new fee, I might have considered it.

        Now I have the radar going for a suitable replacement. Not a priority, but if I stumble over it...

        True John, it was a bait and switch and that was a nasty trick.....Robo needs a Steve Jobs type nemesis to keep them in check. That was a BS move.
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  • Profile picture of the author GlobalTrader
    If anyone finds a replacement, please post it.

    I purchased two PRO licenses way back in 2004 and their web page still clearly shows "FREE UPGRADES" - see the web archive page from November 2004 -
    Why Buy Pro: Form Filling Software, Password Tool, Password Management, Password Protect

    While I agree with those who have posted everyone needs to make money, they should try to do so honestly. If they are going to change the rules, then grandfather the previous PRO lifetime update licensees and charge the new prices to the new subscribers. There is a little thing known as integrity that seems to be lacking in this instance.
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  • Profile picture of the author Roaddog
    They do have competitors.

    I realize Roboform does more than just store passwords.
    if you would like to check a free alternative that I have been using for a couple of years now...LastPass, for free.

    They have a premium version but I honestly don't know what it does extra, as I have never had the need to upgrade. I think it's 12 bucks a year. ( I have no affiliation whatsoever with them)

    It is worth checking.
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    • Profile picture of the author John M Kane
      Originally Posted by Roaddog View Post

      They do have competitors.

      I realize Roboform does more than just store passwords.
      if you would like to check a free alternative that I have been using for a couple of years now...LastPass, for free.

      They have a premium version but I honestly don't know what it does extra, as I have never had the need to upgrade. I think it's 12 bucks a year. ( I have no affiliation whatsoever with them)

      It is worth checking.
      Yup MyLastPass is $12 and a lot more features if you want to spent the time learning it all.
      no aff https://lastpass.com/
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      • Profile picture of the author JW-Learned
        I was ready to update my Roboform before I searched this forum. Having followed the link to lastpass I am definitely going to give it a try first.

        Thanks to all

        JW-
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  • Profile picture of the author GlobalTrader
    For what it's worth, after posting here yesterday and reading everyone's comments and doing a bit of research on the net I found many other complaints posted with similar remarks about Siber Systems Roboform having recanted on their previously advertised "FREE UPDATES" provision.

    This is to me a clear case of False advertising and rather than post a complaint with the BBB which is worthless since they basically just take membership money from companies to enable them to put their logo on their websites I went to the Federal Trade Commission and have filed a complaint.

    I am posting their link in case anyone else wishes to take 15 minutes and file a complaint with an organization that might get some action on behalf of lifetime "free" update customers of Roboform - here is the FTC's complaint form site - https://www.ftccomplaintassistant.go...d.aspx?Lang=en
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    • Profile picture of the author jwmore
      After a total of 9 emails back and forth, here is the official response and conclusion from RobForm: I've given you your options.

      They started out by offering: You can either continue using RoboForm 6, where the latest version can be downloaded from here - URL Deleted - or I can give you a free year of RoboForm Everywhere 7.

      Then they upped their offer to: I will still offer you a one year license of RoboForm Everywhere, which allows you to use RoboForm on unlimited computers and mobile devices, all while keeping your information in sync. Or I can give you a onetime upgrade to RoboForm 7 Desktop for one computer. There is absolutely no place in our license agreement where we have ever said lifetime upgrades. If you want one of the options above let me know.

      In my response to their final email, I sent them a screenshot of their website from 10/18/2007, which just happens to be the exact day I purchased Roboform and I circled, in red, where it states FREE UPGRADES.

      I will give this one more day, then it's off to the FTC to follow my fellow Warriors in filing a complaint.

      Jack
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    • Profile picture of the author jwmore
      [quote=GlobalTrader;3817928]For what it's worth, after posting here yesterday and reading everyone's comments and doing a bit of research on the net I found many other complaints posted with similar remarks about Siber Systems Roboform having recanted on their previously advertised "FREE UPDATES" provision.

      This is to me a clear case of False advertising and rather than post a complaint with the BBB which is worthless since they basically just take membership money from companies to enable them to put their logo on their websites I went to the Federal Trade Commission and have filed a complaint.

      I am posting their link in case anyone else wishes to take 15 minutes and file a complaint with an organization that might get some action on behalf of lifetime "free" update customers of Roboform - here is the FTC's complaint form site - URL Deleted [end quote=GlobalTrader;3817928]

      Today, I also filed a complaint with the FTC. Maybe now that Bin Laden is off the radar screen, they will get to our complaints in less time than it took them to find Bin Laden.

      This isn't about the $20.00, It's all about honesty, integrity and keeping your word. Win, lose or draw - I'll never do business with Siber Systems / RoboForm again. They can't be trusted!!

      Jack
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  • Profile picture of the author Richard Tunnah
    I changed to lastpass about 6 months ago as lastpass supports my ipad. They also now own xmarks bookmarks (used to be foxmarks). Took a bit of time getting used to lastpass after roboform as it's a little different at first but it works great. And now I;m used to it I think it's easier to use than roboform.

    Rich
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  • Profile picture of the author Chris Worner
    If paying $20 to contribute to the continual maintenance of a software program is too much for you, then you may consider a program called "Last Pass." It is $12 a year, and it is identical to roboform.

    Chris
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  • Profile picture of the author SocialMediaOwls
    Right on, Jack....If you say you are going to offer free updates in the future, you need to stick with that....these clowns think they can slightly alter the product and they say "OH NO, that is new and a different product"

    I hope they learn their lesson on this one
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  • Profile picture of the author Rich77sm
    i dealt with roboform too, it drove me nuts.
    i mostly was dealing with pw's so i moved to lastpass
    thing is great!
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    • Profile picture of the author lcaldwell
      Roboform v.7 was a new Release at the begining of December 2010. If we use the Wayback Machine for Roboform.com and use a date that has been archived 'prior' to release of Roboform v.7 and go to the November 15, 2010 page, go to the bottom and click the link for "License".
      Here we see the following:

      RoboForm License Agreement
      "UPGRADE POLICY: minor fixes and upgrades to RoboForm Desktop Pro shall be provided to Customer for free. However, major upgrades and new releases may require payment and Customer hereby agrees that major releases of RoboForm Desktop Pro may be not free and require payment.
      Major release as defined as release where major version number changes."

      and

      "UPGRADE POLICY: minor fixes and upgrades to RoboForm2Go Pro shall be provided to Customer for free. However, major upgrades and new releases may require payment and Customer hereby agrees that major releases of RoboForm2Go Pro may be not free and require payment.
      Major release as defined as release where major version number changes."

      minor fixes/upgrades would be, and still are FREE:
      v6.03.51 to v6.07.61

      Major Releases would be:
      v6.x to v7.x

      As far as I know each software company on earth reserves the ability/right to update a policy or agreement periodically, time to time or revised.

      And you may have indeed crossed several major versions, however it does state "However, major upgrades and new releases may require payment and Customer hereby agrees that major releases of RoboForm2Go Pro may be not free and require payment."

      Because of the "may require payment" and "may be not free and require payment", I think that makes the policy completely consistent to what you have and are experiencing.

      I honestly don't think it was breach of contract, or bait and switch. No one is required to upgrade to a New Release, nobody is required to signup for the subscription based RF Everywhere, and it doesn't make their product any less fantastic. I still don't know of an app that would provide the same passcard storing and form filling experience.

      Sure, getting it free would have been nice, but it is a company and they do have to pay the bills, and from v6.0.x through v6.9.9 we were provided with FREE fixes and upgrades for the "Lifetime" of the product, v6.x's lifetime development ended with the Release of v7.
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  • Profile picture of the author GetMoreTraffic
    Switch to LastPass...it's ten times better, and it's free!
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    • Profile picture of the author MisterE
      Update 7/1/11: After downgrading to Firefox 4 because of the incompatibility of RF6 and FF5 I have finally regained my RF6 toolbar after Firefox updated itself to 5 without my permission (FF settings I know). As mentioned below in the edit I had no luck in getting the toolbar to work, but, after this update all is well.

      So, what did I do, I had followed CatalogBob's instructions with no luck, other than deleting the RF 7.3.2 addon in FF4 (after following CatalogBob's instructions). The addon for some reason never uninstalled itself, or so it appears, it still say's 7.3.2 but the option to 'Remove' it no longer appears. I have no explanation for this behaviour.

      I am happy once again to have a fully updated FF5.


      EDIT:       With the recent release of Firefox 5 the following instructions will not fix the Roboform Toolbar issue.

      I've spent the last three hours trying everything I could think of to reenable the toolbar function to no avail.

      If you absolutely need Roboform then I would advise you to stick with Firefox 4.0.1 for the time being.

      If I am able to find a solution I will post here with the fix.


      For those of you who can't live without RoboForm (Old Version 6), and want to use it in it's full fledged glory with Firefox 4 here's what i did with the 3 computers in my house.... Yes it does work, and the toolbar will be visible 98% of the time.

      The process is a bit convoluted, and may require you to use all of the steps outlined below.

      1. You will need to download the latest version of FF4 HERE.

      2. Check which version of RF you currently have installed.
      It needs to be version 6.10.2 located HERE.
      This download should include the proper .xpi file for the RF Firefox extension.

      3. Now, in FF4 find the Add-ons Manager and look to see which version of the RoboForm extension is installed. It needs to be version 7.3.0. If it isn't then you can locate the file HERE halfway down the page, look for 'frozen.xpi. Install it.

      4. Now for some of you this will be the last step you need to follow.
      In Firefox Goto: Options > Security and uncheck the box that says 'Remember Passwords For Sites' This must be unchecked for RF to work.

      Close, then restart Firefox... Wait for FF to load fully... If the toolbar hasn't fully appeared then navigate to a site that you have to login to and MANUALLY LOGIN.... Refresh the page, in most cases it should be working just as you remember it.

      If RoboForm still isn't cooperating than I have two additional steps that you can try. Both involve additional extensions for Firefox.

      1. Download, install and restart FF with this add-on first.
      The add-on is called 'Status-4-Evar' and it fixes some of FF4's toolbar problems. If this didn't work, try logging in manually again at a site that requires a login.... Still not working? Then follow the last step.

      2. Download, install and restart FF with this add-on.
      The add-on is called 'Add-on Compatibility Reporter'. This is a great addition to FF if you have other extensions that don't work out of the box with the latest version of Firefox. There's a good chance they will work if the add-on is enabled.
      IMPORTANT!... This add-on requires you to restart Firefox 2 times after the initial install to enable it.

      Well, RF should (I hope) be working for you just as it did with FF 3.6.
      In any event, if it isn't try logging into a site manually again (for some reason this action alone can solve the RF6 problem).

      And I'll say it one more time in case you missed one of the first steps above.... YOU MUST! disable the browsers ability to remember passwords for you.....In FF: Firefox > Options > Options > Security, then uncheck the box.

      As a last resort you can always download LASTPASS. Personally I don't care for it... RoboForm has spoiled me.
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      • Profile picture of the author CatalogBob
        I did this.....

        1. Install Roboform 7.2.7
        2. Copy folder "c:\Program Files\Siber Systems\AI RoboForm\Firefox\" to another location
        3. Uninstall Roboform 7.2.7
        4. Install Roboform 6.10.2 -dont untick option to install adapter for firefox
        5. Replace "c:\Program Files\Siber Systems\AI RoboForm\Firefox\" with your copy from 7.2.7 version
        now you should have working 6.10.2 roboform with latest adapter from 7.2.7

        ......worked for me.

        And it also proves that Siber Systems are lying when they call it a "major upgrade" because it's clearly nothing of the sort. If a simple hack can make the program works with Firefox 4, then it's a simple fix and not a major upgrade.

        They are lying, they are cheats and they should be ashamed of themselves.

        Most of us don't care for version 7, just give us version 6.11 with the fix if they really believe that the new interface in version 7 constitutes a major upgrade.




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  • Profile picture of the author scorpio9
    $20/year? that $1.67/month, most people would consider that chicken feed, I suppose when the current version stop working you would expect them to fix it right? Well how do you think they will continue paying for support, future development, online storage, etc?.

    Lee


    Originally Posted by tboneman View Post

    I'm reading all over the net where Siber Systems has dropped its longtime pledge of 'pay for it once, use it for a lifetime' for Roboform. Now, they want a $20 annual renewal fee. That may or may not be true (the annual part). I have personally run into the upgrade fee. When I tried to upgrade RoboForm to use with the new Firefox (v4), no go unless you pay the upgrade fee.

    So I'm doing what a lot of people are doing...going back to an older verion of Roboform, which works just fine. In fact, if I never get another update to Roboform I will be perfectly content to run it the way it is.

    How some companies can be so stupid. They have the number one product of its kind and they insist on pricing themselves directly into their competition's strong suit. Most other users I've read on the various forums never gave Roboform a thought. It's always been there, always a part of their daily online experience, a product they can't be without, and simply the best password/private info minder out there.

    Now, they're starting to look around. They're angry. They feel like they've been lied to. I know I feel that way.

    I can empathize with a company being squeezed into doing something to increase its revenue. This isn't the way to do it. Long time customers should continue to get free updates. New customers would have to accept the annual renewal fee, but at least they'd know it going in. And if Jon Leger can get $77 a year for one or more of his programs, as an example, Siber Systems should certainly be able to get $20 a year for Roboform.

    But not from longtime customers who were promised never to have to pay for the product again.
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    • Profile picture of the author Troy Broussard
      Originally Posted by scorpio9 View Post

      $20/year? that $1.67/month, most people would consider that chicken feed, I suppose when the current version stop working you would expect them to fix it right? Well how do you think they will continue paying for support, future development, online storage, etc?.

      Lee
      I agree. Being a former programmer I think people's free forever expectations are unrealistic especially for a addin product that has to be continually updated to work with constantly changing browsers...
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  • Profile picture of the author CatalogBob
    Lee and Troy

    You are both missing the point. This company sold their product with "free lifetime upgrades" and now they have changed their terms and payment model and are going back on their word. That isn't right.

    Bear in mind this company also changed the backup process to version 6.10, the last release of version 6 just prior to this upgrade to v7, to make it harder to export information into other services like Lastpass.

    Doesn't that tell you a bit more about what we are dealing with here?
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    • Profile picture of the author Troy Broussard
      Originally Posted by CatalogBob View Post

      Lee and Troy

      You are both missing the point. This company sold their product with "free lifetime upgrades" and now they have changed their terms and payment model and are going back on their word. That isn't right.

      Bear in mind this company also changed the backup process to version 6.10, the last release of version 6 just prior to this upgrade to v7, to make it harder to export information into other services like Lastpass.

      Doesn't that tell you a bit more about what we are dealing with here?
      I'm no expert on the history of what happened here, but my understanding was that the free upgrades were for minor updates, i.e., 6.71 to 6.72, etc... But now they have a major update to version 7 which is not free. That is a very common practice in the industry.

      I don't like it either. I use Roboform personally and have several licenses for several computers so it will cost me quite a bit. But the fact is that I do not believe it is realistic for people to expect free forever updates.
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      • Profile picture of the author GlobalTrader
        Originally Posted by Troy Broussard View Post

        I'm no expert on the history of what happened here, but my understanding was that the free upgrades were for minor updates, i.e., 6.71 to 6.72, etc... But now they have a major update to version 7 which is not free. That is a very common practice in the industry.

        I don't like it either. I use Roboform personally and have several licenses for several computers so it will cost me quite a bit. But the fact is that I do not believe it is realistic for people to expect free forever updates.
        Not to repeat my previous post, but please go see what Roboform's web page stated in 2004 about "FREE UPGRADES" - here is the web archive page from November 2004 -
        http://web.archive.org/web/200411040...m/why-pro.html

        It does not indicate free upgrades for just "minor" adjustments, it clearly states as on their 3 top selling points Free Upgrades. I understand the cost of maintenance and how or why they might have eliminated the negative press by changing their sales page and grandfathering previous customers who purchased licenses and were sold on doing so by the lifetime free updates. This is clearly FALSE advertising pure and simple and it should not be tolerated or condoned either online or offline.
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        • Profile picture of the author Kirk Ward
          Originally Posted by GlobalTrader View Post

          Not to repeat my previous post, but please go see what Roboform's web page stated in 2004 about "FREE UPGRADES" - here is the web archive page from November 2004 -
          Why Buy Pro: Form Filling Software, Password Tool, Password Management, Password Protect

          It does not indicate free upgrades for just "minor" adjustments, it clearly states as on their 3 top selling points Free Upgrades. I understand the cost of maintenance and how or why they might have eliminated the negative press by changing their sales page and grandfathering previous customers who purchased licenses and were sold on doing so by the lifetime free updates. This is clearly FALSE advertising pure and simple and it should not be tolerated or condoned either online or offline.
          The page also references the "Full" license agreement. The license agreement makes no mention of upgrades other than that Roboform will contact Siber Systems once each day to check for upgrades.

          Taken together, it seems to me that Siber promised lifetime upgrades, and that they would check each day to keep the user upgraded.

          I was able to roll back to Version 6 for free and keep operating, but I am still P.O.'d about the surprise I got when I was almost blackmailed into paying. Essentially, they were holding my login data for ransom.
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          • Profile picture of the author CatalogBob
            Yes, that is the problem and that is why so many people are cheesed off about this. Never mind what the site says now about major and minor upgrades, there was a time when "free upgrades" was a big selling point for this company and it had no mention of majors or minors.

            If it did, none of us would be complaining. Point is you can't sell something as a big benefit and then change your mind and your terms and conditions, but if you do, do it retrospectively.

            By the way, someone sent me a private message about the hack to which I cannot reply because I haven't yet made enough posts. So here's what I would've said to the question asking whether my previously mentioned hack would work with Firefox 5....

            I've not tried it, but I am pretty sure it will. Effectively you are using the plug-in from v7 of Roboform and as that works fine in Firefox 5, I'm sure the hack will work.
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  • Profile picture of the author MacS09
    FWIW, I ran into problems with Roboform a couple of years back and switched to the free version LastPass. Have been happy ever since.

    It seems they are also on the ball. Recent unaccountable server activity prompted them to get people to change certain types of master keywords, just in case. Although it was a little bit of a hassle at the time, I for one appreciate that they actively strive not to do a Sony.

    Max
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