39 replies
Kind of frustrating.

You need a list in order to promote products, and you need spare cash to buy solo ads or lots and lots of timeto build your list.

What do you do if you have neither? Your stuck...

I have a product that I know would do well if I had a list to promote to but I don't, and I don't have the time to build the list AND I don't have the extra hundreds of dollars to buy solo ads.

I love IM but it can be very frustrating at times too.

Ok, Rant Finished.
#catch 22
  • Profile picture of the author PetterHedman
    Yes IM can really make You feel frustrated

    Hang in there!
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  • Joanne, I always think of IM as a slow build, not a get rich quick.

    If it's an IM product, then a good way to launch it is with a WSO. You might attract the attention of the right affiliate that way.

    If not, you really have to spend the time to try and attract a joint venture partner. Maybe even let them release the product under their name and take the majority of the income (on the understand that you get the leads).

    There are exceptions, but you're really trying to set yourself up for big success 12 months down the line.

    Thom
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  • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
    Banned
    Originally Posted by Joanne D View Post

    I have a product that I know would do well if I had a list to promote to but I don't
    Then why not simply do a joint venture with someone who does? You supply the product and they supply the relationships with potential buyers which can lead to sales of it?
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  • Profile picture of the author Joanne D
    Just a little clarification - it's not my product, it's a product launch of someone elses product.
    It was too good to pass on but I find that although I am gaining readership daily, it is not growing fast enough to be in time for the actual launch.
    Oh well, it`s been a good learning experience even if nothing else comes of it for this launch...
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    • Profile picture of the author sal64
      Originally Posted by Joanne D View Post

      Just a little clarification - it's not my product, it's a product launch of someone elses product.
      It was too good to pass on but I find that although I am gaining readership daily, it is not growing fast enough to be in time for the actual launch.
      Oh well, it`s been a good learning experience even if nothing else comes of it for this launch...
      So why not go with what you have for now? Some sales are better than no sales. Then reinvest the funds into some targeted paid traffic?
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      • Profile picture of the author Joanne D
        Originally Posted by sal64 View Post

        So why not go with what you have for now? Some sales are better than no sales. Then reinvest the funds into some targeted paid traffic?
        That's what I'm hoping for at this point. Some sales from the few opt-ins or readers that I am getting each day. Thursday and this weekend will be when I find out... crossing my fingers.
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    • Profile picture of the author Trivum
      Originally Posted by Joanne D View Post

      Just a little clarification - it's not my product, it's a product launch of someone elses product.
      There's the rub. You have to bring something to the table. You either have to bring the visitors or the product (or ideally, of course, both).

      No offense, but I can't see any justification for a rant. If you were frustrated that you spent all your time building a product and so didn't have time to build up visitors, that would be understandable. If you were frustrated because you spent all your time building up a list and so didn't have time to build a product, that would be understandable. As it stand, however ...
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      • Profile picture of the author genietoast
        You may want to try a JV Giveaway. They don't cost anything to join, but you get better privileges, like your gift is seen at the top before everyone else's, if you upgrade for $10 to $20.

        All you need is a list with a free gift you have the rights to promote. If you don't have a free gift, go to the JV giveaways that have already occurred or are occurring, download a gift that you like. Put that in your list.

        Then sign up for JV Giveaways that haven't started yet so you can contribute your gift.

        Check newjvgiveaways.com for the schedule. Check the members tab as well as contributors tab (those events that have yet to start).

        or...

        Create your own free WSO that people sign-up to your list to receive.
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      • Profile picture of the author Joanne D
        Originally Posted by Trivum View Post

        There's the rub. You have to bring something to the table. You either have to bring the visitors or the product (or ideally, of course, both).

        No offense, but I can't see any justification for a rant. If you were frustrated that you spent all your time building a product and so didn't have time to build up visitors, that would be understandable. If you were frustrated because you spent all your time building up a list and so didn't have time to build a product, that would be understandable. As it stand, however ...

        Sorry, but I don't think you understand what the "rant" was actually about.
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  • Profile picture of the author Big Al
    I think it's important to put paid traffic in context... versus say an offline business.

    Plus -- guilty as charged -- I've shyed away from paid traffic only to go and blow $97 on a course that caught my eye and made me curious.

    IMHO it is definately worth having a monthly expenditure budget/investment that should ideally be spent on your business (eg. paid traffic) first and on information second.

    ... or as Alexa said.
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  • Profile picture of the author SocialMediaOwls
    As soon as you start thinking outside of the box of "creating a list" you will become rich.
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    • Profile picture of the author Cool Hand Luke
      Originally Posted by SocialMediaOwls View Post

      As soon as you start thinking outside of the box of "creating a list" you will become rich.
      :rolleyes:
      LOL Oh really? You mean its instant riches as soon as someone dumps their lists? Why didn't someone tell me this earlier?!
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    • Profile picture of the author Joanne D
      Originally Posted by SocialMediaOwls View Post

      As soon as you start thinking outside of the box of "creating a list" you will become rich.

      Now you've peaked my interest. Care to elaborate?
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  • Profile picture of the author Sheryl Polomka
    It does take time to build a list but there are ways to speed it up - although it may depend on what niche you are in.

    Write up a quick report that you can give away as a freebie and promote that report on a forum. If it's related to IM you can run a WSO giving away your free report (although from memory I'm not sure about having an optin with a WSO). There are ways to build a list quite fast but it may cost a little bit to invest in promoting your free offer.
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    • Profile picture of the author joinmyclub
      Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

      Then why not simply do a joint venture with someone who does? You supply the product and they supply the relationships with potential buyers which can lead to sales of it?
      Originally Posted by Sheryl Polomka View Post

      It does take time to build a list but there are ways to speed it up - although it may depend on what niche you are in.

      Write up a quick report that you can give away as a freebie and promote that report on a forum. If it's related to IM you can run a WSO giving away your free report (although from memory I'm not sure about having an optin with a WSO). There are ways to build a list quite fast but it may cost a little bit to invest in promoting your free offer.
      I agree with them, it really takes time and some money to build your list and the best option for you I think is the joint venture.
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  • Profile picture of the author SocialMediaOwls
    How long are you going to beat your head against the wall with these worthless lists? And I never said "instant"
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    • Profile picture of the author Rob Howard
      Originally Posted by SocialMediaOwls View Post

      How long are you going to beat your head against the wall with these worthless lists? And I never said "instant"
      Lists are obviously not your business strategy.

      But let me tell you - I'm plenty rich because of them.

      Just because YOU don't like it - it means dittly squat.

      A lot of people don't like sales pages. But they work.

      A lot of people don't like video sales pages. But they work.

      A lot of people hate upsells/downsells. But they work.

      Some people hate PPC, but it works.

      Some people hate SEO (myself included), but hey, it works.

      Some people hate facebook. But it works.

      Some people hate writing articles and syndication. But it works. (just ask Huffington Post what they think of articles and syndication - what, like 300 million dollars of a site flip because of it?)

      There are MANY MANY methods that work for many many different people.

      Rob
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    • Profile picture of the author Michael Oksa
      Originally Posted by SocialMediaOwls View Post

      How long are you going to beat your head against the wall with these worthless lists? And I never said "instant"
      How long are you going to keep trolling?
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      • Profile picture of the author Rob Howard
        Originally Posted by Michael Oksa View Post

        How long are you going to keep trolling?
        I know.

        In about every post he's made thus far, he always throws in a big bash about article writing and list building as being worthless.

        But, as someone already asked above, he never elaborates or shares what it is he actually does (other than games and software).

        I'm going to guess he relies exclusively on facebook and twitter.

        Rob
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  • Profile picture of the author SocialMediaOwls
    I think Article Markters/email list spammers and I have a different definition of what "rich" is.....but it's all good. If you are happy, good on ya
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    • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
      Originally Posted by SocialMediaOwls View Post

      I think Article Markters/email list spammers and I have a different definition of what "rich" is.....
      We probably also have a different definition of what a "business" is.

      Oh, and by the way...

      We are the worlds largest software company for cheating.
      Fixed that for you.
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    • Profile picture of the author Doug Wakefield
      Set up an affiliate system and allow others to promote your product for a commission.

      or

      Take a brief overview of your product, package it into a convenient 3-10 page report that glosses over things. Set up a squeeze page, or a page with the prominent offer, and start driving traffic to it.

      or

      As a PLR writer, I would set up the sales page and have things ready. I would set things up with some sort of affiliate system (since I have E-Junkie I would just roll with it to start as to not complicate things further.) I would then create the traffic source (10 or so articles), I would create a simple report (like I mentioned above), I would create simple squeeze page text, and then I would create a nice and simple 3-7 email autoresponder. To take things a little further I would dig up some killer keywords to promote the thing.

      From there I would make a WSO on this very forum with the whole package above and sell it on the cheap. I would normally charge $16-$30 for the package if I were to sell it on the store. Considering my purpose would be to create a small affiliate army, I would let this whole thing go for about $5. I wouldn't care about breaking even with this product (but you should) as much as getting the content out there.

      Hell, sell the package for a buck.

      On the sales page, and a few times in a separate pdf file included in the package, mention that you have the perfect product for them to promote with this pretty new PLR package and that you created the whole thing with your product in mind.

      Some people may take your PLR and find something else... others will take your PLR and sell a ton for you.

      In either case, you now have a list of buyers looking for content and things to promote that you just gave a sick deal to. If your product doesn't do well... sell it to this new list with PLR or Resale Rights and move on.

      Being unable to sell a product because you do not have a list, or cannot afford PPC or media buys, sounds like an excuse to back down to me. Get creative and find a way to make it work.
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      • Profile picture of the author Joanne D
        Originally Posted by Doug Wakefield View Post

        Set up an affiliate system and allow others to promote your product for a commission.
        Tried something along these lines but there were no takers even though it was a good deal for both parties.

        or

        Take a brief overview of your product, package it into a convenient 3-10 page report that glosses over things. Set up a squeeze page, or a page with the prominent offer, and start driving traffic to it.

        or

        As a PLR writer, I would set up the sales page and have things ready. I would set things up with some sort of affiliate system (since I have E-Junkie I would just roll with it to start as to not complicate things further.) I would then create the traffic source (10 or so articles), I would create a simple report (like I mentioned above), I would create simple squeeze page text, and then I would create a nice and simple 3-7 email autoresponder. To take things a little further I would dig up some killer keywords to promote the thing.

        From there I would make a WSO on this very forum with the whole package above and sell it on the cheap. I would normally charge $16-$30 for the package if I were to sell it on the store. Considering my purpose would be to create a small affiliate army, I would let this whole thing go for about $5. I wouldn't care about breaking even with this product (but you should) as much as getting the content out there.

        Hell, sell the package for a buck.

        On the sales page, and a few times in a separate pdf file included in the package, mention that you have the perfect product for them to promote with this pretty new PLR package and that you created the whole thing with your product in mind.

        Some people may take your PLR and find something else... others will take your PLR and sell a ton for you.

        In either case, you now have a list of buyers looking for content and things to promote that you just gave a sick deal to. If your product doesn't do well... sell it to this new list with PLR or Resale Rights and move on.
        Not an option. It's not my product - I'm promoting another persons product.

        Being unable to sell a product because you do not have a list, or cannot afford PPC or media buys, sounds like an excuse to back down to me. Get creative and find a way to make it work.
        Didn't say I was backing away. In fact, I've found other alternatives that are working, just not as quickly as I would like BUT I am persistent. Whatever I get from this product launch, I'll be happy with even if it is just a lot of learning and experience.

        I just know that an email blast to someones list (to also grow my list) would be very beneficial at this point but that is obviously not an option for me this time.

        So, I continue to work at it the best I can with what I have.
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  • Profile picture of the author SocialMediaOwls
    That's one side of our biz.
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    • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
      Originally Posted by SocialMediaOwls View Post

      That's one side of our biz.
      What's the other side? Twitter spam?
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      • Profile picture of the author SocialMediaOwls
        Originally Posted by CDarklock View Post

        What's the other side? Twitter spam?
        Oh, twitter tools? Yeah, we do that....looks like you need it with your paltry number....that and a haircut would do you good
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        • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
          Originally Posted by SocialMediaOwls View Post

          looks like you need it with your paltry number
          Not really. Every single follower in that number is a real human being that I really know and care about, and I wouldn't have it any other way.
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          • Profile picture of the author sal64
            Originally Posted by CDarklock View Post

            Not really. Every single follower in that number is a real human being that I really know and care about, and I wouldn't have it any other way.
            I wish I had your hair!
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            • Profile picture of the author Jill Carpenter
              Originally Posted by Joanne D View Post

              Kind of frustrating.

              You need a list in order to promote products,
              Really? Because I didn't have a list and I promoted products.

              If list building quickly is your primary goal then you need to drop some things quickly around the web to make that happen.

              Originally Posted by SocialMediaOwls View Post

              Oh, twitter tools? Yeah, we do that....looks like you need it with your paltry number....that and a haircut would do you good
              Really? You think cutting some hair is going to improve his marketing?

              Maybe I need to shave my head too. Didn't realize my hair might be growing from the root by sucking the marketing sense out of me. :rolleyes:
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        • Profile picture of the author oneplusone
          Originally Posted by SocialMediaOwls View Post

          Oh, twitter tools? Yeah, we do that....looks like you need it with your paltry number....that and a haircut would do you good
          Goodness me...

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  • Profile picture of the author NateC
    Jv with someone that has a great list and will send it to them. That is the easiest way to get it out there. You can do all of the social networking etc which is effective also. You can have your followers verify... no need to solicit accounts that no one will ever see your tweets.
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    • Profile picture of the author Joanne D
      Originally Posted by NateC View Post

      Jv with someone that has a great list and will send it to them. That is the easiest way to get it out there. You can do all of the social networking etc which is effective also. You can have your followers verify... no need to solicit accounts that no one will ever see your tweets.
      Tried that already. Not much interest generated. Don't understand why as I was offering a percentage of the sales...
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  • Profile picture of the author efwebm
    Throw it up on CB and let others promote it. Post a few free copies here to people that offer to promote it.

    I'm not sure your example was a catch 22 btw
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    • Profile picture of the author Joanne D
      Originally Posted by efwebm View Post

      Throw it up on CB and let others promote it. Post a few free copies here to people that offer to promote it.

      I'm not sure your example was a catch 22 btw
      I think you should have read through the messages before posting.
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  • Profile picture of the author Joanne D
    Can we have a serious and pleasant discussion please?
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    • Profile picture of the author myob
      @Joanne

      It seems to me with your apparent writing and keyword SEO skills, you should be able to build a list rather quickly.

      I have found writing articles and submitting them to targeted outlets to actually be the fastest free method to build large lists and sell products in even the most highly competitive niches.

      You can submit articles to not just the top article directories, but especially also submit them to ezine publishers, blogs, and high authority websites in your niche.

      The power of article marketing is vastly underused. Using the leverage of articles in thousands of targeted outlets, you are not only building high PR backlinks, but also immediate sales as your site rises in ranking for organic traffic.

      All of this can actually happen quite fast.
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    • Originally Posted by Joanne D View Post

      Can we have a serious and pleasant discussion please?
      Well that is what we can only hope for Joanne.

      Consider learning to publish your own content at a 5000 word a week clip. Do it on a blog, and stick with one blog.

      You will start to see amazing results, and you can sell anything you want, make money with Adsense, AND sell product - your own product, or someone else's products.

      Traffic = Profit

      You can do it. Become a fierce writer and you will succeed.
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  • Profile picture of the author JamesGw
    It's always easier to make money if you have money. With that in mind, hard work perseveres over all else. Just keep chugging away and you'll start to see the money come in eventually.
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