95% of ClickBank Marketers SCAMMERS according to the FTC

by Gaz Cooper 34 replies
Pie in the Sky Earning CLAIMS

Fake Screenshots

Screenshots of Money NOT earn't from the opportunity being offered.

Useless coaching courses only designed to get credit card number then constantly having sales people call to upsell

Not telling the customer what the Opportunity REALLY IS in the copy

Claiming you dont have to work at it

Not putting the Price in there

Not allowing them to get the product they have paid for once paid and being sent immediatley for an upsell


Plus a bunch of other stuff so in my estimation that includes pretty much all of Clickbank and the majority of the Big Name internet marketers

Well now Clickbanks new requirments require all those things to be changed and also all screenshots and earning claims will need to be verified by Clickbank and the money has to be shown to have been earnt by the actual opportunity on offer

BOUT TIME I say


#main internet marketing discussion forum #95% #clickbank #ftc #marketers #scammers
  • Profile picture of the author spectrefax
    The only people this hurts are those who are pushing crappy products and lying in their sales copy. Thumbs up from me.
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    • Profile picture of the author Sylonious
      It doesn't matter what product you sell or how honest you try to be the bottom line is that most of the people who buy these type of products will never put them to good use.

      They don't believe that if given the choice the general public will make the right decision so they want to take that choice away by regulating certain products out of the market. Sort of like taxes on junk food or trans fats etc.. They want to protect you from yourself.

      Any Internet Marketing "Biz Op" could be considered a scam if it's marketed to people who aren't willing to put forth the effort to make it work
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  • Profile picture of the author vishalduggal
    Believe me as an Internet Marketer, I am very happy with these new rules. This will gonna help buyers to buy what really works and sellers to sell what really works. Thanks FTC.
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
      Speaking of outrageous and unsubstantiated claims...
      95% of ClickBank Marketers SCAMMERS according to the FTC
      There are at least two parts of that statement I'd wager you can't support. The first is that the FTC said anything about any specific fraction of Clickbank merchants. I'd be mildly surprised if they said anything publicly about Clickbank at all, at this point.

      The second is the suggestion that 95% of CB merchants are scamming people, or otherwise fall afoul of those rules.

      I'm all for going after scammers, but I don't consider over the top comments like that subject line to be an effective way to help in the process.


      Paul
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      • Profile picture of the author Gaz Cooper
        Yep your right Paul I guess I based my header on the hundreds of emails I receive daily from IM doing exactly what the FTC is claiming and the hundreds of clickbank videos I have watched doing the EXACT same things that the FTC is talking about.

        So yes the headline is a bit over the top but based on whats presented to us day in day it understandable people will agree with me.

        Gaz Cooper
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        • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
          Gaz,

          If your goal is to get people to accept and respond to false claims by playing on negative emotional triggers, that's an excellent headline.

          Is that really the best way to fight fraud?


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          • Profile picture of the author Gaz Cooper
            Ok I accept the claim about clickbank is not substanciated and is not 95% so anyone care to imply a percentage based on the top 10 click bank products ????

            Gaz Cooper
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            • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
              Gaz,

              Why would we need to assign a percentage to it? We'd only be guessing anyway, and even if we knew we were right it wouldn't change the issue.

              Certain behaviors are fraudulent and need to be stopped. Discussion of the nature of those behaviors and the means one might use to reduce them is useful. Quoting guesses as statistics isn't.


              Paul
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              • Profile picture of the author Gaz Cooper
                Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

                Gaz,

                Why would we need to assign a percentage to it? We'd only be guessing anyway, and even if we knew we were right it wouldn't change the issue.

                Certain behaviors are fraudulent and need to be stopped. Discussion of the nature of those behaviors and the means one might use to reduce them is useful. Quoting guesses as statistics isn't.


                Paul

                Hey Paul

                Ok I will drop it paul as it seems that its a taboo subject and not good for IM however it very clear to see and no guessing is required, if anyone spend just a few minutes viewing the videos and reading sales copy and a percentage could be quickly calculated as to how many are using the techniques that the FTC considers fraudulent but we all know the results would be HORRIFIC.

                I would of thought an industry would want to clean itself up rather than wait till the FTC decides to do it for them.

                Gaz Cooper
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                • Profile picture of the author KenThompson
                  Originally Posted by GazCooperOnline View Post

                  Hey Paul

                  Ok I will drop it paul as it seems that its a taboo subject and not good for IM however it very clear to see and no guessing is required, if anyone spend just a few minutes viewing the videos and reading sales copy and a percentage could be quickly done but the results would be HORRIFIC.

                  I would of thought an industry would want to clean itself up rather than wait till the FTC decides to do it for them.

                  Gaz Cooper

                  I think the only taboo subjects here are religion and politics.

                  Paul was merely making a valid point. No need to take it personally, or so it seems.

                  Regarding a self-regulating industry... the trash never gets taken out until someone
                  yells.


                  Ken
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                  • Profile picture of the author Gaz Cooper
                    Certainly not taken personal Ken, I respect Paul

                    Its scary what is under the carpet when you actually lift it up and take a Look so best not lift it seems to be the general concensus.

                    Gaz
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                    • Profile picture of the author Hesaidblissfully
                      Originally Posted by GazCooperOnline View Post

                      Certainly not taken personal Ken, I respect Paul

                      Its scary what is under the carpet when you actually lift it up and take a Look so best not lift it seems to be the general concensus.

                      Gaz
                      The general consensus in this thread is that most people who replied think the new requirements are a good thing. I think Paul's issue is that the thread title presents an opinion as though it's a fact. In order to know which % of products on Clickbank violate the new requirements, you'd have to go through each product (or at least each biz opp/internet marketing/work from home type product) and take note of violations for each, then tally up the numbers and calculate a percentage of violators. Looking at the top 10 products and then trying to extrapolate what percentage violate the requirements won't give you an accurate number.

                      In any case, there have been several threads here in the past week about the new requirements, and the discussions weren't off limits. But again, I think the point Paul was making is that opinions aren't facts. Saying "Many products on Clickbank violate their new stated requirements" would be a statement of fact. Saying 95% of Clickbank products are scams when you're basing that number only on the amount of emails you get in your inbox and some of the high profile launches is an opinion. It might be an opinion shared by many here, but still just an opinion until you've done the research to confirm it.
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                      • Profile picture of the author Gaz Cooper
                        Good post and Well Said dont disagree with any of it.

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                        • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
                          Folks, you're missing half the point. The headline suggests that the FTC has stated that 95% of the offers on CB are frauds. The fact that the post modifies that to an implication, rather than an outright statement, doesn't change the effect the headline has. Not without much more clarification than exists in the OP.

                          There is no rule here against arguing for cleaner practices in the industry. Quite the contrary, in fact. We encourage that kind of discussion. Always have. But you don't reach that goal by using the very tactics you're disparaging.

                          Here's the other half of the problem: When you make a statement like the subject line of this thread, anyone who knows it's not accurate will dismiss the entire discussion as a waste of time. It isn't taken seriously. People who don't know any better may take the allegation as literally true, and repeat it. That sort of thing reinforces the extreme responses people have, and just adds to the "They're all crooks" mentality. It is indiscriminately destructive.

                          The notion gets repeated every time the discussion comes up, and it becomes the dominant meme in the conversation. Rational people tend to avoid such threads. Arguing with people with strong opinions on subjects about which they lack substantive knowledge is pointless and frustrating. So, the folks with extreme ideas dominate the topic.

                          Add to that the tendency of such threads to proliferate. Everyone wants to "own" the topic, rather than aggregating their contributions into a single or small number of threads that actually get past the initial reaction stage and into serious discussion.

                          Voila! A flood of inane nonsense, annoying the rational majority into avoiding the topic altogether. If you know you're going to get into arguments with folks who are going to lob hand grenades when a gentle nudge would work, what's the point?

                          Along with that, you have the problem of visitors seeing subject lines like that and deciding to abandon the place. If we allow or promote such extreme and inaccurate views, as they see it, what's the advantage of participating?

                          Why subject yourself to crazy people?

                          Yes, that's how a lot of folks react to that sort of thing. And I can't say I blame them.

                          Out there in the real world, the word 'guru' means someone who has extensive experience and knowledge in a field, and uses that knowledge to teach others. Here in our insular community, it's been co-opted by a bunch of unthinking bashers to mean 'scam artist.' If you try to point out the distinction, the stampeding herd will try to run you over, claiming you're defending scams.

                          Why? Too many outrageous headlines, over too long a period. Too many people believe them, and join the herd.

                          Sorry, folks. The only things a stampeding herd leaves behind are destruction and a strong odor of bulls__t.

                          Side note: The business of trying to "own" a topic here isn't limited to the inexperienced. A while back, I deleted a post by one of the more senior members. A day or so later, he sent an email to his list, with a subject line claiming that the topic was banned at this forum. Turns out there were two threads on the front page on that very subject at the same time his email landed in my inbox.

                          Gotta love the irony.


                          Paul
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  • It's about time. There is a little thing called "truth in advertising", after all. Seems to have taken a while to affect internet advertsing, though, eh?
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  • Finally that's all I have to say about this.


    Kristof
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  • Profile picture of the author LB
    95% of statistics on forums aren't real.
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  • Profile picture of the author KenThompson
    How many products are on Clickbank? 12k? More?

    Also, by possible extrapolation and the interest of accurate claims, what about
    all the claims in non-IM markets?

    Read faster, date more women, get laid more often, better grades, more beautiful
    skin, no more acne, whiter teeth, bigger muscles, flatter abs, a 6 pack - a 12 pack
    if you're an alien like Paul Uhl... lol

    All that stuff needs to be verified by CB, too! Hey! Just sayin'.

    Who's gonna do all of that work? Clickbank's hiring!


    Ken
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  • Have you noticed that they are all using Plimus now....I hope that the FTC finds them as well. All these fakes have been kicked out of clickbank...I let them take my money way too often and eventually I have taken a piece here and there and built something.

    Oh how I dreamed of that pie in the sky though
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  • Profile picture of the author donkey097
    Finally after all these years something is being done, no doubt someone will come up with a way around it though
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  • Profile picture of the author davemiz
    95% of clickbank marketers are scammers?

    WHAT THE F ARE YOU SMOKING MAN?

    Paul's 100% right.

    Seriously.... if you got out of your little "make money online" bubble, you'll see its just the IM market thats "scammy"...
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    • Profile picture of the author myob
      Originally Posted by davemiz View Post

      ...Paul's 100% right....
      How did you arrive at that figure?
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      • Profile picture of the author Michael Mayo
        Originally Posted by myob View Post

        How did you arrive at that figure?
        LOL...

        Paul has 10768 posts and only 3 were incorrect.

        3/10768= 2.7860326894502228826151560178306e-4

        100-2.7860326894502228826151560178306e-4= %99.99972

        He must have rounded it upwards!

        Have a Great Day!
        Michael
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  • Profile picture of the author sloanjim
    Only 95% wow they must have cleaned up their act.
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  • Profile picture of the author abhi1
    Originally Posted by davemiz View Post

    95% of clickbank marketers are scammers?

    WHAT THE F ARE YOU SMOKING MAN?

    Paul's 100% right.

    Seriously.... if you got out of your little "make money online" bubble, you'll see its just the IM market thats "scammy"...
    I totally agree. To be really honest, 99.9% of the IM products that I've seen
    on CB fake screenshots and lie about the earning claims but then it's just the
    Internet Marketing & Make Money (Online/Offline) niche.
    There are a lot of other products too and trust me, they're good!
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  • Profile picture of the author ankur sharma
    Before taking up the IM world, FTC should take up the cosmetics world. The whole cosmetics industry is killing us with their poisonous elements. However, clickbank products normally dont bring cancer to your body.

    Personally, i am also extremely annoyed with fake claims. I am annoyed with people pumping hype all the time. But there is other side of the story. Some people want "hype", they want someone to tell them "Magic bullets exist". These people are lazy, do not believe in working hard, never use their brain.

    IM product with full of hype is like "hope" for them. May be, it give them reason to believe one day they will be rich and bring smile on their face.

    On the other hand, if i want to sell to crowd containing Paul Myers, allen says, willie crawford, i know i have to bring some "real value" in my product. These people also buy IM products, but fake screenshots, hype cannot influence their buying decision.

    Truth is, somebody will always be out there to sell "Magic bullets", because people want magic bullets. Internet marketers are only "supplying" whats in demand.
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  • Profile picture of the author garyv
    I love the irony in the OP's headline. If I knew it was done for the purpose of irony, I'd have to say it was brilliant. But unfortunately I don't think it was. I just find it very funny that he's using an over the top - unsubstantiated - claim, to bring us into his post about how it's wrong to make over the top - unsubstantiated - claims. LOL Classic!

    Just to set the record straight. Way more than 5% of the products that come out of Clickbank have nothing to do with the IM or make money niche.
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  • Profile picture of the author davez
    Wonder if the WSO's are on the FTC's screen next. Some have testimonials that are a little over the top from people that are marketing them.

    Just sayin'
    Dave
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  • Profile picture of the author ryanzona
    I understand clickbank is saying they will require additional proof, but are they actually even doing it?
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  • Profile picture of the author Chri5123
    Originally Posted by GazCooperOnline View Post

    Pie in the Sky Earning CLAIMS

    Fake Screenshots

    Screenshots of Money NOT earn't from the opportunity being offered.

    Useless coaching courses only designed to get credit card number then constantly having sales people call to upsell

    Not telling the customer what the Opportunity REALLY IS in the copy

    Claiming you dont have to work at it

    Not putting the Price in there

    Not allowing them to get the product they have paid for once paid and being sent immediatley for an upsell


    Plus a bunch of other stuff so in my estimation that includes pretty much all of Clickbank and the majority of the Big Name internet marketers

    Well now Clickbanks new requirments require all those things to be changed and also all screenshots and earning claims will need to be verified by Clickbank and the money has to be shown to have been earnt by the actual opportunity on offer

    BOUT TIME I say
    Totally agree ^

    This should of happened a long time ago even before the FTC clamped down.
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  • Profile picture of the author H.Miller
    I think this is a great move by Clickbank. It is just way to easy for anybody to create a product and put together some fake screenshots claiming they made 50 million in 6 clicks. This should stop a lot of that crap from getting into the marketplace. Thumbs up!!!
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  • Profile picture of the author Caper224
    I reserve judgement, the scammers will find another platform to scam
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  • Profile picture of the author JamesGw
    This is awesome. I'm really tired of having to compete with these silly people that make fake claims just to make a few bucks.
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  • Profile picture of the author himanuzo
    New rules, all CB earning screenshots will be verified by CB? Is this correct?
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