Average Clickbank Refund Rates?

by UMS
24 replies
In relation to the sale of Blogging to the Bank, the refund rate is 23% which the seller claims is pretty good.

He says:

refund rate is at 23% which is great considering the average refund rate in the internet marketing space on Clickbank is between 30% and 35%
Personally, I would consider a refund rate of more than 10% (in the IM product space) to be really high.

Does anyone have actual data to show what the average refund rate for Clickbank IM products is?
#average #clickbank #rates #refund
  • Profile picture of the author rts2271
    Brick and mortar above 2% raises eyebrows.
    Online with deliverable 6-8%
    Digital I can't find numbers but would think it should be 6-8 but people lie so its probably at least 10% but no more than 15 in my educated guess. 20 and up is absurd. Its a crap scamalicious product.
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  • Profile picture of the author williamrs
    I think you could go to www.cbengine.com and take a look on the refund rate of the main IM products.

    I haven't been promoting Clickbank products, but the IM products that I promote (my own products as well as other people's products) usually have a refund rate below 10%. Most of the times way below 10%.

    IMO, Clickbank isn't as it used to be one or 2 years later, now it's full of scams and people already buy with the intention of asking for a refund. Even if we find a good product there the refund rate is still a problem.

    Of course, the serial refunders don't buy only CB products, but because of CB's refund policy and the quality of the products on their marketplace the refund rate tends to be high with them.


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    • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
      Banned
      Originally Posted by williamrs View Post

      I think you could go to www.cbengine.com and take a look on the refund rate of the main IM products.
      You can't, I'm afraid.

      All you can look at is what Cbengine claims the refund rates are.

      The reality is that they have no reliable way of working it out. This information is (understandably) not published/released by Clickbank.

      There are many websites claiming to be able to work it out, but they have no information that you and I don't have, and it's all nonsense.

      Refund rates typically vary hugely from affiliate to affiliate for the same product. It mostly depends on how the product's pre-sold (obviously enough).

      Products which have a really high refund-rate across large numbers of affiliates are swiftly removed from the marketplace by Clickbank for the obvious reason that when this happens, their 8%/9% cut doesn't cover the administrative and transaction costs involved in refunding, and they're losing money.

      There's a lot of nonsense talked about this subject, all over the internet. The truth is very much more prosaic and less interesting than all the widespread claims and speculation: Clickbank refund-rates are not known other than by Clickbank (and they're not saying), and by a product's vendor.

      I don't doubt that the specific product mentioned might have an overall refund-rate of 23% (because I've seen the ways in which it's typically pre-sold by its affiliates, some of which almost defy belief), but the statement reported above, that the "average refund-rate" at Clickbank is between 30% and 35% is absolutely ludicrous.

      Originally Posted by UMS View Post

      Does anyone have actual data to show what the average refund rate for Clickbank IM products is?
      No; they don't.

      This information is not in the public domain. (And why should it be?).

      And if you ask the people who purport to be "working it out" how they're working it out, their answer inevitably includes the words "secret proprietary formula", or something very similar, and someone more skeptical than I would imagine that that's a way of saying "We're not telling you, and please don't laugh at us".
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  • Profile picture of the author H.Miller
    Originally Posted by UMS View Post

    In relation to the sale of Blogging to the Bank, the refund rate is 23% which the seller claims is pretty good.

    He says:



    Personally, I would consider a refund rate of more than 10% (in the IM product space) to be really high.

    Does anyone have actual data to show what the average refund rate for Clickbank IM products is?
    Yea that's pretty high. I don't know the official average refund rate on clickbank but I know for the products I promote the refund rate is extremely low. I think I have only had like 3 refunds in the last 4 months. Nothing in the IM niche though.
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    • Profile picture of the author LooseChange
      ClickBank (scambank) products should have a 100% refund rate because most of them are utter garbage.

      The fact Blogging to the Bank had a 23% refund rate, it makes you wonder how many people didn't bother to ask for a refund and simply went their way knowing they got ripped off.

      Every time I think of scambank, I remember the one and only product I bought back in 2005, "The Rich Jerk" who told people to invest money in autosurf ponzi schemes like 12DailyPro when he was collecting referral commission off of gettting people scammed.
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      • Profile picture of the author Boston Joe
        From my experience, it's gotten a lot worse in recent years. Lots of people are buying with every intention of returning. The max I've come across is 20% though, no one should be bragging about a 23% return rate.
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      • Profile picture of the author Daniel Harper
        Originally Posted by LooseChange View Post

        ClickBank (scambank) products should have a 100% refund rate because most of them are utter garbage.
        That's a pretty broad brush.

        You know what mine is? Zero.

        Granted, that's only 27 sales in just under a week, so it's bound to go up ... but still.

        Not everyone is putting crap products out there.
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      • Profile picture of the author KellyFelix
        Every time I think of scambank, I remember the one and only product I bought back in 2005, "The Rich Jerk" who told people to invest money in autosurf ponzi schemes like 12DailyPro when he was collecting referral commission off of gettting people scammed.
        I remember that guy! I still have a copy of his ebook though and I don't see any mention of investing in ponzi schemes or anything called 12dailypro. It sounds cool though. All I see is weird stuff about SEO & affiliate marketing, and we all know that doesn't work!

        Anyway, can you send me a link to the RJ ponzi scheme? I'm all in!
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        • Profile picture of the author LB
          Originally Posted by KellyFelix View Post

          I remember that guy! I still have a copy of his ebook though and I don't see any mention of investing in ponzi schemes or anything called 12dailypro. It sounds cool though. All I see is weird stuff about SEO & affiliate marketing, and we all know that doesn't work!

          Anyway, can you send me a link to the RJ ponzi scheme? I'm all in!
          LOL.

          The Rich Jerk kicked my dog and keyed my car! It's in the book!
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        • Profile picture of the author Mike Mendell
          Originally Posted by KellyFelix View Post

          I remember that guy! I still have a copy of his ebook though and I don't see any mention of investing in ponzi schemes or anything called 12dailypro. It sounds cool though. All I see is weird stuff about SEO & affiliate marketing, and we all know that doesn't work!

          Anyway, can you send me a link to the RJ ponzi scheme? I'm all in!
          Being a long time affiliate of the Rich Jerk, I was about to defend him saying he never recommended 12DailyPro or any other "surf for cash" website for that matter.

          Luckily, Kelly stepped in and articulated it far better than I
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      • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
        Originally Posted by LooseChange View Post

        ClickBank (scambank) products should have a 100% refund rate because most of them are utter garbage.
        Most, not all.

        I tend to agree though. Much of it is rubbish, and I fail to see why they arent more stringent with their approval process. Seems anyone can sell anything at times regardless of quality.

        My opinion is that something is going to eventually give big time, and when it does, you'll see a massive shift in their TOS. Comparible to what we've seen recently to a lot of article related sites.

        For the moment they're probably comfortable, but eventually they've gotta clean up their act. There's far too many rubbish products listed, and this can be damaging to buyers mindsets. Its starts the mentality of which you've just expressed here ..."scambank". I wonder how many people are reluctant or choose not to buy simply because of this perception?

        This wont keep us ethical marketers who have a vested interest in our products and customers, in a working relationship with CB. It will just see us seek alternatives to organisations that disallow low quality products.

        Meh, Im tired and probably not making a great deal of sense. Just some thoughts off the top of my head.
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  • Profile picture of the author TryBPO
    I've noticed quite a few people beating BTTB up pretty badly about a high refund rate. I'm not so sure it's terrible. I'll preface that I have no experience with this product and very little experience with CB in general, though.

    If you are aggressively marketing your product to the EXTREME and touting the guaranteed, automatic refund to take away risk, I don't see why 23% refund rate is so terrible. With that volume of sales and $$, you know people are going after their affiliate program with a serious push...and they seem to be making enough money to make it worth while.

    And for those claiming it must be a terrible product, they can't believe they put their name on it, they would NEVER allow themselves to have a refund rate that's so high, etc. I wonder if that's because they're selling like 10 products/month with two resellers? Jealous maybe?
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    • Profile picture of the author Naeem Sikandar
      the refund rate in getting higher and higher each on clickbank (esp. for internet marketing products) because they do not fulfill what is expressed on the sales page.
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      • Profile picture of the author kamal17177
        Originally Posted by Naeem Sikandar View Post

        the refund rate in getting higher and higher each on clickbank (esp. for internet marketing products) because they do not fulfill what is expressed on the sales page.
        Exactly. Sales pages are full of hype and the actual product hardly delivers any value.
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    • Profile picture of the author LooseChange
      Originally Posted by TryBPO View Post

      I've noticed quite a few people beating BTTB up pretty badly about a high refund rate. I'm not so sure it's terrible. I'll preface that I have no experience with this product and very little experience with CB in general, though.

      If you are aggressively marketing your product to the EXTREME and touting the guaranteed, automatic refund to take away risk, I don't see why 23% refund rate is so terrible. With that volume of sales and $$, you know people are going after their affiliate program with a serious push...and they seem to be making enough money to make it worth while.

      And for those claiming it must be a terrible product, they can't believe they put their name on it, they would NEVER allow themselves to have a refund rate that's so high, etc. I wonder if that's because they're selling like 10 products/month with two resellers? Jealous maybe?
      Back to school for you. In any logical business model, a 23% refund rate means that what you're selling sucks unless you're just another scammer robbing money from innocent people who believe there is some easy path to wealth.

      Imagine if Walmart or Apple had a 23% return rate? They wouldn't be in business. One can only imagine the BBB complaints and FTC complaints.

      Unfortunately, million of unsuspecting consumers each year are fleeced out of their hard earned money by "self proclaimed" gurus selling ebooks and "get rich quick" schemes that fail to deliver.

      As a marketer myself, I strive for ethical marketing. "Blogging to the Bank" is/was nothing but a scam.

      Jealous, no. Why would anybody be jealous when they can sleep at night knowing they didn't scam some poor fool of their hard earned cash?
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  • Profile picture of the author LB
    My CB refund rate is always just a few percent tops.

    23% is insane, although I do agree that anything in the "IM" space suffers from higher rates.
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  • Profile picture of the author muyenp
    it's not surprising at all that the refund rate is so high considering that the sales page of these products are so full of hype and exaggerated claims. Always take everything with a grain of salt.
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  • Profile picture of the author Brad Gosse
    I have said this before.

    CATEGORY MATTERS!

    I sell a vegan cookbook on clickbank with a 1.4% refund rate. It's not digital products people are refunding it's products that sell a dream instead of straight forward value.
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    • Profile picture of the author imdomination
      Originally Posted by Brad Gosse View Post

      I have said this before.

      CATEGORY MATTERS!

      I sell a vegan cookbook on clickbank with a 1.4% refund rate. It's not digital products people are refunding it's products that sell a dream instead of straight forward value.
      While this is true, I sell mostly weight loss products in the CB marketplace, which in theory should be some of the highest refunders after people don't lose a pound.

      But I've never had more than a 3% refund rate.

      That said, I take really good care to not oversell my product pages and make sure to be realistic. I figure it probably costs me a sale here and there, but not as much as the refunds would cost me when people come back unhappy with the product.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
    One of my best products has had about 5 refunds in 2 and a half years of selling. If I had a refund rate of 23% Id be disgusted.
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  • Profile picture of the author redrabbitt67
    I've been promoting Clickbank meditation products for the past 3 years and have had only 1 refund. These products don't over-hype on their sales page.

    I think if I promoted a product and started getting a refund rate of say 3% or more I'd dump it. That would be a definite indication that something was wrong with the product, and I wouldn't want my name to be associated with it.

    No question, there are a plethora of crappy products on Clickbank, but there are definitely some products that produce value for the customer at a reasonable price. You just have to sort through the riff-raff.
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  • Profile picture of the author Raydal
    All I know is that for the SAME product sold on ClickBank and
    Paypal that the CB refund rate is 10X that for Paypal. At least
    that has been my experience.

    Especially in the IM arena, many people have come to consider
    CB as a give-away fest.

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  • Profile picture of the author langm120
    Smart question! A lot of people do not consider refund rates when judging a product to market. What good is it if everybody returns....you don't make any money!
    Think about it!

    Mike Lang
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  • Profile picture of the author timpears
    I would think that you should be able to get a fairly close number on the refund rate by figuring the average amount made per sale, and the full commission amount. Those two numbers are readily available. If you divide the full average amount made by the full commission rate, the figure you get will be the successful sales rate. If you subtract that number from one and multiply by 100, you get the percentage refunded.

    Doesn't that calculation give you the refund rate. I have not paid much attention to it, but that is the calculation I have understood to be correct.
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