Kevin Riley, Do you know why people are more likely to create and promote crappy products? Part I

by giveusallfreedom 9 replies
You'll have to excuse the reference to Kevin Riley. I was just trying to give him a hard time because of this post that he made. **Edit: Ok this was meant as a joke. Kevin put up a good post and if you read both the post and my headline I clearly tried to take Kevin's advice. Ladies and gentlemen life is too short. Smile occasionally. Oh yeah read the first comment if you want to know why I edited this**

http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...ur-thread.html

Moving On

So, it’s really popular to promote products or courses that let a newbie create a product in “30 seconds on autopilot.” Now honestly instant products, regardless of quality, are a legitimate service. Success in marketing doesn’t require that you have the best product. It requires that you have the biggest audience. In our market this is especially true, because our audience, IMers, is attracted more to provable results than to great products.

If you can build a list of a 1000 people with a product whether good or bad in 24 hours or a week or whatever, you have a ton of leverage. You can now write a simple report and promote it which will drive you more traffic and build your reputation. You can cross promote with other marketers that have lists of a similar size to build your list even more. These among other things work to compound themselves and eventually you have huge list.

Of course in the beginning your list was probably crap. Half those first 1000 people used junk emails and the other half never read another one of your emails because your product sucked. But this is irrelevant. Those first 1000 people gave you leverage to continue building your list. People that join the list later will be the ones that generate sales for you. They’ll be the ones that read your report on getting 1000 subscribers in 24 hours or were referred to you by one of your cross promoters.

These are the emails that will drive your profits. The profits will be more evidence that you can point to and will increase your reputation. Eventually people will be buying on your reputation alone and you’re conversion rates will go through the roof. Even more evidence of your brilliant skills as a marketer. There was another post on the forum about a guy with 68 subscribers that tried to use Frank Kern’s mass control tactics and failed miserably. One of the responses he got was to effect that most of Kern’s subscribers buy on his reputation. That’s how he gets those giant conversion rates.

I’m not saying that Kern’s products aren’t great. I haven’t seen any of his products, but I signed up for his giveaway, so I’m at least willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. I’m also not saying that the strategy I listed above isn’t effective. It obviously is. All I’m saying is that it is resulting in a lot of CRAPPY products being promoted.

Of course why would we spend a lot of time creating great products? You could have the greatest product in the world, but if no one pays any attention to it who cares. They love to say that if you create a great product, word will get out and you’ll get a flood of sales. Yeah that’s crap. If nobody has bought your product, then there is nobody to talk about it.

This is obviously where marketing comes in. But the question the newbies have to ask themselves is why not just skip the product creation part and go straight to the marketing. I mean do the math. You could spend 40 hours marketing or 40 hours creating a product. At the end of 40 hours of marketing you probably made some sales or built your list. At the end of 40 hours of creating a product, you might have a good product, but you still have to do 40 more hours of marketing to see any returns for your effort.

Do I necessarily agree with this strategy? Not really, but it’s a matter of reality. Personally, when I write, I’m really thorough which is how this whole post started. In Part II I’ll talk about how I create really great thorough content, but first I had to make the point of why people don’t do this. Like I said I’m really thorough. Of course you also probably never read one of the reports I’ve written. The few people that have read them love them, but I enjoy writing them more than I like trying to convince people to read them.
#main internet marketing discussion forum #crappy #create #kevin #part #people #products #promote #riley
Avatar of Unregistered
  • Profile picture of the author graphicsgenie
    Originally Posted by giveusallfreedom View Post

    You'll have to excuse the reference to Kevin Riley. I was just trying to give him a hard time because of this post that he made.

    http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...ur-thread.html
    Why are you trying to give Kevin a hard time, his post was totally just, Kevin is a VERY well respected member of the Warrior Forum, and has been for years.

    I suspect you might get a bit of a bashing for this, and rightfully so, not even going to read your post, so I cant comment any further

    Thanks
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[32360].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author giveusallfreedom
      Darren,

      Chill dude. It wasn't a personal attack in anyway shape or form. In fact if you read my reply to his post I actually give him props for it. It was a joke. Go back and read my post man. You might enjoy it. Life's short there's no sense being mad all the time.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[32391].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Adeel_Chowdhry
        Worried about the title first...

        ...but the post was pretty good I say. I spend a lot of time trying to create a kick ass product..which in turn does take a lot of time and then you have to spend time marketing it.

        I'm going to think about creating lower priced product...just to build the list.

        Nice post.
        Adeel
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[32409].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author BIG Mike
          Banned
          [DELETED]
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[32475].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author Kevin Riley
            Now that is a good subject line!

            If you wanted me to read it, it sure got my attention. Also, the rest of the subject line detailed what it would be about. Even if my name hadn't been on it, I would have clicked because of the product creation theme.

            A great post. There are a lot of crappy products. I hope we see more and more good products. I'm trying to do my part to help with that crusade, and I have seen some progress.

            GraphicsGenie - Thanks for coming to my defense, but I know that the OP was simply pulling my leg and I take no offense.
            Signature
            Kevin Riley, Kevin Riley Publishing, Osaka, Japan


            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[32650].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author Daniel Scott
              I assume you're talking about the "Snowball effect" (the marketing one, not that other one - that's just sick! )

              Having said all that, wouldn't it be easier to create a good first product in the long run? Personally I am certainly no expect but I would imagine that having a whole "stable" of strong products in the one niche can really help with cross-selling, up-selling etc, and it certainly seems to be a tactic that many of my favorite marketers (Paul Myers, for example) employ.

              Also, most of the marketers I know that have gotten big in the IM industry have done so because they have released an excellent product to begin with. Traffic doesn't have to come in massive rushes like you seem to be describing - what about a more "evergreen" product that gets a constant dribble? It's not going to make you rich, but it will make you money, and its far easier to upsell to a raving fan than someone who found your product "passable".

              The point where I do agree with you is that you can create a good product and start marketing it, and go back and make it great, then awesome, then ever closer to perfection when you get feedback from your target market (or come up with additional ideas).

              I believe the maxim is "Ready... Fire... Aim!"

              If I have misinterpreted the point of your post I apologize. I found it a little hard to define, but I have no doubt that was my own stupidity and nothing that you have done wrong.

              Kind regards,

              -Dan
              Signature

              Always looking for badass direct-response copywriters. PM me if we don't know each other and you're looking for work.

              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[33122].message }}
              • Profile picture of the author Jeffery
                giveusallfreedom,

                Been reading your posts here and there and find some of them funny in a good way. Was hopeing you would start a thread of your own and this is a good one. Honestly, much of what you are talking about has already been discussed many times. However, I look forward to your own take on the subject. Something about you and your posts makes me think.

                Jeffery 100% :-)
                Signature
                WarriorHelp.com
                Webmaster to the Stars
                {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[33381].message }}
                • Profile picture of the author virtualpro
                  Nice try buddy! You got my attention again!

                  Just my simple opinion:
                  Only build a product when it will make you more money.

                  I was on 'build a great and cheap service' side for around 2 years. I think my offer maybe unrefusable, I never need to do marketing except 20-30 introduction letters I sent around these years. And clients hardly leave me, my service is very limited and maybe my client don't know where to find this kind of offer anywhere else. I got very good money along these 2 years by working hard.

                  Then I realized that there're so much people that make much money as me without so much work while my services need a lot of time and work. And I definitely have to work very hard, sometime 2 days straight without sleeping.

                  So at the end I think about retired from this job, since it ruin my health and my life. I need free-time. income/workload ratio is very important thing, you got to design it since it will eventually get involved your lifestyle.

                  So lesson learned, if you able to make money without much work so do it.
                  Building great product will need time and a lot of work, don't do it if you're not ready.

                  Thanks,
                  Lee
                  {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[33484].message }}
                  • Profile picture of the author giveusallfreedom
                    Ok First off I'd just like to point out that this was the first Kevin Riley Post! Everyone else totally stole my idea and not only that but I was the only one that got flamed for it. I would just like to thank all of you that contributed to this post and completely ignored all those posers. Except for annoyedgirl. She's on my friends list so I can't really call her a poser. ;^)

                    Anyway, I really appreciate all of the generous comments. Daniel said something about my position being kind of hard to define. I guess that's accurate. Lee and Adeel both read the post and said yeah let's go create some cheap products and build a list. Daniel and Kevin both said yeah quaility products are great. So you get two completely different reactions from the same post.

                    The point I was trying to make with the post is that as much as I hate crappy products I know why people create them. Part II of this is going to be ideas on creating better products, however my solutions aren't easy solutions. That's kind of the point you can't easily make a great product, so people aren't inclined to do so. With that said I'm going off to write Part II. Hope everyone will be as generous with that post as well. Except for you Darren. You're not invited. ;^)
                    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[33885].message }}
            • Originally Posted by Kevin Riley View Post

              Now that is a good subject line!

              If you wanted me to read it, it sure got my attention. Also, the rest of the subject line detailed what it would be about. Even if my name hadn't been on it, I would have clicked because of the product creation theme.

              A great post. There are a lot of crappy products. I hope we see more and more good products. I'm trying to do my part to help with that crusade, and I have seen some progress.

              GraphicsGenie - Thanks for coming to my defense, but I know that the OP was simply pulling my leg and I take no offense.
              Which is the reason why Autoresponders are set up to use people's names. If you want to get someone's attention, use his/her name. Don't overdo it, like we have seen in the past a bit here. But remember this principle if you really want to get someone's attention.

              I knew where Graphics Genie was coming from, but this thread proved that Kevin Riley is not only one of the most well respected marketers here, but he's also quite good natured and level headed. Good attributes for a Guru.
              Signature
              -----------------------------------------


              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[33915].message }}
Avatar of Unregistered

Trending Topics