Dear Mr Guru, I just unsubscribed from your list, here's why...

I hear you. That's a shame that is how you've been dealt with. It's too bad that even the "gurus" forget about the customer service side of things as well.

Marcus,

What do you want to see in the emails from people who's lists you join.

I have a feeling (and I do this with my very small list) that each email should have a "gem" that they would otherwise not get, a tip a method a free piece of software etc.

Another question, My particular way to email does not use the "Dear [first name] feature. All of my emails start out "Hi All" "Dear Members." If the content is at least good and at best GREAT does the Hi All greeting offend?

Thanks for starting this thread. I think it can be useful.

George Wright

I'm sure Mr Guru is worried now that he's down to 49,999 subscribers.

@ChrisLockwood: Thanks for another stellar example of your pointless and annoying sarcasm. I think the OP is all too aware that Mr Guru couldn't give a toss about being down 1 subscriber.

I believe the point was that there's all this high-minded moral positioning and preaching being bandied about by the Mr Gurus concerning "providing valuable content" and "developing a relationship" and "overdelivering" and on and on and on [insert other buzzwords]...

...yet watch what they do.

The original post was a little "mental note" to "do the right thing" and not just copy what Mr Guru does--including the lip-service to all those high-minded ideals.

The problem, of course, and here's the rub is that we all know which approach is more likely to make more money.

Or do we?

TheNightOwl

I recently unsubscribed from several lists myself. One reason is so that I don't find myself wasting time reading all of them when I should be working on my business. Another big reason is because they were just filled with pitches and not giving any useful tips or advice at all. :p

First of all big thanks @AgileHosting for choosing to read my content and posting about it in my favorite forum!

Second, while I think this post nails it - it is also a lesson. ANY email list you subscribe to can be a lesson:

a) how to do do email marketing or
b) how not to do it

It all comes down to your own personal beliefs, principals and ways you CHOOSE to operate your online business. I consider people who decide to read my blog and subscribe to newsletter my friends (although the number is ever growing) and while I do pitch other people products every so often - I only do so with products I personally tried, liked them, tested them, verified them.

Not only does it work better for sales, it also creates a better relationships. Although I do get my own share of occasional "hate email". One can never keep 100% of the people happy. It is simple nature of the business.

I actually find that my emails from publishers are content and information starved compared to just 2 short years ago.

Just looking at my inbox now, 9 out of 10 are promotional type emails from lists I've subscribed to, this is not spam, incredible.

Thanks James and Jay (who I know on Twitter by the way). This is the kind of thing the WF is for, and is highly educational. Sometimes, we learn my lurking. I posted over 300 times in the last year, but I hope to post less and lurk more in debates like this.

E-Mail is not dead, yet but it will die if you send me email I don't have the sense that I know you.

I will read e-mail from James and Jay because even if they don't know me, I have talked to them. I sort of know them from twitter and the fact that I can send a PM and hear back in this century. I look at Twitter and see some of these gurus who follow 50 people and have 3000 followers. I think to myself, that it says a lot and they are unlikely to sell to me again. You are right when you say, they probably don't care if I am no longer one of their buyers. But that is just the point.

I trust them (James and Jay) more than another big outfit that just started pushing their product on me this week. They (the big nameless outfit) have sent NOTHING but marketing affiliate products. Nothing. It doesn't work with your girlfriend (only talking to her when you want something), and eventually it will not work with most people either.

This is a competitive time in our business. The big no longer necessarily eat the small.

The fast, responsive and personal eat the slow and impersonal.

That has always been the case during recessionary times and it will be true during this one too. This is not new, folks. Study your business texts and they will tell you. Recessionary times produce new leaders who respond.

Read the Proctor and Gamble story from the last depression. How did they grow and lead?

These may be the internet days, but business is business and some things will NEVER change.

Come to think of it, I think I will just write a blessed e-book on it. Maybe a professor is good for something in internet marketing.

Charles

I am just itching to get some names... but I am sure you'll not give any...

Subject lines that are likely to get me to unsubscribe:

"It ALL starts in 10 minutes..."
"It's A Conspiracy!"
"Only 37 left..."
"Don't buy this until you've grabbed my special report"
"My accountant told me not to do this"
"This WILL change the Web FOREVER!"
(what triggers it for you?)

An occasional email like this isn't bad, but when it's all you get from someone, it's delete-o time!

Don't these people have an ounce of originality?

I too, remember when most lists provided something of value on occasion instead of a constant pitch-fest.

I'm so thankful for the unsubscribe link these days.

This is always a fun subject to discuss, largely because it IS subjective.

Couple of things to consider...

Your list has a life span. That's a fact. If you build a list of 10,000 people and you get great response to your pitch emails today, 6 months from now it will change dramatically, no matter what the economic climate is. That's why building a list is an ongoing job.

Also, there are different types of lists. Some are created specifically for pitching products to and nothing else. When you build a list like this, you're not trying to build a relationship - you're trying to make money. And here's the thing...there are subscribers out there that WANT those emails.

Years ago, when I had my first list, I had good content in every email I sent (usually along with a low-key pitch). I also only mailed once a week. I got emails from subscribers letting me know that they unsubscribed because I wasn't bringing them the latest and greatest product offers...

As marketers, we like to complain about what the guru's are doing or not doing, but we complain through the eyes of marketers being marketed to. I would suspect that the majority of these lists are not filled with other marketers. They are filled with potential customers waiting for the right offers.

At the end of the day, you will never please everyone on your list. My thought here is to understand why you are building a list, what your focus is FOR that list and then be consistent with that list. It's fine to build one just to hit with offers if that's the intent of the list. It's really NOT a dirty word to profit from people (provided you are not scamming people).

You WILL get unsubscribes even if - and at times BECAUSE - you send killer content in every email.

Understand your reason for your list(s). Be consistent in how you communicate with them. It's worked for me for years.

Mike

P.S. I understand the meaning of the OP's post - that's a whole other issue.

For the longest time, I subscribed to a number of lists, even those like we're discussing here, thinking that I had to stay subscribed or I just might miss some magic bullet product.

Then I realized that most of the stuff being offered was either junk or just a slant on things I already knew - no real revelations.

(BTW, if see the word 'conspiracy' used one more time in an email...ARGH!!!)

When I started unsubscribing like a madman (still subscribed to some quality stuff), the noise went away, and I was actually able to get things done!

Kick yourself out of the 'newsletter' nest and you'll learn to fly just fine!

Derek

Happy New Year Marcus - excellent thread!! Thanks.

First,
I'm totally humbled that honored to be included in this discussion. I'm an occasional lurker for the past year or so, so forgive if I'm completely up in the night here, having found this thread thanks to google alerts.

When it comes to list building, I find two distinct schools of thought: Quality or Quantity. One comes faster, the other lasts longer. Through the guru 'rumor mill' that I'm privvy to, I've heard a lot of complaints from the big mucky mucks that their lists aren't responsive like they once were, which belies the statement made earlier that they know what they're doing works.

I would argue that their lists have grown huge because they were first, and they capitalized on that. But first only works as a marketing strategy for as long as you have solid content to build your reputation.

Brand=reputation=brand in this evolving (rapidly) social media driven marketplace. If you developed a following based on what you gave, and now all you're giving is JV links, eventually, the attrition rate WILL catch up to you. It's one of the reasons so many of the new "guru" launches are big ticket. They've come to understand the idea that it's easier to market and maintain a list of fewer big ticket "Crack addicts" - people that are absolutely convinced of their need for this guru no matter what - than it is to keep bleeding their lists and ticking them off to the point of unsubscribe.

They got comfortable - and there's nothing wrong with comfortable - for some people.

But don't think that comfortable will keep you on the hot list of your prospects.

There will be people on your list that will bow down and worship you all the days of their life. And you'll have unsubscribers, too. It's the nature of list building.

But in my opinion, you can have quantity AND quality if you work at building a quality list over time.

I'd rather have a list of 100 that converted at 50-60% than a list of 10,000 that only converted 1-2%. The consistency is better for my peace of mind.

But I'm also not afraid to work to earn your business. There are a lot of people out there that want an autopilot income with no sweat.

I'm reminded of the checkmark on US tax returns - did you materially participate in this business?

I have never been afraid of elbow grease, and I believe if you put together a quality product and target market it (instead of shot gunning it all over the place), word will spread.

And I think my mention in this thread is proof that my belief is sound.

That said, I don't pretend to believe mine is the only way to do business in the world. That's foolhardy at best to believe.

But as John said just before me, there's no need to insult intelligence - we all know an autoresponder when we see it these days, and while personalizing your broadcasts isn't a bad thing, you can do so in a way that's genuine.

Social media is demanding a genuineness to your marketing presence. Without it, everything becomes noise.

Just because you CAN make a crapload of money off the backs of your list, doesn't mean it's the right thing to do if you're not being genuine with your audience. Just sayin'.

In truth, the endearing, genuine, authentic voices in the market are the ones that will see rapidly growing audiences in 2009. Guys like Perry Belcher - who's not afraid to 'show a little skin' are going to play VERY big this year.

Authenticity and Transparency are the new currencies of the web. Jeff Gitomer (among others) said it best:
All things being equal, people want to do business with their friends... all things NOT being equal, people STILL want to do business with their friends.

I subscribe to that notion, and have successfully built my business model around it. I also think that more people will flow in that direction over this new year.

Just my 6.78 cents (price adjusted for inflation) :-)

-Lisa Robbin Young

Lisa,

BINGO!!!

In a nutshell, I would like to add something I consider to be a guiding principle in my life:

In EVERY conceivable way, quality is ALWAYS better than quantity.

As a matter of fact, here's how I've put it, in a quote:

"Provide quality in all you do, look for quality in everything around you, and accept nothing but quality from others".

marcus

It looks like like you are now a high level IMarketer, you can now very quickly discern between value and over hyped rubbishy products. You know exactly what specific typed of information you are looking for to fill in the gaps. I would suggest that you now know as much if not more than any guru, this is why your antennae is so well attuned in spotting naff information. This puts you in strong position because you know what guru and information to disregard and what to take seriously this is half the battle. Maybe this guru does not want savvy buyers, but it is his loss because a savvy buyer will happily pay for any genuine originals insights: what they won't put up with is pitch after pitch of hyped up rehashed information.

Hi,
I have unsubscribed from many gurus. The emails are very annoying. It's the latest and greatest every day and you absolutely have to have it today. Sometimes they remove you from the list for a month and then they start sending emails again.
Thanks,
Jim

Agreed. I've found there's only a SMALL handful, like one-two fingers small, that deserve keeping on my email list.

I do keep the others though, for the sake of gleaming new perspective when they toss out the 'free' stuff come product launch time. I just keep them subscribed under a -newsletter only- email address.

You know, it's kind of funny that every list I was on save one promoted the arbitrage conspiracy. Now, I'm only on one list.

This may have already been mentioned but...
MOST people on your list will not be members here and will not have the vast knowledge of IM that some people here do.

I agree 100% with the remarks Jay and others made...
But always remember, you are not the average person on your list. The average person on your list is looking for ways to make money online and will probably have little to no expertise on the subject.

Do you think the 'gurus' make any money off of the actual 'internet marketers' on their list?
Probably not,...they make money off of the 'newbies' that come looking for instant riches.

You can give away great info, but it doens't mean your list is going to love you for it.
Some people want to be sold too...and I think a lot of marketers need to realize that promoting a product a month or more isn't a bad thing.

I agree with Fabian in a lot of respects because your subscriber won't be reading forever, so take the opportunity to sell while you have their intrest.

Now this doens't mean push every product out there, or give cheesy excuses like "my autoresponder broke so you may just happen to somehow see this message A LOT".

But I think mixing free good content (free e-books, software, advice) with offers that go a long with that free content is a great plan.

For instance give away a freee e-book on article marketing and at the end pitch a very good article marketing product. Best of both worlds right?

Just my 2 cents...
Zach