Article Marketing Going Extinct?

188 replies
As I have always said, article marketing can backfire!

Before the Panda update, you could have built it for do-follow backlinks and collective traffic, which meant more articles, more traffic. Article syndication was never really a good option for various reasons.

And after the Panda update, things have become scary. Check this James Martell article by the way.

Do think before you leap, newbies!

Note: Even the so-called "experts and biggest proponents of article marketing" DON'T do that. You can know that by doing a backlink search of their websites. Once in a while is acceptable. But DON'T let them fool you by saying that article marketing is the REAL DEAL when it isn't!
#article #extinct #marketing
  • Profile picture of the author NestZone
    I will differ with you a bit. I have build clients site to rank on first page even after the post Panda from article submissions with little trouble. Its not a sweep stake as many now look at it, expecting to get instant results. You need to work up your ass, but at the end is worth it.

    Article reproduction can backfire, but article writing can never go extinct.
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    • Profile picture of the author schttrj
      Originally Posted by NestZone View Post

      I will differ with you a bit. I have build clients site to rank on first page even after the post Panda from article submissions with little trouble. Its not a sweep stake as many now look at it, expecting to get instant results. You need to work up your ass, but at the end is worth it.

      Article reproduction can backfire, but article writing can never go extinct.
      Tell you what, I am really NOT sure but just between you and I, I do hope article marketing stays there - one free marketing method after all!

      But here's the thing. We have just scratched the surface in this recent Panda update. More alterations and modifications are going to be done in the latter part of this year (source: Wired.com)

      And if I were to go by the logic presented by James Martell, which sound pretty strong per se...with Matt Cutts cutting in with his comments. I would think twice about it.

      If you ask me, I got a PR update this season, and my site just got up. It was not due to article marketing, but due to link exchange. Moreover, most of my traffic is organic or from StumbleUpon. So, maybe social media is taking over, who knows.

      I would sure welcome some strong arguments from the experts here.
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      • Profile picture of the author dracoboar
        Originally Posted by schttrj View Post


        If you ask me, I got a PR update this season, and my site just got up. It was not due to article marketing, but due to link exchange. Moreover, most of my traffic is organic or from StumbleUpon. So, maybe social media is taking over, who knows.

        .
        seriously man ? seriously?

        first off you bad mouth article marketing and say you think google will lower the hammer on it then talk about link exchanges?

        What google may or may not do to article marketing is unknowable but their policy on link exchanges is crystal clear THEY HATE IT AND CAN DETECT IT VERY EASILY as stated by google and matt cutts on several occasions

        If your arguement is that google doesnt like article marketing to be intellectually honest you MUST then apply that same logic to link exchanges.

        OH btw i am glad you got a pr increase, so did my ecommerce store that is almost exclusively spam article marketing for backlinks. So even crappy article marketing works a little, again using your same logic.
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      • Profile picture of the author ezybux4u
        Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

        Tell you what, I am really NOT sure but just between you and I, I do hope article marketing stays there - one free marketing method after all!

        But here's the thing. We have just scratched the surface in this recent Panda update. More alterations and modifications are going to be done in the latter part of this year (source: Wired.com)

        And if I were to go by the logic presented by James Martell, which sound pretty strong per se...with Matt Cutts cutting in with his comments. I would think twice about it.

        If you ask me, I got a PR update this season, and my site just got up. It was not due to article marketing, but due to link exchange. Moreover, most of my traffic is organic or from StumbleUpon. So, maybe social media is taking over, who knows.

        I would sure welcome some strong arguments from the experts here.
        In relation to your comments regarding social media, it does seem that the social web is having more effect on traffic generation. I have been utilizing social plugins available from Facebook Developers section to make give clients in my business a free viral traffic builder, so I can vouch that attention to social media is worth the time. I have had some success in article marketing, but its really not of alot of interest to me, and I rather do online tasks that I enjoy, I don't want my marketing to be a chore after all
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    • Profile picture of the author Shaikat
      Originally Posted by NestZone View Post

      I will differ with you a bit. I have build clients site to rank on first page even after the post Panda from article submissions with little trouble. Its not a sweep stake as many now look at it, expecting to get instant results. You need to work up your ass, but at the end is worth it.

      Article reproduction can backfire, but article writing can never go extinct.
      By Agreeing with the above post, I like add that if article marketing is done in the perfect way, it is one of best legitimate and effective link building option for the webmasters. When everything is done in the perfect way, an article link can also get a website PR raise.
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    • Profile picture of the author Jaymark
      I don't article marketing is going extinct either. There is always a need for good content. As long as people search for information, they should ultimately find your information if it is well written and optimized. The problem comes in when people try to post articles in submission sites and then duplicate it on their sites. Try to stick with unique content and it should work out well for you. Good luck!
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      • Profile picture of the author davidstar
        I do not agreed. Otherwise you wont see them around. Just look at my stat. My still have many submission daily, many ranking on page 1 when I checked on webmaster. Many got downloaded. You only can tell when you have a directory and can tell you from the insight.

        Try to contact ezine and get some insight LOL !
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  • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
    Alexa will be here in a minute
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    • Profile picture of the author owenlee
      Originally Posted by ramone_johnny View Post

      Alexa will be here in a minute
      thats a nice one!!!
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      • Profile picture of the author Jaymark
        Article marketing (ie submitting to sites like Ezinearticles, etc.) may not have the same benefit as before. However article writing, especially creating fresh content for websites and blogs will remain as important as ever. Google penalizes sites when they aren't freshened with new content so it stands to reason that well written and informative articles will continue to be an important way to get your sites (and keep them) high in the search engine results.
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    • Profile picture of the author bethsuzi
      Originally Posted by ramone_johnny View Post

      Alexa will be here in a minute
      I'm not sure if she will. Alexa is probably sick of talking about the pros and cons of article directory/marketing and which is which (I know I'm sick of hearing about it) and having to send folk links to one of the gazillion threads on this topic.:rolleyes:.

      Beth
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      • Profile picture of the author DireStraits
        Originally Posted by bethsuzi View Post

        I'm not sure if you will. Alexa is probably sick of talking about the pros and cons of article directory/marketing and which is which (I know I'm sick of hearing about it) and having to send folk links to one of the gazillion threads on this topic.:rolleyes:.

        Beth
        It doesn't look like Alexa has made any posts today, so far (which is unusual!), but if/when she does, you can bet your last dime she'll probably be here with something to say on the subject.

        There are only three things for certain in life, if I can be so cheeky to say. The first two are well-known, but the third is Alexa Smith in article marketing threads. :p
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        • Profile picture of the author schttrj
          Originally Posted by DireStraits View Post

          It doesn't look like Alexa has made any posts today, so far (which is unusual!), but if/when she does, you can bet your last dime she'll probably be here with something to say on the subject.

          There are only three things for certain in life, if I can be so cheeky to say. The first two are well-known, but the third is Alexa Smith in article marketing threads. :p
          Yes, I do value her comments. Do you know if she has a blog or not?
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          • Profile picture of the author DireStraits
            Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

            Yes, I do value her comments. Do you know if she has a blog or not?
            Sorry, I don't know. I don't think so.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
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    • Profile picture of the author schttrj
      Well, it DOES explain a lot of things, don't you think? That's what I was trying to say.
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    • Profile picture of the author dracoboar

      Although this video is a nice find, good job Ramone, it really is NOT about what article marketing really is.

      Article Marketing is NOT about links on the article site but about quality links from webmasters that run high trust sites.

      Google can do what it wants to article directoriees, but how is google going to discount links that you get when a webmaster republishes your content on a high PR site?

      The truth is they will never discount relevent links on high trust sites even if it is from a republished article, so it is very clear that what Matt Cutts is talking about really has very little to do with true article marketing.
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    • Profile picture of the author mi100us
      The real point is that these links are worthless really anyways, and you are better off spending your time working on your content.
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    • Profile picture of the author lordkensal
      Good stuff. It is interesting what Matt "Mr Google" Cutts has to say. I think he is talking about Article marketing as a whole. The consistent theme with Matt Cutts is that good SEO is always about Quality and offering "Value Added" - I think the top article sites like Ezine, Article Base, etc can still offer this. I tend to concentrate on the Top 10 highest PR article directories
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      • Profile picture of the author Richard Van
        Originally Posted by lordkensal View Post

        Good stuff. It is interesting what Matt "Mr Google" Cutts has to say. I think he is talking about Article marketing as a whole. The consistent theme with Matt Cutts is that good SEO is always about Quality and offering "Value Added" - I think the top article sites like Ezine, Article Base, etc can still offer this. I tend to concentrate on the Top 10 highest PR article directories
        Sorry to have to disagree with you but what Matt's talking about isn't all article marketing. Just take a look at Paul Uhls and Alexa's style and you'll see what I mean. I do article marketing as part of my business but I rarely use directories at all now.

        As for targetting the top "PR" directories you may need to do a bit more research on what in fact PR is. It means "page" rank, not site rank. Do yourself a simple favour and download SEO quake or just Google "Page rank checker". Put the home page of Ezine articles on there - it's PR6. Then pick an article of your choice or better still, one of your own and copy and paste the URL into the PR checker or whatever you're using. It's PR0 or n/a.

        A lot of people very mistakenly think that just because the directory has a high PR that means they have a high PR backlink. Sadly you don't. It's still a back link but it's not a high PR backlink.
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      • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
        Banned
        Originally Posted by lordkensal View Post

        It is interesting what Matt "Mr Google" Cutts has to say.
        It always is.

        Ironically, though, the people who love to quote him on this subject, on which he's allowed himself to be so widely misunderstood simply through an unfortunate choice of wording, tend to be the very same people who love to decry his public statements on anything else to do with SEO, some of them even alleging that he's specifically employed by Google to mislead and deceive people!

        Originally Posted by lordkensal View Post

        I think he is talking about Article marketing as a whole.
        Indeed not - he's actually talking about what professional article marketers call "article directory marketing".

        Originally Posted by lordkensal View Post

        I think the top article sites like Ezine, Article Base, etc can still offer this. I tend to concentrate on the Top 10 highest PR article directories
        Your articles, as Richard observes above, are published on non-context-relevant, PR-0 pages, whichever directories publish them.

        Ezine Articles, in particular, has plenty of value for many professional article marketers, but its value has nothing to do with backlinks or traffic, and that isn't why we're using it.
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  • Profile picture of the author Gary J Martin
    I personally doubt Google would kill of article marketing of high quality articles.
    After all, it wants quality content.

    The problem is so many articles are far from quality.

    Perhaps Google will be able to distinguish between the two in the future.
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    • Profile picture of the author hamzah3
      Originally Posted by Gary J Martin View Post

      I personally doubt Google would kill of article marketing of high quality articles.
      After all, it wants quality content.

      The problem is so many articles are far from quality.

      Perhaps Google will be able to distinguish between the two in the future.
      I agree with you .Google must distinguish between the original good quality content and duplicate low quality content which i also hope they will do in future .We must not forget that providing information to people is the butter bread of google .So this is a two way relationship google and article marketers are both dependent on each other so google will not try to eliminate this industry off course there will be a problem for people who are in the habit of using duplicate content but for genuine content writers i hope there will not be any problem
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    • Profile picture of the author gsuccess
      Article marketing is a great way to get free traffic to your site and Google loves it, but personally I have had more results from blogs than articles.
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      • Profile picture of the author tpw
        Originally Posted by gsuccess View Post

        Article marketing is a great way to get free traffic to your site and Google loves it, but personally I have had more results from blogs than articles.

        When you create blog posts, aren't those in essence articles?
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        • Profile picture of the author myob
          How to get to the top if you're a turkey:


          A turkey was chatting with a bull.

          'I would love to be able to get to the top of that tree' sighed the turkey, 'but I haven't got the energy.'
          'Well, why don't you nibble on some of my droppings?' replied the bull. They're packed with nutrients.'

          The turkey pecked at a lump of dung, and found it actually gave him enough strength to reach the lowest branch of the tree.

          The next day, after eating some more dung, he reached the second branch.

          Finally after a fourth night, the turkey was proudly perched at the top of the tree.

          He was promptly spotted by a farmer, who shot him right out of the tree.

          Moral of the story:
          Bull S**t might get you to the top, but it won't keep you there.
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  • Profile picture of the author DireStraits
    Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

    Article syndication was never really a good option for various reasons.
    Forgive me, but when you make assertions like that - especially after all the times people have been over it with you before - it's pretty obvious the sole purpose of this thread is to stir up an argument.

    I say argument, not a debate, because you cannot debate with those who dismiss outright whatever evidence or convincing input you provide to make your point; nor with those reluctant to be convinced of the merits of real article marketing because of some unexplainable emotional (or entirely transparent financial) investment in railing against it, no matter what.

    My question is this: why do you care?

    What you do isn't even article marketing by the traditional definition. Since you don't do article marketing, why do you care if it dies? You stand to lose nothing.

    Or is it because you know deep down that the game you play with SEO and/or article directory marketing is actually the most fragile and unsustainable one, and being unable/unwilling to make real article marketing work leaves you with a bad taste in your mouth?
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    • Profile picture of the author Richard Van
      [DELETED]
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      • Profile picture of the author schttrj
        Originally Posted by Richard Van View Post

        More nonsense from the article marketing bashing king, as usual posted without a shred of evidence.

        Schttrj, You keep going to work as an employee of your SEO company and I'll keep laughing all the way to the bank as my own boss.

        I love your posts. Always so funny, bashing away because you can't figure out how to make it work yourself. I love people like you because you keep the competition away from me. Thank you sir. :p

        ...and for the benefits of the OP and anyone else, no I do not post my articles to directories for backlinks or in the hope they rank in Google. I have far better ways to get them in front of relevant, interested eyeballs that want to read them, which has been explained to the OP countless times, he just can't quite get it though.

        That's right Schttrj, it's all an illusion. Back to work.

        No need chap, either hit the search button or take a look at the huge amount of other threads you've been in like this, where it's been explained to you over and over again. Keep reading them until you understand, that way we don't have to keep telling you.

        I won't say anything to your post. That's your point obviously. Good luck with your endeavors.
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    • Profile picture of the author schttrj
      Originally Posted by DireStraits View Post

      Forgive me, but when you make assertions like that - especially after all the times people have been over it with you before - it's pretty obvious the sole purpose of this thread is to stir up an argument.

      I say argument, not a debate, because you cannot debate with those who dismiss outright whatever evidence or convincing input you provide to make your point; nor with those reluctant to be convinced of the merits of real article marketing because of some unexplainable emotional (or entirely transparent financial) investment in railing against it, no matter what.

      My question is this: why do you care?

      What you do isn't even article marketing by the traditional definition. Since you don't do article marketing, why do you care if it dies? You stand to lose nothing.

      Or is it because you know deep down that the game you play with SEO and/or article directory marketing is actually the most fragile and unsustainable one, and being unable/unwilling to make real article marketing work leaves you with a bad taste in your mouth?
      Nopes, you didn't get my point. It was NOT me saying. Did you read the article that I just referred to? Did you listen to that video?

      Provide your REASONS! I am not saying I am right, am I? I am asking your opinion.
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      • Profile picture of the author dracoboar
        Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

        Nopes, you didn't get my point. It was NOT me saying. Did you read the article that I just referred to? Did you listen to that video?

        Provide your REASONS! I am not saying I am right, am I? I am asking your opinion.

        If you are just asking for opinions than I would say no the article was crap.

        First the article doesnt understand the difference between article marketing and article directory marketing.

        Second the matt cutts video was not really on point and did not discuss what happens when quality content gets put on quality sites.
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      • Profile picture of the author DireStraits
        Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

        Nopes, you didn't get my point. It was NOT me saying. Did you read the article that I just referred to? Did you listen to that video?

        Provide your REASONS! I am not saying I am right, am I? I am asking your opinion.
        I wasn't referring to your post in its entirety. I was referring to the specific statement you made of "Article syndication was never really a good option for various reasons".

        Well clearly it was and continues to be viable and good option, because there are many here who make a jolly good living from doing just that. And they - quite unsurprisingly? - are part of the group of individuals who weren't much affected by the Panda update, or the update before that, or the one before that. No, indeed - they're the ones who've been using the same tried-and-tested method for many years, and who have yet to be touched in any significantly detrimental way by any of Google's algorithm updates, or the latest trends.

        You don't need "us" to adduce any further proof/argument in order to disprove your assertion about article marketing (syndication), Ron. You've been in enough discussions about it before, here, to know we'd only be covering the same old ground.
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        • Profile picture of the author schttrj
          Originally Posted by DireStraits View Post

          I wasn't referring to your post in its entirety. I was referring to the specific statement you made of "Article syndication was never really a good option for various reasons".

          Well clearly it was and continues to be viable and good option, because there are many here who make a jolly good living from doing just that. And they - quite unsurprisingly? - are part of the group of individuals who weren't much affected by the Panda update, or the update before that, or the one before that. No, indeed - they're the ones who've been using the same tried-and-tested method for many years, and who have yet to be touched in any significantly detrimental way by any of Google's algorithm updates, or the latest trends.

          You don't need "us" to adduce any further proof/argument in order to disprove your assertion about article marketing (syndication), Ron. You've been in enough discussions about it before, here, to know we'd only be covering the same old ground.
          Yes, I do understand that there are always two sides to everything. My first question to you...why would you think that I am just opposing what you are saying without any reason?

          Because I STILL believe you might have a point. But as I said, my own experience and articles like this one definitely make me think otherwise.

          We are all here to learn, ain't it? It's foolish to categorize us as "us". All of us have value to provide.

          I don't doubt the people who make a living from article marketing, and neither do I doubt how EZA and Hubpages are hit after the Panda update.

          Look, I am not doubting your caliber. Just take it this way. I have a point to make, to which I have provided reasons (James Martell's article and the video where Matt clearly says he would "lean away from article marketing"). Now tell me what would happen a year ahead from now on.

          Just don't make it unhealthy!
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          • Profile picture of the author Richard Van
            Schttrj.

            Forget people syndicating my articles from EZA, I rarely put them there. Also why would anyone show the forum their EZA account? Why not make it easier and just list all your niches here?

            Let me elaborate on my example to Michaeldoring. If Paul Myers wrote a really amazing article on how to succeed in IM. Say he asked Allen Says if he wanted to use it on this forum then Allen posted a thread advising people to read Pauls article that had a link back to Pauls site at the end. Do you think Paul would get a visitor or two? I'd say he'd get a few thousand.

            That's how I get my articles syndicated. I approach the sites in the niche I've written about. I don't wait for them to find me on EZA. This way I form a relationship with them, they then ask me for more content.

            See the way I didn't even mention backlinks there? I don't care about them when I do this. I want my articles to be read on sites with thousands of readers all very interested in the subject matter I've written about.

            I don't do this for the backlinks, I do this for the eyeballs and this is why I disagreed with your comment that article syndication was never a good option. You are only looking at it from the point of view of putting an article in EZA and "hoping" an authority site will use it. That is not how I and many others do it.

            As for wanting people to prove this, again, this has been discussed countless times. Do you really think it's good business advice to come onto a huge IM forum and show people the niches you're in?

            I don't think so either.
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            • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
              I only posted that video because I thought it was relevant. Not because it backs up my opinion.

              Im nuetral on this matter, as I've only just recently begun to grasp the reality of article marketing which is, article syndication - not just articles blasted across the web in hope of gaining backlinks (commonly known as article directory marketing) *thanks Alexa ...im not sure why she hasnt yet made an appearance, but anyway .....

              Richard, Im definitely down for a meetup in Sydney when you get here. Is there any chance we can slap some heads over this when you do. That would be fun
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              • Profile picture of the author dracoboar
                Originally Posted by ramone_johnny View Post


                Richard, Im definitely down for a meetup in Sydney when you get here. Is there any chance we can slap some heads over this when you do. That would be fun
                hope you guys have a good time

                Ramone,

                when I commented on the video my comments were directed at the OP and not you. I think posting it the way you did was very useful and timely
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                • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
                  Originally Posted by dracoboar View Post

                  hope you guys have a good time

                  Ramone,

                  when I commented on the video my comments were directed at the OP and not you. I think posting it the way you did was very useful and timely
                  All good, no problem dude
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            • Profile picture of the author tpw
              Originally Posted by Richard Van View Post

              As for wanting people to prove this, again, this has been discussed countless times. Do you really think it's good business advice to come onto a huge IM forum and show people the niches you're in?

              I don't think so either.

              I took this bait one time in a public forum.

              Someone was asking proof that I had #1 in Google for a term that made me money.

              I had "owned" one keyword for 4 years unchallenged. I figured it was the safest play. So I shared.

              Within 6 months, 6 of my competitors outranked me on that keyword....

              As it turned out, those guys had no idea how valuable of a keyword it was, and when I shared, they found out and took me out!!

              I am still sitting at #7 for that keyword -- a keyword that I had sewn up #1 until I opened my big mouth!!
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  • Profile picture of the author Edie47
    Interesting video - makes sense. Sending out a huge bunch of low quality spun articles may have worked at one time, but as the web matures and Google and others make their changes, quality will win out over mass produced junk in the long run. People complain because their sites fall in the rankings and their earnings drop, but take a look at who is at the top, and why.
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    • Profile picture of the author VirtuallyCapable
      Originally Posted by Edie47 View Post

      Interesting video - makes sense. Sending out a huge bunch of low quality spun articles may have worked at one time, but as the web matures and Google and others make their changes, quality will win out over mass produced junk in the long run. People complain because their sites fall in the rankings and their earnings drop, but take a look at who is at the top, and why.
      I'm with you, Edie! I hate seeing garbage articles littering cyberspace. Sometimes, they are even good articles that I myself have written and some idiot with an article spinner has butchered them and sent them all over....with my byline intact...frustrating, and I hope they'll squash that sort of thing:p
      I always wonder why they even bother- I cannot imagine that many people will be compelled to click on a link in those types of articles... but I guess if the quantity is high enough it makes up for the low quality.
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    • Profile picture of the author mijagi
      Originally Posted by Edie47 View Post

      Interesting video - makes sense. Sending out a huge bunch of low quality spun articles may have worked at one time, but as the web matures and Google and others make their changes, quality will win out over mass produced junk in the long run. People complain because their sites fall in the rankings and their earnings drop, but take a look at who is at the top, and why.
      LOL, with all the crappy one-page sites and/or free blog platforms spammed to death with profile links and blog comments at top of (some) keyword searches, I find this pretty amusing.

      In perfect (future) world, this may be the case, but now, no way.
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  • Profile picture of the author dracoboar
    Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

    As I have always said, article marketing can backfire!

    Before the Panda update, you could have built it for do-follow backlinks and collective traffic, which meant more articles, more traffic. Article syndication was never really a good option for various reasons.

    And after the Panda update, things have become scary. Check this James Martell article by the way.

    Do think before you leap, newbies!

    Note: Even the so-called "experts and biggest proponents of article marketing" DON'T do that. You can know that by doing a backlink search of their websites. Once in a while is acceptable. But DON'T let them fool you by saying that article marketing is the REAL DEAL when it isn't!


    After reading the article i am convinced james martell knows little about article marketing and how it works.

    Duplicate content penalty?

    how many times does google have to SCREAM that there is no such thing. If you are talking about duplicate content penalties, it is hard to take you seriously as an seo expert.
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  • Profile picture of the author michaeldoring
    Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

    As I have always said, article marketing can backfire!

    Before the Panda update, you could have built it for do-follow backlinks and collective traffic, which meant more articles...

    But DON'T let them fool you by saying that article marketing is the REAL DEAL when it isn't!

    And after the Panda update, things have become scary.
    schttrj, you've provided a viewpoint on article marketing, but what are you saying? What things are Scary? And who are Them? Why isn't Article Marketing the real deal?

    schttrj, next time you create a thread: I recommend providing examples to support your statements.

    ramone_johnny, thank you for providing the Matt Cutts YouTube video Do you recommend article marketing as an SEO strategy? - it is a must-watch video for anyone participating in Linkbuilding, or article marketing.


    Originally Posted by Richard Van View Post

    More nonsense from the article marketing bashing king, as usual posted without a shred of evidence.

    Schttrj, You keep going to work as an employee of your SEO company and I'll keep laughing all the way to the bank as my own boss.

    I love your posts. Always so funny, bashing away because you can't figure out how to make it work yourself. I love people like you because you keep the competition away from me. Thank you sir. :p


    Thanks again Schttrj, you truly do the likes of me a jolly splendid service.


    That's right Schttrj, it's all an illusion. Back to work.

    Richard Van, I am confident your breaking a Forum Rule. I wonder if you would say that to Schttrj in real life, especially if he looked like Dwayne Johnson (The Rock). Your post also sounds like nonsense, considering your just insulting another Warrior Member, and indicate your better then us all, but your not prepared to provide a logic retort against his viewpoint.

    Now to the question at hand, is Article Marketing Going Extinct?

    I believe it is alive, but Article Marketing no longer lives in White-Hat St. It has moved to Grey-Hat St. with Google engineers still deciding whether it should be placed in Black-Hat St. - This is evident from the Panda Update, the recent algorithm change and Matt Cutts video on Article Marketing.

    In SEO circles, Article Marketing is primarily used for Linkbuilding. Google is aware of this trend, and be honest with yourself Article Marketing evangelists, resource box links are not editorial and should have little to no PageRank value, which seems to be Google's belief. I am programmer, and Google has already created the technology, without a doubt, to reduce link significance based on location on page, and relation to other content.

    Poor SEO Decision might hurt your website, so use Article Marketing, but don't over do it. Don't believe poor SEO decision can hurt your site? if so, watch: Can I flag spammy links to my site that I didn't create? By Matt Cutts that states '...we removed the language that it's impossible for a competitor to hurt another competitor and replaced it with language along the lines of its very hard...whenever we write an algorithm for example that looks at incoming links we do think about, ok, what if a competitor tried to hurt someone else, and we try to put in code to make sure that is not easy to do'

    Finally, Google acknowledges a trend were most Article Marketing is evil, or poor quality content. In closing, I think Article Marketing is OK, just do it in moderation, just like most things in life.

    p.s. Things always change, and those who do the wrong thing eventually get caught out, and good people like Alan Bleiweiss are evangelists for a better Internet Experience, and they tell Google how to improve, and Matt Cutts and Co. listen, See Alan Bleiweiss Comment
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    • Profile picture of the author DireStraits
      Originally Posted by michaeldoring View Post

      Richard Van, I am confident your breaking a Forum Rule. I wonder if you would say that to Schttrj in real life, especially if he looked like Dwayne Johnson (The Rock). Your post also sounds like nonsense, considering your just insulting another Warrior Member, and indicate your better then us all, but your not prepared to provide a logic retort against his viewpoint.
      Michael (cool name, btw ),

      I don't believe Richard has broken any rule, here. If you look back through Ron's (OP's) posts, you'll see that he has a history of repeating such baseless assertions, and refuses to listen to reason. It's gotten to the point, quite frankly, that all those who've tried in the past have simply gotten bored.

      I, for one - as well as many others, it seems - am not interested in engaging in the age-old debate of "is article marketing dead?", because every single time, it comes down to the same thing: those believing so aren't doing/observing article marketing at all, by any stretch of the true, traditional definition.

      Sometimes they even have a vested interest (emotional and/or financial) in denouncing the effectiveness of article marketing in favour of article directory marketing or SEO ... which recent events (i.e. the Panda algorithm update) have shown to be a fragile model upon which to be reliant, anyway. Still doesn't deter them, though.

      So yes it's irritating. Yes, we've been over it a million times before. And yes, Ron has, for whatever reason, a personal dislike for certain members of this forum (or at least their sentiments) who are proponents and successful practictioners of true article marketing. Hence why he continually makes such wild statements and engages in provocation to arouse the frustrations of those members.


      In other news, the guy who wrote that blog post linked to in the OP is obviously equally clueless about both article marketing and search engine optimisation.
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      • Profile picture of the author michaeldoring
        Originally Posted by DireStraits View Post

        Michael (cool name, btw ),

        I don't believe Richard has broken any rule, here. If you look back through Ron's (OP's) posts, you'll see that he has a history of repeating such baseless assertions, and refuses to listen to reason. It's gotten to the point, quite frankly, that all those who've tried in the past have simply gotten bored.

        I, for one - as well as many others, it seems - am not interested in engaging in the age-old debate of "is article marketing dead?", because every single time, it comes down to the same thing: those believing so aren't doing/observing article marketing at all, by any stretch of the true, traditional definition.

        Sometimes they even have a vested interest (emotional and/or financial) in denouncing the effectiveness of article marketing in favour of article directory marketing or SEO ... which recent events (i.e. the Panda algorithm update) have shown to be a fragile model upon which to be reliant, anyway. Still doesn't deter them, though.

        So yes it's irritating. Yes, we've been over it a million times before. And yes, Ron has, for whatever reason, a personal dislike for certain members of this forum (or at least their sentiments) who are proponents and successful practictioners of true article marketing. Hence why he continually makes such wild statements and engages in provocation to arouse the frustrations of those members.


        In other news, the guy who wrote that blog post linked to in the OP is obviously equally clueless about both article marketing and search engine optimisation.
        DireStraits (Michael), I agree that Article Marketing is alive, its just putting on weight, and no longer plays as much with Google in the playground. I provide more detail on my opinion, http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...ml#post4259012

        Regarding Richard Van, he is verbal attacking Schttrj not the subject matter, which clearly is wrong. The sarcastic and threatening tone is obvious with phrases like "I'd love to say that to his face" , and the statement I'll be in Sydney in January, we could have a beer if you like, I wouldn't like you to think I hid behind a keyboard.

        p.s. I am well aware, that Article Marketing is not just about Linkbuilding, but primarily about traffic generation and sales direct from the Articles themselves. Nevertheless, performance of traffic generation/sales of Article Marketing has also been effected, highlighted by the fact EzineArticles no longer monopolizes the first page of Google.

        p.s. I believe this thread will be canned, its rapidly becoming a flame war. But then again, I am against censorship, so I hope it does not.
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        • Profile picture of the author schttrj
          Originally Posted by michaeldoring View Post

          Regarding Richard Van, he is verbal attacking Schttrj not the subject matter, which clearly is wrong. The sarcastic and threatening tone is obvious with phrases like "I'd love to say that to his face" , and the statement I'll be in Sydney in January, we could have a beer if you like, I wouldn't like you to think I hid behind a keyboard.
          Well, can't say anything. Tell you what, here's what I think. We are all in here for the same purpose.

          And why do we attend this Warrior Forum? To judge, criticize and learn from others' opinions. If I don't listen to what you are saying, I am at a advantage. That's it.
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        • Profile picture of the author Richard Van
          Originally Posted by michaeldoring View Post


          Regarding Richard Van, he is verbal attacking Schttrj not the subject matter, which clearly is wrong. The sarcastic and threatening tone is obvious with phrases like "I'd love to say that to his face" , and the statement I'll be in Sydney in January, we could have a beer if you like, I wouldn't like you to think I hid behind a keyboard.
          Ok. Schttrj.

          My apologies if you felt I was verbally attacking you, I was wrong if that was how it made you felt. Sorry chap.

          Michaeldoring. Chatting on forums is difficult at times and people perceive the tones they want to hear. I was saying I'll be there and we can have a drink. Nothing more. Sorry you felt it was threatening, it wasn't meant to be.

          As for the subject matter, I just left you an example in my last post.

          Anyway, this is all getting a bit stressed like these subjects always do. My response regarding saying it to his face was in response to you saying...

          I wonder if you would say that to Schttrj in real life
          I was saying that I would.

          Now to make life a little calmer and to make you realise I'm not just attacking the OP, I'll delete that post you found so offensive to the OP.
          Signature

          Wibble, bark, my old man's a mushroom etc...

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        • Profile picture of the author tpw
          Originally Posted by michaeldoring View Post

          p.s. I believe this thread will be canned, its rapidly becoming a flame war. But then again, I am against censorship, so I hope it does not.

          I have been around for a while, and I haven't seen anything yet that measures up to the level of a flame war, nor have I seen the tell-tale signals of a thread that was about to be deleted... I am usually pretty good at predicting those.


          Originally Posted by michaeldoring View Post

          DireStraits (Michael), I agree that Article Marketing is alive, its just putting on weight, and no longer plays as much with Google in the playground.

          There are two types of article marketers:

          1. "Old School" - People who understand that good quality, in-context articles appear on all major websites that have oodles of respect from Google and the public-at-large. These folks seek to have their content placed in these high-quality websites (and newsletters) for access to the publishers' audience.

          2. "New School" - People who believe that the only purpose of article marketing is as a link building tool to influence Google's search results. They have never considered that an article should give value to the reader, as they believe that no one will ever see their articles. But they do expect that Google will find the articles and archive them for building link popularity to increase one's ranking in Google.



          A few years ago, I had written an SEO article where I said that if Google was as smart as I thought they were, then they would reduce the value of all articles in an article directory down to nothing.

          I said further that the fact that an article is in an article directory would never be the final determination on the quality of the article.

          An article that finds its way into Mashable.com, WebMd.com, About.com or any of thousands of other Authority Websites is judged to be of good quality by the editors of those Authority sites. (I have had articles published in About.com if you are curious.)

          Therefore the placement of an article in a directory is not the tell-tale signal that the article is of poor quality, but the fact that an article did not find publication in an Authority Website is a pretty good indication that it is probably of poor quality.



          Best I can tell, this is the future direction of Google's algorithm.

          And I say that, because EZA did not take a 100% hit in Google -- it only took a 90% hit.

          Other "article directories" also failed to receive a 100% hit, but the hit was substantial.

          Obviously Google found some articles in the directories that they considered worthy of exclusion in the decimation of the article directories.



          Article Marketing is not "putting on weight" and getting old.

          Instead, the age of "article marketing" as a "mass marketing" tool is just about over.

          And thank God for that.

          Article Marketing was never a tool for the mass marketer until circa 2005, and it was put forward as a method to "screw Google" to get good rankings in Google, despite the consequences and with little regard to the people who want to republish good quality articles and the people who want to find good information.

          The mass marketers are finding less and less value in article marketing, and we "old-school article marketers" welcome the "mass marketing article marketers" hitting the road and leaving "article marketing" to those who give it the respect it deserves.
          Signature
          Bill Platt, Oklahoma USA, PlattPublishing.com
          Publish Coloring Books for Profit (WSOTD 7-30-2015)
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          • Profile picture of the author mattlaclear
            Originally Posted by tpw View Post

            I have been around for a while, and I haven't seen anything yet that measures up to the level of a flame war, nor have I seen the tell-tale signals of a thread that was about to be deleted... I am usually pretty good at predicting those.
            I agree...all we're doing now on the thread is discussing real issues. Of course there will be some differences of opinion. Especially given the fact there are so many different forms of article marketing to choose from.
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            • Profile picture of the author myob
              Agreed, and it seems we all disagree with the OP premise.

              Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

              As I have always said, article marketing can backfire! ... DON'T let them fool you by saying that article marketing is the REAL DEAL when it isn't!
              Signature
              “If I have seen further than others, it is by standing upon the shoulders of giants.” – Isaac Newton
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              • Profile picture of the author Rod Cortez
                Originally Posted by myob View Post

                Agreed, and it seems we all disagree with the OP premise.
                Exactly. And I agree with Bill and Matt, I don't see any flaming going on whatsoever; we're just having a discussion, healthly debate on the issues. The way it was meant to be done in a forum.

                RoD
                Signature
                "Your personal philosophy is the greatest determining factor in how your life works out."
                - Jim Rohn
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            • Profile picture of the author kindsvater
              Earlier this week I had someone hire my law office for a project. The email started: I saw your article .... at ......

              Long article - over 1000 words. Not spun. Providing great content. With my contact information the end. With absolutely zero intent of trying to just get "link juice".

              Do I have articles out there just to get juice? Sure.

              Is that the only reason to write articles? No.

              The tactics are also not mutually exclusive.

              .
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    • Profile picture of the author schttrj
      Originally Posted by michaeldoring View Post

      schttrj, you've provided a viewpoint on article marketing, but what are you saying? What things are Scary? And who are Them? Why isn't Article Marketing the real deal?

      schttrj, next time you create a thread: I recommend providing examples to support your statements.
      Yeah actually I did. If you don't know I have done search on a couple of people's sites here, and none of this "article-marketing experts" sites show that they have backlinks from any article directories or any other blog where it was syndicated, my first point.

      But here I must say, I am NOT against article marketing. For God's sake, why would I be?

      And if you ask me, I can show you the screenshot of my own EZA account. None of the experts would show that! Ask them for their proof first. We are talking logic here. What might happen...That's just a theory and I am asking the qualified Warrior members to render in their valuable comment.

      Originally Posted by michaeldoring View Post

      Now to the question at hand, is Article Marketing Going Extinct?

      I believe it is alive, but Article Marketing no longer lives in White-Hat St. It has moved to Grey-Hat St. with Google engineers still deciding whether it should be placed in Black-Hat St. - This is evident from the Panda Update, the recent algorithm change and Matt Cutts video on Article Marketing.

      In SEO circles, Article Marketing is primarily used for Linkbuilding. Google is aware of this trend, and be honest with yourself Article Marketing evangelists, resource box links are not editorial and should have little to no PageRank value, which seems to be Google's belief. I am programmer, and Google has already created the technology, without a doubt, to reduce link significance based on location on page, and relation to other content.

      Poor SEO Decision might hurt your website, so use Article Marketing, but don't over do it. Don't believe poor SEO decision can hurt your site? if so, watch: Can I flag spammy links to my site that I didn't create? By Matt Cutts that states '...we removed the language that it's impossible for a competitor to hurt another competitor and replaced it with language along the lines of its very hard...whenever we write an algorithm for example that looks at incoming links we do think about, ok, what if a competitor tried to hurt someone else, and we try to put in code to make sure that is not easy to do'

      Finally, Google acknowledges a trend were most Article Marketing is evil, or poor quality content. In closing, I think Article Marketing is OK, just do it in moderation, just like most things in life.

      p.s. Things always change, and those who do the wrong thing eventually get caught out, and good people like Alan Bleiweiss are evangelists for a better Internet Experience, and they tell Google how to improve, and Matt Cutts and Co. listen, See Alan Bleiweiss Comment
      Yes, it is in grey hat st and might end up in the black hat st..but who knows. But when you are talking about moderation, what do you mean? Say, we are talking about bad neighborhoods here. So, if the article directories fall in the eyes of big G, would an inbound link from that article directory be any useful or might be harmful for SEO?

      As is written in the James Martell article, the syndicated articles mostly end up in low quality sites. So, if you even get a backlink there, will it be good or bad?
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  • Profile picture of the author mehmlyndsy
    I do a lot of article posting but my site does not effects. Why?
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    • Profile picture of the author dracoboar
      Originally Posted by mehmlyndsy View Post

      I do a lot of article posting but my site does not effects. Why?
      Post your articles to a few select quality article sites then wait about 2 weeks.

      After about 2 weeks put a chunk of your articles in copyscape and look who has republished you content. Copyscape tends to find higher quality results than a google search which is why i recommend them

      If you find a quality site that has published your articles (not a spam or roboblog) make contact with the webmaster and form a relationship. offer new exclusive content and see if you can continue to get quality links.

      Rinse and repeat

      If you just post articles to directories for links over time this will work but google consideres these links as garbage and they pass very little trust/authority. The name of the game is forging relationships with quality content webmasters who can offer quality links.
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      • Profile picture of the author joseph despariak
        Another "article marketing is dead" thread?! WooHoo!

        Mr. Martell's article lacks a valid debatable point of view. In other words, his entire article is one sided and he fails to offer an alternative or opposing argument.

        He also fails to provide any viable proof that article marketing in his terms has harmed or delisted or caused any site to be penalized by Google.

        The now-famous Matt Cutts video discussing article marketing was a direct point towards the method of republishing articles from one article directory onto content farm sites or adsense sites, with no relevant content to support the republished posts.

        Matt Cutts and Amit Singhal both agree that content and articles are the best and most productive means of promoting your website.

        "Our goal is simple: to give people the most relevant answers to their queries as quickly as possible..."

        AND
        "Google depends on the high-quality content created by wonderful websites around the world, and we do have a responsibility to encourage a healthy web ecosystem. Therefore, it is important for high-quality sites to be rewarded, and that’s exactly what this change does."

        source:Amit Singhal and Matt Cutts, 2/24/2011, http://googleblog.blogspot.com/2011/...-sites-in.html


        Article Marketing is not dead and will never succumb to the rumors of uneducated marketers who fail to provide the proper high quality content that Google wants!

        As a sidenote:

        I started a new blog in May 2011 (currently has 45 posts) to test some of the article marketing theories, this site is now listed in SEM rush with 16 KW as well as Alexa (196,000) and have top listings in Google for several lucrative keywords with more than 600 indexed pages on Google.

        The only method I used to promote this site is article marketing, yet I did it in an acceptable manner consistent with Google's guidelines.

        So maybe YOUR method of article marketing is dead, however, my method is alive and well!

        Joe
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        • Profile picture of the author schttrj
          Originally Posted by joseph despariak View Post

          Another "article marketing is dead" thread?! WooHoo!

          Mr. Martell's article lacks a valid debatable point of view. In other words, his entire article is one sided and he fails to offer an alternative or opposing argument.

          He also fails to provide any viable proof that article marketing in his terms has harmed or delisted or caused any site to be penalized by Google.

          The now-famous Matt Cutts video discussing article marketing was a direct point towards the method of republishing articles from one article directory onto content farm sites or adsense sites, with no relevant content to support the republished posts.

          Matt Cutts and Amit Singhal both agree that content and articles are the best and most productive means of promoting your website.

          "Our goal is simple: to give people the most relevant answers to their queries as quickly as possible..."

          AND
          "Google depends on the high-quality content created by wonderful websites around the world, and we do have a responsibility to encourage a healthy web ecosystem. Therefore, it is important for high-quality sites to be rewarded, and that's exactly what this change does."

          source:Amit Singhal and Matt Cutts, 2/24/2011, Official Google Blog: Finding more high-quality sites in search


          Article Marketing is not dead and will never succumb to the rumors of uneducated marketers who fail to provide the proper high quality content that Google wants!

          As a sidenote:

          I started a new blog in May 2011 (currently has 45 posts) to test some of the article marketing theories, this site is now listed in SEM rush with 16 KW as well as Alexa (196,000) and have top listings in Google for several lucrative keywords with more than 600 indexed pages on Google.

          The only method I used to promote this site is article marketing, yet I did it in an acceptable manner consistent with Google's guidelines.

          So maybe YOUR method of article marketing is dead, however, my method is alive and well!

          Joe
          Lovely! At last, someone who has done an experiment and got some proof. Can we know the name of the site or blog please?
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        • Profile picture of the author mattlaclear
          Originally Posted by joseph despariak View Post

          Another "article marketing is dead" thread?! WooHoo!

          Mr. Martell's article lacks a valid debatable point of view. In other words, his entire article is one sided and he fails to offer an alternative or opposing argument.

          He also fails to provide any viable proof that article marketing in his terms has harmed or delisted or caused any site to be penalized by Google.

          The now-famous Matt Cutts video discussing article marketing was a direct point towards the method of republishing articles from one article directory onto content farm sites or adsense sites, with no relevant content to support the republished posts.

          Matt Cutts and Amit Singhal both agree that content and articles are the best and most productive means of promoting your website.

          "Our goal is simple: to give people the most relevant answers to their queries as quickly as possible..."

          AND
          "Google depends on the high-quality content created by wonderful websites around the world, and we do have a responsibility to encourage a healthy web ecosystem. Therefore, it is important for high-quality sites to be rewarded, and that's exactly what this change does."

          source:Amit Singhal and Matt Cutts, 2/24/2011, Official Google Blog: Finding more high-quality sites in search


          Article Marketing is not dead and will never succumb to the rumors of uneducated marketers who fail to provide the proper high quality content that Google wants!

          As a sidenote:

          I started a new blog in May 2011 (currently has 45 posts) to test some of the article marketing theories, this site is now listed in SEM rush with 16 KW as well as Alexa (196,000) and have top listings in Google for several lucrative keywords with more than 600 indexed pages on Google.

          The only method I used to promote this site is article marketing, yet I did it in an acceptable manner consistent with Google's guidelines.

          So maybe YOUR method of article marketing is dead, however, my method is alive and well!

          Joe
          With all due respect who gives a royal s**t about what Matt Cutt has to say about seo? He is nothing more than a source of misinformation aimed at keeping seo'ers down to a minimum.

          Everything he shares is meant to keep you off the track of what really works.
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      • Profile picture of the author schttrj
        Originally Posted by dracoboar View Post

        Post your articles to a few select quality article sites then wait about 2 weeks.

        After about 2 weeks put a chunk of your articles in copyscape and look who has republished you content. Copyscape tends to find higher quality results than a google search which is why i recommend them

        If you find a quality site that has published your articles (not a spam or roboblog) make contact with the webmaster and form a relationship. offer new exclusive content and see if you can continue to get quality links.

        Rinse and repeat

        If you just post articles to directories for links over time this will work but google consideres these links as garbage and they pass very little trust/authority. The name of the game is forging relationships with quality content webmasters who can offer quality links.
        Can you please let us know your blog or site? I would love to check it.
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        • Profile picture of the author dracoboar
          Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

          Can you please let us know your blog or site? I would love to check it.
          my blog sites are all niche sites and i will not pstt them here to be stolen

          my ecommerce site is this

          Thor's CB Radio. - 10 Meter Radios - CB Radios And Accessories

          you didint say it in your post but i assume you are checking for article marketing links, well thats all thi site has and it does pretty damn well for being a litle over a year old
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          • Profile picture of the author schttrj
            Originally Posted by dracoboar View Post

            my blog sites are all niche sites and i will not pstt them here to be stolen

            my ecommerce site is this

            Thor's CB Radio. - 10 Meter Radios - CB Radios And Accessories

            you didint say it in your post but i assume you are checking for article marketing links, well thats all thi site has and it does pretty damn well for being a litle over a year old
            Dude, don't get me wrong. But the Alexa rank over 22650000 doesn't seem to be helping you. Yes, I checked the site. And yes, you have mostly article links (that comes up to around 90) for that site. You should start adding more articles may be. My two cents.

            As for getting your site stolen, the sites and blogs that we show in the signature...aren't they worthy to be stolen?

            But thanks for showing the site. Appreciated it.
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            • Profile picture of the author dracoboar
              Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

              Dude, don't get me wrong. But the Alexa rank over 22650000 doesn't seem to be helping you. Yes, I checked the site. And yes, you have mostly article links (that comes up to around 90) for that site. You should start adding more articles may be. My two cents.

              As for getting your site stolen, the sites and blogs that we show in the signature...aren't they worthy to be stolen?

              But thanks for showing the site. Appreciated it.

              ummm I dont know what tool you are using but according to my webmaster tools this site has over 2,000 backlinks from directory sites.

              As far as alexa ranking etc I have no idea what I do know is this site has almost exclusivley directory links and MAKES MONEY. A tthe end of the day that is all that matters.
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    • Profile picture of the author Richard Van
      Originally Posted by michaeldoring View Post


      Richard Van, I am confident your breaking a Forum Rule. I wonder if you would say that to Schttrj in real life, especially if he looked like Dwayne Johnson (The Rock). Your post also sounds like nonsense, considering your just insulting another Warrior Member, and indicate your better then us all, but your not prepared to provide a logic retort against his viewpoint.
      Well I'm an ex football hooligan that grew up in the East End of London. I'd love to say that to his face. Don't please make up assumptions about me, I find that offensive.

      My post wasn't nonsense at all. I make a nice bit of my income from article syndication so when he says it's no good why wouldn't I come along and say so? We've said it countless times to him and I'm not insulting him at all I'm pointing out I fully disagree with him as I've done many times.

      and indicate your better then us all
      Bad assumption to make. You don't know me at all, I don't think I'm better than anyone. You made that up.

      but your not prepared to provide a logic retort against his viewpoint.
      I have done, many times, as have many others. Perhaps you would care to take a look at all those previous posts where this has been discussed as well.

      Thanks for your response though, I appreciate you making those assumptions up about me and whether or not I'd have the bottle to say it to his face or indeed this to yours. Trust me though, I would love to.

      I'll be in Sydney in January, we could have a beer if you like, I wouldn't like you to think I hid behind a keyboard. I'm hoping to meet up with Ramone Johnny and WillR when I'm there too, we could make it a foursome.

      Now, I'll explain my point so you understand what I was saying, I'll even give you an example.

      I believe it is alive, but Article Marketing no longer lives in White-Hat St. It has moved to Grey-Hat St. with Google engineers still deciding whether it should be placed in Black-Hat St. - This is evident from the Panda Update, the recent algorithm change and Matt Cutts video on Article Marketing.
      Right. All of the above has nothing to do with what I do. That is article "directory" marketing. I base my articles around getting high quality articles published on authority sites in the niches I'm in. Say I had a product on cleaning elephants, I create or pay someone to create a very good set of articles on cleaning elephants. I then approach all the top sites on elephant cleaning and form a relationship, I sell myself, I give them valuable content with the stipulation I have a link back to my site at the end. Those elephant cleaning sites have lots of relevant and interested readers, they read my article, many visit my site. This is highly targeted traffic.

      This is called article syndication and is what article directories were originally made for, hence the expression "directory" - A directory of articles and incidentally that's why Ezine articles is called so - it was originally where ezines went to get articles and content for their site. This, of course, was before many people decided to spam the directories with junk for those backlinks and the hope that people who wanted to learn about cleaning elephants would spend their days on article directories instead of elephant cleaning authority sites. (Just so you're aware, the elephant cleaning example was just that, an example)
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      • Profile picture of the author michaeldoring
        Originally Posted by Richard Van View Post

        Well I'm an ex football hooligan that grew up in the East End of London. I'd love to say that to his face. Don't please make up assumptions about me, I find that offensive.

        My post wasn't nonsense at all. I make a nice bit of my income from article syndication so when he says it's no good why wouldn't I come along and say so. We've said it countless times to him and I'm not insulting him at all I'm pointing out I fully disagree with him as I've done many times.

        Bad assumption to make. You don't know me at all, I don't think I'm better than anyone. You made that up.

        I have done, many times, as have many others. Perhaps you would care to take a look at all those previous posts where this has been discussed as well.

        Thanks for your response though, I appreciate you making those assumptions up about me and whether or not I'd have the bottle to say it to his face or indeed this to yours. Trust me though, I would love to.

        I'll be in Sydney in January, we could have a beer if you like, I wouldn't like you to think I hid behind a keyboard. I'm hoping to meet up with Ramone Johnny and WillR when I'm there too, we could make it a foursome.
        I disagree, but this follow up post explains a lot. Thanks for your reply, have a great day.
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  • Profile picture of the author Claire Sharp
    I will personally take this as a good tip. I have read James Martell article, and he is right. Article marketing is a weak short sighted marketing model.
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  • Profile picture of the author herrador
    Hi schttrj,

    In my book article writing is definitely not dead...not by a long way.

    I say that from experience in several different niches and with client websites. Watching the video may discourage some people but the key to my mind was the originality comment.

    Throwing out spun articles does a little to help but a few unique articles to the top directories goes a lot further. It is the age old "quantity v quality" argument.

    Personally I use articles in such a way as...

    1 they are original
    2 not all links point to my site (they point to another same topic article that does point to my site)
    3 take or make RSS feeds of the articles and submit those to RSS aggregators

    Bearing in mind this is only one part of a marketers arsenal, it is then up to the individual if they want to use this or not. For me it is one key part of my SEO strategy for all my sites.
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    • Profile picture of the author schttrj
      Originally Posted by herrador View Post

      Hi schttrj,

      In my book article writing is definitely not dead...not by a long way.

      I say that from experience in several different niches and with client websites. Watching the video may discourage some people but the key to my mind was the originality comment.

      Throwing out spun articles does a little to help but a few unique articles to the top directories goes a lot further. It is the age old "quantity v quality" argument.

      Personally I use articles in such a way as...

      1 they are original
      2 not all links point to my site (they point to another same topic article that does point to my site)
      3 take or make RSS feeds of the articles and submit those to RSS aggregators

      Bearing in mind this is only one part of a marketers arsenal, it is then up to the individual if they want to use this or not. For me it is one key part of my SEO strategy for all my sites.
      Yes basically.

      It is only A PART of the whole strategy. But sometimes, we gotta stop and think if what we are doing is worth it.

      That was the deal anyway. Anyway thanks for your comment.
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      • Profile picture of the author vikingmarketer
        Yeah wouw article marketing is dead(sarcasm)

        Personally I don't really do article marketing as such, but that's more because I would rather focus on getting my own assests build and climbing higher on search engines.

        And if I remember correctly about the article from Matt. Isn't he that dude which is always out screaming that doesn't work anymore?

        I can tell you most stuff still works just as good if not better than before, because a tiny change have destroyed so many of the people who are "experts".

        Autoblogs are still going strong,so is content cloaking and so on.

        But hey if I had the status in the IM niche I would also try to hunt people away from all kinds of stuff. More room for me

        If you wan't to put an idea into the head of fellow IM'ers and newbies here or if it's you who just believe blindly what that guy says. Then go for it, although I find it a shame to destroy it for everyone else with the doubts you have, caused by rumors.


        Patrick
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  • Profile picture of the author DireStraits
    Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

    Dude, don't get me wrong. But the Alexa rank over 22650000 doesn't seem to be helping you.
    I honestly don't see how an Alexa Rank below 22650000 would help him any more. Alexa Rank is an indication of nothing except how many people with the Alexa Toolbar installed on their computers come to your site, in relation to others. It says nothing about overall traffic levels, earnings, authority, or indeed anything else that really matters at all. :confused:
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    • Profile picture of the author tpw
      Originally Posted by DireStraits View Post

      I honestly don't see how an Alexa Rank below 22650000 would help him any more. Alexa Rank is an indication of nothing except how many people with the Alexa Toolbar installed on their computers come to your site, in relation to others. It says nothing about overall traffic levels, earnings, authority, or indeed anything else that really matters at all. :confused:

      I tend to believe that the Alexa toolbar is generally only used by SEO people to "prove" to their customers the value of what they provide.

      The only people in my experience that actually use the Alexa toolbar are SEO people, and most of those folks are from overseas, without stating from exactly where.

      I used to use Alexa toolbar daily.

      Then I took the Alexa toolbar down for a couple weeks, because I was having memory problems on my computer -- anything to get some operating power out of the silly thing.

      But interestingly, in the two weeks that I had stopped using the toolbar, my daily traffic average dropped from 60,000 to 200,000.

      When I realized that, I realized that "me" using the toolbar skewed my results by 140,000 places!!

      That is when I stopped seeing value in the Alexa rankings.


      p.s. I own a website that gets 60% of its traffic from India-Pakistan. It has a really high Alexa ranking.
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      • Profile picture of the author schttrj
        Originally Posted by tpw View Post

        I tend to believe that the Alexa toolbar is generally only used by SEO people to "prove" to their customers the value of what they provide.

        The only people in my experience that actually use the Alexa toolbar are SEO people, and most of those folks are from overseas, without stating from exactly where.

        I used to use Alexa toolbar daily.

        Then I took the Alexa toolbar down for a couple weeks, because I was having memory problems on my computer -- anything to get some operating power out of the silly thing.

        But interestingly, in the two weeks that I had stopped using the toolbar, my daily traffic average dropped from 60,000 to 200,000.

        When I realized that, I realized that "me" using the toolbar skewed my results by 140,000 places!!

        That is when I stopped seeing value in the Alexa rankings.


        p.s. I own a website that gets 60% of its traffic from India-Pakistan. It has a really high Alexa ranking.
        Uh huh...I am listening to what you are saying. Points noted. Please keep it coming. Tell you what, this is what I originally wanted in this thread. People to share what they knew.
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  • Profile picture of the author Rod Cortez
    Interesting article, thanks for sharing.

    I just finished reading the entire article and watched the video. What's funny is that he's describing only one aspect of article marketing and fails to mention any other kind of article marketing. I saw nothing in the article about distribution channels, establishing relationships with webmasters / authors, effective syndication, etc.

    It's like me saying that internet marketing can back fire on you because Google can suspend or ban your Adwords account. Well, that's true if you only rely on Adwords for 100% of your traffic and you don't follow Google's guidelines and terms of use. That's only one very, tiny aspect of internet marketing.

    So I agree with him on how he describes article marketing, which the way it was done in 2005, but disagree with him that it's a "short-sighted marketing model" because he's only describing one very small aspect of it and fails to cover the whole gambut of article marketing strategies:



    In my opinion, “article marketing” is a weak short sighted marketing model. Get this:
    1. write articles
    2. submit to articles to directories <LI sizset="367" sizcache="17">receive a blip traffic <LI sizset="369" sizcache="17">articles filtered by Google from the results
    3. start all over
    I have chatted about article marketing for many years. Yes some have made money, but nothing compared to what could have made if they used a strategy that was not offensive (or filtered) by Google.
    But what he fails to mention is how article marketing can be very effective in 2011. And he doesn't know this because he hasn't done it or practiced it himself; so he's giving a misinformed opinion. Quoting Matt Cutts only proves his point, weakly I might add, on one way that article marketing is done and how he defined it (which was defined incorrectly so his premise is already flawed). So I actually agree with him on that very specific point. There is a lot of misinformation out there about marketing by using articles and he does point that out.

    When people write content in the form of articles, they can submit them to article directories, but that's only one very small aspect of it. They can also submit press releases. He doesn't mention that at all. They can create short reports and submit them to ebook directories. They can create podcasts and videos and submit those as well. He fails to mention that as well. Articles are not limited to the written word.

    They can create a network of their own blogs and submit their content on their own blog network. It's also the distribution of that content that is very important, something that he leaves out in his article. So on one hand I agree with him that the way he describes article marketing is not the way to do it. But I disagree with him that it's ineffective because he only described one aspect of it.

    As long as people want content on the Internet, article marketing will be around for decades to come; however, the manner on how it's implemented and incorporated in marketing funnels will definitely change. It's definitely changed a lot in 5 years and people who have kept up with those changes have benefited tremendously. Sheesh, it's changed in the past year!

    Even in the article he admits that he doesn't know the future of article marketing and decides to make a "prophecy" that it's not "worth the risk." Well, he is certainly entitled to his opinion as I am mine. I've been reading about the "death" of article marketing for years. I remember ten years ago when several experts predicted the death of e-mail marketing. I think the bigger point he should have made should have been to not put all your eggs in one basket.

    That would have made more sense to me. And that's my opinion based on over a decade's worth of marketing with articles, which is only one way of many on how I get traffic to my websites.

    I found his article to be quite short-sighted and incomplete.

    RoD
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  • Profile picture of the author cashcow
    I still get a ton of traffic from my articles written over the years.

    Also, the article referenced in the OP may be a bit biased as James Martell offers a very expensive guest blogging membership that consists of all the things the article talks about. Then again perhaps this is really the way James feels about article marketing and that's why he started the guest blogging membership. I used to follow him quite closely actually and I thought he used to be really big on article marketing.

    As for the Matt Cutts video, you have to kind of take what they say publicly over at google with a grain of salt and do your own testing.
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  • Profile picture of the author mattlaclear
    Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

    As I have always said, article marketing can backfire!

    Before the Panda update, you could have built it for do-follow backlinks and collective traffic, which meant more articles, more traffic. Article syndication was never really a good option for various reasons.

    And after the Panda update, things have become scary. Check this James Martell article by the way.

    Do think before you leap, newbies!

    Note: Even the so-called "experts and biggest proponents of article marketing" DON'T do that. You can know that by doing a backlink search of their websites. Once in a while is acceptable. But DON'T let them fool you by saying that article marketing is the REAL DEAL when it isn't!
    Thank goodness the authority on article marketing has enlightened us that article marketing doesn't work. Does that mean I really didn't grab over 3500 page one rankings in the last 12 month using only article marketing? I thought for sure it was working too! Who do I send the $500k back to that we collected in the last 12 months from article marketing? Inquiring minds want to know.

    Or maybe...just maybe article marketing doesn't work for the op so he concludes it doesn't work for anyone.

    Maybe I said.
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  • Profile picture of the author kindsvater
    I doubt Google will ban someone from their services because they submitted a bad article to a low value site.

    It isn't Google's website.

    The solution, which seems to have escaped Google, is to simply not index a site once it deems it of low value.

    If there is junk in Google's index, whose fault is that?

    .
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  • Profile picture of the author Kurt
    A couple of quick points...

    Just because there hasn't been a doop penalty in the past, doesn't mean there won't be one in the future. Plus, I'm not too sure there isn't one now. It's possible this is part of the Panda updates.

    And, do Martell and Cutts have links to spinner software in ther sigs? Sure sounds like they are (indirectly) promoting them.
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  • Profile picture of the author smartdoctor
    Article marketing hasnt gone extinct; In fact I've learnt that no technology ever goes away totally! What happens is that the creators of that form of technology change something to adapt to the industry requirements which keep fluctuating and so also those involved in the same (in this case those who use article marketing to promote stuff online) have also to adjust.

    Its an excellent adapt or die situation; you choose the side you wanna be!


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  • Profile picture of the author mattlaclear
    Blog networks prove their is no such thing as a duplicate content penalty.
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    • Profile picture of the author Kurt
      Originally Posted by mattlaclear View Post

      Blog networks prove their is no such thing as a duplicate content penalty.
      No they don't. A penalty doesn't mean that there can't be value, it could be that a penalty only decreases the value.

      For example, a link from a 100% "unique" page could be worth 100 "points" and a link from a 50% "unique" page could be worth only 80 "points", with a 20 "point" penalty...And in this case, the link is still worth more than "0", while still being "penalized".

      And like I said before, even if there isn't a doop penalty now, it's illogical to assume there won't be one in the future. If Google really doesn't like article marketing, a doop content penalty seems like a logical move to me. Although, they would probably exclude whitelisted news sites from the algo.
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      • Profile picture of the author mattlaclear
        Originally Posted by Kurt View Post

        No they don't. A penalty doesn't mean that there can't be value, it could be that a penalty only decreases the value.

        For example, a link from a 100% "unique" page could be worth 100 "points" and a link from a 50% "unique" page could be worth only 80 "points", with a 20 "point" penalty...And in this case, the link is still worth more than "0", while still being "penalized".

        And like I said before, even if there isn't a doop penalty now, it's illogical to assume there won't be one in the future. If Google really doesn't like article marketing, a doop content penalty seems like a logical move to me. Although, they would probably exclude whitelisted news sites from the algo.
        Google could stop blog networks in their tracks if they wanted to. All they would have to do is blacklist every ip that the known seo hosts are making available. But they don't do that for some reason.

        I also have read here on the forum that G's algorithm is so strong it even detects spun articles and labels them as duplicates.

        But I just haven't seen it.

        We auto spin plr articles and submit them to our blog network. They read like crap but boy do they pack some juice. Our traffic to those sites are 99.99% from the crawlers.

        If Google were to decrease the effectiveness of a backlink then that would only force the marketer to submit a higher quantity of links. Which is extremely easy to do.

        We have 15 staffers who submit links for us. With that we are able to submit 500,000 links a day to our network.

        Divide those 500k by 15 you can see one person can easily submit 33k links a day onto their network of sites.

        So if juice is available via article marketing (and it is!) it doesn't matter if Google is giving out 100% credit for the link or even 1%. As long as there is juice there it will be extracted.
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        • Profile picture of the author dracoboar
          Originally Posted by mattlaclear View Post

          Google could stop blog networks in their tracks if they wanted to. All they would have to do is blacklist every ip that the known seo hosts are making available. But they don't do that for some reason.

          I also have read here on the forum that G's algorithm is so strong it even detects spun articles and labels them as duplicates.

          But I just haven't seen it.

          We auto spin plr articles and submit them to our blog network. They read like crap but boy do they pack some juice. Our traffic to those sites are 99.99% from the crawlers.

          If Google were to decrease the effectiveness of a backlink then that would only force the marketer to submit a higher quantity of links. Which is extremely easy to do.

          We have 15 staffers who submit links for us. With that we are able to submit 500,000 links a day to our network.

          Divide those 500k by 15 you can see one person can easily submit 33k links a day onto their network of sites.

          So if juice is available via article marketing (and it is!) it doesn't matter if Google is giving out 100% credit for the link or even 1%. As long as there is juice there it will be extracted.

          Matt,

          I had a question for you. I am trying to build a blog network myself and have almost a thousand articles at my disposal that my writting team has genereated.

          Is there spinning software that you use to make this porcess quicker? The thought of manually spinning 1000 articles makes me light headed.



          Thank you for any ancient chinese secrets you may reveal.
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          • Profile picture of the author mattlaclear
            Originally Posted by Kurt View Post

            And a point I left out above...Even if there isn't a doop content penalty, what about an "unique" content bonus?

            You just posted yourself that "unique" gives more value than "doop".

            Whether it's a "unique bonus" or a "doop penalty" at play, I agree that there are benefits to not duplicating the same content across the web, from an SEO point of view.
            Unless of course the se's are adapt as some are saying. Maybe they see right through the spun articles and are counting them as dupes. Who knows.

            Originally Posted by dracoboar View Post

            Matt,

            I had a question for you. I am trying to build a blog network myself and have almost a thousand articles at my disposal that my writting team has genereated.

            Is there spinning software that you use to make this porcess quicker? The thought of manually spinning 1000 articles makes me light headed.

            Thank you for any ancient chinese secrets you may reveal.
            We used The Best Spinner for a year. Now my entire staff is using Magic Article Rewriter. The latter works much more efficiently in my opinion.

            When you set up your network understand that .info's work very well. Start out with 200 or so sites and make sure you register them with Godaddy so you can get the free private registration upgrade they offer with bulk orders.

            Then take a program like Link Farm ($500) and input the log ins to your blogs and you're all set. Article Marketing Robot (under $100) works pretty much the same as well.

            Find a good seo host and purchase 20 c class ips and ind install 10 blogs per ip.

            All you need to do is create a resource box and let it rip.
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            • Profile picture of the author dracoboar
              Originally Posted by mattlaclear View Post

              Unless of course the se's are adapt as some are saying. Maybe they see right through the spun articles and are counting them as dupes. Who knows.


              We used The Best Spinner for a year. Now my entire staff is using Magic Article Rewriter. The latter works much more efficiently in my opinion.

              When you set up your network understand that .info's work very well. Start out with 200 or so sites and make sure you register them with Godaddy so you can get the free private registration upgrade they offer with bulk orders.

              Then take a program like Link Farm ($500) and input the log ins to your blogs and you're all set. Article Marketing Robot (under $100) works pretty much the same as well.

              Find a good seo host and purchase 20 c class ips and ind install 10 blogs per ip.

              All you need to do is create a resource box and let it rip.

              Matt,

              I greatly appreciate your tips and already had 90% of that done which is a relief that I am doing it right.

              One last question, do you try and kep the blogs relevant to what you are linking to?

              thank you again
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              • Profile picture of the author mattlaclear
                Originally Posted by myob View Post

                All I do is write one or two articles a week and submit them to my syndicated network of 25,000+ webmasters, bloggers, ezine publishers, and offline outlets such as magazines, trade journals, newspapers, etc. These are real live targeted eyeballs. It does not take many articles at all to quickly break into any market no matter how tough the competition may be.
                For certain that tactic generates traffic. It just takes a whole lot of work. Glad to hear you are rocking it pretty good.

                Originally Posted by dracoboar View Post

                Matt,

                I greatly appreciate your tips and already had 90% of that done which is a relief that I am doing it right.

                One last question, do you try and kep the blogs relevant to what you are linking to?

                thank you again
                We thought so at first. But over the months have discovered that it wasn't the case.

                Just don't try to rank any of the sites in the network. To me that was what Panda was all about. Eliminating junk sites from reaching high up in the serps.

                Also do not use your network to rank any sites for keywords that are not relevant to it. Which is all Google cares about. They want to keep their product clean is all.
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            • Profile picture of the author Kurt
              Originally Posted by mattlaclear View Post

              Unless of course the se's are adapt as some are saying. Maybe they see right through the spun articles and are counting them as dupes. Who knows.
              .
              IMO, I don't believe Google places a black/white definition on unique vs. doop. I'm guessing it's more like a page is "88% unique", etc.

              However, by breaking up text vectors and n-grams, Google will have a very hard time determining if two pages are doops of each other.

              For those that don't know:

              n-grams - strings of text where "n" equals a number. The strings can be letters or words.

              text vectors - the position and relationship of those n-grams to the other n-grams on any given page.
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  • Profile picture of the author tpw
    Is the only reason to ever consider doing article marketing for the purpose of influencing Google?

    Does Google hold all of the cards as to the power and effectiveness of article marketing?

    NO and NO.

    If you think the only reason to do article marketing is to get ranked in Google, then stop doing it.

    We old-school article marketers will keep using article marketing as a promotion method, because we don't do article marketing to impress Google. We do it to drive targeted and relevant traffic to our websites.

    We were doing article marketing when Google was still barely a blip on anyone's radar. And we will keep doing article marketing after Google is gone.

    If Google kicks me out of its search engine, because I do article marketing, I will only lose 1/3rd of my traffic.

    And 2/3rds of my traffic will continue to come, because I have never done article marketing to please Google.

    Using article marketing as a tool to influence Google has only been a major "school of thought" since circa 2005.

    I was doing article marketing for 5 years before then. And I will continue doing article marketing, even when Google is telling me to stop doing it. Funk Google!!!

    So long as you continue to believe that Google is the only source of traffic worth having, you will continue to shoot yourself in the foot.

    And if you decide to give up on article marketing because Google doesn't like it, then hurrah! Because I will have to compete with fewer schmucks to get the recognition I want for my articles.
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    • Profile picture of the author mattlaclear
      Originally Posted by tpw View Post

      If you think the only reason to do article marketing is to get ranked in Google, then stop doing it.
      Really Bill? I simply have to disagree with the statement. In fact it doesn't even make sense.

      Almost everyone that gets traffic from article marketing receives the bulk of the traffic through their improved standings on the serps.

      So you're saying that isn't a strong enough target to go after?
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      • Profile picture of the author myob
        Originally Posted by tpw View Post

        If you think the only reason to do article marketing is to get ranked in Google, then stop doing it.

        Originally Posted by mattlaclear View Post

        Really Bill? I simply have to disagree with the statement. In fact it doesn't even make sense.

        Almost everyone that gets traffic from article marketing receives the bulk of the traffic through their improved standings on the serps.

        So you're saying that isn't a strong enough target to go after?

        Bill's post makes perfect sense to me. All of my websites are in some of the most hotly competitive niches and buried in the murky depths of the SERPs. Virtually none of my traffic comes from the search engines. Almost all of it comes from syndicated articles hitching a ride on the top ranking websites, blogs, etc. And indeed, those markets are the best ones to go after. As I have often said, Google is totally irrelevant in my marketing.
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        • Profile picture of the author mattlaclear
          Originally Posted by myob View Post

          Bill's post makes perfect sense to me. All of my websites are in some of the most hotly competitive niches and buried in the murky depths of the SERPs. Virtually none of my traffic comes from the search engines. Almost all of it comes from syndicated articles hitching a ride on the top ranking websites, blogs, etc. And indeed, those markets are the top ones to go after. As I have often said, Google is totally irrelevant in my marketing.
          To me that is the main reason I do not submit unspun articles. It takes too long to grab juice from the links. So the only traffic you get are from the directories.

          But if you took that same article and spun it and posted it to a blog network of say 200 sites you would get far more juice. Then you take another article you have written and repeat the process. But sooner or later you will run out of content and your juice will dry up.

          That's why spun plr articles is the way to go. There is no end to the amount of juice you can generate with them.
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          • Profile picture of the author Kurt
            Originally Posted by mattlaclear View Post

            To me that is the main reason I do not submit unspun articles. It takes too long to grab juice from the links. So the only traffic you get are from the directories.

            But if you took that same article and spun it and posted it to a blog network of say 200 sites you would get far more juice. Then you take another article you have written and repeat the process. But sooner or later you will run out of content and your juice will dry up.

            That's why spun plr articles is the way to go. There is no end to the amount of juice you can generate with them.
            And a point I left out above...Even if there isn't a doop content penalty, what about an "unique" content bonus?

            You just posted yourself that "unique" gives more value than "doop".

            Whether it's a "unique bonus" or a "doop penalty" at play, I agree that there are benefits to not duplicating the same content across the web, from an SEO point of view.
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          • Profile picture of the author myob
            Originally Posted by mattlaclear View Post

            To me that is the main reason I do not submit unspun articles. It takes too long to grab juice from the links. So the only traffic you get are from the directories.

            But if you took that same article and spun it and posted it to a blog network of say 200 sites you would get far more juice. Then you take another article you have written and repeat the process. But sooner or later you will run out of content and your juice will dry up.

            That's why spun plr articles is the way to go. There is no end to the amount of juice you can generate with them.
            All I do is write one or two articles a week and submit them to my syndicated network of 25,000+ webmasters, bloggers, ezine publishers, and offline outlets such as magazines, trade journals, newspapers, etc. These are real live targeted eyeballs. It does not take many articles at all to quickly break into any market no matter how tough the competition may be.
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      • Profile picture of the author tpw
        Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

        And in regards to what Kurt said, I would still remind you that Google Panda update is still in the beta process. There are changes still being done.

        Google makes an estimated 400 algorithm changes every year.

        Panda is past, but more changes are on the horizon for all of us.


        Originally Posted by mattlaclear View Post

        Almost everyone that gets traffic from article marketing receives the bulk of the traffic through their improved standings on the serps.

        I disagree with you on this point Matt.

        The only people who get the "bulk of the traffic" through the SERPs are those who only invest in SEO.


        Originally Posted by mattlaclear View Post

        Originally Posted by tpw View Post

        If you think the only reason to do article marketing is to get ranked in Google, then stop doing it.

        Really Bill? I simply have to disagree with the statement. In fact it doesn't even make sense.

        Almost everyone that gets traffic from article marketing receives the bulk of the traffic through their improved standings on the serps.

        So you're saying that isn't a strong enough target to go after?

        Matt: Don't think I am dogging your model, because I am not.

        Google is not chump change by any measure. Just one of my sites got 97,000 clicks from Google in 2010. It is not a small chunk by any measure. But Google only accounted for 35% of my traffic during that year.

        My biggest concern is for people who use Google as their only source of traffic... Those folks are just one Google algorithm change away from bankruptcy.

        Anyone putting all of their eggs in one basket -- the Google basket -- are playing Russian Roulette with the future of their business.

        And I believe that in order to make more money, we should take steps to ensure that our IM customers will be able to continue to afford to buy our services. If one of our customers loses the ability to keep spending money on our services, we lose a customer. If a lot of our customers are hurt, we are hurt bad.

        I don't feel at all comfortable having my customers rely on only one source of traffic to stay afloat. And that is not to say that what we do will change that, but we don't know what other shady crap our customers are doing in an attempt to manipulate Google. :rolleyes:

        I lost a $5k per month SEO client one time, because he was doing shady shi+ that got him banned in Google. It wasn't something I had done, but I paid the price in a loss of a major customer for stuff I could not control.

        There are reasons why your system continues to produce substantial results in the aftermath of Panda, but that is a topic that extends well beyond the context of what can be covered here.

        For the average Joe Blow, who is trying to do this on his/her own, looking to Google as the only source of their traffic is a treacherous path fraught with danger around every bend.

        And I am solidly of the opinion that if someone were to pursue the spun article path of article marketing -- I did not say article directory marketing, because to my knowledge you don't do that -- then they are in good hands with your service.

        But you only offer one form of article marketing, and like someone else in this thread said, article marketing is a big umbrella.

        So, I stand behind my original statement, "If you think the only reason to do article marketing is to get ranked in Google, then stop doing it."

        Take off your horse blinders and look beyond Google for traffic from article marketing.



        P.S. Matt already took off his horse blinders, because he gets a good portion of his customers from the Warrior Forum. He might have #1 in Google, but he certainly is not relying on Google to power his business forward.
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        • Profile picture of the author Kurt
          Originally Posted by tpw View Post

          So, I stand behind my original statement, "If you think the only reason to do article marketing is to get ranked in Google, then stop doing it."
          How about if you do it to get ranked in Bing/Yahoo too?
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          • Profile picture of the author tpw
            Originally Posted by Kurt View Post

            Originally Posted by tpw View Post

            So, I stand behind my original statement, "If you think the only reason to do article marketing is to get ranked in Google, then stop doing it."

            How about if you do it to get ranked in Bing/Yahoo too?

            LOL

            Nothing wrong with that.

            In 2010, that site of mine had 97,000 visits from Google also had
            • 22,000 from Bing/Yahoo
            • and 6,000 from another 49 search engines.

            Diversity is our friend.
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    • Profile picture of the author Raquel
      Originally Posted by tpw View Post

      Is the only reason to ever consider doing article marketing for the purpose of influencing Google?

      Does Google hold all of the cards as to the power and effectiveness of article marketing?

      NO and NO.

      If you think the only reason to do article marketing is to get ranked in Google, then stop doing it.

      We old-school article marketers will keep using article marketing as a promotion method, because we don't do article marketing to impress Google. We do it to drive targeted and relevant traffic to our websites.

      We were doing article marketing when Google was still barely a blip on anyone's radar. And we will keep doing article marketing after Google is gone.

      If Google kicks me out of its search engine, because I do article marketing, I will only lose 1/3rd of my traffic.

      And 2/3rds of my traffic will continue to come, because I have never done article marketing to please Google.

      Using article marketing as a tool to influence Google has only been a major "school of thought" since circa 2005.

      I was doing article marketing for 5 years before then. And I will continue doing article marketing, even when Google is telling me to stop doing it. Funk Google!!!

      So long as you continue to believe that Google is the only source of traffic worth having, you will continue to shoot yourself in the foot.

      And if you decide to give up on article marketing because Google doesn't like it, then hurrah! Because I will have to compete with fewer schmucks to get the recognition I want for my articles.
      Best reply/post I've read today....gives me hope...been struggling since google panda and this post gives me hope.....thanks tpw....
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  • Profile picture of the author Drizlek
    I honestly think the only reason why certain people are being hit by the panda update to articles is because they almost relied on them solely for all of their traffic. I know this from experience because someone I was working with at the time constantly threw articles up on directories while at the same time ignored putting any up on the sites themselves or for that matter doing almost anything else seo wise. So in essence the articles were getting all of the focus and not the site itself. Articles may push sales, but unless you have a site that is indexed and ranking eventually your going to get burned putting all your eggs in one basket.

    So article marketing is still alive... but it obviously cannot be relied on like it once used to be.
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  • Profile picture of the author Rod Cortez
    I think the last few replies just proves the point I made in post #44 on page 1. There isn't just one way to do article marketing. Some people use it for SEO and try to get high in the SE results, others use other distribution channels, and others use a combination of methods. The permutations on how it can be implemented are almost endless.

    In any case, the article in the OP was way off base, because it only covered one aspect of article marketing. It's apparently clear that James Martell was only focusing on one article marketing tactic and did not bother to bring up any other.

    So article marketing is still alive... but it obviously cannot be relied on like it once used to be.

    Marketers who have not succeeded in article marketing would like you to believe that because they're usually pitching you some Word Press plug in, their own blog network, or some other product. Hey, in some instances, you should be adding that to your marketing efforts anyway.

    So, no, the way article marketing was described in the article in the OP cannot be relied on. It's an ancient formula that, while it still works, is not a long-term viable solution. But article marketing will be around for decades to come. More and more people are reading their content on their Kindles, iPads, some other tablet or mobile device, and smart article / content marketers will adapt to that.

    And websites and blogs are not going away anytime soon, neither will publishers hunger for content.

    RoD
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    • Profile picture of the author schttrj
      Originally Posted by Rod Cortez View Post

      I think the last few replies just proves the point I made in post #44 on page 1. There isn't just one way to do article marketing. Some people use it for SEO and try to get high in the SE results, others use other distribution channels, and others use a combination of methods. The permutations on how it can be implemented are almost endless.

      In any case, the article in the OP was way off base, because it only covered one aspect of article marketing. It's apparently clear that James Martell was only focusing on one article marketing tactic and did not bother to bring up any other.


      Marketers who have not succeeded in article marketing would like you to believe that because they're usually pitching you some Word Press plug in, their own blog network, or some other product. Hey, in some instances, you should be adding that to your marketing efforts anyway.

      So, no, the way article marketing was described in the article in the OP cannot be relied on. It's an ancient formula that, while it still works, is not a long-term viable solution. But article marketing will be around for decades to come. More and more people are reading their content on their Kindles, iPads, some other tablet or mobile device, and smart article / content marketers will adapt to that.

      And websites and blogs are not going away anytime soon, neither will publishers hunger for content.

      RoD
      Please tell me how many "forms of article marketing" you know.
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      • Profile picture of the author Rod Cortez
        Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

        Please tell me how many "forms of article marketing" you know.
        I listed some of them in my post #44. So have many others in this thread, I'm not going to repeat them.

        RoD
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  • Profile picture of the author schttrj
    I see many people including Richard Van are suggesting bypassing EZA and contacting webmasters directly and building a content sharing relationships with them.

    Is this how article marketing actually works? NO! This is called guest posting.

    And in regards to what Kurt said, I would still remind you that Google Panda update is still in the beta process. There are changes still being done.
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    • Profile picture of the author Rod Cortez
      Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

      I see many people including Richard Van are suggesting bypassing EZA and contacting webmasters directly and building a content sharing relationships with them.

      Is this how article marketing actually works? NO! This is called guest posting.

      And in regards to what Kurt said, I would still remind you that Google Panda update is still in the beta process. There are changes still being done.
      I disagree. Marketing your article is not limited to submitting to directories or any other single tactic or strategy. Yes, you can call it "guest posting", but it's still under the umbrella of article marketing. This is where Jame Martell totally misses the boat in his article.

      Article marketing is a large umbrella, a very general term, under which there are many ways to implement. Guest posting is still a form of article marketing.

      Regarding Alexa rankings: I stopped paying attention to them years ago and have been better for it.

      And in regards to what Kurt said, I would still remind you that Google Panda update is still in the beta process. There are changes still being done.

      This only proves Bill's point. If you market your articles properly, you don't have to worry about changes to the algos. While I pay attention to them, they don't impact any of my long-term business strategies. Our staff of writers continues to write original, high quality content and that model worked in 2001 and still works today in 2011.

      RoD
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      • Profile picture of the author schttrj
        Originally Posted by Rod Cortez View Post

        I disagree. Marketing your article is not limited to submitting to directories. Yes, you can call it "guest posting", but it's still under the umbrella of article marketing. This is where Jame Martell totally misses the boat in his article.

        Article marketing is a large umbrella, a very general term, under which there are many ways to implement. Guest posting is still a form of article marketing.

        RoD
        Ha ha ha...then should my thread be named 'article directory marketing' because that's what i meant.
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        • Profile picture of the author dracoboar
          Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

          Ha ha ha...then should my thread be named 'article directory marketing' because that's what i meant.
          Schttrj,

          Can I ask you a simple question. On this and other anti-article marketing threads you have posted people continue to show you how they re making money this way and getting good rankings.

          This includes my measly site that was my first ever IM venture and makes money from exclusively article marketing backlinks.

          At some point are you going to offer a rebuttle to all the people succeeding this way?

          All I see you do is post snippets and argue some small semantics, you have already changed the 'meaning' of your OP in this thread like 3 times.


          Simple question, what is your rebuttle to all those making money using article marketing?
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          • Profile picture of the author schttrj
            Originally Posted by dracoboar View Post

            Schttrj,

            Can I ask you a simple question. On this and other anti-article marketing threads you have posted people continue to show you how they re making money this way and getting good rankings.

            This includes my measly site that was my first ever IM venture and makes money from exclusively article marketing backlinks.

            At some point are you going to offer a rebuttle to all the people succeeding this way?

            All I see you do is post snippets and argue some small semantics, you have already changed the 'meaning' of your OP in this thread like 3 times.

            Simple question, what is your rebuttle to all those making money using article marketing?
            That's the lack of positive approach we have towards each other.

            Why do you think I am here to rebut something?

            Why don't you see it as someone offering a valid opinion?

            Why can't see it as an exchange of thoughts and ideas?

            Somewhere someone said this thread is to stir up an argument. Yes, it is. A healthy argument where knowledgeable people render their logical opinions can enhance the knowledge level and thus, betterment of the whole community.

            Remember how John Nash modified the Adam Smith theory - work for yourself AND for the group!

            Anyway, back to the topic, never knew there was a difference between article directory marketing and article marketing. Yes, I definitely knew about guest posting before.

            And whatever you call it - article marketing or article directory marketing, i see it as posting your articles to article directories to get direct traffic, backlinks and syndication.

            And my estimate is...in the near future, it might not be worthwhile anymore.

            Backlinks don't carry much value or so is heard.

            Traffic fizzle over time unless you have already written thousands and still writing.

            Syndication is still possible maybe since Google has taken care of duplicate content and indexing date is a big factor in that. But how many of your articles get syndicated is my question.

            So, by now, I hope you got what I wanted to say.

            If something is working for you, I would like to learn from you. And I don't have any enmity with article marketing that I will bash it every time I see it. Get real, buddy.

            I don't see why there would so much anger and aggression in this thread.
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            • Profile picture of the author tpw
              Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

              I don't see why there would so much anger and aggression in this thread.

              Blanket statements that imply things that other people know to be false generally do inflame anger, aggression and defensive responses.

              As a copy writer, I would expect you to understand that, unless you are not that good of a copy writer.
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              • Profile picture of the author schttrj
                Originally Posted by tpw View Post

                Blanket statements that imply things that other people know to be false generally do inflame anger, aggression and defensive responses.

                As a copy writer, I would expect you to understand that, unless you are not that good of a copy writer.
                Ha ha...it was NOT really a statement which I wanted others to agree to...but I referred to a valid and logical article and wanted comments on that.

                Anyway, my statements backfire better than article marketing it seems!
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                • Profile picture of the author myob
                  Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

                  ...my statements backfire better than article marketing it seems!
                  Yeah, I've had some of my jokes backfire on me too. :p
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                • Profile picture of the author Richard Van
                  Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

                  Ha ha...it was NOT really a statement which I wanted others to agree to...but I referred to a valid and logical article and wanted comments on that.
                  Sorry Ron but you started the thread off with these comments.

                  Article syndication was never really a good option for various reasons.
                  Even the so-called "experts and biggest proponents of article marketing" DON'T do that
                  DON'T let them fool you by saying that article marketing is the REAL DEAL when it isn't!
                  I find it rather odd that you think it strange that people have become like they have.

                  Anyway, my statements backfire better than article marketing it seems!
                  That, I 100% agree with.
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            • Profile picture of the author mattlaclear
              Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

              I don't see why there would so much anger and aggression in this thread.
              Humanity is running scared at the moment. I'm seeing flare ups everywhere. They know the fight of their lives stands in front of them regarding income generation. When you attack one form of marketing that group of marketers will become incensed. No one likes to be communicated to authoritatively. Especially regarding their hopes to a livelihood.
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              • Profile picture of the author tpw
                Originally Posted by mattlaclear View Post

                Humanity is running scared at the moment. I'm seeing flare ups everywhere. They know the fight of their lives stands in front of them regarding income generation. When you attack one form of marketing that group of marketers will become incensed. No one likes to be communicated to authoritatively. Especially regarding their hopes to a livelihood.

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                • Profile picture of the author mattlaclear
                  Predictable ending...but it gave me a huge belly laugh nonetheless. Thanks for the share.
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                • Profile picture of the author Boricua
                  ajaja

                  Another forum that I compare this thread has a huge thread defending why "doggy style sex" is dead and why the new and best (can you imagine!) sexual position is women on top. It's another big firework stravaganza of replies. My eBook will get a few sales out of that thread, thank god for pen names I guess.

                  This thread is similar, great replies and info but the definite logics given by the thread starter, are horrible in my opinion. We all learn with a bit of time in our belt. The thread is just as saying; "doggy style is dead" and some replies stating that's no longer effective or efficient when depending who's who, works. Oh well.
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                  • Profile picture of the author tpw
                    Originally Posted by Boricua View Post

                    ajaja

                    Another forum that I compare this thread has a huge thread defending why "doggy style sex" is dead and why the new and best (can you imagine!) sexual position is women on top. It's another big firework stravaganza of replies. My eBook will get a few sales out of that thread, thank god for pen names I guess.

                    This thread is similar, great replies and info but the definite logics given by the thread starter, are horrible in my opinion. We all learn with a bit of time in our belt. The thread is just as saying; "doggy style is dead" and some replies stating that's no longer effective or efficient when depending who's who, works. Oh well.

                    Unfortunately, I would have to agree with the other poster in that other thread.

                    In my house, "doggy style sex" is dead! My wife prefers "missionary".

                    I would argue that for threads like this to catch fire, someone in the thread -- either the OP or a respondent -- must say something absolutely preposterous to trigger others to give emotionally-powered responses.
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            • Profile picture of the author dracoboar
              Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

              That's the lack of positive approach we have towards each other.

              Why do you think I am here to rebut something?

              Why don't you see it as someone offering a valid opinion?

              Why can't see it as an exchange of thoughts and ideas?

              Somewhere someone said this thread is to stir up an argument. Yes, it is. A healthy argument where knowledgeable people render their logical opinions can enhance the knowledge level and thus, betterment of the whole community.

              Remember how John Nash modified the Adam Smith theory - work for yourself AND for the group!

              Anyway, back to the topic, never knew there was a difference between article directory marketing and article marketing. Yes, I definitely knew about guest posting before.

              And whatever you call it - article marketing or article directory marketing, i see it as posting your articles to article directories to get direct traffic, backlinks and syndication.

              And my estimate is...in the near future, it might not be worthwhile anymore.

              Backlinks don't carry much value or so is heard.

              Traffic fizzle over time unless you have already written thousands and still writing.

              Syndication is still possible maybe since Google has taken care of duplicate content and indexing date is a big factor in that. But how many of your articles get syndicated is my question.

              So, by now, I hope you got what I wanted to say.

              If something is working for you, I would like to learn from you. And I don't have any enmity with article marketing that I will bash it every time I see it. Get real, buddy.

              I don't see why there would so much anger and aggression in this thread.

              The reason people are not treating this like an exhange of ideas is your OP was not a question or a respectful submission but another blanket statement about article marketing that has been conclusively proven to be wrong.

              Each time you get bombbarded with facts you change your tone and back off a little and pretend that you were just submitting a theory, which imo according to your OP is a false statement.

              Had you posted in a more academic way with your OP and labeled it a theory for duiscussion it might have gotten treated the way you now say you hoped it would.
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        • Profile picture of the author Rod Cortez
          Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

          Ha ha ha...then should my thread be named 'article directory marketing' because that's what i meant.
          Absolutely. Like I stated before, the way James Martell defined article marketing, I actually agreed with him on that specific point. But I pointed out that the article was myopic because that's really not article marketing. And newbies who don't know any better are probably going to believe that.

          Some people call Bum Marketing article marketing and it's not. It's just one method of article marketing. It's just an article marketing tactic and some people will miss that distinction. The article in the OP only covered one method. That's what I wanted to point out.

          RoD
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    • Profile picture of the author dracoboar
      Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

      I see many people including Richard Van are suggesting bypassing EZA and contacting webmasters directly and building a content sharing relationships with them.

      Is this how article marketing actually works? NO! This is called guest posting.

      And in regards to what Kurt said, I would still remind you that Google Panda update is still in the beta process. There are changes still being done.

      Actually you are only partially right. You find quality webmasters by using ezine articles, this is exactly what it is intended for. If you form a relationship with that webmaster after finding them via ezine articles you cant exactly say that it has nothing to do with article marketing.
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    • Profile picture of the author Richard Van
      Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

      Is this how article marketing actually works? NO! This is called guest posting.
      Call it what you like, I call it article syndication. Why? Because I write an article and the owner of the site syndicates it.

      Oh and if that same site owner found the article on EZA, you'd call that guest posting or syndication? Either way it's exactly the same thing the only difference being I now have a relationship with the site owner because I contacted them.

      Like I said, call it whatever brings a smile to your face.
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  • Profile picture of the author NoBSGuy
    Originally Posted by schttrj View Post

    As I have always said, article marketing can backfire!

    Before the Panda update, you could have built it for do-follow backlinks and collective traffic, which meant more articles, more traffic. Article syndication was never really a good option for various reasons.

    And after the Panda update, things have become scary. Check this James Martell article by the way.

    Do think before you leap, newbies!

    Note: Even the so-called "experts and biggest proponents of article marketing" DON'T do that. You can know that by doing a backlink search of their websites. Once in a while is acceptable. But DON'T let them fool you by saying that article marketing is the REAL DEAL when it isn't!
    Thanks for sharing the resource . Still, I wouldn`t believe everything that I catch up from authors. Actually, I can put in my word that articles are still worth the effort. About 20% of my unique articles rank first page and get decent free targeted traffic from google. I put the weight on quality, keyword optimized articles and have never had major problems so far.

    Dennis
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    Article Marketing Going Extinct?
    Oh Gee - whatever will we talk about in this forum if it does?
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    • Profile picture of the author Rose Anderson
      Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

      Oh Gee - whatever will we talk about in this forum if it does?
      Guess we'll have to go back to "How can I make a lot of money in a few days without any work?"
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  • Profile picture of the author Chris Worner


    POPCORN!!!!

    Chris
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  • Profile picture of the author Frances Colleen
    Article marketing still works. I've known what it's like to get good, unsolicited votes, inquiries from interested people, and page 1 rankings with appropriate keyword densities should that be my intention. No search engine update will ever stop humans from reading and buying into quality content. Try it and see it for yourself.
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  • Profile picture of the author Frances Colleen
    Quality article marketing still works, and will always will. As long as you engage a good readership, you would stand unaffected by any search engine's updates. And that's the truth.
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  • Profile picture of the author melodeas
    that is a great article by james martell
    sheds a whole new light on my marketing and where i should not be wasting my time
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  • Profile picture of the author Trapped
    Nice big thread (and very informative too, read it entirely newbies) from an article that someone wrote .. and one of his keypoints is: duplicate anchors can be problematic

    ROFL for the videos
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  • Profile picture of the author dracoboar
    Schttrj,
    The real damage from this thread are the two or three newer IM's that have read that article and dont have the experience to know it is pure crap. A few have posted here stating they will likely avoid article marketing.

    You have now led a few newer (I assume they are newer to IM and if that assumption is wrong I apologize) marketers down a path tht makes their success journey more difficult.

    You say you are well versed on SEO, fine then you should use your experience to see through the garbage in that article and provide context for newbies so they do not get led astray.
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  • Profile picture of the author tamimabraham
    So, Where from we collect backlink? From Mars? or Moon?
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  • Profile picture of the author Chris Worner
    @Dracoboar

    Read from this post on-wards in this separate thread Ronald started about article marketing;

    http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...ml#post4197787

    Ronald does not know as much as he thinks he does.

    Chris
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  • Profile picture of the author luckyshah290
    Well i dont know exactly ... but article marketing is alive for some people ..

    most of the internet marketers are trying articles marketing for getting targeted traffic ..

    ITS WORTH IT
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  • Profile picture of the author ladymd
    Articles generate traffic for us, contrary to popular opinion i don't think article marketing is dead. It's obviously not as effective as it used to be, but it still brings in customers and provides a sense of authority.
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  • Profile picture of the author Andrew S
    1. The Matt Cutts video is really hilarious because he's talking about a strategy that people applied about 3 years ago...

    Yeah, they really are that behind.

    Since then article marketing has evolved into something way more effective than its ever been.

    2. I have done public case studies on 6 different syndication services and they all work to some degree or another.

    3. To completely denounce article marketing and lump it into one big ball is just a huge disservice to the community simply because of how many newcomers are trying to learn off this forum.

    4. To the OP, Schttrj, and the writer of that article, James Martell, PEOPLE WANT DATA BEFORE YOU MAKE BASELESS CLAIMS.

    Here is my data - Final Results: UAW vs AMA vs AR vs FTS vs SEOLV vs SYA | Marketer's Center Blog

    Where is yours?
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    • Profile picture of the author dracoboar
      Originally Posted by Andrew S View Post

      3. To completely denounce article marketing and lump it into one big ball is just a huge disservice to the community simply because of how many newcomers are trying to learn off this forum.

      very well said
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  • Profile picture of the author seobro
    OK so hubpages is now using sub domains after the panda update to survive. It is a way to weed out articles that are poor. Yeah, from the good stuff that they want you to use. Like wow, we gotta love hub pages.

    My source is Wall Street Journals. Here it is.
    Site Claims to Loosen Google "Death Grip" - Digits - WSJ
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  • Profile picture of the author Viramara
    I prefer guest blogging than article directories. Popular blogs whether they are PR 4 or 0 if they have steady visitors it can make a traffic.

    I have a local blog in anything goes niche that has 500 visitors a month and even after the Google Panda the traffic doesn't decrease because I work so hard for the content. I didn't update it for a month and still have stable visitors. maybe because of the content
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  • Profile picture of the author Joseph Robinson
    Banned
    Article marketing is far from dead, article directory marketing is though. The update actually helps out those of us who write our own unique content. Instead of having to fruitlessly compete against thousands upon thousands of crappy respun articles, content with quality is now given the upper hand. Do your writing, do it right, and there is more oppurtunity than ever to rank for those keywords!
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  • Profile picture of the author dagaul101
    Article marketing has definitely lost most of it's link juice since Panda and Panda 2.2, but it is still a viable option for long term sustainable traffic
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  • Profile picture of the author nicolas simpson
    yep i agree for its much more diff to get you article ranked now a days..
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  • Profile picture of the author dagaul101
    Article marketing has lost its link juice, but is still a viable way for some long term traffic
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  • Profile picture of the author Goldenboy
    I couldn't agree with this. There is still ongoing Article Marketing since they need top quality articles for their site. I have to admit that there are what we call low-quality articles like the copy and paste articles, poorly written, and no-sense content articles which would a bit lowers the quality of the marketing. But I would say that it is not extinct as what you are trying to start here.
    Let's not present a sense of discouragement to newcomers here. They might think that Article Marketing is really going to be extinct and would probably leave and look will look for alternative way to earn. Let their skills in writing top quality articles continue.
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  • Profile picture of the author Scott Skinner
    It is not dead, it has only changed, just like everything else in internet marketing. My view is to build a quality site, employ some basic SEO knowledge, quality backlinking and post your article to that site only. The spiders will find it, index it and you will rise above the rest.
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  • Profile picture of the author Nuno
    There is still great value on doing careful article marketing, even if I now see that "my" Ezinearticles pages aren't at the top (without help) like before.
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  • Profile picture of the author AlexisMoore
    First of all, I can attest to the fact that the article directories are still working, because my clients are still seeing the same results that they always have.

    However, I believe that what needs to happen here is that people have to quit submitting worthless material to the directories. On a personal level, it simply drives me nuts to see all this junk floating around when I work hard to create quality material. Besides, the back links from the directories would be worth so much more if people would quit being so lazy and start producing actual quality material. I hate spinners. I make a living from writing articles, and it just offends me when someone takes my business and turns it into a junk farm like that.

    All Google wants is to be able to provide people with quality, relevant content. What is the point of trying so hard to get around that all the time? If you are providing material that is useful to the reader and is actually worth something, even "article directory marketing" will work. It's just that you can't be a lazy a** and put out crap expecting to get anything out of it.

    Anything that is worth doing in IM is going to require effort and hard work. Once people quit trying to use stupid short cuts and start doing actual work, that's when the money rolls in.

    And that is my humble opinion.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mary Wilhite
    Everyone has a difference in their point of view,just take what you need from the article and leave the rest back.
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    • Profile picture of the author Hud
      So whats the best way to go now?

      1. Write an quality article and wait for it to get indexed on your site
      2. Publish the same article on as many article directories as you can, unspun for better clickthrough rate and some link juice. But you can(should) spin the anchor text pointing back to your site to match a group of related keywords. Don't care about how many links you create, since it is duplicate content google will treat it as syndicated content, not as link spamming (umm, can anyone confirm this?)
      3. Get a great blog network and submit spun articles to them for link juice, the more, the better(as long as its below a certain threshold of links/day, like 100). Only one-click spin them, as google does not yet detect or punish light(badly) spun articles. But try to post another one click spun article to every x blogs in your network to reduce the footprint of many posts with the same source article.
      4. Write more articles for humans that convert good, and repeat step 1 with them, unspun.

      This way you have a) lot's of targeted traffic from the directories, as well as some link juice, and b) lot's of link juice from unflagged websites in the blog networks.

      At least this is what I have gotten out of this thread... am I right or wrong?

      P.S. Don't take this as a guide since I am still a newb and didn't verify this.
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      • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
        Banned
        Originally Posted by Hud View Post

        am I right or wrong?
        Seriously wrong, in several places, I'm afraid.

        The system you suggest in your post is pretty much similar to what's done by many Warriors who start threads with "Article Marketing Going Extinct?" and similar titles.

        Originally Posted by Hud View Post

        1. Write an quality article and wait for it to get indexed on your site
        There you're right - it's important to start that way.

        Originally Posted by Hud View Post

        2. Publish the same article on as many article directories as you can
        There's virtually no gain from this at all. All article-directory backlinks are non-context-relevant, PR-0 (or PR-not-available) backlinks, and it's not as if they'll get any traffic either, especially in these "post-Panda" days.

        In my experience, the more successful people are with article marketing, the fewer the article directories to which they submit their articles. Coincidence?! You decide.

        Originally Posted by Hud View Post

        unspun for better clickthrough rate and some link juice.
        Click-through rate applies only to articles which people read.

        Part of the aim of publishing and having indexed on your own site first is to ensure that potential customer-traffic, in the long run, reads those copies and NOT the article directory copies. Why take all the care about your own website if you want your potential customers going to other people's sites to read your articles?

        Don't forget that saying something like "I have a 25% click-through rate from XYZ Directory" is just another way of saying "I lose 75% of my traffic at XYZ Directory". I'd rather keep that traffic than lose it - wouldn't you?

        Originally Posted by Hud View Post

        and some link juice
        The link-juice is not somehow, magically, changed according to whether or not the content to which the backlink is attached has been spun. These are article directory backlinks we're talking about, here. 100,000 of those backlinks and $3.50 will get you a cappuccino at Starbuck's.

        Originally Posted by Hud View Post

        Don't care about how many links you create, since it is duplicate content google will treat it as syndicated content, not as link spamming (umm, can anyone confirm this?)
        It just isn't "duplicate content", Hud.

        This is simply wrong.

        Clearly explained here.

        Originally Posted by Hud View Post

        3. Get a great blog network and submit spun articles to them for link juice
        That will work if you do it as Matt does, perhaps, aiming at 500,000 backlinks per day, as he explains, but it's way beyond the capabilities, interest, skills and resources of almost any other article marketer to try to do that.
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        • Profile picture of the author Hud
          Thanks alexa for pointing me in the right direction. So... let me see if I understood you right:

          Publishing the same article on as many directories and blogs as I can is bad because:
          1. I need another article thats good written and designed to get the reader to want more(and not to inform the best I can on the topic like this is the case for my onpage articles), so they click my link and I have a good converting article.
          2. Don't bother with most directories, noone will read the articles, because panda cut the traffic of most directories (that are of low quality). Don't bother with link juice too, because its minimal. Well, I can do it, but I should not expect much of a ranking boost. But it would be okay to blast away identical content, I will have no problems with google, since it will see it as syndicated content and its quite normal for google to see lots of identical content in a short timeframe, if it's syndicated identical content.
          3. So if I want traffic from articles, I should submit only to the top article directories.

          Did I understand you right? If not feel free to correct me to death I would appreciate it.
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          • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
            Banned
            Originally Posted by Hud View Post

            Publishing the same article on as many directories and blogs as I can is bad
            Well ... it's not terrible. A backlink is a backlink (just about), I suppose. It's just a very, very low-benefit activity in SEO terms. Nobody's suggesting there's any specific downside to it, though. (I used to do it myself, I admit, a couple of years ago. I submitted to hundreds of article directories. )

            Originally Posted by Hud View Post

            1. I need another article thats good written and designed to get the reader to want more(and not to inform the best I can on the topic like this is the case for my onpage articles), so they click my link and I have a good converting article.
            Don't submit to article directories any articles that you haven't had published and initially indexed on your own site first! That really can have a downside.

            Originally Posted by Hud View Post

            2. Don't bother with most directories, noone will read the articles, because panda cut the traffic of most directories (that are of low quality). Don't bother with link juice too, because its minimal. Well, I can do it, but I should not expect much of a ranking boost. But it would be okay to blast away identical content, I will have no problems with google, since it will see it as syndicated content and its quite normal for google to see lots of identical content in a short timeframe, if it's syndicated identical content.
            This is all perfectly correct.

            Bear in mind what an article directory is, and why they exist: it's a depository of content which is available for webmasters and ezine/newsletter compilers freely to syndicate (within its terms of service, of course, which will always require the inclusion of your resource-box and backlinks).

            Originally Posted by Hud View Post

            3. So if I want traffic from articles, I should submit only to the top article directories.
            You shouldn't want traffic from article directories.

            Whatever your percentage click-through rate is, in an article directory, 100% minus that figure is the traffic you're losing there, which you could have had visiting your own site instead.

            You should want potential customer traffic coming to your own site, not swanning off to an article directory where you'll lose most of it.

            Fortunately, this is easily arranged. And the more Google devalues article directories in their SERP's algorithms (and that's already a lot) the easier it gets.
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            • Profile picture of the author Hud
              Great, I am beginning to think the right way. Thanks Alexa!

              The only thing I don't really get is what you wrote after in point 3 - Isn't the purpose of article marketing to get people that read those directories to click on your link to get to your site...? Or did you mean to say that?
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              • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
                Banned
                Originally Posted by Hud View Post

                Isn't the purpose of article marketing to get people that read those directories to click on your link to get to your site...?
                No; it isn't.

                That's the "purpose" of article directory marketing, not the purpose of article marketing.

                The purpose of article marketing is to get well written, high quality articles in front of well targeted traffic.

                The purpose of putting them in article directories isn't for potential customers to find them there (for all the reasons explained above). It's for webmasters, ezine compilers, newsletter compilers and others who are looking for content and already have their own pre-targeted traffic whom you can't otherwise reach to find them there.

                Their content needs are the reason article directories exist.

                That's the content-providing service they were set up to fulfil.

                That's why "Ezine Articles" is called Ezine Articles: it's the source of articles for ezines.

                There are two groups of people reading articles in directories. One of those groups is the one for whom we're putting our articles there. The other group (potential customers) we don't want going to an article directory: we want them coming straight to our site (rather than losing them as part of our "non-click-through rate" in the directory). That's why we make sure that the original copy of the article on our own site is the one which (if any) they'll find in Google's SERPS, NOT an article directory copy.

                And fortunately/kindly, Google's Panda update has now made it even easier for us to do exactly that.
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                • Profile picture of the author Hud
                  I see - to get people that visit other sites that republished our articles that they found on ezine for example to visit our site through the link. I never thought of that. But I meant the same for article directories - to get people that surf ezine anyways and find my article to get to my site. Of course getting ezine(etc) to rank for my target keywords would be bad and not desired! So I guess we tried to say - in part - the same(EDIT: ok, ezine readers will not be really targeted). This still leaves one problem - getting up enough in the serps to actually get traffic for that keyword, but I guess there are other methods needed for that (or if one is lucky, the little link juice hundreds of article directories provide), i guess. But sure, panda made this easier

                  Thanks again for your patience Alexa, you helped me alot!

                  Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

                  No; it isn't.

                  That's the "purpose" of article directory marketing, not the purpose of article marketing.

                  The purpose of article marketing is to get well written, high quality articles in front of well targeted traffic.

                  The purpose of putting them in article directories isn't for potential customers to find them there (for all the reasons explained above). It's for webmasters, ezine compilers, newsletter compilers and others who are looking for content and already have their own pre-targeted traffic whom you can't otherwise reach to find them there.

                  Their content needs are the reason article directories exist.

                  That's the content-providing service they were set up to fulfil.

                  That's why "Ezine Articles" is called Ezine Articles: it's the source of articles for ezines.

                  There are two groups of people reading articles in directories. One of those groups is the one for whom we're putting our articles there. The other group (potential customers) we don't want going to an article directory: we want them coming straight to our site (rather than losing them as part of our "non-click-through rate" in the directory). That's why we make sure that the original copy of the article on our own site is the one which (if any) they'll find in Google's SERPS, NOT an article directory copy.

                  And fortunately/kindly, Google's Panda update has now made it even easier for us to do exactly that.
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  • Profile picture of the author madz280
    Banned
    [DELETED]
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    • Profile picture of the author ajbarnes777
      Originally Posted by madz280 View Post

      Ok. So why do article marketing at all? Am new to this article marketing this so please be very clear.

      ARTICLE MARKETING = To Do or Not To DO?

      Which one is it?

      and also 2reasons as to why or why not I should or shouldnt do it.
      No matter what, article marketing will always remain a powerful marketing tactic. The simple reason why is because the visitors you'll gain from your articles (if they are high quality) will be highly targeted.

      Having said that, if you are going to embark on an article marketing campaign these days, to echo what many other warriors have already said, you are going to have to focus on producing high quality useful content.

      As long as the quality is there, everything else (traffic, recognition, backlinks, sales, etc.) pretty much works itself out.

      Also, when writing articles, one thing that will put you above the rest is to ensure that the content you are writing is different from the masses (in other words, very unique). If I see one more weight loss article talking about how you need to drink more water, eat an apple a day, get more sleep, and exercise more, I think I'm going to poke my freaking eyeballs out! :p
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    • Profile picture of the author DireStraits
      Originally Posted by madz280 View Post

      Ok. So why do article marketing at all? Am new to this article marketing this so please be very clear.

      ARTICLE MARKETING = To Do or Not To DO?

      Which one is it?

      and also 2reasons as to why or why not I should or shouldnt do it.
      Sorry, but this specific question is even more ridiculous than the recurrent one we have here of "is article marketing dead?" (which itself isn't necessarily a stupid question, of course, given the misconceptions many have about what article marketing is and how to do it; but the rate at which it's asked - and responded to repeatedly by those with boundless patience and relevant experience - really beggars belief, sometimes), because no-one here knows enough about you and your business to be able to tell you whether or not article marketing has a place within it.

      And more than that, in your business, one would hope that you make such decisions.
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  • Profile picture of the author vargasglobal
    I just want to know who wins in the "syndication" and "spinning" argument.
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    • Profile picture of the author yourreviewer
      Originally Posted by vargasglobal View Post

      I just want to know who wins in the "syndication" and "spinning" argument.
      The 'Spindicates', of course
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    • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
      Banned
      Originally Posted by vargasglobal View Post

      I just want to know who wins in the "syndication" and "spinning" argument.
      You have to judge this for yourself (perhaps from the fact that almost all the starters of, posters in and reinforcers of all the many "Article Marketing Is Dead" threads here and elsewhere are those using spinning and/or automated submission software, and that their comments and observations actually relate only to "article directory marketing", as is self-evident to those few who are willing to examine them closely).

      People selling spinning software/services will tell you otherwise, of course, but it seems to me that their collective former customers are among those starting off all these threads alleging that "article marketing" (as they wrongly call it) is dead.
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    • Profile picture of the author mattlaclear
      Originally Posted by vargasglobal View Post

      I just want to know who wins in the "syndication" and "spinning" argument.
      Of course the spinners are going to win. We're winning now and we'll continue to win in the future.
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      • Profile picture of the author David McKee
        I will answer this simply.

        No.

        My wife recently started a coupon and savings site (couponbux if your interested) and wrote her very first article on how to build a coupon binder on Ezine Articles. It took 2 weeks to get approved and is now driving traffic to her site, traffic we can see and monitor (using the word-press plugin "WassUp").

        It works, it works well, and it will continue to work... on one condition.

        That you write useful, pithy, well written content.

        It's as simple as that. Spinners take content and write crap. Crap does not sell anymore.

        -DTM
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        • Profile picture of the author mattlaclear
          Originally Posted by David McKee View Post

          I will answer this simply.

          No.

          My wife recently started a coupon and savings site (couponbux if your interested) and wrote her very first article on how to build a coupon binder on Ezine Articles. It took 2 weeks to get approved and is now driving traffic to her site, traffic we can see and monitor (using the word-press plugin "WassUp").

          It works, it works well, and it will continue to work... on one condition.

          That you write useful, pithy, well written content.

          It's as simple as that. Spinners take content and write crap. Crap does not sell anymore.

          -DTM
          So in 2 weeks you generated 1 backlink?
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          • Profile picture of the author David McKee
            Originally Posted by mattlaclear View Post

            So in 2 weeks you generated 1 backlink?
            She is just getting started and it was for the purpose of an example - the point, which I guess you missed, was that article marketing is not going extinct.

            The other point is that she had her article indexed on her own site, and then placed it on Ezine Articles, as has been pointed out here multiple times, is the way the professionals who desire real, converting traffic do it.

            -DTM

            oh...and she has a whole lot more than one backlink...
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  • Profile picture of the author pbdollars
    what is the panda update?
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    • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
      Banned
      Originally Posted by pbdollars View Post

      what is the panda update?
      It was a substantial change to Google's SEO algorithm, a few months ago.

      One of its significant results was that very many article directories were absolutely hammered, and copies of directory articles became even harder to rank in Google's SERP's. Even article directory owners have been commenting very openly about this, some of them saying that traffic has been reduced by 50% (or even more, I think).

      For those of us in "article marketing" (rather than "article directory marketing") this came as huge bonus, of course: it's much easier for us to rank our own sites with all those article directories out of the way.

      For most people, article directory marketing (depending on article directories for their own backlinks and for their own traffic) hadn't been a very viable business model for a long time anyway, but the "Panda update" was perhaps - as many here put it - the last nail in its coffin-lid.

      Saying "I've got a click-through rate of 25% at XYZ article directory" is, of course, just another way of saying "I lose 75% of my traffic that goes to XYZ article directory". This is among the many reasons why experienced, professional article marketers have for many years been so strongly advising people to publish your articles on your own site first, and have them indexed there, before submitting them elsewhere.

      Some other websites which had a high proportion of syndicated (i.e. previously published elsewhere) content were also apparently victims of this change in Google's algorithm. Our own websites, where the content is initially indexed, are the collective long-term beneficiaries.

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  • Profile picture of the author KabirC
    Article marketing will be going NOWHERE. People will always need unique content since Google is going against duplicate content now!
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    • Profile picture of the author barry500
      Originally Posted by KabirC View Post

      Article marketing will be going NOWHERE. People will always need unique content since Google is going against duplicate content now!

      So how does that sit with experienced people like Alexa ??

      Alexa - who has some knowledge of such things posts to her own sites then syndicates out - based on you world view someone is getting slapped.
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      • Profile picture of the author KabirC
        Originally Posted by barry500 View Post

        So how does that sit with experienced people like Alexa ??

        Alexa - who has some knowledge of such things posts to her own sites then syndicates out - based on you world view someone is getting slapped.
        Spinners will do a lot better on the SEO standpoint than syndicaters, the recent Panda change has proven that.
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        • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
          Banned
          Originally Posted by KabirC View Post

          Article marketing will be going NOWHERE.
          You're actually talking about article directory marketing, and what you say is indeed perfectly true about article directory marketing (but you're mistakenly calling it "article marketing").

          Originally Posted by KabirC View Post

          Google is going against duplicate content now!
          This isn't right at all.

          Clearly you don't understand the difference between duplicate content and syndicated content as it relates to Google.

          The little article by a very successful article marketer linked to in the sentence above can quickly clarify and resolve that misunderstanding for you, but - as the saying goes - only if you're willing to read it.

          Originally Posted by KabirC View Post

          Spinners will do a lot better on the SEO standpoint than syndicaters, the recent Panda change has proven that.
          For the benefit of anyone reading the thread and feeling confused, the above comment is completely wrong.

          The value of a given backlink on a given page is NOT somehow, magically, affected by whether or not the content to which it's attached has been spun. :rolleyes:

          Even people selling spinning software/services are not alleging that.

          It's ludicrous to suggest that the Panda update has somehow improved the prospects for using "spun" content. Rarely, if ever, has a post in an "article marketing thread" here been quite as wide of the mark as your comment above.
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  • Profile picture of the author ContentMachine
    I will disagree with OP, Article Marketing is still a pretty big part of my business. Although there has been a slowdown, I believe it is still crucial, especially when it comes to SEO
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  • Profile picture of the author DireStraits
    When a sheep is on its back and is unable to get up without help, Yorkshire Dales dialect says it is "riggwelted".

    This raises the question of what's to be done with a riggwelted forum thread that just cannot be righted despite earnest, persistent efforts.

    Answers on a postcard addressed to nowhere.

    Meanwhile, the proverb "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em" provides me with a certain comfort.



    Cheers. *burp*
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    • Profile picture of the author myob
      "Those disputing, contradicting, and confuting people are generally unfortunate in their affairs."

      - Benjamin Franklin
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      “If I have seen further than others, it is by standing upon the shoulders of giants.” – Isaac Newton
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    • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
      Banned
      Originally Posted by DireStraits View Post

      When a sheep is on its back and is unable to get up without help, Yorkshire Dales dialect says it is "riggwelted".
      Haven't heard this one before.

      Surprising, sometimes, what you can learn here.

      Originally Posted by DireStraits View Post

      This raises the question of what's to be done with a riggwelted forum thread that just cannot be righted despite earnest, persistent efforts.
      Exactly the question I've been asking myself about this very thread.

      I don't have an answer.

      Except, I suppose, in a sense, that the more of my competitors who think the same as KabirC, the better for me.
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      • Profile picture of the author celente
        Wow there is some good info in here adn there is some very bad stuff as well.

        To those that think spinning is still great and going to get your results, you have rocks in your head. It is a majority why panda came in and wacked you over the top of the head with its bamboo!

        Article marketing is and has always been about writing and posting high quality content. When have you seen a crappy article get results for you!, yes!

        So how do you think spinning will work now and in the futures. IT wont!

        Article marketing has changed, but still google wants quality, it always has. So if you can previde that for her, you will be rewarded by not only google but others passing your articles and content around. That will get you more traffic and more results.
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  • Profile picture of the author moneyten
    I think article marketing still works but it should not be the main focus of your SEO efforts. It is just one piece of the puzzle.
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  • Profile picture of the author David McKee
    I wonder if Alexa has a counter on how many times she has said this sentance:

    "Article Directory Marketing is not the same thing as (Authority) Article Marketing"...



    -DTM
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    Are you an affiliate marketer? My site has tons of free stuff and 14,000 pages of Clickbank research. www.affiliatesledgehammer.com
    Buy a Freedom Bulb! Don't let the government tell you what kind of light bulb you can use!
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  • Profile picture of the author Scott Skinner
    Article marketing is not dead. However, the way the search engines find and rank the content has! It's quite simple actually, LEARN to write quality, keyword focused, relevant articles yourself, post them to a "keyword focused" website/blog and the search engines will find you.
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    • Profile picture of the author Hud
      I tested the "let google index your article before submitting it to article directories" theory, and the result:

      No matter if it is indexed first on my site or not, other sites with my content will outrank me no matter what as long as their authority is higher. So I don't really see the point in waiting for google to index my post first...
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      • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
        Banned
        Originally Posted by Hud View Post

        No matter if it is indexed first on my site or not, other sites with my content will outrank me no matter what as long as their authority is higher. So I don't really see the point in waiting for google to index my post first...
        Then, with respect, you've missed the point, Hud.

        Specifically, the point you've missed is that if you always have the initial indexation done on your site, then those other sites to which your content is subsequently syndicated will gradually outrank you for decreasing amounts of time, and eventually not at all (which is the objective). The effect is cumulative, long-term, and very important if you value your own site's SEO.

        If you start off with a brand new site, wait until it's indexed, put an article on it, wait until the article's indexed, and then submit that same article to EZA, the EZA copy will initially outrank you (they're both on PR-0 pages, but EZA's PR-0 page is backed up by a PR-6 home-page, and although that's not worth much it's worth something). If you continue doing that, one article at a time (as one inevitably does, as an article marketer, when one has a new niche site to which one's gradually adding content), you'll be surprised how quickly that will cease to be a problem, and your site will accumulate some real SEO and always outrank the EZA copies.

        I've done this many times.

        Many of us, here, have done this many times.

        If you don't do it that way, then you're consigning your business to being based on a site that can't even outrank an article directory without building masses of backlinks to it (not a pleasant fate).
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        • Profile picture of the author Hud
          I see... so the positive effect shows up only after this is done several times... thanks for the explanation. No wonder I was disappointed, it could not have worked short term. So I assume once due to the facts that google sees my website as an authority, because I have an increased amount of content and more importantly this content has been syndicated over and over, but was indexed first on my site, I will outrank other sites with my article mid term.

          Any idea how often this has to be done(i.e. how many articles) until this positive effect set's in for a site?(did I ask that before? I'm having a deja vu)
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          • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
            Banned
            Originally Posted by Hud View Post

            No wonder I was disappointed, it could not have worked short term.
            Exactly so.

            Originally Posted by Hud View Post

            Any idea how often this has to be done(i.e. how many articles) until this positive effect set's in for a site?
            I haven't actually started off a new niche site since the famous "Panda update" so I just don't know - sorry. It can only be getting easier, though, with article directories having been hammered by Google ... not more difficult. Others will reply ...
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            • Profile picture of the author Hud
              ok, thanks for you tips, I've learned a lot about article marketing in that short time because of you. If anyone could chimp in with experience on how many syndicated articles are needed, until google recognizes a site as an authority... that would be great!
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              • Profile picture of the author myob
                To put a bit of a spin on your perspective, Hud, positive results of syndication are not necessarily only from its SEO benefits. Quite often, ranking is a secondary or even tertiary benefit of best practices in article writing. The most highly convertable traffic is when your articles are seen directly by your target prospects. But what is very often missed is that conversions are compounded when your articles are seen by your target prospects on authoritative outlets. This is the true power of article syndication marketing.

                To illustrate, many here already know that all of my websites are like the Rodney Dangerfield of search engine ranking. I can't get no respect from Google. None of my websites are anywhere above the murky depths in the SERPs (although some are steadily gaining on competitors now within 100 pages or so). But my syndicated articles primarily are what is driving massive highly converting traffic to my websites. Some online/offline advertising is also a significant contributor to traffic.

                My situation may be in the extreme, being in some of the most hotly competitive markets, but article writing for SEO alone can be a slow grind or even sisyphean task. Some who had been using articles for the single purpose of backlinks seem to be now proclaiming article marketing is going extinct.
                Signature
                “If I have seen further than others, it is by standing upon the shoulders of giants.” – Isaac Newton
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                • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
                  Banned
                  Originally Posted by myob View Post

                  To put a bit of a spin on your perspective
                  Thought you'd manage to "push that one through", did you?!
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                  • Profile picture of the author myob
                    Did you really expect anything less, after reading something like this:

                    Originally Posted by mattlaclear View Post

                    Of course the spinners are going to win. We're winning now and we'll continue to win in the future.


                    Signature
                    “If I have seen further than others, it is by standing upon the shoulders of giants.” – Isaac Newton
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                • Profile picture of the author David McKee
                  Originally Posted by myob View Post

                  ... But what is very often missed is that conversions are compounded when your articles are seen by your target prospects on authoritative outlets. This is the true power of article syndication marketing.
                  ...
                  Another illustration of this from the old days... You may remember the "As Seen On TV!" type adds? Well, back in the murky days of TV (last sixties, early seventies) when color TV was still somewhat novel, Barkers like Ron Popeil would demonstrate his product, and then those products would be advertised in magazines and newspapers with the "As Seen on TV!" icon.

                  Back then, consciously or unconsciously, people seemed to give a bit of authority to anything that appeared on the TV ("it must be true! it was on TV!").

                  The same thing happens when you do proper article marketing the way it has been discussed here ad-nauseum. An I have proven this for myself as well, multiple times in a variety of niches.

                  -DTM
                  Signature
                  Are you an affiliate marketer? My site has tons of free stuff and 14,000 pages of Clickbank research. www.affiliatesledgehammer.com
                  Buy a Freedom Bulb! Don't let the government tell you what kind of light bulb you can use!
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      • Profile picture of the author DireStraits
        Originally Posted by Hud View Post

        I tested the "let google index your article before submitting it to article directories" theory, and the result:

        No matter if it is indexed first on my site or not, other sites with my content will outrank me no matter what as long as their authority is higher. So I don't really see the point in waiting for google to index my post first...
        You do this for the cumulative, long-term effects, Hud; not with the expectation that you'll be able to tell the difference after publishing only a handful of them in this order.

        Whether you notice the difference right now or not, by publishing and allowing your articles to become indexed elsewhere first, you're effectively allowing that site to take credit for your work and benefit from the associated bonuses of that.

        Just because it's not immediately apparent, it doesn't mean it's not happening.

        Nearly all of the successful article marketers here (and many who no longer are), who publish their articles on their own sites and conduct SEO (backlinking) on them in addition to syndicating them - i.e. most of them - will stand together in advising you to first ensure they're published and indexed on your own sites so you can reap the benefits of that.

        Entirely your decision, of course, in the end, but is there any particular reason why you'd be so desperate to send them out elsewhere when the waiting time for indexation, even in a worst case scenario, isn't going to be very long (and becomes briefer the more regularly and consistently you publish to your own sites)?

        EDIT: I should check my email for thread notifications whilst posting, to avoid this happening all the time, LOL.
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  • Profile picture of the author brentb
    My opinion... if you are going to spend time writing articles put them on your site and get them indexed... 2cents
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