Would you Pay a Mentor if you had a Guarantee of Income at the end?

I wouldn't trust a guaranteed income.

Martin, thanks for your your title. I ask for permission to swipe it as the headline for my next advertisement. Will you grant that?

And yes, I realize the importance of mentors. I have one and it's been totally absolutely valuable.

Ronald

I wouldn't pay anything. In my personal experience, success in IM comes down more to the individual than anything else. The mentor might be able to keep you working while he's around, but just having a partner or friend can do the same thing. If you're going to be successful in IM, you will be whether or not you have a mentor. And honestly, creating and developing your own ideas will almost always be more lucrative.

Hey Ronald, be my guest

Michael, I was stirring chatter Lets be more direct then.

The guarantee would be that you would be shown how to take an investment of $x and turn a profit from that investment in an allowed time frame. Being shown the steps in which to walk that path.. Profit could mean, invest $500 made $610 back at the first attempt. But you now know the process to work on going forward.

Working on the fish principle that if you are shown how to do it, you can repeat as you need/want. If I just take money and deliver profit one time, you made money but you have no clue on how it was reached.

Martin

James

Excellent point, and one that any mentor should encourage. But sometimes people need a shove and a leaning post to begin their journey. Not everyone is spirited or tough enough to hang in there from A to B first time out.

Martin

Infact as a matter of fact I would be more than happy for such a mentor who gives guarantee as it removes the RISK element from investment. Once succeded it would be rinse and repeat.

There is no such thing as a guaranteed income - even if you have the best mentor in the world, it's up to you what work you're prepared to put in at the end of the day.

That said, I think that a good mentor is worth his/her weight in gold and I wouldn't hesitate to pay for it (indeed I have and it's been worth every penny)

In my opinion any mentor giving you an income guarantee at the end isn't a mentor but very questionable.

In the end its up to the student to actually take the action required the mentor can mentor you until they are blue in the face, if you don't do anything its not the mentors fault.

A good mentor knows this already and should let you know also.

I'll say I'd pay $25 up front and 20-40% of the first 6 months profit

Hmm... Well if you could guarantee me that every time I walked into the Casino with $100 I would walk out with $1000 I'd pay you. I guess if you could guarantee that I would make $1000 for every $100 spent then yeah I'd jump all over that.

However, there is this strange little thing called common sense that happens to interrupt all of these pie in the sky ideas.

My life on this earth is not even GUARANTEED. How in the hell can a monetary payoff be?

If the budget were available to me, then I would most definitely be working with a one on one mentor by now. Sure, you can go out and learn all of this stuff on your own; but why would you want to? If there is someone who has been around the block, and can help you get to their level without having to go through the same crap they did, who wouldn't jump at the oppurtunity?

Now, if you don't have the budget for a mentor, a partner can be just as beneficial. Here at the Warrior Forum there are thousands of newbies looking to get started. Find one that compliments whatever basic talents that you have. Split the cost on a WSO or something, and build together.

The old cliche "two heads are better than one" fits perfectly when it comes to Internet Marketing. You can never have enough quality minds in your circle.

What do you mean by guaranteed income? Let's say a mentor had some amazing techniques that he could "guarantee" would make me an additional $5,000.00 a month with in the next six month. I'd happily put $5,000.00 in escrow, have a mentor do the same, sign a solid contract, and have a third party arbitrator to check results and insure that I do the work. If the technique develops that income stream he can have my $5,000.00, if it doesn't I can have his.

That's guaranteed income.

A money back guarantee is just a refund policy. They are pretty standard. If you wanted to be a little different than all the other mentor types out there I'll tell you what I've never seen, but always thought would be great.

Charge a $25.00 application fee per applicant to your program. Applicants are required to have $XXX put aside for the overhead of their new business. Application fee is non-refundable. Who ever you choose as your apprentice owes you 20% of their IM profits for the next 2 years. Now you have incentive to slog through the hundreds of applicants your obvious prowess will no doubt inspire. You'll be motivated to do everything in your power to help them succeed because if they fail it is money out of your pocket.

I have recently added a guarantee to my coaching program. I was always told never to allow money back for coaching but I've been doing it for a while now and I have my system down.

I charge $2,000 for a 60 day coaching program and guarantee they will make at least $2,000 over the next 12 months or they can have their money back. I only guarantee this because I have my outsource team create the business for them and make the first $2,000 for them.

I offered 6 spots on launch last week and 5 sold out of about 150 viewers. This is much better conversions than a typical $2,000 package would go with my list. I would say that guarantee helped a lot.

I always prefer a guarantee of some sort when I'm spending hundreds to thousands of dollars on a product or service.

That's a good question,

I would be more willing to invest money into a mentor that I knew and could give me some guarantee of a result. I know the mentor is not going to do all the work for me.
It will require work on my part.

It would be like me hiring a personal trainer that would guarantee I would loose 10lbs if I come into the gym and do this workout for the next 30 days with the personal trainer being there every step of the way. So the personal trainers guarantee is "if you do X then I'll guarantee Z results"

If you do nothing you get nothing.... If you do a little you get a little.

A good mentor would cut your learning curve considerably. One that would let you on at a monthly fee and the option to bail at any time. As far as a guarantee I would be very careful and check out the credentials as best I could and with references.

Maybe, that would take most of the learning away from it I feel. It sound appealing though, if I could learn the "Why?" of everything on the page.

The $25 as compensation for the services, no that isn't nearly enough to compensate the time with an experienced, it's more like you said $5,000-10,000.

However, you have to understand the risks involved in this kind of endeavor. Whether you can solve all of my financial problems is one thing, whether I am willing to gamble a great amount on that is another thing, from my perception.

That is why I think think a commission type structure is suited well, because if I were to make a lot of money under your guidance, I (and I assume everyone starting out) would be more than willing to share the proceeds.

This is genius. I would absolutely go for this. I doubt there is a better way to learn than by this very method. For one - you get incentive to continue with your coaching because you get profit from little effort, are able to delegate tasks that would be cheaper than outsourcing, and probably feel good about what you're doing.

In my hand, I learn a TON of stuff that will actually work (or has a good chance, based on your experience in IM) and will save me a ton of time that I would have spend learning the ropes on my own. I get to see something promising grow, and I could potentially earn a small $ incentive to keep me motivated, learning, and working.

I think people want results, so they need a guarentee.

That is a good way to get trust and make it easy for a nice working relationship.

Every student is different - some will take the information the mentor teaches them, then apply it and be successful with it. Other students won't do anything with it and find themselves deeper in debt.

If the student lacks confidence and always doubting himself, afraid to step out of his comfort zone then he's not going to succeed even with the best mentor by his side.

On the other hand if someone is determined to make it work and be successful then he will make with or without a mentor.

That's what I think about it.

Boy I'd be reluctant to proceed on that basis as well. I don't see how a guru can truly guarantee income unless he is doing all the work. I guess the thing to do is to check further into how this might be set up.

At the same time so much good information is available on the Internet for free. It may be more difficult to obtain and organize but it is there.

Paying for advice is NOT mentoring it's consulting...

If you need some guarantee... keep your day job! There you'll get the guarantee to have a regular income.

If you need a real mentor... Work for free. You'll find the best mentors you could ever dream of.

Just a little case study

J

I think working with a mentor is a great idea for anyone not making money online. You've got to pick your mentor very carefully though and having a guaranteed income promised to you cannot be the basis.

It boils down to your personality and what you want to achieve and how you believe the mentor will be able to help you achieve that.

Mentors guaranteeing income is a way for them to sell their program, however, if a mentor or coach says 'I guarantee you'll make xxx, if you DO all I tell you to", I don't think there's anything wrong with it.

Hey,

I own a successful web design/seo company plus a few IM ventures and I'm thinking of launching a WSO IM Coaching Program in a month or 2.

If I do...I plan on offering a guarantee...for example - you pay me $997 coaching fee and I guarantee you'll make $1,000 within 6 months or I'll refund your coaching fee. The refund is only good if you follow the game plan and make 110% effort in your business.

- Ahmad

if it was a good mentor i would pay even without the guaranteed income

If you have a guarnetee of making money at the end, why not?
Especially if this money is reoccurring !
Do it man, the best thing you can do as in IM besides building a list is getting a Mentor, that actually makes a lot of money.

Here's the problem with guarantees, they attract the wrong people. People who need guarantees are horrible business people. Making money online by yourself, means you're now in business for yourself. However some people are programmed to be "job" people and others are programmed to be "entrepreneurial".

Entrepreneur's don't need guarantees. They understand that in life and business there is always risk. If you don't want to take any risk, get a job. Get a paycheck and stop bothering even trying to make anything online. It's always risk versus reward too. Job people get paid less then entrepreneurs because job people are not assuming any of the risk. Entrepreneurs take on 100% of the risk so their reward is always far larger.

Offering a guarantee with conditions will lead to nothing but headaches down the road. You will get people saying they didn't see that part, they didn't read the fine print and more excuses then you can shake a stick at.

So I think that the very nature of a guarantee in making money online is leading to getting the wrong people even attempting things. It's the same with people always wanting "free" traffic because it's "free". They refuse to accept that you have to spend money to make money, (real money anyway).

In my experience training a lot of people over the years, you can lead a horse to water, but you cannot make them drink no matter what you do, you could stand on the back of their neck but some will just plain refuse no matter what. The best part is when they then blame you for their failure. When in reality it's all on them for failing to take any action and failing to invest anything into their success monetarily.

Boy this is a hot topic.

I paid $500 for a mentoring program. I would never pay someone that much again. I don't care if they have made millions. I see a lot of these types of programs offered, and most of the time someone gets a few successes under their belt and then wants to charge hundreds of dollars for their time. No way! Listen guys. there is enough help here and on the internet to help someone get started. I believe it was Edison who said, " being successful is 1 percent inspiration and 99 percent perspiration". The only difference between you and the GURUs is that they have put in the effort and didn't give up. That's it. So get out there and make it happen guys.

Good thread, thank you, because I stand on the threshold of this one. I've tried for 5 years to make money online, with no support from relatives, and no one I know personally who has ever made a dollar online other than ebay.
I've made every blunder, met every fraudster and thief, blown every hard earned penny trying to solve this one and its cost me a fortune As I'm under pressure to solve this, declining health, looming retirement etc, I've been a real sucker for every trigger loaded sales pitch.

A part of the reason I've not made money is that when I find an obstacle I've got no one around to say, 'thats just a speed bump, not mount everest', and without a mentor's higher point of view I'm unable to know whether pushing onwards will reach the goal, or whether pushing onwards will not work no matter what I do. When the terrain is all new to me there's no way to know the difference. Its also the reason even the good programs often don't generate success. As teachers the folks who write wealth creation programs really really need to raise the standard of their game.

Another thing is the high number of wealth plans with built in deficiencies that mean the instructions would never work, unless you already know what you're doing. I just bought one of these from Mark Anastasi a month ago. Out of a seven step plan to make money on FB, 2 steps simply don't/can't work as described, even their help line was quite open about it.

I'm now beginning Adam Millers $500/day on FB, plus FanPage Dollars/Imran Naseem, both of which are well reviewed and have the information, step by step, detail that look like these will actually work. There are even some recent, 'it worked for me reviews' right here on WF.

A profound thank you to those warriors who have posted those kind of comments, they are the life blood I need get my hopes up and to continue.

But ... I'm actually finished now with this whole thing, if I can't get these to work then I'm quiting, going back to some j.o.b that hopefully won't kill me, and then I'm paying for a good one on one mentor, because if someone can stand beside me and, assuming its not another scam, actually help me work the program as though it was their own until the cash starts coming in I will pay a lot to get this, what ever I can afford.

How much is that? Its got to be affordable for low budget people struggling to get ahead, to me $500 would be a lot to pay, if that were truly guaranteed to come back in a month via sales, or via a refund, I'd do it.

If it was $1,000, I'd be too gun shy to risk that much money, even with a guarantee.

Sorry about the rant, I'm deeply burned out by this whole thing. All I have left is a deep determination to change my family's future for the better.

thank you BR

Thanks to all of you who have posted. It makes a clear terrain from the subject

The problem with anything that is labelled as mentor training is:

1) How good is the material being taught?
2) How good is the person teaching it... They may be excellent at generating revenue but a lousy teacher/coach.
3) Does the student fully understand the implications of what they are getting into
4) Is the student REALLY determined enough to work at it and see it through, or are they just not really cut out for the tougher stuff

Also, is the material being taught still relevant! Many "make money online" schemes are just that. They are not coaching or training, they are merely mashed together content of... "This is what I did, copy me and you make money."

This leaves the student very disappointed and the mentor looking bad in their eyes. It may be that the material worked at the time the mentor did it, but those methods are not outdated, invalid.

A good sign of good mentoring would be someone (or group) that were still proactive in their field, so they know and adapt to the changes around them, keeping the content fresh and relevant. The other pertinent point is that good material should not include fly by night techniques as the core, because it will pass its sell by date!

Good business is about reacting to changes, and adapting, but also to innovate when required to do so.

All points not covered I know, but thanks for some great feedback.

Martin

I would pay about $200. What I wish most experienced marketers would do is offer training for a sufficient price and then take half of whatever the student earns. It'd be nice to have a coach that is determined to make you succeed--- now that would be invaluable.

Hi

This thread really caught my eye as I have just paid for a mentor myself.

I won't state publicly here how much I've paid but suffice to say it was quite a lot of money.

However, I have worked with my mentor previously and I totally trust him which is obviously a big thing. Coupled with the fact that he is very successful online due to his honest and ethical marketing techniques, I didn't hesitate when the opportunity arose to work with him.

You can never guarantee anything that's for sure because as has been stated previously, it all depends on how much time and effort you put into it.

I'm looking forward to progressing with him though for sure.

James

It would depend, if you ever have trust to your mentor and how much has he helped you in your goal of earning money, then probably you would have to give him something in return. And I would say that giving something as to show your gratitude with the amount not that much will be more appreciated than disregarding the help of your mentor. Although you already know that there will be a guaranteed income at the end, it's a show how much you appreciate his/her contribution of how much has he/she taught to in earning that money. A good relationship with a mentor would be better as he/she will guide you and give advises in case you will be needing his help.

I can't see how anyone can give a guarantee. Why because there's so many things to take into account like how a person learns, where they live and outside issues (medical conditions for instance) that even if you can give someone a blueprint to making 8 figures then people will fail period.
If it was as easy as following a set of instructions then everyone would get top grades at school!

Rich

So, now that we have a good amount of discussion on the topic, would anyone like to take a stab at mentoring me?

I think the first step would be to direct me to some of the resources you first read, have me read a ton about everything (which I'm doing now... like a sponge on this forum!) and then begin the process.

I can't PM anyone, so pm me with a way of contact (skype or email) if you're interested.

At this point I probably won't be able to make a one time fee (maybe like $25) but I will give hours of free time (or maybe the 20% commission split).

I look forward to responses!

If someone came to me asking for mentoring, and they requested that I sign a guarantee of income at the end of the training - Id walk.

What you do with your time and efforts is beyond my control.

The problem is the guarantee is the main selling point. That's totally wrong and the person offering it knows that. They just want the money and know that if they "guarantee" earnings everyone will trip over themselves to do it.

There was a guy on here a couple years ago who offered this. He's not around anymore but man did people ever fall for his scam.

Well, I have a mentor now that I pay and gladly do it! The training that I learn from him has made me money and and the skill set that I learn is invaluable. Think of it this way, when you go to college and spend 20 to 100k for your education, do they guarantee you a job? Of course not! What a mentor do is give you leverage. If you stuck on something you can call someone who has been their. And believe me it's easier to be able to call someone when you can't figures something out, than to try to figure it out yourself. And yes I pay for a mentor and will keep on paying for a mentor. It will save you a lot of time.

To tell you the truth there is never any guarantee unless you have a written contract and lawyer. The mentor can help you but not gurantee that you will make becuase out of his or hers control.

My first mentor helped me build my first really successful site back in 2009. The coaching cost me $497 and that site has been making between $500-$1000 every month since.

That's a pretty awsome ROI as far as I'm concerned.

Jimmy

I will quote Tommy Boy for this beautiful thread...

"Heck I can throw a guarantee on the box and all you're going to get is a guaranteed box of crap! Or you can buy a quality product from me."

Not the exact words but pretty close. Just a little LOL moment. =)

Mentors are like fathers. You don't get in the world (industry) without them but you don't always listen to what they say step by step. You can only guarantee something for someone else if you are actually gong to step in and do it for them. Because the truth is most people implement probably less than 10% of what they have learned through the years.

It trips me out that we only use 10% of our brains. Anyone see the movie "Limitless." I thought that was an interesting flick.

Anyhow, every person is responsible for what they produce.

Fact is everyone wants to be responsible for their own success when they are producing $100k per month but no one wants to be responsible for their failure when they have listened to someone's guidance but produce nothing so they shift the blame to someone else.

Ask anyone who is making millions and I bet everyone of them will have a name of an individual they look up to as a leader or mentor.

Leadership/Mentoring is priceless.

I have no idea why the rant. Oh well. =)

Later.

You have to be very careful with Guarantees, the only way that can work is, I will pay the mentor after you see it works, otherwise it's hard to trust something like that.

I wouldn't pay for one.. if you learn it yourself you will get into it more and wake up excited to work on your internet enterprise.

This topic has been beaten to death and is futile. I have many many mentors. I would rather have a mentor and make a mistake then have to learn everything from scratch.

I am an auctioneer, a real estate investor and own an organic farm besides doing IM. I don't give guarantees and don't want them. I can teach you everything there is to know about buying distressed real estate. If you miss one detail, you have a good chance of loosing money. If your willing to go back and figure out what you did wrong and take another crack at it you find you missed a cracked foundation and your profit is gone.That is what being an entrepreneur is all about.

As a seasoned business person who has had to pick rocks out of my butt when I make mistakes... you don't whine about it you admit the mistake was yours, "Man I really screwed that up " remember it and don't make it again. No Guarantees!

hahaha

Yah, right! Guaranteed income...

There are too many variables in business. However, I do pay mentors - and I know the only guarantee is that I get out what I put in.

Well, the big issue is people think they are all in the same. There is a misconception that mentors and coaching programs are alike and this gets push around the forum like nobody's business. The fact of the matter is mentors don't charge anything; they are not looking for any monetary value as they have already made their money.

Mentoring is all about sharing your knowledge and time because you see potential in the person you are working with. They mentor because they genuinely want their apprentice to succeed and the greatest payment is seeing their lives change. It's the true validation that you have become successful! I'm mentoring a good friend now, she didn't ask and she certainly doesn't have the kind of money I would charge if I wanted to be a coach. In fact, I asked her because I see real value in her ability.

Coaching on the other hand is a lucrative business model and though you want your students to succeed, you are being paid for your knowledge and time! Generally coaches can handle multiple students as that is their business model and another source of income. You can find coaches within any industry quite easily, but mentors you have to search for and knock on doors (Many times getting turned down)

The amount of money you would pay for a coach is very subjective, what is it worth to you to gain the knowledge and skill to change your life forever? If I knew that I could gain insight on how to make 6-7 figures a year from someone who has already done it, I would happily spend $50k-$100K.Think about this, how much do you think Michael Jordan, Tiger Woods, Steve Jobs, Mark Cuban, Oprah and many other extremely successful pioneers would charge to coach?

If there is a guarantee of income at the end, then ask the "mentor" to accept payment at the end or some sort of profit split utilizing the so-called "guaranteed" method.

See how that goes...

I'd jump on it.
I almost did one that cost $1,000 to join. The main reason I didn't do it was because the straegty they used AND, big AND here.
The title that lured me was make 6 figures a year with little niche... BUT when I watched the presentation. The power point slide said 5 digit figures...
I'm like, I'm way to busy trying my own stuff.
Plus, ther person was in another country, what if they get tired of me? etc..
PS- I MIGHT STILL DO IT THOUGH if what I'm trying doesn't work.
Main thing is TRY, and keep TRYING

My partner and I offer such a deal. I don't think it would qualify as a mentor though.

This all started as a bet actually. We were on another forum and one of the regulars there hated us for the fact .. now get this .. we had only been there for 3 months and already had more thank you and profile page visits than they did. Is that a mature reason not to like someone or not lol?

We basically told them to shut up or put up.

The bet was that we could take a completely green newbie and have them making $1000 a month before they could. Challenge was accepted. We let the forum owner pick our two candidates.

We took our cadet and basically required them to sign a non-disclosure and a no-compete for 6 months.

We then set up a website in a non im niche and started out with squeeze pages, then upsales .. made a couple of quick products and signed up to a couple of affiliate programs in the niche.

We didn't just tell the cadet what to do .. we rolled up our sleeves and divided the work into thirds.

By the fourth month the cadet had two consecutive $1000 + months and we won the bet. Take into consideration we were actually making $3000 + a month as we were splitting profits from the venture also.

Since then we have always had two cadets working at any given time with us. WE split the work loads while teaching the cadet exactly what we are doing.

We only charge $600 for our services because .. we make money while we do this. At the end of 6 months we offer 4 choices ....

1: if they do not make the $1000 a month for 2 consecutive months we offer them a full refund

2: We offer to sell our portion of the business (in installment) for $1000.

3: We offer to buy the cadet outat $1000

4: We offer to take the cadet to $5000 per month for a new set fee.

We do not offer an option to continue partnering just for the sake of partnering.

To date we have had 12 cadets (not counting the one in the bet). No refunds.

We have bought two out because they didn't want to continue on their own and they were lazy and worked our butts off and we didn't offer the upsale to them.

6 bought us out. This is what we suggest because at that point we really are not needed.

2 took the upsale and we are still in the process with them .. and probably will be for a while because about all we do with them now is a little email support and help them make products on occasion.

2 are about half way through the process at the moment.

Isn't it illegal to guarantee income?

I would not because there is no such thing as guaranteed in business. I'd rather observe, watch and learn in a field that i want to venture.

No. I don't believe income guarantees. It's simply not possible to guarantee that someone will make x amount of dollars, unless you pay him yourself.

The simple answer is yes yes and yes do it!

I think most of you are taking this hypothetical too seriously. I think OP meant it as a metaphorical question or something (that's how I interpreted it anyways), but it's still good that you are shrewd about looking at this. In the real world I wouldn't trust any guaranteed income either. No one can guarantee an income unless they are with the mob.

Well if you guys think you are capable of doing things with your own I suggest you not to get a mentor, but I'm not throwing away the fact that it's good to have a leader especially when things seems to be complicated and goes beyond our understanding.