No More Fake Stories On Clickbank, No Fake Scarcities - CB Policy Update 02 Aug 2011

185 replies
Edit: Noticed there are 4 pages to this thread now. A lot of VERY Good discussions. Highly suggest you read through before responding.

Hey,

I just got an e-mail from Clickbank, they've redone their policies.

Vendor Promotional Messaging Guidelines (Someone posted them in the thread too, but I'd rather link DIRECT to the source).

I've posted the e-mail from CB below too

Opinions?

Some things I noted:

- No fake life "stories", aka "I made 1 million dollars and was a bankrupt stripper"

- You cannot say "300 copies left" when their are infinity copies left to be sold (Some products said 10 left and really sold 1000's)

- You cannot say previously sold at a high price, when you've never offered it at that price

- Must have a "No thanks" on Upsell page, that is AT LEAST 12 pt font

- Prices must be clear.

Caleb

Edit 2: If anyone wants to see the e-mail..


We're contacting you today to make you aware of some important updates applying to all ClickBank vendors regarding sales and messaging guidelines. Please take the time to read through this email and the updated rules and guidelines, as all clients are required to comply no later than August 31st, and this may require making changes to your existing sales materials.

As you may already know, in recent months certain regulatory agencies and credit card processors have been taking a very close look at sales and promotional messaging in the e-commerce space, especially in regards to "make money online" products.

To ensure your long-term success, as well as that of the entire ClickBank network of vendors and affiliates, we want to work with you to provide clear direction on what we will and won't accept on ClickBank sales letters and other promotional materials. We've expanded and clarified our guidelines to protect both our clients and end customers, and to ensure that the incredibly successful network you've helped us build here at ClickBank over the past 13 years will continue to grow and prosper for years to come!
(I've bolded a part of it... Thanks to Alans post below - Caleb)

I Contacted Clickbank about how long people have to fix any violations of the new TOS:

"@CalebSpilchen We'll definitely communicate and give plenty of warning. And everyone has until Aug 31 to fix any issues. \".

Source link

By The Way, Clickbank IS LISTENING To your Opinions

"@CalebSpilchen Sure thing. I've been following the WF thread, glad to see people are happy with the changes!"

Source link

Caleb

Post last updated at 7:43 PM EST
#banning #clickbank #fake #stories
  • Profile picture of the author BloggingPro
    How are they going to know they are fiction? Wait until someone outs them via the Google Maps car?
    Signature
    You're going to fail. If you're afraid of failure then you do not belong in the Internet Marketing Business. Period.
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    • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
      Banned
      It's all kind of "too little, too late" but very welcome, nevertheless. Well done, ClickBank.

      Of course the things they're finally disallowing, in compliance with legal/regulatory considerations, are all the things that most serious affiliates have never been willing to promote anyway. So they're actually doing vendors a favour, prohibiting them.
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  • Profile picture of the author Ron Douglas
    Good for them. What took them so long?

    Will they be deleting the products that violate those policies? That's like half the best selling Marketing/MMO products in their marketplace LOL
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    • Profile picture of the author Alan Petersen
      Originally Posted by Ron Douglas View Post

      Good for them. What took them so long?
      Looks like they finally got on the FTC's radar from their email...

      As you may already know, in recent months certain regulatory agencies and credit card processors have been taking a very close look at sales and promotional messaging in the e-commerce space, especially in regards to "make money online" products.
      That's probably what took them so long, the fear of "certain regulatory agencies" vs just doing the right thing and not rip off people.
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      • Profile picture of the author Caleb Spilchen
        Originally Posted by Alan Petersen View Post

        Looks like they finally got on the FTC's radar from their email...



        That's probably what took them so long, the fear of "certain regulatory agencies" vs just doing the right thing and not rip off people.
        Hey Alan,

        I missed that line. Thanks for pointing it out.

        That's interesting.

        Caleb
        Signature

        Caleb Spilchen

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    • Profile picture of the author professorrosado
      Originally Posted by Ron Douglas View Post

      Good for them. What took them so long?

      Will they be deleting the products that violate those policies? That's like half the best selling Marketing/MMO products in their marketplace LOL
      They can't even get rid of the links that don't work or take you commission away by redirecting the visitor from the sale button!
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    • Profile picture of the author forthright
      [QUOTE=Will they be deleting the products that violate those policies? That's like half the best selling Marketing/MMO products in their marketplace LOL[/QUOTE]


      I was wondering the same thing.... are they banning vendor id's until pitch page copy is changed?
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      • Profile picture of the author Caleb Spilchen
        Originally Posted by forthright View Post

        I was wondering the same thing.... are they banning vendor id's until pitch page copy is changed?
        Better to ask Clickbank. So I did.

        I Contacted Clickbank about how long people have to fix any violations of the new TOS:

        "@CalebSpilchen We'll definitely communicate and give plenty of warning. And everyone has until Aug 31 to fix any issues. \".

        Source link

        By The Way, Clickbank IS LISTENING To your Opinions

        "@CalebSpilchen Sure thing. I've been following the WF thread, glad to see people are happy with the changes!"

        Source link
        Signature

        Caleb Spilchen

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    • Profile picture of the author Caleb Spilchen
      Originally Posted by Ron Douglas View Post

      Good for them. What took them so long?

      Will they be deleting the products that violate those policies? That's like half the best selling Marketing/MMO products in their marketplace LOL
      Via Twitter, they have till end of August to fix it.

      Caleb
      Signature

      Caleb Spilchen

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      • Profile picture of the author Jill Carpenter
        Honestly, all they need is one person to spend their days checking out all the current offers and they could be quickly up to speed. Then it all becomes maintenance.

        And perhaps a system where sellers are required to resubmit once a year what ever copy they are using.
        Signature

        "May I have ten thousand marbles, please?"

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        • Profile picture of the author WillR
          Originally Posted by Jill Carpenter View Post

          Honestly, all they need is one person to spend their days checking out all the current offers and they could be quickly up to speed. Then it all becomes maintenance.

          And perhaps a system where sellers are required to resubmit once a year what ever copy they are using.
          But nothing is stopping the person who has his page checked and then goes and puts all the prohibited stuff back on it AFTER Clickbank have checked it. There are far too many products for them to be checking up on sales pages every few months so it's impossible for them to enforce a policy like this.

          Also, using the example in the OP...

          No fake life "stories", aka "I made 1 million dollars and was a bankrupt stripper"
          So what if I told a story that was more believable, how I made $5000 a month selling goods on eBay from my lounge room floor? Now although that story is a lot more believable and would probably be fine under these new rules, it is still a fake life story. I've never made a dime on eBay!

          This proves my point. Clickbank are not after the truth... they are just wanting to get rid of any claims that have the potential to put them on the radar of agencies like the FTC.
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      • Profile picture of the author theemperor
        Lol! What they now need is no more crappy products written by someone who knows nothing about the niche, no more screenshots copied from other products, no more stealing money from affiliates and, well the list goes on...
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  • Profile picture of the author Jesus Perez
    The Internet has just breathed a collective sigh of relief.
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    • Profile picture of the author rushe
      Originally Posted by Jesus Perez View Post

      The Internet has just breathed a collective sigh of relief.
      I couldn't have said it better myself. After August, I expect things are going to have way less hype than they used to.

      There might be a lot of bashing on hype products though - trying to stay cashing in while remaining within the guidelines. That will cool down by a years time at least.

      I wonder what methods people will use next, now...
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  • Profile picture of the author Rod Cortez
    I don't sell or promote any CB products at the moment, but on the surface this seems like a good thing. But my pragmatic, caffeinated part of my grey matter is thinking "how in the heck are they going to enforce this?". :confused:

    RoD
    Signature
    "Your personal philosophy is the greatest determining factor in how your life works out."
    - Jim Rohn
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    • Profile picture of the author Ron Douglas
      Originally Posted by Rod Cortez View Post

      I don't sell or promote any CB products at the moment, but on the surface this seems like a good thing. But my pragmatic, caffeinated part of my grey matter is thinking "how are they going to enforce this?". :confused:

      RoD
      Good question. I think just having that policy in place is a deterrent. Who wants to do all the work creating a product, a sales page, and launching a marketing campaign knowing that the whole thing could get pulled at any minute.

      The best PR they can do is to make an example of a bunch of scammy sites from the start. The word will quickly spread to the entire industry.
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      • Profile picture of the author Caleb Spilchen
        Originally Posted by Ron Douglas View Post

        Good question. I think just having that policy in place is a deterrent. Who wants to do all the work creating a product, a sales page, and launching a marketing campaign knowing that the whole thing could get pulled at any minute.

        The best PR they can do is to make an example of a bunch of scammy sites from the start. The word will quickly spread to the entire industry.
        Ron,

        By the way, you have nothing to worry about.. You promise the greatest recipes, and you give them

        Caleb
        Signature

        Caleb Spilchen

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        • Profile picture of the author Jill Carpenter
          Originally Posted by Caleb Spilchen View Post

          Ron,

          By the way, you have nothing to worry about.. You promise the greatest recipes, and you give them

          Caleb
          Or does he?

          - No fake life "stories", aka "I made 1 million dollars and was a bankrupt stripper"
          Let's say for the sake of argument that someone wanted to create a fictional character to promote recipes. "Grandma's Best Cookies"

          But the person selling this does not have a grandma or specific grandma and wants to create a fictional character to be the personality. Like Chester Cheetos.

          Who decides what fake stories are allowed? Is this only for MMO products?

          "Grandma here. All the little children line up at my doorstep every day for the cookies. You're going to love these recipes!"
          Signature

          "May I have ten thousand marbles, please?"

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          • Profile picture of the author Joseph Robinson
            Banned
            Originally Posted by BloggingPro View Post

            How are they going to know they are fiction? Wait until someone outs them via the Google Maps car?
            Apparently, yes. Or, they will just use their stripper connections and see if you were ever "one of them."

            Originally Posted by Jesus Perez View Post

            The Internet has just breathed a collective sigh of relief.
            It will be nice to enjoy a few weeks of relative peace (and maybe IM getting a little bit of integrity back). Not a permanent solution though in my opinion, more of a band-aid.

            Originally Posted by Jill Carpenter View Post

            Or does he?



            Let's say for the sake of argument that someone wanted to create a fictional character to promote recipes. "Grandma's Best Cookies"

            But the person selling this does not have a grandma or specific grandma and wants to create a fictional character to be the personality. Like Chester Cheetos.

            Who decides what fake stories are allowed? Is this only for MMO products?

            "Grandma here. All the little children line up at my doorstep every day for the cookies. You're going to love these recipes!"
            I'll never look at Granny Smith Apples the same way again. WAS IT ALL A LIE!?
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    • Profile picture of the author David Sieg
      Originally Posted by Rod Cortez View Post

      I don't sell or promote any CB products at the moment, but on the surface this seems like a good thing. But my pragmatic, caffeinated part of my grey matter is thinking "how in the heck are they going to enforce this?". :confused:

      RoD
      I bet they don't enforce it all. It's a "CYA" legal maneuver on their part to keep the FTC and hungry lawyers off THEIR BACK. If some vendor gets caught by the FTC and the vendors lawyers wants to counter-sue Clickbank on the basis of "they allowed it" then CB, can say "Oh no we didn't!" We have a STRICT policy in place and prohibit any such activity."

      Big city smoke and mirrors.
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      Save Time, Save Money, Save the Planet
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  • Profile picture of the author Onora Oz
    Too much cleaning work needs to be done. Some IM "giants", coaches, copywriters will be quite busy for the next few weeks, seems like.
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  • Profile picture of the author kellyburdes
    I had so many people call me a liar and crazy when I posted this news the other day, I'm just glad I can now cancel my appointment with the psyciatrist and wont have to go on crazy medicine
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    • Profile picture of the author kindsvater
      The key is regulatory agencies and credit card processors.

      That is the import of prior threads about PayPal so important, not only for your business, but the software you use (if it is tied to certain processors like ClickBank or PayPal), WSO Plus, and in fact the entire WSO section.

      That is why this last year has steadily seen changes to ClickBank's TOS. More changes in one year than I can remember over the last ten years.

      Plimus changes.

      YouTube video deletions.


      There is an effort to push making money online products literally off the net.

      If you look beyond this forum this is simply a shocking amount of fraud out there.

      In other words, be prepared because more restrictions are coming.


      .
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    • Profile picture of the author Jill Carpenter
      Originally Posted by kellyburdes View Post

      I had so many people call me a liar and crazy when I posted this news the other day, I'm just glad I can now cancel my appointment with the psyciatrist and wont have to go on crazy medicine
      You can mail me that crazy medicine.
      Signature

      "May I have ten thousand marbles, please?"

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      • Profile picture of the author Jill Carpenter
        Statements that infer that the product is significantly easier to use than it really is (for example, "one push button to make money" or "three simple words will provide you income"). ClickBank requires that pitches make reasonable attempts to reflect the actual effort required to achieve typical results. It is generally unreasonable to assume that someone with little or no experience in internet marketing can achieve a 6-figure income with an hour or less of effort per day. It is more reasonable to assume that with attention, effort, and spare time, the average person with little or no internet marketing experience can achieve a supplemental income.
        Well apparently CB has not seen the fantastic WSO's we have here from time to time. :rolleyes:
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        "May I have ten thousand marbles, please?"

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        • Profile picture of the author Thomas Michal
          One thing people need to remember is that the FTC guidelines are just that "guidelines"


          Mary engle of the FTC says herself:


          Theses are not rules and regulations, and they don't have the force of law.
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          • Profile picture of the author kellyburdes
            Try using that in court when they come after ya.

            It don't work



            Originally Posted by Thomas Michal View Post

            One thing people need to remember is that the FTC guidelines are just that "guidelines"


            Mary engle of the FTC says herself:


            Theses are not rules and regulations, and they don't have the force of law.
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4386848].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author Thomas Michal
              Originally Posted by kellyburdes View Post

              Try using that in court when they come after ya.

              It don't work
              The FTC
              publishes its guidelines for the purpose
              of facilitating self-regulation and
              compliance with the laws. The FTC
              will not issue automatic penalties for
              violations. However, the FTC may issue
              a cease and desist order, which is legally
              binding and may require companies and
              individuals to:

              1. Stop running the deceptive ad or
              engaging in the deceptive practice;

              2. Have substantiation for claims in
              future ads;

              3. Report periodically to FTC staff
              about the substantiation they have
              for claims in new ads; and

              4. Pay a fine of $16,000 per day per
              ad if the company or individual
              violates the order in the future.
              In addition, the FTC has authority to
              institute actions against practices that
              constitute "unfair or deceptive acts or
              practices in or affecting commerce."
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              • Profile picture of the author professorrosado
                Originally Posted by Thomas Michal View Post

                The FTC
                publishes its guidelines for the purpose
                of facilitating self-regulation and
                compliance with the laws. The FTC
                will not issue automatic penalties for
                violations. However, the FTC may issue
                a cease and desist order, which is legally
                binding and may require companies and
                individuals to:

                1. Stop running the deceptive ad or
                engaging in the deceptive practice;

                2. Have substantiation for claims in
                future ads;

                3. Report periodically to FTC staff
                about the substantiation they have
                for claims in new ads; and

                4. Pay a fine of $16,000 per day per
                ad if the company or individual
                violates the order in the future.
                In addition, the FTC has authority to
                institute actions against practices that
                constitute "unfair or deceptive acts or
                practices in or affecting commerce."
                This is an example of the sneaky way the Federal Government controls Local Business and individuals over which they normally, Constitutionally, have no jurisdiction.

                Keep alert people with your activities on line as this is or may become Inter-state commerce = Federal Jurisdiction. Anyone hear about that Amish dairy farmer arrested for selling unpasteurized milk across state lines? They set up a sting!
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              • Profile picture of the author scrofford
                Originally Posted by Thomas Michal View Post

                The FTC
                publishes its guidelines for the purpose
                of facilitating self-regulation and
                compliance with the laws. The FTC
                will not issue automatic penalties for
                violations. However, the FTC may issue
                a cease and desist order, which is legally
                binding and may require companies and
                individuals to:

                1. Stop running the deceptive ad or
                engaging in the deceptive practice;

                2. Have substantiation for claims in
                future ads;

                3. Report periodically to FTC staff
                about the substantiation they have
                for claims in new ads; and

                4. Pay a fine of $16,000 per day per
                ad if the company or individual
                violates the order in the future.
                In addition, the FTC has authority to
                institute actions against practices that
                constitute “unfair or deceptive acts or
                practices in or affecting commerce.”
                You are still under the impression the FTC is playing fair and cares about you. The FTC is in this business to make the U.S. Government money amongst other things. They DON'T care. They will find a reason and take your business down if they can.
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          • Profile picture of the author psresearch
            Originally Posted by Thomas Michal View Post

            One thing people need to remember is that the FTC guidelines are just that "guidelines"


            Mary engle of the FTC says herself:


            Theses are not rules and regulations, and they don't have the force of law.
            That's what I'd call a "peace-making" statement, but the reality is much different.

            Here's what Lesley Fair from the FTC's Division of Advertising Practices told me in an email (I've bolded the most important part):

            "Hi, Mr. Schlegel. You raise an interesting question about how the FTC determines the "net impression." Because the FTC deals daily with the question of what's deceptive, the Supreme Court has said that it has the expertise in most cases to make that determination: "As an administrative agency which deals continually with cases in the area, the Commission is often in a better position than are courts to determine when a practice is deceptive within the meaning of the Act. This Court has frequently stated that the Commission's judgment is to be given great weight by reviewing courts. This admonition is especially true with respect to allegedly deceptive advertising since the finding of a violation in this field rests so heavily on inference and pragmatic judgment."

            Sometimes the process depends on whether it's an express claim or a subtler implied claim. Here's how the United States Court of Appeals described the process in Kraft v. FTC: "In determining what claims are conveyed by a challenged advertisement, the Commission relies on two sources of information: its own viewing of the ad and extrinsic evidence. Its practice is to view the ad first and, if it is unable on its own to determine with confidence what claims are conveyed in a challenged ad, to turn to extrinsic evidence. The most convincing extrinsic evidence is a survey of what consumers thought upon reading the advertisement in question, but the Commission also relies on other forms of extrinsic evidence including consumer testimony, expert opinion, and copy tests of ads."

            One of the best summaries of what makes an advertising claim deceptive us the FTC's long-standing Deception Policy Statement: www.ftc.gov/bcp/policystmt/ad-decept.htm"
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          • Profile picture of the author scrofford
            Originally Posted by Thomas Michal View Post

            One thing people need to remember is that the FTC guidelines are just that "guidelines"


            Mary engle of the FTC says herself:


            Theses are not rules and regulations, and they don't have the force of law.
            No they are not really just guidelines. The FTC really comes after people for not complying.
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            • Profile picture of the author kellyburdes
              Not only the FTC, but all the other alphabet soup federal agencies too.

              And not just in the United States, but in the EU as well, though they tend to not be as aggressive and over-reaching - probably because they don't need to be on account the good ole USA having that bit covered.

              There's a great book called "Your a Federal Criminal" (I might not have the title exactly right) written by a two former Federal Prosecutors, a defender and a judge.

              In it they show how every single one of us commits numerous federal crimes every single day just by living our every day live, and that's exactly the way the Fed's want it....because if they do come after you, they want to be able to nail ya ass.

              If the FTC has an issue with you and by the grace of God and the angles smiling down on you they don't have anything, you can bet your shorts that another Federal or even State agency will - and they will grudgingly pass your hanging over on the small chance they can't make stuff up.


              Originally Posted by scrofford View Post

              No they are not really just guidelines. The FTC really comes after people for not complying.
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    • Profile picture of the author adionline
      I like these changes and I am sure clickbank is going to lose some money in the short terms although it's better than facing legal action down the road from the FTC or whomever.

      I am a clickbank vendor (non IM related) and fortunately I am complying with all these rules except for the pricing discount which I think is a little harsh considering every single business uses this as a marketing technique both online and in brick and mortar stores but I don't think it will affect sales tremendously anyway.

      That being said 80% of my competition in the niche will have to make some rather large changes to their products especially those using video sales letters.
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      Giving up is not an option.
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  • Profile picture of the author Tsnyder
    Enforcement is easy... if they really want it to be.

    Let's say I'm a CB compliance nerd. You submit a web page
    containing a story saying you were once a stripper in a Latvian
    message parlor... then became a millionaire by doing whatever
    it is you propose to teach.

    No problem... send me documentation... payroll stubs, etc...
    showing your employment history at the Latvian massage parlor
    along with verified proof of earnings for your millionaire status
    claim. Until then, you're launch is on hold. Have a nice day.
    Signature
    If you knew what I know you'd be doing what I do...
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    • Profile picture of the author Rod Cortez
      Originally Posted by Tsnyder View Post

      Enforcement is easy... if they really want it to be.

      Let's say I'm a CB compliance nerd. You submit a web page
      containing a story saying you were once a stripper in a Latvian
      message parlor... then became a millionaire by doing whatever
      it is you propose to teach.

      No problem... send me documentation... payroll stubs, etc...
      showing your employment history at the Latvian massage parlor
      along with verified proof of earnings for your millionaire status
      claim. Until then, you're launch is on hold. Have a nice day.
      Ah great, that means I better start keeping ALL my receipts and document all the nights I work(ed) at Chip-n-Dales.

      RoD
      Signature
      "Your personal philosophy is the greatest determining factor in how your life works out."
      - Jim Rohn
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      • Profile picture of the author professorrosado
        Originally Posted by Rod Cortez View Post

        Ah great, that means I better start keeping ALL my receipts and document all the nights I work(ed) at Chip-n-Dales.

        RoD
        Well you're supposed to in the U.S. says the IRS! But then, thats another story and thread!!!
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      • Profile picture of the author HeySal
        Originally Posted by Rod Cortez View Post

        Ah great, that means I better start keeping ALL my receipts and document all the nights I work(ed) at Chip-n-Dales.

        RoD
        I'm sorry, Rod. I do not believe this story. Could you please post the pictures to prove that? Pretty please?

        Whatever the FTC says or doesn't say - they can fine you $11,000 for each infraction. Feel free to point out to them how they are not legally able to do anything about your website and products when they hit you with the fines or tell your server to shut you down. Let us know how it's workin' for ya.
        Signature

        Sal
        When the Roads and Paths end, learn to guide yourself through the wilderness
        Beyond the Path

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      • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
        Banned
        Originally Posted by Rod Cortez View Post

        Ah great, that means I better start keeping ALL my receipts and document all the nights I work(ed) at Chip-n-Dales.

        RoD
        Please post legit screenshots or better yet, live video to prove your previous employment at Chippendales.
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  • Profile picture of the author Ettienne
    THIS IS BRILLIANT!!!
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  • Profile picture of the author Ettienne
    and really bad for those millions of liars out there, karma's a bitch!! (can i say bitch?)

    so, in conclusion...

    WAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!
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    • Profile picture of the author kellyburdes
      Don't be so sure. The major players responsible for these types of launches and promotions have known about it for about a month, and have been spending a lot of time masterminding the issue, and have already figured out how to get around most (but not all) of the issues.

      The one's they haven't figured out yet -they will.


      It's actually going to be worse, not better, because they are going to look a lot more legit, but be way less!


      Originally Posted by Ettienne View Post

      and really bad for those millions of liars out there, karma's a bitch!! (can i say bitch?)

      so, in conclusion...

      WAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!
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      • Profile picture of the author Alex Barboza
        Originally Posted by kellyburdes View Post

        It's actually going to be worse, not better, because they are going to look a lot more legit, but be way less!
        Now this is something to worry about.
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  • Profile picture of the author Ettienne
    PS. Here is the official statement
    Vendor Promotional Messaging Guidelines
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  • Profile picture of the author Truxx
    Maybe they'll finally get rid of some of the junk
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  • Profile picture of the author Ettienne
    Well I for one am sick and tired of seeing all these fake clickbank screenshots all over the net. It's a very dishonest way of making tons of money, what happened to integrity? Most marketers obviously have none
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  • Profile picture of the author yukon
    Banned
    Well the CB email has to be blowing smoke, otherwise they would have to shut down 99% of the CB vendor squeeze pages.

    Hasn't happend...

    I never buy anything from CB, I can't tolerate the over hyped nonsense, I do sell one product but it's not in the IM niche.
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  • Profile picture of the author BloggingPro
    Again I ask how is anyone going to actually enforce this?

    Are they going to run your copy through their "Bull**** Detector?"

    Someone said you could make marketers provide paystub's from their "fictional" stories? Like someone can't just make up type up some pay-sub's in two seconds using excel...

    Videos that portray or reference a fictionalized individual or life story, where a vendor makes false claims as part of the product pitch.
    Wouldn't it be better just to BAN personal stories, whether true or not from the sales copy or videos?
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    • Profile picture of the author Thomas Michal
      Originally Posted by Ken_Caudill View Post

      Let's just repeal the First Amendment and be done with it.
      They're working on that...
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    • Profile picture of the author Regional Warrior
      Originally Posted by Ken_Caudill View Post

      Let's just repeal the First Amendment and be done with it.
      Ken

      Not all live in Amercia so that only apllies to people living there

      Jason
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      • Profile picture of the author WillR
        Originally Posted by drunkenmonkey View Post

        What exactly is your logic/rational behind this?
        In Australia we refer to it as 'the law of common sense'.

        Originally Posted by drunkenmonkey View Post

        The FTC would STILL point the Finger at ClickBank and hold them ultimately responsible for not carrying out the necessary compliance checks, to make sure www.nonspecificwebsite.com is in fact compliant.
        So if I get a Hotmail account and agree to their end user agreement that I will not send any spam email, then I go out and send a whole heap of spam advertising my business, the FTC and authorities will go after Hotmail and not me? Damn, I had no idea. Off to get myself a Hotmail account pronto.

        Originally Posted by kellyburdes View Post

        To be honest that's one of those things that sounds good when you say it, and it feels good too because if your an honest vendor refunds feel like a rejection, and like you didn't live up to your end of the deal. It can be hard to take.
        I get your point but there is aggressive marketing and idiotic marketing. With Clickbank I am sure the majority of people who have the sky high refund rates would fall into the second category.
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  • Profile picture of the author FrozenGod
    Just wanted to post that and saw this post,
    I think its a small step but it will help the industry a bit.
    I mean at least no more time and copies left scarcity (this was a real JOKE!).
    I'm glad that these vampires will have at least some of their skills off and maybe less people will fall as victims and have their money sucked for nothing.

    Regards.
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  • Profile picture of the author pbdollars
    very interesting. I think some strict guide lines should be there.
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  • Profile picture of the author BrendaG
    Ah - now I get it - this is why others are creating their own "clickbank"-esq vendor websites. Paypal TOS's are not as strict "at the moment" and will be a tad easier to comply with - until the FTC holds PayPal accountable in a similar fashion.

    As for enforcement - depends on how many "boots on the ground" clickbank has - as well as other points of compliance they have agreed to with the FTC. Time will tell.
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  • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
    Banned
    They should have had rules against lies and deception all along. Only when their ass is on the line, do they care about ethics.
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  • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
    Okay, raise your hand if you bought the funnel cake report last year and read my advice about how many offers to make and where and why.

    I said outright not to make more than two upsells or have more than one exit pop, and that you MIGHT be able to make a good case for ONE MORE of either - but that's the limit.

    AND WHAT'S CLICKBANK'S NEW LIMIT?


    We Will NOT Allow:
    • More than 3 upsells (one time offers) and two exit offers for each sales flow
    Three upsells, two exit pops.

    The same damn limit I told you to have last year.

    Just sayin', folks. Just sayin'.
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  • Profile picture of the author wrongnumber
    Now this is something... i really appreciate... On another thought... I think this might help cut the Fluff... hope this really helps... (until and unless Vendors find a way to tweak the rules, which they have always been successful at... )

    Thanks For the Update...
    Sigh of Relief..
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  • Profile picture of the author inhwanie
    I just saw a product launched last week that pretty much violates every line haha...wonder what'll become of it.
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    • Profile picture of the author Caleb Spilchen
      Originally Posted by inhwanie View Post

      I just saw a product launched last week that pretty much violates every line haha...wonder what'll become of it.
      They have till the 31st.. (So they'll have to fix it).


      -- Note --

      We're on Page two, be sure to check the first post for updates as I got clickbanks corrections on this.

      Caleb
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  • Profile picture of the author wrongnumber
    reading the entire post at CB that caleb mentions is such a pleasant read.. ... well i got something you should really look at...

    Statements that infer that the product is significantly easier to use than it really is (for example, "one push button to make money" or "three simple words will provide you income"). ClickBank requires that pitches make reasonable attempts to reflect the actual effort required to achieve typical results. It is generally unreasonable to assume that someone with little or no experience in internet marketing can achieve a 6-figure income with an hour or less of effort per day. It is more reasonable to assume that with attention, effort, and spare time, the average person with little or no internet marketing experience can achieve a supplemental income.
    And I think WF should implement something similar to their WSOs...

    cheers!
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    • Profile picture of the author kindsvater
      Originally Posted by wrongnumber View Post

      And I think WF should implement something similar to their WSOs...
      The WSO Rules already prohibit false claims.

      "1. All WSOs Must Comply With Forum Rules, US Laws, and the Laws of Your Location. Keep in mind the forum cannot possibly review and evaluate WSOs. Legal compliance is strictly your responsibility. Do not ask me or a moderator if what you are offering is legal.

      The forum does not tolerate false claims. Treat your membership like gold as violating forum rules can result in a loss of WSO posting privileges."

      If you come across a WSO making false claims report it to the Help Desk.

      .
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      • Profile picture of the author Caleb Spilchen
        Brian,

        Originally Posted by kindsvater View Post

        The WSO Rules already prohibit false claims.

        "1. All WSOs Must Comply With Forum Rules, US Laws, and the Laws of Your Location. Keep in mind the forum cannot possibly review and evaluate WSOs. Legal compliance is strictly your responsibility. Do not ask me or a moderator if what you are offering is legal.

        The forum does not tolerate false claims. Treat your membership like gold as violating forum rules can result in a loss of WSO posting privileges."

        If you come across a WSO making false claims report it to the Help Desk.

        .
        Legal question for you.

        If someone makes a FALSE Claim that I can make a certain amount of money, and I use their system, and can't make a certain amount of money (and they have no earnings disclaimer). Is that a violation of law? Can you be sued for that?

        Just wondering!

        Caleb
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    • Profile picture of the author NetAffiliate
      Originally Posted by wrongnumber View Post

      reading the entire post at CB that caleb mentions is such a pleasant read.. ... well i got something you should really look at...



      And I think WF should implement something similar to their WSOs...

      cheers!
      Clickbank's new guidelines give me a little hope that the future of IM will not continue it's dive into the depths of Dishonesty and Hollow Sales Pitches.

      I think WF should implement something to their WSO's too.
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  • Profile picture of the author JamesGw
    Thank God. It's about time.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mike Hill
    What I like is that they also want you to submit a script prior to shooting a video. Videos will not be accepted without a script pre-review.

    Awesome stuff ClickBank...

    But on the other side I hope ClickBank will be consistent in supporting their new TOS guidelines regardless of who the vendor is.
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  • Profile picture of the author Alexandru
    That's all good, but how are they going to check if the testimonials or stories are true or false? Not much is going to change when it comes to testimonials and stories.

    The other changes are good though.

    I never liked false scarcity and stories like "my private clients paid $10,000 for this $7 product."

    What will happen to the current products on ClickBank? Almost every sales page is full of false scarcity and fake prices...
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    • Profile picture of the author Mike Hill
      Originally Posted by Alexandru View Post

      That's all good, but how are they going to check if the testimonials or stories are true or false? Not much is going to change when it comes to testimonials and stories.

      The other changes are good though.

      I never liked false scarcity and stories like "my private clients paid $10,000 for this $7 product."

      What will happen to the current products on ClickBank? Almost every sales page is full of false scarcity and fake prices...


      ClickBank specifically states that those testimonials must be on file with you and also with a signature and contact details of each person for future proof if you need to provide it. Just like this needs to happen in the offline world with the FTC.

      So, if it comes down to it and ClickBank needs to request those testimonials on file you better produce them or you could face serious consequences.
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      • Profile picture of the author Ben Armstrong
        A very welcome change indeed.

        I only wish I had some experience in product creation. These changes will provide massive opportunities for people who know where to look.
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      • Profile picture of the author Mike Hill
        Originally Posted by drunkenmonkey View Post

        Mike,

        IMO they cannot regulate it full stop.

        It has come way too late.

        All the un-ethical marketers (without naming any names...and I could name over 15 straight off the bat) have already ruined it.

        They have already laughed all the way to the bank.

        The rest of us are picking up the pieces now... hopefully clickbank can prove that all the products are indeed legitimate and improve their rep, I just hope Google takes note of that now, and allow the honest among us to start running ads on the PPC network again.

        Still we can dream eh...

        Yeah it will probably take quite a long time before ClickBank emerges out from that dark cloud but it is possible. And if ClickBank takes this as serious as we want them to then the playing field will be more honestly balanced.

        What I fear is that a dishonest marketer will pay someone overseas to provide a genuine testimonial. hopefully they will not be allowed to use them if the person cannot be easily reached for verification.

        But in the end I think ClickBank is doing the right thing... For a time there ClickBank was all about "the money" they were making from it's vendors instead of doing this right from the start.

        Better late than never and everyone deserves a second chance to make things right... right?
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  • Profile picture of the author Ephrils
    Long overdue. Clickbank will be much better and more reputable once it's all cleaned up.
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  • Profile picture of the author Chris Worner
    yawn....it wasn't all that long ago Clickbank forbade the use of Clickbank income screenshots unless they had verified it was legit and given you permission to do so, I havn't yet seen them enforce that rule, and this was quite a few months ago.

    Chris
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    • Profile picture of the author Thomas Michal
      Now instead of just flat out lies everyone is going to use "forward looking statements" and "soft information" I doubt much will change. Also, many of these people really do make the kind of money they flaunt so they can still do it...
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  • Profile picture of the author WillR
    Call me skeptical but Clickbank have known about all these problems for years - it's no secret. Especially considering they have a policy whereby they have to manually approve each and every sales page that uses their system. So they've known about all this BS forever since each sales page goes past their eyes first.

    The only reason they are putting these 'rules' in place now is to cover their own asses - NOT to clean up the industry. They have made a bucket load of money over the years off the back of the very things they are now trying to ban.

    The only reason they are doing this is out of a fear of what might happen if they do not... NOT because they have somehow grown a conscience overnight. Give me a break! If there were no regulatory bodies breathing down their neck I am certain these changes would NEVER have been made.

    These things will continue to be on Clickbank sales pages in one form or another - mark my word. If you think this is going to really clean anything up then I'm sorry... but you are a little naive. Clickbank will approve the sales page, you then go and add all the nasty stuff on afterwards. The sorts of people using these ludicrous tactics on their sales pages are the same sorts of people who are going to find a simple and sneaky way around a set of rules like this.

    But at least THIS way Clickbank can now point at their user agreement and pass the blame on to YOU when the FTC comes knocking on their door.

    That is all this change is about. Limiting THEIR liability when the sh#t hits the fan.
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    • Profile picture of the author DR's Fynest
      Originally Posted by WillR View Post

      Call me skeptical but Clickbank have known about all these problems for years - it's no secret. Especially considering they have a policy whereby they have to manually approve each and every sales page that uses their system. So they've known about all this BS forever since each sales page goes past their eyes first.

      The only reason they are putting these 'rules' in place now is to cover their own asses - NOT to clean up the industry. They have made a bucket load of money over the years off the back of the very things they are now trying to ban.

      The only reason they are doing this is out of a fear of what might happen if they do not... NOT because they have somehow grown a conscience overnight. Give me a break! If there were no regulatory bodies breathing down their neck I am certain these changes would NEVER have been made.

      These things will continue to be on Clickbank sales pages in one form or another - mark my word. If you think this is going to really clean anything up then I'm sorry... but you are a little naive. Clickbank will approve the sales page, you then go and add all the nasty stuff on afterwards. The sorts of people using these ludicrous tactics on their sales pages are the same sorts of people who are going to find a simple and sneaky way around a set of rules like this.

      But at least THIS way Clickbank can now point at their user agreement and pass the blame on to YOU when the FTC comes knocking on their door.

      That is all this change is about. Limiting THEIR liability when the sh#t hits the fan.
      *Ding, Ding, Diiiing!*

      Couldn't have said it better myself, Will. I'm thinking the exact way. There'll be those who will find ways to work around these new "rules".

      I still remember the last time they had some "rules" and how much that's helped.:rolleyes:
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    • Profile picture of the author davidtong
      Originally Posted by WillR View Post

      But at least THIS way Clickbank can now point at their user agreement and pass the blame on to YOU when the FTC comes knocking on their door.

      That is all this change is about. Limiting THEIR liability when the sh#t hits the fan.
      Exactly... Logistically, there's NO WAY they can prove/disprove any testimonial/claims of all their products, heck, even a single product will take forever to prove as sellers can also blame it on the buyer for not implementing their product correctly.

      Honestly, what if it's a (the usual example) dog training system and it didn't work. Can CB really confirm with the dog owner and/or the dog () why it didn't work out?

      As with most corporate guidelines, they're nothing more that rear-end covering for the most part...
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      • Profile picture of the author HeySal
        Originally Posted by davidtong View Post

        Exactly... Logistically, there's NO WAY they can prove/disprove any testimonial/claims of all their products, heck, even a single product will take forever to prove as sellers can also blame it on the buyer for not implementing their product correctly.

        Honestly, what if it's a (the usual example) dog training system and it didn't work. Can CB really confirm with the dog owner and/or the dog () why it didn't work out?

        As with most corporate guidelines, they're nothing more that rear-end covering for the most part...
        Ah..but it's not up to them to prove damn thing. If you make a statement in your advertising it's on YOU to prove that it is a true statement, in other words, you have to prove "average results" if you make a statement. If you can't prove it, you shouldn't be making the claim. "There are people making x amount" is a very different statement than "Make x amount...." It's up to the business owner to be smart enough to know that. If they know that some people make that much - they should be able to prove it without problems. It's called truth in advertising, so they are just following laws that have been on the books for brick and mortar businesses forever and a day now.

        Clickbank IS reacting to FTC rulings, but they are also reacting to loss of business that is resulting from scam artists that make outrageous claims and leaving masses of customers disappointed and disgruntled. That is also why the FTC stepped in. Control agencies have been deluged with complaints. When your mail and email boxes are stuffed full of complaints every day about products not delivering what is promised on advertisements, it's time to do something.

        Have you seen all the posts on this forum with people bitching because they are expected to be honest when advertising? The word "advertising" itself is being turned into a synonym for "hype" and "bull s***" . There are a lot of us marketing that don't appreciate seeing scammers become so prolific that consumers doubt every word you say even when telling the complete truth with no embellishment. Those of us who put the effort in to make a product that meets or beats consumer expectations appreciate efforts of agencies to keep advertisers honest. Consumers appreciate it, too.

        If of you who expect the rest of us to bleed tears for scammers getting their wings clipped because they don't understand the truth in advertising laws or don't care WTF they say to anyone as long as they get a buck for it, I only have one thing to say. It sucks to be you.
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        • Profile picture of the author davidtong
          I don't think anyone's siding with the scammers in this thread so far. I can't speak for the others, but I see that many 'corporate' policies that try to control fraud tends to rely on how the system is actively enforced. We all hope and wish to live in a society where people operate in good faith and honesty, but the fact of the matter is, when money's involved, there are just too many that don't and a lot of these will still slip through the system, especially if enforcement efforts are limited.

          I sure hope you're not implying that some of us are condoning these fraudulent claims Sal.
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        • Profile picture of the author WillR
          Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

          but they are also reacting to loss of business that is resulting from scam artists that make outrageous claims and leaving masses of customers disappointed and disgruntled.
          I think Clickbank probably make more money than they lose on these types of unethical products... in fact I am sure of it. They wouldn't have let the issue ride so long if that were not the case. Let's face it, they know that for every one customer who gets disgruntled and vows never to buy another Clickbank product again, they will be replaced by about 10-20 new customers the very next day.

          There is one simple way to clean up the whole Clickbank marketplace very quickly... and this is something that should have been done a long time ago. They need to set a maximum refund rate of around 20% and any products that go beyond that are taken out of the marketplace for review or removed altogether.

          Did you know there are some Clickbank products that have refund rates over 40%... and they are still allowed to run! How ridiculous is that?! Get rid of these stupid products.

          Not only does this rid the marketplace of all those products we are talking about, it also encourages vendors to create higher quality products and to deliver on the promises made in their sales copy.

          Simple solution. This is what a company who really gave a sh#t would do... but they don't.
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          • Profile picture of the author kellyburdes
            To be honest that's one of those things that sounds good when you say it, and it feels good too because if your an honest vendor refunds feel like a rejection, and like you didn't live up to your end of the deal. It can be hard to take.

            But I'll just go with something John Carlton says a lot, and it's true.

            If you refund rate is under 20%, your not selling hard enough - and your not making nearly as much money as you should be.

            I used to be very proud of the fact that my products barely had any refunds (around 4%). Of course, I wasn't making nearly as much money as I should have, nor was I reaching and helping nearly are many people with my products as I could have if I'd had the courage to be a little more aggressive.

            I learned that refunds are not a bad thing, they don't make me dishonest or my business a scam.

            I've made my products a lot better, but I've also made my sales much more aggressive and so I have a lot more refunds.

            When I learned that I went from having dozens of happy customers to having thousands, and I went from selling tens of thousands of dollars worth of product, to selling millions of dollars worth of product.

            Yes, I get angry letters and emails from people who are not happy with my products, which hardly ever happened before. But it's barely more than a few days that goes by that I don't also get emails from people telling me that I have changed their lives and that they have been blessed to have bought my products and services. Many of them never would have if I'd not been willing to push on the gas, be more aggressive, and take on higher refunds.



            Originally Posted by WillR View Post

            They need to set a maximum refund rate of around 20% and any products that go beyond that are taken out of the marketplace for review or removed altogether.
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          • Profile picture of the author LegitIncomes
            Originally Posted by WillR View Post

            I think Clickbank probably make more money than they lose on these types of unethical products... in fact I am sure of it. They wouldn't have let the issue ride so long if that were not the case. Let's face it, they know that for every one customer who gets disgruntled and vows never to buy another Clickbank product again, they will be replaced by about 10-20 new customers the very next day.

            There is one simple way to clean up the whole Clickbank marketplace very quickly... and this is something that should have been done a long time ago. They need to set a maximum refund rate of around 20% and any products that go beyond that are taken out of the marketplace for review or removed altogether.

            Did you know there are some Clickbank products that have refund rates over 40%... and they are still allowed to run! How ridiculous is that?! Get rid of these stupid products.

            Not only does this rid the marketplace of all those products we are talking about, it also encourages vendors to create higher quality products and to deliver on the promises made in their sales copy.

            Simple solution. This is what a company who really gave a sh#t would do... but they don't.
            That's absolutely ridiculous! The actual refund rate (subtracting the "serial refunders"), should be no more than 8-10%.
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          • Profile picture of the author LB
            Originally Posted by WillR View Post


            Did you know there are some Clickbank products that have refund rates over 40%... and they are still allowed to run! How ridiculous is that?! Get rid of these stupid products.
            I'm curious where you're getting this data. CB doesn't release it and I don't think a vendor is going to volunteer something so embarrassing.

            I was told 15% is around the number where you are at risk of getting the boot if you don't improve it.
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            • Profile picture of the author Caleb Spilchen
              Originally Posted by LB View Post

              I'm curious where you're getting this data. CB doesn't release it and I don't think a vendor is going to volunteer something so embarrassing.

              I was told 15% is around the number where you are at risk of getting the boot if you don't improve it.
              Refund rates over 80% have been "rumored" to happen with recent guru launches, according to sources of mine (that were BIG affiliates)

              Caleb
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            • Profile picture of the author CyberSorcerer
              Originally Posted by LB View Post

              I'm curious where you're getting this data. CB doesn't release it and I don't think a vendor is going to volunteer something so embarrassing.

              I was told 15% is around the number where you are at risk of getting the boot if you don't improve it.
              There's a site, it is a paid site so you need to be a member, but it gives you a lot of information on products including a products refund rate.

              It's called CBEngine, I believe there a free version of it but you get limited information. Look on the right sidebar for the search criteria entry fields.

              I use this tool extensively and really helps in choosing a product to promote.
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              • Profile picture of the author LB
                Originally Posted by CyberSorcerer View Post

                There's a site, it is a paid site so you need to be a member, but it gives you a lot of information on products including a products refund rate.

                It's called CBEngine, I believe there a free version of it but you get limited information. Look on the right sidebar for the search criteria entry fields.

                I use this tool extensively and really helps in choosing a product to promote.
                Clickbank does not publish refund data.

                There is a way to calculate it based on the amount earned, commission rate, etc. but it's HIGHLY inaccurate if the product price has ever changed, if there are upsells, if there is more than one product in the account etc.

                I have a product with a 2% refund rate on CB and one of those sites at one point claimed I was getting 37% refunds.

                There is NO WAY to know what a refund rate is. CB won't keep you around long if you hit 15 and at 10 there is a chance they will get in touch with you.
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    • Profile picture of the author Greg Jacobs
      Originally Posted by WillR View Post


      But at least THIS way Clickbank can now point at their user agreement and pass the blame on to YOU when the FTC comes knocking on their door.

      That is all this change is about. Limiting THEIR liability when the sh#t hits the fan.
      THis is all it is.. nothing more....

      When I see this page change
      Marketplace - ClickBank

      Then I will raise an eyebrow. My guess is 9/10 products on that page violate everything CB is mentioning in the letter. (and are also their top money makers)
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  • Profile picture of the author Mitchell Assin
    I am happy they finally changed this maybe it will save some honest working people some moolah that they can use the right way instead of wasting it on broken dreams and lies ~
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  • Profile picture of the author stephfoster
    I'm glad to see these long overdue changes. It's ridiculous that Clickbank has taken so long. Allowing such excessive hype on products has done damage to their reputation, and they'll have to be strict and really follow up on vendors to keep them from making changes on previously approved sales pages.

    I wonder how soon they'll start reminding affiliates that they have to follow the rules too. It's not only vendors who make ridiculous claims, but affiliates too. It doesn't matter if you use promotional materials provided by the vendor, you're supposed to make sure that the claims you promote are accurate.
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    • Profile picture of the author Alfredo Carrion
      Originally Posted by stephfoster View Post

      I wonder how soon they'll start reminding affiliates that they have to follow the rules too. It's not only vendors who make ridiculous claims, but affiliates too. It doesn't matter if you use promotional materials provided by the vendor, you're supposed to make sure that the claims you promote are accurate.
      Probably it will be the job of the vendor to remind that to their affiliates:

      Also, affiliates cannot pose as neutral third parties evaluating two products so they make a commission on selling one of them.
      Some review sites will have to redo their posts to comply with Clickbank's new policies.
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  • Profile picture of the author reimer
    Banned
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    • Profile picture of the author Caleb Spilchen
      Originally Posted by reimer View Post

      so the question is:

      When they are gonna to apply the same principle in the WSO section...?
      Read rule #1 of the WSO Forum bro, you can't lie in threads already, you can't have fake testimonials already...

      Caleb
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  • Profile picture of the author alexmobile
    Now all the gurus should modify their CB pages saying "Hurry up, only 10 copies left (until August 31st), AND WE DO MEAN IT" lol
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  • Profile picture of the author lacraiger
    theres no way they will enforce these on every publisher...
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    • Profile picture of the author MarQueteer
      Originally Posted by lacraiger View Post

      theres no way they will enforce these on every publisher...
      Maybe not, but they get the FTC off their back and if things become ugly, it's the publishers and not Clickbank at the short end of the stick.
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  • Profile picture of the author NerdGary
    Yeah this whole thing started with the credit card companies trying to kill paypal off, business wise. They are using their muscle to ruin paypal.. Paypal gets squeezed, and they put the pressure on sites lick clickbank to hamper down.

    Its pretty odd however because paypal is similar to western union, where they just transfer the funds.
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    • Profile picture of the author ChadOath
      Originally Posted by NerdGary View Post

      Yeah this whole thing started with the credit card companies trying to kill paypal off, business wise. They are using their muscle to ruin paypal.. Paypal gets squeezed, and they put the pressure on sites lick clickbank to hamper down.

      Its pretty odd however because paypal is similar to western union, where they just transfer the funds.
      Just curious. Why are credit card companies trying to kill off Paypal? I thought they actually got a boost from all of the credit card transactions that Paypal process.
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  • Profile picture of the author ChadOath
    Like someone said, this is just a way for them to pass the majority of legal liability on to the vendors. Come 8/1, you will just have to agree to the new terms when you log in. They'll only crack down on sites that receive a lot of complaints, or an FTC warning.
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  • Profile picture of the author Gary Ning Lo
    Good move by CB..

    In my opinion, the "timer" and other types of false time sensitive offers should also be disallowed.

    Cheers,

    ~Gary
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  • Profile picture of the author NerdGary
    Chad a HUGEEEEE amount of people use paypal instead of banks for everyday transactions.. Eating right into the CC co's / Bank profits. I have to imagine they HATE paypal, and want to give them a hard time.
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    • Profile picture of the author ChadOath
      Originally Posted by NerdGary View Post

      Chad a HUGEEEEE amount of people use paypal instead of banks for everyday transactions.. Eating right into the CC co's / Bank profits. I have to imagine they HATE paypal, and want to give them a hard time.
      Gotcha.
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  • Profile picture of the author typhoon
    I think it will create some impact...And probably just because of this one of the clickbank vendor "fmtraffic" made to sell a product "Free Mass Traffic" which was big scam (a directory submitter in 2011!) has been taken off the marketplace according to the email I received.

    Let's wait and see the products that will launch after August 2011
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  • Profile picture of the author Gaz Cooper
    If you look at how quick Clickbank Pulled the Poor Cancer guy dying in the hospital bed telling you it might be your last chance if you dont buy his product it would lead you to believe that Clickbank is serious as they pulled that within hours of the launch.

    However the sheer volume of products may make it a real headache to police but as mentioned above its now their terms and conditions and we may be seeing a few more Don Lapre situations should it be ignored.

    kickin it on Amazon

    Gaz Cooper
    Amz Training Academy
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    • Profile picture of the author Steven Wagenheim
      And in the still of the night, a thundering crack could be heard.

      The gods proclaimed "No more crap on Clickbank."

      And the people rejoiced for their new found freedom from lies and deception.

      Oh how naive the people can be.

      The worst is yet to come.
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      • Profile picture of the author IowaGal
        Originally Posted by Steven Wagenheim View Post

        And in the still of the night, a thundering crack could be heard.

        The gods proclaimed "No more crap on Clickbank."

        And the people rejoiced for their new found freedom from lies and deception.

        Oh how naive the people can be.

        The worst is yet to come.
        No, I want to remain blissfully naive for just a few more days. Just let me believe that all is good and true for a little while longer. I'm enjoying this for the time-being.
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  • Profile picture of the author Ansar Pasha
    Banned
    I am liking the "changes" that supposedly Clickbank is coming up with... but like David mentioned, logistically it's just not possible for a company that handles as many products as them to realistically check factual inaccuracies in every single product that gets launched.

    I highly doubt this is going to stop the scammers and hack gurus, but if it gets a few people shut down for ripping people off then it's fine by me. Any measure to reduce it will help.

    ... I just wish more sellers would put half as much effort into creating something actually worthwhile. Probably a pipe dream though

    Ansar
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  • Profile picture of the author Chris Q
    Banned
    Way to go CB! With this brand new policy, there will be no more fraud "gurus" selling on CB!

    I hope next update will be a Paypal option! Yeah!!!
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  • Profile picture of the author davidtong
    What it may do, however, is slow down or at least subconsciously make many publishers make better products, that should be a good enough outcome with this new guideline.
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    • Profile picture of the author Jill Carpenter
      Originally Posted by WillR View Post

      But nothing is stopping the person who has his page checked and then goes and puts all the prohibited stuff back on it AFTER Clickbank have checked it. There are far too many products for them to be checking up on sales pages every few months so it's impossible for them to enforce a policy like this.
      Not if surprise visits occur.

      This is how a lot of jobs test for drugs. They don't tell you that they are coming. But you sign something when you get the job that you are open to this infrequent surprise drug testing and by not agreeing to be tested you can be immediately fired.

      Same could apply here - termination of offer and all accounts on CB.

      One full time employee to monitor this stuff is all that would be needed. It's not that hard to go to read 50 different sales pages a day. LOL, I think I do that already sometimes.:p

      The cost for this additional employee can be added to the fee you pay to get your stuff listed on clickbank.
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      • Profile picture of the author Chris Sorrell
        Damn those do-gooders. You mean to say I can't have a headline like this? -

        'One legged russian spy steals one click software off brazilian show girl while in the amazon rainforest and banks $43,109,443.76 in 4 days with no work'

        'Act now, because even though I have 50,000 of my best affiliate buddies spamming people as we speak, I am only selling 6 copies! Quick, before I change my mind!'

        There goes my 7 figure launch.
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        • Profile picture of the author Gaz Cooper
          Originally Posted by Chris Sorrell View Post

          Damn those do-gooders. You mean to say I can't have a headline like this? -

          'One legged russian spy steals one click software off brazilian show girl while in the amazon rainforest and banks $43,109,443.76 in 4 days with no work'

          'Act now, because even though I have 50,000 of my best affiliate buddies spamming people as we speak, I am only selling 6 copies! Quick, before I change my mind!'

          There goes my 7 figure launch.
          WHAAAAT 4 whole days Im looking for something in the overnight timeline, 4 days is like forever :p

          Gaz
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        • Profile picture of the author MarQueteer
          Originally Posted by Chris Sorrell View Post

          There goes my 7 figure launch
          Well planned, but wait, before you launch you need a decent JV page offering a Porsche and others cars (and forget to mention that it's just a 1 day rental)
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      • Profile picture of the author CMartin
        Originally Posted by Jill Carpenter View Post

        Originally Posted by WillR View Post

        But nothing is stopping the person who has his page checked and then goes and puts all the prohibited stuff back on it AFTER Clickbank have checked it. There are far too many products for them to be checking up on sales pages every few months so it's impossible for them to enforce a policy like this.
        Not if surprise visits occur.

        [...]
        Same could apply here - termination of offer and all accounts on CB.

        One full time employee to monitor this stuff is all that would be needed. It's not that hard to go to read 50 different sales pages a day. LOL, I think I do that already sometimes.:p

        The cost for this additional employee can be added to the fee you pay to get your stuff listed on clickbank.
        No need to increase fees to pay the additional employee(s). They would just have to close the accounts and keep the money.

        And to turn this process even faster, they could $motivate$ employees for each site they found and was terminated.

        Now the question is: does ClickBank *really* want to "clean" the house?

        ...

        I'm still waiting for a feature request since 2003: have the option to allow vendors to control who promotes their products, in other words, allow vendors to approve and/or deny affiliates. This is something that would stop commission theft and people from buying products at a discounted price - I wonder why CB never implemented this *option* in the last 8 years for all vendors $$

        Carlos
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        • Profile picture of the author Terry Crim
          Originally Posted by CMartin View Post

          ....

          I'm still waiting for a feature request since 2003: have the option to allow vendors to control who promotes their products, in other words, allow vendors to approve and/or deny affiliates. This is something that would stop commission theft and people from buying products at a discounted price - I wonder why CB never implemented this *option* in the last 8 years for all vendors $$

          Carlos

          There are vendors that have this setup, Kelly Felix and Mike Long have this setup for their "Bring The Fresh" membership. Have you contacted CB directly to see if you can have this setup for your account as well?

          I would think if enough people requested this it would be implemented for everyone if it hasn't already, they have done the coding for the backend to make this possible.


          - T
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          • Profile picture of the author KellyFelix
            Originally Posted by Chris Kent View Post

            How does this work? I thought there was no way to deny someone if you know their Clickbank ID.

            For those guys, one can just use this link:
            Affiliate Program: Promote Products for 'BRINGFRESH'
            You can ask to have a whitelisted-only affiliate program with Clickbank, which is what we did for the first year. It allows you to pick and choose affiliates manually. We are now open to everyone, but we can still remove any affiliate that isn't following the rules. We can also adjust payouts for specific groups of affiliates. Lastly, you may not know that you can also request to not be in the marketplace if you'd like.

            On the subject of Clickbank's new policies, I couldn't be happier. It will level the playing field for those of us who play by the rules and don't have 80% refund rates, 3 click millionaire software, fake screenshots, etc etc. We asked them for this about a year ago, and they obviously are listening to their vendors. I'm a 10 yr Clickbank affiliate/vendor, and this is a big move in the right direction. Next, I'm hoping they will also start enforcing blacklists on serial refunders and product thieves, and continue to clean things up on both sides of the coin.
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            • Profile picture of the author WillR
              Originally Posted by KellyFelix View Post

              We asked them for this about a year ago, and they obviously are listening to their vendors.
              Sorry, but I don't buy it. I think the regulatory bodies such as the FTC have had a lot more to do with these recent changes than any vendor requests. These new guidelines they have put in place will hit their bottom dollar big time - they know that. They wouldn't have done it unless someone was heavily breathing down their neck. Fact.
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              • Profile picture of the author Justin W
                So wait a minute...

                "Also, affiliates cannot pose as neutral third parties evaluating two products so they make a commission on selling one of them."


                Does this mean all review sites are now against their policies? That's a huge change that a lot of people seem to have overlooked. Or maybe I'm just reading it wrong...
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                • Profile picture of the author angelx
                  Originally Posted by Justin W View Post

                  So wait a minute...

                  "Also, affiliates cannot pose as neutral third parties evaluating two products so they make a commission on selling one of them."


                  Does this mean all review sites are now against their policies? That's a huge change that a lot of people seem to have overlooked. Or maybe I'm just reading it wrong...

                  I read this part too. Everyone seems to be talking about vendors only though. I read this statement as Clickbank are banning all review sites? How are people actually supposed to promote Clickbank products if not through websites? We have had to change our websites and add a disclaimer of earning a commission to comply with FTC guidelines since 2009, isn't that sufficient? I don't get it. This is a big change for affiliates, that they throw into the vendor rules section in one line. I don't get it?
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                • Profile picture of the author bretski
                  Originally Posted by Justin W View Post

                  So wait a minute...

                  "Also, affiliates cannot pose as neutral third parties evaluating two products so they make a commission on selling one of them."


                  Does this mean all review sites are now against their policies? That's a huge change that a lot of people seem to have overlooked. Or maybe I'm just reading it wrong...
                  I have to agree, Justin. I would like to know CB's stand on this. Even with totally non-hypey copy, a review site would be in violation of the new TOS... and if you gently nudged a reader in one direction or the other based upon any knowledge that you might have, such as actually reviewing the product?
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                  • Profile picture of the author Antonios


                    I understand that CB will be losing a lot of money with these new rules.

                    As another member mentioned: they are not interested in the clients wellbeing they are doing because of Big Brother's rules and menace of enforcement.

                    The affiliate review rule is apparently unrealistic, if the review is "honest".

                    Watchdogs could be the buyers of the "hyped" products: reporting them to a special CB support or scam desk. Of course, this can be abused by the competition.

                    I once saw a very probable scam offer through Plimus. I inquired about they checking their legimitacy of advertisers, they said that they don't check them unless there are sufficient complaints from buyers.

                    Lately, I have seen some "magic" offers going through other payment processors.

                    Another alternative is to use a payment processor outside the regulatory countries, specially outside the USA.

                    Asia and Africa could be good options.

                    Several HYIP use them.

                    At first I had confidence on "WSO's" since they were offered through the WF site, but I guess it seems to be the same CB hyped products.

                    Dishonesty is making things very difficult for honest IM.

                    There are so many rules to follow that, specially, newbies will very easily get into trouble without even knowing it.

                    And apparently, there are no options except to adapt and adopt.

                    It is like when e-bay changes rules, google, etc.

                    Sincerely,

                    Antonios



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                    • Profile picture of the author Antonios


                      Now all of us that have e-mail series in our autoresponders (AR) will have to review them, too!

                      IM marketers that have dozens of AR series setup have a great task at hand.

                      I constantly receive daily emails that are over hyped.

                      I guess that these messages are FTC regulated, too.

                      Do we as affiliates have to be in compliance with the FTC rules, too?

                      Our sites will have to be closedly reviewed and checked for non-compliance.

                      The future is changing...

                      Sincerely,

                      Antonios


                      :confused::confused::confused::confused:
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  • Profile picture of the author Tim Franklin
    Sounds like CYA, the new FTC guides are very serious about this kind of stuff and the IM world had better take notice because at least in the US they are coming after people that are engaging in what they call deceptive advertising, that could be just about anything that you cant back up.

    Over all I think it is a good thing, Internet Marketing has been the Wild Wild west for a long time now and people are just getting tired of all the scams, deceptive titles, so if you claim to make 87,000.00 in your spare time in ten min or less per day, you better be able to prove it,
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  • Profile picture of the author CyberSorcerer
    If I was Clickbank, I would MD5 these sales pages once I approved them and if they changed the approval process would have to start all over again. I know there's issues with this but just saying, it's a start.

    Because people will be changing these pages after they have been approved, that's for sure.
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    • Profile picture of the author Kay Zee
      Originally Posted by CyberSorcerer View Post

      If I was Clickbank, I would MD5 these sales pages once I approved them and if they changed the approval process would have to start all over again. I know there's issues with this but just saying, it's a start.

      Because people will be changing these pages after they have been approved, that's for sure.
      Problem is a lot of marketers will want to split test their copy so it could very well be changing on a hourly basis.

      Also, one could just use an image instead of text for the sales copy
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      • Profile picture of the author CyberSorcerer
        Originally Posted by Kay Zee View Post

        Problem is a lot of marketers will want to split test their copy so it could very well be changing on a hourly basis.

        Also, one could just use an image instead of text for the sales copy
        This is true, but still anytime it's been changed CB would need to at lease check it to make sure it conforms to their TOS.

        Otherwise it would be a good flaw in there system to just submit a page that conforms to their TOS, then after approval just change it.
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  • Profile picture of the author Nathy Curiel
    Good ! I hate most CB products, full of ****. Never bought something really usefull ..
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  • Profile picture of the author Steve.S.
    I don't have fake testimonials on my websites, not even one, but this scares me, and I quote:

    "testimonials containing actual customer telling their actual story (does not require a disclaimer, but vendor must have signed documentation from the customer on hand in the event a regulatory agency would want proof that the story is a customer’s actual experience".

    What kind of customer would wanna do that (unless they get something back in return)?

    Basically, it comes down to throwing away all genuine testimonials (unless you have the story on a piece of paper signed by that customer).

    I am quite shocked as this will have a deep impact on all my sites.
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    • Profile picture of the author kellyburdes
      That's something the FTC already "requires" if they decide that they have an issue with you anyway. It's nothing new as far as compliance with regulators go.

      Originally Posted by Steve.S. View Post

      I don't have fake testimonials on my websites, not even one, but this scares me, and I quote:

      "testimonials containing actual customer telling their actual story (does not require a disclaimer, but vendor must have signed documentation from the customer on hand in the event a regulatory agency would want proof that the story is a customer's actual experience".

      What kind of customer would wanna do that (unless they get something back in return)?

      Basically, it comes down to throwing away all genuine testimonials (unless you have the story on a piece of paper signed by that customer).

      I am quite shocked as this will have a deep impact on all my sites.
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  • Profile picture of the author kellyburdes
    It's not only the FTC you have to worry about, depending upon the industry you are active in there can be various state and federal agencies you are accountable too.

    While I personally don't know anyone who's had FTC trouble (and thankfully I've never had any with anyone), I do know people who have had to deal with NFA, FDA and State Agencies.

    The stories all of them tell are enough to make you consider homelessness so that if they come after you they don't have a door to knock on and ruin your life.

    A lot of the IM sellers doing the hired actor made up story stuff are not in the United States at all, and go to great lengths to hide the actual ownership and control of their companies in the legal sense.

    Anyway, it will be interesting to see how this all shakes out. As many have pointed out though, don't assume this is some sort of benevolence on the part of Clickbank.

    And don't just blindly assume this means things will get better.

    But most importantly, if your an affiliate or vendor, especially one in the United States, I think this should put you on notice that the Feds are probably about to get serious.

    Don't be F'n around. No matter how much money you make, they can and will take it all, and sometimes more. It's just not worth it if ya ask me. (and I know you didn't ask me, but sometimes I like to feel important, and today I need too..so please don't call me on it )
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  • Profile picture of the author Scott Skinner
    I like the update. As usual, if you have built and promote products/websites that speak truth and deliver quality, you will benefit. And as usual, if you do not, you are scrambling, trying to figure out how to salvage all your hard work.

    Lesson learned once again. Build slow, build solid. When the changes come, they will PROPEL you, not crush you....
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    • Profile picture of the author LegitIncomes
      Originally Posted by Scott Skinner View Post

      Build slow, build solid. When the changes come, they will PROPEL you, not crush you....
      I like that.
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      • Profile picture of the author Alminc
        Just one more healthy reason to build your own network of websites,
        your own traffic and your own lists. Why depend on CB or anybody
        else when you don't have to?
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        No links :)
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    • Profile picture of the author Ansar Pasha
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Scott Skinner View Post



      Lesson learned once again. Build slow, build solid. When the changes come, they will PROPEL you, not crush you....
      Are we still talking about IM, Mr Skinner

      Ansar
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  • Profile picture of the author jrodriguez315
    This is important news. Thanks so much for staying on top of this!
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    • Profile picture of the author Chris Sorrell
      On September 1st all the sales pages that contravene most of these 'strict' new rules will still be up there.

      Not just IM stuff but a ton of health & weight loss stuff too. We'll see.
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      • Profile picture of the author Caleb Spilchen
        Originally Posted by Chris Sorrell View Post

        On September 1st all the sales pages that contravene most of these 'strict' new rules will still be up there.

        Not just IM stuff but a ton of health & weight loss stuff too. We'll see.
        Very interesting point there, people in the Weight Loss niche need to read these rules.

        How many weight loss sales pages make HUGE promises, and have beautiful false stories? None? I doubt it.

        Caleb
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        • Profile picture of the author celente
          Originally Posted by Caleb Spilchen View Post

          Very interesting point there, people in the Weight Loss niche need to read these rules.

          How many weight loss sales pages make HUGE promises, and have beautiful false stories? None? I doubt it.

          Caleb
          Yes you are right, but it aint just the weightloss niche.

          The IM niche and Forex niche.... those are incredible.

          There sales copy goes like this.

          =========
          Lots of B.S.

          followed by some more B.S.

          Then some BIG TIME B.S.

          sprinkled with some good ole B.S.

          Then topped off with the biggest B.S.

          insert a bit of quick B.S. here.

          ==========

          You know what I mean I guess. But clickbank understands its has the monopoly. So this is a move in the right direction.
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          • Profile picture of the author Caleb Spilchen
            Originally Posted by celente View Post

            Yes you are right, but it aint just the weightloss niche.

            The IM niche and Forex niche.... those are incredible.

            There sales copy goes like this.

            =========
            Lots of B.S.

            followed by some more B.S.

            Then some BIG TIME B.S.

            sprinkled with some good ole B.S.

            Then topped off with the biggest B.S.

            insert a bit of quick B.S. here.

            ==========

            You know what I mean I guess. But clickbank understands its has the monopoly. So this is a move in the right direction.
            Dude,

            You should sell that as a product, perfect sales page layout.

            Caleb
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            Caleb Spilchen

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  • Profile picture of the author barache
    The IM category of Clickbank may suffer from these new rules, but the rest of CLKBNK products should be fine. It's the IM sector that has all the phony stories and fake statistics.
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    • Profile picture of the author MarQueteer
      Originally Posted by barache View Post

      It's the IM sector that has all the phony stories and fake statistics.
      Yep, but the health sector with all those "holistic cancer cures" or "heal parkinson" stuff is even worse, at least from the ethical viewpoint.
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  • Profile picture of the author ChadOath
    What they really need to focus in on are the fake "personal coaching" bonuses that vendors claim to include, but don't provide.

    In fact, in that last big wave of IM sites that was shut down by the government, that was listed as one of the biggest offenses of most of the operations.
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  • Profile picture of the author ProfessorSeo
    Banned
    Awesome info I'm they finally fixed that I got tired of buying useless crap especially that crappy "push button" software that never works lol
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  • Profile picture of the author Zesh
    Fantastic news No more B.S Radars!
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  • Profile picture of the author ContentMachine
    It's about time!!! It took them long enough!
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  • Profile picture of the author RichiiCapone
    Well this comes as a refreshing change!

    CB is a great network, however I don't know about anyone else, but I find it a bit difficult to promote something so passionately when my brain is telling me that the visitors to my site are going to be disappointed with the results of the CB product.

    I try to stay away from CB. Too many people use it, and I find that it doesnt convert as well as the various CPA networks that I work with.

    Of course, thats just my opinion, but I am glad that they've decided to make their 'hat a bit whiter' so to speak
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  • Profile picture of the author Halmac
    This is kind of why I stayed away from Clickbank. Especially the MMO products all seem so overhyped and unrealistic. I guess this will begin to limit that now.

    Thanks for your update.
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  • Profile picture of the author CyberSorcerer
    Yes it is true to trust one source of information but come on, I mean we all know that EVERYBODY lies. Don't you watch House? I mean it's common knowledge that Google is truthful with their monthly search volume numbers right?

    It's all about the research, looking into the product creators sales funnel "yes with the right research, and digging, this can be surmised to an extent".

    It's as with anything involving research, you have to keep digging until you can get as close as you can to the truth and even then it's only an educated guess, but an educated guess is better than having no clue at all.
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    • Profile picture of the author WillR
      Originally Posted by LB View Post

      I'm curious where you're getting this data. CB doesn't release it and I don't think a vendor is going to volunteer something so embarrassing.
      As Caleb said, I have heard from affiliates who have promoted some of these big guru product launches on Clickbank. Clearly if they receive commissions in their account for 100 products and then the commission for 40 of those products are taken away from them over the next month or two, they have a pretty good idea of what the average refund rate is for that product. These sorts of figures have happened on more than one occasion and I have heard it through the grapevine from other affiliates also.

      Originally Posted by LB View Post

      There is NO WAY to know what a refund rate is. CB won't keep you around long if you hit 15 and at 10 there is a chance they will get in touch with you.
      The way these launches work... most of the damage is already done after only the first few days to a week. That is when the majority of their money is made. Considering the Clickbank refund policy allows for refunds up to 60 days later there is no way for Clickbank to know what the exact refund rate will be based on the first few days.

      A product may launch and only have a 4% refund rate over the first week but then as it gets closer to the 60 day limit and more and more people get their credit card statements that remind them of the charge, that refund rate can skyrocket up... by then it's too late for Clickbank to do anything.

      Originally Posted by LB View Post

      CB won't keep you around long if you hit 15 and at 10 there is a chance they will get in touch with you.
      Where are you getting YOUR data?
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      • Profile picture of the author LB
        Originally Posted by WillR View Post


        Where are you getting YOUR data?
        Talking to Clickbank directly.

        My entire response was in answer to your post where you asked:

        Did you know there are some Clickbank products that have refund rates over 40%... and they are still allowed to run! How ridiculous is that?! Get rid of these stupid products.
        I can assure you that Clickbank won't tolerate refund rates like that. But, I agree with you- vendors get away with this because it's "pump and dump" where the damage is done in days and the refunds roll through over the next month. This is why Clickbank kicked a bunch of these offers off. They then (at least many of them) ended up on Plimus who also very quickly removed them as well.

        What's sad is that anyone with an affiliate network strong enough to make so many sales could have easily launched a legitimate product.

        These are also the same idiots that close support tickets for refund requests without refunding.
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  • Profile picture of the author weblink29
    I also see this as good news but the reason they finally decided to make the move is what leaves a bad taste in my mouth. All major companies are starting to protect themselves from future FCC involvement in their business.

    Big brother is starting to regulate the internet. I wonder what the internet will look like in another 10 year.
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    Nothing to see here folks.....move along.

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  • Profile picture of the author Caleb Spilchen
    In all fairness, the 80% Refund product, was banned from clickbank, shortly thereafter.

    Caleb
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    Caleb Spilchen

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  • Profile picture of the author dagaul101
    Nice for Clickbank to be a little stringent on the porkies, but then again how are they to verify any of this?
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  • Profile picture of the author travisl
    Thank god! Now finally maybe some honest people will be able to shine through
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  • Profile picture of the author Apollo-Articles
    Seems fair enough to me, surely it will result in less returns?

    Sam
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  • Profile picture of the author StevenJones
    Smart move, but a bit too late. A lot of people were already struck by these deceptors over last ~10 years? Anyway, onwards to a brighter tomorrow!
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  • Profile picture of the author billsull
    It's amazing they got away with so much false advertising in the past, I'm brand new to internet marketing and clickbank and I'm having a hard time finding something thats not all lies.
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  • Profile picture of the author herbalhound
    Well, My product is not in the IM, MMO, Forex, Weightloss or any other scammy area. It is totally legit my story my everything. I am getting the run around with Clickbank trying to get approved and it has been very frusterating. Exspecially because I do see so many fruadulent products already listed and here I sit with an honest one that I can't get thru. I don't know what to think about clickbank. I know that the approval process right now seems to be very hard to get thru. So I think they are just cracking down by giving the new people hell. I wish I had waited to request approval for my product. I am considering going to another service all together.
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    • Profile picture of the author weblink29
      Originally Posted by herbalhound View Post

      Well, My product is not in the IM, MMO, Forex, Weightloss or any other scammy area. It is totally legit my story my everything. I am getting the run around with Clickbank trying to get approved and it has been very frusterating. Exspecially because I do see so many fruadulent products already listed and here I sit with an honest one that I can't get thru. I don't know what to think about clickbank. I know that the approval process right now seems to be very hard to get thru. So I think they are just cracking down by giving the new people hell. I wish I had waited to request approval for my product. I am considering going to another service all together.
      I see the health field getting slapped hard with these new policies. There are many herbal products that are not fda approved yet people buy them because they believe they work. There are many products that can't prove that they work.

      For example: I make my salad dressing from Apple Cider Vinegar. I believe there are tons of benefits for using it. Yet there are people who claim it has no benefits to the body and the fda sure isn't approving it for health benefits. It is sold in health food stores though because there are many people who believe in the benefits of ingesting it.

      I would assume that promoting any health product or course that can't PROVE it has health benefits won't get accepted. There are many products for sale at local pharmacies and health stores that can't prove the health benefits that people purchase them for.

      Things are going to get tricky in the health field from this point forward...
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      Nothing to see here folks.....move along.

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    • Profile picture of the author Letitia
      If you are marketing an herbal product or info on herbs for health reasons you have several USA govt reg agencies to comply with: the FDA, local law re practicing medicine or nursing without a license (naturopathy is licensed).
      If you purchase an herbal product in a store they have multiple disclaimers on them because of FDA rules and regs.
      Read your wording carefully.
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  • Profile picture of the author zigato
    I think it's great... no more con artists, just relying on pure IM talent.
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  • Profile picture of the author xxxJamesxxx
    This is great and all but it still can be easily cheated just like their income policy.

    The scammers will just get their page approved then change it... Just like they have been doing with their proof of income claims.

    James
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  • Profile picture of the author sloanjim
    Like everything if you try and and get found out expect consequences...
    caffeinated part of my grey matter is thinking "how in the heck are they going to enforce this?".
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  • Profile picture of the author grover69
    After seeing some of the (admittedly) well-filmed huckster videos in the past month, I am excited to see CB cleaning up their act a bit. For some niches, such as the seduction or dating niche, I have no idea how they are going to get someone to backup claims such as sleeping with 3 girls in the same night, but it should be fun to watch!
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  • Profile picture of the author mr.gaurabborah
    Right now, I am promoting few products who doesn't comply with the new rules and they are doing well. What will those products be deleted if not corrected? I am pretty concerned right now as I don't many sites.
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    • Profile picture of the author Onora Oz
      Originally Posted by mr.gaurabborah View Post

      Right now, I am promoting few products who doesn't comply with the new rules and they are doing well. What will those products be deleted if not corrected? I am pretty concerned right now as I don't many sites.
      This is what Clickbank says on what would happen to them:

      "All new products are immediately subject to these guidelines, and existing promotional materials such as Pitch Pages and affiliate sites must be brought into compliance by August 31, 2011 or may be subject to penalties including account termination."
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  • Profile picture of the author Talinn
    Are we gonna have something similar in the WSO section?

    just askin'....
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  • Profile picture of the author imdomination
    What will be interesting is if the FTC goes after the ones that will inevitably scam the system and continue doing what they have been.

    That would be a very interesting smackdown for sure.
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  • It's nice to see Clickbank finally doing this.

    You say CB is listening, well... Anyone from CB... look for me in NY. My team of writers and I will be in NYC later in the month. Let's talk. I'll even buy you lunch.

    I'd like to discuss stories in marketing, and maybe putting together a 10 commandments of storytelling on CB. Rules to keep it legal and ethical. I know real writers look forward to the days when we don't have to compete with the bullsh--.

    Plus I'd love to talk even more ways we can take out the trash.

    So... CB honchos... my name is Vin Montello. Ask around you'll easily find me.
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  • Profile picture of the author glinda2011
    That's good. I hope it will be fixed soon.
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  • Profile picture of the author Akogo
    Will some WSOs become a target? Some WSOs become Clickbank products and some Clickbank products are offered as WSO at reduce prices.
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  • Profile picture of the author Lucas Adamski
    Wow, I think most IM product vendors are in trouble, especially the best selling ones

    I think that's a great move for Clickbank going into integrity marketing. Will be interesting to see how it's going to change conversion rates.
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  • Profile picture of the author roley
    GOOD! about time the B.S stopped, so much hyped nonsense being sold 80% of it in clickbank is just dribble, little kids pretending to be millionaires
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  • Profile picture of the author Cash37
    A step in the right direction but too late. There are already work arounds for everything that's addressed.
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    • Profile picture of the author MarQueteer
      Originally Posted by Cash37 View Post

      A step in the right direction but too late. There are already work arounds for everything that's addressed.
      They heard the impacts coming closer and decided to head for the safe bunker. Everyone is invited in, but if you decide to stay outside, things could get ugly.
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  • Profile picture of the author Kai Pei
    It's a shame... really...

    I was just about to launch my new IM product aptly titled: How to rent a Rolls Royce Phantom for pennies to show off in your next product launch...

    Oh well...
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  • Profile picture of the author james1986
    As they will update by Twitter , so are we eligible to get the information in Forum as well?
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  • Profile picture of the author JustFelix
    I'm very happy with the new changes. It just feels nice.

    The thing that annoys me the most is always the fake testimonials. Instead of earning it they have to use fake one's. Will they wipe out pages for using fake testimonials as well?
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    • Profile picture of the author Antonios
      :confused::confused::confused::confused:

      clickBank gave until August 31 for their merchants to fix things.

      It is August 3, and I have visited some of the offers with overhyped offers and they have been kept the same.

      No fixes!

      Probably, we will continue with the same "fake everything" offers.

      Sincerely,

      Antonios

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      • Profile picture of the author Antonios
        I mean September 3.
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  • Profile picture of the author ChadOath
    I've seen some of the bigboys change their page. I've seen some their pages remain unchanged. I don't think the rules are being strictly enforced. Clickbank will probably only take action on a per-complaint basis.
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    • Profile picture of the author Antonios
      Originally Posted by ChadOath View Post

      I've seen some of the bigboys change their page. I've seen some their pages remain unchanged. I don't think the rules are being strictly enforced. Clickbank will probably only take action on a per-complaint basis.


      We will have to report non-compliance merchants to get rid of these online pests.

      Antonios
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  • Profile picture of the author NerdGary
    It was really getting out of hand on CB... "Make a billion dollars a day with one click on autopilot" lol

    Who really believes this crap anyway?

    My only fear is that alot of those old players influence some WSO's today.
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