Email Marketing - It's Time to Have a Talk

38 replies
I often read forum posts from people complaining about getting slammed by email offer after email offer for the latest shiny object product. One particular post stated how he was flat broke from all of the how to money products that he was buying. Does anybody else see the irony there?

We are all adults here, so it's time we start acting like it. This goes for the list owners and subscribers. I have some advice for both.

My advice to list owners:

For every action there is always a reaction. As a marketer, you want that reaction to be a positive one, so you need to think about what would cause a negative reaction and do the opposite when mailing.

Some people think that less is more, but that is not always the case. Some marketers provide great value in daily emails, even if those daily emails are offers. Ya, that's right, I said that it is ok to mail an offer everyday.... but you need to make sure that your offer has value.

One of the biggest mistakes that marketers make with their offers is to seek out affiliate deals that pay the highest commissions. This will shrink your list faster than a cold pool shrinks your wee-wee. Instead of looking for high commissions, look for products or services that you know will help your list subscribers. Provide reasons why you think that this offer will help them and let them know exactly who will benefit from the offer (and who will not).

If you stick to this method, then commission rates won't be your first concern anymore. Your sales (and income) will increase because you have taken the time to find products that really will make a difference to your subscribers.

My advice to subscribers:

Remove yourself from lists where the marketer claims that you absolutely "need" this product to succeed. There is no single product that could fall into that category.

Remove yourself from lists that promote big product launches (CB usually). Those marketers don't give a rats arse about whether or not the product is good for you. They just want to win an affiliate contest.

If you find yourself buying every product that is recommended to you, then you have a problem. Only buy products that will help you accomplish the things that you are trying to accomplish. If you are building a review blog, don't get sidetracked by an offer for a whiz bang offline marketing method. Remind yourself that you are not the only person on this marketer's list and not every product is meant for you.

I could go on and on with advice for both sides of the fence, but it's late and I have three weeks of True Blood episodes to catch up on. I'll leave it to the peanut gallery to either flame the hell out of me for this post or add their own suggestions. Either way, I don't care. Sookie is supposed to be naked in the last episode and that is much more important to me.

Have a great night. Don't let the vampires bite.
#email #marketing #talk
  • Profile picture of the author J Bold
    Couldn't have said it better myself, though I truly wanted to do so.

    So you're a True Blood fan, huh? I don't even know what that show is, ha ha, only seen people mention it. I presume it's about vampires, but not the Twilight kind I hope, ha ha...
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4586096].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author happyday
    Email marketing's sure a nice way of reaching deep down to prospective buyers.
    I try to get the whole import of mails by checking the subject.If the headline fails to 'woo' me,I don't see why I should be opening such.
    But hey!I've got to beware of scams.I've actually got some offers while checking them out in my mail.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4586115].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author ZachWaldman
    I have an autoresponder series set up that gives nothing but content every 2-3 days. Yet, I had someone unsubscribe today and the reason he gave was, "Too many emails."

    You can't please everybody. I've also had people sign up, get the free gift, and unsubscribe right after.

    I think the bottom line is that you have to really want to help people to be successful in the long run.

    It may seem like simplistic advice, but it's not only good for your bottom line, it's also good for your sanity.

    As long as you KNOW you are giving excellent value, are being honest, and truly want to help people, you won't feel bad when people opt-out. You'll think to yourself, "Okay, maybe it wasn't for him, or she's on too many lists and wants to cut down on the email in the inbox."

    Whatever the reason, you won't take it personally, because you did your best.

    On the other hand, using sneaky subject lines like, "You've earned $1,382.23, click here to receive your commission," will only lead to tarnishing your reputation when people find nothing in the message except an affiliate link."
    Signature
    Zach Waldman - Los Angeles Magician
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4586169].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author E. Brian Rose
      Originally Posted by ZachWaldman View Post

      I have an autoresponder series set up that gives nothing but content every 2-3 days. Yet, I had someone unsubscribe today and the reason he gave was, "Too many emails."

      You can't please everybody. I've also had people sign up, get the free gift, and unsubscribe right after.

      I think the bottom line is that you have to really want to help people to be successful in the long run.

      It may seem like simplistic advice, but it's not only good for your bottom line, it's also good for your sanity.

      As long as you KNOW you are giving excellent value, are being honest, and truly want to help people, you won't feel bad when people opt-out. You'll think to yourself, "Okay, maybe it wasn't for him, or she's on too many lists and wants to cut down on the email in the inbox."

      Whatever the reason, you won't take it personally, because you did your best.

      On the other hand, using sneaky subject lines like, "You've earned $1,382.23, click here to receive your commission," will only lead to tarnishing your reputation when people find nothing in the message except an affiliate link."

      I absolutely agree. I have some folks that I am training and they get very depressed when they see an unsubscribe. My advice was to turn off the notifications. Why let that get you down every time somebody leaves your list? I tell them to keep doing what they believe in and they will make a lot of people happy, not everybody, but a lot.
      Signature
      My New Video Series is Free (for now)
      Crazy good marketing tips from the founder of JVZoo.
      Get EBR 365 Now!
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4589273].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author tpw
        Originally Posted by E. Brian Rose View Post

        I absolutely agree. I have some folks that I am training and they get very depressed when they see an unsubscribe. My advice was to turn off the notifications. Why let that get you down every time somebody leaves your list? I tell them to keep doing what they believe in and they will make a lot of people happy, not everybody, but a lot.

        I bounce with joy when I see the unsubscribe message.

        I rejoice, because I know that person wasn't interested in reading what I sent to them, and I know that I won't be paying for the ability to mail this person who is not listening to me.
        Signature
        Bill Platt, Oklahoma USA, PlattPublishing.com
        Publish Coloring Books for Profit (WSOTD 7-30-2015)
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4590725].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author HeySal
          Originally Posted by tpw View Post

          I bounce with joy when I see the unsubscribe message.

          I rejoice, because I know that person wasn't interested in reading what I sent to them, and I know that I won't be paying for the ability to mail this person who is not listening to me.
          From the "At least I know someone's reading" theory?
          Signature

          Sal
          When the Roads and Paths end, learn to guide yourself through the wilderness
          Beyond the Path

          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4591451].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author E. Brian Rose
          Originally Posted by tpw View Post

          I bounce with joy when I see the unsubscribe message.

          I rejoice, because I know that person wasn't interested in reading what I sent to them, and I know that I won't be paying for the ability to mail this person who is not listening to me.
          LOL I understand where you are coming from, but I don't think that I bounce with joy. I save my bouncing for things that really excite me.
          Signature
          My New Video Series is Free (for now)
          Crazy good marketing tips from the founder of JVZoo.
          Get EBR 365 Now!
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4595487].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author PatriciaS
      Originally Posted by ZachWaldman View Post

      On the other hand, using sneaky subject lines like, "You've earned $1,382.23, click here to receive your commission," will only lead to tarnishing your reputation when people find nothing in the message except an affiliate link."
      I unsubscribe IMMEDIATELY to those types of manipulative subject lines. I don't even think twice about it any more -- no matter who they are.

      I got one a little bit ago from a man whose webinar I attended a few days ago on story-telling to overcome resistance from buyers. It was brilliant, and helpful (but the training he was pitching was about $1k, IIRC) -- anyway, today's email said: "Your son will die by morning." It was one of his lengthy stories in the email, and the subject line fit it, but I'm trying to run a business here. There's no freakin' way I have time for lengthy prose flights of fancy and absolutely NO WAY I'll let that kind of trash of a subject line in my inbox. I was -- and still am -- outraged. I left a comment on the unsubscribe form that there was no way I'd support anyone who had such poor judgment.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4609762].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author E. Brian Rose
        Originally Posted by chi-whiz View Post


        today's email said: "Your son will die by morning."
        Stephen King's book publishing company was served with a class action suit for a text message that was sent out to tens of thousands. The message was promoting King's book "The Cell" and said something to the effect of "This may be the last text message you ever receive".

        The suit asked for $90 million, but was recently settled for $10 million. If you got one of these text messages, then you are actually entitled to $175. Google it.
        Signature
        My New Video Series is Free (for now)
        Crazy good marketing tips from the founder of JVZoo.
        Get EBR 365 Now!
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4609796].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author merk
    I'd like to receive more emails where the subject line isn't some type of lie or deception. For example I had an email today from a well-known marketer with the subject line of "I quit" (and he wasn't of course).

    I'm sure the experts would say otherwise, but I think list owners might have more success with their lists if they actually had subject lines that said what the email was about. Maybe then I wouldn't get so many emails titled "FINAL CHANCE!" or "Test" or "Wassup!". Just tell me what your email is actually about and I'll be happy to open it (and respect you for not playing games).

    Merk
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4587228].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author royljestr
      Originally Posted by merk View Post

      I'd like to receive more emails where the subject line isn't some type of lie or deception. For example I had an email today from a well-known marketer with the subject line of "I quit" (and he wasn't of course).

      I'm sure the experts would say otherwise, but I think list owners might have more success with their lists if they actually had subject lines that said what the email was about. Maybe then I wouldn't get so many emails titled "FINAL CHANCE!" or "Test" or "Wassup!". Just tell me what your email is actually about and I'll be happy to open it (and respect you for not playing games).

      Merk

      Or when they put "Payment Received!" in the subject line or something like that. Yeah...I click unsubscribe so fast it would make your head spin!

      It seems like most list owners just want to make a quick buck by bashing out every offer that comes across their screen...and I must admit that I used to do that! But it doesn't really work, it just ticks people off!

      You are WAY better off just offering good solid advice and products. My rule now is to only promote a product that I have personally bought and have found it to work...as a result not to many emails go out any more
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4589381].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Michael Oksa
    Hi EBR,

    I have been on the "you can send a sales message every day, as long as it provides value" soapbox for quite a while now, and have made several posts to that effect.

    All of the things you said have been said many times, by many people, in many threads...

    Now, before you think I'm being a jerk, let me also add that it's a good reminder and your points can't be stressed enough.

    So...may I ever-so-humbly suggest an alternate title for this thread?

    Email Marketing - It's Time to Listen

    Good stuff.

    All the best,
    Michael
    Signature

    "Ich bin en fuego!"
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4589362].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author E. Brian Rose
      Originally Posted by Michael Oksa View Post

      .

      Now, before you think I'm being a jerk...

      Jerk. Kidding. Good reply. You're right about what the title should be!
      Signature
      My New Video Series is Free (for now)
      Crazy good marketing tips from the founder of JVZoo.
      Get EBR 365 Now!
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4589462].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author HeySal
      Email Marketing - Let's Talk, Shall We?
      Originally Posted by Michael Oksa View Post

      Hi EBR,

      So...may I ever-so-humbly suggest an alternate title for this thread?

      Email Marketing - It's Time to Listen

      Good stuff.

      All the best,
      Michael
      "Let's continue hammering this one because you're still not gettin' it" was the one that came to my mind.
      Signature

      Sal
      When the Roads and Paths end, learn to guide yourself through the wilderness
      Beyond the Path

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4589989].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author E. Brian Rose
        Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

        "Let's continue hammering this one because you're still not gettin' it" was the one that came to my mind.
        You can hammer all of the basics to making money and saving money, but most people will never listen.
        Signature
        My New Video Series is Free (for now)
        Crazy good marketing tips from the founder of JVZoo.
        Get EBR 365 Now!
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4590520].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author loveday101
    Interesting. So do you mean soft sell emails every day or hard sell emails
    Signature

    Please do not use affiliate links in signatures

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4589905].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author E. Brian Rose
      Originally Posted by loveday101 View Post

      Interesting. So do you mean soft sell emails every day or hard sell emails
      Hard sells are not for your friends. A hard sell is usually reserved for a prospect that is in front of you for a very short time. That "now or never" technique is not recommended for people that you communicate on a daily basis. I make suggestions and recommendations to my friends.
      Signature
      My New Video Series is Free (for now)
      Crazy good marketing tips from the founder of JVZoo.
      Get EBR 365 Now!
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4589948].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Michael Oksa
      Originally Posted by loveday101 View Post

      Interesting. So do you mean soft sell emails every day or hard sell emails
      As long as you explain why it has value to the subscriber, it doesn't matter which type of "sell" you use.

      Which brings up another (slightly related) topic: People, you don't need to be afraid to sell. IF you believe in a product, and that the product can help people, then it's your DUTY to get that solution to as many people as you can. That means using whatever sales techniques you can.

      However, if you don't believe in the product, or that it won't really help the people on your list, then you have duty to NOT promote it.

      So...if you're having a difficult time selling, take a look at the product itself and see if it's the source of your hesitation.

      All the best,
      Michael
      Signature

      "Ich bin en fuego!"
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4589961].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Colin Meunier
    Its all a strange thing if you ask me, but thats just how it is I figure... I know a few months ago before Feb. I was not mailing my list very much as I was not really doing much. Then when I did mail I only emailed one of three different things for offers.. My list did not give up much for clicks or response at all for the size of list it was. Then when I started emailing my list a lot more and building at the same time..( I actually deleted most of my list and started over. ) I was getting more and more clicks.. My list actually became more responsive the more I emailed it.

    some unsub for too many emails and whatever... now I really do not care who unsubs. as long as I add more.. because as we see people are strange, I just will not take it personal.. haha.
    Signature

    Build Your List With High Quality Funnel Clicks
    Solid Testimonials Here: http://firstchoicetraffic.com

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4590582].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author kursat
    Originally Posted by E. Brian Rose View Post

    If you find yourself buying every product that is recommended to you, then you have a problem.
    Probably the best type of advice to everyone who is just starting out with IM. Don't buy everything you see that has a "quick get rich promise".

    After speding tons of money myself on many of the clever ideas some of the marketers send us each day, I know only buy one product a month. I limit myself to a top $50 for each month. This way I have to actually search for something that is outstanding.

    Say that I like some product which costs $200, then all I do is wait around 4 months and normally decide whether to buy it or not after this time.

    Enjoyed your post..thanks
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4590589].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Coby
    Originally Posted by E. Brian Rose View Post

    One of the biggest mistakes that marketers make with their offers is to seek out affiliate deals that pay the highest commissions. This will shrink your list faster than a cold pool shrinks your wee-wee. Instead of looking for high commissions, look for products or services that you know will help your list subscribers. Provide reasons why you think that this offer will help them and let them know exactly who will benefit from the offer (and who will not).
    Yup! You will catch me saying this exact same thing over and over again!

    The most important thing in email marketing is VALUE!

    Provide value and you'll always win! (and so will your subscribers)

    Thanks EBR!

    Cheers,
    Coby
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4590654].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Suze Thomas
    It's true marketers need to believe in the product they're promoting. And they need to convey that belief to the subscribers. Many email marketers just shove one high paying offer after another.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4590791].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author jenbob207
    Definitly agree with this post! You cant just send out these emails without thinking how it is going to affect your subscribers! Thanks so much for posting this!
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4595521].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Flyingpig7
    I would like to add something here if I may building a relationship with your list is even better, than just simply sending an email a day with an affiliate link.

    What I mean by that is I don't want to received emails with just a link in it ...oh yes I've had those just a few rows of links nothing else not even a presell, a few lines implying a relationship.
    Needless to say I quickly unsubscribed. Now I only keep emails that are conversational chatty, emails that don't always have link to their new super; very best bestest friend, selling this 'n' that.
    It goes without saying I don't really want to receive an email every day; I realize that's my personal preference.

    List building obviously works and provides a great income for some marketers.

    Hopefully your students are listening Brian and other marketers .
    Signature

    Have a great day

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4595701].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author E. Brian Rose
      Originally Posted by Flyingpig7 View Post

      I would like to add something here if I may building a relationship with your list is even better, than just simply sending an email a day with an affiliate link.

      What I mean by that is I don't want to received emails with just a link in it ...oh yes I've had those just a few rows of links nothing else not even a presell, a few lines implying a relationship.
      Needless to say I quickly unsubscribed. Now I only keep emails that are conversational chatty, emails that don't always have link to their new super; very best bestest friend, selling this 'n' that.
      It goes without saying I don't really want to receive an email every day; I realize that's my personal preference.

      List building obviously works and provides a great income for some marketers.

      Hopefully your students are listening Brian and other marketers .
      With a good marketer, the relationship goes beyond just being chatty in a mass broadcast email. You have to be willing to respond to your subscribers when they ask for help or clarification. Sure, some subscribers will take advantage of your time, but for the most part people are good. Treat them kind in return and you will see your bank account grow fat.
      Signature
      My New Video Series is Free (for now)
      Crazy good marketing tips from the founder of JVZoo.
      Get EBR 365 Now!
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4604359].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author lotsofsnow
        Originally Posted by E. Brian Rose View Post

        With a good marketer, the relationship goes beyond just being chatty in a mass broadcast email. You have to be willing to respond to your subscribers when they ask for help or clarification. Sure, some subscribers will take advantage of your time, but for the most part people are good. Treat them kind in return and you will see your bank account grow fat.
        This is completely true.

        There are some "marketers" that think marketing is a one-way shouting contest. They throw out "products" and blast out emails but don't take the time to respond.

        HP
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4604414].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author mikemcmillan
    EBR Said...
    <<Sookie is supposed to be naked in the last episode and that is much more important to me.>>

    I hear that !

    Below is an actual email I received from one of my subscribers yesterday. I've redacted a fair portion so it doesn't come across as self-promotional; that's not my intention.



    What I highlighted in yellow really struck a chord with me...

    I look forward to your emails...

    Now that is a culture-jamming thought: people looking forward to your emails! What a concept.

    It can become very easy to work on finding ways to suck the life out of your subscribers (not to mention sucking the life out of their wallets). When we think of our subscriber list only as a cash-generating asset and treat them as nothing more than credit card carrying automatons we forget the most important thing: These are real people. They have hopes, dreams, aspirations and most of all FEELINGS.

    It comes down to the thing about, Do unto others as you would have them do unto you, rather than the belief held by many marketers of...

    Do unto your list before they do unto you! This, of course, meaning you must try to sell them something before they get so fed up with your bull sh*t they (1) unsubscribe, (2) quit opening your emails, or (3) mark your emails as spam.

    Just a thought...
    Signature

    I'll help you create a reputation-building evergreen product in any niche and launch it successfully!
    Check it out here.

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4596139].message }}
  • {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4596181].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author xxxJamesxxx
    Some brilliant advice there.

    It's just a shame that there's some desperate people who need the help the most get seduced by marketers who tell them they need this weeks shiny object to succeed.

    Those kind of marketers just don't get care... Well not about you but the commission.

    James Scholes
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4596747].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author ebusinesstutor
    I actually sent an apology to my list about the products offered in my emails. You can read my apology and pledge here.

    Now I ONLY send these to my list.
    - my articles
    - my candid reviews of products
    - special bonuses offered by my partners that have genuine value

    I wanted to be different from all the other Internet marketers, so I rediscovered my "true voice" online.
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4598804].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author uebomoyi
    I'm currently in a position where I sincerely want to help my subscribers, but they're not opening my emails. I've spent a lot of time creating high quality content (at least in my eyes) and I'm trying to figure out how I can get them to appreciate it. I don't mind taking the time out to help them but perhaps that shiny object syndrome is taking a turn for the worst...
    Signature

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4604548].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Coby
      Originally Posted by uebomoyi View Post

      I'm currently in a position where I sincerely want to help my subscribers, but they're not opening my emails. I've spent a lot of time creating high quality content (at least in my eyes) and I'm trying to figure out how I can get them to appreciate it. I don't mind taking the time out to help them but perhaps that shiny object syndrome is taking a turn for the worst...
      Provide them value and they will LOOK for YOUR emails...

      That's the real secret :p
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4605083].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author E. Brian Rose
        Originally Posted by Coby View Post

        Provide them value and they will LOOK for YOUR emails...

        That's the real secret :p
        Ain't that the truth! And, like Mike said earlier... oh what a feeling when you know that people want to hear from you!
        Signature
        My New Video Series is Free (for now)
        Crazy good marketing tips from the founder of JVZoo.
        Get EBR 365 Now!
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4609594].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author marcuslim
    If you manage to develop a relationship with your list, then you will be in a better position to recommend stuff to them once you've established that trust. There is nothing better than to have a list who is eagerly waiting to receive emails from you. I find this is true of those who are genuine and really do want to help.

    One powerful way to develop this relationship is to actually have your emails tell a continuing story from one email to the next. It's what makes people want to read the next one to know what's next. It's why people watch TV series like Lost, it's why E. Brian Rose is hooked on True Blood...lol
    Signature

    Please read the forum rules.

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4609738].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Mr Money Maker
    I think people need to take a good long look at how money is really made, first no one really will share their gold mine with you or give you the key to their bank vault right?...so why would they inform you how to get rich using their real deal solid secrets....they don't, thye give you info that's out dated for the most part...but it's possible 1 person in 10,000 will sell you a good idea.

    But the truth is when ever I made big money online, it was because I used an idea no-one ever thought of before....and..no matter how silly an idea might sound...if I knew it was a money making winner, and something everyone couldn't live without, plus was a creation of my own that's 100% original, then I was on my way to making big bucks.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4609793].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author E. Brian Rose
      Originally Posted by Mr Money Maker View Post

      I think people need to take a good long look at how money is really made, first no one really will share their gold mine with you or give you the key to their bank vault right?...so why would they inform you how to get rich using their real deal solid secrets....they don't, thye give you info that's out dated for the most part...but it's possible 1 person in 10,000 will sell you a good idea.

      But the truth is when ever I made big money online, it was because I used an idea no-one ever thought of before....and..no matter how silly an idea might sound...if I knew it was a money making winner, and something everyone couldn't live without, plus was a creation of my own that's 100% original, then I was on my way to making big bucks.
      I positively 100% disagree with this post.

      Businesses have different divisions and models for making money. A business may have one division that makes money in a certain way and another division that makes money by selling the techniques that are used in the first division.

      This is a common practice and one that describes my business model.

      There are many Wall Street traders that make fortunes buying and selling stock. They also make fortunes telling others what they will be buying and selling.
      Signature
      My New Video Series is Free (for now)
      Crazy good marketing tips from the founder of JVZoo.
      Get EBR 365 Now!
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[4609808].message }}

Trending Topics