Can internationals use U.S. public domain works for free?

8 replies
Hello,
I have a friend who lives in India and he wants to know if he can use the U.S. public domain work for his website. He wants to use some material related to insurance from the U.S. government website. Can he do that? Would it be legal?

Please advise.
#domain #free #internationals #public #works
  • Profile picture of the author Jesus Perez
    Tough issue. According to Wikipedia, "an item may be public domain in one jurisdiction but not another. For instance, some works of literature are public domain in the United States but not in the European Union and vice versa."

    Public domain - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


    Originally Posted by yourreviewer View Post

    Hello,
    I have a friend who lives in India and he wants to know if he can use the U.S. public domain work for his website. He wants to use some material related to insurance from the U.S. government website. Can he do that? Would it be legal?

    Please advise.
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  • Profile picture of the author Diana Lane
    How about if he outsources the work to an American?!

    Trust me to complicate an already clouded issue
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    • Profile picture of the author yourreviewer
      He is a close buddy of mine and I owe him a favor. It would be great if he can take advantage of some stuff, but again I wanted to make sure he doesn't get into any kind of trouble. Maybe it's one of those things that is hard to find out for sure.
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      • Profile picture of the author Jesus Perez
        Indeed it is. This is a question for the legal pros. From what I've gathered on Wikipedia, I recommend telling him "no".

        Then again, who exactly enforces public domain copyright overseas? I can see Warner Brothers suing him for using Bugs Bunny on an Indian affiliate site. But who will do the suing for Shakespeare? (If Shakespeare is public domain).

        At best, this is a gre(a)y area.

        Originally Posted by yourreviewer View Post

        He is a close buddy of mine and I owe him a favor. It would be great if he can take advantage of some stuff, but again I wanted to make sure he doesn't get into any kind of trouble. Maybe it's one of those things that is hard to find out for sure.
        Signature

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  • Profile picture of the author Thomas
    It's not that hard to find out some basics:

    From the Indian Copyright Office's website (at: www.copyright.gov.in):
    ...

    What is the term of protection of copyright?

    The general rule is that copyright lasts for 60 years. In the case of original literary, dramatic, musical and artistic works the 60-year period is counted from the year following the death of the author. In the case of cinematograph films, sound recordings, photographs, posthumous publications, anonymous and pseudonymous publications, works of government and works of international organisations, the 60-year period is counted from the date of publication.

    ...

    Is copyright of foreign works protected in India?

    Yes. Copyrights of works of the countries mentioned in the International Copyright Order are protected in India, as if such works are Indian works.

    ...

    When I checked the above-mentioned "International Copyright Order", every nation that is party to the Berne Convention and/or the Universal Copyright Convention was listed. That includes the U.S.

    (Incidentally, a more recent international agreement called TRIPS, which nearly all states in the world are now party to, seems to be causing other international copyright agreements like those mentioned above to become less significant. Many believe it is the beginning of the first actual international copyright (as opposed to mutual recognition of domestic law) because, with a few exceptions, it prohibits any benefits to citizens of any particular country which are not also available to citizens of other TRIPS signatories).

    Tommy.
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  • Profile picture of the author howudoin
    Hello,
    I have a friend who lives in India and he wants to know if he can use the U.S. public domain work for his website. He wants to use some material related to insurance from the U.S. government website. Can he do that? Would it be legal?

    Please advise.
    I've been doing research on this for quite some time and I find no problem with using the content that is in public domain in US.

    Let me explain,


    1. First off, one needs to understand the basis of international copyright laws, most notably of which is Berne Convention to which United States became a party in 1989. IN fact the US changed its own Domestic law to get its membership in Berne convention nations. Before 1989, US laws require registration or the inclusion of a copyright notice for copyright to exist but after its becoming a member in Berne convention this was no longer required. (India is a member of berne convention since 1886)

    2. "Under the Convention, copyrights for creative works are automatically in force upon their creation without being asserted or declared. An author need not "register" or "apply for" a copyright in countries adhering to the Convention. As soon as a work is "fixed", that is, written or recorded on some physical medium, its author is automatically entitled to all copyrights in the work and to any derivative works, unless and until the author explicitly disclaims them or until the copyright expires. Foreign authors are given the same rights and privileges to copyrighted material as domestic authors in any country that signed the Convention." (From wikipedia on this page)

    It is clear from here that, If an author writes a book in US then it is automatically copyrighted in India and will remain so until the copyright expires in the parent nation (US in this case). The same book will enjoy copyright in INDIA as if it has been produced and copyrighted in india. However, once the copyright expires in US then it also simultaneously expires in other member states. (Including INDIA).

    Also, if the content on US government site is NEVER copyrighted in the first place then it will hold the same status in any other member state of this convention (Including India). There cannot exist a situation where a content is produced in US, in public domain and is copyrighted in other member countries (Under Berne convention)

    3. Another clause of Berne convention is that its members must grant copyright term for the life of the author+50 years (Minimum). This is satisfied by both India (life of the author+60 years) and US (life of the author+70 years) (From this page on wikipedia). Now, it may seem that a work published in INDIA would enjoy an additional copyright term of 10 years in US but the berne convention leaves this decision (Regarding Extra Copyright duration) on the member state (In this case US). Usually such Extra Copyright durations are NOT granted.

    4. As somebody has said previously
    According to Wikipedia, "an item may be public domain in one jurisdiction but not another. For instance, some works of literature are public domain in the United States but not in the European Union and vice versa."
    This is true, since In EU the copyright term ends for life of author + 70 years (Same as US), however there are cases Where a work enjoys a longer period of protection under national laws. Hence an item may have entered Public domain in US but is still copyrighted in EU.


    Bhupinder
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    • Profile picture of the author yourreviewer
      Originally Posted by howudoin View Post

      I've been doing research on this for quite some time and I find no problem with using the content that is in public domain in US.

      Let me explain,


      1. First off, one needs to understand the basis of international copyright laws, most notably of which is Berne Convention to which United States became a party in 1989. IN fact the US changed its own Domestic law to get its membership in Berne convention nations. Before 1989, US laws require registration or the inclusion of a copyright notice for copyright to exist but after its becoming a member in Berne convention this was no longer required. (India is a member of berne convention since 1886)

      2. "Under the Convention, copyrights for creative works are automatically in force upon their creation without being asserted or declared. An author need not "register" or "apply for" a copyright in countries adhering to the Convention. As soon as a work is "fixed", that is, written or recorded on some physical medium, its author is automatically entitled to all copyrights in the work and to any derivative works, unless and until the author explicitly disclaims them or until the copyright expires. Foreign authors are given the same rights and privileges to copyrighted material as domestic authors in any country that signed the Convention." (From wikipedia on this page)

      It is clear from here that, If an author writes a book in US then it is automatically copyrighted in India and will remain so until the copyright expires in the parent nation (US in this case). The same book will enjoy copyright in INDIA as if it has been produced and copyrighted in india. However, once the copyright expires in US then it also simultaneously expires in other member states. (Including INDIA).

      Also, if the content on US government site is NEVER copyrighted in the first place then it will hold the same status in any other member state of this convention (Including India). There cannot exist a situation where a content is produced in US, in public domain and is copyrighted in other member countries (Under Berne convention)

      3. Another clause of Berne convention is that its members must grant copyright term for the life of the author+50 years (Minimum). This is satisfied by both India (life of the author+60 years) and US (life of the author+70 years) (From this page on wikipedia). Now, it may seem that a work published in INDIA would enjoy an additional copyright term of 10 years in US but the berne convention leaves this decision (Regarding Extra Copyright duration) on the member state (In this case US). Usually such Extra Copyright durations are NOT granted.

      4. As somebody has said previously This is true, since In EU the copyright term ends for life of author + 70 years (Same as US), however there are cases Where a work enjoys a longer period of protection under national laws. Hence an item may have entered Public domain in US but is still copyrighted in EU.


      Bhupinder
      Thank you so much. Much appreciated.

      Dan
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  • Profile picture of the author howudoin
    Thank you so much. Much appreciated.

    Dan
    Ok Dan, I've done enormous digging during the last 24 hours and almost kicked myself in the rear for not referencing the below source earlier.....:rolleyes:

    Written below is an exact quote from the book "The Public Domain" (4th Edition MAY 2008) by (US) Attorney Stephen Fishmen

    ISBN-13: 978-1-4133-0858-7 (pbk.)
    ISBN-10: 1-4133-0858-9 (pbk.)

    This book is virtually regarded as "THE" source when in doubt related to anything in Public domain (Also recommended In that Brilliant PD related WSO by Kneb)

    From chapter 16 titled "The Public Domain Outside the United States" under the Sub Heading "Different Copyright Terms"

    "On the other hand, because of something
    called the rule of the shorter term, works
    that are in the public domain in the United
    States are automatically in the public domain
    in many foreign countries as well, including
    most of Western Europe. Countries that use
    the rule of the shorter term treat works in
    the public domain in the United States as
    in the public domain in their own countries
    as well."


    In short, countries that signed the "rule of the shorter term" give public domain status (In their country) to anything that's in public domain in US. This would also include public domain information on federal sites and books and other literature that have passed into the public domain under US laws.

    And guess what, INDIA has signed this agreement as you can see on this this Wikipedia page here.

    You owe me more that $100 for this info.............

    Jus Kiddin!
    Bhupinder
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