Private Messages Will Not Increase The Quality Of Responses

My apologies.

I was just looking for some real world experience by someone who actually has tried Max Gentleman firsthand.

Didn't mean to upset you...


~Bill

This was in response to one person's PM ? I would've guessed you were getting bombarded with private messages and just snapped.

Someone has delusions of grandeur.

After the recent update, they'll probably be more of those PMs flying around.

[Private Messages Will Not Increase The Quality Of Responses]

Reminds me of "Another One Bites The Dust"...

Queen - Another One Bites The Dust - YouTube

Have a Great Day!
Michael

LOL...
Actually, "Under Pressure" was my second choice.

I guess we can both agree that it requires a Queen to
place this thread in check.

Okay, Not my best, but it's Saturday Night and I'm making
a post here anyway?...lol

Have a Great Day!
Michael

Excuse me? More important than THIS?

Now I am hurt How come I did not get one?

John has a quiet celebratory moment as that was
one PM he didn't have to ignore/delete.

John
P.S. When I do find time to reply I often suggest
they "make love elsewhere". ;-)

I got this one last week or something.

Someone asking me to PAY THEM to get a review of something they're selling. PFft. No.

You pay me to let you set up your site on my servers on my domain. I don't need that domain name ruined.

The nerve of some people.

This is all well and good but can someone tell me how you guys make money online?

Where do I start?

Articles or PPC? Which one is the best?



Chris

I have some questions...

1. Whats panda?

2. Where do they sell those?

3. Is it legal to keep a panda in captivity?

4. How can I make a ton of money - even with no panda?

5. How come my friend just told me how he makes $500-$900 (per client) a month doing SEO and I'm out here asking strangers instead of repeating his process...

Wow that's embarrassing Let me explain... I spent countless hours on the forum trying to find answers about article marketing but couldn't really find a solid answer from someone that I thought was authoritative on the subject. So I decided to compile a list of the questions and send it to a few individuals of whose posts I had read and agreed with.

If you received a PM from me then I really do regard you as one of the most knowledgeable on the subject. If you had important questions would you ask one person? Or ask many and use the information you receive to make a logical decision?

The majority of people on this forum just throw out information thinking they know the truth without any real testing or experience. If you read the replies to a recent post I made you'll understand what I'm talking about:

http://www.warriorforum.com/adsense-...ml#post4875565

So yes this is a little embarrassing to say the least, but I think any intelligent person would do the same thing in my situation.

While, I respectively searched for Queen's original version... this one in my opinion hits a bit harder...

"Stone Cold Crazy" (Metallica's cover...caution explicit lyrics)



Great thread!

What is SEO?

I for one would be very happy to see the PM function disappear from existence. I receive so many I quit reading and responding to them months ago. Now I just delete them all unread at the start of every day. If I wanted pen pals I would of joined a prison ministry not the Warrior Forum.

You and I started this odyssey together...

And I have been on the forum for less than 15 minutes total in the last three days.

So let me ask you if I am one of the best people to answer your question, when I haven't had the time to do anything of any real substance of the forum since Thursday?

You are often better off taking your chance in the open forum.

Nice said, it would benefit all if some of these questions were posted to the forum

Me, too.

If you don't want to find yourself banned, don't send lengthy interview-type PMs to strangers and then bitch about them not wanting to spend hours of their time giving you free private consulting.


Paul

The degree of arrogant presumption behind that suggestion, especially leveled at someone who's given as much to this forum as John Taylor, is beyond disgusting. It ranks up there with the sense of indignant entitlement that spammers display when they insist, "If you don't want unsolicited ads, don't put your email address where people can find it."

I presume that adequately answers your question...


Paul

I personally would not mind if someone sent me a brief PM to ask if I was willing to answer a question in their thread. However, my suggestion to him was rooted in ignorance of the fact that some members may not want to receive private messages from those with whom they don't already have relationships (setting aside the members who said here that they don't want to receive PMs from anyone at all). My apologies.

But..but I thought you were superman Bill!

Rich

Ah. So, you think the rest of the people in this forum should be able to send you laundry lists of questions, filling your PM inbox, and then act indignant if you don't make the time to answer them?

I rather doubt that. If it is true, you simply don't grasp the potential issues behind that behavior "if everyone did the same thing." Doesn't mean much to me, either. The content of many of those posts means a lot. As does the fact that he spent a great deal of time here as a moderator, helping to keep the place usable and useful for the other members.

If you think our Mr Taylor has anger management issues, you have a very weird way of looking at the world.

Now, just so you understand another of the customs of our little corner of the web... I have a special gift I give people when they start down this trail you're on.

I give them rope.

I keep giving them rope until they have enough to make a noose or a ladder. Then I let them choose which of those two things they're going to turn that rope into.

Choose wisely.


Paul

Really? The principle is the same. It is no different than becoming indignant toward others because they were disturbed by your lack of manners. And then allowing that indignation to lead you into the ridiculous belief that your standards should dictate how the entire rest of the population here should use PMs.

I believe you have just inspired a new word...

Indignidiot: (n) an otherwise intelligent individual who allows personal pique to lead them to saying or doing things they would know, in a more sedate state, were downright dumb.

I like it. It's a good word, and bears repeating.


Paul

Paraphrase: "I just sort of assumed that anyone who would be disturbed by being flooded with irrelevant ads would have disabled their email addresses!"

Spammer mentality.

By the way... are you asserting that you knew about the ability to disable PMs prior to having read Ken's post pointing that option out? Your replies above don't suggest that to be the case.

The hole is getting deep. Gonna be time to choose soon.


Paul

By the way... John used the word as a noun, which should have been obvious. In that usage, it means (according to Merriam Webster Online) "a silly annoying person."

If you're going to wombat someone, at least understand the difference between a noun and a verb first.


Paul

@ Steven

You failed to miss one key phrase in my original message:

"have a few questions if you have time to help."

I've learned to not PM people with questions. But I still haven't learned why so many people here have so much anger and pessimism.

I am talking about the mentality. "If people don't want my communications, they should disable the channel in which I choose to send them. Even when I should know, based on common convention, that those sorts of communications would be unwelcome."

Exactly the same attitude.

Take a look back through this thread and notice that I didn't make a big deal out of your PM. I jumped back in when you told John that he ought to turn off PMs if he didn't want unsolicited messages from strangers. You, who have been here for all of 15 days, have the nerve to suggest that the rest of us ought to disable a useful function of this forum in order to protect you from your own simple inexperience, which you have since converted to arrogant bad manners.

Here's your last measure of rope, sir: Sensible social conventions don't, as a rule, exist to force people to conform to some arbitrary standard. They exist in order to allow social groups to function with some degree of efficiency.

Technical systems are more easily abused in large ways, and social conventions in technically enabled environments often exist to minimize those abuses. In online environments, those conventions are often referred to as netiquette.

Certain forms of manners are required for the survival of some technical environments. Breaching those forms can provoke strong reactions from the denizens. (See: the angry villager rule)

When you suggested that we all change our settings and disable a feature which many of us find extremely valuable when used within the confines of those standards of manners, you aligned yourself with every scumbag spammer, stalker, and creep who'd benefit from that same way of thinking.

And you asserted your preferences as being more worthwhile than those of the tens of thousands of people who've been here for much longer than you, and who have made the effort to understand the culture of this group.

Your initial mistake was trivial. If it weren't, you'd have known, since you sent that PM to at least one moderator.

Your response within this thread was the thing that became an issue. I have told you why.

Think carefully about what I just explained before you reply.


Paul

You mean, like you just did?

Is the word 'disingenuous' in your vocabulary?


Paul

To be completely fair to the OP, I've sent unsolicited questions to members on the forum with whom I've had no previous interaction.

For example, I had a very specific technical question about Wordpress that really wouldn't have applied to the forum in general. I asked the guy who I know is a (if not the) WP guru here on the WF.

The difference is that: 1) I directed it to an individual whom I KNEW to be an expert rather than to a list of people; 2) While we might not have had personal communication, he's probably seen my name here on the WF; 3) I asked a very specific question that would have likely been easy to answer if he'd dealt with that before. Rather he replied, "I don't know."

In reality, I realize that rather than black and white, the difference between what the OP did and what I have done is really just shades of gray. However, since this is a community and I have been a part of it, I believe there is a difference.

(Yes, I've read the whole post. Yes, I've ignored PM's. Yes, he's crossing the line in this thread.)

Kelly,

The question part was, at least in my opinion, a non-issue. There aren't any rules about asking such things via PM. If I got a question from you, for example, I'd try to make time to answer it. You've done that often enough for other people here over the years.

For me, this is about the gate-crashing rudeness of his "suggestion" to John.

Maybe it was a one-off, and he'll get the idea of why that wasn't a wise notion. Or maybe not. I don't know him well enough to hazard a guess I'd be willing to bet on at this point.

We'll see.


Paul

You know, Kelly's post brings up an interesting point.

We don't object to people sending PMs to introduce themselves, or to propose JVs. That's encouraged, actually.

We do object to sending the same PM to a bunch of people you don't know. Or spamming a bucketload of people. Or sending ads for your product to strangers.

Old-fashioned networking? Nope. Not an issue.

Don't be paranoid, folks. Just be smart. And at least a little considerate.


Paul

Only time will tell... Meanwhile,

~MM~

Not to jump in the ring as the battle ensues, but I find it almost laughable, 2 days ago I responded to several threads posted by a complete newbie. After somewhere around 1,500+ words in 3 posts, I dropped a pm to the person suggesting a few plausible options.

#1 - Use the search function, as often the repetition of repeated questions gets the natives a bit stirred

#2 - I gave him (2) versions of a link containg 100+ step-by-step video tutorials on everything a beginner needs for a mere one-time payment of $17. In light of the questions he was asking, I knew this could help him in a big way.

*I also openly stated "This is the raw link"... if you find it useful, you can use my affiliate link "here".

#3 - I gave him my email within the pm offering him help if he needed it, as others have helped me here significantly, and I believe in; "pushing it forward".

Then, he goes into another thread 'bitching' about how everyone was trying to sell him stuff via pm. (WTF!)

Understanding there's pm spam (as I would consider the mass pm sent by the subject in this thread), there's also those "feeding off the fresh meat" and trying to drum up a quick sale which could be considered spam, and then... there are the few, the proud, and those generally trying to offer someone some genuine help.

In my latest experience, I actually was trying to help, and almost regret it. CDarklock intervened on the OP's pm complaint within the thread, and suggested the 'noob' use the 'violation button', and honestly... I was sweating bullets 'thinking' great, this guy's gonna start pounding out violations like a "Whack-a-mole" game.

Truth is, I'll NEVER send a suggestion via pm again!

And though, I did not get a violation... I consider this thread, and my latest experience means to an end.

Unless, I am considering buying something and was specifically offered the option to ask the person for more info via pm, I'm leaving that pm'ing option closed, and this thread well enough alone.

I have entertained some reviews from 'solicitations' via pm, and even that left me wanting to "badger" the creator on occasion, when I saw the crap they were selling. Most of them were pretty good packages though, considering the cost of admission was free, in exchange for a review.

IF you have a personal relationship, or something too fragile to ask in the open, use the pm function. If not, then be it best to just throw it out there, and weigh the responses accordingly.

I agree with Kelly's post above, as that same WP expert directed me to the TMN network via pm, which I found to be pretty cool!

BTW, get ready myob, I am growing the nerve to pm you later about your solo ad thingy... but, I assure you, it's not a fit question to ask in the open.

All the Best,

Art

Note: general comments below, with "you" being the generic you...

A good parallel that we've talked about before is to simply ask yourself, "Would you do this offline?"

For example, maybe you join a mastermind marketer's group offline that meets weekly. You attend their first breakfast. You then get the phone numbers or email addresses of several of the members and proceed to grill them for hours with all your questions.

Keep in mind that these folks don't know you yet. You can bet it would raise a skeptical eyebrow or two, because they're wondering about the new member who's taking and taking and taking (but there hasn't been much "giving" yet). (And if you told them to get private numbers if they didn't want your calls... well, yikes.)

Now imagine this same person went to the meetings, introduced him or herself, networked with others, started talking to people about common interests, etc. You know, he or she built relationships the old fashioned way. So now what happens if this person calls up one of his or her new friends? The friend will gladly help, as now there's a genuine relationship and not just a one-way street.

This community really is no different than any offline community.

@R Hagel

Good advice. I had actually just read hundreds of posts from various threads and was trying to analyze the information so I could get started working on article syndication and seo. So I sent out PM's a little haphazardly trying to get the final bits of info I needed.

@ Kay

I'll shut up now

@ Sandor

Nice story, thanks for sharing

Letsurf,

Never mind the surf - "LET IT GO MAN!"

I too have PM'ed people that I have had no prior contact with and it worked out well.

Dr Mani and I released a WSO on it as it worked out to be an awesome JV!

However if you DO put yourself in the position where you are asking someone else for something you have to take the knocks sometimes...

On page 1 of this thread simply saying "Sorry, my bad!" learning from it and moving on would of been the wisest move.

Letting it drag on and having a disagreement with one of the top moderators will not do you any favors!

Do I agree with EVERY WAY this forum is run?

No - however I don't OWN the forum!

You have to stay within the rules if you don't own the site/forum etc... works the same way EVERYWHERE...

Relax, learn and move on - I KNOW that if you persist and start offering value then one day you might get a PM and have much the same response as Bill did.

I only hope you remember this....

All the best and Good Luck...

Chris Jones

@ Chris

Great advice. Probably a better tactic would have been to just stay anonymous and not throw myself out there to be scrutinized. In all honestly I wanted to see what kind of reactions I would get.

@ Paul M.

I think you have totally misunderstood me from the beginning. I don't have the spammer mentality and I don't think it's acceptable to just blast out PM's for every little question.


An interesting note: The friend I referred to in the original message just called me today to talk SEO because the methods he's using aren't working anymore. How ironic...

Yes. You do. You also have ego invested in not acknowledging it.

There are two things that typically characterize the spammer mentality. The first is the willingness to usurp another's resources for their own benefit, without permission or compensation. Making your request privately, so that it consumed others' time without any benefit to the provider of the information or the group as a whole, fits the bill.

That was, overall, a minor thing.

The second, and the obvious one in this case, is the belief that they should have free run of a communications channel, and that the only proper and right way to avoid their contacts is to remove oneself from that channel.

"If you don't want unsolicited PM's from strangers, turn off PM's in your account!"

You expressed exactly that sentiment, and in words very close to those. The echoes of spammers past were clear...

"If you don't want unsolicited ads from strangers, don't post your email address where people can find it!"

The logical case against this has already been made. I will refrain from expressing my visceral reaction, as it would not serve any purpose for me to be that rude at this point.


Paul

I feel like we're going in circles here and I've wasted a lot of everyone's time. So, to add something a little more productive I've compiled a list of answers I received and posted them into separate threads. Hopefully someone will find it useful.

http://www.warriorforum.com/adsense-...ml#post4904495

http://www.warriorforum.com/adsense-...ml#post4904584

http://www.warriorforum.com/adsense-...ml#post4904640

http://www.warriorforum.com/adsense-...ml#post4904697

Maybe WF should start charging to send PMs. Stop dramatizing and start Capitalizing!

if id got a question (via PM) from john T or Paul M i'd answer it...

if I got a question from someone i dont know I'd give them a link to one of my coaching programs

Once upon a time,

I used to think getting 'beat up' was making me stronger too, and it sure did... after I learned to arm/defend myself properly. Always loved a good fight!

Then, I soon realized;the only way to 'really win' was to avoid the fight in the first place!

There's nothing like witnessing a good beating to remind us all where we've been.

-Art