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Grey / Blackhat List Building Using Ebay - Make Easy $$$ - What do u think?

by Tim Brendel
44 replies
Hey Warriors,

I've been secretly toying with this idea to build an email list, without the user opt'ing in. I consider this grey/blackhat for this reason. I recently stumbled upon a method of making EASY money online by selling email addresses on eBay.

What I do is take a hot topic or niche, say iPhone for example, and register an email account with one of the free email providers (preferably Gmail) that relates to the topic. Then I would list it for sale on eBay in the Cell Phones (or its corresponding) category.

Examples:

Back in November I sold a few email addresses using this method.
I sold G1Purchase@gmail.com for $152.50!!! No kidding. See screenshot:



I also sold orderG1phones@gmail.com on the same day for $46.00!




I also sold several other email addresses that day with sales ranging from $.99 on up. Its great because the email addresses are free to register, so there's no real expenses other than eBay listing fees (which is pennies).

The main reason I started doing this was obviously to make easy money, however I realized that I was also building a HIGHLY targeted email list, that I could potentially market to at later dates!

I also came to discover that I could register pretty much ANY targeted domain name, and give away lots of free email addresses that my web host offers for free!

For instance:
Let's say (figuratively speaking) I registered and hosted a domain named www.weightlossexperts.com, and I started giving away (or selling) email accounts to interested people that wanted to sound more professional or whatever. I.E. john.doe@weightlossexperts.com, jane.doe@weightlossexperts.com, etc.

The people receiving these email addresses would obviously be highly targeted to weight loss, hence I would market the crap out of affiliate products, CPA's etc.!

What do you Warriors think about this method of list building and making money in a different way?
#$$$ #blackhat #building #easy #ebay #grey #list #make
  • Profile picture of the author Tim Brendel
    Bump - accidentally posted incomplete thread
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  • Profile picture of the author Tim Brendel
    Not one reply / comment?

    I can take constructive criticism.
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    • Profile picture of the author tomw
      Originally Posted by up4bidz View Post

      Not one reply / comment?

      I can take constructive criticism.
      I guess, as they say, "the market has spoken."

      That's all the feedback a marketer really needs.



      Thomas
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    • Profile picture of the author jmidas
      Interesting. Can you talk about the size of the lists you have been able to build? If that works, that is where the real money is.
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      • Profile picture of the author garyv
        I was about to write, saying that this is probably against the law. But after reading the canned spam act, I see that this could be legitimate. I've read that there are no restrictions against a company emailing its existing customers. And if they've purchased the email addresses, then I guess that they could be considered your customer. You must have an opt out link though. Also I don't know if you could consider someone you gave an email address to your customer or not.
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        • Profile picture of the author Frank Donovan
          I'm having a hard time understanding why anyone would want to use an email address registered on someone else's private domain.

          Would you have cPanel access?

          Even if you had your own individual passwords, you would have no control over whether the domain owner sold the address or just let the domain name expire.



          Frank
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      • Profile picture of the author Tim Brendel
        Originally Posted by jmidas View Post

        Interesting. Can you talk about the size of the lists you have been able to build? If that works, that is where the real money is.
        Small so far (20+ emails) because I work FT and have very, very little time to experiment.

        Originally Posted by Frank Donovan View Post

        I'm having a hard time understanding why anyone would want to use an email address registered on someone else's private domain.

        Would you have cPanel access?

        Even if you had your own individual passwords, you would have no control over whether the domain owner sold the address or just let the domain name expire.



        Frank
        They wouldn't need cPanel access. Just give them webmail access.


        Originally Posted by garyv View Post

        I was about to write, saying that this is probably against the law. But after reading the canned spam act, I see that this could be legitimate. I've read that there are no restrictions against a company emailing its existing customers. And if they've purchased the email addresses, then I guess that they could be considered your customer. You must have an opt out link though. Also I don't know if you could consider someone you gave an email address to your customer or not.
        Its not illegal, may be considered immoral or unethical though by some. Assuming you did capture an email address this way, you could send emails with an opt-out link if you really wanted to, but they never really opted-in in the first place, so.....


        Originally Posted by JayMartins View Post

        Hi,

        If you had a great domain then of course they would be interested.

        How many of you would love yourname@warriorforum.com or yourname@marketing.com etc..

        If you owned @yoga.com, you could sell therename@yoga.com, it LOOKS VERY PROFESSIONAL.

        The only problem with selling these on e-mail is that you need to host this domain for them, so you would have to have some sort of contact where they pay yearly.

        If you're selling GMAIL accounts you're not going to have this problem.
        My point exactly! If you make the domain name targeted to a specific niche, and people become interested in the email addresses, then you are good to go. As internet marketers we should have no problem giving away these email accounts
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  • Profile picture of the author JayMartins
    Hi,

    If you had a great domain then of course they would be interested.

    How many of you would love yourname@warriorforum.com or yourname@marketing.com etc..

    If you owned @yoga.com, you could sell therename@yoga.com, it LOOKS VERY PROFESSIONAL.

    The only problem with selling these on e-mail is that you need to host this domain for them, so you would have to have some sort of contact where they pay yearly.

    If you're selling GMAIL accounts you're not going to have this problem.
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  • Profile picture of the author testaccount9998
    Wow! Tim I have no idea about your plan for selling those email services However,


    I think your selling gmail accounts on ebay is Absolutely BRILLIANT!

    I have to ask, how do you go about marketing those ebay auctions? or do you literally just put them up and see what happens?
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  • Profile picture of the author edpudol1973
    Wow my first time to hear that you can sell an email address
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  • Profile picture of the author ahlexis
    People used to do this with GMail accounts (selling the email address) when GMail was really in "beta". Sometimes the accounts would get shut down, or the auctions would get canned, or . . . ?

    Why?

    Google's GMail TOS didn't allow it. Not sure if that has changed or not, but it used to be "don't get caught"

    I like the concept of selling or giving away email addresses at your own domain, however! Clever! (jane.doe@cashflowexperts.com, anyone?)
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    • Profile picture of the author JustaWizard
      Legal/moral or not, I can't fathom why anyone would buy an email address?

      Why should I want to buy an email address, what's in it for me?
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  • Profile picture of the author jasonl70
    Whenever I saw these, I always figured the bidders were stupid and thought they were bidding on the item itself (the phone in this example).
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    • Profile picture of the author LB
      Originally Posted by jasonl70 View Post

      Whenever I saw these, I always figured the bidders were stupid and thought they were bidding on the item itself (the phone in this example).
      Bingo.

      Notice in the listing example he shows the subject is a little ambiguous and there is a picture of an item in the listing.

      This is just taking advantage of unfortunate folks who didn't take the time to read the listing.

      This is like people who sold X-Box boxes. Bidders thought they were getting an X-Box and instead got a box.
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  • Profile picture of the author Tim Brendel
    You know, I never claimed that this method was moral. I did in fact say it was a little on the blackhat side of marketing. You are playing on the fact that people think they are getting an actual tangible product (i.e. an iPhone or xbox), HOWEVER I made it very clear several times, in red capital letters that they were purhcasing an email only.

    It is indeed their fault for not reading the entire auction if they were under the impression that they were purchasing the item thinking it was an iphone or xbox. Some people wanted the email addresses for business purposes, and they emailed afterwards thanking me for the email account.
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    • Profile picture of the author IMChick
      Originally Posted by Tim Brendel View Post

      You know, I never claimed that this method was moral. I did in fact say it was a little on the blackhat side of marketing. You are playing on the fact that people think they are getting an actual tangible product (i.e. an iPhone or xbox), HOWEVER I made it very clear several times, in red capital letters that they were purhcasing an email only.

      It is indeed their fault for not reading the entire auction if they were under the impression that they were purchasing the item thinking it was an iphone or xbox. Some people wanted the email addresses for business purposes, and they emailed afterwards thanking me for the email account.

      Well, have a look at this first if you are going to try to split hairs on what was actually being sold in the auction. It says it all...

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      • Profile picture of the author Tim Brendel
        Originally Posted by IMChick View Post

        Well, have a look at this first if you are going to try to split hairs on what was actually being sold in the auction. It says it all...

        YouTube - eBay Scammer on Judge Judy

        First of all after watching that, Judge Judy is biased, asks rhetorical questions, and should be sued by that woman for defamation of character for claiming that the girl "makes babies".

        I DID NOT do anything like that girl did.

        She: Sold an image of a phone and made the buyer believe they were actually getting a phone by stupidly putting the weight and dimensions of an actual phone, I did not.

        She: Worded her auctions to also make the buyer believe they were gettign a phone and not a picture of one. I did not.

        She: Blatantly scammed her buyers by doing this "scam-like" practices which I DID NOT DO.


        My auctions were honest, clearly stated what was for auction, and that there was no actual item included with the auction. (SEE AUCTION TITLE PICS IN ORIGINAL THREAD AGAIN)
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    • Profile picture of the author jasonl70
      Originally Posted by Tim Brendel View Post


      Who exactly was tricked or scammed?

      I just replied a few minutes ago that in the auction in BIG BOLD RED LETTERS that they werent getting a tangible item, that they were getting an EMAIL ADDRESS ONLY. How are they tricked if they don't read the auction or terms?
      you know you are scamming people

      Originally Posted by Tim Brendel View Post

      You know, I never claimed that this method was moral. I did in fact say it was a little on the blackhat side of marketing. You are playing on the fact that people think they are getting an actual tangible product (i.e. an iPhone or xbox),
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      • Profile picture of the author jasonl70
        In the future, you might want to block out your ebay ID :rolleyes:

        I wonder how long it will take for someone to report this to eBay..
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      • Profile picture of the author Tim Brendel
        Originally Posted by jasonl70 View Post

        you know you are scamming people
        Please explain to me how I know this?

        Let's review the FACTS:

        • I listed something on ebay and CLEARLY described what it was
        • I CLEARLY stated again in the auction description, and additional terms that "This is an auction for an email address only - NO PHONE IS INCLUDED"
        • After the auction ended, I emailed the buyer letting them know once again that: "This is an auction for an email address only - NO PHONE IS INCLUDED"
        So when, exactly was someone buying something that they didn't pay for? Im confused which part of the auction stated that they were acutally getting a phone,and not an email address.

        If you need reference, please check this (mine) highly unprofitable auction that closed recently:
        T-Mobile Google G1, Fantastic Email Address, Gmail - eBay (item 330301123542 end time Jan-16-09 20:28:51 PST)

        Im not worried about someone discovering my ebay ID because I've done nothing wrong.
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        • Profile picture of the author garyv
          Originally Posted by Tim Brendel View Post

          Please explain to me how I know this?

          Let's review the FACTS:

          • I listed something on ebay and CLEARLY described what it was
          • I CLEARLY stated again in the auction description, and additional terms that "This is an auction for an email address only - NO PHONE IS INCLUDED"
          • After the auction ended, I emailed the buyer letting them know once again that: "This is an auction for an email address only - NO PHONE IS INCLUDED"
          So when, exactly was someone buying something that they didn't pay for? Im confused which part of the auction stated that they were acutally getting a phone,and not an email address.

          If you need reference, please check this (mine) highly unprofitable auction that closed recently:
          T-Mobile Google G1, Fantastic Email Address, Gmail - eBay (item 330301123542 end time Jan-16-09 20:28:51 PST)

          Im not worried about someone discovering my ebay ID because I've done nothing wrong.
          Your mistake is the category you listed it in - That category is for cell phones only. Anyone that shops in that category has the right to expect that they are getting a cell phone. - Plus it's quite obvious from the statements you've made already that you're the scamming type.

          It's too bad we don't have a rating system in here - I would never want to be caught doing any kind of business w/ you.
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  • Profile picture of the author SlickSki
    I thought the same thing i.e. that the people thought they were buying a phone for example. I can't really see anything wrong with selling email addresses even though you did get them for free. Just because it was free to you doesn't mean it's not going to be in demand.

    As for the list building, surely it's not the end of the world if someone gets an email they didn't ask for.
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  • Profile picture of the author Kelly Verge
    I'm confused.

    In what manner could people who you've tricked (scammed) into buying an email address be a responsive list? What good would having their email address be if they ignore, spam, or delete all of your emails because they don't trust you?
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    • Profile picture of the author Tim Brendel
      Originally Posted by Kelly Verge View Post

      I'm confused.

      In what manner could people who you've tricked (scammed) into buying an email address be a responsive list? What good would having their email address be if they ignore, spam, or delete all of your emails because they don't trust you?

      Who exactly was tricked or scammed?

      I just replied a few minutes ago that in the auction in BIG BOLD RED LETTERS that they werent getting a tangible item, that they were getting an EMAIL ADDRESS ONLY. How are they tricked if they don't read the auction or terms? You obviously didn't read the entire thread and posts otherwise you would have answered your own question.

      Also, I never claimed an email list generated this way would be responsive, I just said it would be targeted. I also never said that you HAVE to email or market to that list. You can just sell the email account and move on to the next. Rinse, Lather, Repeat as they say.
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      • Profile picture of the author Kelly Verge
        Originally Posted by Tim Brendel View Post


        Who exactly was tricked or scammed?
        Originally Posted by Tim Brendel View Post

        You are playing on the fact that people think they are getting an actual tangible product (i.e. an iPhone or xbox)...

        Finally, the thread title includes "listbuilding" first. I suppose this is just another bait and switch?
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      • Profile picture of the author garyv
        Originally Posted by Tim Brendel View Post

        Who exactly was tricked or scammed?

        I just replied a few minutes ago that in the auction in BIG BOLD RED LETTERS that they werent getting a tangible item, that they were getting an EMAIL ADDRESS ONLY. How are they tricked if they don't read the auction or terms? You obviously didn't read the entire thread and posts otherwise you would have answered your own question.

        Also, I never claimed an email list generated this way would be responsive, I just said it would be targeted. I also never said that you HAVE to email or market to that list. You can just sell the email account and move on to the next. Rinse, Lather, Repeat as they say.
        LOL - This is too rich! - You sound just like the chick in the video!
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  • Profile picture of the author jasonl70
    IMChick - that was just brilliant!!!!
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  • Profile picture of the author Droopy Dawg
    Hey Tim I "get it"... you did post in big bold red letters that they were purchasing an email address... but pictures do speak VOLUMES. Some people only look at the picture and just go from there.

    I'm no judge... but I think you've done your part to let them know that its an email addres. If they don't actually read the listing, then its THEIR fault.

    be careful though, because your eBay ratings could go into teh toilet if many people feel they are cheated. You're playing with fire, but have yet to get burned.
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    • Profile picture of the author Tim Brendel
      Originally Posted by Droopy Dawg View Post

      Hey Tim I "get it"... you did post in big bold red letters that they were purchasing an email address... but pictures do speak VOLUMES. Some people only look at the picture and just go from there.
      People that do this are idiots!

      I'm no judge... but I think you've done your part to let them know that its an email addres. If they don't actually read the listing, then its THEIR fault.
      My point - thank you!

      be careful though, because your eBay ratings could go into teh toilet if many people feel they are cheated. You're playing with fire, but have yet to get burned.
      I have several accounts, and no longer do this method anyway because it has not been very profitable for me
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  • Profile picture of the author Mark Riddle
    Folks, take a closer look, there is no record of these sales on the feedback page, not surprised are you ?

    Just as Judge Judy illustrated in the clip the item description is not what is being sold:

    Item Specifics - Cell Phones & Smartphones
    Carrier: T-Mobile


    Technology: --


    Contract: N/A


    Camera: --


    Brand: Google


    Features: --


    Model: G1


    Condition: --


    Type: Smartphone (PDA Phone)

    I don't consider Gmail a     Smartphone (PDA Phone)
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  • Profile picture of the author Martin Avis
    Seems that there are a few people doing this:
    http://completed.shop.ebay.co.uk/ite..._ipg=50&_rdc=1

    Martin
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  • Profile picture of the author AtticusBaker
    It seems like a lot of potential problems with very little upside to me. Maybe I just don't get it, though.
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    • Profile picture of the author Tim Brendel
      Originally Posted by AtticusBaker View Post

      It seems like a lot of potential problems with very little upside to me. Maybe I just don't get it, though.
      And my advice is to either not try it at all, or try it and dont tell anyone about it because you will just be criticized for your efforts.


      FOR THE RECORD - I do not use this technique anymore. Yes, it probably was not right, so rest assured that I only experimented with it becasue I saw others doing it on ebay as well. I am not a blackhatter or a scammer. Just an experiment that got results, which I posted here on the forum.
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      • Profile picture of the author CmdrStidd
        Originally Posted by Tim Brendel View Post

        Please explain to me how I know this?

        Let's review the FACTS:

        • I listed something on ebay and CLEARLY described what it was
        • I CLEARLY stated again in the auction description, and additional terms that "This is an auction for an email address only - NO PHONE IS INCLUDED"
        • After the auction ended, I emailed the buyer letting them know once again that: "This is an auction for an email address only - NO PHONE IS INCLUDED"
        So when, exactly was someone buying something that they didn't pay for? Im confused which part of the auction stated that they were acutally getting a phone,and not an email address.

        If you need reference, please check this (mine) highly unprofitable auction that closed recently:
        T-Mobile Google G1, Fantastic Email Address, Gmail - eBay (item 330301123542 end time Jan-16-09 20:28:51 PST)

        Im not worried about someone discovering my ebay ID because I've done nothing wrong.
        Originally Posted by Tim Brendel View Post

        And my advice is to either not try it at all, or try it and dont tell anyone about it because you will just be criticized for your efforts.


        FOR THE RECORD - I do not use this technique anymore. Yes, it probably was not right, so rest assured that I only experimented with it becasue I saw others doing it on ebay as well. I am not a blackhatter or a scammer. Just an experiment that got results, which I posted here on the forum.
        Lets look at something here. In your very first post along with the title of the thread you state that this is grey/blackhat. Then as time goes on, we find you trying to justify what you are doing and trying to clean it up so is it blackhat or isnt it? Then in the most recent post as I am reading this, you try and tell us that you are not a blackhatter or a scammer but where did you say you were putting the auctions for these email addresses again? Oh yeah, in the spaces for CELL PHONES. Why not list them in the section for email addresses for sale instead of CELL PHONES FOR SALE? The woman in the video also had it stated in her ad that you were buying a photograph of a cell phone. Just like you did and we all saw what happened to her. I would love to know what happened to her with regards to the Atty Generals office. They really frown on fraud in that office.
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        • Profile picture of the author Tim Brendel
          Originally Posted by CmdrStidd View Post

          Lets look at something here. In your very first post along with the title of the thread you state that this is grey/blackhat. Then as time goes on, we find you trying to justify what you are doing and trying to clean it up so is it blackhat or isnt it? Then in the most recent post as I am reading this, you try and tell us that you are not a blackhatter or a scammer but where did you say you were putting the auctions for these email addresses again? Oh yeah, in the spaces for CELL PHONES. Why not list them in the section for email addresses for sale instead of CELL PHONES FOR SALE? The woman in the video also had it stated in her ad that you were buying a photograph of a cell phone. Just like you did and we all saw what happened to her. I would love to know what happened to her with regards to the Atty Generals office. They really frown on fraud in that office.

          Give it up already! I don't do or condone this method. It was an experiment that I tried and posted my findings here on the forum. Give it a rest and please save your comments for better threads than this old turd.
          Jeez!
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  • Profile picture of the author Virtual Banker
    I own the Domain
    IAMWarrior.com

    do you think anybody wants to buy an email address here?

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  • Profile picture of the author jasonl70
    Tim, I understand that you spelled everything out in the auction description very clearly.. but you also said that you were banking on people not realizing they were not getting the actual product.

    It's cool that you have stopped doing this.
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  • Profile picture of the author Rob Whisonant
    This reminded me of the guy who sold xbox boxes on eBay many years ago. His auction said you get everything in the picture.

    In the picture was an xbox box. Yep you got the box. Many people purchased these empty boxes for hundreds of dollars.

    I could not live with myself if I had done something like the xbox box guy did. It's not worth the bad karma.

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    • Profile picture of the author Droopy Dawg
      Originally Posted by Rob Whisonant View Post

      This reminded me of the guy who sold xbox boxes on eBay many years ago. His auction said you get everything in the picture.

      In the picture was an xbox box. Yep you got the box. Many people purchased these empty boxes for hundreds of dollars.

      I could not live with myself if I had done something like the xbox box guy did. It's not worth the bad karma.

      Re's
      Rob Whisonant

      Wow... that's almost as bad as people putting up bogus donation sites right after natural disasters... that's just plain wrong.

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  • Profile picture of the author Trader54
    This makes me laugh, and when it comes to using your real name it keeps you honest and makes you more trustworthy. LOL
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  • Profile picture of the author jasonl70
    tim - I didn't realize someone had dragged this up from archives..
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  • Profile picture of the author Samuel Lee
    Seems an interesting idea, and would agree that I'm a little confused as to how you can sell indivdual email addresses and not the domain itself. But the techniques seem viable though, I think your selling gmail accounts on ebay is a different and unique way to build your list for sure and earn an income at the same time!
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    • Profile picture of the author kishio
      Well, I don't see anything wrong with that except that you listed it in the wrong category that's all.
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