Ridiculous refund requests...

I typically refund those....just so long as they promise to never be a customer again. (Seriously, I'll use that exact wording....)

Some will disagree with me, but, in those instances, I really don't feel it's fair to a seller.

Are they ridiculous? YES!

Can you doing anything about it? NO!

It's a pain in the ar*e and annoyingly, there's nothing you can do about it. You have to refund it.

The issue I have is with repeat refunders. I have people purchase membership to one of my site, then cancel, then resign up and then cancel. They did it for 5-6 consecutive days, two of them did it...

Refund, blacklist, and move on. These kind of people do nothing but waste your time. If they make ridiculous refund requests, then chances are they're difficult people who you want to just get out of your life.

For some of my products I use 1ShoppingCart. That system requires people to enter their addresses and a lot of other info to place an order.

This one person asked if there was a way he could purchase my $7 WSO without going through 1ShoppingCart.

I said sure, send $7 to my PayPal account and I'll email the product to you directly. He sent the money, I sent the product, and within 30 seconds he asked for a refund.

I guess now I know why he wanted to be anonymous.

Can I ask, are these all Clickbank products?

Just refund to save any arguments or disputes but yes I also think its funny when people compliment you on your product then ask for a refund lol

I don't think he can hear you Johnny, shout louder chap. I'll try for you...

OP, were these Clickbank products? Johnny wants to know.

They are really ridiculous. That's being unfair to the seller. They can get all the info they want and after that they can refund their money with just a flick of their fingers.

I don't think these are clickbank products.

Just thank them for giving your product a try and refund them, don't waste your energy on them. Also the great thing about using WSO pro is you can blacklist the buyer.

Just refund them and move on. Don't waste your time with people like that. They are ridiculous.

Cheers

Mildred

With a refund rate of below 0.25% you're doing really well so I'd focus on the 99.75% sales you ARE making and just refund & move on.

If you use DLGuard for payment/delivery of your product, you can put a refunder on the ban list so they are only able to do that once and never purchase from you again. I do that and don't have any serial refunders.

maybe it would help if you tightly defined your refund parameters and anything outside of those would be politely denied a refund.

Ridiculous?

Not even close.

Those excuses are what I would call "normal".

There are excuses that are much, much more ridiculous than this.

Unfair or dishonest? Maybe.

Ridiculous? No.

All the best,
Michael

To decrease your refund rate follow these 3 steps.

1. Provide what you offered

This is the main and important backbone of your business you really need to provide what you are over-hype talked about in your sales page.

2. Be a trusted guy

Trusting is all about building relationship with your customers though you really need to provide your real information.

3. Over Deliver

This is a new strategy , Over deliver means give something extra than what offered in the sales page

First question, what were the refund terms stated in your guarantee? If you have, for example, a 60 day, no question asked, moneyback guarantee, then you really can't complain why they are seeking a refund. Issue it and move on.

Did the sales copy give any indication as to the implementation time of said method? Or any indication of the type of method that would be in use? Someone, for example, might be able to spend an hour a day on something, whereas someone else may have only 15 minutes to spare. If your method requires an hour, and they have 15 minutes, they don't have time to implement it.

They may have time to implement certain methods but not others.

Sounds reasonable. I mean, I know I could make money by going around collecting good stuff people set out on trash day. Some people throw out good stuff. I could take it, clean it up, fix it up and sell it. But, that's not really my thing. So, if I buy a book on how to make hundreds of dollars a week and discover it's a method such as that, I might like a refund.

But, to a degree, this kind of refund request could be reduced by being more clear in the sales copy as to what the product is and what it entails.

If it involves Facebook, the sales copy should reflect that. I'm not a big Facebook fan, so I'd want a refund too.

0.25%= 1 refund out of 400 sales if my math is correct. I am not the type to buy IM products, but, where can I get yours? This low of a refund rate in the MMO niche tells me your product is beyond amazing!

totally ridiculous

That's just the cost of doing business! If we live in a perfect world we wouldn't have no refunds, now would we? Give them their money back and ask what can I do to make the product better? Move on!

Yeah its part of the business. If you see another occurence from the same customer, then be sure to blacklist them. Make sure that your thank you page is secure!

I suggest you outline the fact you dont offer refunds, and then explain a few key points on the product page.

Not enough to give it away, but something like:

-NOTE: Requires Facebook Account

That was people know what the require before they purchase and your refund rate will decrease even further

Jamie.

I don't think number 2 is that reasonable if they weren't sure what to expect...

I know recently I bought a product thinking it would help my business and when I read through it, while it was an amazing product, it didn't apply to what I was already doing. It was more about monetizing than traffic and the traffic tips it did have I had already been using. I emailed them and told them that while the product was fantastic, it wasn't something I could use. I would be sad to be blacklisted by them because I would be happy to buy a product from them in the future that I could actually make use of.

I would suggest using information you get from refund requests to set up a small FAQ including things like the fact your product uses Facebook and outline a little more of what they can expect.

Yep, there idiotic reasons for asking for refunds but...

it comes with the territory of the MMO Niche!

The refund policy should state that after trying these methods and showing proof that you have applied what has been taught and you still don't get the minimum results expected then you will be entitled to a full refund.

You should also have an earnings diclaimer, however the forum doesn't have this appeal as it would but many buyers off!

I guess the MMO Niche will forever have its serial refunders lol, saying that selling 1,000+ copies and having 10 to 15 refunds still isn't bad considering 4 to 7 of them are serial offenders!

Peace,

Colin.

Those requests may be unreasonable, or they may not be, it depends on what the sales copy says. I was going to write something similar to what Dan said, but he got here first and saved me the typing.

I'd just add that, you might want to go slow on the blacklisting part. Like you, my refund rate is extremely low so I know my products are good. I've refunded people before with what seemed to me to be frivolous reasons, only to have them come back later and buy other products -- and keep them!

I generally don't blacklist someone until one refund becomes two, indicating a trend. Most people I give the benefit of the doubt the first time around. It's paid off in additional sales before, and I expect it will again. We need to be careful about judging other people according to our own reality.

How about these examples:

"This shirt looked good in the store, but made me look fat in my mirror."

"I didn't realize that this coffee maker required water."

"This rose scented air freshener made my house smell like roses. I didn't know it would do that."

These are all ridiculous excuses for refunds, but Walmart will give your money back every time.

What you are talking about seems like a curse on merchants that has been aroujnd since there were merchants. Sounds like an occupational hazard to me

Steve,

There is nothing you can do about these people. They know it can help them but they are not willing to do anything to move towards success.

There are people who go through every single product when it comes to making money online and always know that they are going to ask for their money back.

It really comes down to your stated refund policy. Some products come with a "no hassle, no questions asked" guarantee. If you promise this, then no request can be considered ridiculous. It's best to make your position on this as clear as possible on the sales page.

This is a risk which we all live with while selling a software or a service. We can't list all the reasons in which a seller won't refund. Having a different page for "I Agree to terms and conditions" and let them Agree before they buy your product may allow you to stop these kind of refunds(Note: Just an idea, never tried it to see the impacts on sales)

When somebody asks a refund for a lame reason which I can't accept, I have a inner voice interpreting the text for me, which says:

"I got your software, got the code removed which asks for license, and now it works without your License Key. I want the money back."

Or

"I purchased your e-book, read it, and I saved a copy in my hard drive and uploaded it on a free sharing website. Now give me my money back. "

.... list goes on.

In all cases, the moment they asked for a refund, those are NOT my customers anymore, and I should care less about them. As Jason said, "Refund, blacklist, and move on."

Mohit

my favorites are the folks who ask for a refund within a couple minutes of purchase. They never intended to pay and are just working the system. Blacklist if possible and move on..
"oh, I didn't know this involved effort. I want a refund. Actually could I have double my money back?"

I rarely ask for a refund on any product and certainly wouldn't use any of the "reasons" you mentioned. However, no matter how clear your copy is and how detailed you are (without giving away the method) there is going to be one unhappy person. At best it will be the person who is buying products but have no clue what they are doing, and at worst it will be someone who wants to get your product without paying.

The best thing to do is refund the money and ban the buyer. If that person is a serial refunder they will at least have "d'oh!" moment when they try to buy from you again.

Even if you feel the refund request is not legit, it is best to get them out of your hair by refunding the money. Some people who might have just been slightly dissatisfied might become enraged if their refund request is denied.

It's just a cost of doing business. Like your Internet connection or something.

Well, LOL, at least you *got* a reason...

My only real issue with refunders is those that had no intention of buying in the first place. In other words, they planned to refund from the beginning - serial refunders. Those typically will provide no reason whatsoever. Just "please give me a refund".

Or, I love this, when they quote my refund policy to me in the request for a refund - as if I don't know my own policy that *I* wrote in the first place!

It's an annoying cost of business, yes, but it's going to be interesting to see how this materializes over time. Refund rates are up industry wide and I don't suspect they will go back down.

It's going to be interesting to see how this unfolds over the next couple of years...

Another trend that is prominent is refund requests can be very high from certain countries and that is getting out of hand with some. May have to stop selling to certain countries because of it...

Do I think they're fair? Not really. I think they're dumb. But you're going to get dumb reasons for a lot of things most days. I've seen people selling products who mention they've gotten refund requests because "product requires work."

I agree with others that dumb refunds happen. Refund the money, blacklist them, and move on. Tell them they're blacklisted or don't, but I wouldn't let it get to you. The more you're annoyed, the more distracted you are from the things you want or need to do.

I can't tell you how many times I've had this isn't for me. Why buy it then?

I've had to learn with releasing products that you have to grow a thick skin as far as refunds go....lol

colleen

If you offer a no questions asked guarantee, then suck it up and move on. Or switch to a no refund policy.

Part of doing business.

If you have a 'no questions asked guarantee' as is so commonly advertised these days, then no there's nothing you can do about it or should do about it. Don't have a refund policy if you're going to complain about refunds. Plain and simple. It's just part of the game. Change your refund policy to "Refunds will be given on a case by case basis" or "Refunds will be given after a detailed explanation of why this product wasn't for you".

And there's always the possibility that those people are just sparing your feelings by not ripping you a new one about your product. Obviously I have no idea, but I'm just laying out the possibility.

I know for a fact that not every business needs a no questions asked refund policy. I think its only necessary if your a clickbank merchant (obviously). But clickbank balances that disadvantage out because your product can get marketed by some monster affiliates. As for me, some of my websites say there is no refund once the transaction is complete. If they don't like it, they shouldn't buy it.

@ Kevin - That gives me an idea. I could write up a WSO about out sourcing someone to push that button!

I hate refunding, but with PayPal disputes I always refund unless the reason is way out of line.

I agree that many people ask for refunds for that are totally uncalled for. If they would simply read the sales page and find out what the product involves they probably would not have to ask for a refund. I have bought many, many products and I seldom ask for a refund. I can usually pick up some valuable information even if I do not use product itself. There are usually always some golden nuggets. That being said, without offering a refund policy many people will not buy from you. So the only choice is to just simply refund them. I know that has got be really frustrating!!

Some of these refund requests are just plain funny

I hate those! But even worse is the odd "I didn't like the way you replied to my question, I want a refund!" or "I didn't like the course I purchased 1.5 years ago from you but I threw it out. Can I get a refund?" hahah People are FUNNY. It will always be something!

I have a software site where I manually install the script for the user if they pay an installation fee.

I just had a user open a dispute for the installation fee, and the first 3 months of the software. He said in the Paypal dispute that "the owner told me that it was impossible to install it on my server". What actually happened was I successfully installed it on his server, then he went in and manually deleted the installation before opening up the dispute!

It's unfortunate that in the world of IM, there will always be refund requests, the most frustrating ofcourse is from buyers who know they can get a refund, and still implement what was taught, so in essence the obtained the info for free

Just because someone asks for a refund doesn't mean you have to honor it! I agree with customer satisfaction, but on any membership site, you should have an as is disclaimer. If it's a recurring membership, they can cancel the membership anytime, though they don't get the money back that they've already paid.

Now, selling an individual product I would always offer 100% money back guarantee. But memberships and packages should be as is (in my opinion). Chances are, they'll never do business with you again anyways.

Well, the first two sound somewhat legit. I might refund either of those depending on the circumstances.

The last one though, that is funny You could create the facebook account for them though, then say 'here you go'! (But it actually sounds like they just don't want to do work).

I got a refund request, for an e-book, on the 4th of this month October 2011.

What got me, apart from the the request coming 21/2 years down the track, was

(1) The female still had the receipt no

(2) The wording & spelling was indicative of someone with a reasonable level of education

(3) She praised the book?????

(3) $9.97 would make a difference??

Some people are just wired wrong... Weird.

Michael

"Waaaaaaa, only 99.75% of my customers are happy and some of the rest are stupid!"

It depends what your refund policy is. If you have a no questions asked refund policy then you refund everyone who asks. Just remember about the extra sales you have made by offering the refund policy and forget about the small few who decide to take advantage of it. Feel happy in the fact they will most probably never get anywhere with their IM ventures.

Of course you refund it: that's the nice thing to do. But I think I've only asked for one refund in my entire IM career - this is real hard work, and if you learn just one thing of value, it has to have some kind of... um.. value?

You have to write people and situations like that off as the cost of business though. A money back guarantee means you're assuming the risk for a product... you're basically signing on for stuff like this in exchange for a "safe" purchase.

Ive begun making conscious efforts to address refunds requests by changing my business model. Ive had enough, seriously....

Im tired of the BS involved with people gaming the system, especially within Clickbank. I think many buyers are AWARE that their refund request will be processed, regardless of the reason. Clickbank will honour the refund request, even if its blatently intentional, which is just downright annoying.

How can someone seriously file a refund request, just seconds after purchase, and that refund be granted? Especially on a product that would take hours or days to go over in detail?

I cant think of any business (offline) that would follow this system? Unless Im unaware, what store could you possibly walk into, buy a product, then whilst still standing at the counter say..."I want my money back, Ive changed my mind, but I want to keep the product."

Its ridiculous.

I truly believe that as more and more people become aware of Clickbanks "No questions asked" refund policy, that over time, refund requests will only escalate. I wonder how this will affect their business in years to come?

At present, I'm working with some local printing/binding companies in order to convert my info products from digital to physical format. Im hopeful that this will weed out the idiots, and prevent refunds.

I know it wont eliminate them completely, but at least with a physical product, it needs to be returned, unlike digital - where they buyer gets their money back and they keep the product. Having to actually 'return' a product, rather than simply 'push a button' might be too hard for serial refunders. Id rather not make the sale, than make the sale, then have to "give it back for free"

I also believe that physical products have a much higher perceived value to that of digital, therefor I might be able to sell my products at a higher pricing point. I could be wrong, I dont know, and I wont know until I test it out and weigh up the results.

Ill be sure to share my experiences here on the forum if anyones interested. Im really looking forward to seeing my products in shiny binders with vacuumed sealed wrap

I have had some doozies over the years.

But there is nothing you can do about it.

You know that with every 1000 sales you get, there are going to be refunds. Get over it, move on...do your job properly, and keep overdelivering. Infact I do this, and on occasions even if someone refunds accept it. Just from being nice to one of my refunders...I made $1000 from him about 2 months later. So it pays to be nice and professional. Not everything you create is going to be a rock star success. But it doesnt have to be to make a killing online...that is important to remember.

Refunds happen deal with em and move on.

but here, here is a little humor to help brighten your day

Customer emails me one day and says "I bought your product I have not opened it, I have no idea what is inside but I don't want to miss out on my refund period so can I have a refund please"
I respond Hi, If you have not even opened the product why would you need a refund you have no grounds to base that on, do you just need the money or what gives here?

Response back" Errrm no I made a mistake yours is the one I want it's the other one...

Cheers
-WD

zappos has a refund rate of around 33% (according to an npr interview) because they encourage you to order their shoes just to try them on ... they have tightly woven it into their business model and is now an integral part of their success.

Stating that you offer 100% no questions asked refund, and that you let the customer keep the product if they are not happy will yield to a higher refund rate, but it also will increase sales, and possibly retain a few long term customers that otherwise would not have paid in the first place ( considering the info is good)

Just my two cents, I know it's annoying! I have been through it a couple times myself, but taking it with a grain of salt and moving on is the best way to go... Sometimes customers are just in a financial crunch and really need the money so they just make up some generic excuse to preserve pride.

just wondering... how many of you that are complaining about refund requests state in your sales copy " No Questions Asked Refund Policy" ?

I usually just refund those, lest they turn into a Paypal dispute. Too many Paypal disputes makes Paypal antsy. It's better to give them their money back, then just block them as a buyer, delete them from your lists, etc,

Unfortunately you will always get people who want a refund. You can't please everyone.

The more transparent you can be about your product the better. i.e. by stating this product involves using Facebook eliminates ridiculous excuses.

In the IM industry there is a lot of crap products (not that I'm suggesting yours is) but there are also a lot of people who buy things with no intention of actually paying. They know you have to offer a refund and will come up with the most ridiculous reasons.

I agree with others, blacklist them and hopefully others will do this trend and they can't keep up with their silly excuses.

Yeah I get similar refund requests. And I also have a very low refund rate. Truth is you'll get people like this with any business you run and there's not much you can do but give them a refund. It's not worth making a big deal about or refusing to give them a refund. That's how companies get a bad rep.

You're better off focusing your energy on growing your business rather than worrying about silly refund requests.

I'll play the devil's advocate for a second.

A lot (maybe most?) of sales pages on info product don't disclose much at all, they're more on "you can make this much money with so little effort" sales pitches, some are well written, but provides no outline of what to expect.

It's like putting a name of a dish on a menu with no description or photo to give the patron what that dish is other than big, bright words saying "MUST TRY! Awesome taste! Guaranteed culinary masterpiece!"...

Then the order arrives and it turns out to be a dish with ingredients that you absolutely hate.

A lot of WSOs are marketed in such a way where great shiny promises presented but without providing the potential buyer any ideas on what they're actually buying other than the premise of... wait for it...

"Buy it, you'll like it! If you don't, you can get a refund!"

Doesn't that automatically make these refund gripe threads invalid?

If the seller doesn't lay things out clearly right up front, and there's no way the buyer can gauge whether it's right for them after-the-purchase, who's at fault?

You don't buy a pair of jeans without seeing it and fitting them first, right? If the seller isn't capable of providing those tangible and analyzable details, then the seller must offer a no-questions asked refund/return/exchange policy - much like what most mail order companies do.

As sellers, we may have a tendency to get defensive and blame the reader/customer right away... But have we ever put on the customer hat and read our sales copies often enough and wonder if we're clear enough with our message?

Having said that, it's 100% correct that as business owners, we must concentrate on our efforts of continuously satisfying the bigger % of happy customers than dwell on the bad ones, but that doesn't mean we should ignore them because they may very well have valid points that your business and marketing practices are wrong or flawed as well.

My return policy is.

Buy my stuff. Later you can return and buy more.

George Wright

Keep it moving....you'll always have tirekickers who want something for nothing and with digital products, it's easy just to send an email with a BS excuse for a refund. If you don't have consistently high refunds then don't worry about it. That's how the game goes.

People will cancel for whatever reasons they want, I say under promise and over deliver and you won't go wrong.

Personally I would just refund them, its really not worth wasting time on. Alot of the time people cancel for reasons completely outside your control.

Just received a good one today:

" I just purchased your product, but the product that I wanted to use it in conjunction with turned out to be a scam and now I can't use yours either. Can I get my money back? I don't want to be stuck with this."

So, the product that you got from SOMEONE ELSE was a scam and so now you can't use the one you got from me either (which, BTW, is not designed to use in conjunction with anything else)?

Sheesh...

Money refunded...

Yea I get some lame excuses as well. But its just better to refund them and then come back here and we can all laugh about the lame excuses people make..lol

One I just got was this:

"Your product is amazing and I got so much from it. But I am now getting out of the business and need a refund."

This was like 1 day after buying my product...lol

The only ones I hate are these types that post this in your wso salespages:

"I got no value from your product and it sucks" but you can keep the refund because I can afford it."

Translation: I like to bash and talk crap but I didnt pay for your product. I stole it! lol..

WHAT is ridiculous with those?

1. They almost 100% of the time DON'T know what is required when they buy it! And conditions CHANGE! HECK, I have sometimes bought things when I had a 1 MONTH window, and they shipp it to me AFTER the window closes. I HAVE thought about getting refunds in such cases.

2. AGAIN, almos 100% of the time they DON'T know specifics.

3. A number of people DON'T want to use facebook, and it may conflict with what they do, etc... If you didn't make it clear that it was so reliant on facebook, EXPECT some refunds!

Steve

If you truly provide a product or service of great value, just give them a refund and move on. No need to focus on a few outliers.

This wasn't a refund but along the same lines...

I had a guy today who said he'd become a member of mine if I pay his way, otherwise he's "not doing it".

I told him to let me know when he opens his own retail store, so that I can come in and have him buy me some of his merchandise

-Bryan

Love this one.
Awesome product - I like the way it works. Please refund, now I have seen it - I am going to build it for myself.
wow.......

What about:

"I love your product, but I'm saving up to buy a car and I need all the money I can get".

Its not fair but we live in times of refund policy. however, did you know that with paypal you can block certain buyers, so they don't make a habit of it.

All standard reasons. Problems arise when people don't even bother asking for refunds and decide to start doing chargebacks instead. The other types of annoying customer can include the ones who refund within an hour then continue to send you support emails about the product they've instantly refunded.

It is the age of "reveiws"! When it comes to buy a product, at least a one dollar toy, a little baby also check review before final decision. Physical product can be damage during transportation but what's wrong with digital product.

I just refund them and not think about it. Who cares, at least they have opt-in'ed in my sub list.

Hi..

people ask for refunds for various reasons.Never bother about them.Just focus on your promotions.

super warrior had forgotten to put his link in signature.

You know it is so frustrating to work hard at a project, deliver seriously good content, videos etc... and then have people say, "I was dissapointed" or "I can't find anything new"... or "I don't speak english well" so many stupid refund requests and most people KNOW in advance they are going to ask for a refund.

I think what I have learned is that I can't take it personal. I have people emailing me and thanking me a lot for my guide, thanking me for helping them with this or that, or just thanking me for helping them make money for the first time - love those.

It's important to really not take it personal I guess. I've heard that last year (on into this one) more and more people are asking for refunds. You know I had one gal tell me she was going to ask for a refund so she could buy my guide! I gave her a free copy so she would not do that. ><

It's not fair, it shouldn't be legal, and we should be able to say, "I don't offer refunds because my guide is seriously worth every dollar spent". But then many people have purchased pure garbage WSO's. I know I have. So, you want to be sure you can get a refund in case it's yet another horrible WSO.

I usually do not ask for refunds even when they are garbage. It's rare for me to ask, but sometimes it's necessary.

It still irritates me. And I really want to SMACK people who are liars and KNOW very well the product they downloaded was high quality and worth it. But ((big sigh)) it's part of being a business owner I guess.

What I do is I Block them, I BAN THEM, then I remove them from my subscribers list as I don't want them to reap all the great high quality free bonuses I give my list.

One time someone never even requested a refund, they just went straight to Paypal and started a dispute! ARG!!!

Maybe we need a WSO that is some type of software that will add these "true" offenders to our BAN list and then they can't buy in the first place??

Phew! Time to get off this soap box.

Allow the happy customers to make you smile and feel good about what you do. Let the refunders bad juju just roll off and move on.

Okay, that's my speil.

Best Wishes,
Chrisi

There's no law which says you have to refund. If you don't want to refund, don't give a refund guarantee.

Just give their money back. They're not worth the hassle. What I would do though is blacklist them and give them a little lecture after sending them a refund.

I sell my products through authorize . net and when customers make a purchase they do not get a receipt from authorize . net but they get a customer receipt from my website.

In this way they don't get a refund at all