Write quality articles for people or work at McDonalds?

At many McDonalds the employees get free meals and drinks.
:p

fLufF
--

Look at the for hire forum here and fiverr. Looks like plenty of English speakers are.

Of course writers are going to feel like they are worth a certain amount. However, if you are doing the hiring, it's hard to not give native English speaking writers a try at a penny a word.

This is what I've been doing. I thought writing on the side could help me get along while my sites grow, but so far it's no really happening.

I hope some people interested in getting paid for their writing contacted this person ...

Another "price/value of articles" thread? Well, yes, I suppose there's been only one, so far, today ...

It all depends on the markets in which you choose to compete.

I don't know which is more surprising: the fact that people expect perfect literate, fluent, competent writers to work for $0.02 per word (or even less!) or the fact that so many writers are apparently willing to do it.

It's terribly difficult to make a living writing $5/$10 articles, because the clients tend to be people whose own businesses don't flourish (they often don't know how to use the articles because very often they think of "article marketing" only in SEO terms), and therefore these writers need permanently to advertise for new clients, to allow for this. :rolleyes:

I always point out in similar threads that the reason you don't see writers of $50/$100 articles advertising all the time isn't (as some wrongly imagine) that they don't exist: it's mostly the fact that their clients know how to use their work, with the result that their own businesses do well, and they keep returning for more. I was "there", and know this from personal experience. In that market, one doesn't have the "client generation problem" to anything like the same extent. But I always get the impression that many people simply don't accept/believe this.

Still - it's a global market, and many American/British/Canadian/Australian/other "Western" writers are choosing (often - I suspect - because they don't quite realise that they do have a choice about it) to compete with people working in countries where $5 is a full day's pay.

What people earn from their writing depends as much on their own marketing skills as on their writing skills.

The classic "article-writing mistake" to avoid, is imagining that it's a good idea to start off for low prices (like $5 per article) intending to increase the prices later (to something like $10 per article) "after establishing some clientele".

That doesn't work.

Actually for one very obvious, glaring reason which a lot of people completely overlook, I think: what attracts customers to writers of $5 articles is the fact that they're charging $5, and it really is as simple as that. Up go the prices and away go the customers, because in the $5 article market there's a never-ending supply of service-providers. :p

(NB: I have no writing service to offer to anyone!).

Interesting...

While I have not ruled out establishing a writing service as I have been working on a site for that purpose, it does seem less entertaining to write a standard 500 word article for .02. as opposed to writing an optimized 'piece' for 2-3 keywords for as you say; $75-$100.

However, from the perspective of being one who has little experience as a professional or paid writer, there's an element of confusion that resonates when asking oneself; can I over-deliver and get my customers the results they seek?

As Alexa points out, I certainly wouldn't expect room for growth if I jump into the .02 per word crowd, as I don't see the writing as a 'hit and run' business model.

Instead, I have been considering several options such as; content management, consulting, web design, SEO, and along the lines of packaging the term 'writing' differently. In fact, the majority of my studies have been 'outside' my comfort zone which is writing, specifically because I feared being trapped by the same limitations a job offers, if writing is my only skill/service being offered.

One thing I cannot afford is to lose my passion for writing due to the frustration of cheap clientele. Yet, my stubbornness may land my home office to being under a tree on a park bench soon, if I don't get one of my many blueprints active straight away.

Ironically, a few people have 'hinted' just from my posts that they were interested in hiring me to write, but puts both them and myself in such an awkward position;

i.) I have never offered any such services to date
ii.) I cannot possibly know what price barrier to set had I truly been ready to entertain the offer

Sure, I'd like to believe I'd spend 2-4 hours and crank out 'optimized' content that could make 100x the money I'd charge.

However, I wouldn't see the benefits personally unless I could charge $75 -$100 for a 500 -750 word article, and even then, I almost prefer teasing readers, and writing 1,000+ word articles. It gives me more flexibility, and allows for some creative juices to flow.

So, without knowing the true value of my ability; 10-15 cents per word sounds peachy, and I'd write all day long...happily!

Meanwhile, my wife's bent on the idea I should be writing books. Others have said; "How can you be unemployed when you have such a way with writing?"

I'll tell ya straight, I CANNOT critique my writing or put a dollar amount on it's value, as writing is a priceless gift, one to wit; I cannot afford to let be dismayed by money...no matter how bad I need it!

Not sure if any others can relate, but again; I have NEVER written for money. I believe to be capable and able, "if" a respect can be maintained. From what Alexa mentions above, I fear that may NOT be possible writings for others.

Ah... the starving artist syndrome, both inspiring and frustrating!

-Art

who are you pitching your premium articles to?

it's better to start with an idea and shop it around than to say "premium articles for sale"

You sound like me, man. I have two degrees, actually. My Master's is doing me no good, but I wanted to stay home with my kids, so there you go.

Anyway, I fried my eyes researching alternative ways to do my writing online over the last year or so, and I've come to a couple conclusions. First, whether it's content mills or (most) online private clients, you are not going to make much more than minimum wage. You're right on that.

Second, the writing that WILL make money - now and forever - is sales copy. Learn how to write a kick-a$$ sales letter and you can sell that thing for $50. That's $50 an hour. Or $25 for 2 hours if that's how long it takes you. And I'm new around here but by no means new to the make-money-online game. And it seems to me what these guys want around here is good sales copy.

I'm getting some books to sharpen my skills as a copywriter. You should too. That's where the money is.

And since it's sales copy, you may accidentally learn how to market yourself in the process. Bonus!

Hope this helps.

Whenever this topic comes up, we talk about things like "selling to the wrong market" and "positioning yourself differently". Let's expand on that a bit because, really, what the hell does that even mean?

The way I look at it, it's ultimately a problem of market segmentation. Let's break it down into categories of customers:

a) Bargain shoppers - this group of buyers either don't have much cash, rewrite heavily, or don't care about the quality of their content. The ESL'ers need work as well, so let's forget about this market. You'll find these shoppers on eLance, Fiverr, and even the WF.

b) Serious start-up shoppers - these guys know the value of good content, and are willing to pay a bit extra for it. Imagine someone starting a new niche site and needing some articles. Don't expect to get rich here, but don't expect to work for McWages either. They're hanging out on eLance, WF, ect.

c) Premium content shoppers - now we're talking... business. These guys have income-generating sites, and in order to keep them generating income, they need premium content. What's a $50 article if it earns you $500? To find these people, take out a Warrior For Hire ad, watch who's hiring on WF, and network.

d) Corporate - this is the promised land of $150+ an article. In my mind, this would be sites that are worth hundreds of thousands to millions. It's unlikely you'll find them on WF or eLance (although I'm sure one thing has led to another). Count on these guys advertising on their site or going through a well-known SEO company.

This is pretty rudimentary, more as an example than anything.

How about positioning? That basically entails being in the right place at the right time. It's time to think backwards here.

If you were a premium content shopper, where would you look for a writer? If I knew about the WarriorForum, I'd probably start my search here. If I didn't, I'd probably start by searching Google for reputable content companies. I'd ask my buddies who they use.

If I were corporate, I'd put the word out. Let the good writers come to me. I'd be on one of those fancy writing sites, or if my traffic was high enough, I'd simply post it on my site. I might talk to an agency. I'd go through the resumes I'd been sent in the past.

So here's what I can do to position for the segments I want:

1. Take out a Warrior For Hire ad, with my shiny new price tag.
2. Watch the Hiring section on these forums.
3. Create a site, with a portfolio. I wouldn't just be a freelance writer, I'd be a content company (even if I'm a one-man show).
4. Ask for referrals from clients.
5. Comb sites like Writer's Market and apply often.
6. Contact the sites I want to write for. Treat it like applying for a job because that's what it is!
7. Apply to agencies that pay their writers serious money.
8. If the sites you read regularly put up a For Hire ad, apply.

Pretty basic outline but hopefully it brings my point across.

The low-end of the market is a crap shoot if you can't live on burger-flipping wages. Just delete that market from your mind. It doesn't exist anymore. Time to find a new way.

Maybe, yes ... but more importantly you have to decide first in which market you're competing. All writers determine that for themselves. The $5/$10 market is the most difficult and most unreliable in which to compete: in that market, for very understandable reasons, the turnover of clients is so dramatic that most of one's "businesses activities" involve constant promotion and advertising of one's services. The lower the price-range one targets, the more marketing and the less writing one really does.

On the contrary, there's an overwhelming difference.

In the $5/$10 market, there are apparently nearly as many service-providers as customers. When you're writing longer articles for syndication, for example in the $100/$150 price-range, if you write a couple of good articles for a client that serve their purpose well, you typically have that client for as long as you maintain your service. The corollary is that clients in that market can have quite some difficulty finding a suitable writer able and willing to take them on. The reason you don't see those writers advertising all the time isn't (as some people wrongly imagine) that there aren't any of them - in fact a few of them commonly post in all "these threads", every time the subject comes up: it's the fact that they tend to be as fully booked up as they want with regularly returning clients.

Is that so? How much does Nemanja Vidic get paid, again? ...

I think you should definitely charge more than that to begin with. I used to buy articles for 1$/100words and quite often I had to redo them completely. And I'm not even a native English speaker myself.

Of course it's not only about correct spelling, writing a compelling article is definitely not easy..

No, they are not rare.

There are many writers at or well above the $30 per article / content piece level. You just don't hear about them as much.

John.

Most writers are being paid a fair amount.

I keep seeing these threads and the Nr.1 question that most OP's should be asking is: dear buyer, why are you paying 25 bucks for one article and 5 bucks for another?

Here's a tip to all writers who feel they are being undercut by the 5 buck gang:

Stop thinking article and writer and focus on research and author

There are many levels of "writing" and, believe it or not, each currently has a adequate and fair pricetag.

I buy articles from the cheap as well as from the pricy range. What I buy depends on what I intend to do with the article. I buy cheap stuff for backlink purposes. That material will not end up on my own sites and I am perfectly happy to accept so-so quality because it is just manure for the fields.

Most writers in this category will market their services "including research". Here the buyer needs to understand that in this category, research means gathering a couple of basic facts and existing content and more or less mixing it up with lots of fluff. You can call it research but it is essentially just skimming the surface, not deep diving.

As a 5 buck scoop of manure to make my fields grow it is fine.

So, what is it about the 15 - 25 buck material that makes me buy it? Originality, research on a level that turns up facts and angles that feel new and fresh, complexity and voice. Less SEO and more SOUL.

This is content that provides value on a level which I am comfortable using as content on my own sites, or as part of a product. Material that I am willing to stand for with my biz. I will often add my own touch but what I got delivered was something that felt exclusive, custom made for me, on my topic, something that may entice readers to return to my site/service/product. Seeds rather than manure.

I think 15- 25 bucks is a great price for this kind of material. Many authors in this range could request 30+ bucks and I would still buy it.

25 bucks won't get you rocket science and even good writing is easy - quality research is harder. For me, that makes a huge difference. There may even be a couple of grammatical mistakes - that's fine by me as long as what I got had meat on its bones. Obviously, there are some topics that require no real research. This is where the author's voice make all the difference and I would want to see at least some glimmer of lore in there.

If you have established your rep and have a solid knack for self-promotion you could end up in the 100+ range but this is not an "article" anymore. In this range, I would assume you need to understand "branding" and that is something entirely different from "writing". I have little experience about this but guess that you would have to mature and evolve into this range, rather than step into it.

Anyway, most writers who feel they are being paid too little - perhaps you are undercutting yourself? Try stepping up into the next level. These buyers tend to be much more demanding though and you will find out if you have what it takes pretty quickly.

Some writers should step up. On the other hand, many writers think too much of themselves.. or at least of their content.

In the end - don't blame it on the buyers.

It is up to you as a writer to test the market and see how high you can go.

The problem is, article writing or any serious writing for income IS a career or business. I am glad the big players online are clamping down on these spun worthless articles.

Write as fast as you can, employ articles writers for pennies.. hurry up and try to get as many websites as you can out there on as many niches as possible - hoping one site will make money!

People are getting smarter to this type of crap marketing.

We want to come online and read "articles" not spun crap or people who obviously threw something simple together for Adsense earnings, people who can barely speak our language even in 30 words.. sucks!

500 words or not; you sit there and take a blank page, do the research and come up with an article that could possibly make someone $1,000's a year on their website for $5 an hour or less. Let's see how you would feel.

I'm sure you "get me".

I will definitely try this. I haven't tried the request feature.

When you write for $1 per 100 words it is torture indeed. Arguably worse than actual torture.

Agreed.

Why be at a $5 market when you know you'll get $5.

Be at $20 market or more, to get the amount you want.

You can start at $20 per 500 word article and go waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay higher too!