Have you had PayPal funds frozen?

39 replies
I'd love to hear how many people had funds frozen.

Please, if you read this thread, please vote so we can keep the stats accurate.

Appreciated.
#frozen #funds #paypal
  • Profile picture of the author Ben Gordon
    It never happened to me -- yet. I'm ready in case something like that does happen though and am secure so I'm not frightened .
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    • Profile picture of the author Spartan480
      Originally Posted by Ben Gordon View Post

      It never happened to me -- yet. I'm ready in case something like that does happen though and am secure so I'm not frightened .
      What measures are you taking to prepare and be secure if that happens? I hate PP but it's sort of a necessary evil since so many people/companies use it including here on the WF...
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      • Profile picture of the author Ben Gordon
        Originally Posted by Spartan480 View Post

        What measures are you taking to prepare and be secure if that happens? I hate PP but it's sort of a necessary evil since so many people/companies use it including here on the WF...
        Well, firstly you make sure that your business isn't fully based on PayPal. Make sure that monthly subscriptions completely stay away from PayPal. Use another payment processor for them -- perhaps 2Checkout or something along those lines. This way, if you're ever limited, all your subscriptions won't come to an end. The next step is finding a payment processor that you can easily switch to in case it happens. For example, set up a 2CO account and learn how they work. In case PayPal limits you, you will be able to easily switch all your websites to the 2CO payment processor.

        Obviously this is easier said than done, but preparing yourself for these situations really helps and minimizes your downtime as well as maximizes your earnings.
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        • Profile picture of the author Manie Amari
          Originally Posted by Ben Gordon View Post

          Well, firstly you make sure that your business isn't fully based on PayPal. Make sure that monthly subscriptions completely stay away from PayPal. Use another payment processor for them -- perhaps 2Checkout or something along those lines. This way, if you're ever limited, all your subscriptions won't come to an end. The next step is finding a payment processor that you can easily switch to in case it happens. For example, set up a 2CO account and learn how they work. In case PayPal limits you, you will be able to easily switch all your websites to the 2CO payment processor.

          Obviously this is easier said than done, but preparing yourself for these situations really helps and minimizes your downtime as well as maximizes your earnings.
          Good points! May I add avoid using PP for split payments processes. Apparently this can raise flags no your account. It's never happened to me but I have heard other marketers have had their accounts frozen because of this.
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  • Profile picture of the author nicheblogger75
    I think it's happened to more than 50% of Internet Marketers. I long for the day when a payment processor emerges that strictly caters to Internet Marketers who provide digital downloads. My biggest fear is losing my Paypal account, and it's something that is almost always on my mind. Nobody should have the power to tear food from your mouth and bury your hopes and dreams, but Paypal does.

    ***UPDATE***

    Just found a payment processor/merchant account that caters to Internet Marketers. It's called 1ShoppingCart:

    http://www.1shoppingcart.com/


    AWESOME!
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    • Profile picture of the author WillR
      Originally Posted by nicheblogger75 View Post

      I think it's happened to more than 50% of Internet Marketers.
      You're kidding, right? Where on earth are you getting these stats from?!

      I would bet everything I have that the number is WELL below 5%.

      As with anything in life, the only people you ever hear from are the ones having problems. You don't see the thousands and thousands of other Internet Marketers who have never had an issue with Paypal starting threads about how great Paypal is because no one does that.

      If you really think the number is up around 50% then you are wayyyyy off... which is actually a good thing to be wrong about.

      You might think you see a couple of threads in the Warrior Forum every week from people who have had their account limited. But compare that to the thousands and thousands of other Warrior Forum members who use Paypal and never have a problem. The proportion of problems is absolutely tiny. It's just because they are publicized that you think there are so many of them.

      I'm not really sure what this thread is set out to achieve? Does knowing how many people have had problems stop me or anyone else from having problems in the future? It would probably be more worthwhile asking those who have had issues how they resolved them.

      The subject line of this thread is also a LOT more appealing to someone who has had problems with their Paypal account so they are going to be the majority of people who open this thread -- thus the numbers you get will be way off reality, as they appear to be already.
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      • Profile picture of the author Ord Allenbea
        I would take you up on that bet because the number is way above 5%, this problem is in more than just internet marketing. There are thousands upon thousands of coders, website developers, graphic designers, content writers, and more that have had the same problems.

        Everyone seems to try and blame the lockdowns to Internet Marketing and large launches only. This is not true. If joe shmo gets sued and 50 people with that same name live in the same state, guess what happens ? Paypal will freeze all the accounts because unless the sued party has released his social security number to the courts, paypal has no idea which joe shmo has been sued.

        So paypal is presented with a court order that has a name and location, so how do they know which account to freeze ?? This is just one example by the way because the problem is far bigger than this.

        I do not use paypal nor do I have any desire to use them but I know many honest businesses and individuals that have lost their funds and livelihoods.
        Originally Posted by WillR View Post

        You're kidding, right? Where on earth are you getting these stats from?!

        I would bet everything I have that the number is WELL below 5%.

        As with anything in life, the only people you ever hear from are the ones having problems. You don't see the thousands and thousands of other Internet Marketers who have never had an issue with Paypal starting threads about how great Paypal is because no one does that.

        If you really think the number is up around 50% then you are wayyyyy off... which is actually a good thing to be wrong about.

        You might think you see a couple of threads in the Warrior Forum every week from people who have had their account limited. But compare that to the thousands and thousands of other Warrior Forum members who use Paypal and never have a problem. The proportion of problems is absolutely tiny. It's just because they are publicized that you think there are so many of them.

        I'm not really sure what this thread is set out to achieve? Does knowing how many people have had problems stop me or anyone else from having problems in the future? It would probably be more worthwhile asking those who have had issues how they resolved them.

        The subject line of this thread is also a LOT more appealing to someone who has had problems with their Paypal account so they are going to be the majority of people who open this thread -- thus the numbers you get will be way off reality, as they appear to be already.
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  • Profile picture of the author chad3623wiley
    not me I dont make enough as it
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    • Profile picture of the author Kim Phoenix
      What are the reasons why PP freezes someone's account?
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      • Profile picture of the author Elluminati
        Originally Posted by Kim Phoenix View Post

        What are the reasons why PP freezes someone's account?
        It has happened to me, I'm guessing because I didn't add a backup payment method right away. They sent a message saying my funds would be held temporarily because I was "high risk!" I wasn't really tripping because I was using other payment methods more at the time.
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  • Profile picture of the author danlew
    It never happened to me. The only thing that really happened to my Paypal account is that they set it to limited status because I've logged in from another country (since I often travel to both Thailand and Australia).
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  • Profile picture of the author jacktackett
    I know plenty of folks who have had their accounts frozen. I've never had it happen to me but I am proactive and will alert Paypal to any launches I'm doing. Plus I do leave some $$$ in my account to pay for various on going fees.
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  • Profile picture of the author BestSEO
    All they really want is ID to show your a really who you say you are and to cover their asses!
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  • Profile picture of the author nicheblogger75
    Building a business around Paypal is precarious at best. the fcat that they can just crush your life and make you lose your home and possibly end up on the street by shutting down your business is scary.

    You need to have a backup already in place when the day comes (and it will come) that you lose your Paypal account for one reason or another.

    They hate marketers I think, or they consider us a big risk for some reason.
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  • Profile picture of the author MobApps
    It hasn't happened to me yet but I hear about it all the time in the IM world.
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  • Profile picture of the author Silas Hart
    I come from the eCommerce world, that when someone including my students says something about their PayPal accounts being frozen, I unfortunately lack empathy because I've gone through the process all too often. When it came to large amounts, I've always got my money back. When I didn't, it was because it wasn't worth chasing after.

    It took a while for my stubborn head to realize that there were better ways to go about collecting payments. Right now, I'm loving Dwolla. I also love my regular ol merchant and PayFlow Pro which allows me to accept PayPal. It feels like once I finally figured out what PayPal Really wanted from me, I was able to say "eh, I'll bring my ball and play in that other court, thanks though!"

    I said it in another thread today, PayPal is like traveling cross country on a bicycle. It's possible, but isn't practical unless you really need it to be.
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  • Profile picture of the author celente
    had my account frozen twice, two big launches, that I did with the help of some super affliates.

    I have to say that paypal were good about it, and thought I was smuggling drugs or something LOL. But they are a great group to work with. Called them up at like 2am in the morning (as I live in oz) and problem solved. But I have heard some horror stories. So just be careful.
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  • Profile picture of the author Praney Behl
    I get that alot actually. Mostly my Paypal payments are $3000 or above. And they just seem to randomly freeze the payment and my current balance, even though its a usual thing.

    So far its been 6 times, and can't tell how much I hate it.
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  • Profile picture of the author ryanmilligan
    Banned
    A tip for those who this might happen to:

    Don't think it is safe to just take all the money out of your paypal. They actually have the right to take the money straight back out of your bank account if they want. Plus if everytime you get some money in your account you are withdrawing it, that seems a little strange to me. So it will definatly raise their red flags.
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    • Profile picture of the author nicheblogger75
      Originally Posted by ryanmilligan View Post

      A tip for those who this might happen to:

      Don't think it is safe to just take all the money out of your paypal. They actually have the right to take the money straight back out of your bank account if they want. Plus if everytime you get some money in your account you are withdrawing it, that seems a little strange to me. So it will definatly raise their red flags.
      Why is that strange? It's your money. So what if you are withdrawing it every day? That's what I don't like about them. They automatically think you are into shady behavior if you do certtain things when they are actually innocent.

      I've also read several Paypal guides that state you should never leave more than $500 in there unless you are prepared to lose it at any time. I usually siphon off every day and have been doing so for almost 5 years without incident. So I doubt that frequent withdrawals are really a trigger.

      They are more concerned with frequent, larger size deposits.

      I didn't know that they could go into your bank account. That's scary.

      The fix there is to open a bank account just to link to Paypal and keep like only $100 in it at all times. This way if they decide siphon off your income you only lose $100.

      Best fix yet: Dump them before they dump you...
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      • Profile picture of the author WillR
        Originally Posted by nicheblogger75 View Post

        Why is that strange? It's your money. So what if you are withdrawing it every day?
        Paypal has a 45 day period where people can contest purchases they have made with you. This means until that time period is up, any one of your customers can claim an unauthorized or not as described transaction and get their money back.

        If you have run off with all your money then you become a HUGE risk to Paypal. If half of your customers come claiming the product is not as described then all of a sudden Paypal has to foot the bill to give everyone back their money since you emptied out your account. Do you think they are going to cop that? Hell no.

        So yes, removing large amounts of money from your account just after you received them does make you a higher risk to Paypal and is much more likely to get frozen or limited. Besides, it's not what a normal business who has nothing to hide would do.
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    • Profile picture of the author Elluminati
      Originally Posted by ryanmilligan View Post

      A tip for those who this might happen to:

      Don't think it is safe to just take all the money out of your paypal. They actually have the right to take the money straight back out of your bank account if they want. Plus if everytime you get some money in your account you are withdrawing it, that seems a little strange to me. So it will definatly raise their red flags.

      Why is it strange that you take your own money out as often as you get paid? I'm sure it does raise red flags, but I do it because I've also had my PP account hacked into by a 16 year old kid from Australia and had hell getting it back to normalcy. Ever since then, I make sure I transfer most of it. That's just me because I feel better about it, and I haven't PP tripping with me about...?
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      • Profile picture of the author WillR
        Originally Posted by Elluminati View Post

        Why is it strange that you take your own money out as often as you get paid? I'm sure it does raise red flags, but I do it because I've also had my PP account hacked into by a 16 year old kid from Australia and had hell getting it back to normalcy. Ever since then, I make sure I transfer most of it. That's just me because I feel better about it, and I haven't PP tripping with me about...?
        Because Paypal no longer have any money to cover your refunds, chargebacks, disputes, etc. You then become a BIG risk to Paypal when you take your money out as quickly as you earn it. I would always leave at least 30% of what you earn in your account at least until 45 days after those sales were made.

        That's if you want to send a message to Paypal that you are a serious business. It's not to say other things won't get your account frozen but you want to minimize the risk as much as possible and removing all your money is one tactic that is only going to cause you problems.
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  • Profile picture of the author Nikolas
    I got limited when my account reached 6k (euro)

    This is something common in Europe, and after that you have to provide PayPal with all the legal documents that justify your business and identify you.
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  • Profile picture of the author EricHall
    I had it happen to me because they claimed I was negative on another paypal account. They claimed I had two accounts which I did not have. Spent several days yelling at them about it. They would not open my account until the second one was paid. I tried my best but in the end I had to pay the second account off.
    When there is trouble Paypal is hard to deal with. They can be a real pain!!
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  • Profile picture of the author GeorgR.
    I "almost" had my account limited (not frozen) once since i ran into trouble with matching the EXACT name on the account with the name on our utility bill.

    (Here in Spain, people have TWO (!) last names....so this how the name appeared on our utility bill. The name on the PP account of course only had a normal name like first name,last name).

    I uploaded a TON of scans and documents and started to freak out since i seemed not to be able to convince them that this is indeed my name due to the name different on the scan of the bill.

    Then i read all those horror stories about customer service and how hard it is to talk to them etc.... but after some emails and documents emailed forth and back they put my account back in normal standing without me having to call, so i could convince them that's indeed my name on the bill. But it freaked me a out a little especially if most of your biz depends on them.
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  • Profile picture of the author Eduard Stinga
    I think I already said this story twice today, in different topics.

    I personally had my account "frozen" for a few days. When I first started using it I only had few and small payments, so nothing important. Once I reached a certain amount (I don't remember exactly), something like $3k of transactions in a year, they wanted to "verify" me. So I sent the documents they requested and boom, everything went back to normal.

    As Will has been trying to explain, they have nothing against you and they're not stealing the food from your mouth, they're just doing it to protect their own business. Just go to any bank and see if they'll just let you open an account without any documents and let money go through it.

    Plus, even if they freeze your account, from what I know, you can withdraw your money after 180 days. I might be wrong though, I'm not sure.
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  • Profile picture of the author hmartin90
    I wanted to chime in on this. I used to work for a money transfer service and it was a pain at times. It is the regulations that make is so hard for them to do business and offer fast effective services to their customers. I know that companies like PP can also be to blame with their own policies, but often it is not them but the regulations that rule over them.
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  • Profile picture of the author Josh MacDonald
    26 people have claimed to have money frozen!
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    • Profile picture of the author Jon Patrick
      Originally Posted by WillR

      The subject line of this thread is also a LOT more appealing to someone who has had problems with their Paypal account so they are going to be the majority of people who open this thread -- thus the numbers you get will be way off reality, as they appear to be already.
      Therein lies the problem with this kind of poll. While I have had Paypal troubles myself (which I was fortunately able to deal with), and would love to know the numbers behinds the scenes when it comes to account flagging/limitation, I just don't think we can get an accurate picture of things this way, sadly.
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  • Profile picture of the author Josh MacDonald
    Either way, that's still a good portion of accounts.
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    • Profile picture of the author iAmNameLess
      Originally Posted by nicheblogger75 View Post

      I think it's happened to more than 50% of Internet Marketers. I long for the day when a payment processor emerges that strictly caters to Internet Marketers who provide digital downloads. My biggest fear is losing my Paypal account, and it's something that is almost always on my mind. Nobody should have the power to tear food from your mouth and bury your hopes and dreams, but Paypal does.

      ***UPDATE***

      Just found a payment processor/merchant account that caters to Internet Marketers. It's called 1ShoppingCart:

      Shopping Cart & Ecommerce Software - 1ShoppingCart.com


      AWESOME!
      That is incorrect. Having funds FROZEN only happens to .5% of all paypal accounts. If your funds are FROZEN they can hold it up to 6 months and it is usually the risk department that decides that they don't want to do business with you because you either have a high refund ratio, chargebacks, or don't acknowledge disputes.

      There are many differences between a frozen account, basic limitations and the 18 day limitation.

      Also, 1shoppingcart is garbage and one of the biggest rip offs in the industry. You guys always trash paypal, but you know that they have the lowest percentage of account freezes in the industry?

      Originally Posted by Kim Phoenix View Post

      What are the reasons why PP freezes someone's account?
      For example... if you do around $1,000-$2,000/mo for 6 months and then you all of a sudden start doing $7,000 a month, that is enough for a brief limitation. It isn't an account freeze just a limitation and you will need to send in your ID.

      It also happens when you have a high refund rate and if there is a high ratio of disputes per transactions.

      Originally Posted by WillR View Post

      You're kidding, right? Where on earth are you getting these stats from?!

      I would bet everything I have that the number is WELL below 5%.
      Yeah, right on. The exact number is between .5-1%. There are so many users on paypal, and it is usually only the internet marketing crowd and various ecommerce platforms that ever experience a problem with paypal.

      Originally Posted by nicheblogger75 View Post

      Building a business around Paypal is precarious at best. the fcat that they can just crush your life and make you lose your home and possibly end up on the street by shutting down your business is scary.

      You need to have a backup already in place when the day comes (and it will come) that you lose your Paypal account for one reason or another.

      They hate marketers I think, or they consider us a big risk for some reason.
      No, they LOVE marketers. They HATE chargebacks, refunds, disputes that go unattended. If you have a product and you sell 20 copies and 15 are refunds, you have a problem. It flags their system.

      There is a big difference between a frozen account and brief limitations. Good call though, definitely don't build your business around paypal alone. It is always good to have a back up in processing payments.

      Originally Posted by celente View Post

      had my account frozen twice, two big launches, that I did with the help of some super affliates.

      I have to say that paypal were good about it, and thought I was smuggling drugs or something LOL. But they are a great group to work with. Called them up at like 2am in the morning (as I live in oz) and problem solved. But I have heard some horror stories. So just be careful.
      I think they might have more strict triggers for those outside the USA. Big launches definitely can get your account limited. I don't think your account was frozen, if it were you wouldn't have experienced it the second time, they would have just closed your account after 180 days.

      If you sign up for a business account and the average amount you say you will process is 2k/mo and then you end up doing 8k one month, its suspicious and they flag you and you're limited for up to a 18 days and need to send in your ID, or invoices to the client, or proof work has been started.

      Originally Posted by Josh MacDonald View Post

      Either way, that's still a good portion of accounts.
      Not really. Paypal is far less than any other online processor. Paypal has the most users but the lowest % of account freezes.
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    • Profile picture of the author Centurian
      My good friend Eduard Stinga is correct. The hair trigger on account seizures is PayPal must guarantee refunds.

      VISA and MasterCard rules require this, but not how PayPal runs their business.

      The internet is full of complaints with PayPal. Two top-tier affiliates on this forum had over $20,000 each frozen. Even though there were never any previous problems, complaints, or refund requests, it took two months to get one of the accounts back.

      Even Sheriff Richard Mac had $46,000 frozen. Another offline business had $30,000 seized for over six months. Another guy I know had $1,600 frozen even though the buyer verified there was no problem with the furniture he bought through a Craigslist ad. It goes on. I've helped a few fellow warriors fix this before.

      Yes, there are plenty of people online who have no problems. There are some very reputable warriors who are advising you how to maintain good relations with PayPal. You do have to manage your relationship.

      PayPal promotes it's Buyer Guarantee for online security. But they build their reputation and their business on your back. That's the weak link for you. The primary problem is because of a flaw in their business model. It's not their problem, but it's yours.

      They "keep" your money for you and you have to have permission to get it.

      Your money belongs in your bank, not theirs. This protects them, not you. According to their terms of service, they can freeze your account and hold your money for up to half a year.

      The key is never bank your business on PayPal. At least have a back-up plan. Get online and start looking for a reputable bankcard account that is underwritten upfront especially for your business model. Don't wait to find out until it's too late they don't like you or what you do.

      PayPal is not a bank and does not have to abide by federal banking laws that give you normal rights to access your money.

      I've been in the financial sector since 1988 and been watching this crap on the forum for too long.

      I have reputable banks lined up with ecommerce accounts to fix this for anyone who wants to fund directly to their own local bank account. Plus you can cut 20% to 50% off PayPal or 2CO fees.
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      • Profile picture of the author MarcWalton
        I only use paypal to buy products and receive smaller amounts of money. A client of mine had his account frozen 3 times (the last time for $17.000 for 11 months). His clients were told by paypal that his account was frozen which of course freaked them out, it did serious damage to his business at a critical stage in his IM career.

        If you want to read some true horror stories then just google "paypal problems" something like 100 million pages on the subject

        On the other hand another client has a big six figure business all done via paypal, BUT he spent months going through dozens of letters, paperwork, legal documents. So perhaps the solution is if you are going to use them then jump through all the hoops when you open the account. If you are in IM you can have periods of little or no activity followed by BIG amounts. THAT is what freaks, paypal, banks, money transfer people as they are all terrified of being accused of aiding money launderers, Marc
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  • Profile picture of the author Genycis
    I never went through this before at all, thank Goodness! But then, chances are, if I'm making in the upper 4 figures, or even 5 figures, better believe I'm transferring as I make to my BANK and not going to leave it sit in there. I'll leave some for reinvesting, but I won't be sitting on a 6 figure income and leaving it in there, that's for sure.
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    • Profile picture of the author colinaudie
      They only freeze it if you do not follow their rules regarding certain things like large influx of money is one. You need to inform them of such things its logical.
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  • Profile picture of the author MilesT
    I used to get regular, $10,000 deposits into my PayPal account and never had a problem, and those were coming from both the US and Canada. I've never had a problem with them even with launches and recurring payments etc. I do know my time is coming and I'm prepared to do battle, but I think as long as you stay proactive with your money (which you should) and inform PayPal (who is your partner) about the goings on in your account and what they should expect during a launch or whatever, your account should be fine.
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  • Profile picture of the author gojiberryman
    The two main reasons why paypal would ever freeze your account is for one, you make huge paydays on a weekly basis. And secondly, they may do it because they feel that there is some other kind if fraudulent activity going on with your account.
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  • Profile picture of the author Josh MacDonald
    WillR, certainly above 5%.
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