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I.M Game Changer: Brass B*lls vs. Wimp Wrist Guarantees

by The Niche Man
35 replies
Today guarantees continue as the bedrock of most offers. Most still go the routine path. For example, 30, 60 or 100% money back (yawn).

Ironically, you hear most marketers brag about over-delivering (giving more than expected). But for some reason they ignore over-delivering when it comes to their guarantee. Hmm!

In my experience a brass b*lls guarantee can ...

- Make you stand out.
- Increase credibility over competitors.
- Nudge on-the-fence prospects to buy.

In my opinion a brass b*lls guarantee should make others think at least one of the following:

1. Your guarantee could attract scammers!
2. You have deep pockets!
3.You must really believe in your product to risk making that guarantee!

Here's a few successful examples:

Hampton Hotels:
The "100% Hampton Guarantee" - If you're not 100% Satisfied ... We Don't Expect You To Pay!

Hammacher Schlemmer:
Lifetime Guarantee ... Unconditional... Unwavering

Saddleback Leather Company:
All of our products are fully warranted against all defects in materials and workmanship for 100 years. If you or one of your descendants should have a problem, send it back to me or one of my descendants and we'll repair or replace it for free or we'll give you a credit.

I've had products and services where a brass b*lls guarantee increased sales and a few where it didn't. The only way to tell is to ... test it.
#balls #brass #changer #game #guarantees #wimp #wrist
  • Profile picture of the author MidlandsMarketer
    In theory, this isn't a bad idea.

    However, before doing anything like this the risk certainly has to be weighed up against the reward. How many more sales is doing something like this really going to get you?

    Done right this kind of strategy may demonstrate confidence in your product/service and attract interest from more skeptical buyers. Done badly, though, and you can end up in all kinds of trouble. Only the other day I saw a thread on here where someone had offered a guarantee that they couldn't live up to and came in for all kinds of flack from others, and I imagine a fair amount of sales were lost. On top of this, the reputation damage can harm your earnings for the future.

    By all means if you can afford to, 'test' this strategy. DO NOT do it, however, if you can't afford to fulfill the guarantee for every single customer in a worse case scenario.
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    • Profile picture of the author The Niche Man
      Originally Posted by MidlandsMarketer View Post

      In theory, this isn't a bad idea.

      However, before doing anything like this the risk certainly has to be weighed up against the reward. How many more sales is doing something like this really going to get you?

      Done right this kind of strategy may demonstrate confidence in your product/service and attract interest from more skeptical buyers. Done badly, though, and you can end up in all kinds of trouble. Only the other day I saw a thread on here where someone had offered a guarantee that they couldn't live up to and came in for all kinds of flack from others, and I imagine a fair amount of sales were lost. On top of this, the reputation damage can harm your earnings for the future.

      By all means if you can afford to, 'test' this strategy. DO NOT do it, however, if you can't afford to fulfill the guarantee for every single customer in a worse case scenario.
      Those are good points. No one should do this if they can't live up to the guarantee. This is for real players ... not posers!
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      • Profile picture of the author Premier Plugins
        Originally Posted by The Niche Man View Post

        Those are good points. No one should do this if they can't live up to the guarantee. This is for real players ... not posers!
        Vast majority of forum immediately excluded, including myself. hehe.
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  • Profile picture of the author jacksonlin
    I disagree. Some people enjoy abusing the refund guarantee. I've even had people saying "why does it matter if I try your course, it's a guaranteed refund".

    Sighs....
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    • Profile picture of the author Romeo90
      Originally Posted by jacksonlin View Post

      I disagree. Some people enjoy abusing the refund guarantee. I've even had people saying "why does it matter if I try your course, it's a guaranteed refund".

      Sighs....
      Yes they do indeed. One purchaser of my eBook asked for a refund shortly after purchase.

      They told me they read the eBook right through, but it wasn't for them, and asked for a refund.

      When i asked why it wasn't for them, they replied saying 'Look, not got time to explain, I wanted to read it and in my eyes its free as you have a refund guarantee so give me back my money'

      I asked if they purchased my book in physical form, from Barnes or Waterstones, would they read it then take it back for a refund. I have not had a reply yet.
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    • Profile picture of the author The Niche Man
      Originally Posted by jacksonlin View Post

      I disagree. Some people enjoy abusing the refund guarantee. I've even had people saying "why does it matter if I try your course, it's a guaranteed refund".

      Sighs....
      Yes, a guarantee can be a scammer magnet.

      But if you had 100 sales and 10 returns with a guarantee.

      -or

      No guarantee and 50 sales which would you choose?


      I'd at least test it ,if you could, and let the market decide for your specific product.
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      • Profile picture of the author cjreynolds
        Originally Posted by The Niche Man View Post

        I'd at least test it ,if you could, and let the market decide for your specific product.
        I still consider myself somewhat of a clueless newbie, but I think this is the crux of the matter. You don't know if your niche really wants a guarantee, or if it really doesn't matter to them.

        I personally don't care about a $7 or $20 item - if I can't afford to take a chance on a $7 report, I probably shouldn't be tryin to start a business. But I really wouldn't buy a high-dollar product in the MMO niche unless i knew I could say "no thanks" if it turned out to be rubbish.

        Point is, to know for sure, you would have to test it on you own niche - if you haven't tried selling a product to your niche without a guarantee, you can't really know if it will increase your conversions. If you haven't tried selling one to your niche with a guarantee (or a "Brass Balls" guarantee), the same applies. You can't really know.
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        • Profile picture of the author The Niche Man
          Originally Posted by cjreynolds View Post

          I still consider myself somewhat of a clueless newbie, but I think this is the crux of the matter. You don't know if your niche really wants a guarantee, or if it really doesn't matter to them.

          I personally don't care about a $7 or $20 item - if I can't afford to take a chance on a $7 report, I probably shouldn't be tryin to start a business. But I really wouldn't buy a high-dollar product in the MMO niche unless i knew I could say "no thanks" if it turned out to be rubbish.

          Point is, to know for sure, you would have to test it on you own niche - if you haven't tried selling a product to your niche without a guarantee, you can't really know if it will increase your conversions. If you haven't tried selling one to your niche with a guarantee (or a "Brass Balls" guarantee), the same applies. You can't really know.
          That wisdom and common sense overshadows your self-described newbie status. Couldn't have said it better.
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  • Profile picture of the author travlinguy
    I don't see guarantees as the bedrock of anything. Quality stuff is.
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    • Profile picture of the author The Niche Man
      Originally Posted by travlinguy View Post

      I don't see guarantees as the bedrock of anything. Quality stuff is.
      I agree quality is vital, but try selling it without a guarantee behind it, especially online. Good luck.
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      • Profile picture of the author Joseph Robinson
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        Originally Posted by The Niche Man View Post

        I agree quality is vital, but try selling it without a guarantee behind it, especially online. Good luck.
        As stated earlier in this thread:

        My no refund policy works great. Does not hurt sales. And no BS refund requests because they know up front no refunds.

        Many other well known marketers do this. Big Mike comes to mind immediately.
        Plenty do, and it works just fine.
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      • Profile picture of the author travlinguy
        Originally Posted by The Niche Man View Post

        I agree quality is vital, but try selling it without a guarantee behind it, especially online. Good luck.
        I've sold many wholesale PLR and MRR product packages on this forum without guarantees. In fact, the disclaimer below is on all my PLR and MRR stuff:

        NOTE: Because of the nature of Private Label Rights Products and the sheer number of items in this offer at the LOW, LOW price, there will be no refunds given on this sale. Your questions are welcomed.
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        • Profile picture of the author The Niche Man
          Originally Posted by travlinguy View Post

          I've sold many wholesale PLR and MRR product packages on this forum without guarantees. In fact, the disclaimer below is on all my PLR and MRR stuff:

          NOTE: Because of the nature of Private Label Rights Products and the sheer number of items in this offer at the LOW, LOW price, there will be no refunds given on this sale. Your questions are welcomed.
          I understand your policy when it comes to wholesale PLR products. It it would be hard to have that same or similar policy selling retail software, electronics or clothing, for example.
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  • Profile picture of the author Tim_Carter
    Selling on the back of a guarantee is Chicken sh#$ selling.
    You need to sell on the strength of the product.

    My no refund policy works great. Does not hurt sales. And no BS refund requests because they know up front no refunds.

    Many other well known marketers do this. Big Mike comes to mind immediately.

    So my advice is to try no refunds. You could give a sample or a trial to entice buyers. It does not have to be a guaranteed refund. That attracts the scammers. Especially in this industry.
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    • Profile picture of the author Joseph Robinson
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      Originally Posted by travlinguy View Post

      I don't see guarantees as the bedrock of anything. Quality stuff is.
      Exactly. I'm immediately suspicious of a product that goes crazy with their "guarantees". If you don't feel the strength of your product is enough to convince me, then you should probably go work some more on the product.

      Originally Posted by Tim_Carter View Post

      Selling on the back of a guarantee is Chicken sh#$ selling.
      You need to sell on the strength of the product.

      My no refund policy works great. Does not hurt sales. And no BS refund requests because they know up front no refunds.

      Many other well known marketers do this. Big Mike comes to mind immediately.

      So my advice is to try no refunds. You could give a sample or a trial to entice buyers. It does not have to be a guaranteed refund. That attracts the scammers. Especially in this industry.
      This too. If we want to talk brass balls, don't offer a refund. Man up and say your product is good enough plain and simple. Those who don't want it can walk away.
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      • Profile picture of the author travlinguy
        Originally Posted by Joe Robinson View Post

        Exactly. I'm immediately suspicious of a product that goes crazy with their "guarantees". If you don't feel the strength of your product is enough to convince me, then you should probably go work some more on the product.



        This too. If we want to talk brass balls, don't offer a refund. Man up and say your product is good enough plain and simple. Those who don't want it can walk away.
        Look at any marketing survey going back 100 years or more. People buy based on what a product will do for them. Guarantees are okay but ask people why they bought something and I'd bet fewer than 5% will say they bought it for the guarantee. Does the guarantee sometimes help them make a decision? For some people, yeah.

        In online marketing guarantees are more important because folks are naturally suspicious about many of the claims made, especially for MMO and related stuff. Some people in this arena do buy for the guarantee alone. Many do it so they can immediately use it to get their money back and buy another MMO product.
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        • Profile picture of the author The Niche Man
          Originally Posted by travlinguy View Post

          Look at any marketing survey going back 100 years or more. People buy based on what a product will do for them. Guarantees are okay but ask people why they bought something and I'd bet fewer than 5% will say they bought it for the guarantee. Does the guarantee sometimes help them make a decision? For some people, yeah.

          In online marketing guarantees are more important because folks are naturally suspicious about many of the claims made, especially for MMO and related stuff. Some people in this arena do buy for the guarantee alone. Many do it so they can immediately use it to get their money back and buy another MMO product.
          You're 100% spot on. I personally have never bought a product based solely on the guararantee alone. But it helped to tip me to buy when I was on the fence and all other things were equal.

          I personally think twice about buying a product with no guarantee of what they said in the sales letter or ad is true. Especially if their competitiors offer a guarantee. That's just me.
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          • Profile picture of the author Joseph Robinson
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            Originally Posted by The Niche Man View Post

            You're 100% spot on. I personally have never bought a product based solely on the gurarantee alone. But it helped to tip me to buy when I was on the fence and all other things were equal. I personally think twice about buying a product with no guarantee of what they said in the sales letter or ad is true. That's just me.
            Product creators have a nice work around for that: don't promise anything outlandish/hype-filled/fake/stupid in your Sales letter :rolleyes:. It's amazing how being straightforward with people often does more towards building trust in you and your product.
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      • Profile picture of the author The Niche Man
        Originally Posted by Joe Robinson View Post

        Exactly. I'm immediately suspicious of a product that goes crazy with their "guarantees". If you don't feel the strength of your product is enough to convince me, then you should probably go work some more on the product.



        This too. If we want to talk brass balls, don't offer a refund. Man up and say your product is good enough plain and simple. Those who don't want it can walk away.
        Interesting marketing philosophy.
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    • Profile picture of the author atvking
      Originally Posted by Tim_Carter View Post

      Selling on the back of a guarantee is Chicken sh#$ selling.
      You need to sell on the strength of the product.

      My no refund policy works great. Does not hurt sales. And no BS refund requests because they know up front no refunds.

      Many other well known marketers do this. Big Mike comes to mind immediately.

      So my advice is to try no refunds. You could give a sample or a trial to entice buyers. It does not have to be a guaranteed refund. That attracts the scammers. Especially in this industry.
      Exactly! I have stopped giving refunds completely and it has not hurt my custom motorbike part sales one little bit! There are more and more self entitled ass@#@# out there than ever and the "everything on the net is free" mentality is becoming overwhelming.

      This advice may not be for everybody but for me it works great!
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    • Profile picture of the author The Niche Man
      Originally Posted by Tim_Carter View Post

      Selling on the back of a guarantee is Chicken sh#$ selling.
      You need to sell on the strength of the product.

      My no refund policy works great. Does not hurt sales. And no BS refund requests because they know up front no refunds.

      Many other well known marketers do this. Big Mike comes to mind immediately.

      So my advice is to try no refunds. You could give a sample or a trial to entice buyers. It does not have to be a guaranteed refund. That attracts the scammers. Especially in this industry.
      Interesting experience. I've marketed custom-made products with no refunds, but I've yet to do it with online products.
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    • Profile picture of the author The Niche Man
      Originally Posted by Tim_Carter View Post

      Selling on the back of a guarantee is Chicken sh#$ selling.
      You need to sell on the strength of the product.

      My no refund policy works great. Does not hurt sales. And no BS refund requests because they know up front no refunds.

      Many other well known marketers do this. Big Mike comes to mind immediately.

      So my advice is to try no refunds. You could give a sample or a trial to entice buyers. It does not have to be a guaranteed refund. That attracts the scammers. Especially in this industry.
      I'm not sure if your blanket statement and advice would be effective for everyone.

      For example, if someone you don't know asked you to spend your money for a product you've never tried, many people would call not having a guarantee Chicken sh#$ selling.

      So, I quess it's all a matter of perspective.
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    • Profile picture of the author braincandy7
      I agree. Our membership has a no refund policy. Once you have paid you are paid up until the end of your monthly period you can chose to use the services and resources or not.

      It has not hurt conversions at all. In fact in our case taking away the free trial and replacing it with a "try it for 7 days @ x price", which isn't actually a discount as such just a smaller commitment, has actually increased long term membership as people who pay tend to take action and get involved.

      Once they start using the services and talking to us they realize the value that we offer and become longer term members.



      Originally Posted by Tim_Carter View Post

      Selling on the back of a guarantee is Chicken sh#$ selling.
      You need to sell on the strength of the product.

      My no refund policy works great. Does not hurt sales. And no BS refund requests because they know up front no refunds.

      Many other well known marketers do this. Big Mike comes to mind immediately.

      So my advice is to try no refunds. You could give a sample or a trial to entice buyers. It does not have to be a guaranteed refund. That attracts the scammers. Especially in this industry.
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  • Profile picture of the author Robbie B
    There's 2 things get me thinking on it

    1. Your guarantee could attract scammers!
    3.You must really believe in your product to risk making that guarantee!
    It's weighing out the 2 to find out which is suitable.

    If it's in the IM arena, then I'd imagine there's a lot of folks would pounce and take advantage.

    On the other hand, believing in your product is really hard to convey online, I think. People need to know you before you can say you stand behind it 100%.

    Doesn't make it valuable.

    Good advice though. Test it and find out. I've nothing on the market. Well, services. Ghostwriting, that I'm about to open again. Never did money back guarantees before and I don't think I'll start.

    Too many people can take advantage and I reckon it'll be an expensive test to find out.

    Probably further down the line when I get things off and running.
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  • Profile picture of the author Randall Magwood
    I offer a 12-month money back guarantee. Is that brass enough?
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    • Profile picture of the author The Niche Man
      Originally Posted by Randall Magwood View Post

      I offer a 12-month money back guarantee. Is that brass enough?
      Your market will let you know!
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    • Profile picture of the author theemperor
      Originally Posted by Randall Magwood View Post

      I offer a 12-month money back guarantee. Is that brass enough?
      Not even close - I want to buy your ebook for $7 max and if I am not satisfied I want a full refund plus a domesticated elephant from Phuket delivered to my house.
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  • Profile picture of the author WebPen
    I think that the IM and ebook market is a lot different than most.

    Some IMers buy stuff all the time- if they "dont think it's for them", they ask for a refund. (yes, I did it a few times early on- not proud of it)

    But 99% of people don't try to abuse guarantees like that.

    Even if 5% do abuse the guarantee- if your conversion rate jumps up say 10% from an amazing guarantee, it's well worth it.

    Its a numbers game.
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    • Profile picture of the author The Niche Man
      Originally Posted by Justin Stowe View Post

      I think that the IM and ebook market is a lot different than most.

      Some IMers buy stuff all the time- if they "dont think it's for them", they ask for a refund. (yes, I did it a few times early on- not proud of it)

      But 99% of people don't try to abuse guarantees like that.

      Even if 5% do abuse the guarantee- if your conversion rate jumps up say 10% from an amazing guarantee, it's well worth it.

      Its a numbers game.
      You're right, it's all about the arithmatic!
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  • Profile picture of the author The Niche Man
    Here's an interesting pros and cons article on this subject.
    Guarantee or No Guarantee
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  • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
    Try pulling the guarantee from your offers entirely. Don't change it; continue to honour the same guarantee you always had. Just take it down, so nobody's using it to make their buy decision.

    And take a look at how much it doesn't matter on your bottom line.
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    • Profile picture of the author The Niche Man
      Originally Posted by CDarklock View Post

      Try pulling the guarantee from your offers entirely. Don't change it; continue to honour the same guarantee you always had. Just take it down, so nobody's using it to make their buy decision.

      And take a look at how much it doesn't matter on your bottom line.
      Interesting. Are you talking about wholesale products or retail products? I've tested both and noticed the result you described selling wholesale products at times.

      But I haven't had those results consistently marketing retail. But I guess it depends on what your selling, the market and the offer.
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      • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
        Originally Posted by The Niche Man View Post

        Interesting. Are you talking about wholesale products or retail products?
        Info products. Physical products are slightly different, so I'm not surprised you see a difference between wholesale and retail - there's a whole different mindset you're dealing with.

        It probably comes down to the b2b or b2c distinction. Since I sell info products about running your business, while my actual model is b2c, the mindset of my customers is still b2b.
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  • Profile picture of the author Andyhenry
    I like the leather one - me or one of my descendants - now THAT is a guarantee.
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    nothing to see here.

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  • Profile picture of the author BIG Mike
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    • Profile picture of the author The Niche Man
      Originally Posted by BIG Mike View Post


      Guarantees, like any other element of a successful business must be based on scientific testing - not simply parroting what others are doing. Seeing an idea, thinking about how you could benefit from it is all well and good, but only testing it will determine if it's a game changer for any given market.
      You're right, it's definitely a strategic move - Built on a foundation of testing and evaluation of results. If you're not doing this you're just guessing or maybe even playing a lethal game of "Marketing Russian Roulette".
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