Two Things I've Learned to Profit in the World of Internet Marketing

20 replies
Hello,

I read these forums a lot. I've noticed and benefitted from some good tips, but there are a couple things that have been a large part of my success I have never seen anyone discuss on here. So I thought I'd give my two cents and see if it helps anyone.

1. There's Two Sides to the Equation. I've seen a million posts starting with "help", or "I'm lost, I can't make this work", etc. People that for every dollar they put into a campaign in PPC or other marketing methods, are only getting $0.85 back, and I always shake my head (figuratively...I'm not actually alone in my room shaking my head...that would just be weird).

There are two sides to the equation...cost, and REVENUE - yet many internet marketers are only focusing on cost. They take the revenue for granted. "What is the revenue per lead, per sale, per etc? Well it's indicated right there on the network, $15/per lead. OK, now I'll test it to see if I can get my cost under that"... The most, most marketers will do is look for that same offer on multiple networks, and find the "best" one....if you do this...you're doing it wrong.

Just as important a part of creating a successful affiliate campaign, as testing, to minimize cost per unit and maximizing number of units (which I don't actually do...as I'll explain in part 2)...is maximizing revenue per unit!

Internet marketers...many of you do not give yourself enough credit. Who owns the power in this relationship?... you do! How much power depends on how much you can produce...but irregardless (is that a word?) you still have some negotiating power to work with.

Everytime I look to start a campaign, it can take me weeks. I will look at thousands of offers, and from that call up 50, or 100 people, who "own" the offers I'm looking for. This either involves calling the affiliate manager...or calling an in-house person, to negotiate. Some of them don't negotiate...click, hang up. Some of them negotiate a bit...and some give you an offer you never thought would be possible.

Don't believe me - that you have power? Think of it this way. Let's say you're a salesperson. Now call up 10 companies at random and ask the owner if they will give you a job...paying you salary. It's a normal telemarketing call...chances are slim you'll get anyone interested. Now, call up 10 companies, and finish with, "oh and I'll work on commission, and you only pay me a dime, when and if I make a sale"...you would get 9 out 10 of those companies talking to you. The 1 company owner who doesn't want to talk to you is most likely a moron (unless his business is so awesome he can't handle anymore sales)...you don't want to work with him anyways. Why does this work? Because they're not risking anything! You're adding value - your time and/or money - and at most, they pay you a price that they know is less than the value they receive for the output you created. It's a win-win for them. This is exactly the relationship you're in, when you do affiliate marketing - who own's the power?...you do.

So what's the benefit of remembering there are two sides to the equation?

I now have people who call me up, to pitch me their offers asking me to take them. So I get the best offers coming my way.

Secondly, I get a much higher price. For example right now I get $20-24/lead for life insurance (variations based on geography by state)...know what the price is indicated on the website? $10/lead - it's a simple form. I get more than double. Is that worth your time? Well let's see...hmmm... yes getting $20,000+ in revenue for the same work and output as $10,000 in revenue does seem worth my time...at least to the same extent as me spending hundreds of hours tweaking my campaign to get it from $9,000 in cost, to $5,000 in cost...wouldn't you say?

People are greedy. Managers and owners, they take a massive share...as they should. It's your right to get back what's rightfully yours, a bigger piece of the pie. It's yours, take it!

2. This is a business like any other business...don't forget it./Think Big!
Just because you can wear your pajamas to work, doesn't mean you're not running a professional business. I believe too many people in this industry, don't treat their internet marketing "business" as they would a normal start-up business.

What would you do if your company was a clothing store, with a retail location? Well you would have a real plan. And you would look for better ways to do things - to succeed. I believe most noobies, and even professionals come into this market, by trying to learn too much. They try to learn PPC, they try to learn creating a landing page. Why? Are you going to be the best PPC marketer in the world? no, no you're not. Are you going to become the best website creator? no. Then why are you wasting time doing this? If these things were easy, then everyone would be an internet marketing millionaire - but they're not, and that's why the opportunity exists in the first place.

I don't do any of it. That's right, I make money doing affiliate marketing, and I don't actually do any of the marketing. I don't even know how to create a website - I really don't. I do know how to do PPC...to the extent that I can put keywords in an adwords account - not to the extent that I can get the lowest CPC or whatever - I don't even know the metrics to the full extent. Why would I? I can pay an expert to focus on what he/she is good at...building a website. So that I can focus on what I'm good at...making deals. Just like I've done in other businesses. Focus on your strengths.

Many website developers make a happy living doing website design. Many marketers make a living "managing people's PPC accounts". That's great. But I don't want a happy living, I want to be a rock star (again..figuratively, I can't sing worth a $#*@). That's my goal.

There are people and companies out there that can create thousands of leads/day. They own banner ad real estate on some of the highest trafficked/largest brand websites available, or they have perfected a type of PPC. They can do things, I'll never be able to do - I know I couldn't do PPC for 100 leads/day at a great price... I work with a company that spends over $2 million dollars/month on banner ads - allowing them to own banner space at ridiculously low prices. Am I going to spend $2 million to create those capabilities for myself...umm no, no I'm not. But they have the capabilities.

And so I hire them. We agree on a price per lead, or CPA. I pay them at price X. I negotiate a company up to price Y, and I take the difference.

Why do they do this with me? Why don't they work with the networks? Well...they do, on many campaigns. But why they include me is because I add value. 1. I pay them in advance. One of the big issues of course is who's going to bankroll it? When you create 1 million + leads/month, as these companies do, if everyone paid them later, that would be a lot of upfront cost. I pay them in advance for my leads, which is great for them. (sometimes, by going to in-house programs, I can also get paid in advance for leads...which is a great situation) 2. I don't necessarily pay them less than the network, I negotiate the revenue of the per lead up...so they're still getting a good price per lead - I just take the difference. 3. I pay them per lead, not per lead that the network decides to accept. That way, they don't deal with any crap or customer service - they know exactly what they're getting. However, I don't put up with crap either. If the network is rejecting too many of my leads...good bye. Their acceptance rates are between 75-90% for the campaigns currently...so I just make sure I negotiate the revenue per sale that much higher than what I pay them.

2.5 Don't trust anyone!
Lastly, 2.5 is a semi truth - not an entire truth. I don't want to be negative, but I've been ripped off so many times in this business to find the right people, the right providers, here's what I can tell you. People's words should equal people's actions. Meaning, if you talk to a PPC person, and they say they can do something for you. "Do you think you can generate 100 leads for my $1000 investment?" "Oh, yes, absolutely". "OK great, then put that guaranteed in the contract". That's how that conversation should go. Don't fall for people's crap. If a marketer truly believes that they can do what they say they can, then they should be willing to do it with a guarantee or on performance - just like we do when we take an affiliate offer. With my trusting nature, it took me many providers, and many wasted dollars to find these types of people.

And that's it! That's my big advice (some of it). Looks like an essay now. Maybe I should have made it an ebook. Hopefully it's not drivel to you.

If anyone's interested, I wrote a post yesterday saying that I would like to start a support group/coaching program...a FREE one! I've taken part in many such programs and always got something of value regardless of whether I was the mentor or the mentee. If you like my advice above, I can recommend the providers I use, or give you some advice. And I'd love to know tricks you've tried.
#internet #learned #marketing #profit #things #world
  • Profile picture of the author TelZilla
    Originally Posted by nicholl08 View Post

    I read these forums a lot. I've noticed and benefitted from some good tips, but there are a couple things that have been a large part of my success I have never seen anyone discuss on here.
    <snip />
    I've been reading this forum for years. Literally. Long before I actually signed up as a member, I lurked here reading and learning. You've given some great advice here for those people who'll take the time to read and understand, and then take action.

    I do want to comment on a couple of sections...

    There are two sides to the equation...cost, and REVENUE - yet many internet marketers are only focusing on cost. They take the revenue for granted.
    <snip />
    I don't know how many times I've seen people do this. Focus so much on cost, they forget to look at simple ways to increase revenue. I learned about negotiating with suppliers when I owned a brick & mortar business. If you just take the same model and apply it to your IM business, you'll see revenue increase, followed by profit.

    2. This is a business like any other business...don't forget it./Think Big!
    Just because you can wear your pajamas to work, doesn't mean you're not running a professional business. I believe too many people in this industry, don't treat their internet marketing "business" as they would a normal start-up business.
    <snip />
    Most IMer's don't equate home business with big business. It takes a large amount of faith, belief, and confidence in yourself to do what it takes to make it big in this business.

    But those who want to make the big bucks in IM can, if they are willing to make the necessary sacrifices of time and money to do it.

    2.5 Don't trust anyone!
    Lastly, 2.5 is a semi truth - not an entire truth.
    <snip />
    Amen. And then some.
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  • Profile picture of the author nicholl08
    Hi Darryl,

    Appreciate your comments. I'm glad someone read my post!

    I can tell by your comments that you have a better understanding of this industry then most. I'd be interested to learn more about what you do, if you have time for a PM. Or you can reach me at MSN at uwochris at hotmail.com
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    • Profile picture of the author TelZilla
      Originally Posted by nicholl08 View Post

      Hi Darryl,

      Appreciate your comments. I'm glad someone read my post!
      It's a good post

      I can tell by your comments that you have a better understanding of this industry then most.
      Not necessarily a better understanding of this industry, but of business in general. Even more likely is a good understanding of human nature. I spent too many years in door-to-door sales. You tend to learn a few things about psychology and the sales process when your income depends on knocking on doors.

      I'd be interested to learn more about what you do, if you have time for a PM. Or you can reach me at MSN at uwochris at hotmail.com
      I'll send you a PM shortly.
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      Don't get so wrapped up in making money that you forget the important things in life.
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  • Profile picture of the author TrafficGuy Claude
    I agree with you 100% Nicholl, many people get stuck in the paralysis of analysis and end up learning their way broke.
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  • Profile picture of the author Dragone
    Very good post. I agree with you as i'm new and had those thoughts when i started out.
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  • Profile picture of the author sarisri
    This is a very nice post.
    I especially liked the analogy of the companies that U gave. It is always about adding value to the other person before U start making. If U can get that one point right, U will succeed big time.
    Thanks Nichol. it was a good reading.
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  • Profile picture of the author Tom Sindoni
    Business is business... Whether its bricks and mortar or IM. If you don't treat it like a business you will not get the results. If you treat it like a hobby you shouldn't expect much.
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    • Profile picture of the author Kevin AKA Hubcap
      Originally Posted by Tom Sindoni View Post

      Business is business... Whether its bricks and mortar or IM. If you don't treat it like a business you will not get the results. If you treat it like a hobby you shouldn't expect much.
      Agreed. Business is business. What people need to realize is that with an internet business model you can have a business that is producing a lot of revenue with comparatively lower costs than a brick and mortar business.

      Also, an internet business gives you nationwide and worldwide access to customers but in the end it is a business not a hobby.

      Respect is as a business and you'll go far.
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  • Profile picture of the author Tom Sindoni
    It is definitely about helping others. If people could get past the "whats in it for me" we could get a lot more done.
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    • Profile picture of the author TelZilla
      Originally Posted by Tom Sindoni View Post

      It is definitely about helping others. If people could get past the "whats in it for me" we could get a lot more done.
      I disagree. "What's In It For Me" is what internet marketing is all about. While our products and services may help other people, without profit there is no reason to do it.

      The whole point of business is to make money. If you want to help people, make a lot of money first and then start a foundation.
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      • Profile picture of the author Kevin AKA Hubcap
        Originally Posted by TelZilla View Post

        I disagree. "What's In It For Me" is what internet marketing is all about. While our products and services may help other people, without profit there is no reason to do it.

        The whole point of business is to make money. If you want to help people, make a lot of money first and then start a foundation.
        Tom

        I think what was meant by that statement is if we focus on other people problems and are able to sell the widget that solves them then we will make money.
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  • Profile picture of the author nicholl08
    Hi Tom,

    I agree with your first post, but with your second - I'm actually saying people should demand more for themselves.

    Most people take what's given to them, rather than demanding something better. As an affiliate marketer who risks money and time, to give someone a lead or sale they can't lose on...don't let people push you around. They need you, more than you need them. Again, I've had people offer me more than twice as much, or 200% of their initial offer. Well, where was all that profit going in the first place? If they can still make profit (obviously or they wouldn't accept the higher price)...they're making a killing off my efforts while I slave away to earn pennies. Treat it as a business. You should work in your best interests - if that also ends up working with what other people need, then great. If not, not a match, move on.

    As an affiliate marketer, WHAT'S IN IT FOR ME!!?!

    Chris
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  • Profile picture of the author nicholl08
    Adding to my last post, as an example. There are so many people that do loan mod CPA's on networks, and they get what for it? Between $10-20/lead. Do you know if you took 2 hours, and called up 40 loan mod companies - 1. every single one of them would be interested, and 2. you could find a company willing to pay you $300/CPA.

    $300...that's a 1/30 closing rate for those to be of equal value. The average loan mod company closes such leads at 15%.

    Find the best offer.
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    • Profile picture of the author TelZilla
      Originally Posted by nicholl08 View Post

      Do you know if you took 2 hours, and called up 40 loan mod companies - 1. every single one of them would be interested, and 2. you could find a company willing to pay you $300/CPA.
      There is more value in this one post than in any 50 ebooks. But I don't know how many people will use it.
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  • Profile picture of the author nicholl08
    sorry...the $10-20 was CPL...but usually still with qualifications
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  • Profile picture of the author twannahiga
    A great post! I particularly liked the example of the corporations that you used. Adding a great value to the customer or source is always extremely important before you start constructing the bare essentials. It's always important to get that particular aspect correct right off the bat. Many thanks the post it was great read!
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  • Profile picture of the author JustAdam
    I must agree with you, I have had ppc-adsense activated on my site for about 2 months, granted i have no visitors coming to my site cause its new but i have made 12 bucks for two months! not bad huh?
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  • Profile picture of the author nicholl08
    beareroftruth, yes I am NVA_Marketing from digital point - I posted this on both sites. Figured, if I spent 20 minutes writing it, I might as well take the 30 seconds to post it a second time...
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  • Profile picture of the author Eric Lancheres
    Great post, I'd love to be part of your mentoring group.
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  • Profile picture of the author nicholl08
    Hi Kaybee,

    Thanks. I'm dragging butt on intiating a private group, been focusing on more immediate issues at the moment - but I will contact you as soon as I get my act together.

    Or if anyone else, would like to take charge, that would be great, I'd be happy to participate.
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