Excellent advice. I definitely try to read up as much as possible on anything I purchase, whether its WSOs or real life products. I am a review girl all the way.

I see your point.

With digital product, the problem is that people can get a full refund and still keep the product.

I concur. If you bought a spoiled product, got scammed etc, always bring it buck to the seller and ask for your money back. Doesn't matter is it Internet or real life.

No he is saying that if the "sales copy" got him because he wasn't in control of his ego and greed he would not have purchased the course (the whole point of a good sales copy). Buyers remorse is not reason to return an $8 product(not a $1000 camera). A bad camera needs to go back. A WSO that some people loved but he didn't find useful.... Well it stays!!!! If we all return every ebook or video we personally don't like. Then this whole forum would be for not. As long as you can get something from an $8 product you won.

Not the same thing at all. Most cameras look good on the outside and don't make false promises and wild unfounded claims.

So, you're gullible enough to believe that you can make $5K in the next 10 hrs without lifting your little pinkie, maybe you should blame yourself. The market is what it is and those kinds of claims will always be there. How long are those who fall for that going to be a sucker and believe that kind of crap?

It's rare that I request a refund. Mostly for a piece of software that simply doesn't work and that would be a good comparison to the camera that doesn't work. Would you buy a camera that claimed that the camera will also clean your house, wash your dishes, and do your laundry? I think I would be skeptical and people should use some common sense when buying products.

Agree with this. If the product is "cheap" (in price) but you gain even the smallest amount of knowledge, you definitely WIN.

That one little piece of information might have cost you $100 in advertising, etc. to figure out on your own, but you just got the information for less than $15. Even if you already knew 99% of the rest of the information, that 1 thing was worth the minute investment.


Totally agree, "Serial Refunder's" should be dragged out and Beaten to an inch of death! Then a video of the beating should be played for anyone who hovers their mouse over the "refund" button, just so they know the consequences of pulling shady sh!t like serial refunding.

Then again, like I said above, if you buy a product for less than $15 and gain ANYTHING from it, You Win!

On the other hand, if the same situation cost $297.00 , Then you might want to consider contacting the seller, explaining the situation and possibly working out some other sort of deal. They most likely have other products or training you might be interested in, in exchange for your purchase. You have to remember, people don't want to let go of money once they have their hands on it, and will be willing go above and beyond to keep thier hands on it. You'll probably end up with more value than you expected from the initial purchase.

Rich

Quoted for truth. There is way to much over selling and under delivering even on a cheap products. If you create certain expectations then you need to be held to meeting those expectations or what is already a bad problem will continue to get worse.

For example if you make a claim or bullet point about something I want to look up a page or point in a product and see that claim delivered. Part of the problem is people make claims THEY CANT deliver. Simply because the product is based on an isolated case or there are more variables involved then the product creator is aware of or willing to teach.

You are also adding to the problem because you will continue to buy and refund those types of products again and again.

Not getting the money back is your punishment for making stupid choices. And if you are not punished, you will never learn.

You are missing the point. Of course, you have the "right" to ask for a refund.

But what I'm talking about is another level of looking at things.

For instance... people have the right to social welfare or benefits, as we say in the UK. And people spend time fighting for "their" money.

Well, they have the right. But also they are destroying their lives just by doing it. If you wish I can go into detail why.

If you go somewhere for a seminar on direct mail, and they know nothing about direct mail, that's fine.

But if you go buy a WSO and you say "it's good but it's not something I want to do right now" and refund - you're damaging yourself and your thinking.

Also if it promises a lot of money, and it seems you won't be able to make that money, I'll tell you something.

YOU KNEW THIS BEFORE YOU BOUGHT IT.

It was your greed and lack of responsibility that motivated your actions. And you hoped that maybe this time it will be different.

I think its a good procedure to keep a list / eye on serial refunders .. or create products with a limited 'try before you buy' function ..

Here is the thing.

There was a forest. We cut it down. We built a city. Since we don't have to hunt for food, we must be entitle to it right? Yeah, right. :rolleyes:

1. Open your eyes.

2. The right to refund doesn't exist to protected the customer.

3. This "right" exists to increase sales because the customer feels protected.

The point is, the first thing you must do is to make everything that happens in your life YOUR RESPONSIBILTY - even when "it's not your fault".

You think by refunding you're reducing the number of people who make bad products? I'm sure there is somebody here who can elaborate on how people factor in refund rates when creating crap.

Actually it doesn't.

As a side note, if people knew they wouldn't get a refund they'd be more careful about buying.

Sellers would be more careful about their reputations because customers would complain more. So maybe things would be better.

Anyway, the point here is not about whether or not you have the right to get a refund.

It's about taking RESPONSIBILITY for your life - which I see people conveniently choose to ignore...

[DELETED]

Maybe if there wasn't so much blind copy in there people wouldn't refund so much.
It's like walking into a shop for a new sofa and the shop assistant saying 'Yea you can pay us for the sofa and we'll deliver it for you, but you aren't seeing which one it is until you get it'
However he is willing to give you a 60 day money back guarantee just in case you aren't happy, but then gets annoyed when you take him up on it!

Good question...

I am in the same boat. I don't normally ask for them either, but every once in a while it just has to be done.

Normally, I am more peeved that a garbage product wasted my time rather than my money - and I am definitely not going to waste more time trying to get back the $5-$15 that most WSO's cost.

I disagree with this attitude that I shouldn't request a refund for a product which doesn't meet my expectations, based on the fact that the product does have some value other than the reason I purchased the product.

I'll decide if the product meets my needs based on my criteria and how it corresponds with what was advertised.

If I buy a computer with an advertised 8 hour battery life, I'm going to ask for a refund if the battery lasts only 2 hours. I don't care if the computer has the fastest processor of any machine I've owned, or if it cost me only $10 - if I bought the damn thing for the battery life and the battery life isn't as advertised, I will get a refund.

Same with digital products. If I purchased a product based on "a simple SEO trick that will get your site to the front page of Google for any keyword" but the product doesn't deliver on that claim, well I'm going to ask for a refund - even if it does offer other good information.

Even if the digital product is great in other ways, if it doesn't deliver for the advertised claim which led me to purchase it, then I'm getting a refund. End of story.

This is a nice philosophy, but unfortunately, when sellers aren't held to account because of such liberal attitudes as this, standards slip badly.

Worse yet, this "entitlement" mindset takes root and causes scenarios where sellers who previously advertised a no-questions-asked money-back guarantee (not because they intend to fulfil it but because it "looks good and helps them sell more") begin to question, challenge and dismiss customers' requests because they disagree with their reasons.

This in turn causes an accumulation of complaints of false advertising and scamming, among other things, to various watchdog organisations, consumer groups and government bodies like Trading Standards and the FTC, from which the sort of regulation people love to moan about will ultimately arise.

"Responsibility", as AdwordsMogul talks about, takes many forms. I found his comments a little ironic, in fact, because I see the act of letting vendors off the hook so lightly as forgoing one's consumer responsibilities, not exercising them.

The seller does not learn anything from it.

When you force the seller to give back your money, it doesn't matter if you tell him why, he will still call you a "serial refunder" and bad-mouth you to his seller friends on Skype that all sell worthless crap so they share a blacklist of all the people who buy products and refund them immediately. Which is a big list, because their products are garbage and you can almost smell it before the download's complete.

When you look at the product and think "I made a bad buying decision," so you don't get your money back and have to sit there knowing you wasted it on garbage, you understand what you are doing and why you are doing it. YOU learn something.

You can't make that happen on the other side of the fence. So make the difference where you can control it.

If people didn't buy from blind copy, the sellers would stop using it.

I won't buy from blind copy. I may miss a good product this way, but I doubt that happens very often. My philosophy is that if they can't tell you anything about the product because it will "give the secret away", then it can't be much of a product.

When it comes to blind copy, I put more blame on the buyer. If you don't know what the hell it is, then why are you buying it?

I do. I've only asked for refunds a few times over the years and that's only when the product didn't match up to what was promised in the copy - and then it has to be a pretty wide discrepancy.

Anytime I've been given a refund, I've deleted the files. If I were to find enough value in them to keep them, I wouldn't ask for a refund.

The people who keep the files and ask for a refund are lower than a snake's belly. Doesn't matter if you refund in the first 2 minutes or a month down the road, if you still use the files, you're a thief.

DING DING DING DING!!!!....

ah....we have a winner.

Ask not what the WSO can do for you, but...ask.... what you can do with the WSO.

The cheapest or most expensive WSO you have purchased in 2012 is worthless, unless you actually get off your arse and do something with it.

Come to think of it, the difference between making no money and a stack load of money is in these two words.... TAKING ACTION..... there I said it. To most these two words are like swear words.....

oh and DO NOT think I am all high and mighty, because for 3 years I did not take action and got not results, so I know why people struggle they simply do not get off their ass, I have been there, and its not a good place to be. Trust me.

I'm confused. When did the WSO section, as a marketplace, gain some kind of mystical aura where you should never ask for refunds? It's a place where buyers and sellers trade.

I do take responsibility for my purchases, there or in any other marketplace. Part of taking responsibility is acknowledging when one makes a mistake in purchasing and taking whatever steps are available to remedy the error. Including asking for a refund if one is offered.

As Big Mike said, if you don't want to deal with refunds, don't offer them. You can't have it both ways.

Why is that a problem? It doesn't diminish your supply of available products, and if the product truly is not useful to the buyer, they will not use it, so possession is meaningless.

I'll qualify that to include refunds given because the buyer either made an honest error regarding the product's suitability for his own use, or some equally innocent reason. I don't extend that to thieves committing fraud, as I don't count them as 'buyers' anymore than a store considers shoplifters 'customers'.

This is unvarnished horse manure. And I'm not sure that's being fair to road apples...

There's more to "taking responsibility" than simply wearing the hair shirt. There's also an obligation to remedy errors, and often the way to remedy a bad purchasing decision is to undo it by obtaining a refund.

In addition to more quality products (although I haven't bought more than 2 shoddy products from the WF ever), I'd like to see the marketplace correct itself by putting measures in place to prevent thieving serial refunds from stealing product after product under the guise of "not being happy" with any of them. They of course became unhappy with those products approximately 5 minutes after purchase. Go figure. Fast workers, aren't they?

I personally already have a system in place. I use DLGuard and I simply ban any customer who requests a refund. I don't offer a refund and if they file a Paypal dispute, I just ban them from ever purchasing anything from me again. I sell a membership and when a buyer buys, they have access to 16 sites to download. How many "customers" do you think I would have that instantly refunded after downloading all that if I had a refund policy and didn't fight Paypal disputes? A lot.

I think JVZoo and WSO Pro and any other sales platform should add the ability to ban "customers" by IP and email like DLGuard does.

I think that there are just as many dishonest "customers" as there are sellers.

When you allow the seller to keep the funds you are in essence saying "I agree you're product is worth $xx" when you really think it's not worth a pile of poo.

If you want to punish yourself by "not getting your $ back", it's better to remove the funds from the seller and give it to a worthy charity and not take the tax write-off.

At the end of the month/year/whatever take a good hard look at how much you stupidly spent and on what. Consider how much work you could have outsourced. How much you could have spent on ads. Consider what you've lost because of chasing the stupid and learn.

Don't reward someone for producing an unworthy product.

Rashell

I agree, and disagree.. (boy, that's a useless statement! :rolleyes

Anyway, for those of us who have been at this for more than a month or two, "I'll get you on page one of Google for 'dog'!" may seem preposterous. For someone who really doesn't know how to rank a site for a keyword (or doesn't even know what the Adwords Keyword Tool is about), it's not so obvious.

I'm not sure the refund/serial refund/etc. issue is really something we can solve completely. Consider the drill:

1. Newbie sees "great" wso that either promises the moon or claims to be "newbie friendly".
2. Newbie buys the wso and tries to use it
3. Newbie finds that either the wso promised something it won't do, or the information is over his head (he probably doesn't know which).
4. Newbie requests refund
5. Rinse and Repeat

Eventually the newbie either gives up on wso's altogether or becomes a serial refunder - He doesn't intend to be a pain in the arse, often it's just a case of (understandable) ignorance.

Add those to the tons of real serial refunders and content thieves and you've got a real problem, and it's hard to tell the thieves/jerks from the newbies that just don't know any better.

Does that mean newbies should just "suck it up" and loose money for each and every mistake, even though the seller agrees to refund the purchase "for any reason"? That seems a little harsh... I think I would prefer to educate newbies with threads like this one

You're joking, right? Please tell me you are joking...

The act of obtaining a refund negates the possibility of learning from one's mistakes? Seriously?

I truly hope any of your potential customers never get wind of how dumb you really think they are.

Here's what I think will really happen.

> A portion of said unhappy buyers will get their refund and spend it on something else of more value to them. They've learned their lesson, despite getting their money back.

> Another portion will never learn. They'll continually chase pie in the sky, whether they get refunds or not.

> Some will simply become bitter, and rather than learn any "lesson" you think they should learn, will conclude that all sellers are cheats, crooks, scammers or any other word you choose to use. And they'll blast that opinion to anyone who will listen.

Somebody, PLEASE open the windows. It's getting pretty rank in here...