I don't think you should hide it, because reading stories like this is very inspirational.
I still remember when I started in IM, whenver I read a rags to riches story, I said to myself "if this guy can do IT, even I can do it".

If you think about IM, its a dream, its a dream that every 9-5 job worker or a middle class guy would like to live.

I would say your story would be very interesting to read ( I would personally like to read it), don't get rid of it even for million dollars.

Do what feels right with yourself man, personally I'm too honest.

I see a lot of people on these forums just talk crap all day long because that's what keeps them going. Some people are compelled to lie about every single thing they do, even to themselves.

Be who you want to be, choose your own destiny. It's your reputation not his.

Hi Marcus,

First of all - great to see a fellow Bristolian on the forum.

There's nothing wrong with a truthful, inspiring background. It makes you an honest Internet marketer; one that can give hope and motivation to others dealing with tough life situations.

The thing about a lot of these big-time gurus is that they shape an image for themselves for the sake of marketing. Heck, plenty of them even use fake names, otherwise you'd be able to dig up all kinds of info on them. I won't name any names - but some are only interested in helping themselves.

Carry on as an honest, helpful IMer and don't let the gurus disconcert you.

I'm with you on this one. Most people love that kind of dramatic life turn around. It gives people confidence that if you can have success than they can too... mostly because they assume that they are better/smarter than you since they don't/didn't have a drug problem but that's another topic. It's a good marketing tactic to include your story and it does make you more brandable. That "guru" seems out of touch.

Thanks.

The ultimate question is "does what we tell our readers, prospects and customers add value whilst promoting ourselves intelligently?"

I've questioned this over and over and come the pretty much the same conclusion that "who you are" is enough - wording the content affectively is the tricky part!

My personal opinion that is not backed by my own research is that an in depth description of the dark corners of your life will affect your overall credibility. Anything where a person admits that they made a string of bad decisions makes them seen as a person who makes or made those bad decisions at one time. I feel that things like personal bios aren't done by large marketers (or are at least fabricated) because its like applying for a job. You wouldn't go into a job interview and say "I was once a heroin addict, but I'm good now!" because judgement will be placed. I feel a lot of people who don't see the world as "sober or not sober" can really connect to the people who view the world that way.

I agree with the above post.

I'm all for adding authenticity to your marketing but sometimes you can tell people a little too much. I must admit nowadays I find myself getting a little tired of hearing about everyone's life stories. Just tell me what you got and what it does. Whether you were a drug addict in your past or not, it doesn't add anymore credibility to your product in my eyes. The only thing that adds credibility is a great product on the back-end. Your product speaks for itself.

Don't tell anyone anything you wouldn't be prepared to tell someone in a job interview or first date. In both of those instances you are also trying to sell yourself but you wouldn't mention such things, would you?

I know Brendon Burchard's story and I think it is real. But it also helps him market himself using a unique story.

You shouldn't fake a story and you need not tell every history. Just do it if it is going to help you in the marketing. Does your unique story help making an emotional connection with your readers? If no, then drop it.

Yes that's a valid point and you must be right about producing a great product full stop.

Actually in my first job back to life I said of my addiction and got the job working in a children's home.

Thanks for your responses.

Marcus

yes i agree. If the story assists in the marketing process then put it in, if not then don't. That is good advise.

Thanks

Exactly what Will said. Something you need to keep in mind is that when selling a product (and this holds more true in the IM niche than some others) you are not only marketing that guide, but yourself as well. You screwed up, got sober, and apparently found success. Congratulations. But if I have the choice of learning from the guy who did everything right and the guy who could only recently learn to get his act together, who do you think I'm going with.

I mean this as no offense to you personally, and I won't pretend to know your situation. But you need to take into consideration the way that customers and potential partners will view you. Reformed drug addict doesn't exactly scream "Great JV Opportunity". You don't have to lie though, just don't divulge everything.

People love an underdog/redemption story when it comes to sports. From their potential teachers? Usually not as much, at least in my opinion.

Who cares what that dummy said......never erase your story to suit some DORK IM "guru"!


If you were making up a drug/alcohol story to be "edgy" or different from 98% of the other marketers out there (who kind of seem like they have never drank, smoked, had any fun in life) then that's not good.

But if you were being honest, then why hide that! When I read a sales page or WSO letter or whatever and someone sounds like a phony dork, it makes me NOT want to listen to them.

If I can't relate to a person, I don't want to listen to them.


I recently got a course from a big social media guy who is a big-shot in IM, and let me tell you.....the dude is a total dork.


It's really hard for me to listen to him talk because I don't relate to his NON-CUSSING, non-fun and non-normal-life ways.


Tell your story, and screw the dummy who didn't like it...

Something I neglected to mention above was your message to market match.

It's very important.

If I were selling a course on how to pick up girls then I want to tell a story about how I used to be crap at picking up girls and how I was able to turn things around to where I am now, fighting off girls with a stick.

If I were selling a course on how to play basketball then I would want to tell a story about how I was the shortest guy in school and how, using my special training techniques, I was able to overcome things and get into the basketball team I wanted.

Your message, your story -- they need to resonate with your market.

You want to tell a story that your target market can relate to. In IM I would guess that very few of the people you are selling to have had drug or alcohol issues. Sure, there would be some and those people will be able to resonate with your story even more so, but for the vast majority of people who have never been through that experience, they can't relate to you.

You know when you meet someone and they say... "Wow, you remind me so much of how I used to be when I was a kid." You want your customers to have that same feeling. They need to see THEMSELVES in your story because only then will they believe they can achieve the same success you have.

And that's what good story telling is about.

Sometimes it seems that everyone has a sob story to tell - and let's face it, most of us do. You only have to read the stories of virtually every entrant to Britain's (not) Got Talent - everyone of them was abandoned as a baby, suffered abuse at the hands of a member of their family............

My take is this.
Yes - your story is inspiring. I for one admire you for turning your life around and managing to have a stable, loving family which hopefully will mean your children will follow a different path.
No - if I'm buying a product from you, I don't want to hear it. I hate the "poor me" style of marketing.

As for the guru - it's your life, it's your product, you have to make your own decisions about your selling techniques. What appeals to one won't appeal to another. No selling technique will hook all prospective customers.

Thanks Will

Great advice that I will take on board.

I was unsure which way this thread would go but I am pulling out some nuggets of info that will help in the future, yours being one of them.

I was surprised that 1 in 5 people across Europe and the US have some kind of connection to drug/alcohol addiction. 1 in 3 have a connection to addiction of one kind or another, whether that be eating, gambling etc. It is my intention to grapple with peoples emotions on a sub conscious level too, which is a part of marketing.

It seems that there will definately be "lost prospects and customers" as a result of this kind of disclosure - but how many. Would it be more or less beneficial?

Still unknown.

Thanks again.

Marcus

Hi Marcus,

It's good to see that you're open to all perspectives and not just looking for people to agree with yours.

I think the answer for "what's best" will always have many factors that are situation-based, so for some people your story will be a turn off and for others an inspiration.

I second what Will said about the relativity of it.

If I go to buy fish and chips I don't want to hear the guy selling them telling me he just got out of jail and doesn't do drugs anymore.

If I go to a personal development seminar - maybe that's exactly what I want to hear from someone who's now successful as it offers a "I had nothing and built my success from scratch" perspective. That's good as there are also a lot of successful people who were already successful before they got into IM and the pictures they show of their flash car and house are nothing to do with IM or what they're selling.

Now, to answer your question directly.....

I think you should drop your story when you're selling a product, unless that product is targeted at helping people who are still having those problems that you overcame.

Just because you have framed your past problems as something that give you strength, that doesn't mean that others will do the same. For many people they never get over some of the problems that life has dealt them and showing them that you did will just give them a reason to feel worse about themselves.

So - it's horses for courses. If your story gives you strength and inspires others - share it with those who are interested. Just don't start a conversation with it.

If you're building a list you can get personal once people have bought from you and want to know more about who you are. You don't have to use it as a USP to get sales.

Good luck with things and I hope you continue to move forward as well as you already have done.

Andy

yeah well said Andy.

The story could harm sales but not putting it in won't.

You can't win Wimbledon in the second round but you can sure lose it. Ask Raffa.

Marcus

yes it will be removed now.

Thanks

I would not hide anything I have things that in my bio that I tell people and big gurus will not talk to me once they hard it, but I don't care. Live is not perfect they only pretend it is.

In my opinion, it says a lot more about the "guru" than it does about you. Perhaps you did reveal a bit too much, but then the "guru" could have requested that you tone it down, as opposed to removing it completely.

It's the kind of thing that you could gloss over, but that's your choice.

I have a hunch that the "guru" doesn't like people who used to be addicts, and he probably doesn't believe in second chances. In effect, he did you two favors: He said your info was good, and he also let you know what kind of person he is. That's a good thing, because why would you want somebody like that promoting your product anyway?

All the best,
Michael

Everyone probably has experiences that shaped them into who they are today. Some good, some not so good. A lot of marketers seemed to have jumped on this "I was an Alcatraz convict until one day ....."

I've seen so much of it that now I tend not to believe it. It doesn't sound genuine. I haven't read yours, so I don't know if it would hit me the same, but I used to write resumes for a living and the things I put on a resume were results.

That's still the way that I approach sales letters.

One of the biggest problems of using biographical information within sales
copy is that it's all about you. That type of information, irrespective of
it's content, is unlikely to build empathy with your reader unless they have
had a similar experience.

Your sales copy should be written to your perfect customer... that one
person who is most representative of your target market.

If your sales copy wasn't written in a form that would be attractive to
my perfect subscriber, then I would probably turn down your offer too.

John

Trying to blend into a very crowded marketplace is a fools game. You need to stand out. That will attract some to you and it will make some run from you. But just trying to be the "normal" pay check to pay check turned internet millionaire guy is a damn hard way to build a following.

Stories sell things. They always have. The key is to make your story as relevant to your product as possible. Of course a story like yours will close some doors. Thats normal and almost certainly not "game ending" problem. Truth be told every one of us has closed some doors on ourselves before.

I have always found that for me its a lot easier to find other doors to open when I am true to myself than if I am trying to be something I am not. My advice is to stay true to yourself and you will eventually find your "circle" to fit into when it comes to the internet marketing niche.

I think it depends on how relevant it is to your success story. But as mentioned, too much is a turn off even to people who will relate to it.

Someone once told me something that stuck. Everything you write can be one of three things. It can help you. It can be neutral or it can hurt you. Then he said you should only use stuff that can help or is neutral.

I don't always agree with that because there are times, according to your audience, that something that might be harmful in a certain venue is accepted or even expected in others.

I always think of cussing when this comes up. There are plenty of markets where it's accepted and it won't hurt much. There are literally NO markets where you're going to get hurt if you don't use it.

At the end of the day you've gotta be true to yourself, even if it does cost you a sale or two.

I agree with the rationale that if your personal history is relevant to your product; then I would include it. I'm not sure I would put in the "guts and blood details", but your story of getting your self back on track could well be an inspiration to others.

When I look at my list and the type of information they like I'm not sure because of the bio it would work with them. Therefore I don't think I would promote your product, simply because it wasn't a good fit.

Ken

The Old Geezer

In my opinion, that's not the type of personal info you want to air in a business environment as it WILL put many people off.

Everything has a time and a place, and openly talking about your drug addictions in a business-minded proposal is *NOT* the place.

Imagine this scenario: You're about to ask a girl for a date, and right before asking her out you tell that your ex-girlfriend just dumped you and you're heartbroken and whatnot... your chances to get her phone number would just dropped significantly. Wrong timing, wrong place. See?

Sometimes it's a matter of not what we reveal but how we reveal it. I never saw your bio and if you had a copy of it I might have better input. Otherwise, if you feel convicted to share your story by all means stay true to yourself.

I got the example I was thinking about, he is uber successful he shares similar story to you, his name his "Jordan Belfort" and he openly shares his story with people.
Go figure.

I think that you should be proud to have accomplished what you did and if someone decides to look down on you simply because you openly discuss a life experience, then you can't do anything but to move on from that person as they won't be any good for you anyway.

That being said, people subconsciously judge your product based on your bio. Should you be concerned? No, because I'm sure you will gain much more by being open. You can't please everyone and obviously some people will always hate what you do.

Good luck with your product,
Vlad

You could try making up you bio- a composit chararator for a memoirs- like Obama did in his books. Not saying this is ethical but look where it got him. Memoir - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Mark

I think you should keep your story man. Maybe you don't have to be too detailed about your history because people do judge a book by its cover but definitely mentioning it could be helpful.

I'd just be wary of your choice of words that's all. Instead of using addict which sounds mmm harsh? You could just say you was in a bad place in your life with drugs and other bad influences.

Respect your story though man. Good luck!

I likely have one of the most messed up stories on this forum as it goes far beyond drug addiction. It involves more than most people could handle, so I rarely talk about it. The ONLY time I talk about it is when I'm asked.

For instance, when I got out of prison and went back to college, my school asked me to give a speech on drug addiction, self esteem & self improvement. In a room of over 300 people, I talked about my past in the most vivid manner a person can imagine.

After giving that speech, every single person in the room stood up and clapped their hands. But the thing is, I told the story proudly.

If you can't tell a story proudly, people WILL try to use it against you. On the other hand if you tell a story in a way where you seem proud of it, NOBODY will try to challenge you.

I noticed this when I saw Frank Kern telling his war story. He goes VERY MUCH into detail about his past, but he tells the story in a way where you can tell he does NOT give a damn what others think.

People will look at the story for guidance. If you don't sound proud telling it, people will naturally start to assume you left some very important details out. Its just natural imo. Like "why does he seem insecure telling the story... when he's turned his life around.. what is he not telling us?"

Like right now you see how you're asking us for our opinions. I'll tell you one thing, if I got the same response from this guy, I'd take that more as a clue that I just told the story the wrong way. I'd go back and read it and compare it to people who have ALREADY told worse stories, but still have great reputations.

The fact is when you reveal personal information like that, you can't leave a shadow of a doubt in peoples minds about what actually happened. You really need to fill in the details imo or don't say anything.

Like don't just write a few sentences about how you were an addict. Look how Ryan Eagle talks about his struggle with addiction. He doesn't really hold anything back. He is PROUD of the fact that it helped it become a much better person. I'd actually be curious to see this story myself, just to see how it reads. Do you think its possible that you were a little too vague maybe?

Maybe you didn't frame things the right way?
idk.. just thinking outloud here.

If Frank Kern can tell a not so admirable story about being a bum and drug addict, I think you can definitely tell a respectable story about addiction. If know tons of professional people talk about their pasts, there is absolutely NOTHING wrong about it imo.

People almost expect stories like this now just thanks to how social media has changed the world.

-Red

Thats true Frank doesn't talk about drug addiction in his sales copy but he DOES talk often about how lazy he use to be.

So maybe just talk about that. =]
I suppose a lot more people can identify with it. The fact is these guys operate on a whole nother level and I still don't know if Frank is lazy or busts his ass for a living. Because he's said on multiple occassions that he is lazy, but also busts his ass when it comes time to work.

So maybe its the duality that really appeals to people the most. He seems to appeal to both lazy minded newbs AND hardworking gurus alike. Doesn't really leave either group behind imo. As far as talking about drug addiction... I'll let the more experienced people decide how to address that.

-Red

I think that was too much information for someone to put on their bio. You have to wait until you get rich and famous then write a book about it.

I will take that on board. Thanks for your insights.

I can't tell you what to do. But if I read your story as a pitch, I would run run run far away. good luck with your decision.

I like your approach to being authentic in how you deal with people online. You show people your strengths and also your weaknesses which I think says a lot of good things about your character. I like that you're trying to remain truthful in your online career. Those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it

Just to close of this thread I want to say thanks once more. A ton of good stuff for me to take away, with one or two acceptions of course

Good to be a part of this forum, giving and receiving information and advice.

Cheers!

Marcus

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I'd agree with WiIIR...how is the product you are selling to the exact state( with details) of your life before? or is it a coaching programme on self development? Because self development does not relate very much to Internet Marketing, probably thats why the guru refused to understand your point of view and promote you to internet market potential customers...would be out of topic...

Marcus Rockey,

Just consider whether airing your drug addictions in public (in a business-minded website to be more specific) actually serves any purpose. Should you customers care about your personal story or should they care about your actual offer? could some people rightfully be put off by the drug thingy? why making that info public would help in any way your credibility? and shouldnt that credibility be based on your offer and your skills, rather than on your drug addictions?

Seriously man, there's a place and time for everything... are you sure a business-minded website is the right place to talk about drug addictions? I mean, really? I personally would be put off by it - not because I have a problem with that, but simply because I'm not interested in that and I don't find it relevant to the topic at hand (business).

Food for thought.

Yes that's a valid point Anonymous and one I will consider too but I largely sell through personality.

I have sold hundreds of cars to people and they bought 1. because the car was good quality and value for money 2. That they liked me and we found mutual benefits through personality. Now sometimes the mutuality was sport other times family, other times addiction, would you believe it?!

Open mindedness is key to sustainable success in what ever we do. I am open minded that some will appreciate and warm to this brand of honesty and others will not - and that is ok.

Hi Marcus, I took my time for reading your bio, and it's a thing I never do for all the Warriors.
I appreciated your frankly description of your life, and knowing you are now following the right direction makes me happy.

It's always important to know all by a person, and for my way of thinking is right to show your history and especially the fact you won over alcoholism and drug addiction.

See you soon,
Alessandro

Only one way to find out.

Split test two sales pages... One with the bio that talks about the past drug addiction and then have one that has the bio without it.

I personally think the conversion rate will barely differ between the two versions.

And most customers only care about what your product can do for them, not your past addiction problems.

It doesn't make you more credible by talking about it.

But it may strike a chord with people who can relate.

...though I think it won't make a difference either way when you test.

Here's a lesson you're going to learn eventually, but should learn it right now:

No matter what you do, you simply cannot please everyone all the time.

Someone will always have issue with you or something you do.

Get used to it and just ignore people like that.

Your time is too valuable to spend it even bothering with threads like this about it.

That's what I'm saying, don't waste your time on things like this, it's pointless.

I know he started the thread...maybe I'm missing what you mean?

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