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Semi-Newbie Need Some Direction

by Tocholke
9 replies
Hi Everyone,

I've been dabbling in the IM game for a little while now. I have somewhat of an understanding of how things work. I am still having some trouble getting into the black.

Lately I've been promoting email/zip submits on Peerfly through direct links. I've been losing a little money but am close to making money some days. I've tested/tweaked my campaigns many times and am still in the red. I'm hoping someone could get me going in the right direction here.

Here are my questions to you warriors:

1) When I first started in CPA I was told to go with 7search as it's cheap and, supposedly, easy. That doesn't seem to be the case. I've read that other PPC traffic sources give better quality traffic. If I go with another source (i.e. adcenter) will I be able to get better conversion rates while still getting cheap keywords (6 to 7 cents)? Also, do any other networks allow direct linking?

2) I understand that having a solid landing page will help conversion and also allow for my to work on building a list. Do you build landing pages for email/zip submits? Doesn't really make sense to me as they only pay $1 - $2 and there isn't much to presell.

3) I've read that low paying email/zip submits won't make any real money. Everyone seems to say promote something with at least a $20 payout, but when I look at the offers on the CPA network there isn't really anything worth promoting at that payout (usually sketchy looking business systems etc). Should I be focusing on something like clickbank with higher payouts? Or are there CPA networks with decent high payout offers?

Thanks for listening. Any feedback would be appreciated.
#cpa #direction #newbie #ppc #seminewbie
  • Profile picture of the author Ryan Even
    Having been in many markets (and also having played the CPA game for a while) I can tell you that the best thing you can do to start building a real, long-term sustainable business that you can be proud of (and be proud to show off to your family and friends) is to always focus on delivering value to whatever market or niche you decide to enter instead of focusing on just what will get you money.

    Think about it this way...

    Are you really adding value to a person's life when you get them to enter their zip code or email address on a form somewhere so someone else can market to them?

    Does that sound like a long-term business you would be proud to tell your family about?

    The truth is, some people do really well with CPA marketing and some people don't care about building a real business online (they just want that quick buck)...

    However, if you are looking to build a more sustainable business I would urge you to instead focus on things like building your own list, blogging, creating products & membership sites and building a business and brand that is 100% yours that you can be proud of!

    And it ALL stages of your business always focus on delivering value and the money will follow!
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    • Profile picture of the author Lakezilla
      Originally Posted by Ryan Even View Post


      However, if you are looking to build a more sustainable business I would urge you to instead focus on things like building your own list, blogging, creating products & membership sites and building a business and brand that is 100% yours that you can be proud of!

      And it ALL stages of your business always focus on delivering value and the money will follow!
      Well said Ryan

      Tocholke here is a Free E-Book on how to build a powerful Email List:
      http://affiliatebuys.com/wp-content/...-Beginners.pdf

      Hope this helps!
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  • Profile picture of the author The Real Deal
    Although I can't actually answer some of your specific questions, (I have never used 7search for example), let me give you some advice that may be useful.

    1. Track and split test everything you do.
    2. Track and split test everything you do.
    3. Track and split test everything you do.

    Ok sorry, you probably get it and I know you have heard it before!

    Seriously though, regardless if you are running ads on 7search or doing PPV make sure that you track each ad and keyword independently and split test different ads against each other. Try to start at the most detailed level possible with everything that you do, and then scale up.

    With PPV for example, make sure that you not only track the main domain that you are targeting, (do NOT target keywords!), but the actual URL on that domain.

    When you track everything down to the smallest detail you will quickly see which traffic sources are working and which ones are not. Sure, its a bit more hassle than just launching off a wider campaign, especially if you are not used to doing it. But once you find some truly profitable campaigns its more than worth it because what you have then is virtually an automatic money machine that just keeps paying you!

    In general, my personal experience is that you want to promote higher paying offers, (not just with CPA) rather than the low paying stuff. However, some people have great success with email submits etc. but you need to drive a lot more traffic to those offers to make any real money.

    I would also say that in general you are probably better off going with higher paying CPA offers than Clickbank. Info products generally have lower conversion rates than "real" offers in my experience. I know others feel differently and I do recognize that there are some great converting Clickbank offers.

    If you want to do CPA why not try something like an insurance offer or a loan offer with really tight URL targeting via PPV, (targeting URLs like: www.biginsurancesite.com/cars/under25/application-form.php rather than www.biginsurancesite.com)?

    Oh, and and easy way to track and split test lots of different traffic sources is to use LinkTrackr (not an affiliate link). With LinkTrackr you can track conversion rates even for campaigns/networks that don't let you fire off a pixel on the thank you page.

    Good luck! (and sorry I wasn't able to answer your specific questions more directly.)

    Added: If you are looking for a cheap alternative paid traffic source you may want to give InfoLinks (not an affiliate link) a try. I haven't used them myself but someone was talking about them the other day. I am a little skeptical as to how much traffic they can actually deliver for narrow keywords since I don't see that many big sites using them, but I know you can get traffic for 2-4 cents a click from them. Perhaps bigger keywords like Ipad, Iphone, Apple etc. could work with some email submit offers? Just an idea...
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    • Profile picture of the author Tocholke
      Originally Posted by The Real Deal View Post


      If you want to do CPA why not try something like an insurance offer or a loan offer with really tight URL targeting via PPV, (targeting URLs like: www.biginsurancesite.com/cars/under25/application-form.php rather than www.biginsurancesite.com)?
      Thanks for all the info. I'm a little confused as to what exactly you mean by this? If you could explain further I would greatly appreciate it.
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      • Profile picture of the author The Real Deal
        Originally Posted by Tocholke View Post

        Thanks for all the info. I'm a little confused as to what exactly you mean by this? If you could explain further I would greatly appreciate it.
        Hmm, do you know how PPV works?

        If not, it might be something you want to look into if you are going to try to make money from CPA networks.

        In short it works like this.

        1. A user wants to install a particular piece of software or toolbar on their computer.

        2. The company offering the software/toolbar allows the user to download it for free under the condition that they are allowed to "pop-up" a certain number of ads per day to that user.

        3. Advertisers can then pay to use those pop-ups, and that's what many successful CPA marketers do.

        4. There are different ways of targeting users. Basically you can "trigger" a pop-up when they search for a specific keyword or when they visit a certain URL.

        5. What I am suggesting is that you should never use the keyword option as a trigger, but rather use a very specific URL as the trigger for the pop-up. The simple reason for this is that a user that has entered a car insurance site (as per my example above) and actually gone all the way to the application form on that site, is very likely to be highly interested in car insurance offers!

        6. The problem with the above strategy is that although the users will be highly targeted there won't be that many people with the specific software installed (the software/toolbar that is required to launch the PPV pop-ups) on their computer, and that are also filling in a car insurance form on this particular site that you are targeting in your campaign!

        7. The solution to the above problem is to find as many highly trafficked car insurance sites as possible, and do the same thing with all of them, whilst still keeping things highly targeted.

        8. The main advantage of PPV is that its very cheap, sometimes as little as 1 cent. However, since you are basically "interrupting" the user with a pop-up the traffic will never be as good as PPC or SEO click, no matter how targeted he/she is at the moment of the pop-up. On the other hand, some insurance PPC clicks in markets that I play in go for $8-$10 per click...so cheaper alternatives are always interesting!!

        To be honest that is a very short answer about what PPV is all about, but if you have never done PPV before you probably need to learn more about it before jumping into it.

        Most PPV networks require a minimum deposit of a few hundred or perhaps $1k. They do this because they want bigger advertisers rather than a bunch of "little guys".

        I am mostly "self-taught" when it comes to PPV so I can't really recommend a course or anything like that. I have heard a lot of people saying good things about "Kenster" in regards to CPA. He is a Warriorforum member. You may want to look him up and see what he has written in the past if you want to learn more.

        Alternatively, just stick with PPC if that is what you are now comfortable with. To be honest, if you are close to breaking even now and not tracking things properly you can most likely turn some of those ads into winners if you track and split test everything!
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        • Profile picture of the author Tocholke
          Thank you so much. That makes total sense to me. I'm going to look into PPV as another source. I have read a few things that Kenster has put out. I heard ppv mentioned but there was no detail in the stuff I read. Maybe I'll dig a little deeper.

          Is PPV your main source of traffic?
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          • Profile picture of the author The Real Deal
            Originally Posted by Tocholke View Post

            Thank you so much. That makes total sense to me.
            No worries, glad I could help!

            Originally Posted by Tocholke View Post

            Is PPV your main source of traffic?
            No, not really. I do a lot of different things that make money, (far too many actually, it's better to focus on one or two and do them really well! :rolleyes and PPV is just one of those things.

            The most important thing to remember is that quality targeted traffic is the key to making money online. It doesn't really matter if it comes from SEO, PPC, PPV, List building or somewhere else. However, for any paid traffic sources you will have to track things carefully and split test different ads and landing pages etc. to try and optimize your click through and conversion rates. This is especially true for PPC because there is so much competition there.

            Good luck, I am sure you will do well!
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  • Profile picture of the author Parry
    7search is indeed cheap but can be unprofitable for those who do not know how to work it. PPV on the other hand is very expensive and can burn you out with quick spurts of cash requirements for campaigns.

    With 7search you need to track and optimize your campaigns. Filter out bad traffic with their "block sub id" feature. Observe which keywords get clicks and which ones convert and eliminate bad keyword accordingly. Take advantage of their targeted keyword feature as also their TDU feature for selected keywords. Lastly keep adding keywords and track them for clicks and conversions.

    It does take some hard work and time but 7search can be the best source of traffic and a mine of profit if you optimize your campaigns the way 7search allows you to.
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  • Profile picture of the author paul nicholls
    you can make some good money with cpa but your best off to first build a real online business and then dabble with cpa once you have a business online which is earning you money

    why don`t you ditch cpa and promote clickbank products instead?

    at least with clickbank products it will be far easier to build a list and then promote related offers to them further down the line

    Paul
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