31 replies
Hi everybody, I try to find an article writer that writes for syndication. I tried different services, most of the results i don't even publish in the blog because i am ashamed really, they are not serving for nothing. Paid for 20+, published 10+ . Part of the problem is the writers/company did not understand my order and topic and another problem is 2 of them just throw me a content for the sake of "throwing" something for the money i paid. Not syndicated, i guess it is normal, as i only have few articles in Ezine. Please help with advise where to find a normal writer that is not scared to explain his point and be down to earth and not trying to write poems and exaltation articles about celebrities or just enumerating chronology and writing articles like they are giving instructions on how to use some machinery........ when it all comes to clothes.

Also am i right to think that articles here are a bit less useful since many women just research for photos when it comes to clothes and fashion and get ideas of what is up to date and find their own styles /please, i don not underestimate article marketing/. I think like it is more effective to write shortly about last news and only last news about celebrities and blend keywords into the article because in this niche it is about self confidence and taste - most of women are more looking and browsing for different pictures when choosing clothes than reading someone's points why to wear low back dress when she already knows that low back dress doesn't suit her, for example.

So am I on the wrong way? I do not underestimate article writing at all, it is my main source / and anyone's source/ to find something, get informed, get anything you need, and it just means ALL on the web but not really with the same degree when the niche is clothes? Any advise is very much appreciated.
#afraid #earth #people #writers
  • Profile picture of the author Thomas W
    if your articles need to be in english maybe you should ensure that it's their first language?
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  • Profile picture of the author R Hagel
    There are a couple keys to getting good results with writers:

    1. Pick the RIGHT writer. Do your due diligence. Yes, it takes time... but it's worth it in the long run. Find writers who create articles in the same style you'd like YOUR articles written.

    (HINT: Those $2 article writers aren't going to give you what you need.)


    2. Write a clear and concise brief. Writers aren't mind readers, so you need to tell them exactly what you want and need. Give them examples of writing styles you like. Don't just throw a brief together -- take your time to create an easily understandable brief.

    Cheers,
    Becky
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  • Profile picture of the author letstalkaboutlove
    Hi here too Thomas , thank you! Yes, they say the writers are USA based and style is american /when i order from a company/ but when i went in Ezine to publish, there were lots of mistakes in spelling and i can only imagine what is going on in the writing style itself. Than tried one non English first language writer and no spelling mistakes but not good quality. Now again with English first language writer from fiverr which i honestly liked but yet to see the result in syndication.
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  • Profile picture of the author Joseph Robinson
    Banned
    As soon as I saw "company" I found the problem. I might just be hazarding a guess, but you went for a low price option, didn't you? Writers who actually know how to write for syndication are rare and expensive, because they know they could also be making that residual income for themselves.

    Seems it's becoming a popular thing for writers to say they write syndication pieces, but as you've learned that isn't something you can apply "fake it 'til ya make it" to.
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    • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Joseph Robinson View Post

      Writers who actually know how to write for syndication are rare and expensive, because they know they could also be making that residual income for themselves.
      This.

      Exactly.

      If you find a "syndication quality" writer who will produce articles for you at much under $100 each, which are successfully syndicated to relevant sites/ezines/newsletters, then you've found gold-dust, and you might want to get as much as possible out of that writer until s/he just becomes his/her own client and stops writing them for others.

      The income potential from articles syndicated to the right places is huge (I have some individual articles first published over 3 years ago which are still, directly or indirectly, producing income for me every single month), but that does - understandably - make them an expensive commodity by comparison with other kinds of articles.
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      • Profile picture of the author Kay King
        This is more than price - though if spelling is bad, that's definitely a factor.
        the writers/company did not understand my order and topic
        Then maybe the problem is in YOUR order and topic??? Is the topic and your purpose defined? Are your instructions clear?

        You seem to have a pre-conceived idea of what the articles should say - and a writer can't read your mind. You have a perception of "what most women do" - but is that correct?

        Are the keywords sufficient that an article can be built around them? In fashion writing, an article about "skirt lengths" might work but any writer would have to stretch to make an article about "short, black skirt" worth reading.
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        • Profile picture of the author letstalkaboutlove
          It is sure that i am doing it wrong, no matter these are my guidelines, the topic, the expectation i have or the writer i choose. However i didn't expect writers are so rare to find. I have a list of topics, guidelines and another keyword list prepared in advance. My impression - again only impression - is that writing needs higher spirit and self estimation as well as a little more experience with people and intuition to understand them apart from the talent. When someone starts writing about Rihanna and her style as a mother of a saint or something like that ...like she is not a human - this is a kind of personality ,could say even a problem, not a writing style. Another impression is that they don't care at all as well as in many other online services i found.


          Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

          This is more than price - though if spelling is bad, that's definitely a factor.
          Then maybe the problem is in YOUR order and topic??? Is the topic and your purpose defined? Are your instructions clear?

          You seem to have a pre-conceived idea of what the articles should say - and a writer can't read your mind. You have a perception of "what most women do" - but is that correct?

          Are the keywords sufficient that an article can be built around them? In fashion writing, an article about "skirt lengths" might work but any writer would have to stretch to make an article about "short, black skirt" worth reading.
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          • Profile picture of the author Kay King
            When someone starts writing about Rihanna and her style as a mother of a saint or something like that ...like she is not a human - this is a kind of personality ,could say even a problem,
            I hope the job is better explained than the paragraph above.

            YOU know you want an article about Rihanna, the singer. If you are paying a decent price for articles - the writer will do some research to write about her. If you are buying cheap articles the writers are churning out words and have to do it fast to make money. They don't research - they may have no idea who Rihanna is.

            It is a problem - but it starts with you. You are bashing writers as being bad but you have NEVER said what you are paying for the articles you don't like. That tells me you are not paying much.

            If you want articles on popular personalities or celebrities you need to let the writer know what you want. Do you want history - lifestyle - problems - personality of the person? Someone writing a $2 article isn't going to spend 20-30 minutes researching before they write - they will just make up some words and call it an article. That's reality.

            is that writing needs higher spirit and self estimation as well as a little more experience with people and intuition to understand them apart from the talent.
            Huh? A writer should not have to intuit what you need or what you want - you should be able to define it.
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  • Profile picture of the author letstalkaboutlove
    I don't know what is a higher price in article writing, i can say what i paid. It is delicate because everybody are saying to be good writers and i start paying of course but when the result comes i can not say - repair this article, i don 't like your writing.... Looks like i need to try many to find one.
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    • Profile picture of the author Joseph Robinson
      Banned
      Originally Posted by letstalkaboutlove View Post

      I don't know what is a higher price in article writing, i can say what i paid. It is delicate because everybody are saying to be good writers and i start paying of course but when the result comes i can not say - repair this article, i don 't like your writing.... Looks like i need to try many to find one.

      Put in the simplest terms possible: you won't get syndication quality work from those charging "As low as $1 per article" (if you went with the company you contacted publicly on here) or $5 on Fiverr. You're going to just get words on a page.

      Low-end syndication writers are charging $.10 per word minimum. That should only last a short time and only because they still don't get how they can leverage their work. Pro syndicators either don't write for others at all or charge $.50 per word and up. They understand how each piece brings traffic, which brings targeted leads, which become buyers. That makes each piece worth hundreds (and for good marketers thousands) of dollars.

      Why do that for someone else for $5? Anyone who pretends they can/will write syndication pieces at low prices (you know who you are *Reddit look of disapproval*) is just desperate for your money. Protect it accordingly.
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      • Profile picture of the author MissTerraK
        I agree with what the others have posted here. If you want syndication quality articles, you've got to hire syndication worthy writers.

        It seems from your responses you aren't quite getting it, so let me try to put it in terms you may understand.

        Let's take you user name for instance; you call yourself letstalkaboutlove. So you should be able to understand when I say the problem is that you're looking for love in all the wrong places.

        Or, you say you desire articles on women's fashions. So how about you won't get quality fashion clothing by shopping at Kmart. However, by shopping at Macy's or Sac's 5th Avenue, you will.

        I hope this helps.

        Terra
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  • Profile picture of the author letstalkaboutlove
    Thank you for the explanation Miss
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    • Profile picture of the author MissTerraK
      Originally Posted by letstalkaboutlove View Post

      Thank you for the explanation Miss
      You are very welcome.

      I hope that you will take the advice given here and start looking for writers who won't continually disappoint you. There are many very talented writers here on the WF just as the WF has many experts in many fields of the umbrella of IM.

      You need only search the WSO, classified, for hire sections as well as signatures.

      Any writer that takes pride in their craft will aim to please their customer as their reputation, their word of mouth referrals and positive feedback depend on their continuing success and therefore want open communication with their clients on what style and tone the client wants before they begin the piece.

      For example, do they want a piece that people empathize with, purely informational, funny, in story form, etc.

      I hope you take to heart everything you have been advised in this thread and go on to be quite successful.

      All the best to you,

      Terra
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      • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
        Originally Posted by Joseph Robinson View Post

        Seems it's becoming a popular thing for writers to say they write syndication pieces, but as you've learned that isn't something you can apply "fake it 'til ya make it" to.
        Another factor if you simply specify "for syndication" is an ongoing confusion about what that means. Even just reading the various article marketing threads here, you'll see that for many "syndication" means blasting an article to a bunch of directories or blog farms for backlinks.

        As for writers who put out the quality you seek being hard to find, consider this:

        I have a half dozen quality diamonds, which I place in a glass bowl. I ask you to pick out the diamonds. Easy, right?

        Now I fill the bowl with a mixture of lower quality diamonds, cubic zirconium and cut glass. Again, I ask you to pick out the diamonds. Still easy? Not so much, right?

        It's the same way with writers right now. You may have to sift through a lot of lesser talents to find the ones you need, and they may be much more expensive than those lesser 'stones'...
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        • Profile picture of the author fin
          No offense to the syndicators here, but I think they are blowing smoke up their backsides.

          What do you want from your articles? To get it on another website with a resource box, right?

          So you only need someone who is capable of writing articles that will be accepted on high traffic websites.

          I know people that bring out writing courses and they can't write well. Everyone on here tells people to bump up their prices and what you're left with is people charging high prices for gash work.

          You just need to find someone who charges a decent rate. I've no doubt you could find someone that wouldn't break the bank.

          But I don't think you should bother paying for quality articles yet because I don't think you would know what to do with them. Just going by what you've written. I'd just practice converting traffic in smaller numbers until you get it right.
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          • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
            Originally Posted by fin View Post

            What do you want from your articles? To get it on another website with a resource box, right?

            So you only need someone who is capable of writing articles that will be accepted on high traffic websites.
            Unless you're playing the 'syndicate for backlinks' game, "getting an article on another website with a resource box" isn't the end objective. Getting people to read those articles and click the link in the resource box back to your landing page.

            So you need a writer capable of a) getting the article published on other sites and b) generating the real desired outcome.

            I will concede that the required quality can vary depending on the website.

            Originally Posted by fin View Post

            But I don't think you should bother paying for quality articles yet because I don't think you would know what to do with them. Just going by what you've written. I'd just practice converting traffic in smaller numbers until you get it right.
            I can't speak to the OP's knowledge level, but the condition is common to many getting started in syndication. Better to start out with a handful of good articles (good enough to get published, read and clicked) and refine one's syndication practice than to worry about finding a pile of so-so or worse content and wondering what to do next.

            When I say "syndication practice", I mean your end to end method from conceiving the article, writing it (or getting it written), getting it published, and converting the resulting visitors to subscribers and/or customers.
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            • Profile picture of the author fin
              Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe View Post


              and converting the resulting visitors to subscribers and/or customers.
              I just can't see this happening.

              I think they could practice without spending loads on articles, but that's just me.
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              • Profile picture of the author Joseph Robinson
                Banned
                Originally Posted by fin View Post

                I just can't see this happening.

                I think they could practice without spending loads on articles, but that's just me.
                On that point at least I'd have no argument. A syndication quality article isn't worth much to someone who doesn't know how to use it. It'd be a lot like:

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            • Profile picture of the author fin
              Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe View Post


              So you need a writer capable of a) getting the article published on other sites and b) generating the real desired outcome.
              I'm just writing this because I'm interested in your opinion (and Joe's if he wants), not to start an argument.

              So you have a writer that can pen a good story. He can also add a good call to action. That's cool. Syndication level? Or not?

              But then you have the other problem of putting your article in more than one place. You don't really have a specific audience to write for. At least not everywhere the article will go.

              There's been people come out and said one article had opposite outcomes depending on where it was published, just because of the audience.

              So my question is:

              If you have someone who can write a good story and have a great call to action, how do you know the article will do any good?

              Surely that requires a lot more than a good writer. Someone who can pick out the proper places to put it. Also make contact to get the post published.

              I think it requires more than good writers. And I think there's a lot more variables than whether someone can have a good call to action.

              The desired action is a bad choice of words. A basic article could get more clicks, so by your definition the article written by the syndication writer is of a lower quality.
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              • Profile picture of the author Joseph Robinson
                Banned
                Originally Posted by fin View Post

                I'm just writing this because I'm interested in your opinion (and Joe's if he wants), not to start an argument.
                Jumps right in. "People wanna listen to you Joe, don't screw it up!"

                Originally Posted by fin View Post

                So you have a writer that can pen a good story. He can also add a good call to action. That's cool. Syndication level? Or not?
                Maybe, maybe not. Sometimes "penning a good story" isn't a good way to get the message across (and definitely not to get it spread). You're correctly pointing out that there is literally no vanilla way for a syndication article to be written. It's very situational.

                Originally Posted by fin View Post

                But then you have the other problem of putting your article in more than one place. You don't really have a specific audience to write for. At least not everywhere the article will go.
                Right, which is why I agreed with your point in the above post. The buyer has to know what they are going to do with it, or pay the writer even more to be a consult and have them find potential spots for them. That's my reasoning above for the different price ranges. A syndication writer shouldn't have a problem knowing where their work will go in most cases.

                Each syndicated article doesn't have to go out to each outlet either. Let's take the Disney niche: I write an article talking about the three best desserts in Magic Kingdom. General sites will take it. Restaurant focused sites will take them. Sites focused on rides, future developments, the conservation program? Probably not going to take it. You don't have to write for everyone all the time.

                Originally Posted by fin View Post

                There's been people come out and said one article had opposite outcomes depending on where it was published, just because of the audience.
                See above. That's why you don't publish everything everywhere. As I've been saying lately (verify through my post history), this is an area where syndicators are at fault. We make this thing seem easier than it actually is. People follow the four basic steps that get mentioned (1. Your site 2. Syndicate 3. EZA 4. Rinse/Repeat) and think that's it. Then they fail miserably and suddenly the method is invalid. The method isn't, the teaching is. I'll be the first to admit fault in that, but it does not take away from the fact that this stuff works.

                Originally Posted by fin View Post

                If you have someone who can write a good story and have a great call to action, how do you know the article will do any good?
                Testing. Vanilla answer, but that's how it is. It's a much higher stakes game, but it is what it is. As you recommend, it's probably best for a beginner to play in the shallow end first. When they want to get serious though, it will cost the big bucks.

                Originally Posted by fin View Post

                Surely that requires a lot more than a good writer. Someone who can pick out the proper places to put it. Also make contact to get the post published.
                Yep, you're very right. You aren't just hiring a great writer: you're hiring a great marketer as well. That's why they're more expensive, and like I said they are less likely to be for hire at all. Why do that work for someone else when you can do it for yourself?

                Originally Posted by fin View Post

                I think it requires more than good writers. And I think there's a lot more variables than whether someone can have a good call to action.
                Haven't seen anyone say otherwise, although I could just be missing it.

                Originally Posted by fin View Post

                The desired action is a bad choice of words. A basic article could get more clicks, so by your definition the article written by the syndication writer is of a lower quality.
                I didn't see us say that in the thread either.
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              • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
                Originally Posted by fin View Post

                I'm just writing this because I'm interested in your opinion (and Joe's if he wants), not to start an argument.

                So you have a writer that can pen a good story. He can also add a good call to action. That's cool. Syndication level? Or not?

                But then you have the other problem of putting your article in more than one place. You don't really have a specific audience to write for. At least not everywhere the article will go.

                There's been people come out and said one article had opposite outcomes depending on where it was published, just because of the audience.

                So my question is:

                If you have someone who can write a good story and have a great call to action, how do you know the article will do any good?

                Surely that requires a lot more than a good writer. Someone who can pick out the proper places to put it. Also make contact to get the post published.

                I think it requires more than good writers. And I think there's a lot more variables than whether someone can have a good call to action.

                The desired action is a bad choice of words. A basic article could get more clicks, so by your definition the article written by the syndication writer is of a lower quality.
                Interesting to ponder.

                In this thread, at least, the focus was on writers hired to write. Once the article is written, delivered and accepted, it's up to the buyer to place the article.

                Beyond that, there is some distribution that can't be controlled, especially if one chooses to place content on directories and other content sharing sites.

                If you are going to put the responsibility for creating a call to action, finding syndication outlets and making contact, you're no longer hiring a writer. You're outsourcing your entire content marketing process, which is going to cost you a lot more than a good writer will.

                "Desired action" was a precise choice of words. From a marketing perspective, if the intent is to generate targeted visitors, then an article which generates targeted visitors who go on to subscribe, or take some other desired action, is by definition a "quality article". It may not be great literature, but it's made two sales - a publisher has judged it to be valuable enough to his audience to publish, and a reader has judged it to be valuable enough to desire more and take action to get it.
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                • Profile picture of the author fin
                  I think going by what Joe's written the easiest way to guarantee success is by writing for yourself and testing as you go along.

                  If you're hiring someone to write for you I'd imagine it's a bit more hit and hope. The best you can hope for is that they can write an engaging article with a good call to action.

                  If I was the OP, I still wouldn't spend $100 per article. Obviously we will all have different opinions and it's ultimately up to them, but I'd definitely test with cheaper options until you learn to convert.

                  I just don't want to see them waste lots of money. But maybe following my advice will lose them thousands in lost profits. Who knows?
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                  • Profile picture of the author Joseph Robinson
                    Banned
                    Originally Posted by fin View Post

                    I think going by what Joe's written the easiest way to guarantee success is by writing for yourself and testing as you go along.
                    Probably. Again, we don't really know what the OP has going on syndication-wise (although we can probably guess little to none). If they have no idea, they either test the waters themselves or pay more to have it done for them.

                    Originally Posted by fin View Post

                    If you're hiring someone to write for you I'd imagine it's a bit more hit and hope. The best you can hope for is that they can write an engaging article with a good call to action.
                    Yep, no one's denying that (in fact, John said it with his diamond analogy ).

                    Originally Posted by fin View Post

                    If I was the OP, I still wouldn't spend $100 per article. Obviously we will all have different opinions and it's ultimately up to them, but I'd definitely test with cheaper options until you learn to convert.
                    Shrugs never hurts to test, although they should still head away from Fiverr articles .

                    Originally Posted by fin View Post

                    I just don't want to see them waste lots of money. But maybe following my advice will lose them thousands in lost profits. Who knows?
                    Nobody can for sure. Business would be so much easier otherwise.
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                    • Profile picture of the author fin
                      Yeah, they are in a bit of a shotty situation.

                      I think syndication is a pretty weird choice. I'd much rather tackle something I could become an expert in, such as paid traffic.
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                      • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
                        Originally Posted by fin View Post

                        Yeah, they are in a bit of a shotty situation.

                        I think syndication is a pretty weird choice. I'd much rather tackle something I could become an expert in, such as paid traffic.
                        The two are not mutually exclusive...
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                        • Profile picture of the author fin
                          Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe View Post

                          The two are not mutually exclusive...
                          Eggs and baskets and such... lol
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  • Profile picture of the author letstalkaboutlove
    Sorry Kay, i see you get mad but i can not agree. I don't pay $2. I paid as cheap as $5 in Fiverr which actually was the only 3 articles i like. The other articles are more than 3 times more expensive and were with spelling mistakes. It is cheap for you but it is not cheap for others and still they make money. I don't intend to "bash" writers, i am telling my experience and seek advise as newbie searching for writer in a marketing forum which is for people like me and you - problem with that?! I am somehow sure i am not the reason there is a service like that on the web and it is on top of page 1 of the SERP actually. Also just as i gave an example with Fiverr - if they exist for so many years and they have a million of hits per day - it is not because there are millions of mistaken newbies using some worthless services. I am not making the market, you neither and i am not going to a level to attack you because i don't find a writer, so do not do it too because you don't find a customer. Topic is closed for me but if you like come practice your writing.
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  • Profile picture of the author FIERCE IM
    hello,

    write for syndication, is not for everyone. There are a lot of great article writters ou there, but you need to found them And if your subject is too technical, maybe your writter do not know anything about that and they will have a hard time to write they article. You need to make sure before hiring that they understand your needs.
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  • Profile picture of the author Rose Anderson
    You just haven't found the right writer for your purposes. If you want a particular style and tone of writing then you need to work with one writer -- not a service or a large company.

    Be very specific in what you want covered in your article. Show them an example of an article you like. (Only as an example. Not for a rewrite!)

    Read the writer's emails carefully. This can often tell you a lot about how they write. Sometimes the samples they send you are not truly their work.

    Place small orders with several writers and then see which one meets your requirements.

    Never shop only by price.

    You should consider the Warriors for Hire section of this forum. Read the reccomendations from other warriors who have worked with the writer.

    It may take some time. But you can find the writer you need.

    The writers I've talked to on this forum are all very "down to earth" people.

    Rose
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  • Profile picture of the author David Sneen
    Did you check to see if the articles were original material?

    If you got 3 articles you liked from Fiverr, either it was from people just gearing up to enter that industry, or your standards were very low. I do not see how anyone can write for that fee. I am sure there are exceptions. But, if a person can consistently produce content at that price, that person can soon command more money.

    I would want to see a sample of the work of the person I was considering hiring. If they can produce quality work, that is step one.

    Step two is: Do they listen and ask questions? Do they know exactly what you want before they start writing? Will they research the topic? Are they going to tell a story or insert a bit of humor to keep your readers reading?

    Step three: Can you get a guarantee on your work? Make sure that it is thoroughly proofread. It is very tough to get on page one for meaningful keywords. If errors are made on your article, you can guarantee that someone will pass you....and possibly kick you off page one because of it.
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    • Profile picture of the author Kay King
      I'm not angry - just offering some common sense advice from the viewpoint of someone who writes for clients and who has hired writers as well.

      Also just as i gave an example with Fiverr - if they exist for so many years and they have a million of hits per day - it is not because there are millions of mistaken newbies using some worthless services.
      Fiverr hasn't been around that long - and attracts both buyers and sellers because of the cheap price. That's what gained it attention and keeps it going....not a reputation for high quality.

      if you like come practice your writing.
      I don't think so - but thanks anyway.
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